Moderators: jsumali2, richierich, ua900, PanAm_DC10, hOMSaR

 
MSYtristar
Posts: 7543
Joined: Sat Aug 27, 2005 12:52 am

Airbus N.A. Chairman: "747-8i is the Ford Edsel"

Fri Dec 08, 2006 12:41 am

At the moment, Airbus is a laughing stock to me. The CEO is getting his panties in a bunch because he cannot accept defeat well it looks like. I mean it's not like LH has NOT bought any Airbus aircraft...they are a loyal customer...but in this case, the B747-8 was the better fit for the airline. Those remarks, coming from the leader of a global company, are pretty childish. I would expect more class.

I'm also enjoying s great laugh at the comments regarding the "1960's deign" of the 747. It' still holding its own, isn't it?
 
Ken777
Posts: 10077
Joined: Thu Mar 11, 2004 5:39 am

Airbus N.A. Chairman: "747-8i is the Ford Edsel"

Fri Dec 08, 2006 12:42 am

I think the comments were rather unwise, but probably reflect the frustration Airbus feels about the 748 sales, both in the freighter version (which is cleaning their clocks) and now the LH order.

While McArtor might be putting this down to a "stumble" by Airbus (I assume he is limiting this stumble to the 380 and not including the 350) the fact is that he's been in the military and probably understands the term FUBAR. It seems that he doesn't want to address the issue that the 748 might be a plane with the size and specs (including performance) that airlines want.
 
User avatar
Asturias
Posts: 1977
Joined: Wed Apr 05, 2006 5:32 am

Airbus N.A. Chairman: "747-8i is the Ford Edsel"

Fri Dec 08, 2006 12:43 am

Quoting MSYtristar (Reply 52):
At the moment, Airbus is a laughing stock to me. The CEO is getting his panties in a bunch because he cannot accept defeat well it looks like. I mean it's not like LH has NOT bought any Airbus aircraft...they are a loyal customer...but in this case, the B747-8 was the better fit for the airline. Those remarks, coming from the leader of a global company, are pretty childish. I would expect more class.

I feel it is important to notice that this is a comment made by the boss of Airbus North America. Not of Airbus itself.

cheers

Asturias
Tonight we fly
 
tak
Posts: 121
Joined: Sun Jul 23, 2006 9:41 am

Airbus N.A. Chairman: "747-8i is the Ford Edsel"

Fri Dec 08, 2006 12:44 am

WOW  eyepopping  almost designed to rile everyone up on Airliners.net, perhaps it was planned that way... Only joking. Seriously, very tactless bad analogy that might be best applied to his own company's projects. In short, PR disaster. Curious if Randy will respond  Smile. I doubt it but, would be interesting. Ciao
 
DAYflyer
Posts: 3546
Joined: Wed Sep 08, 2004 9:35 pm

Airbus N.A. Chairman: "747-8i is the Ford Edsel"

Fri Dec 08, 2006 12:46 am

Airbus North America? Whats that?

Seriously, when the 747-8I has been out for 2 more years, it will have more orders than the A-380, will be delivered on time, and will meet performance gaurantees.

If the 747 is the Ford Edsel, then the A-380 is the Titanic.
One Nation Under God
 
NYC777
Posts: 5103
Joined: Wed Jun 09, 2004 3:00 am

Airbus N.A. Chairman: "747-8i is the Ford Edsel"

Fri Dec 08, 2006 12:46 am

Quoting Asturias (Reply 54):
I feel it is important to notice that this is a comment made by the boss of Airbus North America. Not of Airbus itself.

Does that semantic matter? He is still talking as an employee of Airbus, doesn't matter if he's Airbus North America, Airbus France, or EADS. When Forgeard and Leahy were bashing Boeing and the 787 were there any distinction of whom they represent? They all get their paychecks from the same place.
That which does not kill me makes me stronger.
 
User avatar
N328KF
Posts: 5962
Joined: Tue May 25, 2004 3:50 am

Airbus N.A. Chairman: "747-8i is the Ford Edsel"

Fri Dec 08, 2006 12:49 am

Quoting Asturias (Reply 54):

I feel it is important to notice that this is a comment made by the boss of Airbus North America. Not of Airbus itself.

