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trijetfan1
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Large Cities Without A Major Airline Hubbed There

Sun Feb 22, 2004 10:23 am

What are some large cities without a major airline based or hubbed there?
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usairways85
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RE: Large Cities Without A Major Airline Hubbed There

Sun Feb 22, 2004 10:31 am

I think one of the biggest is BOS. BOS does have sizeable ops for American, Delta, and US Airways but none are a main hub at BOS.
 
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RE: Large Cities Without A Major Airline Hubbed There

Sun Feb 22, 2004 10:33 am

Probably b/c BOS lacks the facilities and, to a lesser degree, central location for 'large hub' status...

I guess IND, MCO (major DL station - but not a hub) and MCI would be up there.

STL, anybody?  Laugh out loud

[Edited 2004-02-22 02:37:25]
 
trijetfan1
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RE: Large Cities Without A Major Airline Hubbed There

Sun Feb 22, 2004 10:34 am

Is anyone based in SEA?
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United_fan
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RE: Large Cities Without A Major Airline Hubbed There

Sun Feb 22, 2004 10:36 am

Alaska has a large presence in SEA.
"Suspicion is a matter of opinion"
 
nonrevman
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RE: Large Cities Without A Major Airline Hubbed There

Sun Feb 22, 2004 10:39 am

If you do not count gateways or focus cities as a hub, I would say New Orleans MSY is amongst the largest.
 
ssides
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RE: Large Cities Without A Major Airline Hubbed There

Sun Feb 22, 2004 10:40 am

SAN is probably the largest market without a hub. BOS is not technically a hub, but AA routes so much traffic through BOS most would say it doesn't count.
"Lose" is not spelled with two o's!!!!
 
yanksn4
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RE: Large Cities Without A Major Airline Hubbed There

Sun Feb 22, 2004 10:47 am

Alaska Airlines is based in Seattle, so Seattle is ruled out. I might be wrong, but has anyone noticed that New York (JFK and LGA) isn't home to a major airline?
Don't let the truth get in the way of a good story
 
trijetfan1
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RE: Large Cities Without A Major Airline Hubbed There

Sun Feb 22, 2004 10:47 am

Does US Airways still have a hub in BWI
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trijetfan1
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RE: Large Cities Without A Major Airline Hubbed There

Sun Feb 22, 2004 10:49 am

Probably beacuse the demand is so large at JFK that one airline cannot rule most of the routes.
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flyabr
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RE: Large Cities Without A Major Airline Hubbed There

Sun Feb 22, 2004 10:52 am

well, i guess it depends upon what is considered a large city....but what about san antonio...sacramento or oklahoma city?

[Edited 2004-02-22 03:00:39]
 
HNLFlyBoy
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RE: Large Cities Without A Major Airline Hubbed There

Sun Feb 22, 2004 11:04 am

HNL doesn't have a major based here nor is it a gateway....unless u count HA as a major carrier...then we have one based here.
 
trijetfan1
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RE: Large Cities Without A Major Airline Hubbed There

Sun Feb 22, 2004 11:06 am

Doesn't Air New Zealand have a hub in HNL?
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HNLFlyBoy
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RE: Large Cities Without A Major Airline Hubbed There

Sun Feb 22, 2004 11:16 am

nope TriJet, that's a negative...I don't even think they serve HNL daily anymore....nothing from the down under flag carriers, QF and AZ, serve HNL daily anymore....only AC from SYD is daily.
 
trijetfan1
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RE: Large Cities Without A Major Airline Hubbed There

Sun Feb 22, 2004 11:21 am

O I see, thanks for clearing that up for me. In this airline book it siad that Air New Zealand had a hub in HNL. But that book was made in 99'.
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Coronado990
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RE: Large Cities Without A Major Airline Hubbed There

Sun Feb 22, 2004 11:39 am

I would think that would Los Angeles. Although a lot of airlines have a healthy amount of flights there, not one airline really has a "hub" there.
Bonanza Air Lines. The original BZ.
 
trijetfan1
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RE: Large Cities Without A Major Airline Hubbed There

Sun Feb 22, 2004 11:41 am

Who do you think will be the first airline to hub in San Diego?
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aa757first
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RE: Large Cities Without A Major Airline Hubbed There

