Moderators: richierich, ua900, PanAm_DC10, hOMSaR
ZK-NBT wrote:NZ516 wrote:CO
LAX-HNL-AKL-SYD/MEL/BNE 747/D10
LAX-PPT-AKL-SYD D10/747
LAX-HNL-SYD D10/747
Pulled out 1993
UA
LAX-HNL-AKL-SYD 747
SFO-HNL-AKL-SYD 747/D10
LAX-SYD-MEL 74L, 744 commenced 1990
LAX-AKL-SYD 74L? 74L did visit AKL
LAX-AKL-MEL 744 commenced 1991
AA
DFW-HNL-AKL D10 3 weekly 1990-92
DFW-HNL-SYD D10 4 weekly
Also Pan Am flew to AKL in 1983 before selling the route to UA.
PA812 JFK - LAX - HNL - AKL - SYD 747 3pw
http://www.departedflights.com/AKL83p2.html
Yes they did, I only went back to when UA took over roughly. PA were up to 8-9 weekly 747s in the late 1970s, mix of
LAX-AKL-SYD-LAX 74L
LAX-AKL-LAX 74L
LAX-HNL-AKL-MEL 741
LAX-HNL-AKL-SYD 741
They flew to NAN/NOU/PPT/PPG with 747s, NAN continued to SYD 3 weekly while the others were weekly on most cases PPT/PPG were combined from memory.
I believe a brief SFO-AKL when the 74L was very new 1976/77. Before that 707s via PPT or PPG.
NZ516 wrote:ZK-NBT wrote:NZ516 wrote:
Also Pan Am flew to AKL in 1983 before selling the route to UA.
PA812 JFK - LAX - HNL - AKL - SYD 747 3pw
http://www.departedflights.com/AKL83p2.html
Yes they did, I only went back to when UA took over roughly. PA were up to 8-9 weekly 747s in the late 1970s, mix of
LAX-AKL-SYD-LAX 74L
LAX-AKL-LAX 74L
LAX-HNL-AKL-MEL 741
LAX-HNL-AKL-SYD 741
They flew to NAN/NOU/PPT/PPG with 747s, NAN continued to SYD 3 weekly while the others were weekly on most cases PPT/PPG were combined from memory.
I believe a brief SFO-AKL when the 74L was very new 1976/77. Before that 707s via PPT or PPG.
You are good at record keeping ZK-NBT. A while ago I remember seeing an old Pan Am route map showing an extensive South Pacific network. They certainly served a lot of the islands with lots of different routings. They may have been the dominant airline in the late 70s between AKL and LAX with 9 747s per week with the most seats as I believe AIR NZ were just daily Dc-10 service at the time. This was after AA had left the market so less competition then.
NZ516 wrote:ZK-NBT wrote:NZ516 wrote:
Also Pan Am flew to AKL in 1983 before selling the route to UA.
PA812 JFK - LAX - HNL - AKL - SYD 747 3pw
http://www.departedflights.com/AKL83p2.html
Yes they did, I only went back to when UA took over roughly. PA were up to 8-9 weekly 747s in the late 1970s, mix of
LAX-AKL-SYD-LAX 74L
LAX-AKL-LAX 74L
LAX-HNL-AKL-MEL 741
LAX-HNL-AKL-SYD 741
They flew to NAN/NOU/PPT/PPG with 747s, NAN continued to SYD 3 weekly while the others were weekly on most cases PPT/PPG were combined from memory.
I believe a brief SFO-AKL when the 74L was very new 1976/77. Before that 707s via PPT or PPG.
You are good at record keeping ZK-NBT. A while ago I remember seeing an old Pan Am route map showing an extensive South Pacific network. They certainly served a lot of the islands with lots of different routings. They may have been the dominant airline in the late 70s between AKL and LAX with 9 747s per week with the most seats as I believe AIR NZ were just daily Dc-10 service at the time. This was after AA had left the market so less competition then.
eta unknown wrote:NZ516 wrote:ZK-NBT wrote:
Yes they did, I only went back to when UA took over roughly. PA were up to 8-9 weekly 747s in the late 1970s, mix of
LAX-AKL-SYD-LAX 74L
LAX-AKL-LAX 74L
LAX-HNL-AKL-MEL 741
LAX-HNL-AKL-SYD 741
They flew to NAN/NOU/PPT/PPG with 747s, NAN continued to SYD 3 weekly while the others were weekly on most cases PPT/PPG were combined from memory.
