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BigGSFO
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RE: Airlines' Most Profitable Routes And Loads?

Mon Feb 05, 2007 12:46 pm

Quoting WorldTraveler (Reply 49):
On a profit margin (rather than a profit per flight basis), almost all of any US airlines' most profitable flights are LGA to/from their hubs.

Do you mean most profitable domestically? Even moreso than SNA or intra-Alaska? Interesting.
 
BALAX
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RE: Airlines' Most Profitable Routes And Loads?

Mon Feb 05, 2007 12:52 pm

Quoting MAH4546 (Reply 48):
IMO, pretty unlikely. The route makes money as is because the 2-class 763 and one-daily frequency is the right mix to serve the market. Add a second flight or a larger plane, and yields will go anywhere but up. Same with Miami-London. They've had a second daily in the past (the second daily runs only SaSu now), but it just really hurt premium class yields.

I remember the ORD-MAN route being so successful in the early/mid 90s that AA added double daily frequencies in the summer, however this didn't last very long. A single flight might be answer.
 
plunaaircanada
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RE: Airlines' Most Profitable Routes And Loads?

Mon Feb 05, 2007 1:49 pm

Quoting GB (Reply 5):
Please mind that a full flight doesn't mean that it is profitable. The world of yield/rev mgmt goes a "bit" beyond this naive theory! These numbers are never published in any listings! It's like writing your PIN on your bank card!

 checkmark   bigthumbsup 


100% correct who knows whats behind the companies income and profit, maube its 100% full but another orute makes more with the 75% in a similar distance.
 
LipeGIG
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RE: Airlines' Most Profitable Routes And Loads?

Mon Feb 05, 2007 2:01 pm

Gol

Domestic
SDU-CGH 72%
GIG-BSB 84%
GRU-SSA 78%
New York + Rio de Janeiro = One of the best combinations !
 
BALAX
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RE: Airlines' Most Profitable Routes And Loads?

Mon Feb 05, 2007 2:15 pm

Quoting LipeGIG (Reply 53):
Domestic
SDU-CGH 72%
GIG-BSB 84%
GRU-SSA 78%

If these are load factors then you're really missing the point of making profits.
 
plunaaircanada
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RE: Airlines' Most Profitable Routes And Loads?

Mon Feb 05, 2007 2:21 pm

Im bad at saying which would be the most profitable routes but my guesses for AC are:

YYZ-FRA
YYZ_LHR
YYZ-YUL
maybe YYZ-HKG
YVR-HKG

I dont really know just give opinions Big grin

puac  flamed 
 
bobnwa
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RE: Airlines' Most Profitable Routes And Loads?

Mon Feb 05, 2007 9:54 pm

Quoting CLE757 (Reply 44):
Continental's most profitable is IAH-LGW.

You know this or your guessing this?? What is your source if you know it?
 
cornish
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RE: Airlines' Most Profitable Routes And Loads?

Mon Feb 05, 2007 10:51 pm

Quoting Goldorak (Reply 29):
I don't know for the entire AF network,

My understanding was that for both AF and also for BA pretty much the highest yielding route they did was Luanda in Angola.
Just when I thought I could see light at the end of the tunnel, it was some B*****d with a torch bringing me more work
 
cle757
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RE: Airlines' Most Profitable Routes And Loads?

Mon Feb 05, 2007 11:00 pm

Quoting Bobnwa (Reply 56):
You know this or your guessing this?? What is your source if you know it?

I've actually seen a list of the most and least profitable routes by management...IAH-LGW always tops the list for CO.
Cleveland the best location in the Nation
 
IADLHR
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RE: Airlines' Most Profitable Routes And Loads?

Mon Feb 05, 2007 11:22 pm

I have heard from well placed sources in ABQ that for WN BWI-ABQ-BWI is one of the ten most profitable routes for WN.

Over time it has been suggested, a few times, here on various threads that perhaps PHL-LIS and PHL-MAN are extremely siccessful for US.
 
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yellowtail
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RE: Airlines' Most Profitable Routes And Loads?

Tue Feb 06, 2007 4:10 am

Quoting AlitaliaMD11 (Reply 22):
I also remember reading that Continental does very well on IAH-EZE.

