Taking Water Onboard - An Idea

bsu747 · Sun Aug 20, 2006 3:23 pm

If not taking liquids onto a plane becomes the way off life from now on, here's what I suggest on flights over an hour long, where the water has already been security cleared and is in a clear bottle. Also surely it can't be that expensive for the airlines to supply water since they could buy it in bulk.

Would it not be a better idea to supply each passenger a bottle of water as they board the plane?
1, People could get a bottle on the air bridge prior to boarding the plane. (this could be open to abuse)
2, The flight attendants could hand you a bottle as you board the plane as they check your boarding card. At least if you want a bottle you can get one and everyone gets the opportunity to "take a drink onboard"
3, Leave a bottle on every seat during the turnaround so that each passenger has a drink. (this could be open to abuse)

I think number 2 would be a better option as it could save the FA some time during flight, it also helps the passengers from developing an initial thirst should the flight be delayed in taking off & also might save a bit of weight being carried on the plane as the FA can leave any excess water at the gate. It would be a time-saver for the FA as they would not have passengers pushing the call button as often earlier in the flight when they could be getting any meal service ready.

I have had this a few times when boarding international flights and it certainly helped both me the passenger and the FA.

I only want to keep this topic related to water as it is a simple and cheap method and is the best thing to drink in flight anyway.
I apologise if this has been covered already.

Thomas_Jaeger · Sun Aug 20, 2006 7:01 pm

This seems to be getting a standard on most longer flights anyway (typically either water distributed as soon as boarding has completed or in your seatback pocket already when you board). Have seen this on DL, EY, LX, QR etc. recently.

mariner · Sun Aug 20, 2006 7:20 pm

I don't understand what the fuss is about - why do you have to have your own bottle of water?

In a long life of flying, with good and bad airlines, I have never been refused water on an aircraft when I asked for it.

???

mariner

Carfield · Sun Aug 20, 2006 7:41 pm

Finnair is handing out bottles of water on my HEL-HKG flight two days ago to everyone, J and Y. It is definitely a good way to handle the current liquid ban.

About bottles of water, it takes sometimes for F/As to set up the galley carts before being able to do the first beverage service. Sometimes there are ATC delays, turbulence on climbout and various reasons that can further delay the flight. Most passengers, including me, often bring a bottle of water with me for that reason, and also not all airlines are like CX, SQ, or LX, which came around with water and juice every hour in all cabin classes.

I definitely say yes to handing out water bottles during boarding.

Carfield

eoinnz · Sun Aug 20, 2006 8:08 pm

I think (if bottles were to be given out) the bottles of water should be given once everyone is seated. Boarding takes long enough without the extra task of giving people water, they already have their hands full. Also there would not be enough room to have up to 400 bottles of water at the door.

aerorobnz · Sun Aug 20, 2006 8:14 pm

every seat in U class and C Class had a sipper bottle of water in onboard NZ to LAX and back, and I recall AR doing the same in economy. I thought most airlines did this already...

kalakaua · Sun Aug 20, 2006 8:54 pm

Is it possible to take on board, a frozen bottle of water?

cloudyapple · Sun Aug 20, 2006 9:48 pm

Quoting Kalakaua (Reply 6):
a frozen bottle of water?

Very funny~

iairallie · Sun Aug 20, 2006 10:09 pm

Seriously though a frozen bottle of water is solid not a liquid one could argue it doesn't meet the ban requirements.

Duggy · Sun Aug 20, 2006 10:34 pm

BMI have offered bottles of water from a rack when boarding for longhaul flights for a while (don't know if they're still doing this with the new security procedures however) for passengers to take onto the plane.

Also, Virgin Atlantic are installing water fountains in economy on their new A340-600's and on existing A340-600's when they remove the mid-cabin galley.

28thguy · Sun Aug 20, 2006 10:50 pm

I was on an American Airlines from Miami to New York yesterday where the F/A refused water to a mother trying to prepare baby formula for a crying baby because "service does not begin until we reach cruising altitude."

I was so mad at watching that incident that I won't be flying AA anytime soon again.

Delta seems to be the best about providing water.

iairallie · Sun Aug 20, 2006 10:59 pm

We're the FA's still in jumpseats strapped in and the mom rang a call bell or were they allready up out of their seats?

28thguy · Sun Aug 20, 2006 11:41 pm

Walking down the aisle. No call button.

