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727LOVER
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Pilots That Survived Crash And Flew Again

Thu Sep 07, 2006 10:08 am

In that moronic thread on the Comair co-pilot, someone mentioned that's the end of his career. That got me wondering have there been cases where a pilot survived, and then flew again. I guess its possible if he (or she) weren't seriously injured.

Did these pilots ever fly again, commercially?

Pan Am (tenerife)
TWA (JFK-L-1011 mishap, 1992)
Delta DFW 1988--I'll guess no on this one.
USAir 1994 CLT DC-9
Northwest DC-9/727 collision at DTW
United DC-8, PDX, 1978--honestly can't remember if any dead in cockpit
USAir 734, LGA, 1989
USAir 733, LAX, 1991--co-pilot survived


That's some that I remember, that at least 1 member of flight crew survived.
I guess it also depends on how much at fault the crew were.
"We must accept finite disappointment, but never lose infinite hope." - Martin Luther King, Jr.
 
CF188A
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RE: Pilots That Survived Crash And Flew Again

Thu Sep 07, 2006 10:22 am

AF 358 here in Toronto, the FO was flying a few weeks later
Dream as if you'll live forever. Live as if you'll die tomorrow~ RIP ... LJFM
 
OV735
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RE: Pilots That Survived Crash And Flew Again

Thu Sep 07, 2006 10:25 am

IIRC one of the crewmembers of the SAS MD-80 that made a crash landing on a field near Stockholm in 1991 (http://aviation-safety.net/database/record.php?id=19911227-0) flew again later on.

Regards,
OV735
 
777STL
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RE: Pilots That Survived Crash And Flew Again

Thu Sep 07, 2006 10:27 am

The pilot of the UA DC10 that crashed in Sioux City, Iowa finished his career with UA.
PHX based
 
HKGKaiTak
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RE: Pilots That Survived Crash And Flew Again

Thu Sep 07, 2006 10:58 am

Matt Warmerdam, the FO on ASA529 flew commercially for ASA again many years after the crash - took him that long to fully recover from those horrific injuries.
4 Engines 4 LongHaul
 
charlienorth
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RE: Pilots That Survived Crash And Flew Again

Thu Sep 07, 2006 11:06 am

Quoting 727LOVER (Thread starter):
Pan Am (tenerife)

All three returned to PAA,the capt retired at 60,he died about 5 years ago,fo ended up at UAL with the Pacific deal.

Quoting 727LOVER (Thread starter):
United DC-8, PDX, 1978--honestly can't remember if any dead in cockpit

The Second Officer died,the Captain was terminated or early retired or something.The F.O. retired at 60 and died a couple years ago. Not too sure about the rest you listed,you could check the licenses section of the F.A.A. website and do a search,this gives type ratings and medical dates,you probably could figure out what happened to them by any subsequent ratings they earned.
Work hard fly right..don't understand it
 
socalfive
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RE: Pilots That Survived Crash And Flew Again

Thu Sep 07, 2006 11:27 am

IIRC Correctly the F/O on the Southwest over-run accident in BUR in 2000 is still flying. The PIC was fired though.
 
cedarjet
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RE: Pilots That Survived Crash And Flew Again

Thu Sep 07, 2006 11:36 am

The crew of the Qantas 747 that overran at Bangkok are still flying. I flew from Singapore to Manchester nonstop in Jan 03 with Juliet Hotel, the same aircraft (repaired at great cost - in fact more than a new plane) and the same captain that was involved in that crash. Much to my amazement, I might add, because it was such an open-and-shut case of bad airmanship (non-stabilised 'hot and high' approach then deciding to go around then deciding to stop but leaving engine no 1 at full takeoff thrust etc) and bad managament (non-pertinent conversation below 10,000' with the first officer's wife in the jumpseat etc).

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jetdeltamsy
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RE: Pilots That Survived Crash And Flew Again

Thu Sep 07, 2006 11:46 am

Quoting 777STL (Reply 3):
The pilot of the UA DC10 that crashed in Sioux City, Iowa finished his career with UA.

Incorrect.

Captain Haynes continued to fly until 1991.
Tired of airline bankruptcies....EA/PA/TW and finally DL.
 
