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1337Delta764
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Delta - JFK-HNL Possible?

Mon Aug 14, 2006 10:21 am

With Delta's expansion of the JFK hub, some are expecting that JFK will surpass SLC as Delta's #3 hub. However, JFK lacks what the other three hubs have - service to HNL. JFK is one of the busiest airports for O&D traffic, and could really support nonstop 767-400ER service to HNL. I do believe that back when Delta operated the L-1011, they had DFW-HNL service. Currently, the only airport in the NYC area that currently has HNL service is EWR.

What are your thoughts on a potential JFK-HNL route?
 
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aloha73g
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RE: Delta - JFK-HNL Possible?

Mon Aug 14, 2006 10:31 am

HAHA....I think that everyone from Hawai'i will join me in being flattered at your implication that HNL service is so important.

I think that Delta may try JFK-HNL and if they do, I think it will do well. East Coast traffic to Hawai'i tends to be increasing, and also tends to be higher yielding than West Coast traffic. DL probably connects alot of people from NYC to HNL through ATL and subsequently knows how much traffic they will get 'automatically' on the route.

HA seemed fairly certain to start the route prior to 9/11 and is still rumoured to do so. I think it will be started by someone sooner rather than later....so why not DL.

-Aloha!
Aloha Airlines - The Spirit Moves Us. Gone but NEVER Forgotten. Aloha, A Hui Hou!
 
Tan Flyr
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RE: Delta - JFK-HNL Possible?

Mon Aug 14, 2006 10:35 am

Depends, can that market support a PROFITABLE nonstop flight in addition to the existing service? HNL is somewhat a lower yield deal, and airlines want to fill every seat to at least break even..thus the flights from collecting/connecting hubs farther west.

UA operated a DC-8-62 on the route from the mid 60's into the early 70's as I recall.

Depends if DL schedules enough connecting possibilites and if that is the most profitable use of a 763/764.
 
Cory6188
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RE: Delta - JFK-HNL Possible?

Mon Aug 14, 2006 10:36 am

Don't forget that CO already has daily nonstop service from EWR-HNL. Is there enough demand from the NYC area to support an additional flight? I have no idea, but I would hate to see DL add JFK-HNL service, thereby diluting yields and causing both DL and CO's service to become financially unprofitable, causing both carriers to drop the route, leaving New York without any service at all.
 
Boston92
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RE: Delta - JFK-HNL Possible?

Mon Aug 14, 2006 10:38 am

Quoting Aloha73G (Reply 1):
NYC to HNL through ATL

What a useless first leg, JFK-ATL-HNL, JFK-ATL gets you nowhere (except for maybe a couple hundered skymiles)!
 
MSYtristar
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RE: Delta - JFK-HNL Possible?

Mon Aug 14, 2006 10:40 am

ATA flew JFK-HNL with the L15 nonstop...I think it was three days a week....didn't last very long. Of course, it was all O&D traffic for that flight, but I don't see DL starting JFK-HNL anytime soon. More money to be made on new JFK-Europe flights.
 
deltaffindfw
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RE: Delta - JFK-HNL Possible?

Mon Aug 14, 2006 10:43 am

Quoting 1337Delta764 (Thread starter):
I do believe that back when Delta operated the L-1011, they had DFW-HNL service.

True - but it was not profitable. I remember talking to a F/A when DFW was a hub and she used to fly that route. There were many times when you saw 80% non-revs on the flight.
 
rwsea
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RE: Delta - JFK-HNL Possible?

Mon Aug 14, 2006 10:46 am

JFK-HNL could definitely fill a 763ER, especially if timed properly to connect to the European flights (back to back redeyes - yuck!).

However, as others have said, there are already plenty of connecting opportunities (SLC, CVG, SFO, LAX, ATL) and the plane could probably make the company more money flying to Europe and back.

The question isn't whether JFK-HNL could fill up - it certainly could. The question is if JFK-HNL would make more money than JFK-ARN or JFK-CPH or JFK-PRG or any other transatlantic destination.
 
dartland
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RE: Delta - JFK-HNL Possible?

