flywithjohn
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How Long Can FedEx Use It's DC/MD-10/11 Fleet

Wed Feb 08, 2006 10:10 am

Being none of the those three planes are made how long can FedEx continue use of the DC/MD-10/11 fleet. Do they still make parts for them? I know they say McDonald Douglas made airframes are not meant to have a limited life span. But how long with these planes fly after all parts will run eventually and when they do what will be a good replacement? Same goes for the 727
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United_fan
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RE: How Long Can FedEx Use It's DC/MD-10/11 Fleet

Wed Feb 08, 2006 10:17 am

It's Mc Donnell-Douglas.
"Suspicion is a matter of opinion"
 
flyf15
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RE: How Long Can FedEx Use It's DC/MD-10/11 Fleet

Wed Feb 08, 2006 10:18 am

There are still lots of DC-8s out there doing the same job and the -10s/-11s are much much newer. I'd say they probably have decades of live left in them.

Then again, like United_Fan said, they're Douglas birds. I read that up until fairly recently, there were more DC-3s out there flying than 777s.
 
flywithjohn
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RE: How Long Can FedEx Use It's DC/MD-10/11 Fleet

Wed Feb 08, 2006 10:24 am

Quoting United_Fan (Reply 1):
It's Mc Donnell-Douglas.

It's been a long a day and I used spell check.....but that is stupid kid's mistake yes.
Always Blue Sky's.....
 
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AA777223
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RE: How Long Can FedEx Use It's DC/MD-10/11 Fleet

Wed Feb 08, 2006 10:32 am

Quoting Flyf15 (Reply 2):
I read that up until fairly recently, there were more DC-3s out there flying than 777s.

How is that possible? When is the last time any of you saw a DC-3 flying other than at an airshow? I know MD/DC made enduring aircraft, but their production methods couldn't have differed that much from their competitors. I'm sure their aircraft have a good life left, but alot of those DC-10s especially are getting on up there.
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FLALEFTY
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RE: How Long Can FedEx Use It's DC/MD-10/11 Fleet

Wed Feb 08, 2006 11:01 am

FedEx doesn't put that many cycles on their DC/MD-10s and they get excellent maintenance, so I expect they will be around for a number of years. The DC-10s, with a 3-crew cockpit will probably get phased out first when they come up for their next major overhaul.

The MD-11 is one of their workhorses and should be around in FedEx's fleet for at least another decade.

That being said, however, with Boeing's 777F and Airbus' A330F in the offing, I bet FedEx will be willing to listen to any special deals that may be offered for these new, long-haul freighters.
 
waterpolodan
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RE: How Long Can FedEx Use It's DC/MD-10/11 Fleet

Wed Feb 08, 2006 11:04 am

Someone else can give you better info, but I'm pretty sure another reason the DC/MD10/11 series will last so long with the cargo airlines is that the airplane undergoes far fewer cycles per day than the same aircraft would have in passenger service. Look at the B52, there isn't an airframe younger than 40 yet they will be frontline bombers for another 20 years or so, thanks to very few cycles and excellent maintenance. Also, there are literally tons of DC10s in the desert for spare parts, and I'd bet Boeing still makes MD11 parts...
 
N1120A
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RE: How Long Can FedEx Use It's DC/MD-10/11 Fleet

Wed Feb 08, 2006 11:43 am

Quoting Waterpolodan (Reply 6):
Look at the B52, there isn't an airframe younger than 40 yet they will be frontline bombers for another 20 years or so, thanks to very few cycles and excellent maintenance.

Look at the KC-135 as well. Reskinning can make a huge difference.

Quoting Waterpolodan (Reply 6):
Also, there are literally tons of DC10s in the desert for spare parts, and I'd bet Boeing still makes MD11 parts...

Actually, I'd bet that they make parts for both still. Besides that, FedEx has gotten into the business of making aftermarket parts when it suits them (they make one of the main 727 hushkits out there). Further, the engines wont be an issue because they were not limited to just the DC10/MD11 family. They can be found on all types of planes, and hence will be widely available
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flywithjohn
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RE: How Long Can FedEx Use It's DC/MD-10/11 Fleet

Wed Feb 08, 2006 12:15 pm

Ok so this answers part of the question but at what point will it come into play the 2 engines cost less 3 and 2 pilots cost less then 3 also.
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pilotpip
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RE: How Long Can FedEx Use It's DC/MD-10/11 Fleet

Wed Feb 08, 2006 1:24 pm

Considering that one of the major upgrades to the MD-10s was getting rid of the FE, you have one problem solved. Also, fuel costs don't screw up the bottom line for FX like they do a pax carrier. FX charges a surcharge for fuel to make up the difference.

