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jdwfloyd
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Why Doesn't WN Move From PHL To PNE

Fri Jul 29, 2005 2:16 pm

I asked this in a previous post but at work tonight I really thought on this subject. North East Philly is about the same distance from the metro area as PHL and doesn't have any of the problems of PHL. With WN trying to move from SEA to BFG one would think this could work too.
 
stlgph
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RE: Why Doesn't WN Move From PHL To PNE

Fri Jul 29, 2005 2:54 pm

that's probably next on their list of things to whine about like a kid whose daddy won't let him go on the Merry Go Round.
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usair330
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RE: Why Doesn't WN Move From PHL To PNE

Fri Jul 29, 2005 5:37 pm

Nope... No planes with more than (I think) 48 passengers is allowed to land at PNE. Says it on there website .... Look it up when u have time.
 
nycflyer
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RE: Why Doesn't WN Move From PHL To PNE

Fri Jul 29, 2005 5:46 pm

in the past, I started a thread about WN moving to ILG (Wilmington, DE), but everyone who replied shot down the idea. I don't think it's "too close to BWI" as some say. I think it'd be great! As a city, ILG has a lot of business, and it can and should be a reliever airport to PHL.
 
PHLBOS
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RE: Why Doesn't WN Move From PHL To PNE

Fri Jul 29, 2005 8:32 pm

Quoting USAir330 (Reply 2):
Nope... No planes with more than (I think) 48 passengers is allowed to land at PNE. Says it on there website .... Look it up when u have time.

I don't believe that PNE has had any type of scheduled commercial service in at least 10 to 15 years. It's mostly a G.A. airport.

Plus any attempt to revive commercial service there, be it WN or whoever, would be met with a lot of community opposition (i.e. the NIMBY factor). There's a lot more surrounding residences there than at PHL. It would make WN's present fight to repeal W/S A look like a tea party in comparison.

Believe me, if PNE had any type of scheduled commericial service today; WN would've certainly given that airport some consideration.
"TransEastern! You'll feel like you've never left the ground because we treat you like dirt!" SNL Parady ad circa 1981
 
runway27right
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RE: Why Doesn't WN Move From PHL To PNE

Sat Jul 30, 2005 7:11 am

Like Chris said PNE is a no-no.

Up to the late 80's (maybe early 90's) TWA Express & Pan Am Express had a PHL-PNE Shuttle. They use to fly directly over my house. They used DHC7, DHC8, ATR42s & Jetstreams over the course of their modern service. (My era that is)

TTN has been unsuccessful for the Airlines that tried. That is a shame since it is a great airport for the traveler. I used it once on a Buffalo flight. It also has a little viewing area which once had picnic tables. But then 9-11 happened.

BTW, no cameras were confiscated in the London bombings. Hmmm. (Off Topic comment)

Paul
Keeping PHL Spotting Alive Daily!
 
A330323X
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RE: Why Doesn't WN Move From PHL To PNE

Sat Jul 30, 2005 8:21 am

Quoting Runway27right (Reply 5):
Up to the late 80's (maybe early 90's) TWA Express & Pan Am Express had a PHL-PNE Shuttle. They use to fly directly over my house. They used DHC7, DHC8, ATR42s & Jetstreams over the course of their modern service.

The final service to PNE was Trans States d/b/a TWExpress with J31s on PNE-JFK, around 1993 or so.
I'm the expert on here on two things, neither of which I care about much anymore.
 
SRT75
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RE: Why Doesn't WN Move From PHL To PNE

Sat Jul 30, 2005 8:22 am

My theory is that WN smells blood and was (is) trying to aggressively destroy US. PHL and PIT appeared on the WN schedule within the last year (maybe year and a half). Conveniently after the US-UA deal went through and US looked to be finished. Just seemed too perfect to be a coincidence.

With the HP-US merger it will be interesting to see how aggressively the new company defends these US hubs.
 
Fleet Service
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RE: Why Doesn't WN Move From PHL To PNE

Sun Jul 31, 2005 11:56 pm

Quoting A330323X (Reply 6):
The final service to PNE was Trans States d/b/a TWExpress with J31s on PNE-JFK, around 1993 or so.