Mon Aug 14, 2006 10:51 am

Quoting RwSEA (Reply 7):
The question isn't whether JFK-HNL could fill up - it certainly could. The question is if JFK-HNL would make more money than JFK-ARN or JFK-CPH or JFK-PRG or any other transatlantic destination.

Exactly. I agree with the arguements above.

I'll further add that HNL flights are great burn flights for frequent flier points -- which is actually good for the airlines (reduced FF liability, builds loyalty, etc.), but can just as easily be done via ATL/SLC/CVG, as people who are burning point don't generally care about stopping (and may even purchase a ticket for someone accompanying them!)
 
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aloha73g
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RE: Delta - JFK-HNL Possible?

Mon Aug 14, 2006 10:51 am

Quoting RwSEA (Reply 7):

The question isn't whether JFK-HNL could fill up - it certainly could. The question is if JFK-HNL would make more money than JFK-ARN or JFK-CPH or JFK-PRG or any other transatlantic destination.

Maybe as a winter complement. Hawai'i does well year round, with alot of 'snowbird' traffic which might be a good use of a 767 when many European destinations cut back in the winter.

I've provided articles and quotes many times in the past which prove that Hawai'i has been VERY profitable for airlines since 9/11 and that it was always atleast slightly profitable before then. Anyone familiar with Hawai'i can tell you that airfares to/from Hawai'i have increased alot recently and are much higher than transcon routes of similar length. Why else would every single airline have dramatically INCREASED the routes and seats available to Hawai'i in the last 5 years.

-Aloha!
Aloha Airlines - The Spirit Moves Us. Gone but NEVER Forgotten. Aloha, A Hui Hou!
 
LGAtoIND
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RE: Delta - JFK-HNL Possible?

Mon Aug 14, 2006 11:02 am

Does anyone know if Delta's 767-300ERs can make it JFK-HNL nonstop?
 
worldtraveler
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RE: Delta - JFK-HNL Possible?

Mon Aug 14, 2006 11:07 am

Delta just flew a 763 from Larnaca to Atlanta nonstop. JFKHNL is a cakewalk in comparison. DL has flown JFKHNL charters before on the 764.
 
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1337Delta764
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RE: Delta - JFK-HNL Possible?

Mon Aug 14, 2006 11:07 am

Quoting LGAtoIND (Reply 10):
Does anyone know if Delta's 767-300ERs can make it JFK-HNL nonstop?

Definately. I am pretty sure the 767-400ER could do it as well (Continental uses 767-400ERs on EWR-HNL).
 
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STT757
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RE: Delta - JFK-HNL Possible?

Mon Aug 14, 2006 11:07 am

Quoting TAN FLYR (Reply 2):
UA operated a DC-8-62 on the route from the mid 60's into the early 70's as I recall.

CO flew JFK-HNL nonstop with a DC-10-30 in the 1980s, they operated out of the Eastern Airlines Terminal.
Eastern Air lines flt # 701, EWR-MCO Boeing 757
 
EWRCabincrew
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RE: Delta - JFK-HNL Possible?

Mon Aug 14, 2006 11:08 am

DL could more than definitely do it. It would be good for another carrier in that market. Would be a welcome sight (that, and one more way to get to the islands - Hawaiian islands, that is).

Their 764s would be good. Although, the HNL flights are big mileage burners for the frequent fliers.

We do get a few connectors from Europe to the HNL non-stop. They love the fact they only have to stop once.
You can't cure stupid
 
gte439u
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RE: Delta - JFK-HNL Possible?

Mon Aug 14, 2006 11:10 am

Quoting LGAtoIND (Reply 10):
Does anyone know if Delta's 767-300ERs can make it JFK-HNL nonstop?

Easily!

For example, JFK-HNL= 4983 sm but JFK-IST= 5016 sm.
 
AeroWesty
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RE: Delta - JFK-HNL Possible?

Mon Aug 14, 2006 11:14 am

Quoting EWRCabincrew (Reply 14):
the HNL flights are big mileage burners for the frequent fliers.