Just another male flight attendent at AA with a bad, unpleasant attitude. That's why I prefer Delta and Continental and try to avoid AA, although it is my company's preferred carrier.. nicer F/As on DL and CO.

sk736 · Mon Aug 21, 2006 12:55 am

In the UK, there's no restriction on taking bottles of water on board. The restriction is on taking them through the security check point. You simply buy your water in the departure lounge and take it on board without any problems at all (except on flights to the USA of course, where water is the seen as the latest example of WMD Wink

brilondon · Mon Aug 21, 2006 1:02 am

I have never been on a flight where water is not available even on very short flights i.e. YXU-YYZ on AC there was water available. Cool

skyyblue · Mon Aug 21, 2006 1:18 am

Quoting BSU747 (Thread starter):
Would it not be a better idea to supply each passenger a bottle of water as they board the plane?

For what? Please keep in mind that planes aren't catered at every station and sometimes we have to stretch our supplies for a whole roundtrip (i.e. JFK-DEN-JFK). Flights are full and we have limited space. My airline has already added an extra water cart and sometimes we still get really low on longhauls. Handing them out to everyone during boarding would only deplete our limited supply faster.

I have absolutely NO problem handing out water on request during boarding, nor would I ever deny someone. I just don't see what the big deal is. If you know you will be thirsty buy some water or Gatorade in the terminal and drink it before you board.

bsu747 · Mon Aug 21, 2006 2:25 am

Quoting SKYYBLUE (Reply 15):
For what? Please keep in mind that planes aren't catered at every station and sometimes we have to stretch our supplies for a whole roundtrip (i.e. JFK-DEN-JFK). Flights are full and we have limited space. My airline has already added an extra water cart and sometimes we still get really low on longhauls. Handing them out to everyone during boarding would only deplete our limited supply faster.

I was only making this suggesstion in the event of a ban being enforced whereby you are not being able to take any liquid that you have purchased being taken onto the aircraft even if you have purchased in the secure area, such as current rules on flights from the UK to the USA.
Another idea is that the ground station itself provides the water so that only water that the passenger wants is taken onto the plane, in the same way that pre packed meals used to be handed out at the gate. I'm not saying every flight but those which might be over 60 minutes flying time or when the weather is very hot.

Quoting SKYYBLUE (Reply 15):
I have absolutely NO problem handing out water on request during boarding, nor would I ever deny someone. I just don't see what the big deal is. If you know you will be thirsty buy some water or Gatorade in the terminal and drink it before you board.

My argument regarding this is delays can happen on departure whereby the FA are strapped to their seats or performing other duties. If you force drink yourself before flying you are going to have some passengers who might need to go to the toilet at a critical stage during departure.

jumbojet · Mon Aug 21, 2006 2:53 am

On a related subject, at Yankee stadium, anyone entering the stadium with a bottle of water or whatever the liquid may be is forced to open the bottle and consume from the bottle while security watches. Anyone who doesn't follow this procedure is denied entry into the stadium. Can you imagine the same policy on an airliner?

UpperDeck79 · Mon Aug 21, 2006 3:31 am

Quoting Carfield (Reply 3):
Finnair is handing out bottles of water on my HEL-HKG flight two days ago to everyone, J and Y. It is definitely a good way to handle the current liquid ban.

There is no liquid ban on Europe-Asia flights. Finnair has been doing this was years! I like it, although I still always carry my own bottle of water onboard.

777ER · Mon Aug 21, 2006 4:33 am

Quoting Jumbojet (Reply 17):
at Yankee stadium, anyone entering the stadium with a bottle of water or whatever the liquid may be is forced to open the bottle and consume from the bottle while security watches.

What drink the whole bottle or just take a mouth full to convince security?

mariner · Mon Aug 21, 2006 4:59 am

On the bright side, if the ban kills the concept of a bottle of designer water as a fashion statement, people will save a fair amount of money.

Smile

cheers

mariner

flight7e7 · Mon Aug 21, 2006 5:41 am

Ok, so buying the beverage (water, et. al.) in the sterile boarding/departure lounge-area, whatever you want to call it....if asked by a gate agent or flight attendant for whatever reason...what proof do you have it was purchased inside security-besides a receipt? Can you imagine the chaos that would cause-"sir I need to see your bording pass, passport and/or photo ID and a receipt for your beverage?

Let's face it-security is one thing, and traveling as I do, OC behavior on the part of any government in the free world is beyond reasonable. In a way, the damn terrorist have "softly" acheived wreaking havoc with the global aviation system. Not to say discount entirely that something good did not come out of this melee, but when is enough, truly enough?