Also well on IAH-NRT and IAH-GRU, IAH-LAX is always full but yield is low....

These days anything going to Brazil from anywhere is bound to be minting cash becasue of the Varig collapse.
When in doubt, hold on to your altitude. No-one has ever collided with the sky.
 
LipeGIG
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RE: Airlines' Most Profitable Routes And Loads?

Tue Feb 06, 2007 7:29 am

Quoting BALAX (Reply 54):
If these are load factors then you're really missing the point of making profits.

Yes, are load factors, but if we compare the fares...

SDU-CGH - Average R$ 250 (US$ 120) for a O/W 35 minutes flight on 24 daily flights.
GIG-BSB - Average R$ 580 (US$ 280) for a O/W 105 minutes flight + Cargo on 9 daily flights
GRU-SSA - Average R$ 490 (US$ 240) for a O/W 140 minutes flight + Cargo on 6 daily flights

Higher loads on Gol, you can find on single daily flight routes, closer to 92%, but in terms of profit, not so good.

Felipe
New York + Rio de Janeiro = One of the best combinations !
 
MAH4546
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RE: Airlines' Most Profitable Routes And Loads?

Tue Feb 06, 2007 7:32 am

Quoting IADLHR (Reply 59):

Over time it has been suggested, a few times, here on various threads that perhaps PHL-LIS and PHL-MAN are extremely siccessful for US.

Successful is relative. It could very well mean that US Airways expected to lose money to Lisbon, but instead made a small profit or broke even. Lisbon and Milan are poor yielding markets from the United States. While it is very possible to make money flying there, I truly doubt that they are extremely profitable for US Airways.
a.
 
skyzheimers
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RE: Airlines' Most Profitable Routes And Loads?

Tue Feb 06, 2007 7:52 am

AA #292/293 ORD-DEL according to Chicago flight service has not been profitable in '06 - its first full year of operation...
 
BigGSFO
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RE: Airlines' Most Profitable Routes And Loads?

Tue Feb 06, 2007 8:40 am

Quoting Skyzheimers (Reply 63):
AA #292/293 ORD-DEL according to Chicago flight service has not been profitable in '06 - its first full year of operation...

I've heard just the opposite...
 
stirling
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RE: Airlines' Most Profitable Routes And Loads?

Tue Feb 06, 2007 8:48 am

Quoting AlitaliaMD11 (Reply 18):
The amount of flights and the large variety of aircraft on the routes could serve as proof.



Quoting Bobnwa (Reply 26):
So if any route has a lot of aircraft with a lot of capacity, it is profitable? What is the logic in that?

To me, all it suggests is an extremely competitive environment.

Delta has used widebodies to Florida as much to carry high-loads as they do to maintain a competitive advantage.

Does a full 764 have a higher profit margin than a full 717?
Its a moot point until someone starts posting spreadsheets from the acctg. depts.....
 Wink
Delete this User
 
skyzheimers
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RE: Airlines' Most Profitable Routes And Loads?

Tue Feb 06, 2007 8:51 am

well I hope your sources are better than mine...  bigthumbsup 
 
LAXdude1023
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RE: Airlines' Most Profitable Routes And Loads?

Tue Feb 06, 2007 8:53 am

Out of curiosity does anyone know how DFW-NRT does in profit for AA? I would think they do very well, they have 2x daily and the loads tend to be good. I know that loads dont have anything to do with profit, but im curious.
FOR THE LOVE OF GOD BRING BACK THE PAYWALL!!!!
 
8herveg
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RE: Airlines' Most Profitable Routes And Loads?

Tue Feb 06, 2007 9:21 am

Quoting InbarD (Reply 6):
I pretty sure BA's most profitable route is LHR-JFK.

I agree. Must be pretty successful since they fly it 8 times a day!! Plus 3 to EWR.

I think in general, the most profitable routes will be the ones between the major world hubs:

i.e. LHR, CDG, AMS, FRA, HKG, NRT, SIN, SYD, LAX, ORD, ATL, JFK, YYZ etc etc
 
skyzheimers
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RE: Airlines' Most Profitable Routes And Loads?

Tue Feb 06, 2007 10:31 am

Out of curiosity does anyone know how DFW-NRT does in profit for AA?

