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airtran737700
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Airtran To Annouce Another Transcon P2p Route

Sat Mar 03, 2007 12:50 am

This week they announced BWI to SEA nonstop.....next up

SAN to MCO nonstop
 
727LOVER
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RE: Airtran To Annouce Another Transcon P2p Route

Sat Mar 03, 2007 12:55 am

wow!

I was looking for MCO-LAX, but not SAN!
"We must accept finite disappointment, but never lose infinite hope." - Martin Luther King, Jr.
 
Mikey711MN
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RE: Airtran To Annouce Another Transcon P2p Route

Sat Mar 03, 2007 1:24 am

Quoting Airtran737700 (Thread starter):
SAN to MCO nonstop

According to the recent B6 rumor thread--where they announced IAD-MCO and SDQ--there were quite a few SAN fans who were disappointed that this wasn't added by B6. So they'll be quite pleased with this. And from a pure O&D numbers assessment (247 passengers/day IIRC), this makes a lot of sense for FL.

-Mike
I plan on living forever. So far, so good...
 
Trvlr
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RE: Airtran To Annouce Another Transcon P2p Route

Sat Mar 03, 2007 1:27 am

AirTran has publicly said that if they are impressed with results on the recently announced SAN-ATL, they will look into the possibility of SAN-MCO.

Since the original SAN-ATL announcement, AirTran has bumped up the service from 2x daily to 3x daily. With the impending(?) announcement of SAN-MCO, you have to wonder if AirTran is kicking itself for not coming to SAN earlier.

Aaron G.
 
panam330
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RE: Airtran To Annouce Another Transcon P2p Route

Sat Mar 03, 2007 2:40 am

While it will be nice to see FL adding some unique routes to MCO, and nicer yet to see SAN finally receive service to the state of Florida, I'd (personally) rather see B6 on the route. That way, I can pick my seat before check-in. The TVs help too  Wink. Or Delta. They've been adding some unique routes to the west lately (RDU-LAX, JAX-LAX, etc), and this would seem like a shoe-in for their MCO focus city (of sorts).
 
AA737-823
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RE: Airtran To Annouce Another Transcon P2p Route

Sat Mar 03, 2007 3:50 am

Quoting PanAm330 (Reply 4):
That way, I can pick my seat before check-in.

Uh, you can do that with AirTran too. Just pay a tad more.

That's why they're called a Low-Fare airline.
 
ejmmsu
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RE: Airtran To Annouce Another Transcon P2p Route

Sat Mar 03, 2007 6:24 am

Quoting AA737-823 (Reply 5):

Uh, you can do that with AirTran too. Just pay a tad more.

It is often significantly more.
"If the facts do not conform to the theory, they will have to be disposed of"
 
bonanzaair
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RE: Airtran To Annouce Another Transcon P2p Route

Sat Mar 03, 2007 6:37 am

Quoting Ejmmsu (Reply 6):
It is often significantly more.

Guess someone beat you to the cheap seats.

Quoting PanAm330 (Reply 4):
I'd (personally) rather see B6 on the route. That way, I can pick my seat before check-in. The TVs help too Wink

The XM Radio isn't bad - more choices in entertainment.


Bonanza
 
EXAAUADL
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RE: Airtran To Annouce Another Transcon P2p Route

Sat Mar 03, 2007 6:45 am

Im kinds surprised WN never took advantage of this...should work, especially as a monopoly market
 
floridaflyboy
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RE: Airtran To Annouce Another Transcon P2p Route

Sat Mar 03, 2007 6:48 am

Quoting PanAm330 (Reply 4):
While it will be nice to see FL adding some unique routes to MCO, and nicer yet to see SAN finally receive service to the state of Florida, I'd (personally) rather see B6 on the route. That way, I can pick my seat before check-in. The TVs help too . Or Delta. They've been adding some unique routes to the west lately (RDU-LAX, JAX-LAX, etc), and this would seem like a shoe-in for their MCO focus city (of sorts).

I agree with your entire post there, but I'm thrilled that AirTran is doing this finally. Service from SAN to Florida is LONG overdue, as you implied.
Good goes around!
 
727LOVER
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RE: Airtran To Annouce Another Transcon P2p Route

Sat Mar 03, 2007 7:10 am

Correct me if I am wrong, but

is this the first nonstop ever between these two airports? I can't recall anybody else. National, Eastern, Delta, United.....
"We must accept finite disappointment, but never lose infinite hope." - Martin Luther King, Jr.
 
