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Halophila
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QF 744 Clips Fence At JFK

Tue May 30, 2006 1:03 pm

Please delete this thread if it has already been posted
---------------------------
Qantas jet damaged in NY
From: By staff writers
From: News.com.au 30 May 2006

May 30, 2006
A QANTAS jet clipped a fence after arriving at New York's John F Kennedy International Airport today, authorities said.

AP reports that no one was hurt, and the plane was not significantly damaged.
The plane had flown in from Los Angeles and hit the fence as it was heading for a terminal.

AP said the plane landed safely about 5.30pm (0830 AEST), according to Tony Ciavolella, a spokesman for the Port Authority of New York and New Jersey, which operates the region's airports.

Passengers were reportedly held up for only a few minutes after the accident and then disembarked.

-----------------------------

I wouldn't want to be a GA in LAX this evening. Any word on how bad the damage was other than "not significantly"? Did it head back to LAX OK this evening?

Halophila

(Added) Just noticed that on Flightwaware.com that QF108 from JFK to LAX has been cancelled this evening. Spare 744 anyone?

[Edited 2006-05-30 06:07:46]
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rjpieces
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RE: QF 744 Clips Fence At JFK

Tue May 30, 2006 1:30 pm

Hmmm, they were landing on 13L around that time...I'm guessing they hit the fence when trying to pull into Terminal 7...It is rather tight around there.

I'm always interested in how an airline handles a situation like this. My guess is that they rebooked as many pax as possible on American for the JFK-LAX segment. Seeing that QF has a fairly large operation at LAX, I'm sure it wasn't a huge problem to accomodate most of the pax for the LAX-SYD segment.

As far as I know, the QF crew turns at JFK and heads back to LAX. So they are probably having a 24 hour layover and flying her back to LAX tomorrow night, assuming the wing is inspected and fixed within 24 hours which shouldn't be a huge problem at an airport like JFK.
"Millions long for immortality who do not know what to do with themselves on a rainy Sunday afternoon"
 
USAFHummer
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RE: QF 744 Clips Fence At JFK

Tue May 30, 2006 1:34 pm

A quick follow-up...

"In late breaking news, above article actually spells "QANTAS" correctly; a.net world collectively exhales"

 Wink

Greg
Chief A.net college football stadium self-pic guru
 
bakestar
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RE: QF 744 Clips Fence At JFK

Tue May 30, 2006 1:47 pm

Quoting USAFHummer (Reply 2):
"In late breaking news, above article actually spells "QANTAS" correctly; a.net world collectively exhales"

It must be a miracle.
fly'nhi
 
Halophila
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RE: QF 744 Clips Fence At JFK

Tue May 30, 2006 1:48 pm

Quoting USAFHummer (Reply 2):
"In late breaking news, above article actually spells "QANTAS" correctly; a.net world collectively exhales"

Now if the aussie press had that one wrong... I would have laughed! It's drilled into us at an early age - you were held back a year in primary school if you ever got it wrong!

[Edited 2006-05-30 06:48:51]
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CO7e7
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RE: QF 744 Clips Fence At JFK

Tue May 30, 2006 2:00 pm

Any pics of the incident ?
 
SEAPlane10
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RE: QF 744 Clips Fence At JFK

Tue May 30, 2006 2:03 pm

Quoting Halophila (Thread starter):
A QANTAS jet clipped a fence

The title of the article made it sound like the jet clipped the fence on the landing...that would have been a very, very low approach!!  Wow!
 
rjpieces
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RE: QF 744 Clips Fence At JFK

Tue May 30, 2006 2:06 pm

Quoting SEAPlane10 (Reply 6):
The title of the article made it sound like the jet clipped the fence on the landing...that would have been a very, very low approach!!

Doubt it...The article said "after landing"...The only possible place I can think of where it could have clipped a fence was when pulling into T7.
"Millions long for immortality who do not know what to do with themselves on a rainy Sunday afternoon"
 
aa777jfklhr
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RE: QF 744 Clips Fence At JFK

Tue May 30, 2006 2:08 pm

I love how AP quotes "no signifigant damage to the aircraft" I went up and saw the wing at about 2000 local time and there is a huge gash on the co-pilots wingtip....This aircraft will definatly be out of service for quite some time.
people know me...Im a kinda a big deal!
 
SEAPlane10
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RE: QF 744 Clips Fence At JFK

Tue May 30, 2006 2:10 pm

Quoting RJpieces (Reply 7):
Doubt it...The article said "after landing"...The only possible place I can think of where it could have clipped a fence was when pulling into T7.