Bush-Blair, etc. "We will not allow them to keep us from living our lives normally".....I don't think so....

Any way, just MHO.

Cheers

kaddyuk · Mon Aug 21, 2006 5:57 am

I Dont drink Potable water, most water supplied on flights comes from the taps...

I know how they're cleaned and i even feel dirty washing my hands in the water onboard. I'll only drink bottled water on the aircraft...

mariner · Mon Aug 21, 2006 6:02 am

Quoting Kaddyuk (Reply 22):
I know how they're cleaned and i even feel dirty washing my hands in the water onboard. I'll only drink bottled water on the aircraft...

Your faith in the manufacturers of designer water is quite touching.

Smile

cheers

mariner

brilondon · Mon Aug 21, 2006 6:04 am

Quoting 28thguy (Reply 12):
Just another male flight attendent at AA with a bad, unpleasant attitude. That's why I prefer Delta and Continental and try to avoid AA, although it is my company's preferred carrier.. nicer F/As on DL and CO.

Flight attendents on domestic flights on AA seem to have an idea that they are only there because the law mandates a certain number of attendents. AA flight attendents on intermnational flights could not be more friendly and helpful so lets not blame a whole airline for the rotten attitude of a few FA's. frown

Chances are the lady in question probably was not the most patient to deal with considering she has a young child who is still drinking formula and probably was not in the best of moods. Angry

Panman · Mon Aug 21, 2006 7:00 am

Quoting Mariner (Reply 23):
Your faith in the manufacturers of designer water is quite touching.

Trust me, if you knew how the water onboard aircraft is sterilized you wouldn't drink it either. I have done that job once, after doing it, I was not too convinced that the water was actually sterilized. I said there is no way in hell that I am ever drinking water on a commercial flight again. That includes tea and coffee as the boilers on aircraft do not actually boil the water. That, and also the incident a colleague of mine at work told me involving an aircraft, a blocked tap in the lav, and a three foot long tape worm!!

kaddyuk · Mon Aug 21, 2006 8:14 am

Quoting Mariner (Reply 23):
Your faith in the manufacturers of designer water is quite touching.

Hey, at least i know they dont have to add copious amounts of chlorine to the water for it to be "safe" to drink...

Have you ever seen INSIDE a water tank on an aircraft?

Flyboy14295 · Mon Aug 21, 2006 8:21 am

Quoting Panman (Reply 25):
That, and also the incident a colleague of mine at work told me involving an aircraft, a blocked tap in the lav, and a three foot long tape worm!!

I will never drink warter fron an airplane again(like I ever Did)

Quoting Kaddyuk (Reply 26):
Have you ever seen INSIDE a water tank on an aircraft?

It would probably be interesting to see but probably disgusting at the same time!

Motorhussy · Mon Aug 21, 2006 8:27 am

Quoting Flyboy14295 (Reply 27):
Quoting Kaddyuk (Reply 26):
Have you ever seen INSIDE a water tank on an aircraft?

It would probably be interesting to see but probably disgusting at the same time!

There are some things it's just best not to know.

jumbojet · Mon Aug 21, 2006 8:27 am

Quoting 777ER (Reply 19):
What drink the whole bottle or just take a mouth full to convince security?

just a mouthful. Its actually pretty funny to watch this.

Starlionblue · Mon Aug 21, 2006 8:31 am

Quoting 28thguy (Reply 10):
I was on an American Airlines from Miami to New York yesterday where the F/A refused water to a mother trying to prepare baby formula for a crying baby because "service does not begin until we reach cruising altitude."

I was so mad at watching that incident that I won't be flying AA anytime soon again.

As Brilondon says, AA F/As are quite uneven. Some are fantastic. Some are horrible. That's the crappy part. It's like a lottery. I have written several letters to AA Customer Relations about this and gotten very nice replies. But they did tell me "we cannot mandate our F/As to smile". To which I replied "Why the heck not?"

As for water, I agree that a bottle of water for everyone would make life easier for everyone.

Also, I seriously think that allowing trial size toiletries (say, up to 50ml) would make road warriors happy (and thus the airlines) and free up security from the pointless task of looking for teeny bottles and tubes. This would give them time to find large bottles of Gatorade and, you know, explosives.

hmmmm... · Mon Aug 21, 2006 8:40 am

They used to make the flight attendants smile in the good old days. Now, the unions tell the airline what goes and what doesn't. In the '60s and '70s, you would never have gotten that flip response from airline management.