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SANFan
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RE: Airtran To Annouce Another Transcon P2p Route

Sat Mar 03, 2007 7:12 am

I can't believe I'm 6 hours late in seeing this news -- this is news, right, not a rumor?!

I don't know if anyone has been more vocal than I about SOMEONE needing to connect SD and Florida -- anywhere in Florida, although MCO and MIA/FLL would be the most obvious choices.

Incidentally, DOT shows, for 3Q-2006, 405 O&D pax/day and this is the largest unserved SAN n/s market (besides RNO which is getting served by WN in a few days)! Despite a low-yield market, I still can't believe it has taken so long to get this route going. I trust it will start early in the summer so all the families in both cities can fly to the other city for a vacation! (Talk about a 2-way market, the plane should be packed both ways with about equal numbers of people heading out and returning home.)

There will also be some business travelers as there are certainly still some SAN connections with the Space industry at the Cape and the ever-present military.

In any case, this is some of the best news I've heard in a long time and I'm anxious for the formal announcement and details of the service. Thank you, AirTran Airways (and Airtran737700) for the new service and the news!

BTW, I wonder if THIS will be announced as another seasonal service...  banghead 

bb
 
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LAXintl
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RE: Airtran To Annouce Another Transcon P2p Route

Sat Mar 03, 2007 7:29 am

One thing to remember is that CA-FL yields with the exception of MIA are quite weak.

Both DL/Song and Jetblue have both upped to only drop services, so I would hardly consider an AirTran SAN-MCO route an automatic money maker.
From the desert to the sea, to all of Southern California
 
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SANFan
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RE: Airtran To Annouce Another Transcon P2p Route

Sat Mar 03, 2007 9:20 am

Quoting 727LOVER (Reply 1):
According to the recent B6 rumor thread--where they announced IAD-MCO and SDQ--there were quite a few SAN fans who were disappointed that this wasn't added by B6.

I was certainly one of those "SAN fans", 727', as I was really hoping that B6 would see the logic of just moving the xld BUR-MCO flight 100 miles south and flying it from Lindbergh. I hope they either regret passing SAN by (again) or maybe they will decide to try the route as well -- but they apparently have missed the chance to be first!

Quoting PanAm330 (Reply 4):
I'd (personally) rather see B6 on the route. That way, I can pick my seat before check-in. The TVs help too . Or Delta. They've been adding some unique routes to the west lately (RDU-LAX, JAX-LAX, etc), and this would seem like a shoe-in for their MCO focus city (of sorts).

I've thought for years that DL could make this route work but regarding SAN, they have unfortunately become just another hub-and-spoke participant with no P2P at all. And I've given up on B6 doing anything original here, despite several markets that they could develop.

Quoting EXAAUADL (Reply 8):
Im kinds surprised WN never took advantage of this...should work, especially as a monopoly market

It would be a natural for WN if they were into long-distance n/s. The thing about the SAN-MCO market is...

Quoting 727LOVER (Reply 10):
is this the first nonstop ever between these two airports? I can't recall anybody else. National, Eastern, Delta, United.....

...yes, 727", absolutely. In fact, unless I am forgetting about some very short-lived experiment years ago by National --the ORIGINAL one -- (I seem to have a nagging memory of TPA or JAX but it probably stopped in LA) there has never been a n/s between SAN and FL. AA may have once announced MIA, even had it on a schedule, but I'm 99% sure it never flew. The SAN-MCO O&D figures are high enough and the market has been untouched for so long...

Quoting Laxintl (Reply 12):
Both DL/Song and Jetblue have both upped to only drop services, so I would hardly consider an AirTran SAN-MCO route an automatic money maker.

...as I said earlier, despite low yields, this route should work! Also remember we are connecting 2 major tourist destinations (inc. 2 of the 3 SeaWorlds) and cruise ports on both ends...

The thing about WN is I would not expect them to get into LAX-MCO (3 n/s cx) or even Bay Area-MCO (SFO has n/s) but SAN has high O&D and no n/s service at all. As both SAN and MCO are high-growth cities for WN (and both in the Top-Ten stations) who knows, maybe they will decide at some point to try it too.