I figured that out. I meant the title of the thread.  Wink
 
Halophila
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RE: QF 744 Clips Fence At JFK

Tue May 30, 2006 2:11 pm

Quoting AA777JFKLHR (Reply 8):
there is a huge gash on the co-pilots wingtip

Oh dear!! That doesn't sound good at all. Did you by chance happen to get the reg of the a/c?
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antskip
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RE: QF 744 Clips Fence At JFK

Tue May 30, 2006 2:17 pm

Quoting RJpieces (Reply 7):
The only possible place I can think of where it could have clipped a fence was when pulling into T7.



Quoting AA777JFKLHR (Reply 8):
there is a huge gash on the co-pilots wingtip....This aircraft will definatly be out of service for quite some time.

Seems like a great deal of damage - for a seemingly unusual event? How could it have happened? I would have thought such an event would be almost impossible considering the number of times the fence is NOT clipped? Surely not as simple as a minor mis-calcution...
 
eoinnz
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RE: QF 744 Clips Fence At JFK

Tue May 30, 2006 2:19 pm

Quoting RJpieces (Reply 1):
As far as I know, the QF crew turns at JFK and heads back to LAX.

That's correct. The pilots actually get to slip in New York for 1 or 2 night but the cabin crew return back to Los Angeles. I recently completed this pattern - It's a hell of a day so there will be a lot of happy QANTAS cabin crew in New York - I know I'm always praying for something non-dangerous to allow a stopover - Hopefully winter will be of some assistance!!  Smile
 
access-air
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RE: QF 744 Clips Fence At JFK

Tue May 30, 2006 2:27 pm

What Tail number was this 744????

Access-Air
Remember, Wherever you go, there you are!!!!
 
rjpieces
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RE: QF 744 Clips Fence At JFK

Tue May 30, 2006 2:27 pm

Quoting AA777JFKLHR (Reply 8):
I went up and saw the wing at about 2000 local time and there is a huge gash on the co-pilots wingtip....This aircraft will definatly be out of service for quite some time.

Ouch, well we know how the press is with aviation stories. There goes my 24 hours and back on her way to LAX theory....

Quoting Antskip (Reply 11):
Seems like a great deal of damage - for a seemingly unusual event? How could it have happened? I would have thought such an event would be almost impossible considering the number of times the fence is NOT clipped? Surely not as simple as a minor mis-calcution...

If the aircraft were taxying into Terminal 7 and made a left to turn into the gate, it would coincide with what was said above about the wing on the starboard side being hit...The fence is on the right for aircraft taxying into the BA side of T7.

Quoting Eoinnz (Reply 12):
I know I'm always praying for something non-dangerous to allow a stopover - Hopefully winter will be of some assistance!!

A QF flight/crew had to overnight this past winter during the massive snowstorm. If I remember correctly, QF 108 left the gate and taxied for several hours before returning to the gate and cancelling because of crew hour restrictions. So maybe you'll have some luck in the future!  Smile
"Millions long for immortality who do not know what to do with themselves on a rainy Sunday afternoon"
 
JetBlueRamper
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RE: QF 744 Clips Fence At JFK

Tue May 30, 2006 3:49 pm

That plane is too big for where they park it no room anywhere. Just wait for the A380 to come what damage may happen to that plane?
 
Halophila
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RE: QF 744 Clips Fence At JFK

Tue May 30, 2006 3:57 pm

Update from news.com.au:
---------------------------------------
Qantas plane hits fence at US airport
From:
May 30, 2006
A QANTAS plane's wingtip ran into a fence after landing in New York today but no passengers were hurt.

A spokesman for Qantas said that the airplane, with 204 passengers on board, was taxiing to the terminal when its wingtip hit a blast fence.
"No one was hurt as a result of the incident and passengers were kept updated at all times by the flight crew," the spokesman said.

"Relevant local and Australian authorities have been advised of the incident and we are conducting our own investigation."

As a result of the incident the return flight of the aircraft to Los Angeles and then onto Sydney was cancelled.

Passengers awaiting the plane in Los Angeles were to be transferred to other flights, the Qantas spokesman said.

Possible repairs to the wingtip were being investigated.

AP quoted a spokesman for the Port Authority of New York and New Jersey as saying the passengers were delayed for a few minutes in leaving the aircraft.

