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Cathay LHR-JFK
I recall that in order for VS to be given the rights to fly HKG-SYD, Cathay was given the rights to fly LHR-JFK... and yet it seems that they haven't taken up that option. Anyone know why? Any plans to start this route?
cabin crew: doors to automatic and cross-check...
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- carledwards
- Posts: 215
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RE: Cathay LHR-JFK
that would be great; since if this were to happen I believe they would be the first airline to offer a round the world service (correct me if im wrong please!?)
However I can imagine that it would be quite difficult for Cathay to make this route profitable, as I cannot think of any need for them to have their own passengers connecting on this flight to other services.
The only way it would work is if it was a BA/QF/CX One World code share.
It also would not be of any use to Cathay frequent flyers since their oneworld benefits should be valid on BA anyway?
The only bonus in their favour is LHR-JFK is a profitable route regardless, and if they offer good fares, people will buy them. But in my experience Cathay are never cheap!
Im not sure ths route will ever happen to be honest, even though it is a nice idea.
However I can imagine that it would be quite difficult for Cathay to make this route profitable, as I cannot think of any need for them to have their own passengers connecting on this flight to other services.
The only way it would work is if it was a BA/QF/CX One World code share.
It also would not be of any use to Cathay frequent flyers since their oneworld benefits should be valid on BA anyway?
The only bonus in their favour is LHR-JFK is a profitable route regardless, and if they offer good fares, people will buy them. But in my experience Cathay are never cheap!
Im not sure ths route will ever happen to be honest, even though it is a nice idea.
Extraordinary World
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- BestWestern
- Posts: 8358
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RE: Cathay LHR-JFK
| Quoting Carledwards (Reply 1): The only bonus in their favour is LHR-JFK is a profitable route regardless |
Tell that to United, who have just halved their schedule to Heathrow - now just daily.
Greetings from Hong Kong.... a subsidiary of China Inc.
RE: Cathay LHR-JFK
| Quoting Carledwards (Reply 1): that would be great; since if this were to happen I believe they would be the first airline to offer a round the world service (correct me if im wrong please!?) |
Doesn't SQ fly SIN-FRA-JFK?
Last flight: SAW-CPH on H9 on 02/11/09 - Next Flights: 23/12/09 CPH-AAL on QI, 30/12/09 CPH-LHR on SK, 19/01/10 CPH-CDG-
RE: Cathay LHR-JFK
Actually I believe China Airlines had a round the world at one point.. correct me if I'm wrong, but IIRC that was the case.
I don't really see why they should start that service though from JFK-LHR.
I don't really see why they should start that service though from JFK-LHR.
RE: Cathay LHR-JFK
I am sure I heard somewhere that CX had not taken up this plan due to a lack of slots at suitable times...
From the construction site that is better-known as London Heathrow Airport
RE: Cathay LHR-JFK
I'm not sure the EU has approved it yet....
"Millions long for immortality who do not know what to do with themselves on a rainy Sunday afternoon"
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- PlaneGuy27
- Posts: 289
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RE: Cathay LHR-JFK
A couple of issues:
- Slots - Why would Cathay want to shuffle any slots around from the valuable HKG-LHR route for JFK-LHR. If they are able to get more slots, then it would change....
- I have a feeling BA and AA, as key oneworld members, would not be happy at all to have CX on this route. Even though CX could do a frequency to start, BA/AA market dominance and service coupled with CX doing this on a fifth freedom basis would spell disaster for CX
- CX already has two daily flights into JFK with a nonstop and a onestop. Would it even be needed right now? Still, JFK-LHR isn't a bad little route authority to hold on to!
- Slots - Why would Cathay want to shuffle any slots around from the valuable HKG-LHR route for JFK-LHR. If they are able to get more slots, then it would change....
- I have a feeling BA and AA, as key oneworld members, would not be happy at all to have CX on this route. Even though CX could do a frequency to start, BA/AA market dominance and service coupled with CX doing this on a fifth freedom basis would spell disaster for CX
- CX already has two daily flights into JFK with a nonstop and a onestop. Would it even be needed right now? Still, JFK-LHR isn't a bad little route authority to hold on to!
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- Flying Belgian
- Posts: 1958
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RE: Cathay LHR-JFK
What about SQ ? Sorry to be off-topic, but was it not in SQ's plans to fly on the lucrative LHR-JFK route ?
FB.
FB.
Life is great at 41.000 feet...
RE: Cathay LHR-JFK
| Quoting PlaneGuy27 (Reply 8): - CX already has two daily flights into JFK with a nonstop and a onestop. Would it even be needed right now? Still, JFK-LHR isn't a bad little route authority to hold on to! |
JFK-LHR wouldn't be started to feed pax from HKG onto JFK....It would exist for NYC-London traffic, of which there is TONS.