The traffic and cargo to Central & South America helps support the NRT-DFW flights as well as the NRT-JFK route...
it is interesting to note that both NW and UA despite their long standing presence and hubs in Tokyo discontinued their nonstops JFK-NRT which left AA as the only US carrier on that run...
 
ordryan28
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RE: Airlines' Most Profitable Routes And Loads?

Tue Feb 06, 2007 11:10 am

Quoting 7474ever (Reply 3):
TLV is a major success for CO.

Correct. I've always found it hard to believe given LY's presence at EWR/ JFK.

But it sure does do well!
Whoever said winning is not everything never fought cancer.
 
b52murph
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RE: Airlines' Most Profitable Routes And Loads?

Tue Feb 06, 2007 3:10 pm

Quoting Miller22 (Reply 37):
For domestic US, you can look at a routes overall revenues in pretty map form at:

http://paxdata.airlineempires.net

That site is quite handy...take a look at MHT...WN has totally trounced UA, US, NW, and DL on their routes to BWI, MCO, TPA, and MDW with only US' PHL still in the top 5. Believe WN is the newest carrier out of the group.

Quoting IADLHR (Reply 59):
I have heard from well placed sources in ABQ that for WN BWI-ABQ-BWI is one of the ten most profitable routes for WN.

Absolutely believable if it's based on fare--most anywhere else, the WN fare is in the $100-$200 range each way; but if I want to take 1593 ABQ-BWI and 2081 BWI-ABQ, even the lowest fare is usually quite a bit higher. Great Flights, BTW. Have flown that round trip 3 times in the last three months, connecting in BWI for MHT.
 
TBCITDG
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RE: Airlines' Most Profitable Routes And Loads?

Tue Feb 06, 2007 3:32 pm

As for AR:

EZE - SYD
EZE - MIA
EZE - MAD
 
UAL777UK
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RE: Airlines' Most Profitable Routes And Loads?

Tue Feb 06, 2007 6:04 pm

Quoting United Airline (Reply 47):
UA: ORD-HKG, SFO-HKG, SFO-NRT, LAX-SYD

I would also add SFO-LHR to that, UA have always performed very well on that route with very high loads and i expect good yields as well.
 
AirGAbon
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RE: Airlines' Most Profitable Routes And Loads?

Tue Feb 06, 2007 6:36 pm

I think all the flights from LOS in Nigeria operated by BA, AF and LH are very profitable as the flights from LAD in Angola for AF and BA, very high yields.

In general AF fares on the African network are very very expensive and these are lucrative flights, because of the lack of competition (except Nigeria) and no other european operators except Brussels airlines on few routes.
I don't know if it's the same for BA and KL regarding their other African operations in term of high profitability.
 
flyboy7974
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RE: Airlines' Most Profitable Routes And Loads?

Tue Feb 06, 2007 7:06 pm

Kevin777 - and why would you doubt that LAX would be in the top 3 for any airline, and then you pick JFK/EWR? First of all, from the west coast, LAX is the gateway and international choice for airlines to Asia and the South Pacific. As for European flights, LAX isn't prone to the competition that you find out of EWR/JFK with the amount of flights over the pond. There isn't competition between LAX and any other west coast destination, not SAN, SFO, LAS because LAX in itself is far above any west coast airport in terms of pax and O&D traffic as well as yield. On the east coast, EWR/JFK not only compete with themselves for traffic and yield, but also with the metropolitan areas of BOS, PHL, and BWI/IAD.

Quite often, people respond and post on here that airlines don't post information on route profiles, pax figures and yield analysis. Actually, incorrect. Here within the states, those figures are released quarterly and I tried to find the most current for the US airlines at the ERAU library. I couldn't find figures for 2006 because the Aviation Daily publication where posted is gone to have bonded, but, I do have some old old pages from years ago. Wow, just found them in old boxes, from years and years ago, but, here I am looking at "America West Hub Profile - Phoenix." How they break it down is by the top 20 markets for HP for 2002 out of PHX, and then by column it lists NONSTOP MILES, DAILY PASS EACH WAY, DAILY REV EACH WAY, AVERAGE FARE, AVERAGE YIELD, ESTIMATE TRANSFERRING PAX. Well, although quite old, I do have 2002 numbers for most airlines in the U.S such as UA - ORD, NW - MSP, AA - DFW, DL- ATL, CO - IAH, AA- ORD, US - CLT, CO - EWR, UA - DEN, UA - SFO, UA - LAX, and US - PHL. The only other pages I have from past thesis and papers I had to complete for my degree was UA Top 50 Domestic Pairs for 2Q 2005, and the same for AA, AS, HP, and NW and these pages show basically the same figures but also compares those quarterly figures to a % change from 2Q00. (quite a jump)
 