He's an official representative of the company acting in an executive capacity. What he says counts. It may count less than what Louie and Tommy say, but it still counts.
“In the age of information, ignorance is a choice.”
-Donny Miller
 
TeamAmerica
Posts: 1540
Joined: Thu Sep 07, 2006 3:38 am

Airbus N.A. Chairman: "747-8i is the Ford Edsel"

Fri Dec 08, 2006 12:53 am

Quoting NA (Reply 43):
The Edsel was a technologically backward, even badly engineered car

No, it wasn't. It was ugly as sin, but technologically at least equal to other cars of the day. Ford sold essentially the same car with different body styles under different names. The Ford Fairlane 500 was equivalent to the Edsel Ranger and sold much better. All the other Edsel models sold well enough under the Mercury brand.

The Edsel failed because it was ugly. The B748i is not ugly, and for that reason alone the comparison is ridiculous.
Failure is not an option; it's an outcome.
 
manni
Posts: 4049
Joined: Thu Nov 08, 2001 1:48 am

Airbus N.A. Chairman: "747-8i is the Ford Edsel"

Fri Dec 08, 2006 12:55 am

Quoting Asturias (Reply 54):
I feel it is important to notice that this is a comment made by the boss of Airbus North America. Not of Airbus itself.

cheers

Indeed.

Quoting MSYtristar (Reply 52):
Those remarks, coming from the leader of a global company, are pretty childish. I would expect more class.

He's not, that would be Mr. Gallois.

Quoting DAYflyer (Reply 56):
Airbus North America? Whats that?

The guys who'll be building the USAF's next tankers.  stirthepot 

Quoting N328KF (Reply 58):
He's an official representative of the company acting in an executive capacity.

So is Mr. Leahy. Why are his comments by all but a few being ignored?
 
supa7E7
Posts: 1360
Joined: Fri Aug 27, 2004 2:05 am

Airbus N.A. Chairman: "747-8i is the Ford Edsel"

Fri Dec 08, 2006 12:56 am

Quoting TeamAmerica (Reply 59):
he B748i is not ugly, and for that reason alone the comparison is ridiculous.



Courtesy: Boeing Image

 checkmark 
"Who's to say spaceships aren't fine art?" - Phil Lesh
 
User avatar
solnabo
Posts: 5025
Joined: Fri Jan 11, 2008 8:53 am

Airbus N.A. Chairman: "747-8i is the Ford Edsel"

Fri Dec 08, 2006 1:09 am

@ Supa 7E7

Seen that pic for about 36 years now. Look like 743SUD.

Give us something new and state-of-the-art instead

Micke//  

[Edited 2006-12-07 17:12:04]

[Edited 2006-12-07 17:22:39]
Airbus SAS - Love them both
 
katekebo
Posts: 681
Joined: Sat Apr 14, 2001 12:02 am

Airbus N.A. Chairman: "747-8i is the Ford Edsel"

Fri Dec 08, 2006 1:10 am

Quoting Manni (Reply 60):
The guys who'll be building the USAF's next tankers.

Don't think so. Not because A330 tanker is a bad airplane, but because EU has decided to push forward their case against Boeing B787 in the WTO, which is not going to help to improve Airbus popularity with the American government.
 
dtwclipper
Posts: 6668
Joined: Wed Oct 29, 2003 3:17 am

Airbus N.A. Chairman: "747-8i is the Ford Edsel"

Fri Dec 08, 2006 1:10 am

Quoting TeamAmerica (Reply 59):
No, it wasn't. It was ugly as sin

Ugly? I don't know, that's kind of an understatement!

Compare New York Air, the Airline that works for your Business
 
Indio66
Posts: 403
Joined: Sat Mar 06, 2004 10:22 am

Airbus N.A. Chairman: "747-8i is the Ford Edsel"

Fri Dec 08, 2006 1:11 am

After the LH order, Boeing made a statement to the effect that they were happy to get the order, but that Airbus is a strong company and Boeing can't rest on their laurels. Airbus instead makes these rediculous statements ripping Boeing.

Compare and contrast the mentality of the two companies.
 