I believe a brief SFO-AKL when the 74L was very new 1976/77. Before that 707s via PPT or PPG.
You are good at record keeping ZK-NBT. A while ago I remember seeing an old Pan Am route map showing an extensive South Pacific network. They certainly served a lot of the islands with lots of different routings. They may have been the dominant airline in the late 70s between AKL and LAX with 9 747s per week with the most seats as I believe AIR NZ were just daily Dc-10 service at the time. This was after AA had left the market so less competition then.
I can't remember a UA 74L service LAX-AKL-SYD, although there was a DC-10 service SFO (or LAX?)-HNL-AKL-SYD. You may have seen many UA 74L's in AKL for tech stops which were very common as when the route was transferred, PA neglected to inform UA of the need to block seats. In fact, I once flew UA SYD-LAX subload on the SP and the only reason I was accepted for the flight was because of a planned refueing stop in HNL. Yes you are correct the original PA route was SFO-AKL-SYD (I flew that sector as a young boy).
Sprite8806 wrote:Any chance Jetstar regional will ever come back? I really miss those Dash 8s
getluv wrote:With QF and NZ code-sharing on each others domestic networks I don’t think it’s necessary for QF to consider ruining the truce.
NZ516 wrote:Here is a good article about the challenge that Air NZ faces now. Not enough planes with the 8 772s gone and high demand so it's likely going to loose market share. One error is saying that Air NZ were up to 3 daily to LAX. It was a maximum of 15 flights per week with the one service via RAR.
https://www.stuff.co.nz/travel/news/300 ... app-iPhone
NZ516 wrote:Here is a good article about the challenge that Air NZ faces now. Not enough planes with the 8 772s gone and high demand so it's likely going to loose market share. One error is saying that Air NZ were up to 3 daily to LAX. It was a maximum of 15 flights per week with the one service via RAR.
https://www.stuff.co.nz/travel/news/300 ... app-iPhone
ZK-NBT wrote:. . .flying back of clock to RAR/CNS,
DavidByrne wrote:ZK-NBT wrote:. . .flying back of clock to RAR/CNS,
I view the fact that Australian airlines are increasingly flying nonstop to the Pacific Islands as being a direct result of NZ's lack of attention to this market. As with North America, AKL is perfectly positioned to be the connecting hub of choice for all of Australia to access Polynesia. Back of the clock to the islands is the only way it can be done without requiring a completely new Tasman timetable. The existing morning departure bank ex AKL to Australia and the evening bank aggregating services from Australia for North America are perfectly placed for Pacific Island services as well.
They do have some flights using this bank (esp to PPT) and they from time to time dabble with RAR but the larger market is surely to APW and TBU, given the number of Samoans and Tongans living in the East coast cities. Such services would by nature be back-of-the clock and leave the islands at rather unsociable hours, but PPT does not seem to suffer unduly from this handicap. Unless NZ does tackle this, expect to see more and more point-to-point services and frequencies by Australian carriers on routes on which NZ has many natural advantages - and those advantages being eroded more and more. The A220 is key for QF here - expect to see it used to take on NZ's market position to Polynesia.
Toenga wrote:All very well to say Air NZ should have retained the the 777 200 (and their crews?) during covid.
But at whose expense?
Presumably the writer believes that the government should have increased its support during the period, so that now lower airfares would be bringing even more tourists here to experience the rest of our now seriously under resourced hospitality and internal transport provision.
There were far far more pressing needs on taxpayers money during covid then that.
Methinks that the writer is just concerned about the extra costs of his frequent flying forays abroad.
Zkpilot wrote:Toenga wrote:All very well to say Air NZ should have retained the the 777 200 (and their crews?) during covid.
But at whose expense?
Presumably the writer believes that the government should have increased its support during the period, so that now lower airfares would be bringing even more tourists here to experience the rest of our now seriously under resourced hospitality and internal transport provision.