"Millions long for immortality who do not know what to do with themselves on a rainy Sunday afternoon"
RE: Cathay LHR-JFK
it would seem to have limited strategic value as a route other than just opportunism -- ie a route with potnetially good loads and good profits. However, who cares if it earns them money. Still. If they can't get slots, it's all a bit academic!
cabin crew: doors to automatic and cross-check...
RE: Cathay LHR-JFK
Hi
Pan Am and United both used to have a round the world service.
Rich
Pan Am and United both used to have a round the world service.
Rich
RE: Cathay LHR-JFK
Didn't I hear earlier that CX couldn't get slots at LHR the time they wanted out of LHR-JFK route? Also mentioned earlier, with such route, CX would require 2 daily slots at LHR, which may be better used with 2 daily LHR-HKG flights at this point.
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- fbgdavidson
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RE: Cathay LHR-JFK
And for us BA Exec Club folks we can use BA miles to fly CX F to the US East Coast 
"My first job was selling doors, door to door, that's a tough job innit" - Bill Bailey
RE: Cathay LHR-JFK
"Tell that to United, who have just halved their schedule to Heathrow - now just daily."
Actually, you should cite BA, AA, and VS, all which have multiple daily widebody service on a mix of 777s, 747s, and A340s. No small planes on that route. AA is 6 daily 777s. I believe BA is 7 daily. VS has 2 or 3 daily.
UA can't seem to make anything work . . . even bankruptcy takes 37 months. But just for the hell of it, UA couldn't make:
BOS DL/AA/B6
SEA DL/AA/B6
DEN B6
S. America DL/AA/Varig/TACA . . .
HKG CX
SJU DL/AA/B6
work out of JFK either. Funny how other airlines can
PJ
Actually, you should cite BA, AA, and VS, all which have multiple daily widebody service on a mix of 777s, 747s, and A340s. No small planes on that route. AA is 6 daily 777s. I believe BA is 7 daily. VS has 2 or 3 daily.
UA can't seem to make anything work . . . even bankruptcy takes 37 months. But just for the hell of it, UA couldn't make:
BOS DL/AA/B6
SEA DL/AA/B6
DEN B6
S. America DL/AA/Varig/TACA . . .
HKG CX
SJU DL/AA/B6
work out of JFK either. Funny how other airlines can
PJ
RE: Cathay LHR-JFK
Am I not right in saying that QF also hold rights for LHR-JFK? If so then they would also be able to offer round-the-world service
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- planespotting
- Posts: 3026
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RE: Cathay LHR-JFK
| Quoting JFKLGANYC (Reply 16): UA can't seem to make anything work |
Even lucrative, dense markets have their caps, especially considering all of those airports you listed (sans Denver) are pretty much dominated by airlines other than UA (AA and AS in SEA, AA and DL in BOS, AA in SJU, etc...). Historically, most of UA's main frequent fliers and base have been in the midwest and the west coast (evidenced by their largest hubs @ SFO, DEN and ORD). AA, DL and B6 all have much stronger customer bases on the East Coast, and therefore would have a better chance of making more flights to and from JFK work.
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RE: Cathay LHR-JFK
| Quoting Carledwards (Reply 1): But in my experience Cathay are never cheap! |
I'm looking at booking a trip home in Dec-06 for my wedding in New York and right now they are cheapest option for premium cabins from SYD-JFK with a change in HKG.
I agree with the posters above, if Cathay is able to launch this route and allowed to code share with AA and BA, then they should do it. They would pique enough interest offering round-the-world flights with 3-5 day layovers in some of the world's finest cities.
If they cannot code share, then why bother.
Keep on truckin'...
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- planemanofnz
- Posts: 4383
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RE: Cathay LHR-JFK
NZ will hopefully have a new round-the-world route if everything goes to plan in the next couple of months. Plan is AKL-HKG-(Gatwick or Heathrow)-LAX-AKL.
CX would be better using their time and energy elsewhere I think. OW already has LHR-JFK covered.
CX would be better using their time and energy elsewhere I think. OW already has LHR-JFK covered.
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- iowa744fan
- Posts: 906
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RE: Cathay LHR-JFK
| Quoting HZ747300 (Reply 19): I'm looking at booking a trip home in Dec-06 for my wedding in New York and right now they are cheapest option for premium cabins from SYD-JFK with a change in HKG. |
HZ747300,
If you take CX, are you planning to take 831 nonstop to HKG and then transfer to 101 onto SYD or are you looking at 889 through YVR to HKG and then connecting to 139 to SYD? According to my computer, the first option is two 346s and the second in December of next year is to be a 744 and a 333. According to my computer, 889 gets upgraded to a 744 on 29 Oct. Anyone else get this too?