DAYflyer
Posts: 3546
Joined: Wed Sep 08, 2004 9:35 pm

Airbus N.A. Chairman: "747-8i is the Ford Edsel"

Fri Dec 08, 2006 1:12 am

Quoting Manni (Reply 60):
Quoting DAYflyer (Reply 56):
Airbus North America? Whats that?

The guys who'll be building the USAF's next tankers.

If you actually believe that, I've got some prime beach front property in Kansas to sell to you......
One Nation Under God
 
DAYflyer
Posts: 3546
Joined: Wed Sep 08, 2004 9:35 pm

Airbus N.A. Chairman: "747-8i is the Ford Edsel"

Fri Dec 08, 2006 1:14 am

Quoting Solnabo (Reply 62):
Give us something new and state-of-the-are instead

Or perhaps "state of the arse", as in the A-380......
One Nation Under God
 
bringiton
Posts: 763
Joined: Thu Sep 28, 2006 10:24 am

Airbus N.A. Chairman: "747-8i is the Ford Edsel"

Fri Dec 08, 2006 1:14 am

Quoting Manni (Reply 60):
The guys who'll be building the USAF's next tankers

Airbus north america is there to " Serving the US and Canadian airlines from coast to coast " according to their own website

"""Airbus North America headquarters is just outside Washington, D.C., in Herndon Virginia. The facility employs some 140 people in sales, marketing, and communications for Airbus customers in the U.S. and Canada. This facility also serves as headquarters for Airbus North America Customer Services. The employees here reflect the diversity in nationality that is so commonplace at Airbus worldwide, offering North American customers daily interaction with a company that offers a true global perspective.
"""

Quote:
I feel it is important to notice that this is a comment made by the boss of Airbus North America. Not of Airbus itself.

So airbus north america has no connections with Airbus as a company? Or is that the airbus north america is held to some different standard of corporate responsibility then their Parent company? What if a boeing Conexion executive or a boeing executive from europe made a comment on the A380 being c-r-a-p would that not count as a statement comming from boeing
 
User avatar
clickhappy
Posts: 9175
Joined: Thu Sep 13, 2001 12:10 pm

Airbus N.A. Chairman: "747-8i is the Ford Edsel"

Fri Dec 08, 2006 1:14 am

Actually, the USAF just made it easier for such a move to happen:

http://www.aero-news.net/index.cfm?C...aaa122-cc3e-4a0f-a722-c879c82d5620

So, is that the Pacific or Atlantic Ocean in Kansas?
 
F4N
Posts: 507
Joined: Fri Mar 17, 2000 11:37 pm

Airbus N.A. Chairman: "747-8i is the Ford Edsel"

Fri Dec 08, 2006 1:16 am

Quoting Manni (Reply 60):
The guys who'll be building the USAF's next tankers.

 rotfl  rotfl  rotfl  rotfl  rotfl  rotfl 

Manni:

In your dreams....

F4N
 
manni
Posts: 4049
Joined: Thu Nov 08, 2001 1:48 am

Airbus N.A. Chairman: "747-8i is the Ford Edsel"

Fri Dec 08, 2006 1:24 am

Quoting DAYflyer (Reply 66):
If you actually believe that, I've got some prime beach front property in Kansas to sell to you......

Noticed the smily?  Yeah sure

Quoting Katekebo (Reply 63):
Not because A330 tanker is a bad airplane, but because EU has decided to push forward their case against Boeing B787 in the WTO, which is not going to help to improve Airbus popularity with the American government.

One Obstacle Gone For Airbus Tanker Bid
USAF Says It Will Disregard WTO Disputes

http://www.aero-news.net/PlainPage.cfm

Having posted that. I tend to agree that the USAF will likely not order the A330, but for different reasons you suggested. As unlikely it seemed for some that LH would order Boeing aircraft, LH being the flag carrier of one of the nations that hosts a Airbus assembly plant. As unlikely it seems to me that the USAF would order Airbus aircraft.
 