DL only carries $40 of liability per 25,000 in SkyMiles accounts, so there's not the incentive other carriers might have to burn off FF miles with new Hawaiian routes.
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28thguy
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RE: Delta - JFK-HNL Possible?

Mon Aug 14, 2006 11:14 am

The other part of this question is would Delta be interested in JFK-HNL-SYD (nice mid-way stopping point versus LAX or SFO), and whether it could secure daily route authority (rather than 4x/week) to fly to SYD.

I suspect that a JFK-HNL-SYD flight, timed for connections ATL-HNL-SYD and SLC-HNL-SYD, might do quite well, and attract some premium fares as well.
 
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aloha73g
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RE: Delta - JFK-HNL Possible?

Mon Aug 14, 2006 11:17 am

Quoting Dartland (Reply 8):
I'll further add that HNL flights are great burn flights for frequent flier points

I think the free-seats factor is overstated on Hawai'i flights. My aunt has almost a million frequent flier miles (credit cards for her business) on various airlines (UA, HA, DL, CO, AA, AQ.....) so people in my family NEVER buy tickets.

I can't tell you how HARD it is to find seats using miles, there just are not very many available--the airlines are way too smart to give away so many seats that they would lose money. If people use the 'double miles' option for any seat, as we usually do, then thats a huge benefit for the airlines since the miles disappear that much faster.

Also, airlines make a riduculous amount of money on their credit cards which probably more than offsets the costs of free tickets. One of the airlines in Hawai'i makes over $10,000,000 a year in PROFIT on their credit card ($750,000+ every month) since the bank pays them 1 cent for every dollar spent ($75 million a month in this case). Imagine how much the big guys must make on theirs since they are so much larger than the airline in this case.

-Aloha!
Aloha Airlines - The Spirit Moves Us. Gone but NEVER Forgotten. Aloha, A Hui Hou!
 
HnlBoi
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RE: Delta - JFK-HNL Possible?

Mon Aug 14, 2006 11:23 am

I believe if CO's EWR-HNL route is profitable, DL's JFK-HNL route would do just as well. Ive flown CO' EWR-HNL route and its great. A big decision would be which airport do peolpe rather fly out of. JFK or EWR.
 
HnlBoi
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RE: Delta - JFK-HNL Possible?

Mon Aug 14, 2006 11:26 am

Quoting 28thguy (Reply 17):

One of the Airlines in the Sky Team alliance seriously needs to build up there pressence in the pacific which include SYD, AKL etc. Thats one part of the world where the sky team alliance lacks.
 
tommy767
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RE: Delta - JFK-HNL Possible?

Mon Aug 14, 2006 11:35 am

I'd vote for it to work. With DL expanding at JFK into the Euro markets from Kennedy, the HNL route is always possible.

What about US PHL-HNL 762 or even a few times a week JFK-HNL on AA 763?
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Boston92
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RE: Delta - JFK-HNL Possible?

Mon Aug 14, 2006 11:40 am

I think for HNL flights to work they have to originate either in SFO or LAX; or JKF or EWR, one coast or another. They will have traffic year round. These airports in the middle of the country would not do so well with HNL flights, mind me there are some exceptions.
 
flyguy1
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RE: Delta - JFK-HNL Possible?

Mon Aug 14, 2006 11:40 am

IIRC, wasn't something said recently by the DL COO, that they plan to be on all of the major continents by 2007? If so, a routing through HNL, on to SYD makes sense.
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JLDWC
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RE: Delta - JFK-HNL Possible?

Mon Aug 14, 2006 11:47 am

I think DL could give CO some very good competition, they may even be able to use a aircraft as small as a 752....about a week ago ATA flew a 752 (non-wingleted) nonstop from hnl-ewr...and the winds were terrible
 
EWRCabincrew
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RE: Delta - JFK-HNL Possible?

Mon Aug 14, 2006 11:52 am

Quoting JLDWC (Reply 24):
they may even be able to use a aircraft as small as a 752....about a week ago ATA flew a 752 (non-wingleted) nonstop from hnl-ewr...and the winds were terrible

Was it determined to be with passengers? A 757 wingleted or not could not do it with a full payload. I noticed that thread as well. DL would do it with a widebody, if at the very least.
You can't cure stupid
 
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STT757
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RE: Delta - JFK-HNL Possible?

