Moderators: jsumali2, richierich, ua900, PanAm_DC10, hOMSaR

 
FlyHoss
Topic Author
Posts: 534
Joined: Wed Feb 02, 2005 12:20 pm

CBS Marketwatch Reports CO Cancels 787

Sat Feb 12, 2005 9:36 am

How did I miss this? According to a recent (today, Friday) CBS Marketwatch report, Continental has already canceled the order for 10 Boeing 787s. Is this an error?
Try this link:
http://www.marketwatch.com/news/yhoo/story.asp?source=blq/yhoo&siteid=yhoo&dist=yhoo&guid=%7BF7D1E0E2%2D582C%2D4697%2DA8CC%2D826638A0D4F4%7D
A little bit louder now, a lil bit louder now...
 
AA737-823
Posts: 5498
Joined: Wed Mar 01, 2000 11:10 am

RE: CBS Marketwatch Reports CO Cancels 787

Sat Feb 12, 2005 10:00 am

Actually, this rumor has been circulating on this board since the day after the announcement.
While I would not be surprised, I would be hugely disappointed in my airline.
 
JoFMO
Posts: 1840
Joined: Wed Jul 14, 2004 1:55 am

RE: CBS Marketwatch Reports CO Cancels 787

Sat Feb 12, 2005 11:06 am

Maybe CO realized that they first have to clean their house.

But even if they really canceled the order, it is clear that they will fly the plane in the future. So it shouldn't be seen as a drawback for B nor any A fan should begin to party.

CO will fly 787's, if they ordem them now or later!
 
gigneil
Posts: 14133
Joined: Fri Nov 08, 2002 10:25 am

RE: CBS Marketwatch Reports CO Cancels 787

Sat Feb 12, 2005 11:19 am

I work for a CBS competitor, but I would stand behind their journalistic integrity in general.

We KNEW from the first day that there was a chance this would happen.

I'm just as excited about anyone about CO getting the plane, but their purchase was subject to getting employee deals. If they're not getting the deals, they're not getting the planes.

N
 
B777ER
Posts: 431
Joined: Mon Jun 21, 2004 3:35 pm

RE: CBS Marketwatch Reports CO Cancels 787

Sat Feb 12, 2005 11:28 am

CO lost 47 million dollars in January, they got more pressing/immediate concerns than 10 787's.
 
scotron11
Posts: 1432
Joined: Tue Feb 10, 2004 4:54 pm

RE: CBS Marketwatch Reports CO Cancels 787

Sat Feb 12, 2005 11:53 am

The story has been corrected. They admit their error and that CO has NOT (yet) cancelled the order for the 787.
 
M27
Posts: 409
Joined: Mon Oct 04, 2004 11:25 am

RE: CBS Marketwatch Reports CO Cancels 787

Sat Feb 12, 2005 12:01 pm

"I'm just as excited about anyone about CO getting the plane"

And it don't rain in Indianapolis in the summertime!
 
goCOgo
Posts: 709
Joined: Mon Jan 17, 2005 11:24 am

RE: CBS Marketwatch Reports CO Cancels 787

Sat Feb 12, 2005 12:18 pm

If it is to be cancelled, the order won't be until the board meeting at the end of the month. That's when CO originally said the board would vote. Even then, I doubt we will see them canceling. The CO order gives the 787 legitimacy to many other airlines considering ordering. I think Boeing would renegotiate to give the frames away for the price of an RJ before they would see their one and only US legacy carrier cancel their order two months after it was made.

Interestingly, the article said ExpressJet was making good money, and that it helped offset the losses. I imagine we will see even more CO mainline go the COex.
"Why you fly is your business, how you fly is ours"
 
dynkrisolo
Posts: 1849
Joined: Mon Feb 12, 2001 12:12 am

RE: CBS Marketwatch Reports CO Cancels 787

Sat Feb 12, 2005 12:32 pm

If they haven't signed the final contract, how can they cancel the order? From day 1, the order was conditional upon achieving a certain amount of cost saving ($500m?) by Feb 28 with various unions.
 
N766UA
Posts: 8339
Joined: Thu Jul 29, 1999 3:50 am

RE: CBS Marketwatch Reports CO Cancels 787

Sat Feb 12, 2005 12:42 pm

I imagine we will see even more CO mainline go the COex.

