Moderators: richierich, ua900, PanAm_DC10, hOMSaR
GSP psgr wrote:pmartin wrote:I am not surprised at all that GVA is a year round destination for DL. DL generates 60,000 pax and usd 80m of revenues from GVA offline. This is a good basis for channeling O&D traffic through JFK (instead of Paris or Amsterdam). And GVA profile is not eminently tourist driven and seasonal. There is a year round business traffic flow, which provides very high yield to JFK (the highest in Europe in fact). And winter months are as strong as summer peaks due to the ski season.
With DL going big on GVA, I think that ends any chances for a seasonal JFK-LYS for awhile. LYS is a market that I'm surprised DL hasn't returned to; guess that it's a function of Geneva's proximity and the need to fill all of those CDG seats. AC (and seasonally Transat) makes it work with a 330 from YUL, so there's clearly a transatlantic market there. Comparatively, GVA has UA to EWR and IAD, Swiss to JFK, AC to YUL, and now DL to JFK. Guess that tells the whole story about relative yields.
AdEd wrote:panamair wrote:Looks like JFK-VCE has also been extended to year-round service with the schedule update this weekend
So now we have only CPH, NCE, PRG, and KEF as seasonal TATL destinations from JFK?
Reducing reliance on seasonal flights, but by finding a way to make them work year-round instead of ending them. ATL-BCN/MXP and BOS-LIS/FCO are also year-round now.
ContinentalEWR wrote:GSP psgr wrote:pmartin wrote:I am not surprised at all that GVA is a year round destination for DL. DL generates 60,000 pax and usd 80m of revenues from GVA offline. This is a good basis for channeling O&D traffic through JFK (instead of Paris or Amsterdam). And GVA profile is not eminently tourist driven and seasonal. There is a year round business traffic flow, which provides very high yield to JFK (the highest in Europe in fact). And winter months are as strong as summer peaks due to the ski season.
With DL going big on GVA, I think that ends any chances for a seasonal JFK-LYS for awhile. LYS is a market that I'm surprised DL hasn't returned to; guess that it's a function of Geneva's proximity and the need to fill all of those CDG seats. AC (and seasonally Transat) makes it work with a 330 from YUL, so there's clearly a transatlantic market there. Comparatively, GVA has UA to EWR and IAD, Swiss to JFK, AC to YUL, and now DL to JFK. Guess that tells the whole story about relative yields.
Doubtful DL will ever resume JFK-LYS. The route was short lived when it operated (AA also tried it in the late 1980s, though a different time entirely, and also didn't succeed). Service to France is very Paris-centric from the US, with NCE an increasingly popular seasonal add. GVA has a larger catchment area than LYS and LYS and its region is well connected on France's rail networks so less likely to require a nonstop to the US. The 321XLR seems like the right plane for this route, but doubt it will be AA to fly to LYS.
ORDLHR787 wrote:There has been a little bit of talk (not much but a little) about the competitive advantage DL has at ORD over UA and AA for the next 3-5 years being colocated with its JV partners in T5. Any chance DL will try to exploit this by adding new routes or frequencies into ORD?
flyaa757 wrote:I tried putting together an aircraft utilization schedule for DL this summer and I must have some gaps or am forgetting a few routes. Can anyone help? To me 764 and 332 are over-booked, all other fleets have significant availability, especially 763.
