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TIA
Posts: 483
Joined: Mon Mar 13, 2006 3:42 am

Re: Wizz Air News and Discussion - 2023

Thu Jun 08, 2023 5:29 pm

AirBourne wrote:
GlobalRepublic wrote:
TIA wrote:

Out of curiosity, do you hold the same view of Ryanair? FR announced EDI-TIA a day after W6. In fact almost all routes that W6 just announced out of TIA seem to have been in response to the upcoming FR. And although W6 routes may seem erratic, the failures out of TIA can be counted on one hand. I'm not saying that EDI will work, but it's not necessary wild either given thev growth of TIA and the number of long shot routes that have worked in the past.


No. I think Ryanair smell blood and they are clearly going after Wizz Air. The only reason Ryanair are launching some of these routes is because Wizz Air are, IMO.


Precisely. FR have shown no interest in Tirana before, yet the day after Wizz announce BHX and LPL they announce MAN and STN and go head to head on EDI.

Who said they haven't shown interest before? In fact, just go back and read this very same thread where I and others have mentioned it. This has been in the works for months, if not years. Do you think they only announced these routes after W6 did the day before? I do think that W6 announced the routes yesterday in anticipation of the FR announcement today. W6 has experienced immense success at TIA. The longevity of the routes there and the constant growth of the base shows that. FR needs to find avenues for growth. TIA is one of the few markets that FR hadn't entered yet and a growth one at that, so obviously FR wants a piece of that.
 
Kikko19
Posts: 1030
Joined: Sat Apr 22, 2017 4:45 pm

Re: Wizz Air News and Discussion - 2023

Thu Jun 08, 2023 5:50 pm

TIA wrote:
AirBourne wrote:
GlobalRepublic wrote:

No. I think Ryanair smell blood and they are clearly going after Wizz Air. The only reason Ryanair are launching some of these routes is because Wizz Air are, IMO.


Precisely. FR have shown no interest in Tirana before, yet the day after Wizz announce BHX and LPL they announce MAN and STN and go head to head on EDI.

Who said they haven't shown interest before? In fact, just go back and read this very same thread where I and others have mentioned it. This has been in the works for months, if not years. Do you think they only announced these routes after W6 did the day before? I do think that W6 announced the routes yesterday in anticipation of the FR announcement today. W6 has experienced immense success at TIA. The longevity of the routes there and the constant growth of the base shows that. FR needs to find avenues for growth. TIA is one of the few markets that FR hadn't entered yet and a growth one at that, so obviously FR wants a piece of that.

Last year wizz flown (TLL) mxp
l, vce fco and nap, FR opened cia, nap and TSF... Wizz left all except MXP and now FR left suit Nap cia... And maybe TSF next winter.
 
greg85
Posts: 214
Joined: Tue Jun 26, 2007 9:45 am

Re: Wizz Air News and Discussion - 2023

Thu Jun 08, 2023 5:55 pm

TS811 wrote:
holczakker wrote:
Great reports everywhere saying that the loss "narrowed" from 643 million to 535 million and that the company expect to return to profit this year. How on earth will they do so if they couldn't while everyone made money left and right?


It will depend on their ability to manage (reduce) their cost base. Compared to pre-Covid, revenue increased +41% while growing +36% so demand is there. RASK is flat due to an increasing stage length but it's still strong yield performance given the growth. Yes easyJet and Ryanair saw stronger unit revenue growth but easyJet are smaller compared to pre-Covid and Ryanair "only" grew 16%.

The issue is on the cost side. Without properly dissecting each cost item, I believe there will be relief from two main areas:
1) Utilization is still 1 hour below 2019 levels. Improving utilization will lower their fixed unit costs. Their target for next year is to do better than 2019.
2) Fuel hedges from the competition will start to expire and level the playing field. Wizz Air's unit fuel costs should decrease while easyJet/Ryanair's should increase.

My analysis is that they lost money because they grew faster than others, and failed to hedge their fuel costs when everyone else did. But if the revenue environment remains strong and they reduce their costs thanks to higher utilization and lower fuel bills, I wouldn't be surprised if they're profitable again next year.


A nice analysis. But I think it ignores a few points. It ignores Wizz’s shambolic operation. They have seemed unable to overcome this, and no doubt owe many more passengers compensation for delays and cancellations.