[email protected]
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RE: Airlines' Most Profitable Routes And Loads?

Tue Feb 06, 2007 7:10 pm

Care to explain how anyone herein can state accurately using fact and not speculation about profitable routes? It seems to me to be futile and inaccurate based on personal bias.
"Everyone writing for the Telegraph knows that the way to grab eyeballs is with Ryanair and/or sex."
 
jobalas
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RE: Airlines' Most Profitable Routes And Loads?

Tue Feb 06, 2007 7:12 pm

For AF,it's
CDG/LAD,
CDG/LOS,
CDG/HKG,
CDG/NRT,
CDG/SIN,
CDG/PNR,
CDG/SSG,
CDG/JFK
Regard
Faire du ciel le plus bel endroit de la Terre...
 
cornish
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RE: Airlines' Most Profitable Routes And Loads?

Tue Feb 06, 2007 7:17 pm

Quoting [email protected] (Reply 76):
Care to explain how anyone herein can state accurately using fact and not speculation about profitable routes? It seems to me to be futile and inaccurate based on personal bias.

My remark about Luanda for BA and AF is from discussions with appropriate people in those airlines in the past.

By and large, you want to look for some of the highest yielding routes by major airlines, then look for oil routes. Luanda is all about the oil industry with the front of the cabin full on a limited number of frequencies, hence high prices and very high yields.

You can add destinations from major world capitals to the likes of Nigeria, Houston, etc where the oil industry traffic is high to get a good indication of how much money these routes make compared to others.

I remember when Port Harcourt was started up by Virgin. There new route development guy is a friend and he was explaining the figures to me. Quite amazing, despite almost no pax in the back cabin. Of course that route has now gone as part of the Virgin Nigeria deal - but at one time it was one of Virgin's best performing routes.
Just when I thought I could see light at the end of the tunnel, it was some B*****d with a torch bringing me more work
 
flyboy7974
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RE: Airlines' Most Profitable Routes And Loads?

Tue Feb 06, 2007 7:27 pm

As far as my post, I am referencing dated and printed publications and materials based upon airline data that they release for financial figures.

To add to my post, I just found pages also for the Top 50 Domestic City Pairs for DL, SW, FL, CO and US.
 
[email protected]
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RE: Airlines' Most Profitable Routes And Loads?

Tue Feb 06, 2007 7:29 pm

Quoting Cornish (Reply 78):
My remark about Luanda for BA

BA generally charges around 1,300 GBP (of which about 130 is tax and charges) for a return to LAD. Evidently, that's very high yield - especially for economy. But how many people were paying it? Of course, you could argue quite a few considering it utilised a 772 than, say, a 763. But there's still no figures, no facts, only speculation, even if it were informed speculation. Yes, such a route, dependent on oil and when such fares are paid, seems likely, if sufficiently demanded, to return a profit, but no one can say for certain until it's crystal-clear through the submission of evidence, i.e. facts. And even saying my information is "from discussions with appropriate people in those airlines in the past" isn't sufficient; after all, anyone could say that to add some amount of authority to their submission. But as it's you, Cornish, and as you tend to speak sensibly not least by mentioning realistic routes, I believe you.  Smile
"Everyone writing for the Telegraph knows that the way to grab eyeballs is with Ryanair and/or sex."
 
Kevin777
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RE: Airlines' Most Profitable Routes And Loads?