767300ER(28 frames needed)
JFKFCO
JFKLGW
JFKMXP
JFKATH
JFKCPH
JFKBCN
JFKMAD
JFKDUB
JFKPRG
JFKLIS
JFKVCE
JFKBER
JFKEDI
JFKARN
JFKBRU
JFKACC
ATLDUS/STR alternate
ATLMXP
ATLVCE
ATLEDI
ATLGRU
ATLMAD
ATLBCN
HNLSLC
HNLLAX
HNLJFK
LAXJFK
LAXJFK
767400ER(22/21 frames needed)
JFKFCO
JFKLHR
JFKCDG
JFKCDG
JFKCDG
JFKGVA
JFKNCE
JFKGRU
JFKZRH
DTWMUC
CVGCDG/3rd ATLCDG alternate
ATLLHR
ATLLHR
ATLCDG
ATLMUC
ATLNCE
ATLEZE
BOSLHR
RDUCDG
EZEATL
GRUJFK
LAXJFK
A330200(11/10 frames needed)
JFKFRA
DTWFRA
DTWFCO
DTWLHR
DTWLHR
DTWHNL
MSPLHR
ATLFRA
ATLLOS
pdxhnd
A330300(28/31 frames needed)
JFKFCO
JFKMXP
JFKAMS
JFKATH
DTWAMS
DTWAMS
DTWCDG
DTWHNL
MSPAMS
MSPAMS
MSPAMS
MSPCDG
ATLHNL
ATLAMS
ATLAMS
ATLFCO
ATLFCO
ATLGRU
ATLDUB
BOSFCO
BOSAMS
BOSAMS
SEAAMS
SEAAMS
SEACDG
SEALHR
PDXAMS
GRUATL
A330900(17 frames needed)
JFKLHR
JFKAMS
JFKTLV
MSPICN
MSPHND
MSPCDG
MSPHNL
BOSATH
BOSCDG
SLCCDG
SLCLHR
SLCAMS
SEAHND
SEAICN
LAXLHR
LAXHND
TLVJFK
A350900(19-20 frames needed)
DTWAMS
DTWICN
DTWHND
DTWPVG
ATLCDG
ATLAMS
ATLATH
ATLTLV
ATLSCL
ATLLIM
ATLICN
ATLHND
ATLJNB
LAXSYD
LAXCDG
TLVATL
SYDLAX
JNBATL
SCLATL
kavok wrote:ORDLHR787 wrote:There has been a little bit of talk (not much but a little) about the competitive advantage DL has at ORD over UA and AA for the next 3-5 years being colocated with its JV partners in T5. Any chance DL will try to exploit this by adding new routes or frequencies into ORD?
Doubtful. From their hub in MSP, DL only has TATL to AMS/CDG/LHR, plus the FI response flight on MSP-KEF.
As an outstation, ORD is not going to get anything on DL that MSP doesn’t have. Besides, ORD-AMS/CDG are both better served by KL/AF than DL…. and if LHR-ORD ever returns on SkyTeam, it too will almost certainly be VS operated again.
flyaa757 wrote:I tried putting together an aircraft utilization schedule for DL this summer and I must have some gaps or am forgetting a few routes. Can anyone help? To me 764 and 332 are over-booked, all other fleets have significant availability, especially 763.
767300ER(28 frames needed)
JFKFCO
JFKLGW
JFKMXP
JFKATH
JFKCPH
JFKBCN
JFKMAD
JFKDUB
JFKPRG
JFKLIS
JFKVCE
JFKBER
JFKEDI
JFKARN
JFKBRU
JFKACC
ATLDUS/STR alternate
ATLMXP
ATLVCE
ATLEDI
ATLGRU
ATLMAD
ATLBCN
HNLSLC
HNLLAX
HNLJFK
LAXJFK
LAXJFK
767400ER(22/21 frames needed)
JFKFCO
JFKLHR
JFKCDG
JFKCDG
JFKCDG
JFKGVA
JFKNCE
JFKGRU
JFKZRH
DTWMUC
CVGCDG/3rd ATLCDG alternate
ATLLHR
ATLLHR
ATLCDG
ATLMUC
ATLNCE
ATLEZE
BOSLHR
RDUCDG
EZEATL
GRUJFK
LAXJFK
