Shortest USA 747 Flights..Any?

nsfguy · Wed Jan 12, 2005 1:12 am

Is it still possible to fly trans con in a 747 anymore? I used to take a UAL 747 from ORD to JFK many years ago... Retired now and just love to ride on these big dogs, just not too long. Thanks!

as739x · Wed Jan 12, 2005 1:22 am

This present schedule has no UA 747 flying domestic. I'm sure at some pont you will see them again on SFO/LAX-DEN/ORD and a few other hub to hub route. NW never flys them domestically, so thats it!

Does UA's flights from SFO to the desert count?
Smile

ASSFO

drerx7 · Wed Jan 12, 2005 1:28 am

Northwest originally flew the 744 MSP (or DTW) to PHX on proving runs back in '89-'90 and they use to run a 747-200 on the MSP-SEA flight for many years. But not anymore--in fact I don't believe there are any domestic Northwest widebodies save for Hawaii.

roseflyer · Wed Jan 12, 2005 1:36 am

NW's schedule is a lot easier to maintain for the 747s. All of them fly to NRT and Asia. UA needs to do positioning flights for their international widebodies to maximize efficiency. Since there are 747s in the Atlantic and Pacific, there often has been flights domestically connecting them, which leads to less ground time for the planes. NW's fleet is smaller and serves a single hub/focus city. It is still possible to get 777s domestically, and I can't see how UA would eliminate that without a huge schedule change. Having 777s and 747s operate on international flights from LAX, SFO, SEA, ORD, IAD and JFK is a logistics nightmare if you want to keep them flying only international routes. Fortunately us consumers benefit from this by having the option to fly internationally equipped planes domestically, which means an awesome product in the premium cabins that can beat the pants off any LCC any day. Unfortunately almost no one pays to fly 1st class domestically.

lincoln · Wed Jan 12, 2005 1:58 am

While I think it's been changed, in March of '04 I flew UA 125 ORD-LAX which was a 747-400.

Great service and we got in over an hour ahead of schedule Big thumbs up

I fogured out that it was positioning for SYD... I forget the flight # though.

First and only 747 flight to date & the reason I went with UA,

Lincoln

airxliban · Wed Jan 12, 2005 2:20 am

Looking at the Star Alliance timetable right now, I can tell you that there are no 744s scheduled between LAX, DEN, SFO and ORD.

There are a couple of 777s though.

Although that doesn't mean that the odd 744 doesn't appear on any of the routes.

uadc8contrail · Wed Jan 12, 2005 2:21 am

anyone remember when nwa flew msp-ord on the 200???i flew it 2x and it was great albeit short......................

MDW22L31C · Wed Jan 12, 2005 3:05 am

NWA had 747's on ORD to MSP about 10 years ago. After NWA gave up the Chicago to Tokyo run.

iowa744fan · Wed Jan 12, 2005 3:19 am

uadc8contrail,

I do remember the daily 747 from MSP to ORD. If I recall correctly, gate 8 (old configuration from 10 or so years ago) used to be the gate designated for the hourly ORD flights. My family and I used to fly NW and would always leave DSM on the 0600 flight to make int'l and Hawaii connections. We used to go down to the ORD gate area as they had the area with juice, coffee, donuts, etc. I thought that they only had the one flight each way as positioning for the 747 that operated to NRT.

For a few years, NW also operated a 744 between MSP and DTW early in the morning. I remember seeing it out at the end of the red concourse in the early 1990s. I think that this was also a positioning flight. I remember it because occasionally, they would place two 747s out at the tip of the old red concourse, one to DTW and I don't recall where the other one went. This was long ago before they upgraded the former gold concourse area...forget what they call it now.

As for the 747 from MSP to SEA, good old flight 7/8. I rode this once all the way from MSP to SEA to NRT. Always nice to have a 747 on the domestic flights.

Does NW still sub the 744 onto AMS anymore during busy seasons? Is AMS largely converting to a 333 and D10 (soon to be only 333?) destination?

MAH4546 · Wed Jan 12, 2005 5:37 am

El Al flies 744s domesticly, between Miami and Newark. Though you can't be tickets on the MIA-EWR segment.

