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Tifoso
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Video Walkthrough Of The 748 Sky Suites

Sat Feb 25, 2006 8:48 am

In his latest blog entry, Randy points to a very nice fly through video of the 748 skysuites. Very cool.

Watch it here : http://video.boeing.com:8080/asx_ext...l/events/747_8_FlyThrough_22mb.asx

Some of my takeaways :

1. Sky suites for all three classes, First, Business and Economy. Previously, I thought it was only for F. I wish some airlines would adopt this!

2. Boeing thinks operators may include gyms and bars Big grin

3. The concept of including computers was pretty cool, although I'm sure people paying for the sky suites would all have individual laptops.
 
IFEMaster
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RE: Video Walkthrough Of The 748 Sky Suites

Sat Feb 25, 2006 8:51 am

Quoting Tifoso (Thread starter):
Boeing thinks operators may include gyms and bars

Pffff...

Gyms and Bars are much more profitable when they are made of seats, seatbelts, and PTV's.

It won't happen.
Delivering Anecdotes of Dubious Relevance Since 1978
 
CptGermany
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RE: Video Walkthrough Of The 748 Sky Suites

Sat Feb 25, 2006 9:08 am

The Fly-Through was impressive. I always thought that the 747 has a lot of potential regarding all the volume just above the main cabin. Nevertheless, it is up to the airlines to realize these options. Due to the highly competitive market airlines are experiencing nowadays, I doubt any of them will choose these options due to costs. I highly doubt that eco-class passengers will ever be able to experience this luxury.

The 777-style overhead bins in the main cabin certainly look great and the mood lighting definitely improve the experience to fly on that aircraft.
 
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keesje
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RE: Video Walkthrough Of The 748 Sky Suites

Sat Feb 25, 2006 9:12 am

Perhaps a modification on existing 747-400s too?
"Never mistake motion for action." Ernest Hemingway
 
Glom
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RE: Video Walkthrough Of The 748 Sky Suites

Sat Feb 25, 2006 9:13 am

If these extras are being put into the non-rev crown space, then it has more chance of materialising than it would on the A380 where there the extras must take the place of seats.

Question: if there is all this crown space, why hasn't it been used before?
 
ctbarnes
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RE: Video Walkthrough Of The 748 Sky Suites

Sat Feb 25, 2006 9:21 am

Very cool! Wonder how much of this will actually make it into production...

Charles, SJ
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solnabo
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RE: Video Walkthrough Of The 748 Sky Suites

Sat Feb 25, 2006 9:24 am

I think there will be bars in 748 but no gym, bars is a hit on VS flights...

It will happen.

Micke//SWE Big grin
Airbus SAS - Love them both
 
tinpusher007
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RE: Video Walkthrough Of The 748 Sky Suites

Sat Feb 25, 2006 9:34 am

It's always very amazing to see what technology can provide in this business of aviation. But, in the reality of today's market, with oil through the roof, most airlines eliminating a true first class product altogther and pax flocking to the likes of B6 and WN so they can fly coast to coast for $100 or less, I give this about as much of a chance of happening as shopping malls in the A380.
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twolz2rn
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RE: Video Walkthrough Of The 748 Sky Suites

Sat Feb 25, 2006 9:38 am

I liked the bar in the beginning of the tour. It looks like it would work well for business and first class passengers. The sleeper suites don't sound very feasible since most airlines offer flat seat beds, its an option but i can't really see many airlines ordering them. The space could be used better. I really liked the computer work station. Gyms on an airplane are dumb. A good exercise is a walk around the cabin...would you really want to get all hot and sweaty without showering on long flights?

Is it true that there will be little windows showing the sky from the ceiling on the upper deck?
 
Glom
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RE: Video Walkthrough Of The 748 Sky Suites

Sat Feb 25, 2006 9:44 am

I have to say though, that those suites are lush. It's like having your own private cubby hole. Kind of cosy. The limited room of the crown space works well there.
 
andessmf
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RE: Video Walkthrough Of The 748 Sky Suites

Sat Feb 25, 2006 10:03 am

I'm thinking what the price would be for a small 'family suite' where the kids could watch a little TV, sort of like they have in some trains. For the right adder on a long flight, I bet you could fill them pretty quickly.
 
EridanMan
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RE: Video Walkthrough Of The 748 Sky Suites

Sat Feb 25, 2006 10:06 am

methinks the mile-high membership rolls are going to skyrocket...

