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vsmike
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VS 777-300ER

Sun Jul 04, 2004 1:56 pm

10 - 17 firm, options for 10 addl. Based at LHR, allowing ops up to 5 747-400s to MCO. Go British people!! I'm proud to be your favouite holiday destination!!

InTheKnow, see you soon. Drop me a line... I know who you are...! If you ever see a low flying plane, CROWCH, baby!

DXB, HAV, SYD, NAS, more DEL... Virgins are everywhere! Protect YOUR children!

777-300ER "Mine's Thicker Than Yours"
powered by GE100s... zoom, zoom.

SEND YOUR THOUGHTS NOW!

[Edited 2004-07-04 07:02:24]
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rjpieces
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RE: VS 777-300ER

Sun Jul 04, 2004 2:06 pm

Are you asking us, or telling us?

And you mean GE-90s.........

And is the "Mine's Thicker Than Yours" what it will be, or is that your guess?
"Millions long for immortality who do not know what to do with themselves on a rainy Sunday afternoon"
 
Northwest717
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RE: VS 777-300ER

Sun Jul 04, 2004 2:21 pm

I am wondering the same thing as Rjpieces. What are you trying to say Vsmike?  Confused

-Tim
Dubai: Center of the 21st Century
 
777ER
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RE: VS 777-300ER

Sun Jul 04, 2004 2:36 pm

Have VS ordered the B773ER?
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ua777222
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RE: VS 777-300ER

Sun Jul 04, 2004 3:04 pm

I don't know 777ER have they? Wink/being sarcastic


UA777222
"It wasn't raining when Noah built the ark."
 
Hamlet69
Posts: 2541
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RE: VS 777-300ER

Sun Jul 04, 2004 3:07 pm

No, this is still just a rumor. Otherwise, we would know the exact size of the order, not '10-17' firm, plus 10 options.

Although I know VS is serious about getting 777's, I don't think the odds are any greater now than they were 6 months ago - about 50/50.

Regards,

Hamlet69
All gave some. Some gave all.
 
Northwest717
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RE: VS 777-300ER

Sun Jul 04, 2004 3:13 pm

Hamlet69, thank you! A perfectly reasonable answer!  Smile/happy/getting dizzy

-Tim  Smile/happy/getting dizzy
Dubai: Center of the 21st Century
 
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solnabo
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RE: VS 777-300ER

Sun Jul 04, 2004 4:32 pm

Maybe Richard are to use the ER on domestic routes in US  Big grin
(if he ever order them)

Mike/  Insane
Airbus SAS - Love them both
 
dutchjet
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RE: VS 777-300ER

Sun Jul 04, 2004 7:02 pm

I have heard this rumor as well with the Virgin order to be announced very shortly - heard the info from a rather reliable source (a real person, not in cyber world) who is usually right about these things - but whenever there is a post about VS and the 777, it starts an A vs B war, so I said nothing.

I heard 10 firm plus 10 options, with an additional 7 coming from leasing companies......the leasing company will place their order simultaneously and Virgin will be required to lease those 777s aer part of this bigger deal. I also heard that this order is not very good news with respect to the future of A340 aircraft at Virigin, but we shall see what happens.

I heard from the same source that the SQ 772LR/773ER order will be announced shortly after the Virgin order, and we will be surprised by the size of that order.....couldnt not get more out of him than that, except that SQ will also order the 7e7 as a "Launch" customer (lots of discounts) and this will also cover many aircraft, and, finally, the A345's future at SQ does not look very promising.

Please, please, do not start an A Vs B war over this, I am NOT anti-Airbus and just repeating information that I heard from a reliable source......both the SQ and VS deals, if true, are MORE ABOUT MONEY than aircraft performance. Seems as if Boeing is going to go out and sell a lot of airplanes.
 
squirrel83
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RE: VS 777-300ER

Sun Jul 04, 2004 7:21 pm

No, this is still just a rumor. Otherwise, we would know the exact size of the order, not '10-17' firm, plus 10 options.

Although I know VS is serious about getting 777's, I don't think the odds are any greater now than they were 6 months ago - about 50/50.

