Rail & Fly From Airlines And Deutsche Bahn

NumberTwelve · Mon Jan 30, 2006 9:15 pm

Hi there,
on homepage of Deutsche Bahn (German railway system), the railway company informs about airlines which are Rail & Fly partners.
Rail & Fly is a service from DB and airlines to their passengers to bring them to their German origin (or AMS) by train.
As far as I know, Aerolineas Argentinas isn't flying to Germany any longer - so why do they have this agreement? The URL has been updated this month.

Any idea?

http://www.bahn.de/-S:PtVOZ9:dJEPt9N.../MDB19254-airlines_januar_2006.pdf

[Edited 2006-01-30 13:30:21]

StarFlyer · Mon Jan 30, 2006 11:02 pm

Possibly a mistake?

Could also be that AR sells tix from Railways Germany to a German airport on DB from where they have code-share operations.

NumberTwelve · Mon Jan 30, 2006 11:07 pm

Thanks a lot, StarFlyer,
means: AR partner ex Germany with AR documents and/or AR flight number also would be possible with Rail&Fly?

Comfortzone · Mon Jan 30, 2006 11:12 pm

Well, AR is flying to/from Germany - there is a feeder to MAD by Air Plus Comet with AR flight number:

1A7*AR1121 7 MUC 1 MAD 1 1145 1405 0 CONNECT MAD M88
AR1139 7 MAD 1 EZE 1530 2355 0 29JAN06 05FEB06 744 16:10

NumberTwelve · Mon Jan 30, 2006 11:15 pm

Cool, TUIman, so a train feeder for AR makes sence (even if departure airport is "only" MUC).
Thanks a lot for the info.

leftshoe · Mon Jan 30, 2006 11:31 pm

Quoting NumberTwelve (Reply 2):
AR partner ex Germany with AR documents and/or AR flight number also would be possible with Rail&Fly?

You are probably right. I remember that a friend of mine went to MUC by train to connect to an AR flight to MAD and EZE. I'm not totally sure anymore, but I think he had Rail&Fly.

View Large View Medium
Click here for bigger photo!

Photo © Michael Fritz

Are you thinking about going to Germany with AR?

aircanada014 · Mon Jan 30, 2006 11:36 pm

I wonder why UA and NW wasn't on the list and they both do fly to FRA right?
I know for sure UA does just wasn't sure about NW but it seems logic they do.

NumberTwelve · Mon Jan 30, 2006 11:40 pm

I also don't understand it, because they can't loose anything. And Rail&Fly is very popular in Germany because train feeder is very very cheap.
Ok, there are airlines who offer train feeder for free in Germany, f.e.
Qantas, Air Namibia, American Airlines, China Airlines etc. But airlines can charge customer if they don't want to pay the costs themselves.
But you're right: UA and NW are flying to Germany and don't have Rail&Fly agreement.
I guess, UA only wants to use LH's flight feeder (but LH offers Rail&Fly, too) but what about NW?
Anyway: they don't offer it.

[Edited 2006-01-30 15:42:55]

Joost · Tue Jan 31, 2006 12:12 am

Quoting NumberTwelve (Reply 7):
but what about NW?

I suppose they only want to use KL feeder flights to AMS, and that they only have FRA for local demand. KLM and KLM Cityhopper have an extensive German network, flying to HAM, BRE, TXL, HAJ, DUS, CGN, STR, FRA, STR, MUC, NUE and starting march FMO (operated by European Air Express).

NumberTwelve · Tue Jan 31, 2006 12:22 am

@Joost, this works for flights ex AMS - but NW offers flights ex FRA with 330. Also there are areas with no airport around, such as Karlsruhe - Freiburg - Basel, but also Kassel - Göttingen (and for KL: Erfurt, Leipzig, Dresden).
And as I wrote before: LH also offers Rail&Fly - with all common German airports.