Plus, there are a hell of a lot of $10 overnight envelopes in a ULD. There are a number of those big ULDs on the aircraft.
DMI
 
alexinwa
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RE: How Long Can FedEx Use It's DC/MD-10/11 Fleet

Wed Feb 08, 2006 1:43 pm

So help me out here,.....If cargo airline pilots make about the same a pax airlines pilots, and fuel costs the same, why would FedEx what all these older birds that the airllines say are too exspensive to operate any longer?

Are the planes being used that much less to off set the cost of fuel?
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vegasplanes
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RE: How Long Can FedEx Use It's DC/MD-10/11 Fleet

Wed Feb 08, 2006 1:54 pm

Quoting Alexinwa (Reply 10):
Are the planes being used that much less to off set the cost of fuel?

See:

Quoting Pilotpip (Reply 9):
FX charges a surcharge for fuel to make up the difference.

That is how FX can do it flying older metal, also a lot cheaper to buy = lower financing costs.
 
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LTU932
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RE: How Long Can FedEx Use It's DC/MD-10/11 Fleet

Wed Feb 08, 2006 6:34 pm

Quoting Pilotpip (Reply 9):
Considering that one of the major upgrades to the MD-10s was getting rid of the FE, you have one problem solved.

Does FX still send DC-10s for conversions into Boeing MD-10s? I'm curious, as the Boeing MD-10 programme doesn't seem to be that popular with operators except FX.

Quoting Flyf15 (Reply 2):
There are still lots of DC-8s out there doing the same job and the -10s/-11s are much much newer. I'd say they probably have decades of live left in them.

Not to mention the few 707s still flying, some as corporate aircraft, others as AWACS or the already mentioned KC-135s or even John Travolta's own QF 707 (N707JT).  Wink Hell, even the prototype, the 367 Dash 80, was restored and flew for a while until being finally retired and put up for display in 2003.

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RichardPrice
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RE: How Long Can FedEx Use It's DC/MD-10/11 Fleet

Wed Feb 08, 2006 6:46 pm

Quoting Alexinwa (Reply 10):
So help me out here,.....If cargo airline pilots make about the same a pax airlines pilots, and fuel costs the same, why would FedEx what all these older birds that the airllines say are too exspensive to operate any longer?

Next time you are flying in a commercial passenger jet, stand up and take a look around. See all that free space between the seats and the ceiling, between the aisles, the seat pitch, the toilets etc.

You can cram a whole lot of $10 parcels into those spaces. I would be highly surprised if the cargo value (to Fedex in terms of money paid) of a Fedex flight comes in at less than a passenger flight on the same equipment (in terms of fare paid).

Plus packages arent that fussy about getting inflight meals, entertainment, aircon etc.
 
geg2rap
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RE: How Long Can FedEx Use It's DC/MD-10/11 Fleet

Wed Feb 08, 2006 9:15 pm

Quoting RichardPrice (Reply 13):

Next time you are flying in a commercial passenger jet, stand up and take a look around. See all that free space between the seats and the ceiling, between the aisles, the seat pitch, the toilets etc.

You can cram a whole lot of $10 parcels into those spaces. I would be highly surprised if the cargo value (to Fedex in terms of money paid) of a Fedex flight comes in at less than a passenger flight on the same equipment (in terms of fare paid).

Plus packages arent that fussy about getting inflight meals, entertainment, aircon etc.

it's $13.85 to send a letter overnight saver with UPS or Fedex, think of how many letters = your weight plus the weight of your luggage.
The value of a cargo load far outvalues a passenger load, that is why UPS can have a new a300 fly 8 eights per week (2 per day m-th most weekend volume is trucked) and still make money on the deal.
 
flyingbronco05
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RE: How Long Can FedEx Use It's DC/MD-10/11 Fleet

Wed Feb 08, 2006 10:15 pm

Quoting Flywithjohn (Thread starter):
Being none of the those three planes are made

All of them were made  Silly
Never Trust Your Fuel Gauge
 
skibum9
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RE: How Long Can FedEx Use It's DC/MD-10/11 Fleet

Wed Feb 08, 2006 11:02 pm

Quoting AA777223 (Reply 4):
When is the last time any of you saw a DC-3 flying other than at an airshow?

