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BOAC911
Posts: 280
Joined: Sun Sep 19, 2004 9:47 pm

RE: SK To End Intercontinental Flights In 10 Years?

Mon Nov 28, 2005 1:05 am

Actually SAS is the more inexpensive option for many Frankfurt residents. I consistently chose SAS for Trans Atlantic travel for its competitve fares and far superior business class service. Although SAS has a limited number of US gateways, however cabin crew are alsways very friendly and efficient. LH frequently gouges the Frankfurt market when it comes to nonstop flights, and I find them increasingly arrogant.
 
scalebuilder
Posts: 605
Joined: Thu Nov 24, 2005 10:32 pm

RE: SK To End Intercontinental Flights In 10 Years?

Mon Nov 28, 2005 1:10 am

Quoting Hodja (Reply 98):
I used to think that too. But frankly I'm starting to care less and less.

I think it is a shame that you do. Think of all the businesses within Scandinavia that have come to depend on this airline for their transportation needs. They simply could not do without it, and SAS can't do this unless they make money.

Quoting Matt27 (Reply 99):
Historically SAS has never been the broad popular choice of the major part of the scandinavian population (at least not in DK);

So let's change that. I have heard this quoted for years, and I am frankly puzzled why SAS has chosen not to do anything about it. Not easy by any means, but at least we know where this airline rates with the common traveler out there. SAS simply knows where it stands too.

Quoting Lufthansa (Reply 2):
think SK need a completely new business model because the old one clearly isn't working.

This is from one of the early posts within this dicussion, and I think this is what SAS needs. It is challenging from the start because the carrier is multilateral, but let's keep this company as simple as possible. As a start, let's invent one way of traveling with this airline that the customer can identify with and enjoy. They will likely come back.

Quoting Scalebuilder (Reply 27):
The same thing happens if you go to a travel agent. They never look up SAS' prices or schedules

Huge problem for SAS. If travel agents avoid you, who will really seek you? Instead of maintaining multiple brands, SAS needs to build a strong travel brand out there that people want, and that agents want to sell.

In the early 80's Jan Carlzon reinvented SAS not just as the "Business Man's" airline, but also for SAS to be a dynamic and adaptible airline. This guy just did a fabolous job! Even though this "Business man's" concept is not appropriate for this day and age, maybe it is time for SAS to reinvent itself.. again...to rebuild that organization that used to be adaptible...  Wink
Go the extra mile......and avoid the traffic!!!
 
copenhagenboy
Posts: 543
Joined: Fri Sep 14, 2001 11:03 pm

RE: SK To End Intercontinental Flights In 10 Years?

Mon Nov 28, 2005 2:36 am

"I'm tired of paying clearly non-competitve prices on SK longhaul. For pretty much any destination worldwide I can get a cheaper quote from LH, KL/AF or BA. For instance, why is CPH-NRT consistently DKK2-3000 more expensive than BA or KL?"

Good for SAS they can take that prices and still fill the flights  
But to be honest, I often pay less on SAS than I would have on LH, KL and so on. I think it depends on when and where you are travelling. Living in the Copenhagen area, I am also willing to pay around 500 DKK more to fly direct to New York or Bangkok, than to make a stopover. Having said that, it is quite normal that tickets are cheaper on an airline outside their homemarket. Some years ago I met a girl from Nice, on the island Koh Chang in Thailand. The best deal she had and bought was Nice-CPH-BKK. I had to pay 1000 DKK more to fly direct CPH-BKK than here, so I choosed LH CPH-FRA-BKK. I have never understood the nature of pricesettings, I think you need a special education.

[Edited 2005-11-27 18:40:37]
 
Tango-Bravo
Posts: 2941
Joined: Sun Jun 17, 2001 1:04 am

RE: SK To End Intercontinental Flights In 10 Years?

Mon Nov 28, 2005 3:04 am

Quoting Scalebuilder (Reply 93):
The organization is messy, it is over-branded, and has too many bells and whistles to keep track of.

A fitting description of the U.S. leagcies who are in either in bankruptcy or continue to lose money profusely in spite of all-time record demand. If this is actually true of SAS as well, then it is no wonder that they also have found it exceedingly difficult to avoid losing money, much less post profits consistently.
 
scalebuilder
Posts: 605
Joined: Thu Nov 24, 2005 10:32 pm

RE: SK To End Intercontinental Flights In 10 Years?

