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Doona
Topic Author
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Star Alliance Terminal At LHR?

Sat Mar 26, 2005 7:04 pm

I remember reading an article saying that as soon as the new T5 is completed at LHR, Star Alliance would make T3 into a Star Alliance Terminal. Does anyone have any info on that?

Cheers
Mats
Sure, we're concerned for our lives. Just not as concerned as saving 9 bucks on a roundtrip to Ft. Myers.
 
MANmatt
Posts: 861
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RE: Star Alliance Terminal At LHR?

Sat Mar 26, 2005 9:04 pm

I though T1 was going to become the Star terminal, because i think i remember some people questionning whether or not T1 would be able to hand all the heavies from the likes of UA, TG, NZ, etc. Please correct me someone if i am wrong!

Matt
 
User avatar
B742
Posts: 3593
Joined: Mon Mar 14, 2005 12:48 am

RE: Star Alliance Terminal At LHR?

Sat Mar 26, 2005 10:09 pm

Yeh MANmatt, I thought that too! T1 will have a bit of trouble handling all those heavies, especially UA!

Can someone please tell me what the terminal plans are for LHR?

Rob!
 
rtfm
Posts: 421
Joined: Sat Oct 09, 2004 5:35 pm

RE: Star Alliance Terminal At LHR?

Sun Mar 27, 2005 4:31 am

BA & QF to T5
SkyTeam to T4
Star to T1; remember that T1 already handles SAA & El Al widebodies as well as quite a few BA 744s.
AA, VS and the other (non-aligned) carriers to stay in/move to T3
T2 to be demolished/re-built?

I think that's roughly the plan.
 
zvezda
Posts: 8886
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RE: Star Alliance Terminal At LHR?

Sun Mar 27, 2005 4:51 am

I thought that was about the plan that BAA offered, but that Star Alliance asked for something different. No?
 
Speedbird2155
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RE: Star Alliance Terminal At LHR?

Sun Mar 27, 2005 5:08 am

Quoting Zvezda (Reply 4):
I thought that was about the plan that BAA offered, but that Star Alliance asked for something different. No?

From what I understand, the arrangement that RTFM outlined has been agreed on. I would only say that T3 will be for Oneworld long-haul partners other than BA/QF and all other long-haul services. T2 will remain as is present with mainly non-aligned EU carriers, unless a decision is made about renovations/rebuilding.
 
imatams
Posts: 312
Joined: Wed Feb 09, 2005 8:42 pm

RE: Star Alliance Terminal At LHR?

Sun Mar 27, 2005 6:11 am

It does look to me that Star got the bad end of the deal, considering that T1 is really old, especially the piers, and not optimised for all the long haul traffic, of wich they have quite a bit (AC,UA,SQ....) It's been a year and half since I were there last, and it might have improved, but then it was really messy, especially after leaving the main hall and going towards the gates. What's the status of T1 now, has it improved?

IM
 
VS045
Posts: 188
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RE: Star Alliance Terminal At LHR?

Sun Mar 27, 2005 6:35 am

T1: Star
T2: Non - alligned european carriers, although there are planes for it to be re-built.
T3: Other long haul carriers
T4: SkyTeam
T5: BA/QF

This has got to be one of the worst plans I have ever seen.

Lets start with T1. Old, spread out so bad for connections, dirty, not enough widebody gates(IMO), etc.
T2: Has to be rebuilt, the check-in area is just awful.
T3: This is fine.
T4: SkyTeam!??????? What are they thinking! Do they actually know how many SkyTeam carriers fly to LHR- three. AF and AZ are fairly substantial, but they (plus CSA) are hardly going to need 23 gates, are they!
T5: This is fine.

I (please do not label me as some armchair CEO, but anyway) would do it like this:

T1:SkyTeam, non-aligned eurpean carriers.
T2:re-built
T3:Other long-haul carriers.
T4:Star
T5:BA/QF

Cheers,
VS045
4 engines 4 long haul
 
lymanm
Posts: 1102
Joined: Tue Jan 23, 2001 2:30 pm

RE: Star Alliance Terminal At LHR?

Sun Mar 27, 2005 6:53 am

I'm fairly certain that it wouldn't be NZ, TG or even UA that would pose the most problems as far as heavies go, but rather AC. I believe at peak season, they have about 15 different aircraft pass through LHR, with UA reaching perhaps 10. NZ and TG don't compare.
buhh bye
 
Speedbird2155
Posts: 694
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RE: Star Alliance Terminal At LHR?

Sun Mar 27, 2005 7:27 am

At present T4 also has UL, KL, KM and KQ, all of which I believe will stay in T4. Asiana also operates from here, but I suspect they will move to T1, unless KL continue to do their ground handling at LHR.

T1 has more gates that T4, which could be the reason why it was offered to Star Alliance, especially given the large BD operations, which T4 would not be able to accomodate in addition to the other numerous other Star Alliance flights. At present BA can barely manage with T4 and it presents a major challenge running operations from there daily, which is why T5 is so important.
 
dutchjet
Posts: 7714
Joined: Sat Oct 14, 2000 6:13 am

RE: Star Alliance Terminal At LHR?

Sun Mar 27, 2005 7:40 am

Interesting information, although the plans do not seem to make a lot of sense - STAR at Terminal One will be a disaster I think but the decision is likely being made to accommodate BMI. BMI is fine in Terminal One (it needs some work of course), but would it not make more sense to put the remaining STAR members at Terminal 4 which is well suited for widebody aircraft?