Mon Aug 14, 2006 11:53 am

CO used to fly JFK-HNL-Sydney with a DC-10-30, I've though about CO flying this route today with the 767-400 from EWR however the traffic between NYC and Australia is not as much as to the West Coast.

Someone posted they flew Qantas between Los Angeles and JFK and there was 50 people aboard the 747-400, and some of them connected from other flights at LAX (Brisbane, Melbourne etc).

Traffic between Hawaii and Australia is alot lighter than traffic between California and Australia.

CO would be better off waiting for their 787s to arrive and operate Houston-Sydney nonstop, with onward service to EWR.

[Edited 2006-08-14 04:58:05]
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STT757
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RE: Delta - JFK-HNL Possible?

Mon Aug 14, 2006 11:53 am

Quoting HnlBoi (Reply 19):
I believe if CO's EWR-HNL route is profitable, DL's JFK-HNL route would do just as well.

CO has some advantages that make it worth it to support the route.

First they have the cargo that Air Mike supports between the US Mainland and Micronesia, Asia via Guam. CO flies from Honolulu to Nagoya, Guam, Majuro, Kwajalein, Pohnpei, Truk, Kosrae.

CO also has 767-400 maintenance facilities at both Honolulu and EWR, meaning they need to rotate aircraft from Micronesia to EWR or from EWR to Honolulu to receive work.


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Photo © Je89 W.



Delta for their size of operations at JFK does not have any hangars or Maintenance facilities at JFK.

Guam is receiving a tremendous influx of Government spending, Japan has agreed to pay Billions to move 8,000 Marines from Okinawa to Guam. When you factor in dependents and contractors you talking between 10,000-18,000 additional people, they all travel on Government contracts between the US and Guam which means CO via Honolulu.

The Navy is basing 4 attack Submarines at Apra Harbor Guam, the dependents and contractors that support are also going to Guam. The Navy wants to base additional surface ships at Guam which may include an Aircraft carrier. If they go ahead with that that will bring an additional 10,000-15,000 thousand to the Island.

Then there's Anderson AFB which is constantly under construction and Expansion, they now have a permanently assigned Air Wing supporting B-2s, B-1s, B-52s and will support a rotating Squadron of F-22s.

With all these addtional Goverment Contractors, military dependents traveling back and forth between the Mainland and Guam CO will see increased revenues and traffic.
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deltaguy767
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RE: Delta - JFK-HNL Possible?

Mon Aug 14, 2006 12:18 pm

I agree with what has been stated above, CO has a multitude of advantages flying to HNL from EWR so that even if they don't break even on the pax, it won't be a total loss. Perhaps DL should try to get slots at SYD and try a ATL/SLC/SFO/LAX-HNL-SYD for a little while during the more quiet winter when the European destinations decrease in pax. If it doesn't work, well at least they tried and didn't leave an a/c doing the Florida runs. But if it does, that could pave the way towards making DL the 2nd US carrier at SYD, and if they get 777-200LR/787, they can run more direct flights after building up a customer base.

Cheers from BDL and BAF,  wave 
DeltaGuy767
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AeroWesty
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RE: Delta - JFK-HNL Possible?

Mon Aug 14, 2006 12:23 pm

Quoting DeltaGuy767 (Reply 28):
Perhaps DL should try to get slots at SYD

Any U.S. carrier may fly to Australia. The bilateral states they may only have 4 frequencies to begin with before building up to daily service.

Quoting DeltaGuy767 (Reply 28):
that could pave the way towards making DL the 2nd US carrier at SYD

3rd, after UA and HA.  Wink
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supa7E7
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RE: Delta - JFK-HNL Possible?

Mon Aug 14, 2006 12:27 pm

Quoting Boston92 (Reply 22):
I think for HNL flights to work they have to originate either in SFO or LAX; or JKF or EWR, one coast or another. They will have traffic year round. These airports in the middle of the country would not do so well with HNL flights, mind me there are some exceptions.