:-P

One of the cool things about the skysuite concept, in my humble opinion at least, is the fact that its extra space on an already efficiant airliner than _can't_ be used for seats, meaning that airliners than buy the -8's will have to come up with interesting stuff to do with it... Whether it be private bed/suits (for a cost), or an open lounge area, or... whatever- for once they'll have floorspace where they 'obvious' answer of 'pile more seats in' isn't legally feasible...

And i'd imagine we'll see some airlines, VS in particular, giving us some interesting alternatives...

If anything, it is a good selling point for the 748... sure the A380 is larger, but that extra size brings an extra pressure to sell more seats, and essentially the same flying experience for the onboard pax... The 748 is a 'safer' bet, considering that loads don't have to be significantly larger than the current ships (which aren't having any problem), yet the airlines can make the IFE something unique - something that a non-aviation-buff pax can go and say 'yeah, I remember that plane, it had the cool lounge/bar on top... I wonder why they didn't do what every other airline does and just stick more seats up there? either way, that was cool, I like them"...

Just my .02... i'm far from an expert.
 
jacobin777
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RE: Video Walkthrough Of The 748 Sky Suites

Sat Feb 25, 2006 10:49 am

Quoting Tifoso (Thread starter):
The concept of including computers was pretty cool, although I'm sure people paying for the sky suites would all have individual laptops.

I liked that part too..how about a little "internet cafe" and 35,000 ft...I'll go there, log on with my laptop (of course, I'll be happy to pay for "connexion by boeing")..and purchase a mocha.... Smile
"Up the Irons!"
 
spacecadet
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RE: Video Walkthrough Of The 748 Sky Suites

Sat Feb 25, 2006 12:18 pm

Quoting Tifoso (Thread starter):
Sky suites for all three classes, First, Business and Economy. Previously, I thought it was only for F. I wish some airlines would adopt this!

You're not reading that right. It's "Business Class Suites" and "Economy Suites", not "suites for business class" and "suites for economy class".

It's basically the train travel model. You can buy an "Economy" room on Amtrak but you are still a first class passenger. The fact that you bought a bedroom at all is what determines your class. "Economy" is relative to the other passengers in first class bedrooms.

All of the "suites" in the 747-8 would be a step above regular first class. You can bet an "Economy Suite" would cost probably about 1.5 times the price of a standard first class seat.

(You'll note that Boeing says these suites offer "new revenue opportunities" - you think they're expecting airlines to charge less than a first class price for an economy suite?)

Basically, you can figure suite cost based on the amount a set of regular seats occupying the same amount of square footage - with the same amenities - would run for.
I'm tired of being a wanna-be league bowler. I wanna be a league bowler!
 
Tifoso
Topic Author
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RE: Video Walkthrough Of The 748 Sky Suites

Sat Feb 25, 2006 8:04 pm

Quoting Spacecadet (Reply 13):

Thanks for the correction Spacecadet; your interpretation certainly makes more sense.  thumbsup 

Quoting Spacecadet (Reply 13):
(You'll note that Boeing says these suites offer "new revenue opportunities" - you think they're expecting airlines to charge less than a first class price for an economy suite?)

Well, these suites are in the loft, and are thus akin to extra seats. Extra seats means more revenue.
 
norcal
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RE: Video Walkthrough Of The 748 Sky Suites

Sat Feb 25, 2006 8:30 pm

I think the sky galley and maybe a lounge makes the most sense. If you took out all of Galleys and moved them upstairs then you might just be able to offer 450 seats in a realistic seat layout. Maybe they could put a couple of the restrooms up there too.
 
dl021
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RE: Video Walkthrough Of The 748 Sky Suites

Sun Feb 26, 2006 3:45 am

Sky galleys and lavs in the upper area seems to be the easiest items to look at, since they don't add additional weight (they are already in the aircraft, but elsewhere) while the extra seats sold in the spaces where the galleys and lavs used to be will enhance revenues without taking away cargo space belowdecks.

The suites seem to be nice, but I would bet that economy suites would take away from some business class seats (as the passenger would not need to pay for the extra room in a seat he/she will only be using for takeoff and landing and perhaps a meal).

I do see these suites options being considered mostly by airlines on their routes over 9 or 10 hours....anything less and it's almost a waste for the passenger.

