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AASTEW
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Posts: 418
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World's Largest Carrier?

Thu Oct 30, 2003 12:00 pm

I know the title has been back and forth between AA and UA being the world's largest carriers. However, I believe CO was the largest for a short time! Is that true?

AASTEW
 
767Lover
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RE: World's Largest Carrier?

Thu Oct 30, 2003 12:14 pm

I refuse to believe any airlines claims of being the "world's largest" because too often they "cheat" by counting code-share seats in the total.
 
AATriple7
Posts: 156
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RE: World's Largest Carrier?

Thu Oct 30, 2003 12:18 pm

BA is a large one isnt it? I dont know how many aircraft they own. I think something like 25 747-400`s I think I heard that somewhere
USAF
 
timz
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RE: World's Largest Carrier?

Thu Oct 30, 2003 12:20 pm

Very much doubt that CO was ever the leader by passenger-miles or ton-kilometers or any such measure.
 
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B747-437B
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RE: World's Largest Carrier?

Thu Oct 30, 2003 12:23 pm

Very much doubt that CO was ever the leader by passenger-miles or ton-kilometers or any such measure.

Back in the day when Texas International owned everything from Continental to Frontier to Eastern to New York Air to PeoplExpress it was indeed a reality.
 
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northstardc4m
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RE: World's Largest Carrier?

Thu Oct 30, 2003 12:23 pm

Texas International, which owned CO along with EA and other, was the largest "carrier" in the world during most of the 1980s, though Aeroflot wasnt counted at the time.

But Continental itself i dont believe was ever the largest in any terms.
Those who would give up Essential Liberty to purchase a little Temporary Safety, deserve neither Liberty nor Safety.
 
GSPITNL
Posts: 342
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RE: World's Largest Carrier?

Thu Oct 30, 2003 12:25 pm

I know that DL is the worlds 2nd largest carrier? Are there any numbers that prove who is the worlds largest??


GSPITL
Fly Delta - The Only Way To Fly! Silver Medallion Baby :)
 
n844aa
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Joined: Fri Jul 18, 2003 10:38 am

RE: World's Largest Carrier?

Thu Oct 30, 2003 12:28 pm

At one point, EA carried more passengers than any other airline in the "free world."

I've always loved that particular distinction. You just can't compete on size with a 12,000-plane behemoth, though.
New airplanes, new employees, low fares, all touchy-feely ... all of them are losers. -Gordon Bethune
 
flyabr
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RE: World's Largest Carrier?

Thu Oct 30, 2003 12:35 pm

doesn't american have the largest fleet....but delta flies the most passengers...?
 
Guest

RE: World's Largest Carrier?

Thu Oct 30, 2003 12:41 pm

American Airlines is currently the worlds largest. Prior to the TW buy out UA was.
 
rockyracoon
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RE: World's Largest Carrier?

Thu Oct 30, 2003 12:46 pm

FlyABR,

Delta says they are "the 2nd largest airline in passngeres carried," I believe they changed this because I recall them saying they were 1st in passengers carried in the past. It all sounds like bs to me  Smile/happy/getting dizzy


Tim

Airports I've flown from: CVG PIT DAY JAX MWO PHL PHX ORD DCA IAD MIA TPA MCO FLL ATL DTW DFW SJC LAX DEN SLC LAS HNL LIH OGG YVR GYE MUC ICN NRT PVG SHA SZX MNL PPS CRK BKK DMK KBV EOH MDE CLO CTG SMR BOG ACD MEX CUN MID AUA SAL RTB
 
777-200X
Posts: 24
Joined: Sat Apr 08, 2000 4:17 am

RE: World's Largest Carrier?

Thu Oct 30, 2003 12:47 pm

In terms of Revenue Passenger Kilometers (based on the first 8 months of 2003) the order is as following:

1. American
2. United
3. Delta
4. Northwest
5. Continental

Based on number of passengers carried (end of 2002):

1. American
2. Delta
3. United
4. Southwest
5. Northwest

Based on number of Aircraft (end of 2002):

1. American 806
2. United 557
3. Delta 548
4. Northwest 446
5. Southwest 375

This information is on Air Transport World's website.

http://www.atwonline.com
 
GSPITNL
Posts: 342
Joined: Tue Oct 28, 2003 1:10 pm

RE: World's Largest Carrier?