Sun Feb 22, 2004 11:44 am

Top 25 Cities in Terms Population

1. NYC - B6, DL, CO
2. LAX - UA
3. CHI - UA, TZ, WN
4. IAH - CO
5. PHL - US
6. PHX - HP, WN
7. SAN - No Hub
8. DFW - AA
9. SAT - No Hub
10. DTW - NW
11. SJC - No Hub
12. IND - No Hub (TZ Focus City)
13. SFO - UA
14. JAX - No Hub
15. COLUMBUS - No Hub
16. AUS - No Hub
17. BWI - WN, FL
18. MEM - NW
19. MKE - Midwest
20. BOS - AA
21. DCA/IAD - US/UA (Respectfully)
22. BNA - AA, WN
23. EL PASO - WN
24. SEA - AS
25. DEN - UA, F9

The largest is San Diego.

AAndrew
 
trijetfan1
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RE: Large Cities Without A Major Airline Hubbed There

Sun Feb 22, 2004 11:47 am

Doesn't ATA have a hub in IND?
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aa757first
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RE: Large Cities Without A Major Airline Hubbed There

Sun Feb 22, 2004 11:50 am

TriJetFan1,

I am almost positive TZ considers IND a focus city.

AAndrew
 
trijetfan1
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RE: Large Cities Without A Major Airline Hubbed There

Sun Feb 22, 2004 11:53 am

Sorry, I didn't know what TZ was. When I put the cursor on it, nothing came up.
-chris
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frontiers4ever
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RE: Large Cities Without A Major Airline Hubbed There

Sun Feb 22, 2004 11:56 am

Alaska Air also has a "hub" at LAX.

-Frontiers4ever
Until you prove, your right, your wrong
 
ssides
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RE: Large Cities Without A Major Airline Hubbed There

Sun Feb 22, 2004 12:02 pm

Good job, Aa757First, but I think a better measure is metro area population. I love San Antonio, but in terms of "real" size, it doesn't hold a candle to Detroit or San Francisco.

In terms of metro area population, however, San Diego is still the largest:

1. New York (B6, DL, CO)
2. Los Angeles (UA, AA focus)
3. Chicago (UA, AA, ATA)
4. Washington-Baltimore (UA, US focus, WN focus)
5. San Francisco-Oakland-San Jose (UA)
6. Philadelphia (US)
7. Boston (AA focus, DL focus)
8. Detroit (NW)
9. Dallas-Ft. Worth (AA, DL)
10. Houston (CO, WN focus)
11. Atlanta (DL, FL)
12. Miami-Ft. Lauderdale (AA)
13. Seattle (AS)
14. Phoenix (HP, WN focus)
15. Minneapolis (NW)
16. Cleveland (CO)
17. San Diego (no hub)
18. St. Louis (AA barely)
19. Denver (UA, F9)
20. Tampa-St. Petersburg (no hub)
21. Pittsburgh (US)
22. Portland (no hub)
23. Cincinnati (DL)
24. Sacramento (no hub)
25. Kansas City (no hub)

"Lose" is not spelled with two o's!!!!
 
ssides
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RE: Large Cities Without A Major Airline Hubbed There

Sun Feb 22, 2004 12:08 pm

Also, by that same measure, it appears that Memphis (NW) is the smallest metro area with an airline hub.

The Memphis area, at 1.13 million people, is smaller than the above metro areas, as well as:

Milwaukee
Orlando
Indianapolis
San Antonio
Norfolk
Las Vegas (HP)
Columbus (former HP)
Charlotte (US)
New Orleans
Salt Lake City (DL)
Greensboro-Winston Salem
Austin
Nashville
Providence
Raleigh
Hartford
Buffalo

Let's not knock Memphis, though -- they still have the busiest cargo airport in the world.
"Lose" is not spelled with two o's!!!!
 
luv2fly
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RE: Large Cities Without A Major Airline Hubbed There

Sun Feb 22, 2004 12:24 pm

I don't think BWI is no longer even a focus city for US.
You can cut the irony with a knife
 
ssides
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RE: Large Cities Without A Major Airline Hubbed There

Sun Feb 22, 2004 12:27 pm

True, but you could still argue that it is a de facto focus city for WN. In any event, when judging by metro area, the DC area has UA at IAD.
"Lose" is not spelled with two o's!!!!
 
trijetfan1
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RE: Large Cities Without A Major Airline Hubbed There

Sun Feb 22, 2004 12:40 pm

Isn't New Orleans a focus city for Delta Airlines?
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MSYtristar
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RE: Large Cities Without A Major Airline Hubbed There

Sun Feb 22, 2004 1:05 pm

New Orleans USED to be a focus city for Delta. Flights to ORD, LGA, JFK, LAX, LAX, SLC, PNS, SJU, JAX, TPA, PNS, CCS, etc etc etc. Now, the only mainline service is to ATL and CVG, with DFW and MCO being relegated to all RJ-operated flights. Pretty much the only Delta has not changed from N.O is the use of wide bodies....767's, just like the L1011's before them, are still frequent sights here thankfully!