Just what CLE needs. However, if COEx is making all the money... we must be sittin' pretty as a hub...  Big thumbs up
 
DfwRevolution
Posts: 9305
Joined: Sat Jan 09, 2010 7:31 pm

RE: CBS Marketwatch Reports CO Cancels 787

Sat Feb 12, 2005 1:01 pm

I think Boeing would renegotiate to give the frames away for the price of an RJ before they would see their one and only US legacy carrier cancel their order two months after it was made.

I'm sure they would  Insane

It doesn't reflect on poorly Boeing when Continental has to cancel an order because they can't find the funds to purchase new assets. The 787's is plenty legitimate without CO's order for 10, which BTW, is eclipsed by NH, JL, and China.

The CO order gives the 787 legitimacy to many other airlines considering ordering.

Bull....
I have a three post per topic limit. You're welcome to have the last word.
 
SWISSER
Posts: 1568
Joined: Sat Feb 12, 2005 11:31 am

RE: CBS Marketwatch Reports CO Cancels 787

Sat Feb 12, 2005 1:10 pm

Talking about CO,

how are the USA-Europe yields in general, CO fans?

I know the BRU-EWR flight is a big succes with the 764!
But that's all!

I believe all american carriers and flights are doing a good job out of Brussels;
2 DL flighs ATL-JFK
2 AA flights ORD-JFK
1 UA flight IAD
1 CO flight EWR
What time is top of descent?
 
User avatar
LN-MOW
Posts: 1691
Joined: Tue Feb 01, 2000 12:24 am

RE: CBS Marketwatch Reports CO Cancels 787

Sat Feb 12, 2005 1:12 pm

And now .... :

''(This story has been updated to correct an earlier version. Continental hasn't canceled a recent order to buy 10 Boeing jets, as was incorrectly reported.)

 Laugh out loud
- I am LN-MOW, and I approve this message.
 
User avatar
zippyjet
Posts: 5107
Joined: Tue Sep 04, 2001 3:32 pm

RE: CBS Marketwatch Reports CO Cancels 787

Sat Feb 12, 2005 1:27 pm

http://www.marketwatch.com/news/yhoo/story.asp?source=blq/yhoo&siteid=yhoo&dist=yhoo&guid=%7BF7D1E0E2%2D582C%2D4697%2DA8CC%2D826638A0D4F4%7D

So Co had a shitty financial quarter; but unless there is something hidden, I didn't see anything even referring to the Boeing 787. The canceled order is just one of those rumors/urban legends that float around. Think of the Eddy Haskell becoming porn star in gay porn movies rumor or that fake and clever Internet phenomenon http://urbanlegends.about.com/library/weekly/aa072301a.htm
Man Beef yummy yummy.

And, don't forget the vicious rumor that almost downed one of the nation's largest consumer product corporations.

http://www.snopes.com/business/alliance/procter.asp#add

Look for a CO 787 taxiing to a jet way near you in the near future.  Smile/happy/getting dizzy
I'm Zippyjet & I approve of this message!
 
787
Posts: 271
Joined: Tue Jan 11, 2000 11:57 pm

RE: CBS Marketwatch Reports CO Cancels 787

Sat Feb 12, 2005 1:57 pm



It's GOING to look nice!

787 Italia - Io, il comandante dell'aria
 
NIKV69
Posts: 13562
Joined: Wed Jan 28, 2004 4:27 am

RE: CBS Marketwatch Reports CO Cancels 787

Sat Feb 12, 2005 2:10 pm

787,

What a picture!! That is a beautiful plane. Gordo would be so proud.
I am the Googlizer!!!
 
USAIRWAYS321
Posts: 1729
Joined: Wed Jul 11, 2001 4:31 pm

RE: CBS Marketwatch Reports CO Cancels 787

Sat Feb 12, 2005 4:05 pm

Gordo would be so proud.