A330200(11/10 frames needed)
JFKFRA
DTWFRA
DTWFCO
DTWLHR
DTWLHR
DTWHNL
MSPLHR
ATLFRA
ATLLOS
pdxhnd
A330300(28/31 frames needed)
JFKFCO
JFKMXP
JFKAMS
JFKATH
DTWAMS
DTWAMS
DTWCDG
DTWHNL
MSPAMS
MSPAMS
MSPAMS
MSPCDG
ATLHNL
ATLAMS
ATLAMS
ATLFCO
ATLFCO
ATLGRU
ATLDUB
BOSFCO
BOSAMS
BOSAMS
SEAAMS
SEAAMS
SEACDG
SEALHR
PDXAMS
GRUATL
A330900(17 frames needed)
JFKLHR
JFKAMS
JFKTLV
MSPICN
MSPHND
MSPCDG
MSPHNL
BOSATH
BOSCDG
SLCCDG
SLCLHR
SLCAMS
SEAHND
SEAICN
LAXLHR
LAXHND
TLVJFK
A350900(19-20 frames needed)
DTWAMS
DTWICN
DTWHND
DTWPVG
ATLCDG
ATLAMS
ATLATH
ATLTLV
ATLSCL
ATLLIM
ATLICN
ATLHND
ATLJNB
LAXSYD
LAXCDG
TLVATL
SYDLAX
JNBATL
SCLATL
flyaa757 wrote:A350900(19-20 frames needed)
DTWAMS
DTWICN
DTWHND
DTWPVG
ATLCDG
ATLAMS
ATLATH
ATLTLV
ATLSCL
ATLLIM
ATLICN
ATLHND
ATLJNB
LAXSYD
LAXCDG
TLVATL
SYDLAX
JNBATL
SCLATL
flyaa757 wrote:I tried putting together an aircraft utilization schedule for DL this summer and I must have some gaps or am forgetting a few routes. Can anyone help? To me 764 and 332 are over-booked, all other fleets have significant availability, especially 763.
767300ER(28 frames needed)
JFKFCO
JFKLGW
JFKMXP
JFKATH
JFKCPH
JFKBCN
JFKMAD
JFKDUB
JFKPRG
JFKLIS
JFKVCE
JFKBER
JFKEDI
JFKARN
JFKBRU
JFKACC
ATLDUS/STR alternate
ATLMXP
ATLVCE
ATLEDI
ATLGRU
ATLMAD
ATLBCN
HNLSLC
HNLLAX
HNLJFK
LAXJFK
LAXJFK
767400ER(22/21 frames needed)
JFKFCO
JFKLHR
JFKCDG
JFKCDG
JFKCDG
JFKGVA
JFKNCE
JFKGRU
JFKZRH
DTWMUC
CVGCDG/3rd ATLCDG alternate
ATLLHR
ATLLHR
ATLCDG
ATLMUC
ATLNCE
ATLEZE
BOSLHR
RDUCDG
EZEATL
GRUJFK
LAXJFK
A330200(11/10 frames needed)
JFKFRA
DTWFRA
DTWFCO
DTWLHR
DTWLHR
DTWHNL
MSPLHR
ATLFRA
ATLLOS
pdxhnd
A330300(28/31 frames needed)
JFKFCO
JFKMXP
JFKAMS
JFKATH
DTWAMS
DTWAMS
DTWCDG
DTWHNL
MSPAMS
MSPAMS
MSPAMS
MSPCDG
ATLHNL
ATLAMS
ATLAMS
ATLFCO
ATLFCO
ATLGRU
ATLDUB
BOSFCO
BOSAMS
BOSAMS
SEAAMS
SEAAMS
SEACDG
SEALHR
PDXAMS
GRUATL
A330900(17 frames needed)
JFKLHR
JFKAMS
JFKTLV
MSPICN
MSPHND
MSPCDG
MSPHNL
BOSATH
BOSCDG
SLCCDG
SLCLHR
SLCAMS
SEAHND
SEAICN
LAXLHR
LAXHND
TLVJFK
A350900(19-20 frames needed)
DTWAMS
DTWICN
DTWHND
DTWPVG
ATLCDG
ATLAMS
ATLATH
ATLTLV
ATLSCL
ATLLIM
ATLICN
ATLHND
ATLJNB
LAXSYD
LAXCDG
TLVATL
SYDLAX
JNBATL
SCLATL
ORDLHR787 wrote:There has been a little bit of talk (not much but a little) about the competitive advantage DL has at ORD over UA and AA for the next 3-5 years being colocated with its JV partners in T5. Any chance DL will try to exploit this by adding new routes or frequencies into ORD?
