Atlanta Aviation - 2023

hOMSaR · Sat Dec 31, 2022 11:40 pm

Welcome to the Atlanta Aviation thread - 2023 edition.

Please continue to post your news and discussions below.

Link to the locked 2022 edition:
viewtopic.php?f=3&t=1468487

Boeing757100 · Sat Jan 07, 2023 2:17 pm

Any progress on the Concourse D widening project? Haven't been to ATL in few months to see for myself.

Polot · Sat Jan 07, 2023 2:32 pm

Boeing757100 wrote:
Any progress on the Concourse D widening project? Haven't been to ATL in few months to see for myself.

I don’t think it has started yet. Certainly hadn’t in early November when I was last in D.

I suspect they are waiting for all the gates in the new T expansion to open first, to move over (more or all of) AA and ease pressure of gate closures on D during construction.

bravoindia · Sat Jan 07, 2023 2:41 pm

Any idea why both an Eastern 767, came in yesterday. Went to signature I believe.

bigbird · Sat Jan 07, 2023 2:55 pm

How many gates are being added to the North end of T ?

Polot · Sat Jan 07, 2023 3:05 pm

bigbird wrote:
How many gates are being added to the North end of T ?

5 new gates plus old one reconfigured to allow for larger planes. 4 of the new gates opened in November, I’m not sure if the last new gate and reconfigured gate are both open yet.

flyaa757 · Sat Jan 07, 2023 3:20 pm

No progress yet on D. But it is much needed.

AMEX announced they are building a Centurion lounge in E. It will be the largest lounge @ ATL, and also the largest Centurion globally. Supposedly 3 outdoor decks.

In other news, I know AF is going to 17 weekly this summer, so it should be possible to see 2 AF tails on the ground on some days. Curious if we can get any new carriers in 2023? What are the candidates? SY? More AS? I had hope for HA, but with DL starting ATL-OGG, that's doubtful. TP? LA? Maybe AZ?

Love seeing AF, KL, VS, WS, CM, QR, TK, KE, AC lined up in F... would love even more colorful international tails...

Boeing757100 · Sat Jan 07, 2023 5:07 pm

flyaa757 wrote:
No progress yet on D. But it is much needed.

AMEX announced they are building a Centurion lounge in E. It will be the largest lounge @ ATL, and also the largest Centurion globally. Supposedly 3 outdoor decks.

In other news, I know AF is going to 17 weekly this summer, so it should be possible to see 2 AF tails on the ground on some days. Curious if we can get any new carriers in 2023? What are the candidates? SY? More AS? I had hope for HA, but with DL starting ATL-OGG, that's doubtful. TP? LA? Maybe AZ?

Love seeing AF, KL, VS, WS, CM, QR, TK, KE, AC lined up in F... would love even more colorful international tails...

Latam seems likely, but HA seems a bit far. I don’t think SY or G4 will come to ATL soon.

That said, my hope is that ATL will someday get a direct connection to India again, though I can say for sure it’s not gonna happen this year.

flyaa757 · Sat Jan 07, 2023 8:03 pm

The new T gates are open and look fantastic. New kiosks, LED panels, seating, vendors.

Currently, UA occupied the new gates and their old gates are walled off for some type of construction. Not sure what they're doing. Originally AA was going to take the UA gates, but no longer, which is kind of shocking. I fly though again on Thursday night and will take a look. UA doesnt need anywhere near the 9-10 gates @ ATL, so let's see...

N776AU · Sat Jan 07, 2023 8:48 pm

bravoindia wrote:
Any idea why both an Eastern 767, came in yesterday. Went to signature I believe.

Taking the UGA Redcoat Band to Los Angeles to the national championship game.

bigbird · Sat Jan 07, 2023 9:09 pm

So AA still has their split ops between T gates D Con?

flyaa757 · Sat Jan 07, 2023 9:27 pm

bigbird wrote:
So AA still has their split ops between T gates D Con?

Yes, they do. Amazingly, the legacy US destinations (PHL, CLT, PHX) tend to operate out of D, and the legacy AA (MIA, ORD, DFW, LGA) out of T.

I cannot imagine how that is efficient from an HR perspective, let alone a customer one. The T gates in ATL are by far the most convenient from a PAX perspective and I cannot imagine why a carrier wouldnt want them, unless the cost was egregious.