Thu Oct 30, 2003 12:49 pm

Thanks 777-200X

GSPITL
Fly Delta - The Only Way To Fly! Silver Medallion Baby :)
 
geg2rap
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RE: World's Largest Carrier?

Thu Oct 30, 2003 12:49 pm

Before we argue all day about who is the largest are you saying passengers carried or fleet size.
Fleet size...drum roll please...is fed ex by alot over american (even including american eagle)
Passengers AA, UA try harder next year  Smile maybe take over US
 
767Lover
Posts: 3254
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RE: World's Largest Carrier?

Thu Oct 30, 2003 12:49 pm

You just can't compete on size with a 12,000-plane behemoth, though.

Who has 12,000 planes?
 
GSPITNL
Posts: 342
Joined: Tue Oct 28, 2003 1:10 pm

RE: World's Largest Carrier?

Thu Oct 30, 2003 12:50 pm

I assumed AA was #1. I also thought that DL had more planes than UA though

GSPITL
Fly Delta - The Only Way To Fly! Silver Medallion Baby :)
 
StevenUhl777
Posts: 3281
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RE: World's Largest Carrier?

Thu Oct 30, 2003 12:54 pm

It has been argued that Aeroflot was the world's largest airline up until 1991, when the USSR broke up.

Excluding Aeroflot, it was UA for the longest time, with AA on their heels much of that time. I believe, as the #'s support above, the title now belongs solely to AA, despite all the cutbacks of the last two years.

Sadly, because UA and AA are the two largest carriers, it's also believed that's the reason why their planes were chosen to be used on 9/11.
And the winner for best actress is....REESE WITHERSPOON for 'Walk the Line'!!!!!!!!
 
n844aa
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RE: World's Largest Carrier?

Thu Oct 30, 2003 12:59 pm

Aeroflot had 12,000 planes before the breakup of the Soviet Union. I believe some 400 new airlines were created from its remnants.
New airplanes, new employees, low fares, all touchy-feely ... all of them are losers. -Gordon Bethune
 
777-200X
Posts: 24
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RE: World's Largest Carrier?

Thu Oct 30, 2003 1:15 pm

GEG2RAP,

As of year end 2002, FedEx has 324 in its fleet. I am not sure what you mean by "a lot" over American. Also, the fleet size listed above only refer to main-line fleet. For example if you include Eagle, American will have 1,105 aircraft.
 
Guest

RE: World's Largest Carrier?

Thu Oct 30, 2003 1:35 pm

- AATriple7 / We (BA) have 56 B-747-400's and 43 B-777-200's in our fleet. I'm not very sure but I think that means we have the world's largest fleet of jumbo jets. I'm sure someone here will know for sure.

I know for a fact that BA is the world's largest airline in terms of international destinations served.

Lots of people are talking about CO as being a record holder. Their record is also for international destinations. They fly to more than any other US carrier.
 
lehpron
Posts: 6846
Joined: Tue Jul 10, 2001 3:42 am

RE: World's Largest Carrier?

Thu Oct 30, 2003 1:37 pm

How come when I asked this question just with the topic worded differently, there weren't as many replies?? Should I stop using the word airline or what?

Anyone else? Your input is theoretically greatly appreciated.

https://www.airliners.net/discussions/general_aviation/read.main/1237889/

The meaning of life is curiosity; we were put on this planet to explore opportunities.
 
flyboy80
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RE: World's Largest Carrier?

Thu Oct 30, 2003 2:14 pm

Yeah... I think that DL does have more planes than UA
 
9V-SVE
Posts: 1953
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RE: World's Largest Carrier?

Thu Oct 30, 2003 2:29 pm

- AATriple7 / We (BA) have 56 B-747-400's and 43 B-777-200's in our fleet. I'm not very sure but I think that means we have the world's largest fleet of jumbo jets. I'm sure someone here will know for sure.

Besides about 15-20 744(D)s, does JAL have several dozen 742s and 743s?
 
LHR001
Posts: 966
Joined: Mon Oct 27, 2003 1:56 am

RE: World's Largest Carrier?