BB78710 wrote:ORDLHR787 wrote:There has been a little bit of talk (not much but a little) about the competitive advantage DL has at ORD over UA and AA for the next 3-5 years being colocated with its JV partners in T5. Any chance DL will try to exploit this by adding new routes or frequencies into ORD?
There is no competitive advantage for DL at ORD because for DL ORD is a O&D (line) station.
I honestly would be shocked if a search on Delta.com allowed passengers to book a connection to another Delta flight or even an AF or KL flight out of ORD.
Polot wrote:BB78710 wrote:ORDLHR787 wrote:There has been a little bit of talk (not much but a little) about the competitive advantage DL has at ORD over UA and AA for the next 3-5 years being colocated with its JV partners in T5. Any chance DL will try to exploit this by adding new routes or frequencies into ORD?
There is no competitive advantage for DL at ORD because for DL ORD is a O&D (line) station.
I honestly would be shocked if a search on Delta.com allowed passengers to book a connection to another Delta flight or even an AF or KL flight out of ORD.
It might. But ultimately DL is only serving their hubs from ORD, that already have JV nonstops, so encouraging connections over ORD is literally just chasing after the lowest yielding traffic. There is no incentive for DL to add additional flights out of ORD unless can compete in local Chicago market, because there is no reason to connect passengers through ORD vs DTW or MSP.
BB78710 wrote:I honestly would be shocked if a search on Delta.com allowed passengers to book a connection to another Delta flight or even an AF or KL flight out of ORD.
centrair wrote:
So sad that ICN-MSP will downgrade to A330-900. Good aircraft but it was nice to see the flagship flying the route.
B752OS wrote:flyaa757 wrote:I tried putting together an aircraft utilization schedule for DL this summer and I must have some gaps or am forgetting a few routes. Can anyone help? To me 764 and 332 are over-booked, all other fleets have significant availability, especially 763.
767300ER(28 frames needed)
JFKFCO
JFKLGW
JFKMXP
JFKATH
JFKCPH
JFKBCN
JFKMAD
JFKDUB
JFKPRG
JFKLIS
JFKVCE
JFKBER
JFKEDI
JFKARN
JFKBRU
JFKACC
ATLDUS/STR alternate
ATLMXP
ATLVCE
ATLEDI
ATLGRU
ATLMAD
ATLBCN
HNLSLC
HNLLAX
HNLJFK
LAXJFK
LAXJFK
767400ER(22/21 frames needed)
JFKFCO
JFKLHR
JFKCDG
JFKCDG
JFKCDG
JFKGVA
JFKNCE
JFKGRU
JFKZRH
DTWMUC
CVGCDG/3rd ATLCDG alternate
ATLLHR
ATLLHR
ATLCDG
ATLMUC
ATLNCE
ATLEZE
BOSLHR
RDUCDG
EZEATL
GRUJFK
LAXJFK
A330200(11/10 frames needed)
JFKFRA
DTWFRA
DTWFCO
DTWLHR
DTWLHR
DTWHNL
MSPLHR
ATLFRA