PanAmOldDC8
Posts: 934
Joined: Tue Dec 05, 2006 9:25 pm

Airbus N.A. Chairman: "747-8i is the Ford Edsel"

Fri Dec 08, 2006 1:27 am

When will the Airbus people get their act together and stop name calling it doesn't look good on them. It seems to me that they are very worried about their 380, otherwise there would not be so much noise. You know the old saying "where there is smoke there is fire", something must be going on at Airbus HQ to cause this stink. I wonder if there is another delay coming up and they are setting us up for it. The 747 is one of the best planes built and has been flying a long time, the 380 has never flown a passenger yet and has to prove itself. After it has flown for 10 years then I will judge it against the 747. Until then I will reserve judgement. I am not a fan of big airplanes and will not use it, but that is just me. Maybe I am from the old school,I like to get off and out of customs etc quickly
Barbados, CWC soon, can't wait
 
jacobin777
Posts: 12262
Joined: Sat Sep 11, 2004 6:29 pm

Airbus N.A. Chairman: "747-8i is the Ford Edsel"

Fri Dec 08, 2006 1:46 am

Quoting Solnabo (Reply 48):
LOL

Way to go Airbus, give them hell!

The Boeing Brigade is totaly blown away by this statement "Ford Edsel and 747 have much in common"..

In hate we trust

Signed: 99,9% of A bashers

He got what he deserved...are you defending his asinine comments?

Quoting Solnabo (Reply 62):

Give us something new and state-of-the-art instead

Do you mean this...?  Wink

"Up the Irons!"
 
skyhawk62507
Posts: 78
Joined: Sat May 14, 2005 12:03 pm

Airbus N.A. Chairman: "747-8i is the Ford Edsel"

Fri Dec 08, 2006 1:57 am

Regarding the "Edsel" comment... I haven't found the direct quote from Mr. McArtor where he makes this statement, which appears to have originated in a NYT article. The 'Edsel' comment is not in quotes there:

"Of course, these events have not gone unnoticed at Airbus, which has lost some freighter orders for its A380 to Boeing in recent weeks. Allan McArtor, chairman of Airbus North America, called the new 747-8 a brand-new Edsel, the famous new-car failure of the late 1950s."

http://www.nytimes.com/2006/12/07/bu...ess/07boeing.html?_r=1&oref=slogin

All other articles I've seen have attributed the comment to McArtor, but not as part of his later quotes.

My question is this: did McArtor actually make this "Edsel" comment, or was it the article writer's hyperbole?
 
flysherwood
Posts: 881
Joined: Thu Jul 20, 2006 2:58 am

Airbus N.A. Chairman: "747-8i is the Ford Edsel"

Fri Dec 08, 2006 2:07 am

Quoting Curmudgeon (Reply 4):
And that's it in a nutshell. We are all aware of airbus' recent woes, but most of us are also aware that they have a fine collection of engineers building some fine aircraft. Too bad some senior management feel it appropriate to engage in cynical rhetoric. Actually, from what I have seen, everything except the engineering and production is crap. Their marketing, PR, enterprise management and corporate governance is poor, to say the least.

I have to agree with you wholeheartedly. Airbus engineers are among the best in the world. It is too bad that more of them are not actually running this company. It is time for Airbus to get to work solving problems instead of running off at the mouth when they absolutely nothing to crow about! How many A380 airframes have been sold this year? How many B7478F or 8I have been sold this year? No wonder Airbus is in the trouble that they are in.
 
AerospaceFan
Posts: 6990
Joined: Thu Dec 22, 2005 1:43 am

Airbus N.A. Chairman: "747-8i is the Ford Edsel"

Fri Dec 08, 2006 2:07 am

Wow! That proposed MD-12 has blended winglets. Was that in the original? Talk about being ahead of its time!
What's fair is fair.
 
astuteman
Posts: 7146
Joined: Mon Jan 24, 2005 7:50 pm

Airbus N.A. Chairman: "747-8i is the Ford Edsel"

Fri Dec 08, 2006 2:08 am

Quoting Jacobin777 (Reply 45):
Astuteman, I think this is one of the majour reasons many here on A.net bash Airbus

Which is a very great shame....

Quoting PanAm_DC10 (Reply 12):
''We're disappointed as you can imagine. Lufthansa told us that they see the 747-8 as not a competitor to the A380. They felt the need due to their network to have some planes in the 400-seat category and our plane is in the 500-seat category.''