Thu Oct 30, 2003 3:22 pm


British Airways has a mammoth number of widebody aircraft

Qantas until a few years ago was the Worlds largest all-widebody fleet

Singapore Airlines has a mammoth number of widebody aircraft
 
Birdwatching
Posts: 3711
Joined: Sat Sep 06, 2003 10:48 am

RE: World's Largest Carrier?

Thu Oct 30, 2003 3:25 pm

You can interpret statistics in any way you want. Just think hard, and you could even say that Northwest is the world's largest carrier.

What was the criteria again? Highest average fleet age?  Smile/happy/getting dizzy
All the things you probably hate about travelling are warm reminders that I'm home
 
chrisdigo
Posts: 179
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RE: World's Largest Carrier?

Thu Oct 30, 2003 4:05 pm

777-200LX :This information is on Air Transport World's website. http://www.atwonline.com

What about since the deal between AF and KLM?
From this source
http://www.cnn.com/2003/BUSINESS/09/30/france.klm/index.html

Af & KLM would become the 3rd.

Chris
 
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azncsa4qf744er
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RE: World's Largest Carrier?

Thu Oct 30, 2003 4:15 pm

777-200X Is correct. It's really hard to narrow now how big an airlines is considering fleets size, codeshare, passengers carried, cargo, etc.... I like the way 777-200X explain.... Thanks...
 
ual777contrail
Posts: 2914
Joined: Sun Feb 17, 2002 11:33 am

RE: World's Largest Carrier?

Thu Oct 30, 2003 4:50 pm

BAJAX,
You said that BA has 56-747's and 43-777's
UAL has 11-767-200's
38-767-300's
52-777's
29-747's
total is 129
BA is 99 widebodies.

United is the biggest operator of the 777, for now anyways.

doesn't AA count their AE planes as well? I find it hard to believe that AA has that many narrow and widebodies.

UAL 777 CONTRAIL
 
qqflyboy
Posts: 1635
Joined: Sat Oct 25, 2003 1:47 pm

RE: World's Largest Carrier?

Thu Oct 30, 2003 10:30 pm

According to the AMR Corp website, here's AA's fleet as of October, 2003:

772 - 45
A300 - 34
763 - 58
762 - 29
752 - 146
738 - 77
MD80 - 260
F100 - 48
------
Total: 799

AE Fleet:

SAAB 340 - 37
ATR 42 - 12
ATR 72 - 42
EMB 140 - 59
EMB 145 - 46
EMB 135 - 39
CRJ 700 - 15
------
Total: 250

Combined Total: 1,049
The views expressed are mine alone and do not necessarily reflect my employer’s views.
 
flyabr
Posts: 869
Joined: Fri Sep 19, 2003 11:42 am

RE: World's Largest Carrier?

Thu Oct 30, 2003 11:42 pm

hummm...something seems odd about AA md80 numbers. i could have sworn they had 260 md80s before combining with twa? don't they have over 300 now??

 
Bobs89irocz
Posts: 599
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RE: World's Largest Carrier?

Fri Oct 31, 2003 1:24 am

UA777CONTRAIL- UA has 129 wide bodys all together, however you just counted the 99 wide bodys BA has from there 747/777 fleet. You didnt count there 767 fleet. If you want to count the 767's and such then AA is the biggist in that catagory too with over 160 widebodys.

772-45
A300-34
763-58
762-29
total: 166 (according the the info abover)

FlyABR- thats exacly what i was thinking, i thought AA had over 300 MD-80's now.
 
Shamrock_747
Posts: 1499
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RE: World's Largest Carrier?

Fri Oct 31, 2003 1:33 am

BA also has 21 767-300ERs, so that brings their widebody fleet to a total of 120.

Declan
 
User avatar
EA CO AS
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RE: World's Largest Carrier?

Fri Oct 31, 2003 1:44 am

BA also has 21 767-300ERs, so that brings their widebody fleet to a total of 120.

Which is still less than AA's total of widebody aircraft.
"In this present crisis, government is not the solution to our problem - government IS the problem." - Ronald Reagan

Comments made here are my own and are not intended to represent the official position of Alaska Air Group
 
L1011Lover
Posts: 736
Joined: Sat Oct 25, 2003 5:16 am

RE: World's Largest Carrier?