EasyJet are once again bigger than pre covid, and I don’t remember either them or Ryanair accepting huge losses just because they were growing.

The “playing field” will never be level. Ryanair are famous for dodging taxes and all the other tricks from the last decade or 2. I’m sure Wizz will continue to try a few tricks of their own.

It’s a poor performance from Wizz, no other way to put it.
 
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PatrickZ80
Posts: 5801
Joined: Tue Jul 13, 2010 5:33 am

Re: Wizz Air News and Discussion - 2023

Thu Jun 08, 2023 6:01 pm

TIA wrote:
AirBourne wrote:
GlobalRepublic wrote:

No. I think Ryanair smell blood and they are clearly going after Wizz Air. The only reason Ryanair are launching some of these routes is because Wizz Air are, IMO.


Precisely. FR have shown no interest in Tirana before, yet the day after Wizz announce BHX and LPL they announce MAN and STN and go head to head on EDI.

Who said they haven't shown interest before? In fact, just go back and read this very same thread where I and others have mentioned it. This has been in the works for months, if not years. Do you think they only announced these routes after W6 did the day before? I do think that W6 announced the routes yesterday in anticipation of the FR announcement today. W6 has experienced immense success at TIA. The longevity of the routes there and the constant growth of the base shows that. FR needs to find avenues for growth. TIA is one of the few markets that FR hadn't entered yet and a growth one at that, so obviously FR wants a piece of that.


Maybe Ryanair didn't know exactly which routes Wizzair would launch, but they knew they were strong there and expanding so they set up shop there as well. Some routes are overlapping, some aren't. For example Ryanair has announced TIA-NRN, an airport not served by Wizzair. They serve EIN instead, but Ryanair didn't announce TIA-EIN. Likely they figure the Dutch market is served from NRN just as well as it is from EIN, in which I think they're right. NRN is in Germany but so close to the border it's unofficially a Dutch airport, last time I was there there were more Dutch than German cars on the parking lot.
 
NeperQiell
Posts: 61
Joined: Mon Sep 30, 2019 10:22 pm

Re: Wizz Air News and Discussion - 2023

Thu Jun 08, 2023 6:16 pm

PatrickZ80 wrote:
TIA wrote:
AirBourne wrote:

Precisely. FR have shown no interest in Tirana before, yet the day after Wizz announce BHX and LPL they announce MAN and STN and go head to head on EDI.

Who said they haven't shown interest before? In fact, just go back and read this very same thread where I and others have mentioned it. This has been in the works for months, if not years. Do you think they only announced these routes after W6 did the day before? I do think that W6 announced the routes yesterday in anticipation of the FR announcement today. W6 has experienced immense success at TIA. The longevity of the routes there and the constant growth of the base shows that. FR needs to find avenues for growth. TIA is one of the few markets that FR hadn't entered yet and a growth one at that, so obviously FR wants a piece of that.


Maybe Ryanair didn't know exactly which routes Wizzair would launch, but they knew they were strong there and expanding so they set up shop there as well. Some routes are overlapping, some aren't. For example Ryanair has announced TIA-NRN, an airport not served by Wizzair. They serve EIN instead, but Ryanair didn't announce TIA-EIN. Likely they figure the Dutch market is served from NRN just as well as it is from EIN, in which I think they're right. NRN is in Germany but so close to the border it's unofficially a Dutch airport, last time I was there there were more Dutch than German cars on the parking lot.


They didn't launch TIA-EIN because they don't have a base in EIN.
 
TS811
Posts: 132
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Re: Wizz Air News and Discussion - 2023

Fri Jun 09, 2023 7:55 am

greg85 wrote:
TS811 wrote:
holczakker wrote:
Great reports everywhere saying that the loss "narrowed" from 643 million to 535 million and that the company expect to return to profit this year. How on earth will they do so if they couldn't while everyone made money left and right?


It will depend on their ability to manage (reduce) their cost base. Compared to pre-Covid, revenue increased +41% while growing +36% so demand is there. RASK is flat due to an increasing stage length but it's still strong yield performance given the growth. Yes easyJet and Ryanair saw stronger unit revenue growth but easyJet are smaller compared to pre-Covid and Ryanair "only" grew 16%.