This is a far more appropriate response... (from Leahy too)


Quoting DAYflyer (Reply 55):
then the A-380 is the Titanic.

Possibly not a good analogy - the Titanic was doomed by poor seamanship, not poor design.
From a purely Naval Architecture viewpoint (i.e. ignoring inadequate lifeboat arrangements etc), the Titanic would exceed the safety margins of most modern liners. She had 4 (flooded) compartment stability. Modern liners only have 2 (flooded) compartment stability.

Regards
 
User avatar
N328KF
Posts: 5962
Joined: Tue May 25, 2004 3:50 am

Airbus N.A. Chairman: "747-8i is the Ford Edsel"

Fri Dec 08, 2006 2:09 am

Quoting AerospaceFan (Reply 75):
Wow! That proposed MD-12 has blended winglets. Was that in the original? Talk about being ahead of its time!

No, those are definitely fences a la the A380.
“In the age of information, ignorance is a choice.”
-Donny Miller
 
jacobin777
Posts: 12262
Joined: Sat Sep 11, 2004 6:29 pm

Airbus N.A. Chairman: "747-8i is the Ford Edsel"

Fri Dec 08, 2006 2:11 am

Quoting Astuteman (Reply 76):
Quoting Jacobin777 (Reply 45):
Astuteman, I think this is one of the majour reasons many here on A.net bash Airbus

Which is a very great shame....

I don't disagree with you there mate... Wink

..unfortunately, Mr. McArtor's comments have been.....shall I say "typical" of Airbus management the past few years......
"Up the Irons!"
 
AerospaceFan
Posts: 6990
Joined: Thu Dec 22, 2005 1:43 am

Airbus N.A. Chairman: "747-8i is the Ford Edsel"

Fri Dec 08, 2006 2:11 am

Quoting Astuteman (Reply 76):
Possibly not a good analogy - the Titanic was doomed by poor seamanship, not poor design.

Wasn't it a fact that the compartmental walls extended upwards only so far, making it possible for water to overflow into neighboring compartments, therefore dooming the ship? That's what I seem to recall having seen in a documentary.

(Sorry for being off-topic.)

[Edited 2006-12-07 18:12:35]
What's fair is fair.
 
AerospaceFan
Posts: 6990
Joined: Thu Dec 22, 2005 1:43 am

Airbus N.A. Chairman: "747-8i is the Ford Edsel"

Fri Dec 08, 2006 2:13 am

Quoting N328KF (Reply 77):
No, those are definitely fences a la the A380.

Interesting; thanks!
What's fair is fair.
 
User avatar
keesje
Posts: 13935
Joined: Thu Apr 12, 2001 2:08 am

Airbus N.A. Chairman: "747-8i is the Ford Edsel"

Fri Dec 08, 2006 2:13 am

Quoting Curmudgeon (Thread starter):
Airbus N.A. Chairman:"747 Is The Ford Edsel"



Quoting Curmudgeon (Thread starter):
Airbus North America chairman, who likens the 747-8i to the Ford Edsel

The title is wrong anyway, probably not on purpose..
"Never mistake motion for action." Ernest Hemingway
 
coa747
Posts: 380
Joined: Wed Jul 13, 2005 3:11 pm

Airbus N.A. Chairman: "747-8i is the Ford Edsel"

Fri Dec 08, 2006 2:22 am

There is a difference between Boeing and Airbus. Boeing is just focusing on building planes. Airbus is focused on fighting a battle with its self. There is so much in fighting at Airbus I don't think anyone knows what direction they are headed. The fact that the 747-8I now has over 70 orders is I think the real motivation for these comments. They see sales for the 747 starting to pick up at the expense of the A380. The fact that Boeing's minimal investment compared to the A380 is sucking up sales and has totally wiped out the A380F is a BIG problem. For the first time Airbus is having to consider the possibility that they may not turn a profit with the A380.

By the way if anyone is curious the last new customer to sign on for the A380 was Kingfisher and that was on June 15, 2005. But if you are like me and don't believe Kingfisher will ever take delivery of those 5 frames you have to go back to China Southern on January 31, 2005. Either way the last order for the A380 was over a year and a half ago. So which aircraft is on life support?