Regards,

Hamlet69


I like this response the best as stated above I must agree BUT I do like the slogan that he came up with for VS 2 Engin Aircraft . . 777-300ER "Mine's Thicker Than Yours"

I would love to seee VS order the 300er the possibilities are endless . .

777-300er VS
A346, 7E7, 747, 777, Sonic Cruiser
 
Guest

RE: VS 777-300ER

Sun Jul 04, 2004 7:53 pm

Thats a 777-200ER

Still pretty appaling knews about SQ's A345's going (and the VS 7773ER), if it is true. I dunno what they are going to do with that A340NG simulator now. Ahh well IMO the A345 will always be the undeniable prettier of the 2 aircraft.

Puts VS in a good position though. Every time they want new 773/346, they just need to get the two companies around and see who will go the lowest.

[Edited 2004-07-04 13:07:30]
 
Scorpio
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RE: VS 777-300ER

Sun Jul 04, 2004 8:24 pm

I'll believe it when I see it. This reminds me of the rumours surrounding Qatar Airways and the 777 about a year ago. There we also had 'very reliable' sources telling us QR was going to buy the 773ER, up until the day of the signing, when those 'reliable sources' all turned out to be wrong, and QR bought Airbus.
 
dutchjet
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RE: VS 777-300ER

Sun Jul 04, 2004 8:29 pm

Good point, Roberta.....SQ is in a unique position: whenever its shopping for aircraft, they can make Boeing and Airbus do all kinds of unusual things and really play one manufacturer against eachother. SQ wanted the A345 to introduce the ultra long haul flights, but now if the 772LR is available and its a better fit for the fleet planning (ie, why bother with he A345 when we have all of these 777s?), SQ can order the 772LR at a great price from Boeing and Boeing and/or a leasing company will come up with some solution for the A345s (where SQ probably also got a killer good deal). The power of being a market leader, and having strong resources!

Re the A346 simulator that SQ ordered (no A345 simulators are yet available), I guess one of the leasing companies will take it off SQ hands, or Boeing will buy it and transfer it to the FlightSafety operation.
 
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solnabo
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RE: VS 777-300ER

Sun Jul 04, 2004 10:31 pm

"Mine´s thicker than your´s" when VS intro A388  Insane Just a thought..
Eat you´re heart out, 773  Big thumbs up

Mike//SE
Airbus SAS - Love them both
 
Northwest717
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RE: VS 777-300ER

Mon Jul 05, 2004 12:00 am

LOL, good one Solnabo! Hehehe. Can't wait for the introduction of the 7773ER in either Singapore's or Virgin's fleets (if it happens). Big thumbs up

-Tim  Smile/happy/getting dizzy

[Edited 2004-07-04 17:00:26]
Dubai: Center of the 21st Century
 
sevenheavy
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RE: VS 777-300ER

Mon Jul 05, 2004 12:30 am

Hi,

VSMike: I too like the slogan! As for the rest I hope you're right! I've heard all the rumors for a while now it would be nice to see something concrete!

Regards,

SevenHeavy.

P.s. Do you work for VS in MCO? I'm flying on the VS016 thursday so might bump into you!!!  Smile
So long 701, it was nice knowing you.
 
Hamlet69
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RE: VS 777-300ER

Mon Jul 05, 2004 12:44 am

Dutchjet,

"I have heard this rumor as well with the Virgin order to be announced very shortly - heard the info from a rather reliable source (a real person, not in cyber world) who is usually right about these things. . ."

Indeed, as have I. That's why I said I know VS is interested in the 777. I have had a few different, reliable (not A.netters) tell me this. However, as you said, it is mostly a financial deal at this point, which means it can change in a matter of hours. Anyone remember ANZ's order of the A320?

"I heard 10 firm plus 10 options, with an additional 7 coming from leasing companies......the leasing company will place their order simultaneously and Virgin will be required to lease those 777s aer part of this bigger deal."