The middle section of the nation

ORD, MSP, DFW, IAH

has VASTLY more Hawaii flights than the East Coast has.
"Who's to say spaceships aren't fine art?" - Phil Lesh
 
Boston92
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RE: Delta - JFK-HNL Possible?

Mon Aug 14, 2006 12:29 pm

Quoting Supa7E7 (Reply 30):
ORD, MSP, DFW, IAH

ORD and DFW would have been my two exceptions considering they are the two major hubs of UA and AA
 
EXAAUADL
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RE: Delta - JFK-HNL Possible?

Mon Aug 14, 2006 12:52 pm

Glen wants to fly JFK-HNL-SYD
 
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aloha73g
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RE: Delta - JFK-HNL Possible?

Mon Aug 14, 2006 12:55 pm

I've always felt that the SkyTeam carriers, should link up with HA to provide connections to SYD via HNL. The cities served by these carriers from HNL is pretty impressive (ATL, CVG, SLC, LAX, SFO, IAH, EWR, MSP, SEA, NRT, NGO, GUM, and the island hopper cities). If HA pushed their service to daily it could work really well....maybe even allow for the addition of MEL and AKL. They could also transfer a few pax to PPG and PPT.

-Aloha!
Aloha Airlines - The Spirit Moves Us. Gone but NEVER Forgotten. Aloha, A Hui Hou!
 
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SLCUT2777
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RE: Delta - JFK-HNL Possible?

Mon Aug 14, 2006 1:00 pm

Quoting 1337Delta764 (Thread starter):
With Delta's expansion of the JFK hub, some are expecting that JFK will surpass SLC as Delta's #3 hub. However, JFK lacks what the other three hubs have - service to HNL. JFK is one of the busiest airports for O&D traffic, and could really support nonstop 767-400ER service to HNL.

Keep in mind SLC and JFK are two ENTIRELY DIFFERENT TYPES OF HUBS. SLC is a major inland interior network connection hub for the far west, and JFK is Delta's International gateway across "The Pond" along the eastern seaboard. The way things seam to be going is that SLC will becomes #2 for DL and CVG and JFK will vie for #3.
Could DL do a JFK-HNL run on a 764ER? Absolutely! As other threads pointed out, the 764ER does have the range to do this route, but is it really a viable route? Keep in mind the eastern seaboard has very close geographical access to the Caribbean and can be to many destinations there in a mere 3 hours when compared to 10-11 to get to the Hawaiian Islands. In fact it isn't until you get to SLC in the west that you reach the break-even point geographically as far as flight time to either destination. SLC is one hour less in flight actual time to two Dominican Republic resort based airports; POP & PUJ (if DL offered direct flights there without going through ATL from SLC) than they are to HNL, OGG & KOA. Why go to Oahu when you can be in St Lucia in only one third the time?
So when it all gets settled, it might be a great idea to originate a Hawaii flight at JFK to HNL, but route it through SLC to better assure a full 764ER.
DELTA Air Lines; The Only Way To Fly from Salt Lake City; Let the Western Heritage always be with Delta!
 
MalpensaSFO
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RE: Delta - JFK-HNL Possible?

Mon Aug 14, 2006 10:37 pm

Quoting SLCUT2777 (Reply 34):
Why go to Oahu when you can be in St Lucia in only one third the time?

Ala Moana
Diamond Head
Hanauma Bay
Honolulu
North Shore
Pearl Harbor
Polynesian Cultural Center
Sandy Beach
USS Arizona Memorial
USS Missouri
Waikîkî
Waimea Falls
Sea Life Park

Quoting SLCUT2777 (Reply 34):
So when it all gets settled, it might be a great idea to originate a Hawaii flight at JFK to HNL, but route it through SLC to better assure a full 764ER.

SLC is not needed. If Delta Airlines does add JFK-HNL it would not be daily, but would 4 or 5 x a week. Delta Airlines would have a hard time turning the aircraft in a 24 hour period.
TO FLY IS TO SERVE
 
Alitalia744
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RE: Delta - JFK-HNL Possible?