Fri Oct 31, 2003 7:45 am

Hi FlyABR and RockyRacoon,

...Delta used to be the world´s largest airline in terms of passengers carried!

After AA´s aquisition of TWA, Delta dropped to position 2!

Best regards

L1011Lover
 
Sydscott
Posts: 3513
Joined: Thu Oct 30, 2003 11:50 am

RE: World's Largest Carrier?

Fri Oct 31, 2003 8:09 am


According to JAL's website they equal AA's widebody fleet with 166 aircraft made up of;

26 B747LR
3 B747SR
34 B747-400
8 747-400D
10 747F
3 767-200
25 767-300
14 A300
22 A300-600R
6 MD-11
15 Dc-10

Just for you info.  Smile/happy/getting dizzy
 
RickB
Posts: 807
Joined: Mon May 19, 2003 3:11 am

RE: World's Largest Carrier?

Fri Oct 31, 2003 8:58 am

Question for you guys ?

Who has the largest number of seats in a fleet -i.e. which airline is capable of lifting the greatest number of passengers into the air at one time?

RickB

 
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JeffM
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RE: World's Largest Carrier?

Fri Oct 31, 2003 9:06 am

Actually, the Nimitz-class carriers are the largest at 1092 feet long.

 Smile

Jeff
 
Bobs89irocz
Posts: 599
Joined: Fri Aug 22, 2003 4:52 am

RE: World's Largest Carrier?

Fri Oct 31, 2003 3:30 pm

LOL....thats funny Jeff.

Dang, i had NO idea JA has so many different types of birds in there fleet. That is amazing. I knew they had alot of widebodys but i had NO idea it was as much as AA. I always thought UA had more widebodys as well but i guess not.
 
skiordie
Posts: 71
Joined: Thu Jul 19, 2001 4:20 am

RE: World's Largest Carrier?

Fri Oct 31, 2003 4:29 pm

Everyone is counting the # of aircraft in passenger service. How do shipping companies like UPS and Fedex line up in respect to fleet size?

Thanks for the insights...
 
qqflyboy
Posts: 1635
Joined: Sat Oct 25, 2003 1:47 pm

RE: World's Largest Carrier?

Fri Oct 31, 2003 5:22 pm

Correction to AA's fleet total:

There are 362 MD-80s in the fleet... I just copied it over wrong. The total number of 799 A/C remains the same. Sorry for the confusion.

I remember AA used to have a "Fast Fact' link on its AMR CORP website, but I can't find the part I am looking for. On it, they used to say how many seats the airline had. I went through and roughly figured them on my own. Please keep in mind they aren't 100% accurate as some A/C configurations vary by a few seats. From my best estimate, AA has 123,446 seats, and AE has 11,929 seats for a total of 135,375 seats. I highly doubt AA has the most seats since we do not fly the 747, and most of our aicraft are equipped with "More Room Throughout Coach." The airline removed some 7,200 seats in its MRTC initiative. Sadly, as you may have heard, those seats are being added back to the 757 and A300 A/C.
The views expressed are mine alone and do not necessarily reflect my employer’s views.
 
bmacleod
Posts: 2990
Joined: Sat Aug 25, 2001 3:10 am

RE: World's Largest Carrier?

Sat Nov 01, 2003 3:47 am

AA is still the largest in terms of fleet size. Delta did carry the most passengers until 2001. AA may be the current leader but Delta will probably move back to the top by next year.

[Edited 2003-10-31 19:51:14]
"What good are wings without the courage to fly?" - Atticus
 
SESGDL
Posts: 2920
Joined: Sat Jan 13, 2001 6:25 am

RE: World's Largest Carrier?

Sat Nov 01, 2003 6:08 am

United owns 163 widebodies.

48 747-400
19 767-200/200ER
34 767-300ER
60 777-200

Not 90 or whatever someone previously said. DL has 134.

15 767-200
28 767-300
59 767-300ER
21 767-400ER
8 777-200
3 MD-11

P.S. Over half of AA's 767-200 fleet is in storage as if over half of UA's 747's.