This makes a lot of sense with what I've been told. According to my sources, the order will place the -300ER fleet on 'equal or greater' footing with the A340-600 fleet. The fact that ILFC has publically stated they were talking to VS about the -300ER is a good indicator they will be involved. If so, they virtually have to place new orders, as they currently only have 6 free 777 spots left (all those being -200ERs).

" I also heard that this order is not very good news with respect to the future of A340 aircraft at Virigin"

Although only one source told me this, he is the most reliable of them - at least the options, if not some of the firm orders, will be for -200ERs as well. These will eventually replace the A340-300 at VS.


"Puts VS in a good position though. Every time they want new 773/346, they just need to get the two companies around and see who will go the lowest."

Very excellent point, Roberta. Both companies need their respective aircraft to sell well, as they will eventually (and quickly) become the anchor for the respective entire lines. Therefore, these battles will only continue, whether at VS or elsewhere.


"I'll believe it when I see it. This reminds me of the rumours surrounding Qatar Airways and the 777 about a year ago. There we also had 'very reliable' sources telling us QR was going to buy the 773ER, up until the day of the signing, when those 'reliable sources' all turned out to be wrong, and QR bought Airbus."

Scorpio, the problem with the contest you just brought up, and one nobody has raised yet - IB - is that both companies were serious about getting the 777. Indeed, from what I understand, QR is still considering operating the A340 and 777 side-by-side. And just like the present situation, both those orders came down to price. Will Boeing allow itself to be beat again? We'll see. . .

Regards,

Hamlet69
All gave some. Some gave all.
 
AA777
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RE: VS 777-300ER

Mon Jul 05, 2004 1:13 am

Roberta,

I've noticed that you are pretty ardent supporter of Airbus, and you seem to..... well... strongly dislike.... more than ANYONE on this forum. Is there a reason why? I mean, I will admit I am more a Boeing fan, but, I dont think I could ever get to be as strong a liker/ disliker of one over the other?

I dunno what they are going to do with that A340NG simulator now.

do you REALLY think that that is the biggest worry when they are about to place a multi-billion dollar order from them? (assuming they take the 777)

Anyhow, Just curious as to why? P.S. I love Boeings, but I would still love to be on an A330 or A321 if I fly somewhere...

-AA777

 
Guest

RE: VS 777-300ER

Mon Jul 05, 2004 1:29 am

do you REALLY think that that is the biggest worry when they are about to place a multi-billion dollar order from them? (assuming they take the 777)

Not too much hassle getting rid, but they only recently ordered it, so does it not suggest that they plan to keep the A345's.

and as for the rest of your post

I find myself repeating this weekly

I like Boeing!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

I actually prefer mixed fleets https://www.airliners.net/discussions/aviation_polls/read.main/13623/, so if SQ got A346's and kept their A345's and VS got 773ER's but still got a few A346's i would be very pleased indeed. Imagine how cool the fleets would look.

The problem is so many people just ignorantly put down Airbus, so i feel i have to stand up for them. Being European and all.
 
AA777
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RE: VS 777-300ER

Mon Jul 05, 2004 1:38 am

Fair enough, I do see your point then  Smile Thanks for clearing that up

-AA777
 
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glideslope
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RE: VS 777-300ER

Mon Jul 05, 2004 7:08 am

It's about time Boeing started using subsidies from other divisions to push their Commercial Aircraft. Airbus has been doing it for years with their subsidies from "various sources."

A lot of Airbus sales over the past years have been from Boeing's unwillingness to do just that.

It's nice to see both playing at the same level. I see big sales in Boeing's future. It's nice to have Harry back in the Big Seat.

I also hope Airbus continues to push Boeing. We all benefit from that.
To know your Enemy, you must become your Enemy.” Sun Tzu
 
dalecary
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RE: VS 777-300ER

Mon Jul 05, 2004 7:15 am

I have heard the exact opposite and quite recently. It now seems that the 773ER deal may be dead and they will go for all 346. Could be very much like the IB deal where Boeing was reportedly beaten by a last minute Airbus counterpunch.
 
