AA To Start NCL-BOS?

gkirk · Sat Mar 19, 2005 9:11 pm

Some rumours on another site about AA considering starting NCL-BOS using the 757

Also CO NCL-EWR and EK NCL-DXB cropping up
Any more info?

[email protected] · Sat Mar 19, 2005 9:18 pm

Heard that JL will commence a daily NRT-NCL, a daily KIX-NCL, and a daily NGO-NCL service - all using the 744. Wink

All of them continue to BOH.

gustyorange · Sun Mar 20, 2005 12:07 am

QF SYD-NCL on a 772LR nonstop also mentioned. smirk

Gusty

gkirk · Sun Mar 20, 2005 12:38 am

Well seeing as both you old

gits are trying to not be serious in this thread then,
You forgot the Daily QF A380 service to GLA & EDI Wink

HUYfan · Sun Mar 20, 2005 1:04 am

Pretty sure CO will do NCL-EWR by summer 2006. AA to BOS, is there really a market??? EK to Dubai, maybe three times a week could work.

Regards

Mike

OzarkD9S · Sun Mar 20, 2005 1:06 am

[quote=HUYfan,reply=4][ AA to BOS, is there really a market??? ]

Probably not that big, but AA can take you MANY places beyond BOS. It's actually got more destinations than AA out of JFK.

gkirk · Sun Mar 20, 2005 1:07 am

Well apparently AA are in talks with the management at NCL, but I would have thought they'd be better off with NCL-JFK

AA787 · Sun Mar 20, 2005 1:32 am

AA has more destinations at BOS than at JFK, but you have forgotten that JFK is only the transatlantic and international part of AA's New York operation. You then need to add JFK to LGA's number of flights and then you will realize that NYC is a bigger market for AA.

About AA at NCL. I have heard that AA was going to fly JFK-NCL with the help of contracts from several touring comanies etc. However, CO ended up winning those contracts so AA no longer sees a market on that route.

AA787

Cory6188 · Sun Mar 20, 2005 1:40 am

Well if CO ended up winning those contracts, why haven't we seen any EWR-NCL service yet?

OzarkD9S · Sun Mar 20, 2005 1:40 am

[quote=AA787,reply=7][You then need to add JFK to LGA's number of flights and then you will realize that NYC is a bigger market for AA.
/quote]

I realize that. But what connecting passenger is going to want to transfer JFK-LGA? None, zero, zip. BOS is a better east coast gateway for AA in terms of available connections. And if CO opens EWR-NCL, will either flight do well splitting the NYC market?

JGPH1A · Sun Mar 20, 2005 4:40 am

Quoting OzarkD9S (Reply 9):
BOS is a better east coast gateway for AA

It might be if international-domestic transfers at BOS weren't such a total nightmare. BOS is not a transfer hub, period.

jonty · Sun Mar 20, 2005 5:48 am

That would be great because to get to america at the moment you have to go to LHR/LGW, very annoying when you fly in and have to wait 3 hours for a flight to newcastle! Not that I mind being at LHR but when I've just travelled 7 hours or whatever!

B742 · Sun Mar 20, 2005 5:50 am

I think AA would rather choose to fly to BHX rather than NCL!

Emirates might work as a 2/3 weekly service, but I doubt it!

Rob!

ManchesterMAN · Sun Mar 20, 2005 6:26 am

Even with superior connections at BOS, I'd still think JFK-NCL would be better for AA (if anything). For a start NYC is a MASSIVE od market and passengers could still connect to flights to some of the other popular US destinations from JFK (LAX, SFO, MIA being 3 significant examples). Of course if CO got in there with an EWR service then they would eat AA alive IMHO. Maybe this is why they are looking at a BOS-NCL?

NCLairport · Sun Mar 20, 2005 7:51 am

CO is the most likely option. Daily will not work in my opinion. Well....maybe if its seasonal it will... in the winter 2/3 time a week will sufice!!