The issue is on the cost side. Without properly dissecting each cost item, I believe there will be relief from two main areas:
1) Utilization is still 1 hour below 2019 levels. Improving utilization will lower their fixed unit costs. Their target for next year is to do better than 2019.
2) Fuel hedges from the competition will start to expire and level the playing field. Wizz Air's unit fuel costs should decrease while easyJet/Ryanair's should increase.

My analysis is that they lost money because they grew faster than others, and failed to hedge their fuel costs when everyone else did. But if the revenue environment remains strong and they reduce their costs thanks to higher utilization and lower fuel bills, I wouldn't be surprised if they're profitable again next year.


A nice analysis. But I think it ignores a few points. It ignores Wizz’s shambolic operation. They have seemed unable to overcome this, and no doubt owe many more passengers compensation for delays and cancellations.

EasyJet are once again bigger than pre covid, and I don’t remember either them or Ryanair accepting huge losses just because they were growing.

The “playing field” will never be level. Ryanair are famous for dodging taxes and all the other tricks from the last decade or 2. I’m sure Wizz will continue to try a few tricks of their own.

It’s a poor performance from Wizz, no other way to put it.



I haven't gone into the details of the cancellation costs, but don't all European LCCs more-or-less suffer from operational breakdowns..? Whether it's due to crew shortages, ATC strikes, etc. It could be worse for Wizz Air, I haven't checked.

easyJet and particularly Ryanair did better not only because of lower growth but mainly due to better cost control. As we are discussing profit which is revenue minus costs, I'm addressing both the revenue side and the cost side.

The playing field I'm referring to is regarding fuel costs and hedging. Of course Ryanair will do whatever trick they can to make more money, and so will Wizz Air for that matter.. it's part of the ULCC business model!

I wouldn't say the overall performance is bad, just the fuel hedging strategy was completely botched. It would be interesting to run the numbers assuming a better hedge and see where that would have gotten them.
 
PhilipBass
Posts: 900
Joined: Fri Feb 19, 2021 6:30 pm

Re: Wizz Air News and Discussion - 2023

Fri Jun 09, 2023 9:26 am

They obviously haven't learned the lesson in full because they are only 60% hedged for this year compared to Ryanair at 85%
https://investor.ryanair.com/wp-content ... esults.pdf
https://wizzair.com/static/docs/default ... 7debe0.pdf
 
TexasAirCorp
Posts: 1111
Joined: Sat Mar 20, 2021 5:24 pm

Re: Wizz Air News and Discussion - 2023

Fri Jun 09, 2023 8:28 pm

TS811 wrote:
greg85 wrote:
TS811 wrote:

It will depend on their ability to manage (reduce) their cost base. Compared to pre-Covid, revenue increased +41% while growing +36% so demand is there. RASK is flat due to an increasing stage length but it's still strong yield performance given the growth. Yes easyJet and Ryanair saw stronger unit revenue growth but easyJet are smaller compared to pre-Covid and Ryanair "only" grew 16%.

The issue is on the cost side. Without properly dissecting each cost item, I believe there will be relief from two main areas:
1) Utilization is still 1 hour below 2019 levels. Improving utilization will lower their fixed unit costs. Their target for next year is to do better than 2019.
2) Fuel hedges from the competition will start to expire and level the playing field. Wizz Air's unit fuel costs should decrease while easyJet/Ryanair's should increase.

My analysis is that they lost money because they grew faster than others, and failed to hedge their fuel costs when everyone else did. But if the revenue environment remains strong and they reduce their costs thanks to higher utilization and lower fuel bills, I wouldn't be surprised if they're profitable again next year.


A nice analysis. But I think it ignores a few points. It ignores Wizz’s shambolic operation. They have seemed unable to overcome this, and no doubt owe many more passengers compensation for delays and cancellations.

EasyJet are once again bigger than pre covid, and I don’t remember either them or Ryanair accepting huge losses just because they were growing.

The “playing field” will never be level. Ryanair are famous for dodging taxes and all the other tricks from the last decade or 2. I’m sure Wizz will continue to try a few tricks of their own.

It’s a poor performance from Wizz, no other way to put it.



I haven't gone into the details of the cancellation costs, but don't all European LCCs more-or-less suffer from operational breakdowns..? Whether it's due to crew shortages, ATC strikes, etc. It could be worse for Wizz Air, I haven't checked.

easyJet and particularly Ryanair did better not only because of lower growth but mainly due to better cost control. As we are discussing profit which is revenue minus costs, I'm addressing both the revenue side and the cost side.