Jeremy
 
flyabr
Posts: 869
Joined: Fri Sep 19, 2003 11:42 am

RE: World's Largest Carrier?

Sun Nov 02, 2003 9:02 am

well, one interesting stat was that back in august Southwest carried more passengers domestically vs all other carriers!!
 
Guest

RE: World's Largest Carrier?

Sun Nov 02, 2003 9:08 am

SESGDL,
Your numbers are flawed. UA doesn't own 48 B744 (they own/lease a number in the low-to-mid 40s), and they operate about half the number of B744/B762 you list.
 
AA623BDLSJU
Posts: 374
Joined: Sat Aug 16, 2003 2:16 am

RE: World's Largest Carrier?

Thu Nov 06, 2003 2:59 am

American is the largest carrier as far as fleet size.

British Airways is the largest (from I heard in the news) carrier in Europe with the most international destinations. However, that is going to change once Air France and KLM fully merges.

"Something special in the air."
 
elwood64151
Posts: 2410
Joined: Fri Feb 08, 2002 10:22 am

RE: World's Largest Carrier?

Thu Nov 06, 2003 4:33 am

Chrisdigo:

According to The Economist, AF and KLM want to merge, but they may face anti-trust restrictions in the US if they do so. At present, IIRC, AF owns 49% of a holding company that now owns 80% of KLM. KLM's previous owners own the other 51%. I could have the exact numbers wrong, but I don't have the article with me to check.

Alitalia has also voiced interest in merging with the combined carrier, which would result in the world's largest airline by several different standards.

UAL777CONTRAIL:

After buying TWA, AA had many more planes than that. Several aircraft have been retired for one reason or another.
Those who fail to learn history are doomed to repeat it in summer school.
 
ual777contrail
Posts: 2914
Joined: Sun Feb 17, 2002 11:33 am

RE: World's Largest Carrier?

Thu Nov 06, 2003 3:34 pm

SESGDL,
UAL doesn't have all the planes you listed, those are pre-9/11 numbers.
we don't have 60 777's like we once did, but we are still the largest operator of that fleet type.

the 747's haven't been that high of a number in awhile.


UAL 777 CONTRAIL
 
BN747
Posts: 7934
Joined: Thu Mar 28, 2002 5:48 am

RE: World's Largest Carrier?

Thu Nov 06, 2003 4:26 pm

UAL 777 Contrail, UAL does have all 60 those 777s (except N230UA [#61] which hasn't and may not be built) which is a total of 61 ships. Now some may be parked... along with about 20 some odd 747s. UAL hasn't sold any 777s nor lost any of them (thank god) . And I have them all photographed....except N230UA.
Count 'em....

