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ukkiwibird
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Unthinkable Markings On 747-400

Sun Nov 06, 2005 4:36 pm

Please take a look at this photo more closely.
My little boy was chuckling as I was having a good look . He said " is that where the plane poo's from?" (very young).
So I enlarged it ,and well see for yourself -
https://www.airliners.net/open.file?id=952193
I didn't know what to say to him, but I suggested it was probably some other type of fluid from hydraulics or something. But he was adamant it was from the toilets and it was poo.
Please someone give us an answer SO we can stop giggling
But the way- cracking photo!
Ukkiwibird
 
flyf15
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RE: Unthinkable Markings On 747-400

Sun Nov 06, 2005 4:42 pm

Those are coffee stains from coffee being poured down drains over time...
 
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HAWK21M
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RE: Unthinkable Markings On 747-400

Sun Nov 06, 2005 5:27 pm


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Looks more like some oil leak.
regds
MEL
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Meridian
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RE: Unthinkable Markings On 747-400

Sun Nov 06, 2005 8:44 pm

Quoting Flyf15 (Reply 1):
Those are coffee stains from coffee being poured down drains over time...

Virgin Cola surely?  Wink
I have to talk to myself. No-one else listens!
 
md80fanatic
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RE: Unthinkable Markings On 747-400

Sun Nov 06, 2005 8:47 pm

Looks like hydraulic fluid to me.
 
HS748
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RE: Unthinkable Markings On 747-400

Sun Nov 06, 2005 8:49 pm

Quoting Meridian (Reply 3):
Virgin Cola surely?



Quoting MD80fanatic (Reply 4):
Looks like hydraulic fluid to me

Virgin cola tastes like hydraulic fluid if you ask me  Wink
 
A319XFW
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RE: Unthinkable Markings On 747-400

Sun Nov 06, 2005 8:50 pm

I would have first suggested some kind of dirt from the runway, but then again it goes clean over the L/G doors (which would have been open then).

Seems to be coming from the 2 square access panels just aft of the wing leading edge.
Perhaps outflow from the aircon? Some dirty passengers on the aircraft if  melting 

You do get 'weeping' rivets on aircraft if they are sticking out a bit and get a black trail behind it, but this is way too big for that.
 
andz
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RE: Unthinkable Markings On 747-400

Sun Nov 06, 2005 9:05 pm

From the title I thought it was an offensive livery!
After Monday and Tuesday even the calendar says WTF...
 
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CCA
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RE: Unthinkable Markings On 747-400

Sun Nov 06, 2005 9:41 pm

As Flyf15 said it's coffee, it's from a drain mast so it contacts the AC further down the fuselage. BA AC shouldn't have the stain as it's the policy of BA to put coffee down the toilet. While CX is another that puts it down the sink.

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A319XFW
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RE: Unthinkable Markings On 747-400

Sun Nov 06, 2005 9:45 pm

I thought all waste (toilets, sink) was collected in a tank and pumped out on the ground? Or is this from the galley sinks that goes out the drain mast?
 
md80fanatic
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RE: Unthinkable Markings On 747-400

Sun Nov 06, 2005 9:52 pm

Coffee stains are really "greenish" in color, aren't they?
 
A319XFW
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RE: Unthinkable Markings On 747-400

Sun Nov 06, 2005 10:03 pm

And isn't coffee slightly corrosive? I remember having to get repairs done on corroded coffee maker rails a few times.
 
andrewuber
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RE: Unthinkable Markings On 747-400

Mon Nov 07, 2005 1:05 am

Lav waste goes into a holding tank, NOT into the atmosphere as a lot of people think. I know this - I employ crews who empty these tanks.   

The stains you see there are quite common - and can be from a variety of things. The drain masts are there, and things dumped from the sinks and galley floors go out onto the belly. Also, lubricants, 5606, even fuel will leave stains on the belly. There are weep holes all over the bellies and wings of jetliners (on fairings and non-pressurized panels, of course), and all kinds of fluids and chemicals find their way out of the aircraft from these holes, and the airflow smears these into enormous stains.

Definately not "poo" though!   

This thread's title was a bit misleading, I was kindof hoping that Ryanair had started flying 744's and had made another variation of the tai logo!      