ATLLOS
pdxhnd
A330300(28/31 frames needed)
JFKFCO
JFKMXP
JFKAMS
JFKATH
DTWAMS
DTWAMS
DTWCDG
DTWHNL
MSPAMS
MSPAMS
MSPAMS
MSPCDG
ATLHNL
ATLAMS
ATLAMS
ATLFCO
ATLFCO
ATLGRU
ATLDUB
BOSFCO
BOSAMS
BOSAMS
SEAAMS
SEAAMS
SEACDG
SEALHR
PDXAMS
GRUATL
A330900(17 frames needed)
JFKLHR
JFKAMS
JFKTLV
MSPICN
MSPHND
MSPCDG
MSPHNL
BOSATH
BOSCDG
SLCCDG
SLCLHR
SLCAMS
SEAHND
SEAICN
LAXLHR
LAXHND
TLVJFK
A350900(19-20 frames needed)
DTWAMS
DTWICN
DTWHND
DTWPVG
ATLCDG
ATLAMS
ATLATH
ATLTLV
ATLSCL
ATLLIM
ATLICN
ATLHND
ATLJNB
LAXSYD
LAXCDG
TLVATL
SYDLAX
JNBATL
SCLATL
You're missing BOS-DUB (763), BOS-LIS (763), BOS-EDI (763), and BOS-TLV (339)
AdEd wrote:flyaa757 wrote:A350900(19-20 frames needed)
DTWAMS
DTWICN
DTWHND
DTWPVG
ATLCDG
ATLAMS
ATLATH
ATLTLV
ATLSCL
ATLLIM
ATLICN
ATLHND
ATLJNB
LAXSYD
LAXCDG
TLVATL
SYDLAX
JNBATL
SCLATL
Interesting. DL will have up to 26 active A350s this summer, or even 27. You missed ATL-CPT. ATL-BCN is also switching to the A350 early on I believe
flyaa757 wrote:B752OS wrote:flyaa757 wrote:I tried putting together an aircraft utilization schedule for DL this summer and I must have some gaps or am forgetting a few routes. Can anyone help? To me 764 and 332 are over-booked, all other fleets have significant availability, especially 763.
767300ER(28 frames needed)
JFKFCO
JFKLGW
JFKMXP
JFKATH
JFKCPH
JFKBCN
JFKMAD
JFKDUB
JFKPRG
JFKLIS
JFKVCE
JFKBER
JFKEDI
JFKARN
JFKBRU
JFKACC
ATLDUS/STR alternate
ATLMXP
ATLVCE
ATLEDI
ATLGRU
ATLMAD
ATLBCN
HNLSLC
HNLLAX
HNLJFK
LAXJFK
LAXJFK
767400ER(22/21 frames needed)
JFKFCO
JFKLHR
JFKCDG
JFKCDG
JFKCDG
JFKGVA
JFKNCE
JFKGRU
JFKZRH
DTWMUC
CVGCDG/3rd ATLCDG alternate
ATLLHR
ATLLHR
ATLCDG
ATLMUC
ATLNCE
ATLEZE
BOSLHR
RDUCDG
EZEATL
GRUJFK
LAXJFK
A330200(11/10 frames needed)
JFKFRA
DTWFRA
DTWFCO
DTWLHR
DTWLHR
DTWHNL
MSPLHR
ATLFRA
ATLLOS
pdxhnd
A330300(28/31 frames needed)
JFKFCO
JFKMXP
JFKAMS
JFKATH
DTWAMS
DTWAMS
DTWCDG
DTWHNL
MSPAMS
MSPAMS
MSPAMS
MSPCDG
ATLHNL
ATLAMS
ATLAMS
ATLFCO
ATLFCO
ATLGRU
ATLDUB
BOSFCO
BOSAMS
BOSAMS
SEAAMS
SEAAMS
SEACDG
SEALHR
PDXAMS
GRUATL
A330900(17 frames needed)
JFKLHR
JFKAMS
JFKTLV
MSPICN
MSPHND
MSPCDG
MSPHNL
BOSATH
BOSCDG
SLCCDG
SLCLHR
SLCAMS
SEAHND
SEAICN
LAXLHR
LAXHND
TLVJFK
A350900(19-20 frames needed)
DTWAMS
DTWICN
DTWHND
DTWPVG
ATLCDG
ATLAMS
ATLATH
ATLTLV
ATLSCL
ATLLIM
ATLICN
ATLHND
ATLJNB
LAXSYD
LAXCDG
TLVATL
SYDLAX
JNBATL
SCLATL
You're missing BOS-DUB (763), BOS-LIS (763), BOS-EDI (763), and BOS-TLV (339)
Thanks. Added the 3 763 routes, but BOS-TLV doesnt show operating on dl.com for this summer... check 7/14
gregn21 wrote:Schedule has been updated to reflect the new year round TATL services.
