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StarFlyer
Topic Author
Posts: 929
Joined: Thu Sep 12, 2002 10:07 am

SIN-FRA Is Always Full!

Thu Aug 14, 2003 6:27 am

I fly between Singapore and Frankfurt ever now and then, this route is served a total of 4 times daily by SQ, LH, QF and still it is sold out most days! Only on SQ's day time flight it is sometimes possible to get a seat!
Could somebody please shed some light into why these airlines dont put more night time flights on?
In times of low load factors this route is doing exeptionally well and should really be served more!
Yours truly - StarFlyer
 
AlitaliaORD
Posts: 237
Joined: Wed Aug 13, 2003 12:38 am

RE: SIN-FRA Is Always Full!

Thu Aug 14, 2003 7:28 am

Probably because Germany and Singapore are both HUGE Business Centers of the world, not to mention both countries thrive on manufacturing things. Count in business travellers from both countries than take into consideration Europe's huge tourism industry that attracts people from all over the world and finally Frankfurt is a gigantic star alliance hub, meaning you've got connecting passengers from Europe, North and South America and ill bet some Africa. Put all that together and you could probably fill 4 flights.
Joy To The World, All The Boys and Girls, Joy to the Fishes in the Deep Blue Sea, Joy to You and Me
 
AlitaliaORD
Posts: 237
Joined: Wed Aug 13, 2003 12:38 am

RE: SIN-FRA Is Always Full!

Thu Aug 14, 2003 7:31 am

hey wow i didnt answer your question at all! how about that. Sorry.
Joy To The World, All The Boys and Girls, Joy to the Fishes in the Deep Blue Sea, Joy to You and Me
 
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LAXintl
Posts: 25477
Joined: Wed May 24, 2000 12:12 pm

RE: SIN-FRA Is Always Full!

Thu Aug 14, 2003 8:10 am

Like AlitaliaORD said, both FRA and SIN are Star Alliance hubs.. Hub to hub flying carrying lots of connecting passngers make this route a very popular one.
From the desert to the sea, to all of Southern California
 
trickijedi
Posts: 3201
Joined: Sun May 13, 2001 4:35 pm

RE: SIN-FRA Is Always Full!

Thu Aug 14, 2003 10:05 am

I finally got a seat on this route for holiday travel via Lufthansa! SQ was completely booked! I had no idea this route was so popular!
Its better to be on the ground wishing you were in the air than be in the air wishing you were on the ground. Fly safe!
 
docpepz
Posts: 1706
Joined: Thu May 24, 2001 8:20 pm

RE: SIN-FRA Is Always Full!

Thu Aug 14, 2003 6:02 pm

Plus take into consideration that QF's flight is a continuation from Sydney, LH's is a continuation from Jakarta and SQ's night FRA flight continues on to JFK. So you don't actually have 4 747s for SIN-FRA ALONE!!
 
JGPH1A
Posts: 15079
Joined: Thu Aug 14, 2003 4:36 pm

RE: SIN-FRA Is Always Full!

Thu Aug 14, 2003 6:17 pm

Not full tomorrow night - all flights showing open across the board.

SQ:LH9762 F4 A4 C4 D4 ZL Y4 B4 /FRA 1 SIN 2 1235 0635+1 0/744
M4 H4 Q4 V4 W4 S4
SQ 025 F4 A4 C4 J4 D4 Y9 B9 /FRA 1 SIN 2 1235 0635+1E0.744
M9 W9 Q9 N9 V9 H9 K9
SQ:LH9764 F4 A4 C4 D4 ZL Y4 B4 /FRA 1 SIN 2 2045 1445+1 0/744
M4 H4 Q4 V4 W4 S4
SQ 325 F4 A4 C4 J4 D4 Y9 E9 /FRA 1 SIN 2 2045 1445+1E0.744
B9 M9 W9 Q9 N9 V9 H9 K9
LH 778 F5 A5 O4 C9 D6 Z6 I9 /FRA 1 SIN 2 2210 1555+1E0/744
Y9 B9 M9 H9 X9 Q9 V9 W9 S9
LH:SQ2007 F4 A4 C4 D4 Y4 B4 M4 /FRA 1 SIN 2 2210 1555+1 0.744
H4 Q4 V4 N4 W4 K0
QF 006 J9 D9 IL Y9 B9 H9 K9 /FRA 2 SIN 1 2355 1805+1 0/744
M9 L9 S9 V9 O9 Q9 GL
Young and beautiful and thin and gorgeous AND BANNED ! Cya at airspaceonline.com, losers
 