However, they got off the plane at a gate as planned.
----------------------------------

Any update on which a/c was involved (fingers crossed not -OJH).
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anstar
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RE: QF 744 Clips Fence At JFK

Tue May 30, 2006 3:59 pm

 
Halophila
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RE: QF 744 Clips Fence At JFK

Tue May 30, 2006 4:01 pm

Quoting ANstar (Reply 17):
There is a pic on this site

Good find, ANstar!
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Brendan03
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RE: QF 744 Clips Fence At JFK

Tue May 30, 2006 4:17 pm

I've just been told It's VH-OEE, Can't confirm it though

Quoting Halophila (Reply 16):
Any update on which a/c was involved (fingers crossed not -OJH).

The URL shows It's powered by GEs so It's 99% likely It's an 438ER

OJH is a 438 powered by RR
Coolier than thou.
 
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jumbojim747
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RE: QF 744 Clips Fence At JFK

Tue May 30, 2006 5:50 pm

Looks like the wing would clear the fence in that pick.
I wonder if the fence was hit by one of the engines.
On a wing and a prayer
 
NZ560
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RE: QF 744 Clips Fence At JFK

Tue May 30, 2006 6:00 pm

Aircraft is VH-OEE


View Large View Medium
Click here for bigger photo!

Photo © JumboJim747

-OJL RIP Also to the 7 onboard
 
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Goodbye
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RE: QF 744 Clips Fence At JFK

Tue May 30, 2006 6:31 pm

There's a thread about this from a guy who was actually on the flight when the incident happened: http://www.vpmag.com/yssy/viewtopic.php?t=16348

A.
✈︎
 
scoliodon
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RE: QF 744 Clips Fence At JFK

Tue May 30, 2006 6:33 pm

Quoting SEAPlane10 (Reply 6):
title of the article made it sound like the jet clipped the fence on the landing

I agree with you there. The topic gave the incident a more dramatic feel. I was already visualising the jumbo clipping the fence...as I too often do in FS2004  Big grin
JFK-LGA-EWR-DTW-IND-PHX-CLE-SFO-LAS-SEA-ORD-MCO-MIA-DFW-ATL-CDG-FRA-BOM-MAA-DEL-TRZ-DXB-CLT-CVG-DEN-MSP
 
psimpson
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RE: QF 744 Clips Fence At JFK

Tue May 30, 2006 8:51 pm

Quoting Halophila (Reply 16):

Hello Halaophila,
I was at LHR this Sunday 28th May and saw VH-OJH land on runway 27L as QF6067 which was a charter from Barcelona.New York for at least the last 4 or 5 month have been receiving only the GE power 747-400s of QF. The regulars normally being VH-OEB/OEC/OED with the 400ERs coming in more frequently during the last 6 weeks or so.The RR power 400s are use frequently into LHR, but LHR do quite frequently get the GE Power 400ERs as QF operate 4 flights most days.
 
TinkerBelle
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RE: QF 744 Clips Fence At JFK

Tue May 30, 2006 8:59 pm

Maybe the wing expanded a few feet, just like the concorde expanded 10 inches in flight..  biggrin 
If you are going through hell, keep going.
 
cricket
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RE: QF 744 Clips Fence At JFK

Tue May 30, 2006 9:11 pm

The damage must be expensive, and poor QF - this accident happened at the furtherest point of its network.
been there, flown that
 
aussie747
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RE: QF 744 Clips Fence At JFK

Tue May 30, 2006 9:12 pm

Perhaps they will make the repairs to VH-OEE at their new QF maintenance facility at LAX? or will it fly directly back to SYD. Seems to me like there is wing tip sparing damage.

Looks similar to what happened to the UA 744 at MEL when is clipped a QF767 a few months ago.
 
rjpieces
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RE: QF 744 Clips Fence At JFK

Tue May 30, 2006 10:08 pm

How long do these type of things generally take to repair? Anyone know how QF is making up for the lost capacity?
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JFKviaPHX
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RE: QF 744 Clips Fence At JFK

Tue May 30, 2006 10:47 pm

I heard this on the radio as it happened. One of our mechnics was saying it just took out the blast fence with its wing.
 
richierich
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RE: QF 744 Clips Fence At JFK

Tue May 30, 2006 10:59 pm

Quoting Cricket (Reply 26):
The damage must be expensive, and poor QF - this accident happened at the furtherest point of its network.

Its not like there is a shortage of 744s that utilize JFK though. I'm sure they'd rather have this happen at JFK than quite a few other places!

Its really a minor incident - thankfully nobody was hurt although I suspect somebody will lose their job because of it.
None shall pass!!!!
 