As Trvlr said so well (in reply #3), depending on what this MCO service from FL turns out to be, from the initial announcement of "Inaugurating SAN Service" (made on Jan 23), AirTran is now set to fly at least 4 flights to at least 2 destinations!

Finally, let's not forget about IND, already served from FL's 2 other CA stations. Yooh, AirTran Route Development people, SAN-IND O&D (DOT 3Q-2006) was 312 pax/day! (Shall we try for THREE new cities from SAN before the first plane touches down on runway 27?)  stirthepot 

bb
 
MAH4546
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RE: Airtran To Annouce Another Transcon P2p Route

Sat Mar 03, 2007 9:53 am

Quoting SANFan (Reply 13):
. AA may have once announced MIA, even had it on a schedule, but I'm 99% sure it never flew. T

They flew it for more than three years. Daily non-stop 757. Started in 1992, lasted until about late 1995.

[Edited 2007-03-03 01:56:41]
a.
 
floridaflyboy
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RE: Airtran To Annouce Another Transcon P2p Route

Sat Mar 03, 2007 10:00 am

Quoting MAH4546 (Reply 14):
They flew it for more than three years. Daily non-stop 757. Started in 1992, lasted until about late 1995.

I remember hearing about that. It was during the time they were really building up the miami hub.
Good goes around!
 
Indy
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RE: Airtran To Annouce Another Transcon P2p Route

Sat Mar 03, 2007 10:09 am

Quoting SANFan (Reply 13):
Finally, let's not forget about IND, already served from FL's 2 other CA stations. Yooh, AirTran Route Development people, SAN-IND O&D (DOT 3Q-2006) was 312 pax/day!

I have a feeling we've seen the last of the new routes for FL from IND.
Indy = Indianapolis and not Independence Air
 
panam330
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RE: Airtran To Annouce Another Transcon P2p Route

Sat Mar 03, 2007 10:15 am

Quoting Indy (Reply 16):
I have a feeling we've seen the last of the new routes for FL from IND.

What makes you say that?
 
Indy
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RE: Airtran To Annouce Another Transcon P2p Route

Sat Mar 03, 2007 10:42 am

They seemed to have capped their flights at about 16 or 17 daily.
Indy = Indianapolis and not Independence Air
 
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SANFan
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RE: Airtran To Annouce Another Transcon P2p Route

Sat Mar 03, 2007 11:42 am

Quoting MAH4546 (Reply 14):
They flew it for more than three years. Daily non-stop 757. Started in 1992, lasted until about late 1995.

Thank you for that MAH'; I don't know how I managed to forget a 3-year thing like that but I'm glad to be reminded.

OK, so FL will not be the first to connect SAN with Florida but the rest still stands and I remain very happy about it. I'm anxious to see what their schedule will be and as I still have no idea where the airport will put their operation, and what gate availability will be, I don't know what options will be available for them. I would think the SD Prime Time rule would be the optimum schedule here, i.e., morning SAN departure, late afternoon/early evening MCO departure with a/c RON in SAN. They do have their newest (3rd) ATL flight scheduled that way as of now. If they should somehow end up with their own gate, they could do 2 RON and tow one to remote parking... But maybe they'll make the e/b flight a red-eye; it wouldn't be my first choice for maximum loads but it'll do if necessary.

Quoting Indy (Reply 18):
They seemed to have capped their flights at about 16 or 17 daily.

Aww, come on Indy -- there's always room for just one more... It must be 2 gates they use in IND, right? That looks like about a standard (non-WN) gate usage: about 8 flights/gate in a day.

bb
 
Indy
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RE: Airtran To Annouce Another Transcon P2p Route

Sat Mar 03, 2007 11:44 am

Quoting SANFan (Reply 19):
It must be 2 gates they use in IND, right?

They have 3 gates and use a 4th on a per use basis.
Indy = Indianapolis and not Independence Air
 
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SANFan
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RE: Airtran To Annouce Another Transcon P2p Route

Sat Mar 03, 2007 12:00 pm

Really? Must be staffing or other issues then or else they just don't think the traffic is there for more markets and flights? I think there was a thread a few weeks ago about FL in IND and I thought there were ideas expressed of IND becoming at least a focus city for AirTran, if not another hub...

