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radarbeam
Posts: 998
Joined: Fri Mar 01, 2002 9:00 am

Official: Turkish Airlines Joining Star Alliance

Sat Aug 05, 2006 6:54 am

Congrats to THY! It'll be a pleasure to book our Aeroplan members on your metal!  Wink
 
Motorhussy
Posts: 3676
Joined: Thu Mar 30, 2000 7:49 am

Official: Turkish Airlines Joining Star Alliance

Sat Aug 05, 2006 7:05 am

As an aside, what's TK like? : on time record; cabin service; maintenance; network; scheduling; fleet age; cabin configuration; safety record etc? Presumably a top notch carrier if it's been invited to join the *alliance.

Regards
MH
come visit the south pacific
 
RIXrat
Posts: 674
Joined: Sun Nov 27, 2005 10:20 am

Official: Turkish Airlines Joining Star Alliance

Sat Aug 05, 2006 7:34 am

The last time I flew TK was IST-ATH in 1987 on a DC9. Boarding was via bus and the rear stairs where one could see that the aircraft had suffered at least one tail strike with no repairs being done. Duct tape over a small hole, as I remember. Other than that and the wild dogs at Athens Airport, the flight was uneventful.
 
User avatar
TK787
Posts: 4813
Joined: Wed Jan 04, 2006 3:43 am

Official: Turkish Airlines Joining Star Alliance

Sat Aug 05, 2006 7:44 am

Quoting MotorHussy (Reply 51):
As an aside, what's TK like? : on time record; cabin service; maintenance; network; scheduling; fleet age; cabin configuration; safety record etc? Presumably a top notch carrier if it's been invited to join the *alliance.

I wouldn't call TK a top notch carrier. On the plus side TK is a reliable carrier with good fares and a fairly good network, and they don't loose your luggage. 34" pitch in economy on A343 is very nice, and on longer flights you get a small amenity kit.
Here you can see their fairly young fleet (30 more A320,321,738s on the way):
http://www.thy.com/en-INT/corporate/about_us/fleet/index.aspx
Here you can see some of their network and schedules:
http://www4.thy.com/deparr/start.tk?lang=en
On the minus column:
TK doesn't have lie flat beds, nor 3 class planes.( I don't think they need them). A343s are going through int. refurbishment with PTVs. Cabin crew sometimes seems tired and missing smiles. In terms of safety, it has improved over the years. I often hear that the pax can't understand the English spoken by the FAs or the Pilots. I don't think it is any worse than any other similar size carriers. IST is getting crowded fast, and not a whole lot of room to expand. 2nd airport SAW ( pretty far away from IST in terms of transfers) is getting lots of LCC attention. A 3rd airport might be needed.
 
MCOflyer
Posts: 7089
Joined: Tue Jun 13, 2006 5:51 am

Official: Turkish Airlines Joining Star Alliance

Sat Aug 05, 2006 8:20 am

TK787,

It depnds on how many miles I have. If I have enogh to get me an upgrade, I just might do it. Other than that, It'll be about 4yrs where I can non-rev on the airline I become employed with.

MCOflyer
Never be afraid to stand up for who you are.
 
BMIFlyer
Posts: 8064
Joined: Mon Feb 23, 2004 7:11 am

Official: Turkish Airlines Joining Star Alliance

Sat Aug 05, 2006 8:47 am

Ah, great news.

I look forward to flying them  Smile



Lee
Sometimes You Can't Make It On Your Own
 
firiko
Posts: 133
Joined: Mon Nov 21, 2005 4:05 am

Official: Turkish Airlines Joining Star Alliance

Sat Aug 05, 2006 11:09 am

Does this mean we are going to be able to check our bags to our final

destinations with *A ? Because if u fly lets say IST To miami IST-JFK

with Tk and JFK-MIAMI with AA with the current codE share u need to claim

your bags at JFK and clear customs before you can go to miami. If the

alliance is going to change that a lot more people will start their us journey

with TK
 
Nimish
Posts: 2969
Joined: Mon Feb 14, 2005 6:46 pm

Official: Turkish Airlines Joining Star Alliance

Sat Aug 05, 2006 11:20 am

Quoting Firiko (Reply 56):
Because if u fly lets say IST To miami IST-JFK with Tk and JFK-MIAMI with AA with the current codE share u need to claim your bags at JFK and clear customs before you can go to miami.