Drew

[Edited 2005-11-06 17:16:55]
I'd rather shoot BAD_MOTIVE
 
Tod
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RE: Unthinkable Markings On 747-400

Mon Nov 07, 2005 1:08 am

Forward drain mast is located at STA 860, in line with the aft edge of door 2. (There are 2 more aft of the wings)

This drain is connected to the lav sinks, galley sinks and galley floor drains forward of the wings and the upper deck. The stuff poured down the drain will hit the fuselage about where the mess appears on this picture. Boeing has tested a variety of drain masts including very long ones to eliminate this problem, but due to the shape of the fuselage, everything still gets sucked up against it anyway. If you think coffee is messy, wait till you see a plane with more dain line heating, like a 742, after someone dumps wine and milk at the same time. The result looks like cottage cheese.

Tod
 
danialanwar
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RE: Unthinkable Markings On 747-400

Mon Nov 07, 2005 1:40 am

Quoting AndrewUber (Reply 12):
This thread's title was a bit misleading, I was kindof hoping that Ryanair had started flying 744's and had made another variation of the tai logo!



Quoting Andz (Reply 7):
From the title I thought it was an offensive livery!

Agree! When I read the title of the thread, I thought that it couldn't be a 747-400 in Airbus colors ...  stirthepot 
Best Business Class: Royal Brunei. Best Economy: Singapore Airlines. First: please send money first!
 
TPAnx
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RE: Unthinkable Markings On 747-400

Mon Nov 07, 2005 1:49 am

If it was poo..wouldn't it be more blue than brown ?
TPAnx
I read the news today..oh boy
 
sevenheavy
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RE: Unthinkable Markings On 747-400

Mon Nov 07, 2005 1:54 am

It is hydraulic fluid.

You can tell by the reddish tint. It also looks like it is coming from one of the main gear bays which would suggest maybe one of the gear struts was leaking at one time or another. It needs to be scrubbed off once it gets onto a painted surface.

Regards
So long 701, it was nice knowing you.
 
burnsie28
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RE: Unthinkable Markings On 747-400

Mon Nov 07, 2005 1:54 am

Quoting TPAnx (Reply 15):
If it was poo..wouldn't it be more blue than brown ?

Maybe you should see a doctor and get your blue poo check out.  Wink
 
charliecossie
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RE: Unthinkable Markings On 747-400

Mon Nov 07, 2005 2:36 am

Oh for gawds sake!
It's not oil.
It's not hydraulic fluid (neither the purplish nor the reddish version).
It's not poo (neither the blue nor the brown version).
Unless the landing gear has been modified and moved 6 feet forward of it's normal location, it's not from a leg leak.
It's tea/coffee/wine/orange juice or whatever else has come out of the bloody drain mast situated directly in front of the stain.
 
sevenheavy
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RE: Unthinkable Markings On 747-400

Mon Nov 07, 2005 3:38 am

Quoting Charliecossie (Reply 18):
Oh for gawds sake!
It's not oil.
It's not hydraulic fluid (neither the purplish nor the reddish version).
It's not poo (neither the blue nor the brown version).
Unless the landing gear has been modified and moved 6 feet forward of it's normal location, it's not from a leg leak.
It's tea/coffee/wine/orange juice or whatever else has come out of the bloody drain mast situated directly in front of the stain.

On closer inspection I agree.
The reddish tint was what initially threw me
Still, keep calm. It's not the end of the world. At least you got to participate in your hobby (as listed on your profile) today. Wink

Regards
So long 701, it was nice knowing you.
 
JAGflyer
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RE: Unthinkable Markings On 747-400

Mon Nov 07, 2005 3:40 am

I have noticed LY crews pour our coffee carafes in the lav sinks. No stains on this plane.


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md80fanatic
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RE: Unthinkable Markings On 747-400

Mon Nov 07, 2005 3:49 am

I think there are hydraulic pumps and associated plumbing in that area of the wingbox, forward of the gear. I'm not sure about the drain mast's exact location....but if that is what these plane's are dumping, then my first thought would be why? The airline took the effort to lift the clean water into the air for use in the lavs....why can't they take the waste water back to Earth with them?
 
ChiGB1973
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RE: Unthinkable Markings On 747-400

Mon Nov 07, 2005 4:06 am

Quoting Andz (Reply 7):
From the title I thought it was an offensive livery!

I was hoping for it!

If it were coffee, there would be stains on most every plane out there.