Or maybe it's not the decision of the airline but of Deutsche Bahn - maybe DB (2A) isn't interested in agreement with them. Some East European carriers aren't listet too, f.e. Aerosvit, Donbassaero, etc

[Edited 2006-01-30 16:28:31]

Sabena332 · Tue Jan 31, 2006 12:25 am

Quoting NumberTwelve (Thread starter):
http://www.bahn.de/-S:PtVOZ9:dJEPt9N.../MDB19254-airlines_januar_2006.pdf

Mahan Air is Rail&Fly partner? Great, and I paid 16,50 EUR for my girlfriend and myself to get by train to the airport when we flew on them. Angry

Patrick

NumberTwelve · Tue Jan 31, 2006 12:38 am

lol, Sabena - on Mahan Air's homepage they offer Rail&Fly for 20 Euro per leg.
So it seems that you safed EUR 3,50 per person and leg.
Seems as if Rail&Fly is a flat rate and it depends on the airline how much they charge for the train ride.

In a DB brochure, they say: "Die Flug-Coupons gelten nicht ... für Fahrten auf Innerverbundsstrecken?" . Does that mean, short distances are not allowed?

Sabena332 · Tue Jan 31, 2006 12:52 am

Quoting NumberTwelve (Reply 11):
So it seems that you safed EUR 3,50 per person and leg.

Oh, great to hear, seems that I did the right thing. Big grin

Quoting NumberTwelve (Reply 11):
In a DB brochure, they say: "Die Flug-Coupons gelten nicht ... für Fahrten auf Innerverbundsstrecken?" . Does that mean, short distances are not allowed?

That could be, looks like you are only allowed to use long distance trains.

There is a difference between "real" Bahn tickets and "Verkehrsverbund" tickets, once I wanted to buy a ticket for a S-Bahn ride from Bochum to DUS airport in a travel agency but the dude there told me that he isn't able to issue them via the usual Bahn reservation system. I had to buy a "Preisstufe C" ticket on the ticket automat at the train station.

Patrick

NumberTwelve · Tue Jan 31, 2006 1:01 am

Ah, ok, I got the infos: if you would have to buy tickets from a ticket machine like in RMV, VRS, HVV, etc, you are not allowed to use Rail&Fly. If you are not within these "Verkehrsverbunde", you can also use short distance trains.
Travel agent told me: if there is a price published on bahn.de schedule, you can use Rail&Fly, if not, you can use "Fahren&Fliegen" which is offer from Verkehrsverbuende.

NumberTwelve · Tue Jan 31, 2006 1:13 am

http://i2.photobucket.com/albums/y33/Stefandotde/AAdbBahnhof.jpg

lol I love that Pic!

[Edited 2006-01-30 17:13:49]

Oryx · Tue Jan 31, 2006 1:21 am

Quoting NumberTwelve (Reply 13):
Travel agent told me: if there is a price published on bahn.de schedule, you can use Rail&Fly, if not, you can use "Fahren&Fliegen" which is offer from Verkehrsverbuende.

That's a rule of thumb which should work most of the time. Verkehrsverbuende is short range transport inside a metropolitan are (ok you may say that there is none in Germany Big grin

). So if you take the train from the city centre to the airport is probably that. If you travel from one city to another or the second cities airport you take "a real" train which would be Rail&Fly.

Joost · Tue Jan 31, 2006 1:34 am

Hehe, next to the photoshop image, I have something else for you. In the past, KLM and Martinair even had "logo trains" running in the Netherlands:

KLM:
http://homepages.cwi.nl/~dik/nederla...baar_vervoer/plaatjes/icm14011.jpg

Martinair:
http://homepages.cwi.nl/~dik/nederla...baar_vervoer/plaatjes/icm14012.jpg

About the KLM subject. I can only guess,. Maybe they want to focus just on airline services and get not involved in Bahn issues?

BA · Tue Jan 31, 2006 4:17 am

What other rail companies offer Fly/Rail service?