The playing field I'm referring to is regarding fuel costs and hedging. Of course Ryanair will do whatever trick they can to make more money, and so will Wizz Air for that matter.. it's part of the ULCC business model!

I wouldn't say the overall performance is bad, just the fuel hedging strategy was completely botched. It would be interesting to run the numbers assuming a better hedge and see where that would have gotten them.


Their overall performance isn't necessarily that bad now, however Wizz also massively screwed up its response to labor shortages last summer. Whereas RYR dumped capacity it assumed it may not be able to operate beforehand, Wizz simply hoped for the best and ended up having to delay/cancel masses of flights at the last minute. RYR's strategy meant it just had to refund people under EU261, Wizz on the other hand also had to pay compensation to most pax on top, certainly not helping with losses.

The bigger issue that creates is that Wizz in the UK, and also in Italy from what I've heard, now has a reputation for being shoddy and unreliable. Whilst Ryanair also doesn't have a glowing reputation, it's certainly not known for being continually late or frequently cancelling flights (at least now). I've flown Ryanair countless times and to their credit the worst I've ever had with them is a flight cancelled a month in advance, and another that landed 20 minutes late. My family are largely BA loyalists however they will happily fly Ryanair if the fare is low enough, none of them will touch Wizz with a barge pole regardless of price as they've all heard horror stories, and I'd be quite confident in saying a decent chunk of the travelling public in the UK feel the same. That doesn't bode well for an organisation that's trying to massively expand in that very country and is shown by their frequent cutting and changing of UK bases/routes.

If the most common complaint is about extra fees and slightly uncomfortable seats, the majority of people will happily overlook that if the fare is low enough. That same majority will be unwilling to overlook a reputation of delays/cancellations, especially when the alternative is better known and still competitive on price, hence I cannot see how their dramatic expansion will succeed. I think that's a big factor in their poor financial results.
 
holczakker
Posts: 403
Joined: Sun May 26, 2019 7:34 pm

Re: Wizz Air News and Discussion - 2023

Fri Jun 09, 2023 8:41 pm

As a matter of fact their prices are not low either and simple seat reservation or an added baggage might cost a fortune on certain routes as well.
 
davidjohnson6
Posts: 3930
Joined: Mon Jun 20, 2016 10:10 pm

Re: Wizz Air News and Discussion - 2023

Fri Jun 09, 2023 8:42 pm

If Wizz can operate S23 reliably, and get some good operational stats out of it (cancellation rate, delays, etc) which they can use in future marketing, I think people in the UK may be willing to give Wizz another chance. I live in London and have noticed far more Wizz advertising than for other airlines. I've flown Wizz 20 times since 01-Jan-2023... I avoided them in summer 2022 but they seem to have a stable and reliable operation now. Fares, especially if you just want a simple seat with no luggage or other ancillaries, can be very reasonable. The only complaint I have this year apart from minor delays, is changing the date of flights for March next year - but 9 months advance notice is enough for me to handle it.
 
EIBPI
Posts: 340
Joined: Wed Aug 21, 2019 4:15 pm

Re: Wizz Air News and Discussion - 2023

Fri Jun 09, 2023 10:13 pm

They seem to have thinned flights from quite a few bases from October on. Routes that have operated for the past few winters are gone.
 
PhilipBass
Posts: 900
Joined: Fri Feb 19, 2021 6:30 pm

Re: Wizz Air News and Discussion - 2023

Wed Jun 28, 2023 7:21 am

Ryanair are coming after Wizz:
https://www.rte.ie/news/business/2023/0 ... cee-plans/
"Ryanair expects passenger numbers in central and eastern Europe (CEE) to surge by at least 50% over the next decade, the airline's manager for the region said, as it looks to dominate in a less-developed market also targeted by Wizz Air."
 
Gfgdfgv
Posts: 145
Joined: Tue Sep 25, 2007 4:21 am

Re: Wizz Air News and Discussion - 2023

Wed Jun 28, 2023 12:09 pm

PhilipBass wrote:
Ryanair are coming after Wizz:
https://www.rte.ie/news/business/2023/0 ... cee-plans/
"Ryanair expects passenger numbers in central and eastern Europe (CEE) to surge by at least 50% over the next decade, the airline's manager for the region said, as it looks to dominate in a less-developed market also targeted by Wizz Air."