Steve/NewOrleans
 
MAH4546
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RE: Large Cities Without A Major Airline Hubbed There

Sun Feb 22, 2004 1:26 pm

The above posted metro list is outdated. The 2003 metros, using the newly definied CMA's:

1) New York City
2) Los Angeles
3) Chicago
4) Philadelphia/Atlantic City
5) Dallas/Ft. Worth
6) Miami/West Palm Beach
7) Washington
8) Houston
9) Atlanta
10) Detroit
11) Boston
12) San Francisco/Oakland
13) Riverside/Ontario, CA
14) Phoenix
15) Seattle
16) Minneapolis
17) San Diego
18) St. Louis
19) Baltimore
20) Tampa
21) Pittsburgh
22) Denver
23) Cleveland
24) Cincinnati
25) Portland
http://www.proximityone.com/msa03us.htm
*Note: There are no longer combined metropolitan areas, hence why Ontario and Los Angeles, among others, are now separate.

Going by the above list, Boston is the largest city without a hub, and Ontario is the largest city without a hub or focus city.
a.
 
ssides
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RE: Large Cities Without A Major Airline Hubbed There

Sun Feb 22, 2004 1:34 pm

Note that the first list of MSAs is the official Census list. The second list, while newer, is developed by a private marketing firm. There are flaws in both. For example, it's crazy to count Atlantic City and Philadelphia in the same metro area, but Riverside and Los Angeles are surely the same, as are Washington and Baltimore. In terms of defining air service markets, I think the Census list is much more accurate.
"Lose" is not spelled with two o's!!!!
 
B757capt
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RE: Large Cities Without A Major Airline Hubbed There

Sun Feb 22, 2004 2:02 pm

Kansas City, Since TWA has been gone and Vanguard its still pretty dead as far as hubs go!
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trijetfan1
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RE: Large Cities Without A Major Airline Hubbed There

Sun Feb 22, 2004 2:06 pm

Columbus is without a hub now.
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trijetfan1
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RE: Large Cities Without A Major Airline Hubbed There

Mon Feb 23, 2004 2:38 am

How large was TWA's presence in MCI?
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nycfuturepilot
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RE: Large Cities Without A Major Airline Hubbed There

Mon Feb 23, 2004 2:55 am

Trijet, IND used to be the TZ hub but it was moved to MDW when the airline decided to change its image.
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trijetfan1
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RE: Large Cities Without A Major Airline Hubbed There

Mon Feb 23, 2004 2:59 am

What flights did ATA have out of IND?
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Alert3
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RE: Large Cities Without A Major Airline Hubbed There

Mon Feb 23, 2004 3:16 am

Trijet:

HP doesn't have a hub in CMH now?.... I connected there about a year and a half ago.
 
ssides
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RE: Large Cities Without A Major Airline Hubbed There

Mon Feb 23, 2004 3:20 am

Alert3 --

HP gradually reduced its CMH operations shortly after 9/11/01, and fully closed the hub in early 2003.
"Lose" is not spelled with two o's!!!!
 
texan
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RE: Large Cities Without A Major Airline Hubbed There

Mon Feb 23, 2004 3:39 am

TZ maintains it's corporate headquarters in IND and, according to their website, is the largest carrier at IND and has been since 2002. Their "scheduled service hub" opened at MDW in 1992.

Texan
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Thrust
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RE: Large Cities Without A Major Airline Hubbed There

Mon Feb 23, 2004 3:44 am

STL does not really have a large presence of any airline anymore. AA is not gigantic here.
Fly one thing; Fly it well
 
MAH4546
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RE: Large Cities Without A Major Airline Hubbed There

Mon Feb 23, 2004 4:08 am

STL does not really have a large presence of any airline anymore. AA is not gigantic here.