There were far far more pressing needs on taxpayers money during covid then that.
Methinks that the writer is just concerned about the extra costs of his frequent flying forays abroad.
Storage costs were minimal especially considering how much disposing of them has likely cost.
Crew - the pilots were happy to take LWOP for long periods (eg like furlough) so almost all of them could’ve been retained, many with doing the occasional flight for currency etc. As for cabin crew, same deal, many were happy to take time out/furlough but the airline decided to make most of them (widebody A/c crew)redundant with many moving on to other jobs elsewhere and not coming back. There is also still a significant number of former cabin crew that have been told no to coming back (with many of them not having any disciplinary/sickleave/performance issues etc - while others that did were recalled).
GW54 wrote:After two sectors yesterday OYC appears to be off the schedule ' Tech' today. The prime AKL-WLG NZ405 at 7am was cancelled along with the return NZ412, I can only assume other sectors would have also been cancelled?
a7ala wrote:Hi im interested in understanding how Air NZ's A320 domestic fleet will change in thre future. Does anyone know how many domestic A320's they operated pre-Covid (2019), how many they A320's and A321's (3?) they have now, and how many in the future (I recall hearing 6xA321's in total by the end of the decade?). A fleet profile table would be great (the ones in the investor presentation dont split out domestic or A321's). Thanks.
NZ516 wrote:Pre covid they operated for domestic 17 CEOs OXA to OXM and OAB, OJQ ,OJR, and OJS. Plus a further 3 former international 320s OJB, OKI ,OJM to make a total fleet of 20. Those last 3 have since been retired.
Yes they have just received their 3rd 321 OYC so that the domestic fleet is back up to 20. With 4 more 321s to come in the years ahead they could have a domestic jet fleet of 24 by 2026. As further planned retirements have been postponed.
The international fleet is 13 made up of 6 320s and 7 321s with no more on order. I agree with a table would be helpful. They have one from their website but it leaves off the GE 787 order.
a7ala wrote:NZ516 wrote:Pre covid they operated for domestic 17 CEOs OXA to OXM and OAB, OJQ ,OJR, and OJS. Plus a further 3 former international 320s OJB, OKI ,OJM to make a total fleet of 20. Those last 3 have since been retired.
Yes they have just received their 3rd 321 OYC so that the domestic fleet is back up to 20. With 4 more 321s to come in the years ahead they could have a domestic jet fleet of 24 by 2026. As further planned retirements have been postponed.
The international fleet is 13 made up of 6 320s and 7 321s with no more on order. I agree with a table would be helpful. They have one from their website but it leaves off the GE 787 order.
Thanks very much - so in summary:
2019 (pre-Covid) - 17x A320D + 3x A320I = 17 x 171 seats + 3x 168 seats = 3411 seats
Current - 17xA320D + 3xA321D = 17 x171 + 3x 217 = 3558 seats (+4%)
2026 - 17xA320D + 7xA321D = 4426 (+29%)
GW54 wrote:Zkpilot wrote:Toenga wrote:All very well to say Air NZ should have retained the the 777 200 (and their crews?) during covid.
But at whose expense?
Presumably the writer believes that the government should have increased its support during the period, so that now lower airfares would be bringing even more tourists here to experience the rest of our now seriously under resourced hospitality and internal transport provision.
There were far far more pressing needs on taxpayers money during covid then that.
Methinks that the writer is just concerned about the extra costs of his frequent flying forays abroad.
Storage costs were minimal especially considering how much disposing of them has likely cost.
Crew - the pilots were happy to take LWOP for long periods (eg like furlough) so almost all of them could’ve been retained, many with doing the occasional flight for currency etc. As for cabin crew, same deal, many were happy to take time out/furlough but the airline decided to make most of them (widebody A/c crew)redundant with many moving on to other jobs elsewhere and not coming back. There is also still a significant number of former cabin crew that have been told no to coming back (with many of them not having any disciplinary/sickleave/performance issues etc - while others that did were recalled).