AA737-823
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RE: VS 777-300ER

Mon Jul 05, 2004 10:44 am

I am scared of having Harry in the big seat. I don't know how well he managed MD, but it certainly doesn't look good from my cheap desk chair. But then, like I said, I don't know the story of MD going down.

Airbus has proven time and again that they will NOT be beat on price. IB, ANZ, TWA even (the 318 over 737s or more 717s, if you ask me). Who else... anyhow, yeah. I think that we should not be surprised if Airbus comes up with a last minute "okay, how about the first five aircraft for free?" terms. Douglas did it.

I hope VS goes for 777s. I think they'd look and feel fantastic. And, as a simple passenger, why else would I care? Operating costs don't matter much to me. I just sit in my seat and hope for edible food!

R
 
Hamlet69
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RE: VS 777-300ER

Mon Jul 05, 2004 12:28 pm

"It now seems that the 773ER deal may be dead and they will go for all 346. Could be very much like the IB deal where Boeing was reportedly beaten by a last minute Airbus counterpunch."

It wouldn't surprise me. As I said, the last I heard, this deal was coming down to price as the large and primary factor. In such cases, it also happens to be the most fluid factor. As you say, IB is an excellent example, although I think ANZ is the best to date. OTOH, I have heard that Boeing has been more aggresive with their 777 pricing, as they are no longer demanding the premium they once did for this aircraft. Still, it does have a list price roughly $30 million more per frame than the A340.

As I said - we'll see. . .

Hamlet69
All gave some. Some gave all.
 
IntheKnow
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RE: VS 777-300ER

Mon Jul 05, 2004 6:49 pm

VSMike

See you thursday 8th, I'm on the 15!!

ITK
 
F4N
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RE: VS 777-300ER

Mon Jul 05, 2004 9:29 pm

To all:

I have to go with the naysayers on this one; I simply can't see Airbus allowing Boeing to gain a foothold at VS with the T7 when the 346 is already firmly established in service. Unless Harry is willing to do business in some ways that Condit wasn't(and I hope so for his own sake), Boeing will lose a price war.

Hamlet69:

You keep mentioning the ANZ deal; can you explain the significance?

regards,

F4N
 
SafetyDude
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RE: VS 777-300ER

Mon Jul 05, 2004 9:36 pm

SQ wanted the A345 to introduce the ultra long haul flights, but now if the 772LR is available and its a better fit for the fleet planning (ie, why bother with he A345 when we have all of these 777s?), SQ can order the 772LR at a great price from Boeing and Boeing and/or a leasing company will come up with some solution for the A345s (where SQ probably also got a killer good deal).

I imagine that while Boeing would want the sales, seeing as how SQ ordered the 345 and is now interested in the 777LR (a 345 competitor), Boeing would not exactly be giving the planes away practically for free - or anything close to it. Since Boeing knows that if an airline (SQ) is ordering a competing airplane(777LR) to an airplane they already have (345) they must know something is up and the airline is very interested in the plane (thus less negotiations).

 Smile
-Will
"She Flew For What We Stand For"
 
Guest

RE: VS 777-300ER

Mon Jul 05, 2004 9:57 pm

I dont think SQ so much 'want' the 772LR but instead Boeing are cheekily putting it under their noses as part of the 773ER/A346 deal making it an easy choice. If there was no 773ER around then SQ would probably never consider replacing the A345.
 
SafetyDude
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RE: VS 777-300ER

Tue Jul 06, 2004 12:58 am

If there was no 773ER around then SQ would probably never consider replacing the A345.

Right! Why would an airline replace a brand-new plane that is less than a year old? You do not exactly want to go around shopping for a new plane to replace a line you got less than a year ago. Boeing knows the SQ is serious, and since the competitor to the 777 variants is what they want to replace, well, you get the drift.

 Smile
-Will
"She Flew For What We Stand For"
 
Guest

RE: VS 777-300ER

Tue Jul 06, 2004 1:06 am

and since the competitor to the 777 variants is what they want to replace,

Take a step back SafetyDude, SQ are happy with their A345's and all talk about replacing them with 772LR's is speculation. They infact are after a A346/773ER sized plane to replace some of their 744's.
 