Qantas744er
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RE: QF 744 Clips Fence At JFK

Wed May 31, 2006 12:30 am

ACARS mode: O Aircraft reg: VH-OEE [Boeing B744]
Message label: _ Block id: 2 Msg no: S61A
Flight id: QF0108 [JFK-LAX-SYD] [Qantas]
--------------------------------------------------------[ 28/05/2006 22:24 ]-

Passengers put onto AA flight for LAX and then on QF again for SYD even though the QF 108 after JFK-LAX carries on to SYD was missing they found space to put them on. QF107 is currently not yet been operated again and pax. get put on QF flights to and from the US for QF 107 and 108 and for the LAX-JFK-LAX segment all on AA.

BTW shouldnt take too long to get that fixed, either BA bring a spare from LHR bein a One World member or AA from LAX.

Cheers Leo
You live and you die, by the FMA
 
avroarrow
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RE: QF 744 Clips Fence At JFK

Wed May 31, 2006 1:02 am

So was the damage restricted to the winglet on the end or did it get the metal on the wing surface itself? If it was just the winglet they could just take it off and fly it home correct?
Give me a mile of road and I can take you a mile. Give me a mile of runway and I can show you the world.
 
Gr8Circle
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RE: QF 744 Clips Fence At JFK

Wed May 31, 2006 1:18 am

Quoting SEAPlane10 (Reply 6):
The title of the article made it sound like the jet clipped the fence on the landing...that would have been a very, very low approach!!

That's exactly what I thought too....
 
GQfluffy
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RE: QF 744 Clips Fence At JFK

Wed May 31, 2006 1:36 am

Taking text from the article with the picture...

"Another passenger, who preferred not to be identified, said the flight crew appeared to overshoot the guide line for turning into the gate."

Yeah, l bet they did. Why didn't this guy go up and park the 744 for them. Guidelines are just that...a guide. You can't follow one exactly and hope to turn and stay exactly on that line. I see it every day...
This isn't where I parked my car...
 
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Starlionblue
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RE: QF 744 Clips Fence At JFK

Wed May 31, 2006 3:10 am

Quoting GQfluffy (Reply 34):
Taking text from the article with the picture...

"Another passenger, who preferred not to be identified, said the flight crew appeared to overshoot the guide line for turning into the gate."

Yeah, l bet they did. Why didn't this guy go up and park the 744 for them. Guidelines are just that...a guide. You can't follow one exactly and hope to turn and stay exactly on that line. I see it every day...

Well, to be fair he only said they appeared to overshoot the guide line, not that they recklessly sped past it.

Planes are meant to be in the air. On the ground in tight confines things are trickier.
"There are no stupid questions, but there are a lot of inquisitive idiots." - John Ringo
 
Boeing747_600
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RE: QF 744 Clips Fence At JFK

Wed May 31, 2006 6:17 am

Quoting Richierich (Reply 30):
... although I suspect somebody will lose their job because of it.

I dont think the captain will or should be fired over what was arguably a relatively minor accident, but he should definitely remain grounded and given extensive taxiing refresher courses with special emphasis on the sort of tight manouvres involved in the JFK accident.
 
richierich
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RE: QF 744 Clips Fence At JFK

Wed May 31, 2006 6:20 am

Quoting Boeing747_600 (Reply 36):
I dont think the captain will or should be fired over what was arguably a relatively minor accident, but he should definitely remain grounded and given extensive taxiing refresher courses with special emphasis on the sort of tight manouvres involved in the JFK accident

Agree.
But I was thinking more the wingwalker (if there was one). If there was not a wingwalker, there damn well should have been one! Its easy to blame to little guy....
None shall pass!!!!
 
christeljs
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RE: QF 744 Clips Fence At JFK

Wed May 31, 2006 6:26 am

So who would be to blame for this incident?
Christel A Photography
 
Boeing747_600
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RE: QF 744 Clips Fence At JFK

Wed May 31, 2006 6:36 am

Quoting Christeljs (Reply 38):
So who would be to blame for this incident?

who is in command of the aircraft at all times, even when he is the PNF?
 
B6JFKH81
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RE: QF 744 Clips Fence At JFK

Wed May 31, 2006 6:47 am

I took a drive by T7 and it looks like the damage to the fence was minimal. Haven't gotten over to the cargo area yet to see the a/c. Anyone have a report/pic of the a/c damage???
"If you do not learn from history, you are doomed to repeat it"
 
richierich
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RE: QF 744 Clips Fence At JFK

Wed May 31, 2006 6:55 am

Quoting B6JFKH81 (Reply 40):
I took a drive by T7 and it looks like the damage to the fence was minimal. Haven't gotten over to the cargo area yet to see the a/c. Anyone have a report/pic of the a/c damage???