Tue Feb 06, 2007 7:43 pm

Quoting Flyboy7974 (Reply 75):
Kevin777 - and why would you doubt that LAX would be in the top 3 for any airline, and then you pick JFK/EWR? First of all, from the west coast, LAX is the gateway and international choice for airlines to Asia and the South Pacific. As for European flights, LAX isn't prone to the competition that you find out of EWR/JFK with the amount of flights over the pond. There isn't competition between LAX and any other west coast destination, not SAN, SFO, LAS because LAX in itself is far above any west coast airport in terms of pax and O&D traffic as well as yield. On the east coast, EWR/JFK not only compete with themselves for traffic and yield, but also with the metropolitan areas of BOS, PHL, and BWI/IAD.

Just to clarify, I said:

Quoting Kevin777 (Reply 10):
CDG-LAX... Hmm... doubt that any transatlantic LAX-routes are on the top-three of any airline. JFK/EWR yes, maybe, but LAX, doubtful..

I never said anything about transpacific LAX routes. How can you say that "There isn't competition between LAX and any other west coast destination, not SAN, SFO, LAS because LAX in itself is far above any west coast airport in terms of pax and O&D traffic as well as yield."

LAX might be big brother, in particular in terms of international traffic, but you can't say it doesn't have any competition.

I'd still say LAX isn't in the top-three profitable routes transatlantic for any airline; I reckon they are from the East Coast (okay maybe not EWR, but definitely JFK for some). Look at the yields. Often tickets to NYC cost almost the same as tickets to LAX, even though the latter are much more expensive to produce for reasons discussed in this thread. Biz traffic East Coast - Europe is relatively bigger, also getting yields up. Also, a place like JFK is constrained, pulling up yields.

Kevin777  Smile
"I was waiting for you at DFW, but you must have been in LUV" CPH-HAM-CPH CR9
 
cornish
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RE: Airlines' Most Profitable Routes And Loads?

Tue Feb 06, 2007 7:59 pm

Quoting [email protected] (Reply 80):
But as it's you, Cornish, and as you tend to speak sensibly not least by mentioning realistic routes, I believe you.

Why thank you James  Smile You are right of course, and gone are the days when I had actual figures from the airlines to back my points up. These days my current job has got me working on more specific projects and i don't have access to the figures as i used to.

But even relatively recently working on projects in South Africa and speaking to the airlines there - they all wanted rights or more rights to Angola and Nigeria. They were the most lucrative routes on offer and they all made that clear.

But you can fill the premium seats at an inflated price, fill the cargo hold and carry next to no passengers in economy and do VERY nicely. And thats why the oil routes do so well.

On a similar vein it's why AA continue to fly LGW-RDU for example. Now I don't know where it sits in temrs of AA high yielding routes, but it must be worth something otherwise it would have gone to makeway for some other gateway long ago. But i understand there is a significant business market that is specifically served that means despite a less than full economy cabin, the route does nicely enough on a primarily business market.
Just when I thought I could see light at the end of the tunnel, it was some B*****d with a torch bringing me more work
 
bobnwa
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RE: Airlines' Most Profitable Routes And Loads?

Tue Feb 06, 2007 10:20 pm

Quoting Flyboy7974 (Reply 75):
Quite often, people respond and post on here that airlines don't post information on route profiles, pax figures and yield analysis. Actually, incorrect

I did not see profitable routes listed anywhere in your list of what the airlines publish. That is what this discussion is about.
 
LAXdude1023
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RE: Airlines' Most Profitable Routes And Loads?

Wed Feb 07, 2007 1:27 am

Quoting Kevin777 (Reply 81):
I'd still say LAX isn't in the top-three profitable routes transatlantic for any airline; I reckon they are from the East Coast (okay maybe not EWR, but definitely JFK for some).

Thats true. LAX isnt the most profitable among transatlantic routes, but Id be willing to bet they do make a profit. Otherwise, why would we have so much transatlantic service from a wide range of airlines?

Quoting Kevin777 (Reply 81):
LAX might be big brother, in particular in terms of international traffic, but you can't say it doesn't have any competition.

As far as transpac traffic, LAX's biggest competition (obviously) is from SFO. However the market to Asia is much larger from LAX than it is from SFO and there are more flights on more airlines to Asia from LAX. I can only conclude from this that LAX is probably the most profitable destination over the Pacific.
FOR THE LOVE OF GOD BRING BACK THE PAYWALL!!!!
 