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Plane Holland
Posts: 472
Joined: Sun Oct 01, 2000 8:27 pm

RE: SIN-FRA Is Always Full!

Thu Aug 14, 2003 7:19 pm

Flights or bookclasses fully open when requesting availability doesn't say anything. Try to book 9 seats (close the booking) and see what happens then.

mostly the whole flight is suddenly full. (overbooking...)

maybe time for a lowcost airline on this route  Smile
 
Delta777Jet
Posts: 1476
Joined: Tue Jun 13, 2000 6:19 am

RE: SIN-FRA Is Always Full!

Thu Aug 14, 2003 7:32 pm

SQ even wants to downgrate the evening flight from a 744 to a 777 due to lack of Business Travellers. The Economy Pax do not bring any money for a 13 hours flight for less than €700 !

I still miss Trans World Airlines and the L-1011
 
QANTASpower
Posts: 514
Joined: Sat Aug 17, 2002 3:07 pm

RE: SIN-FRA Is Always Full!

Thu Aug 14, 2003 8:08 pm

Hi,

Can somebody please explain how you interpret the booking figures supplied by JGPH1A.

Thanks
 
rabenschlag
Posts: 1028
Joined: Fri Oct 20, 2000 10:28 pm

RE: SIN-FRA Is Always Full!

Thu Aug 14, 2003 8:22 pm

so this would a road for the A380




r.
 
LJ
Posts: 5468
Joined: Wed Nov 17, 1999 8:28 pm

RE: SIN-FRA Is Always Full!

Thu Aug 14, 2003 8:28 pm

Can somebody please explain how you interpret the booking figures supplied by JGPH1A.

Take for example:

QF 006 J9 D9 IL Y9 B9 H9 K9 /FRA 2 SIN 1 2355 1805+1 0/744
M9 L9 S9 V9 O9 Q9 GL

flightnumber is QF006
J,D,I,Y,B,H,K,M,S,V,Q,G are fare classes the number represents the number of bookable seats
J9 means that 9 or more seats available for booking in fare class J
J8 would mean that there are 8 seats available for booking
J0 would mean the flight is full
JL would mean that fare class J is full, however they do accept passengers on the waiting list for this fare class
JC would mean that fare class J is full and that the waiting list is closed

BTW sometimes the maximum you see is 4 or 7 seats or they use A (= available). This can also vary according to difference in class
 
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Plane Holland
Posts: 472
Joined: Sun Oct 01, 2000 8:27 pm

RE: SIN-FRA Is Always Full!

Thu Aug 14, 2003 8:29 pm

Qantaspower: these are bookingclasses which can be requested through a reservationssystem (CRS) like Worldspan or Amadeus.. The bookingclasses have number which indicate how many seats there should be available for the agent to book.

rgds, Plane Holland
 
airsicknessbag
Posts: 4626
Joined: Thu Aug 17, 2000 2:45 am

RE: SIN-FRA Is Always Full!

Thu Aug 14, 2003 9:05 pm

>>>The Economy Pax do not bring any money for a 13 hours flight for less than €700 !

Good to hear that. I flew FRA-SIN-FRA this weekend and paid 299 EUR, including two nights in a middle class hotel in S´pore. Big grin Big grin Big grin

Daniel Smile
 
mozart
Posts: 2179
Joined: Thu Aug 14, 2003 12:21 am

RE: SIN-FRA Is Always Full!

Thu Aug 14, 2003 9:27 pm

StarFlyer, a small caveat here: these are not the availabilities for SIN-FRA, but for FRA-SIN. Opposite direction may look a little different.