This liquid ban is silly. As far as I know, explosives also come in solid form. Plastic explosive can be shaped into any form. They must ban all items from the passengers, or nothing. Banning only liquids just displaces the threat from liquid back to solid form. Once a terrorist blows up a plane with a watch, or a pen made from plastic explosive, then we will have to board the plane naked.

The authorites are always one step behind the terrorists.

Motorhussy · Mon Aug 21, 2006 8:56 am

Quoting Hmmmm... (Reply 31):
The authorites are always one step behind the terrorists.

And sometimes the authorities are the terrorists.

KE007
IR655

Regards
MH

YULWinterSkies · Mon Aug 21, 2006 9:07 am

Quoting Kaddyuk (Reply 22):
I Dont drink Potable water, most water supplied on flights comes from the taps...

I know how they're cleaned and i even feel dirty washing my hands in the water onboard. I'll only drink bottled water on the aircraft...

Water in the lavatories on aircraft is NOT potable water, it is clearly mentioned near the tap...

Quoting Hmmmm... (Reply 31):
Once a terrorist blows up a plane with a watch, or a pen made from plastic explosive, then we will have to board the plane naked.

Well, actually replace "a terrorist blows up" by "authorities think that terrorists are about to blow up".

alfa75 · Mon Aug 21, 2006 9:14 am

Quoting Panman (Reply 25):
I have done that job once,

Sounds like a job for that "Dirty Jobs" show!

hmmmm... · Mon Aug 21, 2006 9:17 am

Quoting MotorHussy (Reply 32):
And sometimes the authorities are the terrorists.

I don't get this. Are you saying that KAL 007 was destroyed by a terrorist bomb brought on board by a government agent? Because that is the topic of discussion, not whether or not airliners have been shot down. That is another topic completely.

luv2fly · Mon Aug 21, 2006 9:23 am

Quoting Mariner (Reply 20):
On the bright side, if the ban kills the concept of a bottle of designer water as a fashion statement, people will save a fair amount of money.

How true! I remember growing up we never had to constantly have a beverage at are disposal 24/7!

skywatch · Mon Aug 21, 2006 10:02 am

Quoting Kalakaua (Reply 6):
Is it possible to take on board, a frozen bottle of water?

Couldn't a solid rock hard bottle do a whole lot more damage than say nail clippers or scissors? Just a thought....

---Skywatch

mariner · Mon Aug 21, 2006 10:51 am

Quoting Kaddyuk (Reply 26):
Hey, at least i know they dont have to add copious amounts of chlorine to the water for it to be "safe" to drink...

Given some of the acids that fall from the sky these days, a dash of cholrine might be preferable.

But Michael Jackson took your view, he washed his teeth with Evian, and, rumors say, he even had his plumbing fixed so he could flush the lav with it.

One hopes he had examined the mineral content of some of the expensive waters.

cheers

mariner

rampart · Mon Aug 21, 2006 11:45 am

Quoting Mariner (Reply 23):
Your faith in the manufacturers of designer water is quite touching.

Ha ha! How true. My worst case of "traveler's malady" came from a bottled water in China! And from there on, I was a nervous wreck not knowing what water to drink.

-Rampart

mpdpilot · Mon Aug 21, 2006 11:54 am

I am wondering how many of you think that this current ban will last very long. if you go by the past in less than half a decade we are almost right back were we started with the ban items on flights.

ckfred · Mon Aug 21, 2006 12:23 pm

My minister was discussing today that the liquids ban will be a problem for her. I'm not sure what airline she flies, but apparently, it serves Pepsi products.

She will only drink Coke products (Coke, Diet Coke, Sprite, Barq's root beer, etc.), so she always brings her own 20 oz. bottle of Diet Coke.

Now, she may have to change her preferred carrier, so she at least can drink something other than water during beverage service.

On a more serious note, I asked a friend of mine who flies for AA how TSA can be certain that liquids that go aboard a plane (water, Coke, iced tea, liquid soap, salad dressing, etc.) are safe, as opposed to liquids that might be purchased at the airport.

He said that TSA simply believes that:

a) it has better control of what goes through catering facilities and fleet services than what goes through airport stores and restaurants. Even though anything sold at an airport is supposed to be screened, TSA will admit that everything isn't.

b) if passengers only receive beverages in cups or glasses, then it is far less likely for a passenger to go back to a lavatory carrying a cup and mix powders to form explosives or other dangerous chemicals. On the other hand, a passenger could take a perfectly safe can of Coke, bottle of water, or tube of toothpaste, hide it in a coat pocket, go back to a lavatory, and create a deadly concoction.