That my friend, has nothing to do with TK/AA or code shares. That's just the law of the land - which states that all customs/immigrations must be cleared at the point of entry to the United states.
Incredible India!
 
firiko
Posts: 133
Joined: Mon Nov 21, 2005 4:05 am

Official: Turkish Airlines Joining Star Alliance

Sat Aug 05, 2006 12:07 pm

Quoting Nimish (Reply 57):
That my friend, has nothing to do with TK/AA or code shares. That's just the law of the land - which states that all customs/immigrations must be cleared at the point of entry to the United states.

Thanks for this. Well I must say that law makes life alot more difficult when traveling.
 
Motorhussy
Posts: 3676
Joined: Thu Mar 30, 2000 7:49 am

Official: Turkish Airlines Joining Star Alliance

Sat Aug 05, 2006 1:06 pm

Thanks for the info TK787.

Odd that they have the 738 as well as A319/20 I'd have thought. And hopefully NZ and TK will set up a codeshare at some point through HKG.

Welcome to *alliance TK.

Regards
MH
come visit the south pacific
 
manni
Posts: 4049
Joined: Thu Nov 08, 2001 1:48 am

Official: Turkish Airlines Joining Star Alliance

Sat Aug 05, 2006 1:26 pm

Quoting Beaucaire (Reply 18):
I copied that list off a German forum,indicating the 2006/2007 target cities for expansion.Even if some destinations will not be ready next year,it's an impressive growth-path underlining TK's drive for excellence.
I've rarely had bad experiences with TK ,but I expect IST to become a litle over-crowded soon. They lack another runway so some operations might have to start out of asian side operations.(Sabiha G�k�en airport )



Quoting Beaucaire (Reply 18):
-Busan

That's a long way from Turkye. Wonder where they think to find the public to fly on that route.

Quoting KWI (Reply 5):
It seems that all the surviving airlines from the Qualiflyer Group are now in the Star Alliance, Swiss Airlines, Tap Air Portugal, LOT, Austrian Airlines, and now Turkish Airlines.

Swiss is not a SURVIVING member of Qualiflyer, if you do include them you should consider SNBA aswell, and they're not a member of Star.
 
ORDTerminal1
Posts: 124
Joined: Sun May 28, 2006 3:35 am

Official: Turkish Airlines Joining Star Alliance

Sat Aug 05, 2006 1:30 pm

Who is sponsoring their membership?
I would guess LH and for no other reason than the fact that there are tons of Turkish in Germany?
717, 727, 732,733, 734, 735, 738, 742, 744, 752, 763, 319, 320, 340, F100
 
masseybrown
Posts: 5646
Joined: Wed Dec 11, 2002 2:40 pm

Official: Turkish Airlines Joining Star Alliance

Sat Aug 05, 2006 1:56 pm

Quoting ORDTerminal1 (Reply 61):
Who is sponsoring their membership?
I would guess LH ...

Probably. There is a history of German-Turkish cooperation dating back to the days of the Ottoman and German Empires.
 
copenhagenboy
Posts: 543
Joined: Fri Sep 14, 2001 11:03 pm

Official: Turkish Airlines Joining Star Alliance

Sat Aug 05, 2006 2:30 pm

Wow, I have never thought about TK joining Star, but it is only natural. Star is the biggest alliance in Europe, and there are so many Turkish people living in Germany, Denmark and all over Europe. Great move  Wink
 
pilotaydin
Posts: 2100
Joined: Tue Sep 07, 2004 12:30 am

Official: Turkish Airlines Joining Star Alliance

Sat Aug 05, 2006 4:36 pm

it's been rumored for a while now at the company, im glad it's public now. However as LAX said there are some stipulations before joining....

We are going to have to improve our check in and passenger services up to standards, as we will have much more international passengers....people need to know where to go and how to go in english it's very important for on time departures. Aside from that we will need to adjust more to slot times, because they are going to be killer with international connections, our ground handling will need to sharpen their skills and close flights on time. But on the flipside it will definately generate revenue and possibly new routes for me to fly  Smile yay

congrats  Smile
The only time there is too much fuel onboard, is when you're on fire!
 