At TZ, it was much better not to pour coffee down the drains, especially if there were any grains in the pot. People did it anyway. Come to think of it, had they listened to me about the coffee, scheduled service might be making money.

There was a rule about dumping it down the drain on the ground, it burned a few rampers.

M
 
Geo772
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RE: Unthinkable Markings On 747-400

Mon Nov 07, 2005 4:17 am

Quoting A319XFW (Reply 9):
BA AC shouldn't have the stain as it's the policy of BA to put coffee down the toilet.

If that is policy then many crews still do not adhere to it.
Flown on A300B4/600,A319/20/21,A332/3,A343,B727,B732/3/4/5/6/7/8,B741/2/4,B752/3,B762/3,B772/3,DC10,L1011-200,VC10,MD80,
 
wdleiser
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RE: Unthinkable Markings On 747-400

Mon Nov 07, 2005 4:21 am

Quoting Charliecossie (Reply 18):
It's not poo (neither the blue nor the brown version).

What about the green or baby shit yellow kind?

Also, most new planes dont have the blue liquid anymore.


Now, when you pour something down the sink .... does it go out a hole in the belly?
 
soaringadi
Posts: 452
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RE: Unthinkable Markings On 747-400

Mon Nov 07, 2005 4:28 am

If you think its dirty and you care so much.... go ahead and clean it.
Don't **** and **** about it.
If it ain't Boeing, I'm not going !
 
G-CIVP
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RE: Unthinkable Markings On 747-400

Mon Nov 07, 2005 4:31 am

If you ever got close enough to Concorde, there were coffee stains on the underside.

I bet this starts a debate and a half! GDB standby!
 
sevenforeseven
Posts: 124
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RE: Unthinkable Markings On 747-400

Mon Nov 07, 2005 5:18 am

The stains are coffee, or Virgin Cola or any thing poured down the sinks. Not what your son says as the outlet extractor vent for the Lav on a B747-400 and Airbus are on the left hand side of the fuselage towards the rearmost of the ship.
 
bredman1
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RE: Unthinkable Markings On 747-400

Mon Nov 07, 2005 5:40 am

It is 5606 Hyd fluid that is used in the landing gear struts. Skydrol is used in the rest of the aircraft and is clear or light green.
 
PIA777
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RE: Unthinkable Markings On 747-400

Mon Nov 07, 2005 6:45 am

Looks like track marks to me also. They need to change the planes underwear.

PIA777
GO CUBS!!
 
jetdoctor
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RE: Unthinkable Markings On 747-400

Mon Nov 07, 2005 7:05 am

These are definately coffee/cola/beverage stains, as occasionally I have had to clean these off of aircraft, as the crew sometimes mistaken them to birdstrikes.
Also, the stains don't necessarily start right after the drain, but a few feet back or more.
As far as that it is corrosive, maybe to untreated aluminum, but where you see the streak, it is on non-metallic fuselage fairings, and on primed and painted metal. (even AA's planes are protected)

And finally, if you are over a town or city you hate, pee in the sink. That will vent overboard. As for butt nuggets, they are collected by some poor sole on the ground, with the title of lav service guy.

Regards,
JetDoctor
Break ground, and head into the wind. Don't break wind and head into the ground.
 
martinairyyz
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RE: Unthinkable Markings On 747-400

Mon Nov 07, 2005 7:21 am

Quoting JAGflyer (Reply 20):
have noticed LY crews pour our coffee carafes in the lav sinks. No stains on this plane.

I noticed that for about 1000 other airlines too.... your point???


I have to say, blue poo might taste like Vigin Cola  Smile
Chelsea Football Club supporter.
 
UALDUDE
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RE: Unthinkable Markings On 747-400

Mon Nov 07, 2005 7:27 am

The first poster was right, coffee stains. They are on a lot of airplanes if you look. Some airlines just clean their planes more often than others.
 
BOS2LAF
Posts: 353
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RE: Unthinkable Markings On 747-400

Mon Nov 07, 2005 7:30 am

Quoting Jetdoctor (Reply 30):
And finally, if you are over a town or city you hate, pee in the sink. That will vent overboard. As for butt nuggets, they are collected by some poor sole on the ground, with the title of lav service guy.

 laughing  laughing  laughing 

That just made my day. I've never heard the expression 'butt nuggets' before in my life, and I just about choked on my soda when I read that.  rotfl 
 
Ilovenz
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RE: Unthinkable Markings On 747-400

Mon Nov 07, 2005 7:34 am

Call me ignorant, but I'm surprised in-flight beverages would leave such durable stains on the underside of an aircraft. I've always assumed those marks were from rivulets of hydraulic fluid.