Polot · Sat Jan 07, 2023 9:30 pm

flyaa757 wrote:
bigbird wrote:
So AA still has their split ops between T gates D Con?

Yes, they do. Amazingly, the legacy US destinations (PHL, CLT, PHX) tend to operate out of D, and the legacy AA (MIA, ORD, DFW, LGA) out of T.

I cannot imagine how that is efficient from an HR perspective, let alone a customer one. The T gates in ATL are by far the most convenient from a PAX perspective and I cannot imagine why a carrier wouldnt want them, unless the cost was egregious.

It’s not efficient. But there are just not enough gates available in T to consolidate all their operations into-other airlines want T gates as well. So it’s either give up the prime desired gates and fully consolidate into D (DL would happily give AA D gates in exchange for more T gates) or run a split ops.

DFW and LAX are only AA destinations you can basically guarantee will be from T. PHX usually is but sometimes does operate from D. All the others vary and are split between D and T. It just depends on how lucky you are. If you are flying American Eagle it is almost always out of D.

bigbird · Sat Jan 07, 2023 9:31 pm

Is AA operating ant A321NEO from ATL?

DLvsWN · Sat Jan 07, 2023 9:59 pm

flyaa757 wrote:
No progress yet on D. But it is much needed.

AMEX announced they are building a Centurion lounge in E. It will be the largest lounge @ ATL, and also the largest Centurion globally. Supposedly 3 outdoor decks.

In other news, I know AF is going to 17 weekly this summer, so it should be possible to see 2 AF tails on the ground on some days. Curious if we can get any new carriers in 2023? What are the candidates? SY? More AS? I had hope for HA, but with DL starting ATL-OGG, that's doubtful. TP? LA? Maybe AZ?

Love seeing AF, KL, VS, WS, CM, QR, TK, KE, AC lined up in F... would love even more colorful international tails...

Certain days there are 6 flights between CDG and ATL. Insane density.

For new carriers, the ones you mentioned plus VB (Viva Aerobus), XP (Avelo), and expansion from WS (West Jet) seem most likely. Maybe AM randomly comes back.

Interested to keep watching F9 and its international expansion.

Boeing757100 · Sat Jan 07, 2023 10:18 pm

DLvsWN wrote:
For new carriers, the ones you mentioned plus VB (Viva Aerobus), XP (Avelo), and expansion from WS (West Jet) seem most likely. Maybe AM randomly comes back.

Interested to keep watching F9 and its international expansion.

Me personally, I think Latam and Aeromexico are more likely than Viva Aerobus or Avelo, but that's just me.

ALTF4 · Thu Jan 12, 2023 3:55 pm

flyaa757 wrote:
No progress yet on D. But it is much needed.

AMEX announced they are building a Centurion lounge in E. It will be the largest lounge @ ATL, and also the largest Centurion globally. Supposedly 3 outdoor decks.

In other news, I know AF is going to 17 weekly this summer, so it should be possible to see 2 AF tails on the ground on some days. Curious if we can get any new carriers in 2023? What are the candidates? SY? More AS? I had hope for HA, but with DL starting ATL-OGG, that's doubtful. TP? LA? Maybe AZ?

Love seeing AF, KL, VS, WS, CM, QR, TK, KE, AC lined up in F... would love even more colorful international tails...

We need you to do more wishing for us!

Ethiopian announces ADD-ATL.

https://onemileatatime.com/news/ethiopi ... a-flights/

Primary discussion here, but thought it was worth noting in this thread.

viewtopic.php?f=3&t=1480565

flyaa757 · Thu Jan 12, 2023 5:53 pm

ALTF4 wrote:
flyaa757 wrote:
No progress yet on D. But it is much needed.

AMEX announced they are building a Centurion lounge in E. It will be the largest lounge @ ATL, and also the largest Centurion globally. Supposedly 3 outdoor decks.

In other news, I know AF is going to 17 weekly this summer, so it should be possible to see 2 AF tails on the ground on some days. Curious if we can get any new carriers in 2023? What are the candidates? SY? More AS? I had hope for HA, but with DL starting ATL-OGG, that's doubtful. TP? LA? Maybe AZ?