PanAm747
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RE: Pilots That Survived Crash And Flew Again

Thu Sep 07, 2006 11:49 am

Quote:
United DC-8, PDX, 1978--honestly can't remember if any dead in cockpit

Flight Engineer Forrest "Frosty" Mendenhall did not survive the crash.

First Officer Rodrick Beebe survived the crash with extensive injuries, and flew with United until his mandatory retirement age. I was unaware that he had passed on.

Captin Malcom McBroome suffered a severe back injury, crushed ribs, a fractured ankle, and a broken right shoulder plus numerous bruises and lacerations. He survived, and petitioned the FAA to change its findings on the cause of the crash. They didn't - and he lost his license permanently in November, 1979.

Because of this crash and Eastern 401, Cockpit Resource Management became mandatory training in the United States.

This information came from Airliners magazine, Jan/Feb, 1998. If you can find a copy, there are some amazing pictures of the intact and unburned DC-8 wreckage!
Pan Am:The World's Most Experienced Airline - P(oor) S(ailor's) A(irline): San Diego's Hometown Airline-Catch Our Smile!
 
JAM747
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RE: Pilots That Survived Crash And Flew Again

Thu Sep 07, 2006 11:56 am

Quoting Cedarjet (Reply 7):
The crew of the Qantas 747 that overran at Bangkok are still flying. I flew from Singapore to Manchester nonstop in Jan 03 with Juliet Hotel, the same aircraft (repaired at great cost - in fact more than a new plane) and the same captain that was involved in that crash.

A friend of mine was part of the investigation team . He said that Qantas wanted to repair the plane so it could keep it's reputation of not losing a plane in a crash.
 
emiratesa345
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RE: Pilots That Survived Crash And Flew Again

Thu Sep 07, 2006 11:56 am

I remember watchign a show about Ethiopian flight 961 that was hijacked and crashed. Both Captain Leul Abate and First Officer Yonas Merkuria continued to fly for Ethiopian, after the crash.

Mark
You and I were meant to fly, Air Canada!
 
Bobster2
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RE: Pilots That Survived Crash And Flew Again

Thu Sep 07, 2006 11:57 am

What about Michael Origel, the FO who survived the AA Little Rock crash?
"I tell you this, no eternal reward will forgive us now for wasting the dawn." Jim Morrison
 
OPNLguy
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RE: Pilots That Survived Crash And Flew Again

Thu Sep 07, 2006 12:56 pm

Quoting Bobster2 (Reply 12):
What about Michael Origel, the FO who survived the AA Little Rock crash?

I've wondered about that myself. If I recall the hearings correctly, one of his legs was pretty badly injured...
ALL views, opinions expressed are mine ONLY and are NOT representative of those shared by Southwest Airlines Co.
 
71Zulu
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RE: Pilots That Survived Crash And Flew Again

Thu Sep 07, 2006 1:07 pm

Quoting Socalfive (Reply 6):
IIRC Correctly the F/O on the Southwest over-run accident in BUR in 2000 is still flying. The PIC was fired though.

I read somewhere that the F/O was later terminated along with another captain for the infamous naked cockpit flight.

Quoting Jetdeltamsy (Reply 8):
Quoting 777STL (Reply 3):
The pilot of the UA DC10 that crashed in Sioux City, Iowa finished his career with UA.

Incorrect.

Captain Haynes continued to fly until 1991.

Isn't that what he said?
 
jetdeltamsy
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RE: Pilots That Survived Crash And Flew Again

Thu Sep 07, 2006 1:34 pm

Quoting 777STL (Reply 3):
The pilot of the UA DC10 that crashed in Sioux City, Iowa finished his career with UA.

Nope. What he said is written above. And it is wrong.
Tired of airline bankruptcies....EA/PA/TW and finally DL.
 
KabAir
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RE: Pilots That Survived Crash And Flew Again

Thu Sep 07, 2006 1:54 pm

I actually had Captain Haynes on a flight DEN-SEA about a week after he returned to flying for UA. I was flying as an unaccompanied minor and I got to meet him after the flight. He let me sit in his seat, and signed a magazine for me (which my wife apparently tossed out about a year ago - AAAAAARRRRGGGGHHHHHHH!!!!!!!!!!). I still remember the experience vividly, he was the nicest man and I felt like I was meeting a true hero (and indeed he was and is just that)!

So yes, Captain Haynes did fly again.
wow, there sure are a lot of expert economists on this forum....
 