Of note: LAX-CDG will change from 359 to 35L on 10/29/23 (service previously scheduled to end 10/27/23). Appears to remain daily even with the increased seat count.
gstpa wrote:I just checked a few and found BOS-TLV operating on 7/15. Also, JNB and CPT are both flown nonstop, the JNB/CPT triangle route is only on certain days. Check 7/15 again and ATL-JNB and ATL-CPT both operate independently.
gregn21 wrote:Schedule has been updated to reflect the new year round TATL services.
Of note: LAX-CDG will change from 359 to 35L on 10/29/23 (service previously scheduled to end 10/27/23). Appears to remain daily even with the increased seat count.
flyaa757 wrote:[
22/21 764
I'd expect the following:
At least 1-2 764 r/t's need to be shifted to different fleets.
flyaa757 wrote:AdEd wrote:flyaa757 wrote:A350900(19-20 frames needed)
DTWAMS
DTWICN
DTWHND
DTWPVG
ATLCDG
ATLAMS
ATLATH
ATLTLV
ATLSCL
ATLLIM
ATLICN
ATLHND
ATLJNB
LAXSYD
LAXCDG
TLVATL
SYDLAX
JNBATL
SCLATL
Interesting. DL will have up to 26 active A350s this summer, or even 27. You missed ATL-CPT. ATL-BCN is also switching to the A350 early on I believe
I included JNB, which I believe is operating as a triangle with CPT.
flyaa757 wrote:gstpa wrote:I just checked a few and found BOS-TLV operating on 7/15. Also, JNB and CPT are both flown nonstop, the JNB/CPT triangle route is only on certain days. Check 7/15 again and ATL-JNB and ATL-CPT both operate independently.
Got it. Thanks. With these changes, I still see the need for fewer widebodies this summer than usual. Curious if there will be additional adds... lots of room in 763 and 359 fleets
31/41 763
22/21 764
11-12/10 332 with one/pair stranded at PDX/HND (change to 333?)
28/31 333
19/20 339
~20-21 359
I'd expect the following:
At least 1-2 764 r/t's need to be shifted to different fleets. I'd predict a 359 taking an ATLCDG rotation.
I'd expect PDX-AMS to shift to a 332, but then the 332s are even more over-scheduled. Swapping DTWFCO and DTWHNL to 333s would balance things nicely.
Interestingly, with the exception of the PDXHND, the 332 fleet is now entirely Atlantic. Shows the impact of the Asia cuts. Also, with 764 and 333 fleets being the highest utilized, clearly they are the $$$ makers!
TonyClifton wrote:gregn21 wrote:Schedule has been updated to reflect the new year round TATL services.
Of note: LAX-CDG will change from 359 to 35L on 10/29/23 (service previously scheduled to end 10/27/23). Appears to remain daily even with the increased seat count.
It appears they’re somewhat trying to match fleets with pilot bases. LAX getting the 350 for this, MSP the 330 for ICN. Avoids the 7-9 day trips of DTW ICN MSP ICN DTW and such.
LAXdude1023 wrote:BB78710 wrote:I honestly would be shocked if a search on Delta.com allowed passengers to book a connection to another Delta flight or even an AF or KL flight out of ORD.
I mean why wouldnt they allow it? DL/AF/KL all have a joint venture with one another. They don't care which metal your on. In GDS, you can book it with DL flight numbers no problem on a connection.
3 DL/KL 9382 AMS - AMSTERDAM --> ORD - CHICAGO 789 8h 55min J9 C9 D9 I9 Z9 Y9 B9 M9 H9 Q9 K9 L9 U9 T9 X9 V9 E9
Delta Air Lines 15FEB, 12:35 15FEB, 14:30
4 DL 1492 ORD - CHICAGO --> SLC - SALT LAKE CITY 738 3h 40min J5 C5 D5 I5 Z5 W9 S9 Y9 B9 M9 H9 Q9 K9 L9 U9 T9 X9 V9 E9
Delta Air Lines 15FEB, 19:35 15FEB, 22:15
TonyClifton wrote:flyaa757 wrote:gstpa wrote:I just checked a few and found BOS-TLV operating on 7/15. Also, JNB and CPT are both flown nonstop, the JNB/CPT triangle route is only on certain days. Check 7/15 again and ATL-JNB and ATL-CPT both operate independently.