Sam
 
jetdoctor
Posts: 220
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RE: Unthinkable Markings On 747-400

Mon Nov 07, 2005 7:43 am

Sam,

You are not ignorant, but a simple test is to:

Fill up a white mug with hot coffee
Let it sit a day or two
Pour it out and repeat the cycle a few times
You WILL start to see a nasty browish stain in the mug if you don't clean it well.

Better yet, look at an old coffee maker pot, or even a regular coffee drinkers' teeth uggghh

Regards
Jetdoctor

BOS2LAF : Glad you like the Butt Nuggets, that is a term I have used for years!!  yuck 
Break ground, and head into the wind. Don't break wind and head into the ground.
 
jetdeltamsy
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RE: Unthinkable Markings On 747-400

Mon Nov 07, 2005 7:55 am

Quoting Flyf15 (Reply 1):
Those are coffee stains from coffee being poured down drains over time...

You can't be serious.

All waste goes into a holding tank and is emptied (usually) at the aircraft's destination.

Nothing gets put into the environment ever. Except, of course, fuel in an emergency situation.
Tired of airline bankruptcies....EA/PA/TW and finally DL.
 
jetdoctor
Posts: 220
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RE: Unthinkable Markings On 747-400

Mon Nov 07, 2005 8:09 am

Jetdeltamsy

You are mistaken my friend. Only lav waste is put in a holding tank, all other waste (grey water) is vented overboard by means of heated drain masts. the sorces being the sink drains, and galley drains. Only water (and occational soap suds) are supposed to be vented, yet crews do pour coffee and other colorful fluids down there.
Trust me I have worked on these planes for almost 15 years

Regards
JetDoctor
Break ground, and head into the wind. Don't break wind and head into the ground.
 
jetdoctor
Posts: 220
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RE: Unthinkable Markings On 747-400

Mon Nov 07, 2005 8:12 am

Jetdeltamsy

You seem to be a flight attendant, I have a test for you;
Fill up a sink in the aircraft with water (or coffee if you wish, although I don't suggest this)
Go out on the ramp, to the respected drain mast and have a fellow co-worker dump the drain.
You will see the aircraft urinating, I promise you that.

Regards
Jetdoctor
Break ground, and head into the wind. Don't break wind and head into the ground.
 
crogalski
Posts: 477
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RE: Unthinkable Markings On 747-400

Mon Nov 07, 2005 8:32 am

Quoting Jetdoctor (Reply 38):
Go out on the ramp, to the respected drain mast and have a fellow co-worker dump the drain.
You will see the aircraft urinating, I promise you that.

haha, so thats the shit that always gets on me from that tube, when im near the aft of the a/c
A319 A320 A321 A330 B717 B727 B737 B747 B757 B767 CRJ200 CRJ700 CRJ900 DC9 E145 E190 MD88 Q400 | AA AB B6 CO DL EI FL NK
 
ChiGB1973
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RE: Unthinkable Markings On 747-400

Mon Nov 07, 2005 8:51 am

Quoting Jetdeltamsy (Reply 36):
You can't be serious.

All waste goes into a holding tank and is emptied (usually) at the aircraft's destination.

Nothing gets put into the environment ever. Except, of course, fuel in an emergency situation.

As I said above, TZ had a policy of not dumping coffee down sink drains on the ground as several rampers got burned.

Of course, some flight attendants continued to pour orange juice down the drain saying, "it's not coffee." Well, I am sure the rampers did not appreciate the OJ either, but at least it didn't burn them.

M
 
eilennaei
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RE: Unthinkable Markings On 747-400

Mon Nov 07, 2005 9:13 am

Some more coffee stains:


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Leezyjet
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RE: Unthinkable Markings On 747-400

Mon Nov 07, 2005 9:45 am

On a cold day if you look closely when the a/c is on the ground you can see the steam coming off the hot liquids that come out of the drain mast.