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- iowa744fan
- Posts: 906
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RE: Cathay LHR-JFK
Also, I think that CX should go for the LHRJFK route. There is no doubt in my mind that they can get plenty of the high yield traffic on this route with their high quality of service.
Not to get off the thread, but whatever happened to the second daily SFOHKG flight that I thought CX was planning?
Not to get off the thread, but whatever happened to the second daily SFOHKG flight that I thought CX was planning?
RE: Cathay LHR-JFK
I don't doubt CX could find success on this route. AA frequent flyers, prevented from getting credit for flying BA over the Atlantic, and continually dissatisfied with their own airline's subpar business cabin, would probably flock to CX.
Aaron G.
Aaron G.
RE: Cathay LHR-JFK
| Quoting Vincewy (Reply 13): Didn't I hear earlier that CX couldn't get slots at LHR the time they wanted out of LHR-JFK route? Also mentioned earlier, with such route, CX would require 2 daily slots at LHR, which may be better used with 2 daily LHR-HKG flights at this point. |
CX flies to London four times a day already from HKG, I doubt they can up it much beyond the current setup.
RE: Cathay LHR-JFK
| Quoting Iowa744fan (Reply 21): HZ747300, If you take CX, are you planning to take 831 nonstop to HKG and then transfer to 101 onto SYD or are you looking at 889 through YVR to HKG and then connecting to 139 to SYD? ... |
My plan was to fly the weekend before, 25/11/06, and the appeal of the CX flight was the chance to fly on the A346 direct from HKG to JFK. From SYD to HKG, the later flight in the evening was preferred (10pm-ish), set now as an A333 on Expedia.
Keep on truckin'...
RE: Cathay LHR-JFK
SQ will be able to offer RTW when they commence SIN-JFK some time this year. Yes...With more A345s which they are gonna lease from somewhere before the 772LR takes over.
RE: Cathay LHR-JFK
| Quoting BA380 (Thread starter): and yet it seems that they haven't taken up that option. Anyone know why? Any plans to start this route? |
CX wants to start this, but they can't get the slots at LHR.
| Quoting Carledwards (Reply 1): they would be the first airline to offer a round the world service (correct me if im wrong please!?) |
Sorry, but no. PAA was the first, and then several airlines later on joined the "round-the-world club"....TW, QF, BOAC, CI, UA, possibly one or two more that I can't think of right now, eventually all discontinued. UA was the most recent one (and only).
| Quoting Carledwards (Reply 1): The only way it would work is if it was a BA/QF/CX One World code share |
Not necessarily. However, I have speculated with my friend at CX that one way CX might get the needed slots at LHR would be to buy them from AA, who could certainly use the cash, and then for AA to codeshare on the CX flight, and thus not lose a frequency, but reduce their capacity a bit.
| Quoting CPH757 (Reply 3): Doesn't SQ fly SIN-FRA-JFK? |
| Quoting Jakob77 (Reply 4): yes but the 345 non-stop is SIN - EWR |
Jakob77 is quite right...since one flight goes to EWR and the other to JFK, this is technically not a RTW service.
| Quoting LeonB1985 (Reply 6): I am sure I heard somewhere that CX had not taken up this plan due to a lack of slots at suitable times... |
Quite right, see above.
| Quoting RJpieces (Reply 7): I'm not sure the EU has approved it yet.... |
I don't THINK EU approval was necessary (I can't remember), but if it was, they got it, because all necessary approvals were granted, it's now just a slots issue @ LHR.
| Quoting PlaneGuy27 (Reply 8): - CX already has two daily flights into JFK with a nonstop and a onestop. Would it even be needed right now? |
If they get the LHR slots issue sorted out, I'm not sure what will happen with the one-stop currently over YVR...maybe it would be shifted to be over LHR? CX is also planning a 2nd daily nonstop HKG-JFK for later this year.
| Quoting Flying Belgian (Reply 9): What about SQ ? Sorry to be off-topic, but was it not in SQ's plans to fly on the lucrative LHR-JFK route ? |
They do not have traffic rights for this.
| Quoting RJpieces (Reply 10): JFK-LHR wouldn't be started to feed pax from HKG onto JFK....It would exist for NYC-London traffic, of which there is TONS. |
True, but see above, they might shift HKG-YVR-JFK to be HKG-LHR-JFK, as the local traffic LHR-JFK would be much more lucrative than YVR-JFK.
| Quoting EIRules (Reply 17): Am I not right in saying that QF also hold rights for LHR-JFK? |
I don't think they have ANY traffic rights between anywhere in the US and anywhere in Europe; back when QF did RTW, it was routed via Mexico and either NAS or BDA, I can't remember which.
I think I've got all my facts right in my above comments; if not please correct me.
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