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GulfstreamGuy
Topic Author
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Song Diversion Into LIT

Fri Jun 11, 2004 11:44 pm

Song dropped in a 757-200 this morning (N685DL) due to smoke in the cockpit.
First time I have ever seen a Song 757 here in LIT. It was operating as flt 2060 LAX-FLL. I guess they will try to get the pax on other carriers.

This is the plane that is here in LIT now.

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Photo © Rudy Chiarello



Just thought I'd share..  Smile
GulfstreamGuy
"If we couldn't laugh, we would all go insane. " -Jimmy Buffett
 
atrude777
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RE: Song Diversion Into LIT

Fri Jun 11, 2004 11:52 pm

For a second I thought it was the ACTUAL pic of LIT, and was wondering what a BA 777 did too?? But of course i see it isnt now..:-P i feel stupid haah but thanks for sharing that inof, quite interesting,.,,didnt know LIT could handle a 757(but then again I dont know much about Little Rock, AR. lol)

Alex
Good things come to those who wait, better things come to those who go AFTER it!
 
BH346
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RE: Song Diversion Into LIT

Sat Jun 12, 2004 12:21 am

A 757 would definitely not be a big deal for LIT. After all, it used to see Air Force One often when Clinton was president. Also, it had the Concorde fly in a while back...I remembered seeing that when I was a little kid. Little Rock is a pretty decent sized city and it gets a good amount of air service for its size. Lots of Southwest 737s. When I flew in there last year, it was fairly busy. I don't think it would be a problem with the terminal, either. I think it was recently redone to accomodate expansion.

[Edited 2004-06-11 17:21:38]
Northwest Airlines - Some People Just Know How to Fly
 
JohnJ
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RE: Song Diversion Into LIT

Sat Jun 12, 2004 12:35 am

LIT has seen scheduled 757 service in the past on Delta. Their main runway is 8273', more than long enough for a 757. At my home airport of Hartford Bradley Field, Runway 15/33 is 6847' and handles boatloads of 757s.
 
Tom in NO
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RE: Song Diversion Into LIT

Sat Jun 12, 2004 1:08 am

I'd be curious as to why a 757 going from LAX-FLL would be flying as far north as to where a need for an emergency landing would necessitate a landing at LIT.

A more direct routing would have taken him closer to IAH or MSY. Was this a/c not certified for overwater flying, ie he couldn't fly over the Gulf of Mexico? Weather wouldn't have been a problem today. Even a corner-cutting routing would have taken him closer to DFW, JAN, PNS, or TLH.

Tom at MSY
"The criminal ineptitude makes you furious"-Bruce Springsteen, after seeing firsthand the damage from Hurricane Katrina
 
BA747400
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RE: Song Diversion Into LIT

Sat Jun 12, 2004 1:51 am

Atrude, LOL i did too! I was like, ok first of all why is there a BA world tale in the pic, and second what is BA doing in LIT?!

Regards,
Mike
 
dl757md
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RE: Song Diversion Into LIT

Sat Jun 12, 2004 2:01 am

Tom In NO

All Dl/Song 757s are certified for overwater. They are not ETOPS. But it can fly the route you suggested. As for why it was that far north, my best guess is weather.

Dl757md
757 Most beautiful airliner in the sky!
 
Type-Rated
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RE: Song Diversion Into LIT

Sat Jun 12, 2004 2:01 am

"I'd be curious as to why a 757 going from LAX-FLL would be flying as far north as to where a need for an emergency landing would necessitate a landing at LIT."

This was my exact first thoughts as well. Maybe it was FLL-ATL-LAX?
Fly North Central Airlines..The route of the Northliners!
 
zrb2
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RE: Song Diversion Into LIT

Sat Jun 12, 2004 2:52 am

FYI- that plane is scheduled to depart LIT-FLL at 1pm local time as DAL9435. I assume it's the Song 752 that's being discussed.
 
Tom in NO
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RE: Song Diversion Into LIT

Sat Jun 12, 2004 3:37 am

Looking at the current weather in the southeast and over the Gulf, and keeping in mind that Song landed at LIT at 3-something AM, I can't see any convective weather that would have been going on over the northern Gulf late last night. Perhaps some CAT that they wanted to avoid?

2060 is shown as a nonstop LAX-FLL flight.

Can anyone at DL post the flight plan for 2060 last night?

Tom at MSY
"The criminal ineptitude makes you furious"-Bruce Springsteen, after seeing firsthand the damage from Hurricane Katrina
 
OPNLguy
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RE: Song Diversion Into LIT

Sat Jun 12, 2004 5:12 am

Tom...

Three points...

1/ What looks like the shortest distance between two points on a map might not actually be so, as it's dependent upon what type of projection the map is using... (Mercator, Lambert Conical, etc...)

2/ While there may not have been convective weather at in Texas that forced the flight up over LIT, it still may have been weather-related in that this route was where the most favorable winds were. When I pull a "best-winds" flight plan, the resultant flight plan might appear to be this big arcing flightpath relative to what appears to be a "normal" route, but it's one that provides the quickest ETE and lowest fuel burn. Generally speaking, westbound we avoid the jetstream, and eastbound we try to ride it as much as possible.