Love seeing AF, KL, VS, WS, CM, QR, TK, KE, AC lined up in F... would love even more colorful international tails...

We need you to do more wishing for us!

Ethiopian announces ADD-ATL.

https://onemileatatime.com/news/ethiopi ... a-flights/

Primary discussion here, but thought it was worth noting in this thread.

viewtopic.php?f=3&t=1480565

Thrilled to see this news this morning... and the timing is different from most other T-ATL carriers...will give some more flavor to the mornings!

I arrived into T19 yesterday(one of the new gates). T13-T17 were in being restriped, and the gate areas are still blocked off for renovation. UA is not using any of them. I have a feeling someone besides AA/UA/DL took T17 based on the construction/investment - something's happening there.

I like the Viva Aerobus and Avelo ideas... perhaps Volaris could be a fit as well?

Had another thought... would love to see Silver expand into Georgia, maybe even as a codeshare with DL. Plenty of cities would be more efficiently served with ATRs... CSG, MCN, DHN etc.

Polot · Fri Jan 13, 2023 12:09 am

flyaa757 wrote:

Had another thought... would love to see Silver expand into Georgia, maybe even as a codeshare with DL. Plenty of cities would be more efficiently served with ATRs... CSG, MCN, DHN etc.

Silver Airways tried a minihub city in Atlanta about 10 years ago flying to various small cities in AL, MS, and GA (including MCN). It was not a success and did not last long. The reality is without cooperation with DL there is no way those routes can work- and DL already serves two of the three cities you mentioned from ATL. The local flying traffic isn’t strong enough, it just can’t beat out driving.

phatfarmlines · Thu Jan 19, 2023 4:38 am

Woman attacks passengers and employees at ATL Concourses C & D with a fire extinguisher. She also discharges the extinguisher to make it harder to be subdued.

Lots of videos on social media showing different perspectives. It seems it took a while before she was subdued by cops.

Woman accused of spraying fire extinguisher inside Hartsfield-Jackson airport

Source: Atlanta Journal-Constitution

bravoindia · Thu Feb 02, 2023 5:03 am

Does anyone have any idea on daily departures per carrier for 2019,2022, and projected 2023?

flyaa757 · Thu Feb 02, 2023 2:25 pm

Rumor...JetBlue picking up T gates... (source is an airport employee).

DLvsWN · Thu Feb 02, 2023 4:10 pm

flyaa757 wrote:
Rumor...JetBlue picking up T gates... (source is an airport employee).

Jeez, I hope not.

My post from last year's thread:

Is there any prospect of rationalizing which airlines use which areas if there's a south T-Gates expansion, especially regarding Concourse D?

It's rather painful to see Jetblue on E when they're domestic only, Spirit and Frontier both split between D and E, Westjet on D when incoming pax use the baggage claim at F, American randomly jammed onto D for many flights, and through all this Delta still operating on the south side of D even though it's a madhouse of random airlines at this point.

I understand there's a reason for all of these outcomes. There's a reason for everything. But that doesn't mean it's not stupid and shouldn't be fixed. I flew Frontier in December and was shuffled between both ends of E and multiple gates in D before we finally took off. It's just really dumb and annoying and tbh gives the people who fly ULCCs the distinct impression they're getting tablescraps.

I'd rather consolidate AA on T as a #1 priority, and start to build some contiguous non-DL gates at the south end of D so F9/NK/AS/B6 can have a more consolidated operation (realizing, yes, that AA doesn't use gates at the south end of D but rather the center of D--another relic of yore). And get WS out of D while we're at it, maybe?

flyaa757 · Thu Feb 02, 2023 4:22 pm

DLvsWN wrote:
flyaa757 wrote:
Rumor...JetBlue picking up T gates... (source is an airport employee).

Jeez, I hope not.

My post from last year's thread:

Is there any prospect of rationalizing which airlines use which areas if there's a south T-Gates expansion, especially regarding Concourse D?

It's rather painful to see Jetblue on E when they're domestic only, Spirit and Frontier both split between D and E, Westjet on D when incoming pax use the baggage claim at F, American randomly jammed onto D for many flights, and through all this Delta still operating on the south side of D even though it's a madhouse of random airlines at this point.