With what FL is doing these days, it's hard to find patterns to their sudden expansion -- yet. Be interesting to see what happens as the summer approaches. And, of course, there's always the YX angle...

bb
 
Indy
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RE: Airtran To Annouce Another Transcon P2p Route

Sat Mar 03, 2007 12:06 pm

The YX thing may have put expansion on hold. If it falls through who knows what they will do. Six new gates become available here in about 18 months. That gives plenty of room for expansion for someone.
Indy = Indianapolis and not Independence Air
 
MCOflyer
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RE: Airtran To Annouce Another Transcon P2p Route

Sat Mar 03, 2007 2:48 pm

I hope FL does amnounce MCO-SAN. It would be a good money maker and some airline exec needs to relaise this.

MCOflyer
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Coronado990
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RE: Airtran To Annouce Another Transcon P2p Route

Sat Mar 03, 2007 3:34 pm

Call me crazy, but a good coast-to-coast P2P route would be SAN to either ORF or PHF to serve the Navy population bouncing between the two ports. OH&DEE hovers around a respectable 300 pax a day. AirTran could be the next new Poor Sailors Airline (PSA).
SFO=NoCal LAX=SoCal SAN=LoCal
 
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SANFan
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RE: Airtran To Annouce Another Transcon P2p Route

Sat Mar 03, 2007 4:54 pm

Quoting Coronado990 (Reply 24):
Call me crazy, but a good coast-to-coast P2P route would be SAN to either ORF or PHF to serve the Navy population bouncing between the two ports. OH&DEE hovers around a respectable 300 pax a day.

You're crazy! Well, more precisely, you're absolutely right '990; you and I have talked about this idea for 6 months and the only reason I haven't mentioned the idea lately is because it's taken forever to get this MCO flight up and running and it was an obvious one. So how long before the airlines realize the "SAN-ORF" rants are also right on? The latest (3Q-2006) DOT stats show ORF-SAN now at 349 O&D! IF we can now assume MCO is served from SAN, the next biggest unserved n/s market from SAN is, guess? Norfolk. And the next largest one is IND! So there you go AirTran...

WN could easily do either of these routes too. If they're watching FL (and I kinda bet they are  Wink ) maybe we'll see some new Canyon Blue lines out of Lindbergh on the WN route map soon! (Unfortunately WN is still shying away from transcons so I would see IND as a more realistic possibility from them.)

(Good to see you weighing in on these SAN topics '990. Keep working on those turn schedules...)

bb
 
DAYflyer
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RE: Airtran To Annouce Another Transcon P2p Route

Sun Mar 04, 2007 12:12 am

Looks like they are finding homes for all those 737's after all!
One Nation Under God
 
DCAYOW
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RE: Airtran To Annouce Another Transcon P2p Route

Sun Mar 04, 2007 12:23 am

Quoting SANFan (Reply 11):
I still can't believe it has taken so long to get this route going.

The fare levels (and fuel prices) in the past few years were not at sufficient levels to make it break even - even with FL's cost structure. It's simple economics. A market can exist for service (in terms of pax numbers), but the numbers (all the numbers) have to make sense before an airline will initiate service.
Retorne ao céu...
 
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vatveng
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RE: Airtran To Annouce Another Transcon P2p Route

Sun Mar 04, 2007 1:23 pm

Quoting SANFan (Reply 25):
IF we can now assume MCO is served from SAN, the next biggest unserved n/s market from SAN is, guess? Norfolk.

Transcon from PHF? drool......  cloudnine 
 
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LAXintl
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RE: Airtran To Annouce Another Transcon P2p Route

Wed Mar 07, 2007 6:05 am

Here is the official MCO-SAN announcement. Service is only twice weekly however.

http://biz.yahoo.com/prnews/070306/nytu158.html?.v=84

The following nonstop service between Orlando International Airport and San Diego International Airport is available beginning June 29, 2007:

Nonstop Service Between Orlando and San Diego

From To Flight Departs Arrives Frequency
Orlando San Diego 692 7:35 p.m. 9:35 p.m. Fri, Sun
San Diego Orlando 693 10:25 p.m. 6:00 a.m. Fri, Sun
From the desert to the sea, to all of Southern California
 
FA4B6
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RE: Airtran To Annouce Another Transcon P2p Route

Wed Mar 07, 2007 7:19 am

B6 really missed the boat on this.
"Leap! And the net will appear."
 