ConcordeBoy
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RE: VS 777-300ER

Tue Jul 06, 2004 1:16 am

Why would an airline replace a brand-new plane that is less than a year old?

...for the exact same reasons why they did it the last time.



You do not exactly want to go around shopping for a new plane to replace a line you got less than a year ago.

hmm, what's that quip about those who fail to consider history again?



SQ are happy with their A345's

...your source being?
Faire du ciel le plus bel endroit de la terre c'est impossible sans Concorde!
 
Guest

RE: VS 777-300ER

Tue Jul 06, 2004 1:19 am

for the exact same reasons why they did it the last time.

What the A345 cant get over the Himalayas either? ohh wait they dont even fly them that way.
 
ConcordeBoy
Posts: 16852
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RE: VS 777-300ER

Tue Jul 06, 2004 1:34 am

What the A345 cant get over the Himalayas either? ohh wait they dont even fly them that way

Who knows...
I'd imagine that it could, though in your weak attempt at sarcasm; you either forgot or probably never knew that the Hindu Kush were the primary problem for SQ's A343s, not the Himalayas  Big grin

Anywho, getting back to the point:
772ER-- faster, more powerful, more range, and more payload than A343.
No reason whatsoever to postulate that the exact same will not hold true for the 772LR vis-a-vis A345.

[Edited 2004-07-05 18:35:15]
Faire du ciel le plus bel endroit de la terre c'est impossible sans Concorde!
 
Hamlet69
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RE: VS 777-300ER

Tue Jul 06, 2004 2:23 am

F4N,

From the outset, after ANZ's intial RFP for new aircraft, Boeing was tipped from both outside and inside the airline as the clear favorite. ANZ and Boeing had a strong partnership, and the 737-800 was apparently preferred over the A320. Every indication, and I mean every indication, pointed to a Boeing order. It seemed Boeing was even being very lenient on the purchase price. However, Airbus was also desperate to get the A320 flying again in the South Pacific. Remember, at this time Ansett was grounded, Virgin Blue were flying leased 737NG's, and the previous year Qantas had chosen the 737-800 over the A320 in a very public competition.

Anyway, this preference persisted up until the 11th hour. No, scratch that, make that the 11th hour and 59th minute. When the time came to announce the order publically, ANZ announced Airbus as the winner. I can tell you there were some very shocked people at Boeing, who had been assured that they had secured the deal. Since this was obviously a last minute thing, and as neither aircraft's technical specifications changed in that last minute, one can imagine what did. . .

Hope that explains things a little.

Hamlet69
All gave some. Some gave all.
 
F4N
Posts: 507
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RE: VS 777-300ER

Tue Jul 06, 2004 2:52 am

Hamlet69:

Thank you for the reply. I seem to recall now Toby Bright expressing a great deal of dismay over the selection of the A320. I would guess that the same happened at IB with the 777 although I have to admit I would be surprised that IB would have taken it given their mostly Airbus fleet.

Another question then, since you may know or know someone who does. Did Boeing have a right of first refusal or did ANZ & Airbus simply lay one on them?
I have always wondered if, in the course of negotiations, the losing party has an opportunity to re-bid given any last-minute offers from the competitor.

Any ideas?

regards,

F4N
 
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Richard28
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RE: VS 777-300ER

Tue Jul 06, 2004 3:26 am

Surely the order (whichever way it goes) will be announced at the Farnborough airshow (19th-25th July).

This would ensure big press coverage in the UK, and VS do not normally miss a trick like that!

If they do go for the 777, I just hope they do not have a 2-5-2 or a 3-4-3 config in Y class.

Rich.
 
vsmike
Topic Author
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RE: VS 777-300ER

Tue Jul 06, 2004 3:33 am

ITK --
See ya then...

Seven Heavy --
Yes. See ya then...

VSM
Skyteam. Caring More About Me.
 
vsmike
Topic Author
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RE: VS 777-300ER

Tue Jul 06, 2004 3:36 am

ps~
The secret password will be:

Mine's Thicker Than Yours
Skyteam. Caring More About Me.
 