I understand there's a reason for all of these outcomes. There's a reason for everything. But that doesn't mean it's not stupid and shouldn't be fixed. I flew Frontier in December and was shuffled between both ends of E and multiple gates in D before we finally took off. It's just really dumb and annoying and tbh gives the people who fly ULCCs the distinct impression they're getting tablescraps.

I'd rather consolidate AA on T as a #1 priority, and start to build some contiguous non-DL gates at the south end of D so F9/NK/AS/B6 can have a more consolidated operation (realizing, yes, that AA doesn't use gates at the south end of D but rather the center of D--another relic of yore). And get WS out of D while we're at it, maybe?

DL vs WN...you make too much sense. But this is the airport famous for handing contracts to cousins, and for Delta bullying just enough to make life difficult for others. If the JetBlue to T rumor is true, also curious how many of the 4 available gates they are getting... with the Spirit merger in mind, 4 wouldnt be enough, so it would be back to the same problem in 1-2 years. JetBlue is taking over ATL-LGA from AA btw...

I would agree with your proposal, AA entirely on T makes by far the most sense, especially considering the Admirals club. I'd suggest AS try to squeeze in as well.

Moving AA out of D would also allow for some ease and rationalization for Spirit, Frontier and JetBlue.

phatfarmlines · Tue Feb 07, 2023 2:47 am

Polot wrote:
flyaa757 wrote:
bigbird wrote:
So AA still has their split ops between T gates D Con?

Yes, they do. Amazingly, the legacy US destinations (PHL, CLT, PHX) tend to operate out of D, and the legacy AA (MIA, ORD, DFW, LGA) out of T.

I cannot imagine how that is efficient from an HR perspective, let alone a customer one. The T gates in ATL are by far the most convenient from a PAX perspective and I cannot imagine why a carrier wouldnt want them, unless the cost was egregious.

It’s not efficient. But there are just not enough gates available in T to consolidate all their operations into-other airlines want T gates as well. So it’s either give up the prime desired gates and fully consolidate into D (DL would happily give AA D gates in exchange for more T gates) or run a split ops.

DFW and LAX are only AA destinations you can basically guarantee will be from T. PHX usually is but sometimes does operate from D. All the others vary and are split between D and T. It just depends on how lucky you are. If you are flying American Eagle it is almost always out of D.

Was it not the premise of the T-North extension to consolidate AA as well?

If that is not the case, then I can see AA allowing B6 to share a gate for LGA departures and arrivals. It at least provides a very competitive option vs DL (notwithstanding the scheduling disadvantage vs DL).

The FIDS on the night of 2/6/23 are showing AA arrivals on T, D, and E.

flyaa757 · Tue Feb 07, 2023 3:47 am

phatfarmlines wrote:
Polot wrote:
flyaa757 wrote:

Yes, they do. Amazingly, the legacy US destinations (PHL, CLT, PHX) tend to operate out of D, and the legacy AA (MIA, ORD, DFW, LGA) out of T.

I cannot imagine how that is efficient from an HR perspective, let alone a customer one. The T gates in ATL are by far the most convenient from a PAX perspective and I cannot imagine why a carrier wouldnt want them, unless the cost was egregious.

It’s not efficient. But there are just not enough gates available in T to consolidate all their operations into-other airlines want T gates as well. So it’s either give up the prime desired gates and fully consolidate into D (DL would happily give AA D gates in exchange for more T gates) or run a split ops.

DFW and LAX are only AA destinations you can basically guarantee will be from T. PHX usually is but sometimes does operate from D. All the others vary and are split between D and T. It just depends on how lucky you are. If you are flying American Eagle it is almost always out of D.

Was it not the premise of the T-North extension to consolidate AA as well?

If that is not the case, then I can see AA allowing B6 to share a gate for LGA departures and arrivals. It at least provides a very competitive option vs DL (notwithstanding the scheduling disadvantage vs DL).

The FIDS on the night of 2/6/23 are showing AA arrivals on T, D, and E.

Yes, it was the plan. But for reasons known only to AA, they have bailed on that plan…

Deltran757 · Tue Feb 07, 2023 4:09 am

Last week around 10:30pm, I saw AA airbus gate fitting some of United old gates, as United is occupying the new 5 gates, plus 1 old gate. So it looks like AA will have 7 gates on T, and United will have 6 gates on T.

