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aerorobnz
Posts: 8336
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RE: NZ Shanghai Based Crew Wages

Sat Sep 02, 2006 6:39 pm

Quoting Planemanofnz (Reply 41):
No, just huindreds of potential connecting flights to Europe, Africa, Middle East, India and Asia with numerous star alliance partners like SQ, TG, OZ, LX, LH, UA e.t.c.

key word here is POTENTIAL. If we're talking 'potential' then China - the future economic powerhouse of the world has more. You're talking about a country that is growing twice the rate economically of anywhere else ever year, and has done for over a decade. Transit Europeans are only half the story. passengers that are flying to the destination are just as important. In which case SIN is a smaller market.

Quoting Planemanofnz (Reply 41):
Increased fuel prices affect every route. If anything, it should affect SIN less than PVG as SIN is closer to AKL.

I also stated that the rewards for SIN aren't what they used to be. It's fuel prices in relation to revenue. PVG has more potential revenue for using the same aircraft, for similar outlay per flight (less in terms of crew costs)

Quoting Planemanofnz (Reply 41):
What about Product competitiveness? Does that not warrant the extra expense of the 777-200ER, even if the Business Class prices were going up?

profitability is more important. As I said for the time being it is better to suspend the flights to go back at a later time. SIN is dominated by SQ and always will be.

Quoting Planemanofnz (Reply 41):
What!? I thought NZ have too many long haul aircraft at the moment. They only have 6 777's at the moment with a further 2 on order. Where are these new aircraft going to be used? Not to mention the fact that NZ also has too many 747's for it's network.

The 744 is left out of this equation. It's not lack of aircraft. It's lack of revenue per seat and per aircraft. In which case there is more revenue to be gained on SFO/LAX-LHR/PVG using the aircraft. SIN was not doing well enough -especially to warrant 2 772s a day (one up one back), and NZ doesn't have the financial resources to go on infinitely just for the hell of it.
Flown to 147 Airports in 62 Countries on 83 Operators and counting. Wanderlust is like Syphilis, once you have the itch it's too late for treatment.
 
777ER
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Posts: 10069
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RE: NZ Shanghai Based Crew Wages

Sat Sep 02, 2006 6:41 pm

Quoting Planemanofnz (Reply 48):
Quoting 777ER (Reply 47):
MH has 278 seats on its B772ER and MH also have 12 First Class seats.

No actually. MH have re configured their 777's to now only have Economy and Golden Club classes.

Sounds like MH needs to update their web-site then

Quoting Planemanofnz (Reply 48):
Quoting 777ER (Reply 47):
SQ has two different B772ER classes. cabin one has 285 seats and cabin two has 323 seats.

Again, no. I said lets compare the 777-200ER, not the 777-200A. SQ's 772ER's have 285 seats and the non ER 772's have 323 seats.

On the SQ web-site it doesn't say which config is which, so how does people who don't know the SQ seat numbers well know?

Quoting RichardJF (Reply 49):
Why has the qf board renewed peter griggs contract when there was so much of a stink about him before?
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Flown: 1900D,S340,Q300,AT72-5/6,DC3,CR2/7,E145,E70/75/90,A319/20/21,A332/3,A359,A380,F100,B717,B733/4/8/9,B742/4,B752/3,B763,B772/3, B789
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Emirates Skies
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RE: NZ Shanghai Based Crew Wages

Sun Sep 03, 2006 5:05 am

I admit I was wrong: different airlines seem to have very different nightstop allowances. In that case, if the pay is not that high for these PVG-based crew, at least, it is compensated through very generous allowances.  Smile Big grin
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monkeyboi
Posts: 447
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RE: NZ Shanghai Based Crew Wages

Sun Sep 03, 2006 5:33 am

We manage fine with two SIN based CC on LHR/PVG at BA. They operate SIN/LHR/PVG/LHR/SIN. Or maybe it's the HKG base that does it?? Can't remember the HKG base does PEK and the SIN base does PVG or VV.

I can totally understand why airlines have 'local' based cabin crew on certain routes. But to have your entire 'main' crew made up of locals seems a bit much. But I guess I don't really know much about the PVG/NZ market.

But if it is so ultra-important for NZ to have an entire local based crew on this route for cultural/language issues, then why not on the internal NZ flights these passengers will transfer to as well?

This stinks of cost-cutting. But I guess you can't blame the airlines. They identify an area where they can cut costs and go for it. I'm not just talking of wages here. I am also talking of working conditions/hours. Unions. Health benefits. Superannuation/pension schemes. Employer tax contributions.