By the way..... it is very easy to get to USA from NCL. You certainly dont need to go down to LHR. We either fly to SFB from NCL and hire car and do some serious touring....Across to New Orleans or up to Atlanta!! Or we fly Air Transat from NCL to Toronto and driive to Niagra and then down to BOS and New York!! Fantastic two week holiday in some of the USA's biggest hot spots.... all from the lovely NCL International Airport

cambrian · Sun Mar 20, 2005 7:54 am

Quoting NCLairport (Reply 14):
all from the lovely NCL International Airport

Yes, it is a lovely airport! I was there today- did LHR-NCL-LHR to meet some friends. Any airport with a branch of Greggs gets my vote!

NCLairport · Sun Mar 20, 2005 7:59 am

lol

........

........

gkirk · Sun Mar 20, 2005 11:38 am

Daily NCL-EWR/JFK in the summer, and maybe 5/6 weekly during the winter would work well

jonty · Sun Mar 20, 2005 9:21 pm

Quoting Cambrian (Reply 15):
Any airport with a branch of Greggs gets my vote!

definatly! lol

tinpusher007 · Sun Mar 20, 2005 11:34 pm

Excuse me for being ignorant, but what is NCL...Im not familiar with that code.

UK_Dispatcher · Sun Mar 20, 2005 11:37 pm

Newcastle, in the north-east of england. This is where the USA's favourite beer has its origins Wink

LH423 · Mon Mar 21, 2005 1:49 am

Quoting JGPH1A (Reply 10):
It might be if international-domestic transfers at BOS weren't such a total nightmare. BOS is not a transfer hub, period.

You know...maybe it's because I've always flown into Boston and never transited, but I don't seem to understand why BOS has such a bad reputation for transfers. Yes, the terminals are disconnected so if arriving into E you will have to go outside to get to your connecting terminal. But, I fail to see how, if everything runs smoothly, BOS is any worse than the large European 4, JFK, LAX, or ORD. Sure, in Europe your bags will be checked through to your final destination but the distance you have to cover is massive. You can now walk from Terminal E to A in about 5-7 minutes. Terminal B is maybe a 10 minute busride, and the walk to C or D is 3-5 minutes. Yes, you have to claim your bags and that can take some time and does result in missed connections on occasion, but that's US law and has nothing to do with Boston. I'm really puzzled since it doesn't seem to me like BOS is really that bad. I can only imagine what connecting from one side of JFK to the other is like. Maybe it's easier now with the AirTrain, but I can't see it being less time-consuming that a connection in BOS.

I don't think there's a market for BOS-NCL. Although there are a lot of visitors from the northeast of England and Scotland who would probably prefer a non-stop (much in the same that Manchester was so popular), I just don't see it happening, at least for the time-being. If CO were to start a EWR-NCL flight (which I doubt since that would eat up pax from the EDI flight), I think AA would be more apt to start a BOS flight than a JFK flight just because it would be an untapped market.

LH423

JGPH1A · Mon Mar 21, 2005 5:41 pm

Quoting LH423 (Reply 21):
but I don't seem to understand why BOS has such a bad reputation for transfers. Yes, the terminals are disconnected so if arriving into E you will have to go outside to get to your connecting terminal.

The trouble is not the walking, the trouble is having to do the whole check-in and clear security business again. BOS does not have a bag re-check area after customs, unlike ATL or EWR or other large international connecting hubs. You have to drag your luggage round to the other terminal, stand in line to check in, then re-clear security. All that in the depths of a BOS winter, not fun. Plus it ups to connect time to a minimum 3 hours. Not worth it.

cornish · Mon Mar 21, 2005 6:34 pm

Are there any govt incentives for AA or anyone else to start NCL services in the same way I believe that CO started up EDI services - some sort of new route grant for a year or anything. If so then that may be why AA is looking at this. If not, then I would be surprised - especially BOS.

sevenair · Mon Mar 21, 2005 8:20 pm

we would jump at the chance to get a regular service to the US (i.e. not a weekly/fortnightly service). What could be easier than hopping on the metro, and a few hours later arriving in NYC Smile

cant wait!

LH423 · Tue Mar 22, 2005 2:04 am

Quoting JGPH1A (Reply 22):
The trouble is not the walking, the trouble is having to do the whole check-in and clear security business again. BOS does not have a bag re-check area after customs, unlike ATL or EWR or other large international connecting hubs.

Yes we do. And we have for as long as I've been working here (over 2.5 years). The only time it's ever advised that pax take their bags is when the connection is very short due to a late arrival or if the bags were not tagged through to the final destination since we can't print bag tags after a flight has departed.