Jammin
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RE: Airlines' Most Profitable Routes And Loads?

Wed Feb 07, 2007 2:50 am

I think most of you are seeing increased market share as a direct correlation to increased profits... not the case. AF probably wants 6x on CDG-JFK just so that customers dont give their business to BA or LH, etc... also, all though CDG-JFK's profit margins might not be that large (just guessing), some passengers might be connecting to Africa or Asia (routes that are more profitable).

A couple years ago, I sat next to an CO sale's exec once from IAH-LAX and asked him why airlines have daily flights to some locations even when passenger traffic might not be that high. He said it was to remind the customers that their airline is always an option for them and hopefully, they'll use their airline to connect to routes that are more profitable, when it comes to that.

What do you guys think of political routes? Are they usually very profitable as well? Like UA's IAD-KWI or CA and CZ's future China-Africa routes or MH's KUL-JNB-CPT-EZE route? I would think so, because there's probably little direct competition.

Another example would be like ET's PEK-DEL-ADD run. I believe they're the only airline to offer non-stop service between PEK and DEL. But, I flew biz class on them and it wasn't that expensive...
Emancipate yourselves from mental slavery. None but ourselves can free our mind.
 
flyboy7974
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RE: Airlines' Most Profitable Routes And Loads?

Wed Feb 07, 2007 3:36 am

Bobnwa - if yield isn't a measure of how profitable a route is, on information supplied by the airline, then must ask you what you view on route profitability? load factor, no. The charts take O & D pax numbers, then combine those numbers to transferring pax figures. From there, routes are looked at by total revenue, then adjusted per pax counts versus distance and airline ops (a/c, labor, fees, etc) I'm sure are all integrated into the costs already, and eventually airlines can figure their yield on a per route basis, thus, profitability. There are routes out there that can have low to minimal load factors, but with high enough yield, the route can still make profitability on lower load factors.
 
mrgmrg
Topic Author
Posts: 4
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RE: Airlines' Most Profitable Routes And Loads?

Wed Feb 07, 2007 8:47 am

I'm happy this thread has caused such a "deluge" of responses.
This week I will filter the responses and prepare a sheet with all the airlines & the routes that have been posted and will share it with everyone.
In the mean time, keep adding your knowledge about profitable routes.
 
Kevin777
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Joined: Mon Sep 25, 2006 5:36 pm

RE: Airlines' Most Profitable Routes And Loads?

Wed Feb 07, 2007 8:47 pm

Quoting LAXdude1023 (Reply 84):
Quoting Kevin777 (Reply 81):
I'd still say LAX isn't in the top-three profitable routes transatlantic for any airline; I reckon they are from the East Coast (okay maybe not EWR, but definitely JFK for some).

Thats true. LAX isnt the most profitable among transatlantic routes, but Id be willing to bet they do make a profit. Otherwise, why would we have so much transatlantic service from a wide range of airlines?

Oh I do think they make a profit - some of them at least! But not the biggest profits.

Quoting Jammin (Reply 85):
What do you guys think of political routes? Are they usually very profitable as well? Like UA's IAD-KWI or CA and CZ's future China-Africa routes or MH's KUL-JNB-CPT-EZE route? I would think so, because there's probably little direct competition.

I think it can be either way, but above all I think this area can get very complicated. For instance, if an airline preserves a political route that is not profitable, it will demand something in return - for instance rights to profitable routes, favourable tax treatment, government purchases of (profitable) air tickets etc. So, maybe in some cases, a political, yet economically disastrous route, might indirectly be very profitable because of the side effects. On the other hand, political routes can probably also be an annoying liability.

The MH example you mention does - from a purely economic/marketing perspective - seem very odd, and in a fairly competitive market this would hardly be viable. If the market isn't competitive (I don't know about it) MH might gain from it anyway, but if this isn't the case, they'll probably get some benefits indirectly.

From India, you also have all the political routes to Guwahati etc. in the North East region - they are hardly anywhere near break-even, let alone profitable. Yet they give INdian carriers rights to operate on profitable routes (or what used to be profitable routes anyway)

Quoting Mrgmrg (Reply 87):

This week I will filter the responses and prepare a sheet with all the airlines & the routes that have been posted and will share it with everyone.
In the mean time, keep adding your knowledge about profitable routes.