Selfishly crossing my fingers for a fare war. Are there any signs hat wizz is starting to get there operations under control?
 
davidjohnson6
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Re: Wizz Air News and Discussion - 2023

Wed Jun 28, 2023 12:14 pm

At Tirana in Albania, there either is or very soon will be a fare war
 
Kikko19
Posts: 1030
Joined: Sat Apr 22, 2017 4:45 pm

Re: Wizz Air News and Discussion - 2023

Wed Jun 28, 2023 2:12 pm

Gfgdfgv wrote:
PhilipBass wrote:
Ryanair are coming after Wizz:
https://www.rte.ie/news/business/2023/0 ... cee-plans/
"Ryanair expects passenger numbers in central and eastern Europe (CEE) to surge by at least 50% over the next decade, the airline's manager for the region said, as it looks to dominate in a less-developed market also targeted by Wizz Air."


Selfishly crossing my fingers for a fare war. Are there any signs hat wizz is starting to get there operations under control?
Wizz opened several routes to TLL, Tthen
FR came as well arrived to TLL with same routes (NAP, ROM, MIL VCE,then WIZZ bailed and then FR reduced the flights. Bad for passengers. We were better off with Wizz than now.
 
PhilipBass
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Re: Wizz Air News and Discussion - 2023

Tue Jul 04, 2023 8:55 am

https://www.cityam.com/wizz-air-beats-s ... r-getaway/

Wizz numbers for June are respectable.
5.3M passengers and a 92.2% seat occupancy.

The Airline may have problems but if they stick to the knitting they have a fighting chance and they did that last month.
 
holczakker
Posts: 403
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Re: Wizz Air News and Discussion - 2023

Tue Jul 04, 2023 4:53 pm

There's a reason they don't publish any numbers about the financial and operational performance. The load factor itself doesn't say anything. Serious delays, quite a number of cancellations, office staff leaving in an unprecedented rate. Still short of crew as well, they had to cancel the no-return HR policy after 19 years - which was stupid anyway, had to announce sign-in and retention bonuses and new roster patterns, all too late to save the high season. They even needed to lease an american A320 to "support" Bucharest base.
 
davidjohnson6
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Re: Wizz Air News and Discussion - 2023

Fri Jul 07, 2023 1:18 am

Why is the GlobalX A320 (N278GX) from the USA that is wet leased to Wizzair about to fly from Bucharest to Reykjavik (and presumably then onto the USA) on 7 July 2023 under a GlobalX and not Wizzair flight code? No, Wizzair do not have a scheduled route between OTP and KEF. I'm guessing the time of absolute peak demand is late July rather than late June / early July. It seems unusual to go to a lot of trouble and cost to wet lease an A320 from the USA, only to decide it's no longer needed about two weeks before the peak of annual demand. Has the wet lease not worked out in the way that the various people involved had hoped ?
 
holczakker
Posts: 403
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Re: Wizz Air News and Discussion - 2023

Fri Jul 07, 2023 5:01 pm

It was planned like this. Another leased aircraft (Smatlynx) is still flying for Wizz in IAS. End of June might be the peak in terms of legs flown (eg. the record day so far was 28 JUN 2019 according to Eurocontrol).
 
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marcecar10
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Re: Wizz Air News and Discussion - 2023

Mon Jul 10, 2023 6:46 pm

Wizz having a PR catastrophe right now due to removing a passenger, who is a disabled veteran of the war in Ukraine, from a flight between Warsaw and Tel Aviv. :?

https://twitter.com/nexta_tv/status/167 ... 23360?s=20
 
SCQ83
Posts: 6159
Joined: Wed Oct 03, 2012 8:32 pm

Re: Wizz Air News and Discussion - 2023

Thu Jul 20, 2023 11:30 am

Wizz Air enters Iraq!

https://twitter.com/SeanM1997/status/16 ... 7674524672

Even if it is Erbil which is almost another de facto country (Kurdistan) it is still quite shocking to see how far Wizz Air has expanded.
 
davidjohnson6
Posts: 3930
Joined: Mon Jun 20, 2016 10:10 pm

Re: Wizz Air News and Discussion - 2023

Thu Jul 20, 2023 11:47 am

Are insurance rates for Chisinau in Moldova significantly higher than Erbil ? Or is Erbil just a very profitable airport to fly to ?
 