Also, as it's AA, if the pax are connecting onto another AA flight they'll have most likely already been checked in so they'd simply need to go from the transfer desk (where you drop off your bags) to the connecting terminal and right through security.

Furthermore, it has come to my attention that you now must pass a security checkpoint at LHR, even if you're connecting within the same terminal. I wouldn't know since I'm staff and have to clear immigration and customs anyway and check-in at the staff travel desks.

LH423

[Edited 2005-03-21 18:06:20]

JGPH1A · Tue Mar 22, 2005 2:32 am

Quoting LH423 (Reply 25):
Yes we do. And we have for as long as I've been working here (over 2.5 years).

Oh - sorry. I apologise - I've never noticed it. Whereabouts is it then ? Is it before or after you come out of the door from Customs ?

Quoting LH423 (Reply 25):
Furthermore, it has come to my attention that you now must pass a security checkpoint at LHR, even if you're connecting within the same terminal.

Yes you do, but its fairly cursory - not the fully body cavity probe you have to go through in the US.

jfklganyc · Tue Mar 22, 2005 3:20 am

It seems as if this thread has gone in two directions:

AA BOS to NCL? and BOS a disaster?

I'll comment on BOS first. I fly to many airports, however it must be said that BOS is the absolute worst, emphasize worst, run airport in the NE United States. Perhaps the whole country. The terminal area is very congested, the runway configuration is an absolute nightmare, and terminal ammenities are nothing short of horrendous.

BOS is LGA gone wild! If LGA were an int'l airport---it would be BOS. Now let's look at AA at BOS. Three separate concourses. None share the same security checkpoint. ALL are separated by a BUS RIDE on the tarmac. One finger doesn't have any bathrooms beyond security.

Now add on that all int'l arrivals come into a different terminal altogether! That's four separate gate areas. If you are going from the Int'l terminal to the Eagle terminal:

1. Clear customs/immigration
2. Get on bus across airport
3. Recelear security
4. Go to gate, walk down jetbridge to staircase
5. Board another bus
6. Travel across the tarmac
7. Arrive at satellite terminal
8. Go to gate

This is not an AA connecting point for int'l flights for that very reason. It can't be. It is too spread out and too inconvenient.

As for AA at NCL. Since when have we known AA to serve any secondary European airports?
Since when has AA served a majority of primary European airports?

Patterns don't change. AA makes money in Europe with LHR and CDG slots. Not flying to places like Warsaw, Venice, and surely not NCL.

Look to DL and/or CO for that.

Just my two cents.

PJ

David_itl · Tue Mar 22, 2005 3:53 am

Quoting JFKLGANYC (Reply 27):
Since when have we known AA to serve any secondary European airports?

Let me think......since 1st May 1986, shall we say, when ORD-MAN began?

David

gkirk · Tue Mar 22, 2005 3:59 am

Actually I would imagine, BA, even with their tiny NCL presence would probably block any move by AA to operate this, and rather keep feeding their flights through LHR

David_itl · Tue Mar 22, 2005 4:02 am

Not necessarily as they'd be able to add to their non-London transatlantic codesharing services (even if MIA-MAN isn't!).

David

Billy · Tue Mar 22, 2005 9:33 pm

Picking up on a couple of points here. AA did look at BOS because of the number of connections that BOS offered. However, JFK wins on this one. BA cannot and will not stop any such development - there is no anti-trust immunity between the two carriers. Any move would be illegal and AA could contest it.
AA is the favourite ahead of CO on the NCL route.

gkirk · Tue Mar 22, 2005 10:11 pm

Billy, how likely is it that AA will start flights to NCL?

cornish · Tue Mar 22, 2005 10:17 pm

Quoting David_itl (Reply 28):
Quoting JFKLGANYC (Reply 27):
Since when have we known AA to serve any secondary European airports?

Let me think......since 1st May 1986, shall we say, when ORD-MAN began?

David

While MAN might technically be a secondary airport, its throughput of over 20 million passengers a year makes it significant in European terms, much like MUC for example.

NCL is undoubtably a much smaller airport and is not the type that AA would normally serve - CO yes, but AA no. I think that is the point JFKLGANYC was trying to make.

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