3/ Another factor might have been the weather closer to ATL. If the SW arrival fix at ATL was impacted by weather, the route over LIT might have been to "feed" the NW arrival fix at ATL, rather than to proceed to the SW fix and then have to "jink" north to the NW fix.

Lots of variables...(as usual)

[Edited 2004-06-11 22:40:19]
ALL views, opinions expressed are mine ONLY and are NOT representative of those shared by Southwest Airlines Co.
 
smcmac32msn
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RE: Song Diversion Into LIT

Sat Jun 12, 2004 5:40 am

Ever hear of the Great Circle Route? It will be shorter to go north (in the northern hemisphere) and south (in the southern hemisphere) when flying east-west or west-east.
Hey Obama, keep the change! I want my dollar back.
 
dl757md
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RE: Song Diversion Into LIT

Sat Jun 12, 2004 5:57 am

Ever hear of the Great Circle Mapper?
http://gc.kls2.com/cgi-bin/gc?PATH=lax-fll&RANGE=&PATH-COLOR=&PATH-UNITS=mi&SPEED-GROUND=&SPEED-UNITS=kts&RANGE-STYLE=best&RANGE-COLOR=&MAP-STYLE=

Clearly shows the great circle route from LAX-FLL going directly over MSY some 346 miles SSE of LIT. I'll stick with weather being my guess as to why they landed in LIT.

[Edited 2004-06-11 22:58:24]
757 Most beautiful airliner in the sky!
 
Tom in NO
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RE: Song Diversion Into LIT

Sat Jun 12, 2004 6:15 am

Ever hear of the Great Circle Route? Yes: http://gc.kls2.com

I figured up an LAX-FLL GC routing and came up with 2,342 miles. Looking at the map, and taking some measurements, I see that the shortest distance from LIT to the direct GC route is roughly 281 nm. Even if you're going northerly around the Panhandle and not directly across the Gulf, LIT is a pretty fair distant alternate for an LAX-FLL nonstop.

OPNLguy, a question for you: would there be a limit as to how far away from a direct or semi-direct routing you would flight plan an aircraft in order to catch a tailwind or avoid a headwind, other weather criteria aside? I'm sure that it would vary, based upon among other things the length of the leg itself, altitude being flown at, fuel/pax/bags etc load, the winds you'd be getting vs. those you'd be leaving, etc?

Tom at MSY

DL757: I tried to link that map and it wouldn't take. Thanks for linking it.

[Edited 2004-06-11 23:17:08]
"The criminal ineptitude makes you furious"-Bruce Springsteen, after seeing firsthand the damage from Hurricane Katrina
 
OPNLguy
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RE: Song Diversion Into LIT

Sat Jun 12, 2004 6:39 am

>>>OPNLguy, a question for you: would there be a limit as to how far away from a direct or semi-direct routing you would flight plan an aircraft in order to catch a tailwind or avoid a headwind, other weather criteria aside?

Other than being limited by either the max fuel capacity of the aircraft, or the max burnable fuel (an still be able to maintain reserves, etc.) I'm not personally aware of any such limitations. Not saying that they don't exist (since it's pretty much a function of your flight plan provider's software programming), just that I don't know of any...

ALL views, opinions expressed are mine ONLY and are NOT representative of those shared by Southwest Airlines Co.
 
GulfstreamGuy
Topic Author
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RE: Song Diversion Into LIT

Sat Jun 12, 2004 10:36 am

To answer the "Can LIT support a 757?" question. Yes, UPS operates a 757 5 nights and mornings a week.

Delta had another "scare" this morning. The first flight to ATL took off and got a bird strike in the engine (not sure if #1 or #2) and had to make an emergency landing back here in LIT. I don't know the flight or tail number but I do know it was an MD-88.

GulfstreamGuy
"If we couldn't laugh, we would all go insane. " -Jimmy Buffett
 
jjbiv
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RE: Song Diversion Into LIT

Sat Jun 12, 2004 2:34 pm

The last few days it appears to have been a pretty stable route:

LAX.LAXX5.TRM..BXK.J4.SSO..ELP..CLL..LEV.Q100.REMIS..RSW.FORTL4.FLL

joe
 
fsuwxman
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RE: Song Diversion Into LIT

Sat Jun 12, 2004 11:36 pm

Could have been the winds up there. Maybe taking advantage of the jet. HAven't looked at an upper air plot in a couple days though... just my $0.02
ASOS... Another Shi#y Observation Station
 
GulfstreamGuy
Topic Author
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RE: Song Diversion Into LIT

Sun Jun 13, 2004 9:03 am

I found out that the Delta that had a bird strike was flt 1646 going to ATL and it was a/c N909DE. I took a picture of it being worked on, but you won't see it here on the database.

Here is another pic of it


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Photo © Matt Cawley



GulfstreamGuy
"If we couldn't laugh, we would all go insane. " -Jimmy Buffett

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