[Edited 2006-12-07 18:31:43]
 
astuteman
Posts: 7146
Joined: Mon Jan 24, 2005 7:50 pm

Airbus N.A. Chairman: "747-8i is the Ford Edsel"

Fri Dec 08, 2006 2:23 am

Quoting AerospaceFan (Reply 79):
Wasn't it a fact that the compartmental walls extended upwards only so far, making it possible for water to overflow into neighboring compartments, therefore dooming the ship? That's what I seem to recall having seen in a documentary

(off-topic response)

It's the very height of those compartment walls that defines "compartment stability" - i.e. the Titanic was designed so that those walls were high enough to cope with the 4 most extreme (worst case) compartments being flooded, before the waterline rose above them.

A modern ship would only survive 2 compartments flooded before the watertight "bulkheads" (the naval term - honestly  Wink ) were "topped". I.e. the watertight bulkheads don't extend as far up on a modern ship.
The driver for that is that the watertight bulkheads screw up those beautiful open passenger amenity spaces that we all love on our cruises, so they stop them as low down as they can.

(They then ask the drivers to collide with things "head-on" rather than drag the entire ship's length along a sharp object by trying to turn too late, and puncture every compartment  Wink )

Regards
 
AerospaceFan
Posts: 6990
Joined: Thu Dec 22, 2005 1:43 am

Airbus N.A. Chairman: "747-8i is the Ford Edsel"

Fri Dec 08, 2006 2:27 am

Oh, I see now, Astuteman. Since my posting the message, I found that similar information is confirmed by another source, and, as usual, your perspective on this is impeccable. Thank you for your knowledgeable response!
What's fair is fair.
 
astuteman
Posts: 7146
Joined: Mon Jan 24, 2005 7:50 pm

Airbus N.A. Chairman: "747-8i is the Ford Edsel"

Fri Dec 08, 2006 2:30 am

Quoting AerospaceFan (Reply 84):
Thank you for your knowledgeable response!

My pleasure. Here's an ironic, topical thought for you....
It's all to easy to "diss" the old product, when in many ways it can still teach the new ones a thing or two....  Wink

Regards
 
Rbgso
Posts: 337
Joined: Thu Jun 29, 2006 11:15 pm

Airbus N.A. Chairman: "747-8i is the Ford Edsel"

Fri Dec 08, 2006 2:32 am

Quoting PanAmOldDC8 (Reply 71):
I wonder if there is another delay coming up and they are setting us up for it.

Another delay? Impossible! Everything coming out of Airbus this past month has been positively glowing about the A380: all wiring issues solved, the frames are practically assembling themselves, weight problems solved, etc.

Is it possible we can't believe everything an Airbus exec says? I'm shocked!
 
KFLLCFII
Posts: 3579
Joined: Sat Sep 11, 2004 7:08 am

Airbus N.A. Chairman: "747-8i is the Ford Edsel"

Fri Dec 08, 2006 2:40 am

Quoting Skyhawk62507 (Reply 73):
All other articles I've seen have attributed the comment to McArtor, but not as part of his later quotes.

My question is this: did McArtor actually make this "Edsel" comment, or was it the article writer's hyperbole?

Unlike the NYT article, the original IHT article specifically puts the comment in quotes:

Of course, these events have not gone unnoticed at Airbus, which has seen some orders for its A380 migrate to Boeing planes in recent weeks. Allan McArtor, chairman of Airbus North America, called the new 747-8 "a brand new Edsel," a reference to one of the most famous flops in automotive history.

At face value, it's a direct quote in my books...
"About the only way to look at it, just a pity you are not POTUS KFLLCFII, seems as if we would all be better off."
 
jimyvr
Posts: 1597
Joined: Wed Nov 01, 2006 1:08 pm

Airbus N.A. Chairman: "747-8i is the Ford Edsel"

Fri Dec 08, 2006 2:46 am

Quoting WINGS (Reply 5):
"But it is irritating. Boeing is getting orders only because of our inability to meet demand. Had we not stumbled with the A380, there would not be orders like the Lufthansa order for the 747-800."