MAH4546
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RE: Airtran To Annouce Another Transcon P2p Route

Wed Mar 07, 2007 7:34 am

Quoting FA4B6 (Reply 30):
B6 really missed the boat on this.

No they didn't, let FL have it and compete with the Disney traffic. The South Florida-San Diego market is larger (495 daily passengers vs. 457 [417 excluding PBI]) and has a higher average fare ($243 vs. $223; $233 excluding PBI). That's where jetBlue should look at. Too bad they have literally no room to expand at FLL.
a.
 
airtran737700
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RE: Airtran To Annouce Another Transcon P2p Route

Wed Mar 07, 2007 7:51 am

I honestly had no idea it was two times a week, but two times a week is better than none. hopefully it will work better han the LAS P2P flying they have done in the past. Time will tell.
 
luv2fly
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RE: Airtran To Annouce Another Transcon P2p Route

Wed Mar 07, 2007 7:54 am

Keep in mind that SEA is the gateway for Alaska Cruises both the ones that leave from the port of SEA and also many cruise lines fly you into SEA then bus you up to the port of YVR for your cruise.

Also the SAN to MCO are on days when the cruises leave from Port Canaveral so a sure sell.
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SANFan
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RE: Airtran To Annouce Another Transcon P2p Route

Wed Mar 07, 2007 9:54 am

Boy-oh-freekin-boy; first seasonal service to ATL and now twice-weekly to MCO (probably also seasonal.) Why bother? No surprise that no announcement of location at Lindbergh has been made; they'll probably just sneak into some outlying gate when nobody's looking and use a ticket-counter-on-wheels. Then they can pack it all up in someone's pick-up in October and take it back to Atlanta... (Reminds me all too much of our recent new arrival, and more recently departed, Western!)

Very impressive, AirTran. That's what I call really committing to a new market!

This still leaves the door open for someone to really start flying between SAN and Florida -- WN, B6, anyone?

bb
 
airtran737700
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RE: Airtran To Annouce Another Transcon P2p Route

Wed Mar 07, 2007 11:51 am

SANfan you talk about airtran as if it is the only airline that operates seasonal flights. In fact I think that B6 is the king of seasonal flying here (nothing against B6 I like them). Airtran is honest about something being seasonal upfront where as B6 doesn't say something is seasonal (most recently some of the Stewart flights). I think Airtran can make this flight profitable (and SAN as a whole) and may stay year round.
 
travatl
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RE: Airtran To Annouce Another Transcon P2p Route

Wed Mar 07, 2007 12:00 pm

Seriously SANfan - would you just prefer that AirTran not fly there at all?
1 Interview. 24 years. 3 Airlines.
 
gr8slvrflt
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RE: Airtran To Annouce Another Transcon P2p Route

Wed Mar 07, 2007 3:13 pm

Rumor has it CLT-LAX is next.
I work for Southwest, but the views expressed are my own and do not necessarily represent those of Southwest.
 
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SANFan
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RE: Airtran To Annouce Another Transcon P2p Route

Wed Mar 07, 2007 6:00 pm

Quoting Luv2fly (Reply 33):
Keep in mind that SEA is the gateway for Alaska Cruises both the ones that leave from the port of SEA and also many cruise lines fly you into SEA then bus you up to the port of YVR for your cruise.
Also the SAN to MCO are on days when the cruises leave from Port Canaveral so a sure sell.

Sorry but I'm missing your point here Luv'; was this in response to another post or what? SAN is a year 'round cruise port and so is Port Canaveral (near MCO.) But I still don't know what point you're trying for here regarding SEA.

Quoting Airtran737700 (Reply 35):
SANfan you talk about airtran as if it is the only airline that operates seasonal flights. In fact I think that B6 is the king of seasonal flying here (nothing against B6 I like them). Airtran is honest about something being seasonal upfront where as B6 doesn't say something is seasonal (most recently some of the Stewart flights). I think Airtran can make this flight profitable (and SAN as a whole) and may stay year round.

I guess I can assume then that the MCO service is year 'round since it was not announced as seasonal? I guess I can also assume that come Nov. 4, AirTran-SAN will only be operating 2 flights a week to MCO? (If they're flying 2x weekly during the peak season, I would think 2x a week during the off-season would be way too much!)