It's just unfortunate though that ANZ doesn't seem to be able to come out and say 'its to cut costs' instead of dressing it up as being all because of the benefit of the passengers. Just like airlines always do when they reduce catering or start charging for something that used to be free "Its in response to customer demand". Yeah right!! LOL
I hope it works out for NZ. BA states it's 'british-ness' as one of it's key marketing ingredients. They want to be perceived as redpresenting Britain and what the UK stands for. And I have to admit that I instantly feel 'at home' where ever I am in the world when I step on a BA aircraft. I hope passengers in NZ (and indeed OZ) will be able to continue having that same feeling when getting on their own airlines.
 
planemanofnz
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RE: NZ Shanghai Based Crew Wages

Sun Sep 03, 2006 6:28 am

Quoting 777ER (Reply 51):
On the SQ web-site it doesn't say which config is which, so how does people who don't know the SQ seat numbers well know?

I refer to my actual SIA timetables - (the books/pamphlets) - these include seat maps.
 
777ER
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RE: NZ Shanghai Based Crew Wages

Sun Sep 03, 2006 12:36 pm

Quoting Planemanofnz (Reply 54):
Quoting 777ER (Reply 51):
On the SQ web-site it doesn't say which config is which, so how does people who don't know the SQ seat numbers well know?

I refer to my actual SIA timetables - (the books/pamphlets) - these include seat maps.

I don't use these booklets, havn't for a few years now. If I need info on flight times, aircraft operated flights then I always refer to the web-site
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planemanofnz
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RE: NZ Shanghai Based Crew Wages

Sun Sep 03, 2006 12:58 pm

Quoting 777ER (Reply 55):
I don't use these booklets, havn't for a few years now. If I need info on flight times, aircraft operated flights then I always refer to the web-site

The problem with that is that alot of the time certain airlines don't update their sites for a while e.g - the SQ/MH seat maps or the NZ route network.

Quoting Xiaotung (Reply 22):
The Shanghai dialect is only spoken in Shanghai and can only been understood in Shanghai and it's neighbor provinces



Quoting HKGKaiTak (Reply 18):
Shanghaiese and Chinese Mandarin are very different

Then this won't go down well ;

Quoting Xiaotung (Thread starter):
NZ have recruited most Chinese cabin crew from other parts of China.
 
777ER
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RE: NZ Shanghai Based Crew Wages

Sun Sep 03, 2006 1:34 pm

Quoting Planemanofnz (Reply 56):
Quoting 777ER (Reply 55):
I don't use these booklets, havn't for a few years now. If I need info on flight times, aircraft operated flights then I always refer to the web-site

The problem with that is that alot of the time certain airlines don't update their sites for a while e.g - the SQ/MH seat maps or the NZ route network.

I'm rarly looking at route-maps or aircraft seat maps on airline web-sites.
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NZ747
Posts: 849
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RE: NZ Shanghai Based Crew Wages

Sun Sep 03, 2006 3:19 pm

Quoting Planemanofnz (Reply 48):
Again, no. I said lets compare the 777-200ER, not the 777-200A. SQ's 772ER's have 285 seats and the non ER 772's have 323 seats.

Incorrect. All of Singapore Airlines B772's are ER models. Disagree? look it up...

Quoting 777ER (Reply 51):
how does people who don't know the SQ seat numbers well know?

Not that it matters but:
-The Longhaul International series (9V-SV#) which are the ones that fly to NZ, have 255/30 with 34"Y. (285)
-Short/mediumhaul / usually Asia & Australia (9V-SR#) 293/30 (323) 32"Y
-Medium haul usually Asian routes (9V-SQ#) Asia- 234/42/12 (288) (32"Y

So, if you were to compare SQ772's with NZ's, then compare the 9V-SV# series

NZ747
 
planemanofnz
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RE: NZ Shanghai Based Crew Wages

Sun Sep 03, 2006 4:02 pm

Quoting NZ747 (Reply 58):
Incorrect. All of Singapore Airlines B772's are ER models. Disagree? look it up...