So Airbus can't even distinguish apples. and oranges

Lufthansa stated clear 747-8 is a perfect fit between 388 and 346.
1000 - 01MAR07 | http://airlineroute.blogspot.com/
 
PanAmOldDC8
Posts: 934
Joined: Tue Dec 05, 2006 9:25 pm

Airbus N.A. Chairman: "747-8i is the Ford Edsel"

Fri Dec 08, 2006 2:46 am

Quoting Rbgso (Reply 86):
Another delay? Impossible! Everything coming out of Airbus this past month has been positively glowing about the A380: all wiring issues solved, the frames are practically assembling themselves, weight problems solved, etc.

Is it possible we can't believe everything an Airbus exec says? I'm shocked!

Right on. I think you got the message. I am an old fart but have seen too many times when Aircraft makers start screaming, then something is in the works. Something stinks in the State of Denmark and it aint cheese
Barbados, CWC soon, can't wait
 
PanAmOldDC8
Posts: 934
Joined: Tue Dec 05, 2006 9:25 pm

Airbus N.A. Chairman: "747-8i is the Ford Edsel"

Fri Dec 08, 2006 3:05 am

I meant to say" Something is rotten in the State of Denmark and it ain't fish", sorry about the misquote. I apologise to all those from Denmark, it is not meant as an insult it is an English expression that means things aren't Kosher
Barbados, CWC soon, can't wait
 
747727
Posts: 22
Joined: Fri Feb 18, 2005 12:57 am

Airbus N.A. Chairman: "747-8i is the Ford Edsel"

Fri Dec 08, 2006 3:19 am

As I recall, and I was rather young at the time, the Edsel was one of the most technically advanced cars of the day. And it was butt ugly. Anyone who bought one was laughed at, PUBLICLY!

Wiring issues of the 380 aside, don't we have our aircraft mixed up here? 380: butt ugly, not selling, technically a marvel. 747-8: new life for the beautiful queen of the skies, selling well for an old gal, etc.

Just calling it as I see it, as I always do.
Quoting GeorgiaAME (Reply 20):

I completly aggree.

[Edited 2006-12-07 19:22:26]
 
bphendri
Posts: 136
Joined: Fri Mar 03, 2006 3:18 am

Airbus N.A. Chairman: "747-8i is the Ford Edsel"

Fri Dec 08, 2006 3:30 am

It was also the wagon used to jumpstart te shuttle in Airplane II
 
707lvr
Posts: 457
Joined: Mon Jun 28, 2004 3:41 am

Airbus N.A. Chairman: "747-8i is the Ford Edsel"

Fri Dec 08, 2006 3:36 am

Quoting Curmudgeon (Reply 4):
Actually, from what I have seen, everything except the engineering and production is crap.

We might even want to reconsider that. Trying to think of ANY product from ANY company in world history which has recorded multi-billions in sales and taken millions in deposits for a product which is already two years late and counting.
 
SJCRRPAX
Posts: 961
Joined: Wed Dec 21, 2005 2:29 am

Airbus N.A. Chairman: "747-8i is the Ford Edsel"

Fri Dec 08, 2006 3:36 am

Actually, Mr Leary must know nothing about American Cars. The Edsel was actually a fairly decent car, and used most of the lastest technology of the era. It failed because nobody liked its styling. The A380 is much uglier that the B747 (IMHO), and its a totally new model that is not selling so well, so a much closer analogy would be the A380 is airbus's Edsel. The 748 could probably be compared with a 1970 Oldsmobile Cutlass. A great car, with a great history, great sales, but clearly will be replaced in another decade or so.
 
bbobbo
Posts: 173
Joined: Tue Dec 05, 2006 7:33 am

Airbus N.A. Chairman: "747-8i is the Ford Edsel"

Fri Dec 08, 2006 3:49 am

Quoting Jimyvr (Reply 88):
Quoting WINGS (Reply 5):
"But it is irritating. Boeing is getting orders only because of our inability to meet demand. Had we not stumbled with the A380, there would not be orders like the Lufthansa order for the 747-800."

So Airbus can't even distinguish apples. and oranges

Lufthansa stated clear 747-8 is a perfect fit between 388 and 346.

That's a very good point. Airbus has been basing the success of the A380 partly on the idea that it would completely take the market for 400+ passenger VLAs. So how can they now explain LH's 747-8I order? If they admit the 747-8I has a valid market space, then part of their business case for the A380 goes away, which means they made a mistake.