I see DC-3s regularly. If you go to Middletown OH, there is a cargo carrier based there that has about 5 or 6 DC-3s that they use. Also, DC-3s are actively used for cargo in the carribean.
Tailwinds!!!
 
leelaw
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RE: How Long Can FedEx Use It's DC/MD-10/11 Fleet

Wed Feb 08, 2006 11:14 pm

Quoting Skibum9 (Reply 16):
Quoting AA777223 (Reply 4):
When is the last time any of you saw a DC-3 flying other than at an airshow?

I see DC-3s regularly. If you go to Middletown OH, there is a cargo carrier based there that has about 5 or 6 DC-3s that they use. Also, DC-3s are actively used for cargo in the carribean.

IIRC, there are approximately 400 DC-3s still in service.
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USADreamliner
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RE: How Long Can FedEx Use It's DC/MD-10/11 Fleet

Wed Feb 08, 2006 11:27 pm

Are you worry about the DC-10 and MD-11?

So, what about the 707, DC8,DC9,727,etc? They are older airplanes than the DC-10 and MD 11 and there is plenty of them still flying.


USADreamliner  Big grin
 
sampa737
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RE: How Long Can FedEx Use It's DC/MD-10/11 Fleet

Thu Feb 09, 2006 12:29 am

I don't know if any of you have been in Memphis around 4pm each day but the line of MD-11s taking off is an amazing site...one after the other.
 
PGV
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RE: How Long Can FedEx Use It's DC/MD-10/11 Fleet

Thu Feb 09, 2006 12:57 am

Quoting AA777223 (Reply 4):
When is the last time any of you saw a DC-3 flying other than at an airshow?

These old birds haul more freight around the Carribean, Africa, and other remote parts of the world than you can imagine. If you ever land at SJU, take a look at how many are sitting there...and they make runs every night.
"To hell with a Ferrari...give me a Super 70!"
 
smokescreen
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RE: How Long Can FedEx Use It's DC/MD-10/11 Fleet

Thu Feb 09, 2006 1:24 am

Quoting PGV (Reply 20):
Quoting AA777223 (Reply 4):
When is the last time any of you saw a DC-3 flying other than at an airshow?

These old birds haul more freight around the Carribean, Africa, and other remote parts of the world than you can imagine.

There are also a number still in active military service around the world, mostly with African and Latin American nations, as well as Greece. Many of these have been converted to PT6 turboprops in the US or South Africa.
 
HAJFlyer
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RE: How Long Can FedEx Use It's DC/MD-10/11 Fleet

Thu Feb 09, 2006 1:41 am

As long as Stage IV noise regulations will not become mandatory for airliners already in service (and to the best of my knowledge there are no such plans at the moment), the DC-10 is likely to remain in service with cargo carriers for another 2 decades.
 
PGV
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RE: How Long Can FedEx Use It's DC/MD-10/11 Fleet

Thu Feb 09, 2006 1:48 am

Quoting Smokescreen (Reply 21):
There are also a number still in active military service around the world

Basler's Website shows the US Air Force as having a few as well for training purposes.

I love these old birds. Man...if money were no object, I'd have to have me one of these...to put next to my G-V. Oh wait...I said "no object". Therefore it would get parked between my DC-8 Executive and Grumman Turbo Goose

Ok..back to reality!
"To hell with a Ferrari...give me a Super 70!"
 
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fxramper
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RE: How Long Can FedEx Use It's DC/MD-10/11 Fleet

Thu Feb 09, 2006 1:51 am

I can't believe I didn't see this before now.

The only fleet plans in the future for us at FX are getting rid of the 727. We are retiring the 727-100 very soon, some frames are already gone. Looking for a replacement for this a/c.

The DC/MD 10 and MD11 are workhorses and in no danger of being lost in the next 10-15 yrs at FX.

Cheers!
 
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AA777223
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RE: How Long Can FedEx Use It's DC/MD-10/11 Fleet

Thu Feb 09, 2006 4:13 am

Well, I stand corrected! Thanks for the info!
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