Got it. Thanks. With these changes, I still see the need for fewer widebodies this summer than usual. Curious if there will be additional adds... lots of room in 763 and 359 fleets
31/41 763
22/21 764
11-12/10 332 with one/pair stranded at PDX/HND (change to 333?)
28/31 333
19/20 339
~20-21 359
I'd expect the following:
At least 1-2 764 r/t's need to be shifted to different fleets. I'd predict a 359 taking an ATLCDG rotation.
I'd expect PDX-AMS to shift to a 332, but then the 332s are even more over-scheduled. Swapping DTWFCO and DTWHNL to 333s would balance things nicely.
Interestingly, with the exception of the PDXHND, the 332 fleet is now entirely Atlantic. Shows the impact of the Asia cuts. Also, with 764 and 333 fleets being the highest utilized, clearly they are the $$$ makers!
764 is the perfect East coast US-Europe jet. Not an ounce of fat on it, perfectly sized for that type of flying with no excess weight. Great cabin config nose to tail. If you could slap a bigger wing on it, it would be perfect. I’m convinced DL and UA would take a stack more if a legit 764”max” was designed. It’s a little undersized for anything beyond east coast with cargo and alternate fuel. Perfect for what it does, when you don’t need 330/787 capability.
PSU.DTW.SCE wrote:Nice preliminary summary flyAA757.....
With the 763, I think there are some additional Central / South America routes that have been typically operating with the 763....
ATL-BOG, JFK-BOG, ATL-UIO, ATL-LIM
I didn't look for the summer schedule, but I know they've been doing that, and I'm sure they'll also do some domestic flights out of ATL as well.
flyaa757 wrote:
I included JNB, which I believe is operating as a triangle with CPT.
panamair wrote:flyaa757 wrote:[
22/21 764
I'd expect the following:
At least 1-2 764 r/t's need to be shifted to different fleets.
Re: the 764s, you have one extra ATL-CDG; the only 764 on ATL-CDG is the 4x weekly one rotating with the 3x CVG-CDG. Also JFK-ZRH currently shows as switching to the 763 on 8 May. With those changes, it should be down to 19 of 21.
audidudi wrote:As you have LAX->JFK listed for the B763ER, what about SFO->JFK? Unless that is going to be flown by the 75S.
flyaa757 wrote:panamair wrote:flyaa757 wrote:[
22/21 764
I'd expect the following:
At least 1-2 764 r/t's need to be shifted to different fleets.
Re: the 764s, you have one extra ATL-CDG; the only 764 on ATL-CDG is the 4x weekly one rotating with the 3x CVG-CDG. Also JFK-ZRH currently shows as switching to the 763 on 8 May. With those changes, it should be down to 19 of 21.
Nope, I'm counting the 3rd ATL-CDG as alternating with CVG-CDG. ATL-CDG is 11x 764, 7x 350. CVG-CDG is 3x 764.
flyaa757 wrote:audidudi wrote:As you have LAX->JFK listed for the B763ER, what about SFO->JFK? Unless that is going to be flown by the 75S.
No 763s scheduled for summer on SFO-JFK. Mainly 75S.
Interestingly, very few widebody domestics. All I can find are the JFKLAX 763s and the occasional ATLLAX 350.
LAXdude1023 wrote:BB78710 wrote:I honestly would be shocked if a search on Delta.com allowed passengers to book a connection to another Delta flight or even an AF or KL flight out of ORD.
I mean why wouldnt they allow it? DL/AF/KL all have a joint venture with one another. They don't care which metal your on. In GDS, you can book it with DL flight numbers no problem on a connection.
