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mrocktor
Topic Author
Posts: 1391
Joined: Mon Jan 24, 2005 12:57 am

E-190 For AF Régional

Mon Sep 05, 2005 10:17 pm

This has been expected for a while now...

Press release:

Embraer Signs the Final Contract for Six EMBRAER 190 LR Jets With Régional

Régional Compagnie Aérienne Européenne to become the first operator of the type in Europe

São José dos Campos, news released to the media on September 5, 2005 – Embraer and Régional, a fully owned subsidiary of Air France, have announced the signature of the final contract for the purchase of six EMBRAER 190 LR aircraft with six additional options of the same model.

These airplanes shall replace an existing order for seven ERJ 145s. The contract is valued US$ 189 million at list price of the EMBRAER 190.

Deliveries shall commence in the first quarter of 2007 and the aircraft will be configured in a single class cabin layout seating 100 passengers.

“The choice of the EMBRAER 190 LR is the result of a meticulous and rigorous selection process aiming at providing Régional with the best possible fleet to re-enforce its hub and point to point traffic across Europe,” explained Jacques Bankir, Régional Chairman and CEO.

The EMBRAER 190 LR jets will be deployed throughout the carrier’s interregional network, linking 45 major cities in Europe and France.

“It is a great honor for Embraer to have the Air France Group select a member of its EMBRAER 170/190 family of aircraft, enhancing our already existing and longstanding partnership,” said Luiz Fuchs, Embraer Senior Vice-President - Europe, Africa and Middle East - Civil Aircraft. “Régional, which flies 50 EMB 120 Brasílias, ERJ 135s and ERJ 145s, carried out a thorough evaluation of several other possibilities, and its final choice of the EMBRAER 190 LR makes our agreement even more rewarding.”


mrocktor
 
Pyrex
Posts: 4821
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RE: E-190 For AF Régional

Mon Sep 05, 2005 10:31 pm

Great news... I hope this is only the start of a flurry of orders from Air France and other European Carriers for the Embraer 170/190 family.

I bet this leaves Rekkof in a difficult position...

Fica bem,

Miguel
 
mrocktor
Topic Author
Posts: 1391
Joined: Mon Jan 24, 2005 12:57 am

RE: E-190 For AF Régional

Mon Sep 05, 2005 10:50 pm

Agreed, so much for the "no major european carriers will order the E-jets" crowd  laughing 

mrocktor
 
BestWestern
Posts: 8385
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RE: E-190 For AF Régional

Mon Sep 05, 2005 11:06 pm

Wonder if CityJet will follow Regional?? Will the E-190 get LCY approval?
 
frenchpilot
Posts: 71
Joined: Wed Aug 25, 2004 12:50 am

RE: E-190 For AF Régional

Mon Sep 05, 2005 11:20 pm

Words are saying that we, at CityJet are getting Avros next year......... we shall see....... Though there is an ERJ 190 poster in CDG ops.....
 
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lightsaber
Moderator
Posts: 24015
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RE: E-190 For AF Régional

Mon Sep 05, 2005 11:33 pm

Quoting Mrocktor (Thread starter):
and its final choice of the EMBRAER 190 LR makes our agreement even more rewarding.”

Congrats to Embraer. Soon these little jets will get enough sales that like the A320 and 737 families, they'll sell themselves (e.g., as AF sets up to maintain their E190's, other potential European customers will be comfortable that parts will be available.)

Quoting Mrocktor (Reply 2):
Agreed, so much for the "no major European carriers will order the E-jets" crowd

So true.

Hey, where are the customer lists for the E-jets? I'm not finding that information on the new Embraer web site.

Lightsaber
 
HiFi
Posts: 189
Joined: Fri Apr 29, 2005 5:36 am

RE: E-190 For AF Régional

Mon Sep 05, 2005 11:39 pm

Quoting BestWestern (Reply 3):
Will the E-190 get LCY approval?

I don't think so.. The E-170 was designed to operate in LCY because launch customer SWISS requested that feature... The E-190 did not have that performance goal.

One difference that has a major influence on this issue are flaps.

E-170: double-slotted flaps


View Large View Medium
Click here for bigger photo!

Photo © Stefan Sjögren - Stockholm Arlanda Photography



E-190: single-slotted outboard flaps


View Large View Medium
Click here for bigger photo!