HanginOut
Posts: 525
Joined: Sun May 29, 2005 3:24 am

Official: Turkish Airlines Joining Star Alliance

Sun Aug 06, 2006 2:23 am

Quoting AirCanada014 (Reply 48):
I wonder if AC will fly to Istanbul or codeshare on THY?

Currently, AC codeshares with LH to Istanbul. Until now AC wasn't very keen on TK flying to Canada (hence the reason bilateral air negotiations have been going nowhere), but now if/when they join Star AC may very well be more amenable to letting them fly to Canada (YYZ). In this case it would make sense to codeshare, but then considering how close LH and AC are, who knows what will happen.

As for AC flying to Istanbul, I don't see that as being very likely, but then again if the market between Canada and Turkey takes off and once the 787s are in the fleet I suppose anything is possible. It's more likely that TK will fly to Canada.

[Edited 2006-08-05 19:24:58]
 
DALelite
Posts: 1318
Joined: Thu Jun 01, 2000 7:00 am

Official: Turkish Airlines Joining Star Alliance

Sun Aug 06, 2006 3:23 am

i guess i am one of a very few not happy with TK joining Star. always hoped that TK one day might join Skyteam.
But it was more likely that they would go with One World since their code-share with AA.
Why does Star gets all the Top of the Notch Airlines? Besides Star is way to big.

regards: DALelite
They loved to fly and it showed..
 
Nimish
Posts: 2969
Joined: Mon Feb 14, 2005 6:46 pm

Official: Turkish Airlines Joining Star Alliance

Sun Aug 06, 2006 4:33 am

Quoting DALelite (Reply 66):
Besides Star is way to big

And the flip side of that is??

Star is still not represented in any local carrier in India - that's one gaping hole I hope they fill really fast.
Incredible India!
 
User avatar
yowza
Posts: 4514
Joined: Fri Jul 29, 2005 7:01 am

Official: Turkish Airlines Joining Star Alliance

Sun Aug 06, 2006 2:29 pm

Quoting Nimish (Reply 25):
Why would TK joining have anything to do with QR not joining?

Well there is a fair bit of overlap in routes that I don't think would be beneficial to star. Mind you landing QR would be so huge the Star braintrust might not care - just a thought.

YOWza
 
aircanada014
Posts: 1224
Joined: Sun Oct 09, 2005 2:24 pm

Official: Turkish Airlines Joining Star Alliance

Sun Aug 06, 2006 9:47 pm

Welcome aboard Turkish Airlines  Smile nice to see another airline chosing Star Alliance over a competer.
 
ricardofg
Posts: 592
Joined: Wed Feb 23, 2005 4:09 am

Official: Turkish Airlines Joining Star Alliance

Sun Aug 06, 2006 10:38 pm

Quoting TK787 (Reply 14):
What can we expect in terms of TK's aspirations to fly to YYZ, JNB/CPT,

From what I understood, TK has been wanting to fly into YYZ for a while now.
 
firiko
Posts: 133
Joined: Mon Nov 21, 2005 4:05 am

Official: Turkish Airlines Joining Star Alliance

Mon Aug 07, 2006 8:07 am

So how much is this merger likely to cost Turkish Airlines ?Can any insider tell us what needs to change in order to be able to join ?
 
hz747300
Posts: 2420
Joined: Thu Mar 11, 2004 11:38 pm

Official: Turkish Airlines Joining Star Alliance

Mon Aug 07, 2006 8:38 am

Quoting Firiko (Reply 58):
Thanks for this. Well I must say that law makes life alot more difficult when traveling.

Not really... Actually, it makes travelling easier. Once you have cleared customs in the US then you could transfer to anywhere, even TUS. Once you're in, you're in.
Keep on truckin'...
 
LOT767-300ER
Posts: 8526
Joined: Mon Jan 01, 2001 12:57 pm

Official: Turkish Airlines Joining Star Alliance

Mon Aug 07, 2006 9:19 am

Quoting OHLHD (Reply 37):
Quoting DALelite (Reply 11):
Delta never was a member of the Qualiflyer Group.

DALelite

Really??? I must have a wrong memory.

Probably, or you drank too much.

Qualiflyer members were: LOT Polish, Swissair, Sabena, TAP Air Portugal, Air Liberte, THY Turkish, Crossair, Air Littoral, Air Europe, Volare, PGA Portugalia, Balair and LTU.