That's a tough thing for them to admit--so far, management has admitted to problems in engineering, which is easy for managment to do because it spreads the blame. But a mistake in strategy? That's all on the management's head. So maybe McArtor's statements aren't that surprising. If he says otherwise, it's tantamount to admitting, "We screwed up in making the A380 too big."
 
Thorben
Posts: 2713
Joined: Fri Sep 09, 2005 10:29 pm

Airbus N.A. Chairman: "747-8i is the Ford Edsel"

Fri Dec 08, 2006 3:55 am

I think he is pretty much right. Maybe we can call it the "Boeing Edsel" in the future. Sounds nicer than "The Hunchback of Notre Seattle". Or, might as well be the "Boeing Esel". (The donkey, for those who don't speak German.)
France 1789; Eastern Germany 1989; Tunisia 2011; Egypt 2011
 
Areopagus
Posts: 1336
Joined: Thu Sep 20, 2001 12:31 pm

Airbus N.A. Chairman: "747-8i is the Ford Edsel"

Fri Dec 08, 2006 3:56 am

Quoting Aaron747 (Reply 24):
Fuselage structure/dimensions, undercarriage arrangement and wing section are just about the only substantial aspects of the 1960s design remaining.

The wing section has changed, although its planform remains the same (unless adjusted by the new flaps).
 
SJCRRPAX
Posts: 961
Joined: Wed Dec 21, 2005 2:29 am

Airbus N.A. Chairman: "747-8i is the Ford Edsel"

Fri Dec 08, 2006 4:00 am

Quoting Thorben (Reply 96):
I think he is pretty much right. Maybe we can call it the "Boeing Edsel" in the future. Sounds nicer than "The Hunchback of Notre Seattle". Or, might as well be the "Boeing Esel". (The donkey, for those who don't speak German.)



Clearly another German who has no clue of American Automotive history.
 
Thorben
Posts: 2713
Joined: Fri Sep 09, 2005 10:29 pm

Airbus N.A. Chairman: "747-8i is the Ford Edsel"

Fri Dec 08, 2006 4:07 am

Quoting SJCRRPAX (Reply 98):
Clearly another German who has no clue of American Automotive history.

You have cars in America?  confused 

Anyway, don't forget who invented them, who makes the best, and who drives them the fastest.
France 1789; Eastern Germany 1989; Tunisia 2011; Egypt 2011
 
PanAmOldDC8
Posts: 934
Joined: Tue Dec 05, 2006 9:25 pm

Airbus N.A. Chairman: "747-8i is the Ford Edsel"

Fri Dec 08, 2006 4:09 am

Quoting Thorben (Reply 96):
think he is pretty much right. Maybe we can call it the "Boeing Edsel" in the future. Sounds nicer than "The Hunchback of Notre Seattle". Or, might as well be the "Boeing Esel". (The donkey, for those who don't speak German.)

Sticks and stones may break my bones but words will never hurt me. Lets wait until the final numbers are in and then we will see who has the last laugh
Barbados, CWC soon, can't wait

Popular Searches On Airliners.net

Top Photos of Last:   24 Hours  •  48 Hours  •  7 Days  •  30 Days  •  180 Days  •  365 Days  •  All Time

Military Aircraft Every type from fighters to helicopters from air forces around the globe

Classic Airliners Props and jets from the good old days

Flight Decks Views from inside the cockpit

Aircraft Cabins Passenger cabin shots showing seat arrangements as well as cargo aircraft interior

Cargo Aircraft Pictures of great freighter aircraft

Government Aircraft Aircraft flying government officials

Helicopters Our large helicopter section. Both military and civil versions

Blimps / Airships Everything from the Goodyear blimp to the Zeppelin

Night Photos Beautiful shots taken while the sun is below the horizon

Accidents Accident, incident and crash related photos

Air to Air Photos taken by airborne photographers of airborne aircraft

Special Paint Schemes Aircraft painted in beautiful and original liveries

Airport Overviews Airport overviews from the air or ground

Tails and Winglets Tail and Winglet closeups with beautiful airline logos