UdoWald · Tue Feb 14, 2023 9:33 pm

Glad to see WestJet picking up the Atlanta - Vancouver flight. This will be operated 4 days a week starting on May 17, 2023.

WS 1599 ATL-YVR
WS 1598 YVR-ATL

Oilman · Wed Feb 15, 2023 1:36 pm

UdoWald wrote:
Glad to see WestJet picking up the Atlanta - Vancouver flight. This will be operated 4 days a week starting on May 17, 2023.

WS 1599 ATL-YVR
WS 1598 YVR-ATL

Is this a replacement for or in addition to the Delta operated flight? I think the DL flight was 4x weekly, too.

flyaa757 · Wed Feb 15, 2023 2:09 pm

As of last night, the "supposed" AA T gates are still blocked off. Jetbridges look to have been freshly painted.

UdoWald · Wed Feb 15, 2023 7:01 pm

Spirit Airlines has announced daily nonstop service between Atlanta and San Juan beginning on May 5, 2023.
https://www.prnewswire.com/news-release ... 47647.html

NK 3092 ATL-SJU 2:15PM-6:02PM
NK 3093 SJU-ATL 6:58PM-11:14PM

Glad to see Spirit expanding in Atlanta. They currently serve 17 nonstop destinations with 42 flights a day. Quite impressive. It would be nice if they could consolidate their gates at ATL.

flyaa757 · Wed Feb 15, 2023 7:43 pm

UdoWald wrote:
Spirit Airlines has announced daily nonstop service between Atlanta and San Juan beginning on May 5, 2023.
https://www.prnewswire.com/news-release ... 47647.html

NK 3092 ATL-SJU 2:15PM-6:02PM
NK 3093 SJU-ATL 6:58PM-11:14PM

Glad to see Spirit expanding in Atlanta. They currently serve 17 nonstop destinations with 42 flights a day. Quite impressive. It would be nice if they could consolidate their gates at ATL.

It all comes down to D concourse... if AA does move to T, and DL let's those AA D gates go to Spirit/JetBlue/Frontier, I presume co-location will be much improved. B6, F9, NK all do overnights on E.

Atlwarrior · Wed Feb 15, 2023 9:33 pm

flyaa757 wrote:
UdoWald wrote:
Spirit Airlines has announced daily nonstop service between Atlanta and San Juan beginning on May 5, 2023.
https://www.prnewswire.com/news-release ... 47647.html

NK 3092 ATL-SJU 2:15PM-6:02PM
NK 3093 SJU-ATL 6:58PM-11:14PM

Glad to see Spirit expanding in Atlanta. They currently serve 17 nonstop destinations with 42 flights a day. Quite impressive. It would be nice if they could consolidate their gates at ATL.

It all comes down to D concourse... if AA does move to T, and DL let's those AA D gates go to Spirit/JetBlue/Frontier, I presume co-location will be much improved. B6, F9, NK all do overnights on E.

I swear Spirit is expanding more than Southwest in Atlanta; I wonder if Southwest plans to release more gates for other carriers to expand on Concourse C.

tjerome · Sat Feb 25, 2023 5:13 pm

Concourse E has started to get painted in the dark gray color to match the other concourses.

flyaa757 · Sat Feb 25, 2023 9:37 pm

tjerome wrote:
Concourse E has started to get painted in the dark gray color to match the other concourses.

Indeed…noticed they were trying various shades of gray lol…

Also noticed this week that Westjet is parking on D. I guess they have pre clearance, but still would expect them to use E or F…

777Mech · Sat Feb 25, 2023 9:57 pm

flyaa757 wrote:
tjerome wrote:
Concourse E has started to get painted in the dark gray color to match the other concourses.

Indeed…noticed they were trying various shades of gray lol…

Also noticed this week that Westjet is parking on D. I guess they have pre clearance, but still would expect them to use E or F…

I assume it's because it's cheaper to park at a DL owned gate versus the common use gates.

micstatic · Sun Feb 26, 2023 12:19 am

I wish t would be only delta. Would really benefit us Atlanta based road warriors

phatfarmlines · Sun Feb 26, 2023 3:08 am

flyaa757 wrote:
tjerome wrote:
Concourse E has started to get painted in the dark gray color to match the other concourses.