Looked it up and didn't know what to think. I don't know where you are getting your information from - maybe wikipedia?, but go to this link straight from the actual company itself who operates the aircraft ;
http://www.singaporeair.com/saa/en_U...nt/company_info/siastory/fleet.jsp
It clearly says :

B777-200
Engine Type: Rolls Royce Trent 884
In Fleet: 31
On Firm Order: -
On Option: -

B777-200ER
Engine Type: Rolls Royce Trent 892
In Fleet: 15
On Firm Order: -
On Option: -

Although I do acknowledge on Wikipedia at http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Singapore_Airlines it says ;
"All of Singapore Airlines' 777-212s are the Extended Range (ER) models; featuring centre fuel tanks for maximum storage. The airline however chooses to only refer to the 9V-SV* registered series of aircraft as 777-200ERs as those planes are certified to 656,000 lb (298,000 kg) Maximum Take-Off Weight (MTOW) and fly the longer intercontinental routes. The 9V-SR* and 9V-SQ* registered aircraft feature derated engines which can be electronically reprogrammed to produce more thrust and thus operate longer flights at higher MTOWs if ever needed."


I just always get my fleet info and seat maps off of the airlines website itself.

[Edited 2006-09-03 09:06:48]
 
RichardJF
Posts: 565
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RE: NZ Shanghai Based Crew Wages

Sun Sep 03, 2006 5:16 pm

How does VS go on LHR-PVG and will NZ code share this?
On an equivalent area how many more business premier seats can NZ or VS fit in compared to the forward facing cocoon style seats of QF and others. They certainly look very space efficient. What an unusual board qf has. Former BHP chief (1998-2002) Paul Anderson is an American who lives in the US. I'm sure he feels honoured to be on the qf board but does that make him ideal for such a role. Why wouldn't you do what NZ does and have prominent local businessmen. Plenty of experienced business people living around Sydney. The Lowy's (Westfield), Gerry Harvey (Harvey Norman), Roger Corbett (Woolworths), Dick Smith.... but.. James Packer? (remember one tel). Peter Cosgrove 40 years in the armed forces?. Anderson, Packer and Cosgrove all have unquestioned integrity but seem unusual choices for a variety of reasons.
 
NZ747
Posts: 849
Joined: Mon Dec 13, 2004 2:01 pm

RE: NZ Shanghai Based Crew Wages

Sun Sep 03, 2006 8:26 pm

Quoting Planemanofnz (Reply 59):

Well, there you go. I don't know why SQ don't call them ER models as well. Perhaps because of the slightly different engines...beats me.

Quoting RichardJF (Reply 60):
What an unusual board qf has. Former BHP chief (1998-2002) Paul Anderson is an American who lives in the US

Just to add while you're sticking to the original topic, a dolphin lives in the ocean and marijuana is illegal in NZ  Wink
 
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Zkpilot
Posts: 4409
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RE: NZ Shanghai Based Crew Wages

Sun Sep 03, 2006 8:57 pm

Quoting Planemanofnz (Reply 59):
Quoting NZ747 (Reply 58):
Incorrect. All of Singapore Airlines B772's are ER models. Disagree? look it up...

Looked it up and didn't know what to think. I don't know where you are getting your information from - maybe wikipedia?, but go to this link straight from the actual company itself who operates the aircraft ;
http://www.singaporeair.com/saa/en_U...nt/company_info/siastory/fleet.jsp
It clearly says :

B777-200
Engine Type: Rolls Royce Trent 884
In Fleet: 31
On Firm Order: -
On Option: -

B777-200ER
Engine Type: Rolls Royce Trent 892
In Fleet: 15
On Firm Order: -
On Option: -

Although I do acknowledge on Wikipedia at http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Singapore_Airlines it says ;
"All of Singapore Airlines' 777-212s are the Extended Range (ER) models; featuring centre fuel tanks for maximum storage. The airline however chooses to only refer to the 9V-SV* registered series of aircraft as 777-200ERs as those planes are certified to 656,000 lb (298,000 kg) Maximum Take-Off Weight (MTOW) and fly the longer intercontinental routes. The 9V-SR* and 9V-SQ* registered aircraft feature derated engines which can be electronically reprogrammed to produce more thrust and thus operate longer flights at higher MTOWs if ever needed."



Quoting NZ747 (Reply 61):
Quoting Planemanofnz (Reply 59):


Well, there you go. I don't know why SQ don't call them ER models as well. Perhaps because of the slightly different engines...beats me.

SQ has done this because it is cheaper that way. Boeing charges less for a derated ER model than they do for an ER model. They are however the same and if SQ ever needed to have the ER ability, they can pay the ER license fee to Boeing and Boeing will certify them to the increased MTOW and overall ER standard.
So Yes they are ER aircraft, but SQ is not allowed to operate them as such unless they pay Boeing to certify them as ER aircraft.  Wink
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