Mon Aug 14, 2006 10:50 pm

Quoting EXAAUADL (Reply 32):
Glen wants to fly JFK-HNL-SYD

If you're referring to Hauenstein, you are correct my friend Wink
Some see lines, others see between the lines.
 
rjpieces
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RE: Delta - JFK-HNL Possible?

Mon Aug 14, 2006 11:04 pm

Quoting STT757 (Reply 13):
CO flew JFK-HNL nonstop with a DC-10-30 in the 1980s, they operated out of the Eastern Airlines Terminal.

That's pretty cool...I wonder what happened to the CO employees who worked at JFK at the Eastern Terminal..
"Millions long for immortality who do not know what to do with themselves on a rainy Sunday afternoon"
 
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STT757
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RE: Delta - JFK-HNL Possible?

Mon Aug 14, 2006 11:18 pm

Quoting RJpieces (Reply 37):
That's pretty cool...I wonder what happened to the CO employees who worked at JFK at the Eastern Terminal..

The CO flights at JFK were handled mostly by Eastern Employees since they were both part of the Texas Air Corporation, when Eastern's Pilots/Mechanics went on strike Eastern reorganized their operations by consolidating at EWR, LGA and Islip.

When Eastern closed their JFK operation CO ended the JFK-Honolulu flights, the flights were moved to EWR for another year but were then ceased until CO re-launched EWR-HNL in '97 or '98. When CO re-launced EWR-HNL it was a DC-10-30, it then switched to the 767-400 around 2000.

Here's some more photos of CO's Honolulu maintenance base, note the CO Mike 747-200s.


Big version: Width: 432 Height: 288 File size: 90kb


Big version: Width: 432 Height: 288 File size: 74kb


Big version: Width: 432 Height: 288 File size: 54kb
Eastern Air lines flt # 701, EWR-MCO Boeing 757
 
SeeTheWorld
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RE: Delta - JFK-HNL Possible?

Mon Aug 14, 2006 11:43 pm

Quoting TAN FLYR (Reply 2):
UA operated a DC-8-62 on the route from the mid 60's into the early 70's as I recall.

Yep, my grandparents, from Queens, took that flight in the early 1970s when the met us in Maui for a family vacation. I was so jealous, as I thought taking such a long nonstop flight would be really cool. I remember asking my grandmother if there were two movies (since UA should movies transcon, and to Hawaii). She just laughed, and said, "of course not." That was back when the movies were on these huge three-foot diameter reels and loaded into each of the projection systems on the roof of the cabin. I think the DC-8 had three of them (one in FC and two in Coach). Aw, a completely different time.
 
pmg1704
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RE: Delta - JFK-HNL Possible?

Tue Aug 15, 2006 12:12 am

Quoting Cory6188 (Reply 3):
but I would hate to see DL add JFK-HNL service, thereby diluting yields and causing both DL and CO's service to become financially unprofitable

I would love to see DL add JFK-HNL, bring on the competition! We want to keep prices high? In reality, how much competition would it really be? Long Islanders/Brooklyn/Queens don't want to shlep to EWR and same for New Jerseyans to JFK.

(Just priced nyc-hnl 8/28-9/4, CO=$1512, UA/NW/DL 1 stop=$474, I think there's room for competition on a nonstop) ref: Kayak.com

Quoting Cory6188 (Reply 3):
causing both carriers to drop the route, leaving New York without any service at all.

...which would cause a vacuum and we all know that nature and Airline CFOs both abhor a vacuum.
 
DAL767400ER
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RE: Delta - JFK-HNL Possible?

Tue Aug 15, 2006 12:19 am

Quoting MalpensaSFO (Reply 35):
Delta Airlines would have a hard time turning the aircraft in a 24 hour period.

Unless of course they plan the schedules so that a JFK arrival continue on to LAX/SLC/SFO or vv. Turn times on the islands for DL still appear quite a bit long, so something would be possible. Not to say that only 4-5x weekly service wouldn't be appropriate capacity for the market.
 