With an average SAN-MCO O&D of 405 pax/day (per DOT 3Q-2006), can someone please explain to me what kind of numbers we would need for, oh, I don't know, a DAILY flight on FL? (Other DOT O&D #s: 3Q-'05=406, 4Q-'05=388, 1Q-'06=414, 2Q-'06=457!) I certainly understand the meaning of "seasonal" and I have no problem with it, in a seasonal market. I can illustrate San Diego-seasonal: in the winter, B6 flys 2x daily SAN-JFK; in the summer, it's 3x daily. How the heck is SAN-ATL any more seasonal than that? Neither it nor SAN-MCO is a seasonal market other than there are more pax in the summer than the winter (as is true with most markets.)

Quoting Travatl (Reply 36):
Seriously SANfan - would you just prefer that AirTran not fly there at all?

Trav', the whole thing makes no sense to me, that's all. As was discussed on a thread or 2 when AirTran first announced SAN-ATL on Jan 23 (2 flights at that time, now a third is to appear in July), where is the seasonality in this market? Who in the world would ever think these 2 cities are seasonal; which city is it that's seasonal? Is this the way AirTran researches markets? I really don't know much about them as I haven't been around them much but so far they don't seem to know much about SAN either. Perhaps they should pick up the phone, call Delta, and ask how seasonal SAN-ATL is... I guess it is since DL goes from 7 n/s in the summer to a mere 5 in the dead of winter. I won't even go into the # of 767s they fly on the route! Yeah, I can see now why FL realizes there's no market in the winter.

Yes, Travatl, I would have to say that if FL takes up space at the very crowded Lindbergh Field that another cx might want, one that would serve SAN more permenantly and realistically, I would rather they not bother and I don't really see why they ARE bothering. And I'm sure DL would second that!  Wink I have a feeling that what I think is not going to make FL forget San Diego, but it certainly does upset me.

I apologize if this has been somewhat disjointed (and nasty) but I've been trying to deal with the "seasonal" thing as well as the "twice a week" thing -- 2 entirely separate but equally disturbing issues. The commonality, however, is the indication that AirTran does not seem to know this new market they are spending money to start serving. And it makes me wonder how other things are done and decisions arrived at. Those of you more familiar with FL can enlighten me, and I'm sure you will!  Smile

Maybe I'll be very pleasantly surprised and at the end of the year, FL will be flying 3X daily to ATL, 1x daily to MCO and 1x daily to IND, have their very own gate and a huge, bolted-down ticket counter at Lindbergh Field! One can only hope...

bb
 
N1120A
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RE: Airtran To Annouce Another Transcon P2p Route

Wed Mar 07, 2007 6:10 pm

Quoting AA737-823 (Reply 5):
That's why they're called a Low-Fare airline.

Um, jetBlue and Frontier are both Low-Fare airlines and allow seat selection pre-check in at no extra cost.

Quoting Bonanzaair (Reply 7):


The XM Radio isn't bad - more choices in entertainment.

JetBlue has both XM and TV.

Quoting Laxintl (Reply 12):
One thing to remember is that CA-FL yields with the exception of MIA are quite weak.

Well, LAX-MCO does a lot of business because of Disney.
Mangeons les French fries, mais surtout pratiquons avec fierte le French kiss
 
MAH4546
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RE: Airtran To Annouce Another Transcon P2p Route

Wed Mar 07, 2007 6:29 pm

Quoting N1120A (Reply 39):

Well, LAX-MCO does a lot of business because of Disney.

That's what jetBlue was thinking when they launched MCO-BUR. Unfortunately, Disney can only help so much. The average fare on MCO-LAX is a very un-extraordinary $221 each way. For comparison, BOS-LAX is $290, IAD-LAX is $291, MIA-LAX's average one-way fare is $301, and NYC-LAX is $345.
a.
 
WDBRR
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RE: Airtran To Annouce Another Transcon P2p Route

Wed Mar 07, 2007 9:25 pm

Is Airtran getting more gates in MCO? seems like both FL and B6
have no room to grow with WN in the same concourse.
 
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lindy field
Posts: 2986
Joined: Tue Mar 27, 2001 1:52 pm

RE: Airtran To Annouce Another Transcon P2p Route

Wed Mar 07, 2007 10:01 pm

Quote:
Boy-oh-freekin-boy; first seasonal service to ATL and now twice-weekly to MCO (probably also seasonal.) Why bother? No surprise that no announcement of location at Lindbergh has been made; they'll probably just sneak into some outlying gate when nobody's looking and use a ticket-counter-on-wheels. Then they can pack it all up in someone's pick-up in October and take it back to Atlanta... (Reminds me all too much of our recent new arrival, and more recently departed, Western!)