A number of senior B777 pilots left the Airline prematurely. A number of those pilots still had a number of years until retirement. Some were check airman i.e. Check Captains, Training and instructors. Most I am sure would have happily taken extended leave with out pay given the option. Of the 777-200s I recall four were owned and four were leased. The four that were owned could have been put into deep- storage but could be back in service currently. The ongoing issues with the 787 and Boeing were inevitable based on past history and the 777-200 was the perfect solution to the capacity short fall the Airline faces today.
a7ala wrote:NZ516 wrote:Pre covid they operated for domestic 17 CEOs OXA to OXM and OAB, OJQ ,OJR, and OJS. Plus a further 3 former international 320s OJB, OKI ,OJM to make a total fleet of 20. Those last 3 have since been retired.
Yes they have just received their 3rd 321 OYC so that the domestic fleet is back up to 20. With 4 more 321s to come in the years ahead they could have a domestic jet fleet of 24 by 2026. As further planned retirements have been postponed.
The international fleet is 13 made up of 6 320s and 7 321s with no more on order. I agree with a table would be helpful. They have one from their website but it leaves off the GE 787 order.
Thanks very much - so in summary:
2019 (pre-Covid) - 17x A320D + 3x A320I = 17 x 171 seats + 3x 168 seats = 3411 seats
Current - 17xA320D + 3xA321D = 17 x171 + 3x 217 = 3558 seats (+4%)
2026 - 17xA320D + 7xA321D = 4426 (+29%)
NZ516 wrote:GW54 wrote:After two sectors yesterday OYC appears to be off the schedule ' Tech' today. The prime AKL-WLG NZ405 at 7am was cancelled along with the return NZ412, I can only assume other sectors would have also been cancelled?
GW54 wrote:NZ516 wrote:GW54 wrote:After two sectors yesterday OYC appears to be off the schedule ' Tech' today. The prime AKL-WLG NZ405 at 7am was cancelled along with the return NZ412, I can only assume other sectors would have also been cancelled?
Looks like it's back tomorrow doing NZ401 AKL to WLG then NZ389 WLG to CHC.[/quote
I see still not back and alot of cancellations across the network as a result today.]
NZ516 wrote:GW54 wrote:NZ516 wrote:
Looks like it's back tomorrow doing NZ401 AKL to WLG then NZ389 WLG to CHC.[/quote
I see still not back and alot of cancellations across the network as a result today.]
Looks like it has changed again now on NZ613 AKL - ZQN.
GW54 wrote:NZ516 wrote:GW54 wrote:
Looks like it's back tomorrow doing NZ401 AKL to WLG then NZ389 WLG to CHC.[/quote
I see still not back and alot of cancellations across the network as a result today.]
Looks like it has changed again now on NZ613 AKL - ZQN.
Looking like the problem isn't with OYC. Notice that NHC hasn't flown since late Feb. If it's maintenance you would have thought that would be planned into the schedules and wouldn't cause daily disruptions. Anyone know what is happening. Seems if you fly domestically if you are lucky you will be delayed and unlucky you will be cancelled. Can't recall when I was last on a on time Airbus.
NZ516 wrote:GW54 wrote:NZ516 wrote:
Looks like it has changed again now on NZ613 AKL - ZQN.
Looking like the problem isn't with OYC. Notice that NHC hasn't flown since late Feb. If it's maintenance you would have thought that would be planned into the schedules and wouldn't cause daily disruptions. Anyone know what is happening. Seems if you fly domestically if you are lucky you will be delayed and unlucky you will be cancelled. Can't recall when I was last on a on time Airbus.
Not just NHC out of action but OXJ is out as well. There must be huge challenges running the schedule with two Airbus not in service.
NZ516 wrote:Today an A321 was used for WLG to MEL for NZ253. It's been a while since Air NZ has used a 321 on the WLG to Tasman flights it's also flying MEL- ZQN this afternoon. Or it could just be covering for NHC perhaps.
GW54 wrote:NZ516 wrote:GW54 wrote:
Looks like it's back tomorrow doing NZ401 AKL to WLG then NZ389 WLG to CHC.[/quote
I see still not back and alot of cancellations across the network as a result today.]
Looks like it has changed again now on NZ613 AKL - ZQN.