Also, right now, I think it is vacation time in Germany, and as they are big travelers...
 
JGPH1A
Posts: 15079
Joined: Thu Aug 14, 2003 4:36 pm

RE: SIN-FRA Is Always Full!

Thu Aug 14, 2003 9:59 pm

Re: PlaneHolland

" Flights or bookclasses fully open when requesting availability doesn't say anything. Try to book 9 seats (close the booking) and see what happens then.

mostly the whole flight is suddenly full. (overbooking...)"

The availability displayed there is direct from the inventory systems of all those airlines - the principle of WYZIWYG applies in all CRS systems - what you see is what you get. So you could sell up to 9 seats on all those classes where there is a posting level of 9, and the airline is obliged to honour the booking (not all of them do, though !).


Young and beautiful and thin and gorgeous AND BANNED ! Cya at airspaceonline.com, losers
 
Stratofish
Posts: 1043
Joined: Mon Sep 24, 2001 6:38 am

RE: SIN-FRA Is Always Full!

Fri Aug 15, 2003 12:10 am

@Airsicknessbag:
And still no trip report? Should I be disappointed?  Big grin

Falko: A friend just flew FRA-SIN-SYD on SQ and got the nightflight on the leg to SIN. AFAIK, she purchased the ticket about 3 weeks before the flight for about 1100 EUR (Which is 300 EUR more than I did pay for my upcoming flight to MEL Big grin ). Which travel agent / internet site do you check?
The Metro might be the Sub(optimal)way
 
godbless
Posts: 2681
Joined: Tue Apr 04, 2000 5:26 am

RE: SIN-FRA Is Always Full!

Fri Aug 15, 2003 1:43 am

And still no trip report? Should I be disappointed?
I must defend Airsicknessbag here... It is not his fault that it is taking so long but you will soon be able to read a little more about his trip. Laugh out loud And I guess I can promise that. Smokin cool

On the flight last thursday there were over 300 passengers that flew JFK-SIN via FRA and the rest was filled up with passengers just going FRA-SIN. I have no idea how many just flew JFK-FRA (SQ has full rights) but without the JFK passengers I doubt that SQ would need a 747 on that leg just as the second SIN-FRA-SIN flight will soon be operated by a 777 and that flight better shows the actual traffic between Frankfurt and Singapore.

Max
 
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Plane Holland
Posts: 472
Joined: Sun Oct 01, 2000 8:27 pm

RE: SIN-FRA Is Always Full!

Fri Aug 15, 2003 5:15 am

JGPH1A:
the booking when made for let's say 9 pax will be honoured, but it's quite possible suddenly all classes appear full. The availability for example shows 90 seats open but in fact no way 90 seats are open.

I know for Worldspan you can use direct access which guarantees when booked, but neutral mostly doesn't.

thanks, Plane Holland
 
StarFlyer
Topic Author
Posts: 929
Joined: Thu Sep 12, 2002 10:07 am

RE: SIN-FRA Is Always Full!

Fri Aug 15, 2003 6:17 pm

Just flew SQ26 and it was PACKED! It was quite a mission to get on it as well, had to waitlist and was confirmed only about 2hours before departure. Absolute horror sitting in SQs cramped seats for that long! I wish I could use my LH Miles to upgrade but thats just wishful thinking isnt it.

I think LH should put on a second daily flight, maybe 3x weekly, on A340. In summer time anyway.
Yours truly - StarFlyer
 
andrew
Posts: 360
Joined: Thu Dec 30, 1999 9:58 pm

RE: SIN-FRA Is Always Full!

Fri Aug 15, 2003 7:03 pm

Welcome back home, StarFlyer.  Smile/happy/getting dizzy
 
StarFlyer
Topic Author
Posts: 929
Joined: Thu Sep 12, 2002 10:07 am

RE: SIN-FRA Is Always Full!

Fri Aug 15, 2003 7:49 pm

Thanks Andrew... I am working on a trip report...  Smile I am actually quite sad to be back...
Yours truly - StarFlyer

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