I reminded him of the time that we and our wives were non-reving from BOS to ORD, back in 1997. We were standing in the first-class galley chatting with an F/A. A passenger came with a wine glass and asked to have his glass refilled.

After the F/A refilled it, the passenger went into the forward lav. The three of us shrugged our shoulders and resumed our conversation.

28thguy · Mon Aug 21, 2006 12:45 pm

Given that Delta hands out bottles of water to passengers (as opposed to a cup or glass), I think the TSA theory is a bit flawed.

jacobin777 · Mon Aug 21, 2006 1:00 pm

Quoting Mariner (Reply 20):
On the bright side, if the ban kills the concept of a bottle of designer water as a fashion statement, people will save a fair amount of money.

Simple pure distilled water does the trick...... Smile

the new "fad" is "vitamin water"....yet another joke (which seem sto be making money for the manufaturers)

cheers.

Motorhussy · Mon Aug 21, 2006 2:17 pm

Quoting Hmmmm... (Reply 35):
Are you saying that KAL 007 was destroyed by a terrorist bomb brought on board by a government agent? Because that is the topic of discussion, not whether or not airliners have been shot down.

Well now, if you're going to be so pedantic about it, the subject is actually about the ease, convenience and necessity of bottled drinking water aboard flights in this current 'alert' security environment. People digress, it's human nature.

BTW, the connection I was making is that "Terror" per se is not the exclusive domain of the RAF, Provos, Bader Meinhoff, al Qaeda et al. These examples were used because of their aviation connection, not because of the availability of bottled drinking water on board the two flights.

Regards
MH

Motorhussy · Mon Aug 21, 2006 2:24 pm

Quoting Skywatch (Reply 37):
Quoting Kalakaua (Reply 6):
Is it possible to take on board, a frozen bottle of water?

Couldn't a solid rock hard bottle do a whole lot more damage than say nail clippers or scissors? Just a thought....

If the water could freeze, it would prove it's water. Water with high contents of glycerine cannot freeze. Glycerine, important in manufacturing nitroglycerine, is an anti-freeze.

Regards
MH

hmmmm... · Mon Aug 21, 2006 2:50 pm

Quoting MotorHussy (Reply 44):
BTW, the connection I was making is that "Terror" per se is not the exclusive domain of the RAF, Provos, Bader Meinhoff, al Qaeda et al.

No, what you were implying by mentioning KAL 007, is that that aircraft was brought down by terrorism.

I remember that aircraft being shot down by the Soviet Air Force, after straying into Soviet territory, not by any act of terrorism. So what was the point of mentioning it? There is digressing and then there is digressing. But that was more than just digressing.

[Edited 2006-08-21 07:55:26]

Motorhussy · Mon Aug 21, 2006 3:03 pm

Quoting Hmmmm... (Reply 46):

No, what you were implying by mentioning KAL 007, is that that aircraft was brought down by terrorism.

ter-ror-ism noun the use of violence and intimidation in the pursuit of political aims.

I believe there was a political agenda in the downing of the Korean Airlines flight with violence and intimidation present as well. They made a political example of this aircraft despite the fact that they could clearly identify it as a civil airliner. Tragic and terrifying.

MH

hmmmm... · Mon Aug 21, 2006 3:17 pm

That is where you are off the scale. Shooting down a plane flying over restricted terrority, is not an act of terrorism. All nations reserve that right. What did they gain politically from doing so, even if we are to assume the dubious assertion that they knew it was a civilian flight? What they got out of it was world condemnation. It was a PR nightmare. They didn't shoot it down to achieve any political goal. They shot it down despite politics. They shot it down as an overzealous act of air defence.

iairallie · Mon Aug 21, 2006 7:29 pm

Quoting Kaddyuk (Reply 22):
I Dont drink Potable water, most water supplied on flights comes from the taps...

Not true of all the airlines I've worked for none of them used the "tap" water for anything but hot drinks.

Quoting Skywatch (Reply 37):
Couldn't a solid rock hard bottle do a whole lot more damage than say nail clippers or scissors? Just a thought....

Lots of permitted items can do a whole lot more damage than nail clippers. A laptop upside the head would be quite uncomfortable for example.

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