It's not like he's dead or anything...
 
scotron11
Posts: 1432
Joined: Tue Feb 10, 2004 4:54 pm

RE: CBS Marketwatch Reports CO Cancels 787

Sat Feb 12, 2005 4:52 pm

It wasn't a shitty quarter. It was a terrible "month"! $47M loss for January alone.
 
sendMEtoLAS
Posts: 66
Joined: Sat Jan 15, 2005 5:00 pm

RE: CBS Marketwatch Reports CO Cancels 787

Sat Feb 12, 2005 5:15 pm

wow. 47M? That's a lot for a carrier the size of CO.

I don't know about the whole picture in the US. Fuel is still high, today oil was back up to $47 a barrel. It just doesn't look good.

I think CO is one of the best run legacy carriers. I can't see them ordering 787's if they can't afford it. They know better.

Didn't they back out of some 738's recently? Or did that go through?
 
User avatar
STT757
Posts: 14146
Joined: Tue Mar 28, 2000 1:14 am

RE: CBS Marketwatch Reports CO Cancels 787

Sat Feb 12, 2005 11:16 pm

The original article has been corrected, CO has not cancelled the 787 order.

Check here..

http://www.marketwatch.com/news/yhoo/story.asp?source=blq/yhoo&siteid=yhoo&dist=yhoo&guid=%7BF7D1E0E2%2D582C%2D4697%2DA8CC%2D826638A0D4F4%7D

Some writers mistake.
Eastern Air lines flt # 701, EWR-MCO Boeing 757
 
IAHtown
Posts: 16
Joined: Thu Aug 05, 2004 10:45 pm

RE: CBS Marketwatch Reports CO Cancels 787

Sat Feb 12, 2005 11:18 pm

Why would CO cancel an order for 2009 because they had a terrible month in 2005? The deposits CO has placed on those planes aren't big enough to make much difference in their current financial situation. Maybe I'm missing something, but this does sound like a lot of speculation on the part of people who don't like CO. Anyway, it's good to see CBS is at least checking their facts, even if they do wait until after the article is published.
 
phollingsworth
Posts: 759
Joined: Sat Mar 06, 2004 6:05 am

RE: CBS Marketwatch Reports CO Cancels 787

Sun Feb 13, 2005 12:45 am

If semantics are your field, CO can't cancel their 787 order because they have not yet actually ordered the aircraft. Only the LOI has been signed. The actual firm order would involve money changing hands. This probably requires the approval of the BOD. What could feasibly happen is CO decides to not order or postpone the 787 order based upon their current and projected future cash position. That and to use the 787 as leverage in any negotiations they engage in with their employees.
 
FlyHoss
Topic Author
Posts: 534
Joined: Wed Feb 02, 2005 12:20 pm

RE: CBS Marketwatch Reports CO Cancels 787

Sun Feb 13, 2005 12:50 am

SendMEtoLAS,
You wrote, "Didn't they back out of some 738's recently? Or did that go through?" I believe it was AA/AMR that delayed some 738 orders. CO/CAL is accelerating the delivery of some (6?) 737-800 in 2006; these aircraft became available as a result of AA/AMRs delay.

IAHtown,
"Anyway, it's good to see CBS is at least checking their facts, even if they do wait until after the article is published." Bravo, well said. I did email the author of the Marketwatch article and ask for his source, he has yet to reply, though a corrected article has been issued (no retraction, per se, though of the original).

Expect even more "doom and gloom" from CAL management especially while the employee negotiations are continuing.
A little bit louder now, a lil bit louder now...
 
B777ER
Posts: 431
Joined: Mon Jun 21, 2004 3:35 pm

RE: CBS Marketwatch Reports CO Cancels 787

Sun Feb 13, 2005 1:34 am

Not to take over the thread but you gotta admit, in looking at that pic above and the CO livery on their 777 for example, they have one sharp professional looking livery. I hope they don't change it for years to come.
 
avek00
Posts: 3254
Joined: Mon Oct 25, 2004 5:56 am

RE: CBS Marketwatch Reports CO Cancels 787

Sun Feb 13, 2005 2:03 am

"Expect even more "doom and gloom" from CAL management especially while the employee negotiations are continuing."

I wouldn't describe it as gloom-and-doom, but rather CO's new reality if the negos continue to drag on - CO has learned from the negotiation mistakes made by UA, US, AA, and DL, and won't wait until the airline literally has no choice but to file bankruptcy before at least threatening to do so.
Live life to the fullest.
 