I only know of SBB CFF FFS and DB.

Regards

Aisak · Tue Jan 31, 2006 4:45 am

Quoting BA (Reply 17):
What other rail companies offer Fly/Rail service?

I think the SNCF in France also does the same service for AA.. unless there are AA "flights" operated by them

blueflyer · Tue Jan 31, 2006 5:02 am

The French railroad company SNCF operates Rail/Fly in collaboration with AF, CO, AA and KL (and those are the ones I know about, there could be more carriers).

Thalys, a company owned by the French, German and Belgian railways partners with AF to connect CDG to downtown Brussels, Belgium (AF passengers can even check in and and drop off their luggage at the train station in Brussels) and to Germany. Thalys also partners with SN to connect the main Paris train station to BRU (don't know if SN has a check-in desk at the station though).

One of the nice touches offered by AF/Thalys is that your rail trip is in first class, whatever class/fare your plane trip is booked in. The difference is 1-2 vs 2-2 seating arrangement and a free meal.

TheSorcerer · Tue Jan 31, 2006 5:16 am

I remember when my dad used to regularly fly FRA to Cairo. He checked his baggage in at DUS and got the train to FRA. Not sure if they put the luggage on a plane going from DUS-FRA or on the train.
Dominic

NumberTwelve · Tue Jan 31, 2006 6:20 am

Quoting Aisak (Reply 18):
Quoting BA (Reply 17):
What other rail companies offer Fly/Rail service?

I think the SNCF in France also does the same service for AA.. unless there are AA "flights" operated by them

No, that's totally different. SNCF/AA service is codeshare and tickets have to be changed into train tickets.
Rail&Fly works for all DB stations, not special routes.

Joost · Tue Jan 31, 2006 6:32 am

Now I re-read this post, I remember, several years ago KLM and NS (Dutch railways) also had an agreement: you got a free train ticket from any station in the Netherlands to AMS and back on your days of travel, by showing your flight ticket. 1st class train for Europe Select/WBC travelers, 2nd class train for economy pax.

After about a year, they ended the service. Not many people were using it, and a big problem at the time (pre e-ticket era) was that many people picked up their booked tickets at the KLM ticket desk of AMS at the day of flight. So for all these people, the outbound train trip for free didn't work - they didn't have the tickets yet.

Another issue I seem to recall was that ticket control people (what's the enlgish word for that) were not all familiar with the agreement and fined people in the train for not having tickets, causing all kind of administrative issues, sorry-cards and flowers from KLM and NS to fix this. And it happened also that people had the impression that it was for all carriers, and thus got problems on board while showing there Transavia tickets - not included in the agreement.

So after a year, they stopped it.

Indeed, codeshare agreements with railways are of a different kind. KLM also has it with Thalys by the way, for Antwerp-Schiphol.

Oryx · Tue Jan 31, 2006 6:57 pm

Quoting TheSorcerer (Reply 20):
I remember when my dad used to regularly fly FRA to Cairo. He checked his baggage in at DUS and got the train to FRA. Not sure if they put the luggage on a plane going from DUS-FRA or on the train.

I think DUS-FRA was a dedicated train operated by DB on behalf of Lufthansa - the AirportExpress. It was painted in LH colors. I'm not even sure if you could use it as a regular train and it's out of service now. Instead you can use the ICE from Cologne with an average of 200km/h.

NumberTwelve · Tue Jan 31, 2006 7:18 pm

Quoting TheSorcerer (Reply 20):
I remember when my dad used to regularly fly FRA to Cairo. He checked his baggage in at DUS and got the train to FRA. Not sure if they put the luggage on a plane going from DUS-FRA or on the train.

They call it "AIRail" and includes routes CGN-FRA and STR-FRA .
http://www.bahn.de/trainflight , but that is different to Rail&Fly.
AIRail is in co operation LH, DB and Fraport, but Rail&Fly is valid for all German airports with heaps of airlines.

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