Photo © Red-Phoenix AirPics



The advantage for the E-190 is less weight and simpler maintenance.  Wink
 
HEGAN
Posts: 204
Joined: Sat Feb 26, 2005 1:11 am

RE: E-190 For AF Régional

Tue Sep 06, 2005 12:17 am

Congratulations for Embraer.

I also think this is bad for Reekof, as AF/KL could have been its best customer.

I think in the following year, the 170/190 family will be the best selling product of Embraer and maybe better dimensioned than the CRJ-900/C-Series

Agur,
Hegan
 
backfire
Posts: 3467
Joined: Fri Oct 06, 2006 8:01 am

RE: E-190 For AF Régional

Tue Sep 06, 2005 12:24 am

Quoting Pyrex (Reply 1):
I bet this leaves Rekkof in a difficult position

Yes - Rekkof's non-existent customers, non-existent production line and completely bonkers business plan were only tiny obstacles compared with this catastrophe.  boggled 
 
Pyrex
Posts: 4821
Joined: Thu Aug 25, 2005 7:24 am

RE: E-190 For AF Régional

Tue Sep 06, 2005 1:37 am

Quoting Backfire (Reply 8):
Yes - Rekkof's non-existent customers, non-existent production line and completely bonkers business plan were only tiny obstacles compared with this catastrophe.

Hey, at least they had the plans of an aircraft out of production for 10 years (that failed when it was launched)
 
stirling
Posts: 3896
Joined: Sat Jun 12, 2004 2:00 am

RE: E-190 For AF Régional

Tue Sep 06, 2005 2:01 am

Quoting Pyrex (Reply 9):
Hey, at least they had the plans of an aircraft out of production for 10 years (that failed when it was launched)

What is your criteria for calling the F100/70 a failure?

Big orders from US and AA...worldwide operations, sure didn't sell like a Boeing 737 or Airbus 320....but if I can be corrected, did not the next-generation Fokkers outsell the original F28 series?

Personally, I didn't care for the aircraft. My only experience was with the Classic American carrier of the past Piedmont; great airline, lousy plane. (For the entire duration of the flight HTS-CLT; I was waiting for the aircraft to shake itself to pieces...)

I would have liked to ride the F70, but my one chance on an example with Desert West (HP) went Mechanical and a mainline 737-200 was brought in as the equipment substitution many years ago PHX-DSM.

--------------------------------------------------

Thesee new "Jungle Jets", at least in my estimation, are a more exciting aviation development than the Airbus 380.
The 380, while impressive for shear size, is an airplane not many will have a chance to fly...while the E170/190s will be the be an aviation equivalent of the VW Bug in the 1930s. I can't wait to fly on one...but we don't see them that much out west.

So it surprises me (not that much really) that the major builders of the US and EU chose to abdicate this market.......I know, more profit in the big birds.

What is the count thus far for European operators...I know LOT, Alitalia, BE, and now Regional AF...who else?

How many does Embraer expect to sell on the continent?
Find it hard to believe that much of a gap exists between the 50 seat regional jets and mainline 150 seaters.

In the US.... wonder if American could realize profitable mainline ops with the E190/E195 sized aircraft....nothing replaced the F100....except for maybe the smaller offerings from Canada and Brazil. Why? Because there wasn't a suitable replacement? Scope clauses?

I realize there are many dynamics in the aircraft selection process; the last 4 years have been anything but ordinary...so I can't help but wonder what the future holds when the airline industry is not under such extreme pressures.
 
kappel
Posts: 1836
Joined: Thu Jul 14, 2005 6:48 pm

RE: E-190 For AF Régional

Tue Sep 06, 2005 2:07 am

Quoting Backfire (Reply 8):
Yes - Rekkof's non-existent customers, non-existent production line and completely bonkers business plan were only tiny obstacles compared with this catastrophe

 rotfl 
 
GoAllegheny
Posts: 310
Joined: Fri Nov 17, 2000 4:48 am

RE: E-190 For AF R�gional

Tue Sep 06, 2005 3:25 am

I flew an Emb-170 R/T from O'Hare to White Plains NY on UA Express/Chautauqua Air this past weekend. I liked the interior, and I also like that boarding a 70 seater at only about 1/2 to 2/3rds capacity is fast.