Thanks!  Smile

Kevin777
"I was waiting for you at DFW, but you must have been in LUV" CPH-HAM-CPH CR9
 
brandonfs88
Posts: 67
Joined: Sun Sep 03, 2006 2:13 am

RE: Airlines' Most Profitable Routes And Loads?

Wed Feb 07, 2007 10:32 pm

MQT-DTW/DTW-MQT by XJ, flights are almost always full on the Saab 340, avergering around 25 people per flight.
 
Bongodog1964
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RE: Airlines' Most Profitable Routes And Loads?

Wed Feb 07, 2007 11:35 pm

I'm sure much of the information can be obtained by observation, its just time consuming. Fares are readily available from airline websites and some idea of load factors. Theres been much talk of exclusive routes being highly profitable and Africa in particular being mentioned. In gross margin % terms these routes may well be top of the list. Their drawback though is frequency; routes such as BA LHR - JFK may not have such a large margin in % terms, but the overall yield would be higher due to many more seats being available.

One additional factor is the impact of frequent flier miles. Routes to LAS have been mentioned as having a lot of frequencies; I realise that a good part of this is conference business, how much of it though is passengers using up frequent flier miles for their vacation, which have been earnt on other routes ?

Where do you make an allowance for this ? If you take the most logical approach you book no income for the flight taken using the flier miles, thus showing a poor yield on the leisure routes; should you not though make an allowance for the flier miles on the routes on which they were earnt ?
 
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United787
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Joined: Fri May 20, 2005 12:20 pm

RE: Airlines' Most Profitable Routes And Loads?

Thu Feb 08, 2007 12:39 am

Quoting 8herveg (Reply 68):
I think in general, the most profitable routes will be the ones between the major world hubs:

I wonder if that is true. I would venture to say that the most profitable routes for airlines are those that have little competition. I have heard on A-Net that the UA flights in and out of ASE are some of the most profitable in the UA system. Not a major hub.
 
usair320
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Joined: Mon Nov 10, 2003 9:53 am

RE: Airlines' Most Profitable Routes And Loads?

Thu Feb 08, 2007 4:03 am

I heard from a PHL based US F/A that PHL-FCO was a good route as it is always full in Envoy many who are full fare customers. It is also on average 100% full. On the 3 times Ive taken that flight the load was nothing short of that. All the seats on that A330
 
bmacleod
Posts: 2990
Joined: Sat Aug 25, 2001 3:10 am

RE: Airlines' Most Profitable Routes And Loads?

Thu Feb 08, 2007 4:28 am

For AC:

YYZ-YVR
YYZ-YYC
YYZ-LHR
YYZ-FRA
YVR-NRT
YVR-HKG
"What good are wings without the courage to fly?" - Atticus
 
COEI2007
Posts: 837
Joined: Wed Jan 17, 2007 1:33 am

RE: Airlines' Most Profitable Routes And Loads?

Thu Feb 08, 2007 5:29 am

Quoting Cedarjet (Reply 32):
doubt CO's flights to Tel Aviv are all that hot. Profitable, yes, but a lot of it is VFR (Visiting Friends + Relatives). VFR is shorthand for "we fill the planes every day but we're barely making five bucks on each ticket" -

Yes, Co fills the back of the aircraft with VFR, but J is always booked heavily, and thats why TLV is one of the most profitable routes.

Quoting Klwright69 (Reply 41):
For CO I would think it would be EWR-IAH and IAH-LAX.

Theres loads International routes are more profitable than LAX!

Quoting CLE757 (Reply 44):
Continental's most profitable is IAH-LGW.



Quoting CLE757 (Reply 58):
I've actually seen a list of the most and least profitable routes by management...IAH-LGW always tops the list for CO.

I second that. Along with IAH-LGW, EWR-TLV, BRU, DUB, MAD, GVA, HKG, DEL, PEK and almost all IAH to Europe/NRT are making them a lot of money.
 
AirEMS
Posts: 625
Joined: Mon May 17, 2004 6:34 am

RE: Airlines' Most Profitable Routes And Loads?

Thu Feb 08, 2007 12:12 pm

What about DEN for UA?