N1120A · Wed Jan 12, 2005 5:57 am

The timing of the UA 744 domestics has also tended to be at a time where they needed hub to hub capacity anyway for O&D and hub to hub connection banks. The shortest of the flights are the always unscheduled LAX-SFO flights but the shortest that have been regularly scheduled, though not at the moment, are the LAX-DEN flights. I do know that my row partner on OXR-LAX on Saturday flew LAX-IAD on a 744 in the past few weeks, most likely a positioning flight for the FRA flight that acted as the leg of UA890 that usually switches from 744 to 763 at LAX.

jfrworld · Wed Jan 12, 2005 6:08 am

I flew a 747-400 from SFO-DEN in 9/04. I believe the original equipment was a 777, but was substituted with a 747-400

cedarjet · Wed Jan 12, 2005 6:40 am

You could fly to the UK or France, I've done Newark to Heathrow in five hours fifteen, Boston to Gatwick four hours fifty five.* Both 747-100s in the 1990s. Now is the cheapest time to travel. BA have ads in the tube for Heathrow to JFK return for £199 rtn incl right now, I bet they've got deals in the USA to come here for a bargain price. So come and visit The Olde Countrie, you're welcome.

*: If only to remember the old girl, to should be added that I, and many other lucky souls, did Heathrow to JFK in three hours once.

Tango-Bravo · Wed Jan 12, 2005 6:41 am

If question of this topic can be interpreted to mean examples of shortest 747 flights within the U.S., one that comes to mind is Northwest's now-discontinued (10 years ago or more) 747-200 flight MSP-ORD, a distance of 333mi/536km. The flight was essentially a positioning flight from NW's MSP 747 maintenance base to put an aircraft in place each day for their ORD-NRT non-stop (also discontinued). My most vivid memory of my one and only MSP-ORD flight on a NW 747-200 was my seat; apparently the aircraft assigned to the flight that day had a larger business class cabin than some NW 747s, which meant that the "coach" seat numbers assigned to my son and I put us the business class cabin, which meant nothing (in the way of enhanced cabin service -- flight time under one hour) except a more comfortable seat plus the "prestige" and memory of having flown in business class for our coach fares.

chrisjake · Wed Jan 12, 2005 7:25 am

Iowa744fan,

i remember those NW 747's. they had a couple of runs in the middle of the night that went JFK-DTW-MKE-MSP and back...i believe they crossed paths somewhere. eventually MKE was dropped as a 747 destination, and NW used that MSP-DTW-JFK route and continued on to either Stockholm or Copenhagen, cant remember which. it was NW's 1st transatlantic 747 route. originally it was flight #220 one way and #221 back. they actually had a name for the route but that escapes me.

if we're speaking of former short 747 routes, UA had a bunch when they 1st started 747 service. i can recall SAN-LAX, ORD-CLE, ORD-PIT, ORD-YYZ to name a few.

chris

leamside · Wed Jan 12, 2005 7:34 am

SFO-OAK which is 9.6 miles!

Just as a point of interest, years ago when I used to see UA 747s fly out of SFO to OAK which is only 9.6 nautical miles across the bay! UA used to have a maintenance center in Oakland where a few heavies were sent from SFO. But of course these were non-pax flights.

BrowntailWhale · Wed Jan 12, 2005 7:36 am

Not that you can ride on the flight, but UPS flies Honolulu-Kona in a 747.

coyoteguy · Wed Jan 12, 2005 8:16 am

At one time we had a choice of 747 flights between JFK and Miami, with Tower Air and TWA both flying it - Tower had a couple each day I think on -100 or -200s and TWA had an evening flight, TW005 which ran on a 747 -100 or -200 for ages, sometime was flown with an L1011 instead, and in the last months was downgraded to a 727. I'm happy to say I flew on all of them. Those were the days.

AirAmericaC46 · Wed Jan 12, 2005 9:51 am

I believe the shortest 747 US domestic route was PHL-JFK by PA in 1975 which was part of a daily SJU-PHL-JFK-FCO route.

I wish someone can resurrect an all-747 fleet airline similar to Tower Air with the same service as JetBlue!! It's time to decongest the airways by using wide-bodied aircrafts like what they do in East Asia and cut down on regional jets!!!