777STL
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RE: Pilots That Survived Crash And Flew Again

Thu Sep 07, 2006 1:59 pm

Quoting Jetdeltamsy (Reply 15):
Nope. What he said is written above. And it is wrong.

Care to elaborate on what I said that was wrong, instead of just saying I'm wrong?

I think your reading comprehension is lacking. I'm guessing you think I intended to say that the DC10 flight that ended in disaster ended his career. But as myself and others have read and comprehended, I said he continued his career afterwards and retired with UA.

Why would I say that crash ended his career in a thread about pilots who continued to fly AFTER a major incident?

Next time read and think before you go shooting your mouth off, kthnxplz.
PHX based
 
JBirdAV8r
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RE: Pilots That Survived Crash And Flew Again

Thu Sep 07, 2006 1:59 pm

Quoting Jetdeltamsy (Reply 8):
Quoting 777STL (Reply 3):The pilot of the UA DC10 that crashed in Sioux City, Iowa finished his career with UA.
Incorrect.

Captain Haynes continued to fly until 1991.

"Finished out" means flying the rest of his career "out" (ie until retirement) at UA, does it not?

That's how I interpreted it, and, obviously, most other members. No need to be so jumpy.
I got my head checked--by a jumbo jet
 
777STL
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RE: Pilots That Survived Crash And Flew Again

Thu Sep 07, 2006 2:02 pm

Quoting JBirdAV8r (Reply 18):
"Finished out" means flying the rest of his career "out" (ie until retirement) at UA, does it not?

That's how I interpreted it, and, obviously, most other members. No need to be so jumpy.

Thank you, yes that's what I intended to say. Amazing how quick some people are to jump down other people's throats. It makes you wonder if they actually read the post(s) they're "correcting" in the first place.
PHX based
 
PIA777
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RE: Pilots That Survived Crash And Flew Again

Thu Sep 07, 2006 2:16 pm

Quoting 777STL (Reply 3):
The pilot of the UA DC10 that crashed in Sioux City, Iowa finished his career with UA.

His final flight was shown on the local news in Chicago, I think its was from
ORD. They even had video of the take off.

PIA777
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aerorobnz
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RE: Pilots That Survived Crash And Flew Again

Thu Sep 07, 2006 2:22 pm

The captain of the SQ crash in TPE also continues/continued with SQ...
Flown to 147 Airports in 62 Countries on 83 Operators and counting. Wanderlust is like Syphilis, once you have the itch it's too late for treatment.
 
PIA777
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RE: Pilots That Survived Crash And Flew Again

Thu Sep 07, 2006 2:28 pm

Quoting Jetdeltamsy (Reply 8):
Captain Haynes continued to fly until 1991.

Thats true.

PIA777
GO CUBS!!
 
blueflyer
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RE: Pilots That Survived Crash And Flew Again

Thu Sep 07, 2006 2:30 pm

Quoting AerorobNZ (Reply 21):
The captain of the SQ crash in TPE also continues/continued with SQ...



Maybe I'm getting things mixed up with another accident, but wasn't this one (partially) due to pilot error?

[Edited 2006-09-07 07:32:13]
 
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Jamake1
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RE: Pilots That Survived Crash And Flew Again

Thu Sep 07, 2006 2:38 pm

One of the cockpit crewmembers who was in the United DC-8 crash in Portland was actually in another fatal accident involving a United DC-8 at Stapleton Airport in Denver during the 1960's. What are the chances of being involved in two fatal crashes during one's flying career?
Come fly the sun.
 
Bobster2
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RE: Pilots That Survived Crash And Flew Again

Thu Sep 07, 2006 2:54 pm

I remember a rumor claiming that the pilots of Delta flight 1288 were fired even though the uncontained engine failure was obviously not pilot error. The accident report mentioned that the pilots ignored a small oil leak noted during walkaround inspection. The oil leak had absolutely no connection with the engine failure, but it was still an embarrassment for the company that the pilots didn't follow the SOP. They only got caught because it was on the CVR, and the CVR only got listened to because of the accident.

So is the rumor true?
"I tell you this, no eternal reward will forgive us now for wasting the dawn." Jim Morrison
 
71Zulu
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RE: Pilots That Survived Crash And Flew Again

Thu Sep 07, 2006 9:00 pm

Quoting Jetdeltamsy (Reply 15):
Quoting Jetdeltamsy (Reply 8):
Quoting 777STL (Reply 3):
The pilot of the UA DC10 that crashed in Sioux City, Iowa finished his career with UA.