Trans States didnt start operations at JFK as TWE until 07 November 1995, and the only Trans States aircraft to ever see JFK or any of the east coast TWE stations was the J41.
Yes, I actually *do* work for an airline,how about you?
 
aa777flyer
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RE: Why Doesn't WN Move From PHL To PNE

Mon Aug 01, 2005 12:20 am

Quoting STLGph (Reply 1):
that's probably next on their list of things to whine about like a kid whose daddy won't let him go on the Merry Go Round.

LOL How true!

Quoting USAir330 (Reply 2):
Nope... No planes with more than (I think) 48 passengers is allowed to land at PNE. Says it on there website .... Look it up when u have time.

So How does that stop them, they are complaining about the Wright now...
The TSA was created to make the post office look efficient!
 
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chrisnh
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RE: Why Doesn't WN Move From PHL To PNE

Mon Aug 01, 2005 12:39 am

Southwest won't go anywhere once (not if) USAirways ceases to exist. Southwest leaving PHL would be the airline equivalent of 'New Coke.'

Southwest would be the laughing stock of the airline industry if they moved after making such a high profile entry into PHL.

The airport run by Fred Testa (Harrisburg?) would be a good candidate. After all, Testa's the guy that did such a fabulous job getting Southwest here at MHT.

Chris in NH
 
A330323X
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RE: Why Doesn't WN Move From PHL To PNE

Mon Aug 01, 2005 2:47 am

Quoting Fleet Service (Reply 8):
Trans States didnt start operations at JFK as TWE until 07 November 1995, and the only Trans States aircraft to ever see JFK or any of the east coast TWE stations was the J41.

My bad, I thought it was Trans States that provided the service.

TWE service on PNE-JFK did run from 1991 until 11/6/95. It ended when the outsourcing of TWE to Trans States began.
I'm the expert on here on two things, neither of which I care about much anymore.
 
Tornado82
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RE: Why Doesn't WN Move From PHL To PNE

Mon Aug 01, 2005 3:35 am

Quoting NYCFlyer (Reply 3):
in the past, I started a thread about WN moving to ILG (Wilmington, DE), but everyone who replied shot down the idea. I don't think it's "too close to BWI" as some say. I think it'd be great! As a city, ILG has a lot of business, and it can and should be a reliever airport to PHL.



Quoting Runway27right (Reply 5):

TTN has been unsuccessful for the Airlines that tried. That is a shame since it is a great airport for the traveler. I used it once on a Buffalo flight. It also has a little viewing area which once had picnic tables. But then 9-11 happened.

And ABE would be far better still... with its proximity to the more populace parts of Jersey, EWR, NYC, etc. than either ILG nor TTN.

Quoting SRT75 (Reply 7):
My theory is that WN smells blood and was (is) trying to aggressively destroy US. PHL and PIT appeared on the WN schedule within the last year (maybe year and a half).

US does a far better job of destroying themselves than WN does of destroying them. US is their own worst enemy. Just ask the DM Elite's who are leaving them in droves.

Quoting ChrisNH (Reply 10):

The airport run by Fred Testa (Harrisburg?) would be a good candidate. After all, Testa's the guy that did such a fabulous job getting Southwest here at MHT.

MDT (Harrisburg Int'l/"Middletown") has already been discussed as being too small, and WAY too far out of the way from PHL to be effective. Once again I refer to my above comments, ABE is the answer to WN (or FL if they desired) wanting to leave PHL but stay in the region... and would also be the answer for someone like FlyI as well. It's alot easier to head up 476 to ABE than to head west to MDT from PHL, it's just a fact of geography, sorry to the MDT fans.
 
FlewGSW
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RE: Why Doesn't WN Move From PHL To PNE

Mon Aug 01, 2005 6:17 am

I have family in counties north of PHL. Prior to WN at PHL, and prior to gas at the pump for $2.25 a gallon, they drove to BWI to get a cheap fare to Florida. Folks will drive for hours and hours and hours.... just to save $ on a flight.