What I didn't like is the absence of any IFE on a 1 hour and 40 minute flight. Why aren't these planes equipped with at least the multi-channel music selection and a few flip-down LCD screens for movies? Seems like as they move into the 70 and 90 seat sizes the trips will be longer and could justify the cost. I also miss Channel 9 on these flights.

Upside, of course, was the price for a Labor Day weekend in the US: $202 R/T for the flight on 12 hours notice, versus $531 to LaGuardia. And even then the flights were not nearly full.
 
SonOfACaptain
Posts: 1695
Joined: Thu May 27, 2004 5:36 am

RE: E-190 For AF Régional

Tue Sep 06, 2005 3:35 am

Quoting GoAllegheny (Reply 12):
What I didn't like is the absence of any IFE on a 1 hour and 40 minute flight. Why aren't these planes equipped with at least the multi-channel music selection and a few flip-down LCD screens for movies?

Movie on a hour and 40 minute flight? I don't think so bud. Welcome to the new airline industry. Three hour flights don't even have IFE anymore.

-SOAC
 
sebring
Posts: 1331
Joined: Sat Jul 24, 2004 12:08 am

RE: E-190 For AF Régional

Tue Sep 06, 2005 4:05 am

Quoting SonOfACaptain (Reply 13):
Quoting GoAllegheny (Reply 12):What I didn't like is the absence of any IFE on a 1 hour and 40 minute flight. Why aren't these planes equipped with at least the multi-channel music selection and a few flip-down LCD screens for movies?
Movie on a hour and 40 minute flight? I don't think so bud. Welcome to the new airline industry. Three hour flights don't even have IFE anymore.

-SOAC

All of Air Canada's Embraer 175/190s and CRJ-705s will have a full AVOD at each seat. Full audio, full video, and by 2007, wireless internet throughout the aircraft.
 
HiFi
Posts: 189
Joined: Fri Apr 29, 2005 5:36 am

RE: E-190 For AF Régional

Tue Sep 06, 2005 4:18 am

Quoting Stirling (Reply 10):
What is the count thus far for European operators...I know LOT, Alitalia, BE, and now Regional AF...who else?

From what I remember: LOT, Alitalia, Finnair, Flybe, Macedonian Airlines, Cirrus, AF Régional and SWISS (I don't really know what became of that deal)...
 
erikwilliam
Posts: 2122
Joined: Fri Mar 12, 2004 12:30 am

RE: E-190 For AF Régional

Tue Sep 06, 2005 4:20 am

Quoting GoAllegheny (Reply 12):

Blame the company, not the aircraft.
B6´s E-190´s will all have IFE and leather seats!!
 
FCKC
Posts: 1631
Joined: Sun Nov 21, 2004 9:39 pm

RE: E-190 For AF Régional

Tue Sep 06, 2005 4:44 am

Great news for Embraer.Nice E190 will wear AF cs.
Perhaps next French customer to follow will be Britair , although no news about their intention.

HiFi

Are you sure about the Macedonian Al contract ?

What about JAT which is supposed to be interested?

If Bombardier doesn't produce a superior product than Embraer, i am afraid , the Brasilian manufacturer will be alone in this segment , thus will sale thousands units of the ERJ family.
I am more and more sceptical about the relaunch of the F70 line.
 
HiFi
Posts: 189
Joined: Fri Apr 29, 2005 5:36 am

RE: E-190 For AF Régional

Tue Sep 06, 2005 4:56 am

Quoting FCKC (Reply 17):
Are you sure about the Macedonian Al contract ?

It may be a leasing contract, that way not appearing explicitly on orders lists... I don't know... but I sure have seen some Macedonian liveries around here.  Smile
 
BDKLEZ
Posts: 1815
Joined: Sun Jun 26, 2005 11:57 am

RE: E-190 For AF Régional

Tue Sep 06, 2005 5:09 am

It had been rumoured that through AF/KL the E170/190 would be adopted as the replacement a/c for KLC's F50/70/100. The information re Regional, could be a pre-cursor to the type being adopted accross all AF/KL regional operators...  scratchchin 
 
SonOfACaptain
Posts: 1695
Joined: Thu May 27, 2004 5:36 am

RE: E-190 For AF Régional

Tue Sep 06, 2005 5:17 am

Quoting Sebring (Reply 14):
All of Air Canada's Embraer 175/190s and CRJ-705s will have a full AVOD at each seat. Full audio, full video, and by 2007, wireless internet throughout the aircraft.