Looking like the problem isn't with OYC. Notice that NHC hasn't flown since late Feb. If it's maintenance you would have thought that would be planned into the schedules and wouldn't cause daily disruptions. Anyone know what is happening. Seems if you fly domestically if you are lucky you will be delayed and unlucky you will be cancelled. Can't recall when I was last on a on time Airbus.
zkncj wrote:GW54 wrote:NZ516 wrote:
Looks like it has changed again now on NZ613 AKL - ZQN.
Looking like the problem isn't with OYC. Notice that NHC hasn't flown since late Feb. If it's maintenance you would have thought that would be planned into the schedules and wouldn't cause daily disruptions. Anyone know what is happening. Seems if you fly domestically if you are lucky you will be delayed and unlucky you will be cancelled. Can't recall when I was last on a on time Airbus.
Weather hammers the load/de-load of the a320/1’s domesticity. When there is either heavy rain or band wind it effects them using the rear door, which effects boarding times. All it takes it for the first couple of flights of the day to get held up by weather, and the delays just keep stacking for the rest of the day.
Also the early morning A321’s ex AKL, often get delayed on there return sectors from MEL,BNE,SYD (SYD is especially bad).
If you on one of the afternoon services across the Tasman where the aircraft is on its second turn you can almost expect it to be late.
AKL needs to set up some of its international gates, to allow dual boarding for the a321’s. It would help turn times on the Tasman runs.
ZK-NBT wrote:Changes or schedules for AKL NS23. A few I’ll miss, maybe some errors.
NZ
LAX 7x 77W, 10x from July
IAH 6-7x 77W (currently 789 x5)
SFO 5x 789 (77W from May 15th, currently 77W)
ORD 3x 789
JFK 3x 789
HNL 3x 789 5x from July
YVR 5-7 789
NRT 7x 789
HKG 7x 789
PVG 7x 789
SIN 7x 789, 7x 77W, 14x 789 from May 15th
ICN 3x 789
TPE 3x 789
DPS 3x 789 5x from July
PPT 2x 77W, 1x 789
NAN 7x 789, 1x 77W, 6x 321
RAR 6x 789, 1x 77W, 6x 321
APW 3x 789, 1x 77W, 6x 321
TBU 2x 789, 4x 321
NOU 3x 321
IUE 1x 320, 2x from July
PER 7x 332 (Wamos)
SYD 7x 77W, 28x 321
MEL 7x 77W, 20x 321/320
BNE 7x 789, 13x 321/320 77W from May 14
CNS 3x 320
ADL 4x 321
OOL 7x 321 (9x from July)
HBA 2x 320
QF
SYD 27x 738, 7x 333, 3x 789 from July SYD-AKL-JFK
MEL 28x 738
BNE 7x 332, 7x 738
JFK 3x 789 from June
FJ
NAN 7x 332, 7x 7M8
SB
NOU 3x 320
TN
PPT 3x 789
NF
VLI 3x 738
LA
SCL 7x 789
SYD 7x 789
UA
SFO 3x 789, 772 from June, 7x from July
HA
HNL 3x 332
EK
DXB 7x 388
QR
DOH-ADL 7x 77W
SQ
SIN 7x 359 (currently 77W)
MH
KUL 8x 332
KE
ICN 5x 772
CI
TPE-BNE 5x 359
CZ
CAN 7x 789
MU
PVG 4x 789
CX
HKG 3x 359
mrkerr7474 wrote:ZK-NBT wrote:Changes or schedules for AKL NS23. A few I’ll miss, maybe some errors.