Indeed…noticed they were trying various shades of gray lol…

So the Georgia red clay facade is gone for good?

Boeing757100 · Sun Feb 26, 2023 3:12 am

phatfarmlines wrote:
flyaa757 wrote:
tjerome wrote:
Concourse E has started to get painted in the dark gray color to match the other concourses.

Indeed…noticed they were trying various shades of gray lol…

So the Georgia red clay facade is gone for good?

I am pretty sure it is...I wish there was a way they could have kept the red line and make it look modern.

flyaa757 · Sun Feb 26, 2023 1:42 pm

Also noticed it looks like Delta is starting to paint the rear of the cargo buildings across from Tech ops. Looks like changing the gray to navy, keeping the red stripe. Looks similar to the widget livery actually.

rsgolfpunk · Sun Feb 26, 2023 2:22 pm

If/when AA moves out of D, there must be a good reason(s) why DL would not use those gates. Wouldn’t mid-concourse gates be considered most desirable?

micstatic · Tue Feb 28, 2023 11:08 am

What is the estimate on :
1. Opening of new D skyclub
2. Start and Completion of D widening project?

flyaa757 · Tue Feb 28, 2023 1:21 pm

rsgolfpunk wrote:
If/when AA moves out of D, there must be a good reason(s) why DL would not use those gates. Wouldn’t mid-concourse gates be considered most desirable?

DL currently has no ops on D South. Theoretically, yes, but with the impending elimination of CRJs ATL and upgauging, the real accomplishment is just blocking competition. And there are available CUTE gates in E, which Spirit often uses, so...

Dalmd88 · Tue Feb 28, 2023 1:51 pm

flyaa757 wrote:
Also noticed it looks like Delta is starting to paint the rear of the cargo buildings across from Tech ops. Looks like changing the gray to navy, keeping the red stripe. Looks similar to the widget livery actually.

Everything is getting painted in the Navy scheme. The street side of TOC 1 is done and they are beginning to work on TOC 2. It's the first time in my 25 years I've seen the outside of the TOC painted.

DLvsWN · Tue Feb 28, 2023 1:55 pm

flyaa757 wrote:
rsgolfpunk wrote:
If/when AA moves out of D, there must be a good reason(s) why DL would not use those gates. Wouldn’t mid-concourse gates be considered most desirable?

DL currently has no ops on D South.

Not sure what you mean.

DL2984 ATLMEM just left D9
DL2344 ATLGSP just left D6
DL564 ATLYYZ leaving D12 in a few minutes
Etc

phatfarmlines · Tue Feb 28, 2023 2:28 pm

DLvsWN wrote:
flyaa757 wrote:
rsgolfpunk wrote:
If/when AA moves out of D, there must be a good reason(s) why DL would not use those gates. Wouldn’t mid-concourse gates be considered most desirable?

DL currently has no ops on D South.

Not sure what you mean.

DL2984 ATLMEM just left D9
DL2344 ATLGSP just left D6
DL564 ATLYYZ leaving D12 in a few minutes
Etc

DLvsWN is correct. As a result of gate shuffling following the UA/CO and WN/FL mergers, DL was able to take on some D-South gates. I can't remember if DL took over the NW gates on D-South immediately following the merger, or if those went to FL.

UdoWald · Sat Mar 11, 2023 10:53 pm

Does anyone know why Virgin Atlantic is ending the Manchester - Atlanta route on March 31?

georgiabill · Sat Mar 11, 2023 11:59 pm

Just a guess can make more money on other routes

David_itl · Sun Mar 12, 2023 9:52 am

crew shortage. Restarts back up in June. Funny it only seems to affect MAN ops. Similarly they've used the "no aircraft" excuse before when stopping routes or not even starting announced MAN routes yet LHR sees continual expansion with the same lack of aircraft.

also need to add they did attempt a similar stunt last year where people's bookings got cancelled/rerouted but the call centres denied that MAN-ATL was being pulled but miraculously found aircraft and crew,

atlflyer · Tue Mar 14, 2023 2:35 am

Have any renderings of the Concourse D widening project been posted?

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