I hate it though on really windy days, as the liquid is blown by the wind, it breaks up into droplets that you cannot see. As you are walking along all of a sudden - SPLAT - you get a soaking of whatever has come out of the mast - not exactly nice either especially to a coffee hater like me !!!. Even when you give them a really wide berth you still get caught out once in a while !!.

 Smile
"She Rolls, 45 knots, 90, 135, nose comes up to 20 degrees, she's airborne - She flies, Concorde Flies"
 
ukkiwibird
Topic Author
Posts: 44
Joined: Sun Oct 23, 2005 2:48 pm

RE: Unthinkable Markings On 747-400

Mon Nov 07, 2005 11:17 am

Well thanks guy's.
All I can say is if it's coffee and coke ,god knows what our insides must look like!
Little man is happy with the probable reasons ,although, he would have preferred it to be poo.

And another question , Are there any restrictions on what a carrier CANNOT throw out through it's structure
Thanks ukkiwibird
 
skyhigh777
Posts: 335
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RE: Unthinkable Markings On 747-400

Mon Nov 07, 2005 11:35 am

It's poo...Yup, definately poo. I'm almost 100% sure.
 
Pomnath
Posts: 384
Joined: Sat Oct 01, 2005 6:55 am

RE: Unthinkable Markings On 747-400

Mon Nov 07, 2005 12:54 pm

I think it could it be the remnants of a passenger who dared to complain about the service on board.

Truth be told, I have never seen such marks on any modern aircraft on the ground. And if that was coffee, then it would be one huge big pot of java.

More likely a maintenance related oil stain. You will see similar marks on older planes with leaky hydraulics. I think VS owes a.net an answer.
Sea to Sky, Racists should Die!!
 
mig21umd
Posts: 318
Joined: Wed Feb 16, 2005 6:30 pm

RE: Unthinkable Markings On 747-400

Mon Nov 07, 2005 12:55 pm

The coffee stains are a major problem because it is impossible to clean off.

The QF A330 had this problem from the beginning and I hear that the engineers tried every cleaning chemical to no avail.

It is now QF procedure not to pore any coffee into the sink of the A330's.
Once you have tasted flight, you will forever walk the earth with your eyes turned skyward, for there you long to return
 
gmidy
Posts: 48
Joined: Mon Jun 13, 2005 12:25 am

RE: Unthinkable Markings On 747-400

Mon Nov 07, 2005 1:16 pm

I think smelling it will reveal this conspiracy!!!
Lawrence
 
simes
Posts: 35
Joined: Sun May 29, 2005 11:04 pm

RE: Unthinkable Markings On 747-400

Mon Nov 07, 2005 3:50 pm

Quoting Mig21UMD (Reply 46):
The coffee stains are a major problem because it is impossible to clean off.

The QF A330 had this problem from the beginning and I hear that the engineers tried every cleaning chemical to no avail.

It is now QF procedure not to pore any coffee into the sink of the A330's.

How about on the rest of the fleet?
 
Tod
Posts: 1716
Joined: Sat Aug 28, 2004 6:51 am

RE: Unthinkable Markings On 747-400

Tue Nov 08, 2005 12:22 am

Quoting TPAnx (Reply 15):
If it was poo..wouldn't it be more blue than brown ?

744 uses a vacuum waste sytem - no blue juice in lavs.

Quoting JAGflyer (Reply 20):
I have noticed LY crews pour our coffee carafes in the lav sinks. No stains on this plane.

Different fuselage and drain mast - aero properties are different and crud isn't sucked as hard against the fuselage.

Quoting MD80fanatic (Reply 21):
I'm not sure about the drain mast's exact location.

744 drain mast locations:
Forward mast - STA 860 / LBL 40
Mid mast - STA 1830 / BL 0
Aft mast - STA 2310 / LBL 10

Quoting MD80fanatic (Reply 21):
why can't they take the waste water back to Earth with them?

They could, but weight is money.

Quoting Jetdeltamsy (Reply 36):
All waste goes into a holding tank and is emptied (usually) at the aircraft's destination.

Only the poopy stuff.

Quoting Jetdeltamsy (Reply 36):
Nothing gets put into the environment ever.

Recycled straight into the wild blue yander.

Quoting SkyHigh777 (Reply 44):
It's poo...Yup, definately poo. I'm almost 100% sure.

The four poo tanks are at the other end of the plane and the plumbing never even get close to the bottom of the plane until then.

Tod

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