TS811
Posts: 132
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Re: Wizz Air News and Discussion - 2023

Thu Jul 20, 2023 12:03 pm

I'd say it has to have a lot of profit potential for Wizz Air to go through the hassle of entering a new country and adding a new station to their network for just one route.

In any case, it's a very interesting move and I'll be looking to see what they do next! It seems that nothing is "off-limits" for them anymore...
 
holczakker
Posts: 403
Joined: Sun May 26, 2019 7:34 pm

Re: Wizz Air News and Discussion - 2023

Sat Jul 22, 2023 11:02 pm

Tuzla base will be closed in 6 weeks with all routes except four terminated.
https://www.exyuaviation.com/2023/07/wizz-air-to-shut-tuzla-base.html

All flights cancelled to/from Kukes, Albania after 11th of July.
https://www.voxnews.al/english/aktualitet/skandali-wizzair-mbyll-te-gjitha-fluturimet-nga-aeroporti-i-kukesit-i43460
 
TS811
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Re: Wizz Air News and Discussion - 2023

Wed Jul 26, 2023 7:47 am

Any thoughts on how the P&W recall will affect Wizz Air? Half of the fleet runs on these engines, I can't imagine it won't disrupt their operations and/or growth plans.
 
PhilipBass
Posts: 900
Joined: Fri Feb 19, 2021 6:30 pm

Re: Wizz Air News and Discussion - 2023

Thu Jul 27, 2023 10:51 am

CAA looking to force Wizz pay to passengers what is owed to them.

https://www.theguardian.com/business/20 ... laints-caa
 
PhilipBass
Posts: 900
Joined: Fri Feb 19, 2021 6:30 pm

Re: Wizz Air News and Discussion - 2023

Thu Jul 27, 2023 10:53 am

TS811 wrote:
I'd say it has to have a lot of profit potential for Wizz Air to go through the hassle of entering a new country.

...or Wizz Air are just devoid of opportunities in Western and Central Europe to establish sustainable, profitable routes.
 
PhilipBass
Posts: 900
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Re: Wizz Air News and Discussion - 2023

Thu Jul 27, 2023 10:54 am

TS811 wrote:
Any thoughts on how the P&W recall will affect Wizz Air? Half of the fleet runs on these engines, I can't imagine it won't disrupt their operations and/or growth plans.

P&W will pick up the tab and Wizz won't care about the experience for their Customers on cancelled flights.
 
holczakker
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Re: Wizz Air News and Discussion - 2023

Thu Jul 27, 2023 2:43 pm

 
holczakker
Posts: 403
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Re: Wizz Air News and Discussion - 2023

Thu Jul 27, 2023 2:46 pm

PhilipBass wrote:
CAA looking to force Wizz pay to passengers what is owed to them.


The three-person department responsible for this will finish reviewing those cases in 2025.
 
EIBPI
Posts: 340
Joined: Wed Aug 21, 2019 4:15 pm

Re: Wizz Air News and Discussion - 2023

Wed Aug 02, 2023 8:36 pm

Another 75 A321 NEOs ordered:
https://www.airbus.com/en/newsroom/pres ... y-aircraft

Nothing on the airline’s own site for the moment but I guess it is being saved for the investor call tomorrow.

In other news, a number of bases incl. VAR seems to be losing an aircraft and some routes in early September. Not clear where the capacity is being redeployed to.

The whole operation seems to be a bit messy this summer with no spare anything anywhere.
 
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FiscAutTecGarte
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Re: Wizz Air News and Discussion - 2023

Wed Aug 02, 2023 9:04 pm

EIBPI wrote:
Another 75 A321 NEOs ordered:
https://www.airbus.com/en/newsroom/pres ... y-aircraft

Nothing on the airline’s own site for the moment but I guess it is being saved for the investor call tomorrow.

In other news, a number of bases incl. VAR seems to be losing an aircraft and some routes in early September. Not clear where the capacity is being redeployed to.

The whole operation seems to be a bit messy this summer with no spare anything anywhere.


Reuter's has an article too: https://www.reuters.com/business/aerosp ... 023-08-02/

Marks 434 A321NEOs on order just for that airline. What an amazing plane. It will go down as the most successful, in terms of orders, passenger jet in history before it's production concludes.
 