777236ER
Posts: 12213
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RE: VS 777-300ER

Tue Jul 06, 2004 3:43 am

It's not like Virgin are a Boeing..uh..virgin.

They have quite a few 747-400s.
Your bone's got a little machine
 
vsmike
Topic Author
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RE: VS 777-300ER

Tue Jul 06, 2004 3:52 am

777236ER-
Sick, baby. Sick. LOL... "Luv" your profile...

VSMmmm
Skyteam. Caring More About Me.
 
vsfullthrottle
Posts: 274
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RE: VS 777-300ER

Tue Jul 06, 2004 4:27 am

VSMike, "Mine's Thicker Than Yours", thats great, LOL.

Can't wait to see the 777-300ER's in VS colours, its gonna happen.
 
ND
Posts: 270
Joined: Sat Feb 07, 2004 4:48 pm

RE: VS 777-300ER

Tue Jul 06, 2004 4:43 am

Instead of using "catchphrases" like "mine is bigger than yours" and "mine is thicker than yours", why not just blatantly paint "my penis is bigger" on the hull of the plane?

But in any event, if such marketing would be construed as vulgur, I would lean towards "Mine Twins are bigger than yours."... it should at least please the male population Smile/happy/getting dizzy.
ND - Hated By Many, Confronted By None
 
vsfullthrottle
Posts: 274
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RE: VS 777-300ER

Tue Jul 06, 2004 4:50 am

Although that would be very funny to see, it just wouldn't be Virgin.
 
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sunrisevalley
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RE: VS 777-300ER

Tue Jul 06, 2004 4:56 am

Speaking of the AirNZ order for the 777-200ER; which MTOW version are they buying?
 
vsmike
Topic Author
Posts: 279
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RE: VS 777-300ER

Tue Jul 06, 2004 9:17 am

ND-

Don't be jealous if Mine's Bigger Than Yours.

Peace

VSM
Skyteam. Caring More About Me.
 
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solnabo
Posts: 5025
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RE: VS 777-300ER

Tue Jul 06, 2004 5:44 pm

ND:
You are wors than a churchlady!! Why dont you put Tipex over the lines on you´re screen that U find offensive and obsurd  Big grin
Where´s you´re sence of humor?

Mike//SE  Big thumbs up
*you only live once*
Airbus SAS - Love them both
 
ConcordeBoy
Posts: 16852
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RE: VS 777-300ER

Wed Jul 07, 2004 12:47 am

Speaking of the AirNZ order for the 777-200ER; which MTOW version are they buying?

Wont be the absolute highest, as they've selected RR.... but still could be pretty up there if they go for Trent895.

Maybe they'll op for different MTOWs in either of the two ordered groupings.
Faire du ciel le plus bel endroit de la terre c'est impossible sans Concorde!
 
gigneil
Posts: 14133
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RE: VS 777-300ER

Wed Jul 07, 2004 1:38 am

Wont be the absolute highest, as they've selected RR.... but still could be pretty up there if they go for Trent895.

I'm fairly confident that the highest MTOW is available for Trent 895 operators, as well.

edit: I verified. The 656,000 lb takeoff weight is definitely available with Trent 895s hung.

N

[Edited 2004-07-06 18:41:30]
 
ND
Posts: 270
Joined: Sat Feb 07, 2004 4:48 pm

RE: VS 777-300ER

Wed Jul 07, 2004 5:09 am

Solnabo,

Setting aside my inane sense of humor, where did you learn to speak English?
ND - Hated By Many, Confronted By None
 
vsmike
Topic Author
Posts: 279
Joined: Mon Sep 15, 2003 12:40 am

RE: VS 777-300ER

Wed Jul 07, 2004 9:50 am

Mine's Still Thicker...

Why can't we all just get along...?
 Smile

VSM
Skyteam. Caring More About Me.

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Special Paint Schemes Aircraft painted in beautiful and original liveries

Airport Overviews Airport overviews from the air or ground

Tails and Winglets Tail and Winglet closeups with beautiful airline logos