N1120A
Posts: 26574
Joined: Sun Dec 14, 2003 5:40 pm

RE: CBS Marketwatch Reports CO Cancels 787

Sun Feb 13, 2005 3:55 am

>However, if COEx is making all the money... we must be sittin' pretty as a hub...<

They are making money because CO is shifting it to them  Big grin
Mangeons les French fries, mais surtout pratiquons avec fierte le French kiss
 
rparker537
Posts: 41
Joined: Thu Sep 16, 2004 12:45 pm

RE: CBS Marketwatch Reports CO Cancels 787

Sun Feb 13, 2005 12:26 pm

Coex doing well doesn't help - Coex is a now a completely separate, independent comany.
 
goCOgo
Posts: 709
Joined: Mon Jan 17, 2005 11:24 am

RE: CBS Marketwatch Reports CO Cancels 787

Sun Feb 13, 2005 12:37 pm

Rparker537,

While COex was spunoff and made its own IPO, I do believe that CO is still the majority shareholder, and thus has control over COex. They do have to share those profits with the other XJT stockholders, though.
"Why you fly is your business, how you fly is ours"
 
FlyHoss
Topic Author
Posts: 534
Joined: Wed Feb 02, 2005 12:20 pm

RE: CBS Marketwatch Reports CO Cancels 787

Mon Feb 14, 2005 2:43 am

Continental is no longer the majority owner of ExpressJet (XJT)(d.b.a. Continental Express) and has recently placed about $51 million of XJT stock into the Continental employee pension. I don't have the percentage that CO still owns in XJT, but I believe it's 19%. Jim Ream, XJT's president was previously Continental Micronesia's president and was in senior management at CO before that. Also, CO has a capacity purchase agreement with XJT for 100% of the capacity; CO sets the schedules, cities, etc.
A little bit louder now, a lil bit louder now...
 
Boeingfan
Posts: 369
Joined: Thu Aug 30, 2001 1:47 am

RE: CBS Marketwatch Reports CO Cancels 787

Mon Feb 14, 2005 2:58 am

No decision has been made, the order is conditional as stated above, and CO may use as leverage with their staff to gain, more reductions and productivity increases. The 787 orders may be delayed several years, but CO most likely would take the aircraft as they are so efficiency minded having the youngest fleet amongst the US legacy carriers.

CO is doing well on their international, just the domestic market yields are suffering, and it is becoming cheaper to park a 737-800, substitute an Express RJ or pull the market all together. Let the other carrier take the blood, and save the fuel, maintenance and staff expense.

The question to ask, is why hasn't AA ordered the 787? They are in the best financial shape of the legacy carriers. This may be due to prudent, and realistic expectations out of the cost vs. return on new aircraft these days.

Once fares go up, as they should soon, then more carriers will increase mainline flying and order of new equipment.

It just does not make sense now, to be ordering for 4 -5 years down the road, when the road is still looking unpaved in front of you. What we need is to beable to turn Corn into a kerosene based petroleum product (similar to what is done in the US Midwestern States for ethanol?)

Bf

Popular Searches On Airliners.net

Top Photos of Last:   24 Hours  •  48 Hours  •  7 Days  •  30 Days  •  180 Days  •  365 Days  •  All Time

Military Aircraft Every type from fighters to helicopters from air forces around the globe

Classic Airliners Props and jets from the good old days

Flight Decks Views from inside the cockpit

Aircraft Cabins Passenger cabin shots showing seat arrangements as well as cargo aircraft interior

Cargo Aircraft Pictures of great freighter aircraft

Government Aircraft Aircraft flying government officials

Helicopters Our large helicopter section. Both military and civil versions

Blimps / Airships Everything from the Goodyear blimp to the Zeppelin

Night Photos Beautiful shots taken while the sun is below the horizon

Accidents Accident, incident and crash related photos

Air to Air Photos taken by airborne photographers of airborne aircraft

Special Paint Schemes Aircraft painted in beautiful and original liveries

Airport Overviews Airport overviews from the air or ground

Tails and Winglets Tail and Winglet closeups with beautiful airline logos