The whole alliance was from Europe (if you count THY as Europe)

Infact in the USA, US Airways and AA were Qualiflyer partners, not Delta.

See http://qualiflyer.loyaltygate.com/partners/
 
abrelosojos
Posts: 4325
Joined: Sun May 29, 2005 6:48 am

Official: Turkish Airlines Joining Star Alliance

Mon Aug 07, 2006 12:01 pm

Now I hope Jet Airways and TAM join Star, and my alliance would be complete.

-A.
Live, and let live.
 
sq452
Posts: 996
Joined: Sat Apr 17, 2004 4:49 am

Official: Turkish Airlines Joining Star Alliance

Tue Aug 08, 2006 4:14 pm

I don't understand why so many people seem to think AI would make sense for star alliance.

Currently (in my opinion) out of the 17 (or is it 19) airlines in star, or that are joining star, the "worst" overall airline (service, cleanliness of planes, flight attendants, etc.) out of the pack there is US Airways, and even so, US Airways isn't THAT bad of an airline. I have heard horror stories about Air India. I know they are getting the 777, and they are making "upgrades" but in all of India, there are way better airlines than AI for a quality alliance like star alliance. Jet Airways is one, FOR SURE. I consistently hear great things about them. They may not have the international network yet, but they could easily become one of the "regional" star alliance members.

This move makes sense for Turkish. I know the debate will rage on and on and on about whether or not this is star allainces "mideast" airline, but I think that this is more "eurasia" than anything. Qatar Airways could still get in to an alliance (and given the quality of that airline and their growth and expansion potential, i think it makes 100% sense for them to join an alliance ASAP).

Quoting Abrelosojos (Reply 74):
TAM join Star

I agree, dump Varig with their problems and let TAM in!
SIN > CVG > BOS
 
gokmengs
Posts: 1283
Joined: Wed Mar 09, 2005 2:48 am

Official: Turkish Airlines Joining Star Alliance

Tue Aug 08, 2006 5:23 pm

Quoting Tommy777 (Reply 36):

So you dislike Turkey, or Turks. What fair comment, they shouldn't be in an alliance because of that???  Confused

Quoting Laxintl (Reply 32):

Gotta give you credit laxintl you called this way before everyone.
I wish TK and Star the best of luck.
Yaşa Mustafa Kemal Paşa Yaşa, Adın Yazılacak Mücevher Taşa
 
Nimish
Posts: 2969
Joined: Mon Feb 14, 2005 6:46 pm

Official: Turkish Airlines Joining Star Alliance

Tue Aug 08, 2006 11:37 pm

Quoting SQ452 (Reply 75):
I don't understand why so many people seem to think AI would make sense for star alliance.

Currently (in my opinion) out of the 17 (or is it 19) airlines in star, or that are joining star, the "worst" overall airline (service, cleanliness of planes, flight attendants, etc.) out of the pack there is US Airways, and even so, US Airways isn't THAT bad of an airline. I have heard horror stories about Air India. I know they are getting the 777, and they are making "upgrades" but in all of India, there are way better airlines than AI for a quality alliance like star alliance. Jet Airways is one, FOR SURE. I consistently hear great things about them. They may not have the international network yet, but they could easily become one of the "regional" star alliance members.

Well it's like this my friend:

* LH/AI, SQ/AI, LX/AI etc - lots of code shares already in place
* LH has been "dating" AI for the past few years (started before the Indian aviation market opened up). At that time AI was truly the only contender
* LH has currently started dating 9W as well
* 9W is currently mired in "security clearance" issues, and has been unable to start services to the US for the past year. No one seems to have a clear picture on when that will get sorted out.
* Even after all the planned expansion, 9W will probably still be smaller than AI/IC combined
* AI/IC merger is on the cards. Following that, their privatization is on the cards. They've both signed up for fleet replacement/enhancement and should have a much better fleet profile in a few years time. All if this makes AI/IC an interesting combination, with a huge potential
* 9W's recent mis-steps on acquiring S2 point to a serious weakness/failure in the management team.
* There were some questions on 9W's plan to acquire widebodies from both Boeing and Airbus, leading to an increase in the costs (due to the need to duplicate infrastructure).
* 9W is bleeding with the rest in the Indian market
* 9W do not seem to be keen to enter into any kind of code shares (probably fear of diluting their brand?). This seems to indicate a mind-set issue - they may want to wing it alone (purely a guess here)?
* Sure 9W's service is one of the best, but AI/IC's in-flight service is pretty good *when things are going right*. It breaks down completely when there's a problem - but that will hopefully be fixed once the merger/privatization completes.
* 9W has "traditionally" been very aligned to Skyteam - with close ties to NW/KLM. That may always spring up again
* 9W has recently also aligned with Oneworld - FFP agreements with BA/QF in place.
* 9W's currently mileage earning policy is much stricter than the standards at *A (Actually I think AI's are as well). Hence joining an alliance, would mean that both airlines would need to get liberal with handing out miles (500 mile minimum etc.)