I'm talking about the US majors.

-SOAC
 
kappel
Posts: 1836
Joined: Thu Jul 14, 2005 6:48 pm

RE: E-190 For AF Régional

Tue Sep 06, 2005 5:32 am

Quoting BDKLEZ (Reply 19):
It had been rumoured that through AF/KL the E170/190 would be adopted as the replacement a/c for KLC's F50/70/100. The information re Regional, could be a pre-cursor to the type being adopted accross all AF/KL regional operators

IIRC KLM's "CEO" Leo van Wijk said a couple of months ago that the F70's will be staying for a while. They are very happy with them. And besides, after the delivery of the a330, he also said that after the purchase of the 777's and a330's they are not going to buy any new aircraft for a while.

Quoting HiFi (Reply 15):
(I don't really know what became of that deal)...

I don't think they even know at the moment. My bet is that this deal is off, considering the news that they will focus around the Bae146 and a320.
 
mrocktor
Topic Author
Posts: 1391
Joined: Mon Jan 24, 2005 12:57 am

RE: E-190 For AF Régional

Tue Sep 06, 2005 5:33 am

Quoting SonOfACaptain (Reply 20):
I'm talking about the US majors.

jetBlue has IFE. Whether US will install IFE on their 190s remains to be seen.

mrocktor
 
hardiwv
Posts: 4341
Joined: Sat Oct 09, 2004 11:30 pm

RE: E-190 For AF Régional

Tue Sep 06, 2005 6:28 am

Quoting Pyrex (Reply 1):
Great news... I hope this is only the start of a flurry of orders from Air France and other European Carriers for the Embraer 170/190 family.

Indeed, excellent news for Embraer!

AF's E-190 will fly to 45 destinations in France and Europe. AF already has 50 Embraers in its fleet, comprised of EMB 120 Brasília, ERJ 135 e ERJ 145.

Quoting Backfire (Reply 8):
Yes - Rekkof's non-existent customers, non-existent production line and completely bonkers business plan were only tiny obstacles compared with this catastrophe

Good one!!!!!!!  Smile

I am sure this order will pave the way for KLM to order Embraers as well. It is high time for KLM to replace its regional fleet!!

Well done Embraer.
 
konrad
Posts: 612
Joined: Fri Mar 15, 2002 3:54 am

RE: E-190 For AF R�gional

Tue Sep 06, 2005 9:41 am

Quoting Hardiwv (Reply 23):
AF's E-190 will fly to 45 destinations in France and Europe. AF already has 50 Embraers in its fleet, comprised of EMB 120 Bras�lia, ERJ 135 e ERJ 145.

In that case I hope they hurry to order more then six of them.
 
PPVRA
Posts: 8641
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RE: E-190 For AF Régional

Tue Sep 06, 2005 11:15 am



Modified pic.
 
SonOfACaptain
Posts: 1695
Joined: Thu May 27, 2004 5:36 am

RE: E-190 For AF Régional

Tue Sep 06, 2005 11:28 am

Quoting Mrocktor (Reply 22):
jetBlue has IFE. Whether US will install IFE on their 190s remains to be seen.

I don't consider B6 one of the major US airlines. When I say major, I mean the big boys. I also highly doubt that US will put IFE into their 190s, although there have been talks in the past couple years of puttin PTVs on all their planes.

-SOAC
 
Airline7322
Posts: 104
Joined: Wed Sep 01, 2004 8:42 am

RE: E-190 For AF R�gional

Tue Sep 06, 2005 11:38 am

SOAC, Jetblue was given the major carrier status by the government a few years ago. In fact, they were the quickest airline to achieve this status. They may not be as big, but they certainly are an airline to contend with.
 
SonOfACaptain
Posts: 1695
Joined: Thu May 27, 2004 5:36 am

RE: E-190 For AF Régional

Tue Sep 06, 2005 11:40 am

Quoting Airline7322 (Reply 27):

On paper, yes B6 is a major airline. But I do not consider them to be with the likes of AA or WN.

-SOAC
 
hardiwv
Posts: 4341
Joined: Sat Oct 09, 2004 11:30 pm

RE: E-190 For AF Régional

Tue Sep 06, 2005 4:29 pm

Quoting SonOfACaptain (Reply 26):
I don't consider B6 one of the major US airlines

Certainly B6 is a major, and growing, airline in the US.