MalpensaSFO
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RE: Delta - JFK-HNL Possible?

Tue Aug 15, 2006 12:22 am

Quoting DAL767400ER (Reply 41):
Not to say that only 4-5x weekly service wouldn't be appropriate capacity for the market

Perfect fits would be a rotation similar to the following:

4 x JFK-MXP
3 x JFK-HNL

4 x JFK-ATH
3 x JFK-HNL

Additionally does anyone know if the talk is true about the following 757 routes from JFK?

JFK-LYS
JFK-MRS
JFK-LIS
JFK-BHX
JFK-CPH
JFK-LUX
JFK-CGN
JFK-GLA
JFK-HAJ

[Edited 2006-08-14 17:24:55]
TO FLY IS TO SERVE
 
Alitalia744
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RE: Delta - JFK-HNL Possible?

Tue Aug 15, 2006 12:39 am

Quoting MalpensaSFO (Reply 42):
Perfect fits would be a rotation similar to the following:

4 x JFK-MXP
3 x JFK-HNL

4 x JFK-ATH
3 x JFK-HNL

You'll see something similar to that.

Quoting MalpensaSFO (Reply 42):
Additionally does anyone know if the talk is true about the following 757 routes from JFK?

JFK-LYS
JFK-MRS
JFK-LIS
JFK-BHX
JFK-CPH
JFK-LUX
JFK-CGN
JFK-GLA
JFK-HAJ

not sure LUX, HAJ and MRS are on the list, but pretty close  Smile
Some see lines, others see between the lines.
 
PanAm747
Posts: 4711
Joined: Mon Mar 01, 2004 4:46 am

RE: Delta - JFK-HNL Possible?

Tue Aug 15, 2006 12:42 am

I don't think you'll be seeing DL flying JFK-HNL anytime soon.

When one considers that right now international flights are where the money is, it would seem to me that DL would put any wide-body jets on routes to Europe out of JFK.

A while back, there was a thread on the possibility of United flying IAD-Hawai'i, and I inquired as to how many UA cities on the east coast had only IAD but no ORD flights - there were only two or three. I would imagine the same situation would exist with DL - what is accessible via JFK that is NOT accessible from ATL?
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DAL767400ER
Posts: 5084
Joined: Wed Feb 09, 2005 2:47 am

RE: Delta - JFK-HNL Possible?

Tue Aug 15, 2006 12:44 am

Quoting Alitalia744 (Reply 43):
not sure LUX, HAJ and MRS are on the list, but pretty close

Hope that "pretty close" in the case of HAJ refers to HAM  Silly . Okay, for going to JAX I'd still have to connect in ATL, but still, better 2 domestic segments than even one on AF  Wink .
 
MalpensaSFO
Posts: 1110
Joined: Mon Feb 20, 2006 10:17 am

RE: Delta - JFK-HNL Possible?

Tue Aug 15, 2006 12:45 am

Quoting PanAm747 (Reply 44):
A while back, there was a thread on the possibility of United flying IAD-Hawai'i

Considering that United Airlines flys from San Diego, Seattle, San Francisco, Los Angeles, Denver, and Chicago to Hawaii there is little room left for Washington. IAD. Compared to Delta that flys from Cincinatti, Atlanta, Los Angeles, San Francisco, and Salt Lake to Hawaii.
TO FLY IS TO SERVE
 
User avatar
SLCUT2777
Posts: 3476
Joined: Sun Jan 01, 2006 12:17 am

RE: Delta - JFK-HNL Possible?

Tue Aug 15, 2006 1:10 am

Quoting MalpensaSFO (Reply 35):
Ala Moana
Diamond Head
Hanauma Bay
Honolulu
North Shore
Pearl Harbor
Polynesian Cultural Center
Sandy Beach
USS Arizona Memorial
USS Missouri
Waikîkî
Waimea Falls
Sea Life Park

While these sites are all attractive, the average New Yorker seeking a tropical getaway will look at the time spent going to and from a particular destination. That said I can agree with you and see DL doing seasonal service from JFK to HNL 3-5x from November to April when tropical getaways are appealing.
DELTA Air Lines; The Only Way To Fly from Salt Lake City; Let the Western Heritage always be with Delta!
 
slcdeltarumd11
Posts: 4760
Joined: Fri Jan 09, 2004 7:30 am

RE: Delta - JFK-HNL Possible?