Incorrect.

Captain Haynes continued to fly until 1991.

Isn't that what he said?

Ok, well maybe it's just me but can you please tell me what is the difference in the two above statements. Al Haynes "finished" his career at UAL. How is that different from he "continued to fly" until 1991, except for listing the date. The topic of the thread is pilots who continued to fly after a crash and the statement by 777STL is correct.
 
dkny
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RE: Pilots That Survived Crash And Flew Again

Thu Sep 07, 2006 9:18 pm

Quoting EmiratesA345 (Reply 11):
I remember watchign a show about Ethiopian flight 961 that was hijacked and crashed. Both Captain Leul Abate and First Officer Yonas Merkuria continued to fly for Ethiopian, after the crash.

Mark

Correct The Captain is still a captain on the 757/767 and the first officer also a captain on the 757/767 now.
 
JHSfan
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RE: Pilots That Survived Crash And Flew Again

Thu Sep 07, 2006 9:51 pm

Quoting OV735 (Reply 2):
IIRC one of the crewmembers of the SAS MD-80 that made a crash landing on a field near Stockholm in 1991 (http://aviation-safety.net/database/record.php?id=19911227-0) flew again later on.

Certainly not the captain Stefan Rasmussen. At a small conference on aviation safety in 1994 in Copenhagen, he told that he lost his certificate, because the experience had been too tough for him to fly safely afterwards.
So it must be the f/o.

- JHSfan
Look at me, I´m riding high, I´m the airbornmaster of the sky...
 
cainanuk
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RE: Pilots That Survived Crash And Flew Again

Thu Sep 07, 2006 9:58 pm

I believe that the BA pilot who was sucked out of the cockpit of a BAc 111 also returned to line flying.
Cainan Cornelius
 
socalfive
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RE: Pilots That Survived Crash And Flew Again

Thu Sep 07, 2006 10:29 pm

Quoting Jetdeltamsy (Reply 8):
Quoting 777STL (Reply 3):
The pilot of the UA DC10 that crashed in Sioux City, Iowa finished his career with UA.

Incorrect.

Captain Haynes continued to fly until 1991.

LOL I read it as intended the first time, but there should be a comma after Iowa or it could be taken as all one statement I suppose. lol
 
CPHGuard
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RE: Pilots That Survived Crash And Flew Again

Thu Sep 07, 2006 10:51 pm

Quoting JHSfan (Reply 28):
Quoting OV735 (Reply 2):
IIRC one of the crewmembers of the SAS MD-80 that made a crash landing on a field near Stockholm in 1991 (http://aviation-safety.net/database/record.php?id=19911227-0) flew again later on.

Certainly not the captain Stefan Rasmussen. At a small conference on aviation safety in 1994 in Copenhagen, he told that he lost his certificate, because the experience had been too tough for him to fly safely afterwards.
So it must be the f/o.

- JHSfan

Stefan Rasmussen never flew again. He was voted for parlament in Denmark.

There were actually two other crewmembers in the cockpit, because a SAS captain happened to be on the flight, and stepped into the cockpit to help, when he heard the engine surges.
AFAIK, both the FO and the assisting captain flew again.

Regards
Thomas
 
Skyguy
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RE: Pilots That Survived Crash And Flew Again

Thu Sep 07, 2006 10:53 pm

Quoting AerorobNZ (Reply 21):
The captain of the SQ crash in TPE also continues/continued with SQ...

Are you sure about this? I thought he was being sued by families of passengers who died and SQ (and the Singapore Aviation authorities as well as Taiwanese authorities) had grounded him.
Can anyone else confirm?
"Those who talk, do not know, and those who know, do not talk."
 
aviateur
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RE: Pilots That Survived Crash And Flew Again

Thu Sep 07, 2006 11:25 pm

I met and spent several hours with Bob Bragg, FO aboard "Clipper Victor" at Tenerife in '77. He returned to flying at PA several weeks after the crash, and eventually retired a 747-400 captain with UA. He even flew the SP for a while. Today he lives in Virginia. He and his wife Dorothy are both extremely nice people.