PhilipBass
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Re: Wizz Air News and Discussion - 2023

Wed Aug 02, 2023 9:39 pm

Where will they fly all those planes profitably?
 
myki
Posts: 586
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Re: Wizz Air News and Discussion - 2023

Wed Aug 02, 2023 11:42 pm

Perhaps 5W could take a few to start flying east out of AUH?
 
TS811
Posts: 132
Joined: Wed Nov 02, 2022 9:24 am

Re: Wizz Air News and Discussion - 2023

Thu Aug 03, 2023 9:25 am

myki wrote:
Perhaps 5W could take a few to start flying east out of AUH?


If they could I'm sure they'd double the fleet in Abu Dhabi and fly to India, but that market is heavily restricted. India's Minister of Civil Aviation already denied the Gulf carriers' requests to increase their capacity to India earlier this year. Pakistan also seems to be dragging their feet.

That's the main issue with the Wizz Air Abu Dhabi venture. In Europe, Wizz Air flies wherever they see an opportunity to make money. In Abu Dhabi, Wizz Air flies wherever they get permission.
 
TexasAirCorp
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Re: Wizz Air News and Discussion - 2023

Thu Aug 03, 2023 9:27 am

PhilipBass wrote:
Where will they fly all those planes profitably?


The real question is how many will they actually end up taking delivery of…
 
holczakker
Posts: 403
Joined: Sun May 26, 2019 7:34 pm

Re: Wizz Air News and Discussion - 2023

Thu Aug 03, 2023 11:12 am

TexasAirCorp wrote:
The real question is how many will they actually end up taking delivery of…

Yep.

Summer capacity has been cut again like last year. You all know the reason: the cheeky supply chain is still behaving badly.
https://travelweekly.co.uk/news/air/summer-capacity-growth-trimmed-by-wizz-air
 
EIBPI
Posts: 340
Joined: Wed Aug 21, 2019 4:15 pm

Re: Wizz Air News and Discussion - 2023

Thu Aug 03, 2023 12:43 pm

holczakker wrote:
TexasAirCorp wrote:
The real question is how many will they actually end up taking delivery of…

Yep.

Summer capacity has been cut again like last year. You all know the reason: the cheeky supply chain is still behaving badly.
https://travelweekly.co.uk/news/air/summer-capacity-growth-trimmed-by-wizz-air


Still maintaining 25+% capacity growth, which is hardly a bad number. Revenue and profit is in line with guidance.

A few interesting things in the investor call: no Saudi Arabia news, AUH is being refleeted with CEOs (as previously rumoured), JV didn’t have much to say about the ridiculous overcapacity in Albania, no return to Ukraine anytime soon (less positive message than Ryanair in this point).

Does anyone have the latest overview of aircraft at each base?
 
TexasAirCorp
Posts: 1111
Joined: Sat Mar 20, 2021 5:24 pm

Re: Wizz Air News and Discussion - 2023

Thu Aug 03, 2023 12:57 pm

EIBPI wrote:
AUH is being refleeted with CEOs (as previously rumoured)


Is there an exact reason for this? Surely NEOs would be more beneficial on 6-7 hour flights out of AUH?
 
TS811
Posts: 132
Joined: Wed Nov 02, 2022 9:24 am

Re: Wizz Air News and Discussion - 2023

Thu Aug 03, 2023 12:57 pm

Abu Dhabi going to CEOs, wow. That has got to hurt. I assume that will have an impact on the range for some of the longer routes, such as Male?
 
Someone83
Posts: 6255
Joined: Sun Sep 17, 2006 5:47 pm

Re: Wizz Air News and Discussion - 2023

Thu Aug 03, 2023 1:01 pm

TS811 wrote:
Abu Dhabi going to CEOs, wow. That has got to hurt. I assume that will have an impact on the range for some of the longer routes, such as Male?


Abu Dhabi is just 1,630 nm. No issue for a CEO
 
TS811
Posts: 132
Joined: Wed Nov 02, 2022 9:24 am

Re: Wizz Air News and Discussion - 2023

Thu Aug 03, 2023 1:15 pm

Someone83 wrote:
TS811 wrote:
Abu Dhabi going to CEOs, wow. That has got to hurt. I assume that will have an impact on the range for some of the longer routes, such as Male?