AeroWesty · Wed Jan 12, 2005 10:37 am

I don't understand the title of this thread and how it relates to the question posed: Is it still possible to fly trans con in a 747 anymore?

To answer that question, yes, you can, on Qantas, if you purchase a through ticket JFK-LAX-SYD. It runs three times a week with a 747-400.

Shortest 747 flight in the continental U.S. surely was OAK-SFO and it did carry paying passengers. I was one of them. I'm rather sure it wasn't a 747-400 when I flew it to qualify for triple miles with MileagePlus in early 1988, as I believe the first 400's didn't arrive in UA's fleet until 1989-90. I don't know how long the route lasted, nor how long it was operated with a 747 or with which version(s), and it's quite possible the 747 opened for sale to accomodate all the passengers buying up every short flight in town to qualify for triple miles if it wasn't normally scheduled, but that's pure speculation.

Cheers.

(I think there are some other threads in the archived forum you can search for more info.) Smile

UA772IAD · Wed Jan 12, 2005 10:51 am

It's not up now, but you can sometimes fly a 744 between IAD and ORD on UA. Also, they constantly switch flights 946/947 b/t 744 and a 772 (IAD-LAX-IAD).

rjpieces · Wed Jan 12, 2005 11:12 am

Up until recently, Saudi Arabian flew 747s on IAD-JFK although you couldn't book tickets on it. I believe it is operated with 777s now.

COAMiG29 · Wed Jan 12, 2005 11:24 am

i have not seen a 747 doing trans-con for a number of years. by the way who still flies the 747 anyway it seems that they are getting fewer and fewer and im getting mad

future757 · Wed Jan 12, 2005 11:31 am

I thought there was a UA 747 that flew SFO to ORD. I thought it was a leg of an international flight. Maybe it was just a repositioning. I thought I remembered reading about this somewhere.
If you are really desperate to fly on a 747 domestically, you could always crawl in a box and try to hitch a ride to ANC on a freighter!
I know this topic is about 747, but as far as domestic heavies go, as all you Peter Max fans know, continental does IAH-EWR on a 777.

Tango-Bravo · Wed Jan 12, 2005 12:30 pm

Not to overlook Delta's ATL-DAL (later DFW)-LAX and ORD-MIA routes operated by their 747-132s for about 5 years before their TriStars took over as their only widebody type.

kanebear · Wed Jan 12, 2005 12:38 pm

Not that you could book it but IIRC SV ran positioning flights from MCO to IAD.

APFPilot1985 · Wed Jan 12, 2005 1:24 pm

You cant book on Qantas' JFK-LAX unless you continue on to sidney right?

ERJ145LR · Wed Jan 12, 2005 1:25 pm

i've flown one from IAD to ORD

AeroWesty · Wed Jan 12, 2005 1:36 pm

You cant book on Qantas' JFK-LAX unless you continue on to sidney right?

Correct, but it's been stated in other posts that you may take a stopover in LAX if you have a ticket onward to Sydney westbound, or to New York when ticketed eastbound. QF doesn't have 8th freedom rights within the U.S. to carry local traffic.

Cheers.

jfrworld · Wed Jan 12, 2005 2:54 pm

Between 1989 and 1991, HP flew 747-200's between PHX and LAS continuing on to HNL.

EIPremier · Wed Jan 12, 2005 3:04 pm

I have flown UA 747s on LAX-ORD, SFO-ORD and LAX-IAD within the past two years.

DBCooper · Wed Jan 12, 2005 6:03 pm

I used to regularly fly SFO-LAX on a TW 747 many many years ago. Routing was SFO-LAX-LHR (flight 760 eastbound/761 westbound). UA used to fly 744s on this route from time to time until recently - especially if there were a lot of ATC cancels at SFO due to WX.

Wasn't one of TW's last 747 routes JFK-STL(-HNL)?

- DBC

NWFltAttendant · Wed Jan 12, 2005 7:36 pm

Just adding (so dont freak out as a double post) to the NW MSP-ORD posts...