I am planning to interview Bragg for a future column at Salon.com, where I write the weekly "Ask the Pilot" series. (Airliners no longer allows me to post links to my articles, but this Friday's piece is another installment on security.)

Bragg's story from Tenerife is pretty astounding. I learned many things about the crash I hadn't previously known. For example, there were 5 people in the cockpit, actually, including two jumpseaters, and all managed to survive relatively unscathed. Bragg hurled himself over the side -- some 40 feet to the grass -- and walked away with only a sprained ankle.

He and I were in California to help with a Discovery Channel documentary on the 30th anniversary of the crash. After filming in a 747 mock-up, the crew drove us out to Mojave, where they got some footage of a mothballed CO 747 to use on the show. I have some still shots from Mojave and also from the studio, of Bragg and the filmmakers in action, if anybody wants to see them.

I wound up making two full artciles out of that day at Mojave, which I published on Salon, talking about the history of derelict planes and why it is some of us are fascinated by such places. Please write to me directly if you'd like to see the stories, since the site won't allow me to link.


Cheers,
Patrick
Patrick Smith is an airline pilot, air travel columnist and author
 
We're Nuts
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RE: Pilots That Survived Crash And Flew Again

Thu Sep 07, 2006 11:33 pm

Quoting Cainanuk (Reply 29):
I believe that the BA pilot who was sucked out of the cockpit of a BAc 111 also returned to line flying.

 rotfl  rotfl  rotfl 
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redcordes
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RE: Pilots That Survived Crash And Flew Again

Thu Sep 07, 2006 11:50 pm

This doesn't have to do with commercial aviation, but one of the top German aces in WWII, Erich Rudorffer, was shot down 16 times!
"The only source of knowledge is experience." A. Einstein "Science w/o religion is lame. Religion w/o science is blind."
 
DeC
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RE: Pilots That Survived Crash And Flew Again

Thu Sep 07, 2006 11:57 pm

Quoting CF188A (Reply 1):

But not the captain i assume?
DEC
 
Boeing744
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RE: Pilots That Survived Crash And Flew Again

Fri Sep 08, 2006 12:05 am

I know that both the FO and Captain of the Air Transat incident in the Azores are both still flying. Does anybody know about the pilots of the Gimli Glider?
 
Gr8Circle
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RE: Pilots That Survived Crash And Flew Again

Fri Sep 08, 2006 12:13 am

Back in 1971, an AI B707 crashed while test flying at BOM, with no fatalities.....I believe, the pilots who were at the controls continued to fly with AI...
 
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carmenlu15
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RE: Pilots That Survived Crash And Flew Again

Fri Sep 08, 2006 12:23 am

Don't know if this counts... Carlos Dardano, a TA pilot, was shot while taking off with a private plane back in the early 80's. He lost one eye due to this incident, but was recertified and continued flying.

Then in 1988 (?) he was the pilot who landed the TA 737-200 in a New Orleans levee, after losing the two engines.

And, up to this date, he continues flying with the company...
Don't expect to see me around that much (if at all) -- the contact link should still work, though.
 
A320ajm
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RE: Pilots That Survived Crash And Flew Again

Fri Sep 08, 2006 1:06 am

I remember watching Air Crash Investigation. There was the cargo flight on a DC 10 where 1 of the crew tried to take over the plane withnumerous weapons including a spear gun. All pilotsinvolved were not allowed to fly again because of their head inhjuries. They said that they may have epileptic fits.
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OPNLguy
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RE: Pilots That Survived Crash And Flew Again

Fri Sep 08, 2006 1:16 am

Quoting Carmenlu15 (Reply 39):
Then in 1988 (?) he was the pilot who landed the TA 737-200 in a New Orleans levee, after losing the two engines.

Not to quibble, but it was a 737-300... Note the photographer's remarks on the aircraft's history...


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carmenlu15
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RE: Pilots That Survived Crash And Flew Again

Fri Sep 08, 2006 1:30 am

Quoting OPNLguy (Reply 41):
Not to quibble, but it was a 737-300...

Whoops, typo there... I was sure I had typed -300!  embarrassed 

And the plane's still flying today? Wow...
Don't expect to see me around that much (if at all) -- the contact link should still work, though.
 