Abu Dhabi is just 1,630 nm. No issue for a CEO


In a straight line, but have you seen Wizz Air's routing? They don't have ETOPS.
 
holczakker
Posts: 403
Joined: Sun May 26, 2019 7:34 pm

Re: Wizz Air News and Discussion - 2023

Thu Aug 03, 2023 1:35 pm

TexasAirCorp wrote:
Is there an exact reason for this? Surely NEOs would be more beneficial on 6-7 hour flights out of AUH?

Sand and heat are no friends of the PW GTF. Last summer some aircraft were out for months. Four of ten aircraft of Wizz Abu Dhabi is already replaced with ceos.
Last edited by holczakker on Thu Aug 03, 2023 1:43 pm, edited 1 time in total.
 
holczakker
Posts: 403
Joined: Sun May 26, 2019 7:34 pm

Re: Wizz Air News and Discussion - 2023

Thu Aug 03, 2023 1:42 pm

EIBPI wrote:
Still maintaining 25+% capacity growth, which is hardly a bad number. Revenue and profit is in line with guidance.

I still can't see how they could make 350-450 million full year if they made 61 in the first (and best) three months. And I have a feeling that a chunk of the disruption costs of June/July are not in the books yet.
 
holczakker
Posts: 403
Joined: Sun May 26, 2019 7:34 pm

Re: Wizz Air News and Discussion - 2023

Thu Aug 03, 2023 1:49 pm

The "fleet update" section saying "thus ending the first quarter with a total fleet of 182 aircraft: 44x A320ceo, 41x A321ceo, 6x A320neo, 91x A321neo" is not quite correct as they have 95 321neos (94 in service and one on ground - being re-registered from WIzz Abu Dhabi to WZZ)..
 
TS811
Posts: 132
Joined: Wed Nov 02, 2022 9:24 am

Re: Wizz Air News and Discussion - 2023

Thu Aug 03, 2023 2:15 pm

holczakker wrote:
EIBPI wrote:
Still maintaining 25+% capacity growth, which is hardly a bad number. Revenue and profit is in line with guidance.

I still can't see how they could make 350-450 million full year if they made 61 in the first (and best) three months. And I have a feeling that a chunk of the disruption costs of June/July are not in the books yet.


The first three months of their fiscal year aren't the best, they're perhaps a bit above average (if Easter falls in April). Q2 will be the best. If they're right about their guidance, I expect profit for Q2 to be around 400 million, and then Q3 and Q4 will be negative and offset the 61 million from Q1.
 
PhilipBass
Posts: 900
Joined: Fri Feb 19, 2021 6:30 pm

Re: Wizz Air News and Discussion - 2023

Thu Aug 03, 2023 7:07 pm

https://businessplus.ie/news/jozsef-varadi-wizz-air/

That incentive deal will definitely militate against sustainable growth of Wizz. Recklessness will be order of the day.
 
holczakker
Posts: 403
Joined: Sun May 26, 2019 7:34 pm

Re: Wizz Air News and Discussion - 2023

Fri Aug 04, 2023 8:04 am

TS811 wrote:
I expect profit for Q2 to be around 400 million, and then Q3 and Q4 will be negative and offset the 61 million from Q1.


I think there's no way that would happen with the amount of disruptions they have, the weakening demand, the engine problems, the crew shortage etc.
 
EIBPI
Posts: 340
Joined: Wed Aug 21, 2019 4:15 pm

Re: Wizz Air News and Discussion - 2023

Fri Aug 04, 2023 8:14 am

holczakker wrote:
TS811 wrote:
I expect profit for Q2 to be around 400 million, and then Q3 and Q4 will be negative and offset the 61 million from Q1.


I think there's no way that would happen with the amount of disruptions they have, the weakening demand, the engine problems, the crew shortage etc.


Well the message during the investor call yesterday is that the company is having a very strong Q2. I doubt the Wizz management can be fully lying to investors but we will of course find out in 3 months time.
 
EIBPI
Posts: 340
Joined: Wed Aug 21, 2019 4:15 pm

Re: Wizz Air News and Discussion - 2023

Fri Aug 04, 2023 8:15 am

myki wrote:
Perhaps 5W could take a few to start flying east out of AUH?


The aircraft ordered are for the group including the AUH operation.

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