So MDT is still in the picture for a PHL alternative.
 
Tornado82
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RE: Why Doesn't WN Move From PHL To PNE

Mon Aug 01, 2005 12:46 pm

Quoting FlewGSW (Reply 13):
So MDT is still in the picture for a PHL alternative.

But why would it be, with ABE closer, with more gate space, etc.?? Not to mention ABE has the NYC advantage... MDT has what... Lancaster? York?? Not to mention BWI is right down the road if your family is that type that'll drive 200 miles to save a few bucks. Defeats the purpose of flying if you spend more time in your car than the plane.
 
haveric
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RE: Why Doesn't WN Move From PHL To PNE

Mon Aug 01, 2005 8:53 pm

What would MDT be an alternative to? It's at least 2 hours from most of Philadelphia and not considered nearby in the local consciousness.

Also, with HP and US forming the largest low-cost carrier, why would passengers need/want to drive to MDT.

Isn't MDT closer to BWI than ILG is, too?

Nice new terminal, bad idea.
 
PHLBOS
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RE: Why Doesn't WN Move From PHL To PNE

Mon Aug 01, 2005 11:05 pm

Quoting ChrisNH (Reply 10):
The airport run by Fred Testa (Harrisburg?)

Testa was briefly the DOA Director for PHL/PNE between his years w/MHT and now w/MDT.

Quoting Tornado82 (Reply 12):
MDT (Harrisburg Int'l/"Middletown") has already been discussed as being too small, and WAY too far out of the way from PHL to be effective. Once again I refer to my above comments, ABE is the answer to WN (or FL if they desired) wanting to leave PHL but stay in the region... and would also be the answer for someone like FlyI as well. It's alot easier to head up 476 to ABE than to head west to MDT from PHL

You forgot about B6. Would they be interested in coming to ABE?

Back to the subject at hand, if (and I do mean if here) WN were to leave PHL; they would probably look to ABE as the logical alternate. It's much closer to PHL than MDT plus it has the facilities, at present, to initially support them. As far as FL moving to ABE; I don't see that happening. ACY's probably out of the picture for WN as well because most of the new gates from the proposed terminal expansion will be for NK.

Quoting ChrisNH (Reply 10):
Southwest won't go anywhere once (not if) USAirways ceases to exist.

With the merger w/HP seeming to be a go at this point; I don't see US' hub PHL operations shrinking anytime soon. The overlapping HP flights to LAS & PHX will probably be the only PHL flights dropped as a result of the merger. The merger somewhat gives US (though run by HP) an extended lifespan, at least in the short-term.
"TransEastern! You'll feel like you've never left the ground because we treat you like dirt!" SNL Parady ad circa 1981
 
Tornado82
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RE: Why Doesn't WN Move From PHL To PNE

Mon Aug 01, 2005 11:54 pm

Quoting PHLBOS (Reply 16):
As far as FL moving to ABE; I don't see that happening.

I agree, I could see them adding ABE on its own merits rather than moving from PHL to be honest. I just threw that name out there. I'd much rather see FL here rather than our Transmeridian, Hooters, etc. stuff. There's alot more stability in an established airline like FL. B6... maaaaybe once they get the E190s... and I sure as hell don't want to start anymore nauseating B6 speculating... not to mention they've already said no NEW E190 cities, just additional services in the prexisting cities for the time being.

B6 would be perfect for PHL though, they seem to have a thing for major ops in majorly congested airports. JFK, FLL, now EWR... PHL and ORD have to be on the horizon  Wink
 
PHLBOS
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RE: Why Doesn't WN Move From PHL To PNE

Tue Aug 02, 2005 12:08 am

Quoting Tornado82 (Reply 17):
B6 would be perfect for PHL though

Unless Isdell can twist US' arms to release some of its gates, I don't believe there's room for B6 to come in and set up shop at PHL right now. The additional gates from the proposed Terminal E expansion project will be taken by WN.
"TransEastern! You'll feel like you've never left the ground because we treat you like dirt!" SNL Parady ad circa 1981

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