Tue Aug 15, 2006 3:19 am

what would be the point of a JFK-HNL non-stop flight????

delta can easily route people from ewr OR jfk to multiple hawaiian airports with one stop in Salt Lake City.

Some airliners.net memebers need to come back to earth and realize that most people dont care about stopping once especially on a long trip to HNL. Most people buy tickets based on price. PERIOD

Most people in the "real world" buy plane tickets and after you talk to them ask them where they are connecting. Most have no idea and dont care until they get to the airport and see the boarding passes.

This would be a waste of a plane that could be used on a europe/asia/africa route to generate more money.

If someone cared so much about a non-stop to HNL they could go to EWR on skyteam partner continental who offerers a MUCH MUCH nicer 767-400ER.

Also EWR is a much better location and easier to get to for most people in the NYC area . JFK is such a terrible airport to get to from manh, conn, or NJ traffic, traffic, traffic, traffic, traffic, congesstion, ass hole drivers  Sad EWR has the train very easy from manh and conn. everytime i park at EWR i notice how many conn, pen, and ny plates you see. LGA and EWR are the prefered domestic airports in the NYC area. JFK is just the hardest to get to. for a domestic flight its just not worth the hassle. JFK is getting all the expansion now because it is less congested and less delays then EWR and LGA its still a worse location people in the New York.

I wish all the co/dl merger scenario boards would stop saying if co and dl megered that EWR hub would be moved to JFK. All from people that dont live or understand NYC. Its a worse location. Yes, we have very bad traffic here. CO does GREAT out of EWR and its the better location. The NYC area needs more airports. badly. in upstate ny prob. I would love to give the people who want to move the ewr flights to jfk a rental car on a weekday at rush hour and see how long it takes them to drive from EWR to JFK.


 Smile sorry for the book
 
Alitalia744
Posts: 3800
Joined: Thu Mar 30, 2000 8:22 am

RE: Delta - JFK-HNL Possible?

Tue Aug 15, 2006 3:22 am

Quoting Slcdeltarumd11 (Reply 48):
what would be the point of a JFK-HNL non-stop flight????

delta can easily route people from ewr OR jfk to multiple hawaiian airports with one stop in Salt Lake City.

Some airliners.net memebers need to come back to earth and realize that most people dont care about stopping once especially on a long trip to HNL. Most people buy tickets based on price. PERIOD

Most people in the "real world" buy plane tickets and after you talk to them ask them where they are connecting. Most have no idea and dont care until they get to the airport and see the boarding passes.

This would be a waste of a plane that could be used on a europe/asia/africa route to generate more money.

If someone cared so much about a non-stop to HNL they could go to EWR on skyteam partner continental who offerers a MUCH MUCH nicer 767-400ER.

Also EWR is a much better location and easier to get to for most people in the NYC area . JFK is such a terrible airport to get to from manh, conn, or NJ traffic, traffic, traffic, traffic, traffic, congesstion, ass hole drivers EWR has the train very easy from manh and conn. everytime i park at EWR i notice how many conn, pen, and ny plates you see. LGA and EWR are the prefered domestic airports in the NYC area. JFK is just the hardest to get to. for a domestic flight its just not worth the hassle. JFK is getting all the expansion now because it is less congested and less delays then EWR and LGA its still a worse location people in the New York.

I wish all the co/dl merger scenario boards would stop saying if co and dl megered that EWR hub would be moved to JFK. All from people that dont live or understand NYC. Its a worse location. Yes, we have very bad traffic here. CO does GREAT out of EWR and its the better location. The NYC area needs more airports. badly. in upstate ny prob. I would love to give the people who want to move the ewr flights to jfk a rental car on a weekday at rush hour and see how long it takes them to drive from EWR to JFK.


sorry for the book

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