NZ
LAX 7x 77W, 10x from July
IAH 6-7x 77W (currently 789 x5)
SFO 5x 789 (77W from May 15th, currently 77W)
ORD 3x 789
JFK 3x 789
HNL 3x 789 5x from July
YVR 5-7 789
NRT 7x 789
HKG 7x 789
PVG 7x 789
SIN 7x 789, 7x 77W, 14x 789 from May 15th
ICN 3x 789
TPE 3x 789
DPS 3x 789 5x from July
PPT 2x 77W, 1x 789
NAN 7x 789, 1x 77W, 6x 321
RAR 6x 789, 1x 77W, 6x 321
APW 3x 789, 1x 77W, 6x 321
TBU 2x 789, 4x 321
NOU 3x 321
IUE 1x 320, 2x from July
PER 7x 332 (Wamos)
SYD 7x 77W, 28x 321
MEL 7x 77W, 20x 321/320
BNE 7x 789, 13x 321/320 77W from May 14
CNS 3x 320
ADL 4x 321
OOL 7x 321 (9x from July)
HBA 2x 320
QF
SYD 27x 738, 7x 333, 3x 789 from July SYD-AKL-JFK
MEL 28x 738
BNE 7x 332, 7x 738
JFK 3x 789 from June
FJ
NAN 7x 332, 7x 7M8
SB
NOU 3x 320
TN
PPT 3x 789
NF
VLI 3x 738
LA
SCL 7x 789
SYD 7x 789
UA
SFO 3x 789, 772 from June, 7x from July
HA
HNL 3x 332
EK
DXB 7x 388
QR
DOH-ADL 7x 77W
SQ
SIN 7x 359 (currently 77W)
MH
KUL 8x 332
KE
ICN 5x 772
CI
TPE-BNE 5x 359
CZ
CAN 7x 789
MU
PVG 4x 789
CX
HKG 3x 359
Does AA only fly seasonal to AKL? And UA flies year round to SFO?
ZK-NBT wrote:MH
KUL 8x 332
planemanofnz wrote:ZK-NBT wrote:MH
KUL 8x 332
Is there really only the 332 on this route? Flightaware shows the 359 operating sometimes.
ZK-NBT wrote:Changes or schedules for AKL NS23. A few I’ll miss, maybe some errors.
NZ
SIN 7x 789, 7x 77W, 14x 789 from May 15th
SQ
SIN 7x 359 (currently 77W)
ZK-NBT wrote:planemanofnz wrote:ZK-NBT wrote:MH
KUL 8x 332
Is there really only the 332 on this route? Flightaware shows the 359 operating sometimes.
The A359 does show up, anyway tbh I’m not 100% sure but I believe AKL-KUL is 8 weekly.
SQ just reintroduced the 77W and F on it, back to an A359 over NS, perhaps the 77W is needed elsewhere or F just hasn’t sold. I’m still hopeful they will find a place for the A380 to come back in NW.
ZK-NBT wrote:Changes or schedules for AKL NS23. A few I’ll miss, maybe some errors.
NZ
LAX 7x 77W, 10x from July
IAH 6-7x 77W (currently 789 x5)
SFO 5x 789 (77W from May 15th, currently 77W)
ORD 3x 789
JFK 3x 789
HNL 3x 789 5x from July
YVR 5-7 789
NRT 7x 789
HKG 7x 789
PVG 7x 789
SIN 7x 789, 7x 77W, 14x 789 from May 15th
ICN 3x 789
TPE 3x 789
DPS 3x 789 5x from July
PPT 2x 77W, 1x 789
NAN 7x 789, 1x 77W, 6x 321
RAR 6x 789, 1x 77W, 6x 321
APW 3x 789, 1x 77W, 6x 321
TBU 2x 789, 4x 321
NOU 3x 321
IUE 1x 320, 2x from July
PER 7x 332 (Wamos)
SYD 7x 77W, 28x 321
MEL 7x 77W, 20x 321/320
BNE 7x 789, 13x 321/320 77W from May 14
CNS 3x 320
ADL 4x 321
OOL 7x 321 (9x from July)
HBA 2x 320
QF
SYD 27x 738, 7x 333, 3x 789 from July SYD-AKL-JFK
MEL 28x 738
BNE 7x 332, 7x 738
JFK 3x 789 from June
FJ
NAN 7x 332, 7x 7M8
SB
NOU 3x 320
TN
PPT 3x 789
NF
VLI 3x 738
LA
SCL 7x 789
SYD 7x 789
UA
SFO 3x 789, 772 from June, 7x from July
HA
HNL 3x 332
EK
DXB 7x 388
QR
DOH-ADL 7x 77W
SQ
SIN 7x 359 (currently 77W)
MH
KUL 8x 332
KE
ICN 5x 772
CI
TPE-BNE 5x 359
CZ
CAN 7x 789
MU
PVG 4x 789
CX
HKG 3x 359