SkyTeam at terminal four is also a curious choice - is there much SkyTeam connecting traffic at LHR - none of the three SkyTeam members from the US (DL,CO,NW) even fly to LHR and none of the UK carriers that offer domestic connections are SkyTeam members, so how much connecting traffic does SkyTeam put through LHR - I would think that almost 100% of AF,KL and AZ traffic out of LHR is O&D. SkyTeam could use a piece of T2 during the renovation period - if that is the plan.

It seems as if LHR will continue to be under construction for the next 25 years, and continue to be one of the more difficult airports to use for connecting service, regardless of what airline you are flying.
 
daron4000
Posts: 608
Joined: Mon Mar 07, 2005 12:17 pm

RE: Star Alliance Terminal At LHR?

Sun Mar 27, 2005 8:31 am

UA definitely has more than ten flights in and out of Heathrow, and all of these, except for maybe one 767 are 747/777.
 
ZKOJH
Posts: 1503
Joined: Mon Sep 13, 2004 9:51 am

RE: Star Alliance Terminal At LHR?

Sun Mar 27, 2005 11:30 am

by the time this is happens, NZ might be flying double flights into lhr , with 744, but this will change when the 773's take over them in about 8 1/2 years
Air New Zealand ~ dreams of flying
 
lymanm
Posts: 1102
Joined: Tue Jan 23, 2001 2:30 pm

RE: Star Alliance Terminal At LHR?

Sun Mar 27, 2005 12:05 pm

Daron4000, you're right. I'm bored and found 12 flights during the summer schedule on UA to LHR.

JFK-LHR #956 (777), #904 (777)
IAD-LHR #924 (777), #918 (744), #922 (763), #920 (763)
ORD-LHR #958 (777), #928 (777), #938 (777)
LAX-LHR #934 (777)
SFO-LHR #954 (777), #930 (777)

For AC, there are 14 flights (below). Granted the vast majority of these are 763, with the rest being 333. I was correct, AC *does* have more flights, but I'd reckon that UA & the extra capacity larger aircraft results in them being more "congestive" to a *A terminal.

YYZ-LHR 5x
YUL-LHR 2x
YOW-LHR 1x
YVR-LHR 3x
YYC-LHR 2x
YYT/YHZ 1x

I don't trust my source 100%, so let me know if you spot any errors.
buhh bye
 
AA787
Posts: 520
Joined: Wed Feb 04, 2004 7:46 am

RE: Star Alliance Terminal At LHR?

Sun Mar 27, 2005 1:37 pm

I thought the rest of Oneworld was going to T4. The definately need the space. You have AA with almost 15 flights, CX with several flights to HKG, IB with flights to a handful of destinations in Spain, EI with flights to basically every major city in Ireland. You also have EY and possibly JL and LA in the future.
 
cx346
Posts: 49
Joined: Mon Apr 07, 2003 9:51 pm

RE: Star Alliance Terminal At LHR?

Sun Mar 27, 2005 4:00 pm

I find it lamentable that oneworld is split between T3 and T5, and it doesn't make much sense either. Most connections incoming on AA or CX will be with BA, not each other. It basically favours BA over oneworld partners. Not the way to go.
 
Doona
Topic Author
Posts: 3382
Joined: Fri Feb 18, 2005 9:43 am

RE: Star Alliance Terminal At LHR?

Sun Mar 27, 2005 7:56 pm

Apart from SK, do any other European airlines currently use T3 for European flights? I'm asking because T3 is generally used for heavies, and just how many narrowbodies operate from there?

Cheers
Mats
Sure, we're concerned for our lives. Just not as concerned as saving 9 bucks on a roundtrip to Ft. Myers.
 
LHR27C
Posts: 846
Joined: Tue Aug 03, 2004 3:49 am

RE: Star Alliance Terminal At LHR?

Mon Mar 28, 2005 12:42 am

TK operate to T3 as well with the 73G, sometimes the A340. SK and TK (if you count TK as a European carrier) are the only European carriers into T3. Regarding narrowbodies, there are a few others like BI who occasionally operate in 757s. But to all intents and purposes T3 is a long haul terminal with almost exclusively widebody operation.

Regarding the queries about T1 being used for Star, I would agree with Speedbird2155. It's the largest terminal at LHR presently in terms of passengers handled and copes with quite a few widebodies already from SAA, CY and BA's long haul services which operate from T1. There would, clearly, need to be some work to convert more gates for long haul use, but certainly the check in hall and arrivals areas are already suitable for more widebodies, most of the infrastructure is in place. Plus putting Star in T1 means BD, second biggest carrier at LHR, can stay where they are established.

Oliver
Once you have tasted flight, you will walk the earth with your eyes turned forever skyward
 
Speedbird2155
Posts: 694
Joined: Wed Feb 02, 2005 7:44 am

RE: Star Alliance Terminal At LHR?

Mon Mar 28, 2005 1:58 am

Quoting AA787 (Reply 14):
I thought the rest of Oneworld was going to T4

That would be the least practical location. T3 is the closest to T5 and the underground access road between the central area (T1,2 &3) and T5 will be closest to T3, therefore making transfers easier and quicker.

Quoting Cx346 (Reply 15):
I find it lamentable that oneworld is split between T3 and T5, and it doesn't make much sense either. Most connections incoming on AA or CX will be with BA, not each other. It basically favours BA over oneworld partners. Not the way to go.

T5 was designed simply to allow BA to move all of its operations to one terminal rather than the current split operations in 3 terminals. LHR is BA's base and the current set up doesn't allow BA to be most efficient. Also the fact that most Oneworld carriers will remain in T3 is simply because T5 won't have the space to handle those carriers. The use of different terminals at other airports doesn't seem to be an issue, so no reason why it should be an issue at LHR.

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