So hence, there's nothing slam-dunk about either airline - I personally don't care much about which one joins, but I hope that one of them do quickly announce the intent, and then start the serious work it takes to join an alliance.!
Incredible India!
 
sq452
Posts: 996
Joined: Sat Apr 17, 2004 4:49 am

Official: Turkish Airlines Joining Star Alliance

Wed Aug 09, 2006 5:44 pm

Quoting Nimish (Reply 77):
* Sure 9W's service is one of the best, but AI/IC's in-flight service is pretty good *when things are going right*. It breaks down completely when there's a problem - but that will hopefully be fixed once the merger/privatization completes.

When things go right,  Smile lol...

Im sure a lot of the reasons you also listed had to do with a lot of international airlines wanting market access and "feed" from the subcontinent.

Quoting Nimish (Reply 77):
* LH/AI, SQ/AI, LX/AI etc - lots of code shares already in place

Again, I mostly think this was for revenue maximization and market access/feed from India. Sometimes it almost seems airlines will marry whoever, just as long as they get what they want. I took a few of those SQ flights with an AI codeshare, and while I always thought (from a service standpoint) marrying SQ with AI was like a cinderella pairing of beauty and the beast (just in terms of how vastly different the quality of the product is), SQ reaped so much $$$ from those flights with AI feed.

In terms of whether AI is a star alliance quality carrier, at this point I have to say no. Comparatively, if it were to enter star (at this present day in age) it would probably wind up being the worst airline in the alliance. 9W would be much better, but internally within their business they have some problems as you mentioned. Their product is miles better than AI from what i hear.

It took *A a while to get around to getting into China (and look, 2 airlines will join from China!), so I imagine the same sort of growing pains are going on right now in India similar to what was experienced there. LH was interested on getting Air China a few years ago, but the aviation market there was just barely starting to really mature.
SIN > CVG > BOS
 
pilotaydin
Posts: 2100
Joined: Tue Sep 07, 2004 12:30 am

RE: Official: Turkish Airlines Joining Star Alliance

Thu Aug 10, 2006 2:01 am

Quoting Tommy777 (Reply 36):

for God's sake....there's nothing more i hate than people saying something then saying they won't get into it...well let's see what you've got then....

Turkish Airlines is doing fine right now, but unfortunately for most of the world, anytime we buy a plane (from the choice of either american or airbus providers) we are acting political, anytime we open a route, we are acting political, anytime we want to join an alliance, it's political...well i have news for you, anything that involves ONE country and ANOTHER IS politicial...you don't think that European airlines flying to Africa is pure business and no politics? remember the colonies of Europe in Africa? well how come European airlines fly there now? POLITICS? hello? yeah....so there is nothing wrong with TK trying to join *A as you depict it for starters.

TK joining *A which is NOT A EUROPEAN ALLIANCE, it's Global, for god's sake US AIR AND UNITED are in it, that makes it political? should we join a south american alliance? i mean use your head before you say things that you think writes off the current status of a country, OF COURSE we are in the European region so we are going to try and strengthen our routes here, I just don't understand, if it's going to make us money and get out brand farther into the global sky, then yes, that is a political tactic, so where are you going by making such open ended blank statements?

things aren't so black and white, get on the internet, book a ticket to some other countries than the one you're in and stop letting tv shows and newspapers making your opinions for you...
The only time there is too much fuel onboard, is when you're on fire!
 
abrelosojos
Posts: 4325
Joined: Sun May 29, 2005 6:48 am

RE: Official: Turkish Airlines Joining Star Alliance

Thu Aug 10, 2006 3:18 am

Quoting Tommy777 (Reply 34):
An addition the *A could do without.