Every time I fly
DEN-ORD
DEN-IAD
DEN-LAX

Thoes planes are always full?

here is a question what is the next big profit area for airlines?
China?
Japan?
Somewhere in the US?

-Carl
If Your Dying Were Flying
 
mrgmrg
Topic Author
Posts: 4
Joined: Fri Feb 02, 2007 10:47 am

RE: Airlines' Most Profitable Routes And Loads?

Sun Feb 11, 2007 6:00 pm

After 95 replies to the post, it is worth noting that few of the posts gave its sources. This is no surprise since this info is confidential to each airline.

Some of the results were hotly contested, in particular those of airlines based in the US since many of the posters gave high capacity/load/frequency routes while some other posters argued that most of these routes are low yielding. This was the case for all DL Florida routes.

There seems to be a coincidence among most, however, that long distance routes are more profitable than shorter ones.

Many of the airlines below are listed with more than one route since there were different posters offering different answers or a single poster giving more than a few options that were not contested or refined (e.g. AC).

A fun fact derived from the great site http://paxdata.airlineempires.net, suggested by Miller 22 in reply 37 shows that the highest revenue route in the US is JFK-LAX, while ORD-LGA while netting just 66% of the revenues of that route has an 84% higher yield. Given that these two routes are flown by many airlines, we can not accurately conclude if they are particularly among the most profitable for any one of them.

So... here's the filtered list from the first 95 replies to the post (AM's are mine).

Debate them, challenge them and keep adding!

AA JFK-EZE
AA MIA-EZE
AA MIA-GRU
AA DFW-ZRH
AA ORD-PVG
AA MIA-LHR
AC YYZ-YVR
AC YYZ-YYC
AC YYZ-LHR
AC YYZ-FRA
AC YVR-NRT
AC YVR-HKG
AF CDG-IAH
AF CDG-IAD
AF CDG-LAD
AM MEX-GRU
AM MEX-CDG
AR EZE-SYD
AR EZE-MIA
BA LHR-JFK
BA LHR-JNB
BA LHR-CPT
BA LHR-LOS
BA LHR-LAD
CO EWR-TLV
CO IAH-LGW
CX NRT-HKG
CX TPE-HKG
CX LHR-HKG
CX YVR-HKG
DL ATL-FLL
DL ATL-MIA
DL ATL-JAX
DL ATL-TPA
DL ATL-MCO
DL ATL-LGA
DL ATL-JFK
G4 GIG-BSB
LH FRA-NRT
LH FRA-SIN
LY TLV-HKG
QF SYD-LAX
SQ SIN-KUL
SQ SFO-HKG-SIN
SQ SYD-SIN
SQ LHR-SIN
SQ JFK-FRA-SIN
UA ORD-HKG
UA SFO-HKG
UA SFO-NRT
 
Kevin777
Posts: 951
Joined: Mon Sep 25, 2006 5:36 pm

RE: Airlines' Most Profitable Routes And Loads?

Sun Feb 11, 2007 10:09 pm

Just one thought here..

Quoting Mrgmrg (Reply 96):
BA LHR-CPT

LHR-CPT? Isn't that just a bit too much on the leisure side to be of any top yields?

Kevin777  Smile
"I was waiting for you at DFW, but you must have been in LUV" CPH-HAM-CPH CR9
 
AlitaliaMD11
Posts: 3704
Joined: Tue Dec 02, 2003 5:19 am

RE: Airlines' Most Profitable Routes And Loads?

Sun Feb 11, 2007 11:49 pm

I was reading an article in the latest Airways Magazine and there is an article about LTU that says DUS-JFK is their most profitable long-haul route and DUS-AYT is their most profitable short-haul route.
No Vueling No Party
 
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LHRBFSTrident
Posts: 574
Joined: Wed Nov 15, 2006 3:38 pm

RE: Airlines' Most Profitable Routes And Loads?

Tue Feb 13, 2007 2:17 pm

BA's top-yielding routes used to be LHR-JNB/CPT and LHR-LAX, in that order.

Source: crew briefing sheet for LAX provided to each flightdeck crew by BA LAX station manager. Admittedly this info is approx 4 years old, but I was surprised at the time...

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