3 DL/KL 9382 AMS - AMSTERDAM --> ORD - CHICAGO 789 8h 55min J9 C9 D9 I9 Z9 Y9 B9 M9 H9 Q9 K9 L9 U9 T9 X9 V9 E9
Delta Air Lines 15FEB, 12:35 15FEB, 14:30
4 DL 1492 ORD - CHICAGO --> SLC - SALT LAKE CITY 738 3h 40min J5 C5 D5 I5 Z5 W9 S9 Y9 B9 M9 H9 Q9 K9 L9 U9 T9 X9 V9 E9
Delta Air Lines 15FEB, 19:35 15FEB, 22:15
tempesama wrote:Surely any London-Chicago demand would be inbound from London - i.e. the base of Virgin FC - and soon to be SkyTeam members, who need to travel to Chicago, but otherwise might have gone BA/UA rather than connecting in AMS or CDG, or DTW etc...
also useful for the many UK-based folks who might go on a 2+ city US business trip, which happens, and might now be possible on their preferred alliance and Virgin. Although ORD-SFO and LAX on DL is still to me a major gap. Hamstrung me just this week, with an LA added to a Chicago trip.
Virgin LHR-ORD felt like it should have always been viable, but this should make it more so.
BB78710 wrote:LAXdude1023 wrote:BB78710 wrote:I honestly would be shocked if a search on Delta.com allowed passengers to book a connection to another Delta flight or even an AF or KL flight out of ORD.
I mean why wouldnt they allow it? DL/AF/KL all have a joint venture with one another. They don't care which metal your on. In GDS, you can book it with DL flight numbers no problem on a connection.
3 DL/KL 9382 AMS - AMSTERDAM --> ORD - CHICAGO 789 8h 55min J9 C9 D9 I9 Z9 Y9 B9 M9 H9 Q9 K9 L9 U9 T9 X9 V9 E9
Delta Air Lines 15FEB, 12:35 15FEB, 14:30
4 DL 1492 ORD - CHICAGO --> SLC - SALT LAKE CITY 738 3h 40min J5 C5 D5 I5 Z5 W9 S9 Y9 B9 M9 H9 Q9 K9 L9 U9 T9 X9 V9 E9
Delta Air Lines 15FEB, 19:35 15FEB, 22:15
The general public does not use GDS they use Delta.com or some other search engine.
Without question there is a lot travel agents can do in GDS but what is the ratio of passengers who book tickets through a travel agent vs booking directly through Delta.com? Even using search engines like Kayak.com, Priceline or others they don't give customers the option to connect from a Delta domestic flight to AF or KLM at ORD. So unless a customers is booking directly with a travel agent it doesn't show up as an option meaning there is no competitive advantage at this point in time because Delta treats ORD as a O&D line station not a station where connections are made.
Delta has a lot opportunity to grow at ORD they now have more gates than they've had in recent years and they can without question run more flights out of Chicago than ever. But the idea that Delta now has a competitive edge over American or United at ORD simply because they've moved to T5 and are co-located with other Skyteam members is more myth than reality. If anything I expect to see Delta focus more on O&D passengers at ORD and add routes out of ORD to destinations like LAX than transiting ORD into a connection station.
SESGDL wrote:The only thing DL's missing from ORD is LAX, and I'm not sure yet why DL hasn't thrown 3 or 4 daily A220s on the route and called it a day. It might get a heavy response from AA and UA, but certainly no more competitive than other routes DL's jumped into over the last decade or so (LAX-DEN, LGA/BOS-ORD).
Jeremy
SESGDL wrote:The only thing DL's missing from ORD is LAX, and I'm not sure yet why DL hasn't thrown 3 or 4 daily A220s on the route and called it a day. It might get a heavy response from AA and UA, but certainly no more competitive than other routes DL's jumped into over the last decade or so (LAX-DEN, LGA/BOS-ORD).
Jeremy
nbc7 wrote:SESGDL wrote:The only thing DL's missing from ORD is LAX, and I'm not sure yet why DL hasn't thrown 3 or 4 daily A220s on the route and called it a day. It might get a heavy response from AA and UA, but certainly no more competitive than other routes DL's jumped into over the last decade or so (LAX-DEN, LGA/BOS-ORD).
Jeremy
LHR is another glaring hole (and likewise Chicago is a massive hole for Virgin Atlantic not to serve)