Quoting Tommy777 (Reply 36):
Politics more than money... But let's not discuss it here

= Why don't you elaborate more ... and not just start a flaming war? This doesnt do anything to add to the atmosphere on A.Net.

Quoting YOWza (Reply 24):
I guess this takes QR out of the Star Alliance picture, at least for now.

= God, I'd rather transit and do layovers in IST than DOH  Smile.

-A.
Live, and let live.
 
ORD Boy 2
Posts: 326
Joined: Fri Aug 25, 2000 12:25 pm

RE: Official: Turkish Airlines Joining Star Alliance

Thu Aug 10, 2006 3:27 am

Heres a thought, like RJ its an Arab carrier that does fly to TLV which most Arab carriers dont. What does this do to Egypt Airs bid to join Star?
 
kiwiandrew

RE: Official: Turkish Airlines Joining Star Alliance

Thu Aug 10, 2006 3:54 am

Quoting ORD Boy 2 (Reply 81):
Heres a thought, like RJ its an Arab carrier that does fly to TLV which most Arab carriers dont. What does this do to Egypt Airs bid to join Star?

TK is not an Arab carrier , Turkey is not an Arab country , Turks are not Arabs
 
kiwiandrew

RE: Official: Turkish Airlines Joining Star Alliance

Thu Aug 10, 2006 3:59 am

Quoting YOWza (Reply 24):
I guess this takes QR out of the Star Alliance picture, at least for now. Till now I think they would have been the perfect fit. Then again if they keep expanding like they have been they won't need to be in an alliance.

why does it take QR out of the picture ?

IST and DOH are about 4 hours flying apart , there are plenty of existing star carriers with hubs closer than that , even going back to the original 5 *A carriers there were close hubs : SK with CPH , ARN , OSL very close to LH with FRA and MUC , and AC with YYZ very close to UA at ORD and IAD , or AC at YVR close to UA at SFO ( closer than IST and DOH anyway )
 
Horus
Posts: 5131
Joined: Sun Feb 22, 2004 1:04 am

RE: Official: Turkish Airlines Joining Star Alliance

Thu Aug 10, 2006 4:05 am

Quoting ORD Boy 2 (Reply 81):
What does this do to Egypt Airs bid to join Star?

Egyptair are still planning on joining the alliance in 2008. The airline has been going through a major restructuring programme since 2004 (which is still ongoing) including opening a new maintenance/engineering base, expanding their network, increasing and streamlining their fleet, renovating and expanding their hub at CAI, etc

Horus
EGYPT: A 7,000 Year Old Civilisation
 
BMIFlyer
Posts: 8064
Joined: Mon Feb 23, 2004 7:11 am

RE: Official: Turkish Airlines Joining Star Alliance

Thu Aug 10, 2006 4:10 am

Quoting Horus (Reply 84):
Egyptair are still planning on joining the alliance in 2008

Oh excellent Big grin

I can't wait  Smile
Sometimes You Can't Make It On Your Own
 
Qazar
Posts: 200
Joined: Sat May 20, 2006 4:18 am

RE: Official: Turkish Airlines Joining Star Alliance

Fri Aug 11, 2006 11:25 am

What does this mean for MS
 
Horus
Posts: 5131
Joined: Sun Feb 22, 2004 1:04 am

RE: Official: Turkish Airlines Joining Star Alliance

Sat Aug 12, 2006 5:26 am

Quoting Qazar (Reply 86):
What does this mean for MS

No changes. TK and MS's route networks will complement one another rather than overlap. It would also give the alliance greater presence in the lucrative and fast expanding Middle Eastern market.


Horus
EGYPT: A 7,000 Year Old Civilisation
 
User avatar
LAXintl
Posts: 25466
Joined: Wed May 24, 2000 12:12 pm

RE: Official: Turkish Airlines Joining Star Alliance

Sat Aug 12, 2006 6:53 am

I doubt you'll see MS in Star. THY has been rightfully promised a certain regional exclusivity by the Alliance. Unless THY receives some other benefits or compensation it would unlikely support a MS bid.
I would think Star instead will look to tie up a Gulf carrier.

Considering OW has RJ now, I'd presume Skyteam would be most anxious to have a Middle Eastern carrier on its route map considering they lost out with THY and the future of MEA and Lebanon in general remain questionable.
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