28714 205 B777-222(ER) 03/22/99 UNITED AIRLINES N205UA 2705
30212 216 B777-222(ER) 05/18/99 UNITED AIRLINES N206UA 2706
30213 232 B777-222(ER) 07/21/99 UNITED AIRLINES N207UA 2707
30214 254 B777-222(ER) 11/12/99 UNITED AIRLINES N208UA 2708
30215 259 B777-222(ER)12/16/99 UNITED AIRLINES N209UA 2809
30216 264 B777-222 01/28/00 UNITED AIRLINES N210UA 2510
30217 282 B777-222 05/18/00 UNITED AIRLINES N211UA 2511
30218 293 B777-222 07/28/00 UNITED AIRLINES N212UA 2512
30219 295 B777-222 08/15/00 UNITED AIRLINES N213UA 2513
30220 296 B777-22208/25/00 UNITED AIRLINES N214UA 2514
30221 297 B777-222 08/30/00 UNITED AIRLINES N215UA 2515
30549 291 B777-222(ER)07/21/00 UNITED AIRLINES N216UA 2816
30550 294 B777-222(ER) 08/14/00 UNITED AIRLINES N217UA 2817
30222 317 B777-222(ER) 01/10/01 UNITED AIRLINES N218UA 2818
30551 318 B777-222(ER) 01/23/01 UNITED AIRLINES N219UA 2819
30223 340 B777-222(ER) 05/25/01 UNITED AIRLINES N220UA 2820
30552 347 B777-222(ER) 06/22/01 UNITED AIRLINES N221UA 2821
30553 352 B777-222(ER) 07/24/01 UNITED AIRLINES N222UA 2822
30224 357 B777-222(ER) 08/24/01 UNITED AIRLINES (WFBN) N223UA 2823
30225 375 B777-222(ER)12/07/01 UNITED AIRLINES N224UA 2824
30554 377 B777-222(ER) 12/12/01 UNITED AIRLINES N225UA 2825
30226 380 B777-222(ER) 01/14/02 UNITED AIRLINES N226UA 2826
30555 381 B777-222(ER) 01/14/02 UNITED AIRLINES N227UA 2827
30556 384 B777-222(ER) 02/14/02 UNITED AIRLINES N228UA 2828
30557 388 B777-222(ER) 03/07/02 UNITED AIRLINES N229UA 2829
30227 *** B777-222(ER) YTB UNITED AIRLINES N230UA 2830
26917 8 B777-222 05/24/95 UNITED AIRLINES N766UA 2366
26918 9 B777-222 05/31/95 UNITED AIRLINES N767UA 2367
26919 11 B777-222 06/26/95 UNITED AIRLINES N768UA 2368
26921 12 B777-222 06/28/95 UNITED AIRLINES N769UA 2369
26925 13 B777-222 07/13/95 UNITED AIRLINES N770UA 2370
26932 3 B777-222 11/27/95 UNITED AIRLINES N771UA 2371
26930 5 B777-222 09/29/95 UNITED AIRLINES N772UA 2372
26929 4 B777-222 01/31/96 UNITED AIRLINES N773UA 2373
26936 2 B777-222 03/29/96 UNITED AIRLINES N774UA 2374
26947 22 B777-222 01/22/96 UNITED AIRLINES N775UA 2375
26937 27 B777-222 04/11/96 UNITED AIRLINES N776UA 2376
26916 7 B777-222 05/15/95 UNITED AIRLINES N777UA 2377 [1ST B777 DELY][FRF 07JUN95]
26940 34 B777-222 07/18/96 UNITED AIRLINES N778UA 2378
26941 35 B777-222 07/26/96 UNITED AIRLINES N779UA 2379
26944 36 B777-222 08/06/96 UNITED AIRLINES N780UA 2380
26945 40 B777-222 09/12/96 UNITED AIRLINES N781UA 2381
26948 57 B777-222(ER) 03/07/97 UNITED AIRLINES N782UA 2782
26950 60 B777-222(ER) 03/11/97 UNITED AIRLINES N783UA 2783
26951 69 B777-222(ER) 04/29/97 UNITED AIRLINES N784UA 2784
26954 73 B777-222(ER) 05/21/97 UNITED AIRLINES N785UA 2785
26938 52 B777-222(ER) 04/04/97 UNITED AIRLINES N786UA 2786
26939 43 B777-222(ER) 06/05/97 UNITED AIRLINES N787UA 2787
26942 82 B777-222(ER) 07/15/97 UNITED AIRLINES N788UA 2788
26935 88 B777-222(ER) 08/11/97 UNITED AIRLINES N789UA 2789
26943 92 B777-222(ER) 09/01/97 UNITED AIRLINES N790UA 2790
26933 93 B777-222(ER) 08/28/97 UNITED AIRLINES N791UA 2791
26934 96 B777-222(ER) 09/25/97 UNITED AIRLINES N792UA 2792
26946 97 B777-222(ER) 10/07/97 UNITED AIRLINES N793UA 2793
26953 105 B777-222(ER) 11/18/97 UNITED AIRLINES N794UA 2794
26927 108 B777-222(ER) 12/09/97 UNITED AIRLINES N795UA 2795
26931 112 B777-222(ER) 01/28/98 UNITED AIRLINES N796UA 2796
26924 116 B777-222(ER) 02/20/98 UNITED AIRLINES N797UA 2797
26928 123 B777-222(ER) 02/28/98 UNITED AIRLINES N798UA 2798
26926 139 B777-222(ER) 05/08/98 UNITED AIRLINES N799UA 2799

61 SHIPS

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BN747



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