Those flights which featured the 747-100s and 200s operated as part of NWA 'FastTrack' service between MSP and ORD. It was essentially a flight every hour on the hour, with guaranteed seating for those passengers on full fare Y and F fares. The 747-400 was never part of that rotation however. Outbound, the 747-200 departed 8:00am usually from gate 8, as NW122, and returned that evening as NW141 approx 6:30pm.
For those who cared more for the 747-400, you had to fly from DTW aboard NW751, which arrived something like 7pm every night. I vaguely remember something about the 747-400 having something to do with Paris, but as a look back on the CDG flights, they were DC10s, not 744s.

danpio · Wed Jan 12, 2005 10:48 pm

Getting back to the original question, shortest USA 747 flights:

DL used to fly 747's ATL-JAX in the early 70's before they started flying trans-atlantic.

ERJ145LR · Wed Jan 12, 2005 11:50 pm

Saudi Arabian flies 777- JFK to IAD

AF022 · Thu Jan 13, 2005 12:47 am

according to OAG, the only B747s operating within the 50 states are international carriers without traffic rights:

JFKANC on CI or KE or OZ
EWRMIA on LY
EWRSEA on BR
JFKLAX on QF
KOAHNL on JO
LASLAX on JL
LAXANC on CI
LAXHNL on PR
SFOHNL on PR

jtamu97 · Thu Jan 13, 2005 1:06 am

Didn't Lufthansa used to have a DFW-IAH-MEX? I thought as a kid I remember seeing this flight on the screens at IAH.

drerx7 · Thu Jan 13, 2005 1:16 am

Yes--for many years it was a FRA-DFW-IAH routing--but then they separated the routes. The closest thing you can get until UA puts 747s back in the domestic schedules is Cathay's (i think) routing JFK-YVR. They do have traffic rights on that route.

iowa744fan · Thu Jan 13, 2005 2:08 am

The closest thing you can get until UA puts 747s back in the domestic schedules is Cathay's (i think) routing JFK-YVR. They do have traffic rights on that route.

Although YVR is Vancouver and thus not a domestic flight! Big grin

drerx7 · Thu Jan 13, 2005 2:14 am

Which is why I said 'the closest thing you can get' Wink/being sarcastic

VC10BOAC · Thu Jan 13, 2005 7:43 am

I have flown the UA IAD-ORD route on a 747 too. This was probably back in 1992. The flight actually originated in LHR and after clearing customs and immigration at IAD, I was surprised to get back on the same aircraft for a connecting flight to ORD. It also picked up new passengers at IAD.

KDTWflyer · Thu Jan 13, 2005 2:06 pm

COAMiG29, I couldn't agree more.

Nice to be born in the mid 80s and grow up into an era of aviation stagnation where emphasis on efficiency and ETOPS is the rule. The only widebody domestic I can recall going on would have been NW DTW-PHX-DTW on DC1040s in Feb. 01' Get to look forward to even less differentiation between planes! Granted, new capabilities in planes like 10,000sm range in a B772LR or 550 pax. in a three class arrangement in the A380 is pretty cool. There are too many people in the world today. We have probably reached the carrying capacity of the Earth for human population and will only continue to exceed it.

Negative moment lol

APFPilot1985 · Thu Jan 13, 2005 2:22 pm

Just checking on that CX flight from JFK-YVR, it looks like for the next two weeks its either an a346 or 343

MDW22L31C · Fri Jan 14, 2005 2:24 am

I think TWA had a flight STL-ORD-LHR back when TWA was moving its Hub from ORD to the St.Louis.

chrisjake · Fri Jan 14, 2005 3:19 am

MDW22L31C,

they sure did. i cant remember if it was flight 770 or 720 eastbound, but it definetely was a 747 STL-ORD-LHR and back.

chris

DTManiac · Fri Jan 14, 2005 2:54 pm

I flew a UA 744 from FRA to IAD and they said the service would be continued to SEA after arrival to IAD. I guess that would be what we are searching for.

Frederik

NBGSkyGod · Fri Jan 14, 2005 3:13 pm

I remember about 4 and half years ago, I flew a UA 742 from DEN to ORD.

DCAYOW · Sat Jan 15, 2005 6:51 am

United is notorious for having a single flight number FRA-IAD-SEA, but then downgauging the IAD-SEA sector to a 757 or a 320/319. I have long thought that this should be illegal as it isn't single plane service / it is a connection. But because they can load it into the schedule as a single flight number it gets a preferential 1 stop listing rather than the conx it really is...

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