I'd like to see the gyms, lounges and other sundries but I don't really see it happening.
Is my Pan Am ticket to the moon still good?
 
lufthansi
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RE: Video Walkthrough Of The 748 Sky Suites

Sun Feb 26, 2006 3:48 am

Nice video indeed. But to me it looks like a joke. This may be some improvements for the virtual cabin of my Flight-Simulator. The PMDG 747 sure would look great in this way if you walk around the cabin with Active Camera... But in reality this won't happen I think. As you all said: Money will be made by selling seats not by providing gyms. And to call this "new" is far away from reality. We already have some airlines offering bars. ANA for example has a nice one on the older 747-400s. In the newer it's much smaller but has a cool blue lightning, which has been announced as new too in this video. When Boeing launched the 747 program they offered those bars and lounges too. So all this is far away from new. The only thing they could call new is the design. And that looks really great! I hope they'll make it an everyday thing with the changing light colors. But please don't program the changes as quick as in the video. It would drive me crazy. Like in the tunnel at the Fraport... That's ok. But only during ground time. In flight I don't think it's cool watching those traffic lights for hours and hours...

The thing I liked most at this "funny" video: The beds!!! How would you feel lying in a bed that only is divided by a curtain? I mean it's more than those First-class seats with the divider you can lift up... But those beds remind me of the crew rests. Except the colors and the size... Those beds look American style!? Are they to be used by a single person only? They look like a two-person bed. Well, just grab your girl and have some "nice hours" on board this skybed. But make sure to be quiet! The 747 is very quiet inside and may give you the feeling of being alone… Don't scream out your pleasure too loud. There's only a curtain...


But don't get me wrong! I like Boeing a bit more than airbus.
 Smile

Cheers, Lufthansi
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Geo772
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RE: Video Walkthrough Of The 748 Sky Suites

Sun Feb 26, 2006 4:23 am

Quoting Keesje (Reply 3):
Perhaps a modification on existing 747-400s too?

Unfortunately not. The air conditioning ducting and control cables run through the ceiling on the 747-400 and it would be very unlikely that the overhead space could be utilised in the same way.
Flown on A300B4/600,A319/20/21,A332/3,A343,B727,B732/3/4/5/6/7/8,B741/2/4,B752/3,B762/3,B772/3,DC10,L1011-200,VC10,MD80,
 
byronsterk
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RE: Video Walkthrough Of The 748 Sky Suites

Sun Feb 26, 2006 4:46 am

oh well.... if those suites were to become reality the member list of the mile high club would rise to astronomic porportions..
Helicopters can't fly, there just so ugly the earth repells them...
 
N766UA
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RE: Video Walkthrough Of The 748 Sky Suites

Sun Feb 26, 2006 6:09 am

Quoting IFEMaster (Reply 1):
Pffff...

Gyms and Bars are much more profitable when they are made of seats, seatbelts, and PTV's.

It won't happen.

Does anyone else find it funny that this statement is still being made about a 747 30+ years later?
 
Airportgal
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RE: Video Walkthrough Of The 748 Sky Suites

Sun Feb 26, 2006 6:27 am

Quoting AndesSMF (Reply 10):
I'm thinking what the price would be for a small 'family suite' where the kids could watch a little TV, sort of like they have in some trains. For the right adder on a long flight, I bet you could fill them pretty quickly.

and put that family in biz class with the toddler that screached the whole way from TPE to SEA yesterday in there.... PLEASE
 
Airportgal
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RE: Video Walkthrough Of The 748 Sky Suites

Sun Feb 26, 2006 6:28 am

Quoting AndesSMF (Reply 10):
I'm thinking what the price would be for a small 'family suite' where the kids could watch a little TV, sort of like they have in some trains. For the right adder on a long flight, I bet you could fill them pretty quickly.

and put that family in biz class with the toddler that screached the whole way from TPE to SEA yesterday in there.... PLEASE
 
andessmf
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RE: Video Walkthrough Of The 748 Sky Suites

Sun Feb 26, 2006 6:34 am

Quoting AirportGal (Reply 22):
and put that family in biz class with the toddler that screached the whole way from TPE to SEA yesterday in there.... PLEASE

That is what I tell you, you remove the kids from the main cabin this way with a family suite, so we are talking about the same thing. (Believe me, I am the proud parent of a drama 'princess' and 'prince'.
 
georgiaame
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RE: Video Walkthrough Of The 748 Sky Suites

Sun Feb 26, 2006 6:45 am

Other than seeming a bit claustrophobic, I think it's brilliant! Especially the idea of the up stairs galley. This machine is competing against a 550 seat Airbus, that doesn't seem to be selling too well at the moment. The jury is still out regarding the actual need for a passenger jet of this size.