I can't believe it was that substantial but I sure wouldn't want to take any chances on a flight across the Pacific!
None shall pass!!!!
 
airfrance
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RE: QF 744 Clips Fence At JFK

Wed May 31, 2006 7:22 am

Anybody know how much structural damage the plane had?
Work Hard, Fly Often
 
GQfluffy
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RE: QF 744 Clips Fence At JFK

Wed May 31, 2006 11:32 am

Quoting Boeing747_600 (Reply 36):
I dont think the captain will or should be fired over what was arguably a relatively minor accident, but he should definitely remain grounded and given extensive taxiing refresher courses with special emphasis on the sort of tight manouvres involved in the JFK accident.

Maybe... I don't think anyone should be fired for this, but I'm wondering if it was more the marshaller's fault (and wing-walker if there was one) then the Captain's. It's a marshaller's job to make sure these things don't happen. And if QF didn't have any wing-walkers (which I know is becoming more and more common it seems like...), this hopefully will remind them that wing-walkers do serve a purpose...
This isn't where I parked my car...
 
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September11
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RE: QF 744 Clips Fence At JFK

Wed May 31, 2006 11:37 am

Quoting RJpieces (Reply 28):
How long do these type of things generally take to repair?

My best educated guess: one week.
Airliners.net of the Future
 
VHXLR8
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RE: QF 744 Clips Fence At JFK

Wed May 31, 2006 4:14 pm

Eoinnz,

How many of those patterns have you done?? I only ask as I thought those patterns were mainly crewed by SYD and MEL based crews. Off reserve??

Whilst it's a long day, a lot of crew i've spoken to actually don't mind it too much, as the hours are great, and the loads are usually relatively light. Easier than doing a SYD/PER/SYD or a SIN/PER/SIN (which i have coming up, ugh!)
 
Boeing747_600
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RE: QF 744 Clips Fence At JFK

Wed May 31, 2006 4:35 pm

Quoting GQfluffy (Reply 43):
Maybe... I don't think anyone should be fired for this, but I'm wondering if it was more the marshaller's fault (and wing-walker if there was one) then the Captain's.

It is ridiculous to expect that the guidance of a several hundred million dollar piece of machinery is subject to the judgement of a guy making something marginally above minimum wage. The captain's judgement is the final governing authority on all aircraft manouvers. He should have sensed that something was amiss and discontinued the turn.

Quoting GQfluffy (Reply 43):
It's a marshaller's job to make sure these things don't happen.

No its not. That's the captain's job. See above.
 
aaden
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RE: QF 744 Clips Fence At JFK

Wed May 31, 2006 9:56 pm

so will they fire him or not?
 
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Starlionblue
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RE: QF 744 Clips Fence At JFK

Wed May 31, 2006 11:57 pm

Quoting AAden (Reply 47):
so will they fire him or not?

Circumstances vary from case to case. Wilful disregard is one thing. A momentary slip in an otherwise solid performance is another. Firing someone for making one mistake can be dangerous. Pretty soon mistakes go unreported, and that's when things become really unsafe.

Three strikes or something similar works better, with the strikes being cleared from the record over time.

It's human to make mistakes. A good employee will learn from those mistakes. Don't you think the guy who made this mistake will be a better worker for it? He probably won't do the same thing again.
"There are no stupid questions, but there are a lot of inquisitive idiots." - John Ringo
 
jamesjoyce
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RE: QF 744 Clips Fence At JFK

Thu Jun 01, 2006 12:01 am

Quoting Gr8Circle (Reply 33):
So was the damage restricted to the winglet on the end or did it get the metal on the wing surface itself? If it was just the winglet they could just take it off and fly it home correct?

There is no technical reason why not to fly with one of the winglets missing. That's what Boeing's manuals say. To quote someone from the business "Just remove the winglet, put duct tape over it and fly the plane home". It's just going to consume more fuel on that one flight and the range as a result of fuel consumption will be reduced.

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Night Photos Beautiful shots taken while the sun is below the horizon

Accidents Accident, incident and crash related photos

Air to Air Photos taken by airborne photographers of airborne aircraft

Special Paint Schemes Aircraft painted in beautiful and original liveries

Airport Overviews Airport overviews from the air or ground

Tails and Winglets Tail and Winglet closeups with beautiful airline logos