Cant wait for KL order of Embraers!

Rgs,
 
LifelinerOne
Posts: 1698
Joined: Tue Nov 25, 2003 10:30 pm

RE: E-190 For AF R�gional

Tue Sep 06, 2005 4:51 pm

Quoting Hardiwv (Reply 29):
Cant wait for KL order of Embraers!

KLM just stated last week that it isn't due to order any new planes anymore for this year to come. When Regional gets a E-190, a Fokker from Regional will move to KLM. I think the Fokkers will be here for a while.

Cheers!  wave 
 
hardiwv
Posts: 4341
Joined: Sat Oct 09, 2004 11:30 pm

RE: E-190 For AF Régional

Tue Sep 06, 2005 4:54 pm

Quoting LifelinerOne (Reply 30):
I think the Fokkers will be here for a while.

Yeah...for one or wto years...they can handle more than that. All major quality airlines, see AA or TAM, are getting rid of their Fokkers...

We will see Embraers in KLM fleet very soon!  Smile

Rgs,
 
LifelinerOne
Posts: 1698
Joined: Tue Nov 25, 2003 10:30 pm

RE: E-190 For AF Régional

Tue Sep 06, 2005 5:11 pm

Quoting Hardiwv (Reply 31):
We will see Embraers in KLM fleet very soon!

Well, I don't know. When is the first E-190 scheduled to be delivered to Regional? And how long will it take to deliver all 6? If it's around 1,5 years, the Fokkers from Regional will be in the KLM fleet for a long time. KLM is also talking to Austrian Airlines and Malev to take over their last Fokker 70's. They are not thinking about the replacement of the Fokkers for at least 5 years to come according to internal plans.

Cheers!  wave 
 
hardiwv
Posts: 4341
Joined: Sat Oct 09, 2004 11:30 pm

RE: E-190 For AF Régional

Tue Sep 06, 2005 5:51 pm

Quoting LifelinerOne (Reply 32):
When is the first E-190 scheduled to be delivered to Regional?

Deliveries to AF will start in January 2007.

Rgs,
 
Gary2880
Posts: 1856
Joined: Wed Aug 18, 2004 8:52 pm

RE: E-190 For AF Régional

Tue Sep 06, 2005 6:34 pm

ABZ????????????????!  hyper   hyper   hyper 
 
erikwilliam
Posts: 2122
Joined: Fri Mar 12, 2004 12:30 am

RE: E-190 For AF Régional

Wed Sep 07, 2005 4:38 am

Quoting Gary2880 (Reply 34):
ABZ????????????????!

meaning???
 
FCKC
Posts: 1631
Joined: Sun Nov 21, 2004 9:39 pm

RE: E-190 For AF Régional

Wed Sep 07, 2005 7:26 am

Erikwilliam

ABZ = Aberdeen
 
BDKLEZ
Posts: 1815
Joined: Sun Jun 26, 2005 11:57 am

RE: E-190 For AF Régional

Wed Sep 07, 2005 7:30 am

Quoting FCKC (Reply 36):
ABZ = Aberdeen

I got that bit, but didn't understand the relevance of....

Quoting Gary2880 (Reply 34):
ABZ????????????????!
 
Squid
Posts: 192
Joined: Sat Jul 02, 2005 4:21 am

RE: E-190 For AF Régional

Wed Sep 07, 2005 1:59 pm

If the airline in Europe can fly the 190/195 as a regional aircraft, I don't see why (I know, scope clause) the US airline cannot. This is going to be a issue the major airlines FORCE down the throats of their pilots and flight attendants, but something that I think must be done.
 
erikwilliam
Posts: 2122
Joined: Fri Mar 12, 2004 12:30 am

RE: E-190 For AF Régional

Thu Sep 08, 2005 9:00 pm

Quoting FCKC (Reply 36):
Erikwilliam

ABZ = Aberdeen

thx for that

Quoting BDKLEZ (Reply 37):
I got that bit, but didn't understand the relevance of....

Quoting Gary2880 (Reply 34):
ABZ????????????????!

Pretty much the same as me.

Guess he´s a really big fan of ABZ and E-190´s Big grin

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