The -8 is only modestly larger than the current -400, with only a few extra rows of passenger carrying, revenue generating seats. Seems to me that if you remove 1 large galley unit from the main cabin, you open up almost the same number of rows of seats that are being added to the -8 model, coming darned close to the 380's seating capacity, with the only weight premium being that of the economy seat rows, the weight of the passengers and their baggage. Sounds like great economy to this non economist.

And as one passenger who seeks out the greatest level of in flight comfort for the least number of bucks, a real upstairs lounge plus a few suites utilizing previously dead space is doubly brilliant. There are a lot of -400 models out there that will be due for retirement in a few years.

The Queen is dead. Long live the new Queen of the Skies!
"Trust, but verify!" An old Russian proverb, quoted often by a modern American hero
 
777fan
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RE: Video Walkthrough Of The 748 Sky Suites

Sun Feb 26, 2006 6:46 am

I'm guessing that the gym literally won't fly - it's a stupid idea but was probably included in the video to suggest just how flexible the various configurations can be. The new cabins look great and the suites are a fantastic idea but how much weight is this going to add?! Are we to assume that all of the suites will be tucked into the "ceiling" or crown of the main fuselage?

As was pointed out, the whole concept takes the pressure off of the carrier to sell slew of extra seats. I could definitely see a pimped out suite-laden version of a 748 being used on a longhaul, high-rev, "premier" international route (JFK-NRT, LAX-SYD, ORD-HKG) much in the same way that UA operates its PS routes.
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galapagapop
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RE: Video Walkthrough Of The 748 Sky Suites

Sun Feb 26, 2006 6:55 am

Quoting IFEMaster (Reply 1):
Pffff...

Gyms and Bars are much more profitable when they are made of seats, seatbelts, and PTV's.

It won't happen.

Not quite that area is not and cannot become banks of seats. Unlike with the A380's promises this area could only be used for those purposes.
 
whitehatter
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RE: Video Walkthrough Of The 748 Sky Suites

Sun Feb 26, 2006 7:10 am

The problem with using the space above the main deck isn't what to do with it, it's one of evacuation. Certifying an aircraft with passenger-accessible features up there might be problematic.

Using it for galley space and other main deck facilities is a much better idea. The authorities might not look on using it for sleeper suites as being ideal in a situation where an aircraft needs to be evacuated quickly.
Lead me not into temptation, I can find my own way there...
 
S12PPL
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RE: Video Walkthrough Of The 748 Sky Suites

Sun Feb 26, 2006 7:36 am

Looks pretty cool! It will be interesting to see what options various airlines choose. I would think Virgin would be a prime candidate for the premium suites, and economy suites. Maybe SQ would opt for the suites as well? Or Cathay?? I do like the look of that bird, though! What a nice looking plane!!!
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Glom
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RE: Video Walkthrough Of The 748 Sky Suites

Sun Feb 26, 2006 8:19 am

Quoting WhiteHatter (Reply 27):
The problem with using the space above the main deck isn't what to do with it, it's one of evacuation. Certifying an aircraft with passenger-accessible features up there might be problematic.

You make a good point. Of course, it should be considered that the times when there would be need for an evacuation at short notice (generally around takeoff and landing), the passengers would probably not be allowed to use the Skyloft. Obviously all passengers must be in their proper seats for takeoff and landing. There will probably be a Skyloft light next to the fasten seat belt sign that will indicate when passengers can use the Skyloft and that will only happen when the aircraft is at or near cruise. Even if there was a total engine failure at cruise or the need for an emergency descent, it would still take some time before the aircraft got to the ground and in that time, the FAs could get people out of the Skyloft and into their seats ready to evacuate the aircraft in a rush. I suppose the certification test would be to see how quickly the Skyloft could be evacuated and passengers returned safely to their seats. If it can happen quickly enough, then the lack of actual emergency exits shouldn't be a problem.

What is more of a concern is fire suppression, especially if they are going to put an Internet cafe up there with all those hot electronics. I got the impression from the video that there was only one sets of stairs into the place. In that case, there will definitely be the need for extra precautions. Good thing it isn't a twin. The ETOPS fire suppression rules for that would be a nightmare.

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