With 200+ daily flights out of St. Louis, AA still has a very large presence at STL, more than double that of any other carrier at the airport. They offer St. Louis residents a route network that other cities St. Louis' size would love to have.
a.
 
VC745D
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RE: Large Cities Without A Major Airline Hubbed There

Mon Feb 23, 2004 5:49 am

"New Orleans USED to be a focus city for Delta. Flights to ORD, LGA, JFK, LAX, LAX, SLC, PNS, SJU, JAX, TPA, PNS, CCS, etc etc etc. Now, the only mainline service is to ATL and CVG, with DFW and MCO being relegated to all RJ-operated flights. Pretty much the only Delta has not changed from N.O is the use of wide bodies....767's, just like the L1011's before them, are still frequent sights here thankfully!"

I seem to remember that MSY landing fees shot up around the time of the 1984 World's Fair, which didn't please DL--this as ATL and DFW were getting bigger & bigger. You might be able to shed more light on this Steve/MSYtristar.
 
Cory6188
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RE: Large Cities Without A Major Airline Hubbed There

Mon Feb 23, 2004 5:52 am

Depending on how technical you want to be, New York doesn't have any airline's hub there because EWR is in NJ. Actually, when you think about it, most of the cities in the US would not have service to New York if it weren't for CO at EWR. There are many that only have service to EWR on CO.

PDX
SMF
AUS
HOU
IAH
CLE
HNL
JAX
DAB
CHS
CAE
CMH
JAC
SRQ
SAT

There are many more, but those are ones that come to mind and I'm too lazy to look up the numerous amount.  Smile
 
VC745D
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RE: Large Cities Without A Major Airline Hubbed There

Mon Feb 23, 2004 6:04 am

Cory6188-- What's point of your post? NYC is the overall New York City airport code, covering EWR, LGA, and JFK, as far as commercial operations go. And all three airports are under the auspices of the Port Authority. Or would you follow Mayor LaGuardia, who, in a what may have been a publicity stunt, arrived at EWR (seems to me on a TW DC2) and then demanded to be flown to NY because his ticket indicated "New York" as his destination? He was flown to Floyd Bennett (this was before LGA or IDL).

 
MAH4546
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RE: Large Cities Without A Major Airline Hubbed There

Mon Feb 23, 2004 7:32 am

Cory6188, time to correct your list.

PDX --> CORRECT
SMF --> jetblue, JFK-SMF, starts 3 March 2004
AUS --> American Airlines, AUS-HOU-LGA, 2x daily
HOU --> American Airlines, AUS-HOU-LGA, 2x daily
IAH --> Continental Airlines, IAH-JFK, daily
--> Continental Airlines, IAH-LGA, 8x daily
CLE --> Continental Express, CLE-JFK, daily
--> Continental and Continental Express, CLE-LGA, 6x daily
--> American Eagle, CLE-LGA, 4x daily
HNL --> CORRECT
JAX --> Delta Connection, JAX-JFK, 2x daily
--> Delta Connection, JAX-LGA, 4x daily
DAB --> CORRECT
CHS --> Delta Connection, CHS-JFK, 2x daily eff. 01Jul04
--> Delta Connection, CHS-LGA, 4x daily
--> USAirways Express, CHS-LGA, 2x daily
CAE --> Delta Connection, CAE-LGA, 3x daily
--> USAirways Express, CAE-LGA, daily
CMH --> Delta Connection, CMH-LGA, 3x daily
--> USAirways Express, CMH-LGA, 5x daily
--> American Eagle, CMH-LGA, 4x daily
--> Delta Conneciton, CMH-JFK, daily
JAC --> CORRECT
SRQ --> CORRECT
SAT --> CORRECT

a.
 
flyiguy
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RE: Large Cities Without A Major Airline Hubbed There

Mon Feb 23, 2004 3:05 pm

UA considers LAX as a HUB. In their inflight magazine they consider LAX as one of their hubs.
The opinions I post are of mine and mine alone, not of the airline I work for.
 
Guest

RE: Large Cities Without A Major Airline Hubbed There

Mon Feb 23, 2004 3:14 pm

"Who do you think will be the first airline to hub in San Diego?"

SAN will probably never be a hub.

But SAN did have an airline based here and I would say at that time it was somewhat of a hub when PSA was around still.

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