Mon Nov 28, 2005 5:31 am

Quoting Tango-Bravo (Reply 103):
A fitting description of the U.S. leagcies who are in either in bankruptcy or continue to lose money profusely in spite of all-time record demand. If this is actually true of SAS as well, then it is no wonder that they also have found it exceedingly difficult to avoid losing money, much less post profits consistently

Same situation in Europe as it is here in the states Tango-Bravo..except we are looking at an area that could not easily lose their airline and cope with it. It is simply too important. No other immediate players that could quickly move in to cover demand either.

Like in the states, unions in three different countries have become difficult to manage effectively for SAS. There seems to be somebody striking all the time. They should know better. They know their employer is ailing, vulnerable and needed.

The stubborness of the unions is what in my mind has brought disaster to US domestic airlines. The funding obligation to pension plans for both current and past employees is simply unbelievable. Very few in corporate America even enjoy these kind of benefits anymore. The unions have obviously decided to stick with these demands, even if it comes at the cost of ultimately bringing the airline down.

Before I go on I should acknowledge that this is likely a discussion more appropriate under a different thread

 smile 
Go the extra mile......and avoid the traffic!!!
 
babybus
Posts: 2379
Joined: Sun Dec 28, 2003 5:07 am

RE: SK To End Intercontinental Flights In 10 Years?

Mon Nov 28, 2005 7:56 am

We really need a fully qualified aviation economist to hand on this site.

Everyone has their own story. It is said that SQ and EK are highly profitable because they operate wholly international flights. SK however, would seem to claim that long haul flights are stripping them of cash. Which account is correct?

The only times I've flown with SK has been on staff tickets.

Maybe all airlines will eventually revert to the old BOAC/BEA arrangement. A long haul and a short haul arm.
and with that..cabin crew, seats for landing please.
 
Tango-Bravo
Posts: 2941
Joined: Sun Jun 17, 2001 1:04 am

RE: SK To End Intercontinental Flights In 10 Years?

Mon Nov 28, 2005 10:52 am

Quoting Hodja (Reply 98):
I'm tired of paying clearly non-competitve prices on SK longhaul. For pretty much any destination worldwide I can get a cheaper quote from LH, KL/AF or BA. For instance, why is CPH-NRT consistently DKK2-3000 more expensive than BA or KL?

Which means SAS is obviously doing something right on their longhauls, given the apparent fact that their longhaul load factors seem to be comparable to, if not greater than, those of their allegedly lower-priced competitors.
 
mikkel777
Posts: 361
Joined: Thu Oct 03, 2002 1:15 am

RE: SK To End Intercontinental Flights In 10 Years?

Mon Nov 28, 2005 11:11 am

Quoting Hodja (Reply 98):
In NO Braathens + Widerøe could handle domestic, and Cimber Air could handle DK domestic.

There are no such thing as Braathens anymore. Planes and staff are absorbed in BUSK, part of Scandinavian AB. WF is also fully owned by Scandinavian AB. If the whole company goes down, I guess Norway is left with Katoair, Coast Air, Norwegian and DAT?

Anyway, SK does not fold. If things gets really bad, they will cut the unprofitable parts of the company. BUSK and WF would proably go last.
I suspect a weakeing of the CPH hub in the future, and more routes from NO and SE direct to bigger cities in Europe. Hopefully, there will also be an intercontinental expantion. The size today is in the middle of nowhere. It either has to be downgauged, or number of destinations and product quality has to be increased. SK's C-class will finally recive a new seat soon, too bad it will not match the best C-seats around, it will only be lie-flast-at-an-angle-and-slide-to-the-floor.
 
hodja
Posts: 79
Joined: Sun Apr 04, 2004 6:41 am

RE: SK To End Intercontinental Flights In 10 Years?

Mon Nov 28, 2005 5:28 pm

Quoting Tango-Bravo (Reply 106):
Which means SAS is obviously doing something right on their longhauls

Not according to the CEO, who publicly claims longhauls currently doesn't earn SK a cent...

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