OPNLguy
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RE: Pilots That Survived Crash And Flew Again

Fri Sep 08, 2006 1:34 am

Quoting Carmenlu15 (Reply 42):
And the plane's still flying today? Wow...

Yep, every day. She came to SWA as a result of the Morris Air acquisition back in the 1990s...

[Edited 2006-09-07 18:35:21]
ALL views, opinions expressed are mine ONLY and are NOT representative of those shared by Southwest Airlines Co.
 
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yellowtail
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RE: Pilots That Survived Crash And Flew Again

Fri Sep 08, 2006 1:44 am

Quoting Carmenlu15 (Reply 39):
Then in 1988 (?) he was the pilot who landed the TA 737-200 in a New Orleans levee, after losing the two engines.


I knew the FO......the most amazing thing was the flew it off the levee after repair.
When in doubt, hold on to your altitude. No-one has ever collided with the sky.
 
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kl5147
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RE: Pilots That Survived Crash And Flew Again

Fri Sep 08, 2006 1:47 am

Quoting Aviateur (Reply 33):
I met and spent several hours with Bob Bragg, FO aboard "Clipper Victor" at Tenerife in '77. He returned to flying at PA several weeks after the crash, and eventually retired a 747-400 captain with UA. He even flew the SP for a while. Today he lives in Virginia. He and his wife Dorothy are both extremely nice people.

I defenitely will not judge about Mr and Mrs Bragg

Quoting Aviateur (Reply 33):
Bragg's story from Tenerife is pretty astounding.

But this thread gives me another view on them. Is This Tenerife Wreckage? (by Hmmmm... Aug 17 2006 in Civil Aviation)#ID2941503
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jetdeltamsy
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RE: Pilots That Survived Crash And Flew Again

Fri Sep 08, 2006 1:49 am

Quoting 777STL (Reply 19):
Quoting JBirdAV8r (Reply 18):
"Finished out" means flying the rest of his career "out" (ie until retirement) at UA, does it not?

That's how I interpreted it, and, obviously, most other members. No need to be so jumpy.

Thank you, yes that's what I intended to say. Amazing how quick some people are to jump down other people's throats.

He didn't say "finished out", he said "finished" which in US English means terminates or ends at that moment.

Quoting 71Zulu (Reply 26):
Quoting Jetdeltamsy (Reply 15):
Quoting Jetdeltamsy (Reply 8):
Quoting 777STL (Reply 3):
The pilot of the UA DC10 that crashed in Sioux City, Iowa finished his career with UA.


Incorrect.

Captain Haynes continued to fly until 1991.

Isn't that what he said?

Ok, well maybe it's just me but can you please tell me what is the difference in the two above statements. Al Haynes "finished" his career at UAL. How is that different from he "continued to fly" until 1991, except for listing the date.

The crash referred to was United 292 which went down on 7/19/1989. Haynes continued flying with United until 1991.
Tired of airline bankruptcies....EA/PA/TW and finally DL.
 
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aloha73g
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RE: Pilots That Survived Crash And Flew Again

Fri Sep 08, 2006 2:00 am

The Captain of Aloha 243, Bob Schornsteimer, flew until he retired at 60 last summer. F/O Mimi Tompkins is still flying AQ 73Gs from Hawai'i to the mainland.

-Aloha!
Aloha Airlines - The Spirit Moves Us. Gone but NEVER Forgotten. Aloha, A Hui Hou!
 
OPNLguy
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RE: Pilots That Survived Crash And Flew Again

Fri Sep 08, 2006 2:06 am

Quoting Jetdeltamsy (Reply 46):
The crash referred to was United 292 which went down on 7/19/1989.

UA232, I think...
ALL views, opinions expressed are mine ONLY and are NOT representative of those shared by Southwest Airlines Co.
 
FlyDeltaJets87
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RE: Pilots That Survived Crash And Flew Again

Fri Sep 08, 2006 2:29 am

Quoting Redcordes (Reply 35):
This doesn't have to do with commercial aviation, but one of the top German aces in WWII, Erich Rudorffer, was shot down 16 times!

Reminds me of the line from Admiral Benson (Lloyd Bridges) in Hot Shots. "You know, I've personally flown over 194 missions and I was shot down every one of them. Come to think of it, I've never landed a plane in my life."
"Let's Roll"- Todd Beamer, United Airlines Flight 93, Sept. 11, 2001

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