Hey SANFan,

I wouldn't be too concerned or pessimistic about the way AirTran is entering the SAN market. I suspect they'll do perfectly well in what is quite a large market and their service to ATL won't be seasonal for long. The MCO flights are a little riskier but stand a decent chance of success given SAN's lack of nonstops to Florida.

I'm still waiting for AA to relaunch service to MIA from SAN, one of the country's only major hubs and connection points without a nonstop from SAN. Although that market wasn't large enough for the twice-daily 767s which AA ran on the route in the early 1990s, I'm sure one or two 737-800s or 757s with winglets would do the job nicely in the early twenty-first century.

Regards,

Edward
 
FlyPNS1
Posts: 5507
Joined: Wed Dec 01, 1999 7:12 am

RE: Airtran To Annouce Another Transcon P2p Route

Wed Mar 07, 2007 10:23 pm

Quoting SANFan (Reply 38):
I really don't know much about them as I haven't been around them much but so far they don't seem to know much about SAN either. Perhaps they should pick up the phone, call Delta, and ask how seasonal SAN-ATL is... I guess it is since DL goes from 7 n/s in the summer to a mere 5 in the dead of winter. I won't even go into the # of 767s they fly on the route! Yeah, I can see now why FL realizes there's no market in the winter.

Maybe, FL is just being cautious. Instead of flooding a new market with capacity, they are entering slowly with the plan to build up service from there. And quite honestly, given the low-yield nature of SAN-MCO, you're lucky to get anyone to fly this route even 2x weekly. Despite the traffic numbers you cite, the yield stinks.

I doubt FL is going to rush over and call DL....the carrier that has hemorraghed billions over the last 6+ years and is in bankruptcy.
 
mcofreak
Posts: 47
Joined: Sun Dec 18, 2005 3:49 am

RE: Airtran To Annouce Another Transcon P2p Route

Thu Mar 08, 2007 5:31 am

Anyone else curious if WN will respond to these last two routes (BWI - SEA, SAN - MCO)?????
 
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knope2001
Posts: 3031
Joined: Wed Jun 01, 2005 5:54 am

RE: Airtran To Annouce Another Transcon P2p Route

Thu Mar 08, 2007 7:07 am

SANFan,

Unfortunately this is AirTran's standard operating proceedure. They seem to be content with living off the spill traffic during high-demand times and pulling back or pulling out at other times. Look at IND-LAX, DFW-BWI and ATL-SEA. Those markets are more than large enough to support year-round service, yet AirTran doesn't seem to be interested in doing so. Well, that plan of attack guarantees that most frequent travelers of the route will stick with the competition. I don't know if AirTran can't (or thinks it can't) compete profitably in markets like these out of season, or if instead so much of their route planning is looking for places to fly planes when there isn't a Florida snowbird demand. But no matter the reason, this is increasingly the M.O. of AirTran.

On a related topic, this is one of the reasons so many of us in MKE do not want AirTran to take over Midwest. We need to be able to fly nonstop to places like Philadelphia, Newark and Dallas even in winter when AirTran would rather be using those aircraft in markets like Akron-Fort Myers.
 
DCAYOW
Posts: 548
Joined: Thu Nov 27, 2003 3:24 am

RE: Airtran To Annouce Another Transcon P2p Route

Thu Mar 08, 2007 7:09 am

Quoting FlyPNS1 (Reply 43):
And quite honestly, given the low-yield nature of SAN-MCO, you're lucky to get anyone to fly this route even 2x weekly. Despite the traffic numbers you cite, the yield stinks.

Hallelujah! FlyPNS1, welcome to my respected users list. SANFan doesn't seem to understand that NOBODY in San Diego knows who AirTran is... and since SAN-MCO is going to be largely SAN origin in nature, they are correct to approach the route cautiously. It also allows them to see who responds, if anyone.
Retorne ao céu...
 
User avatar
SANFan
Posts: 5433
Joined: Sun Aug 06, 2006 10:10 am

RE: Airtran To Annouce Another Transcon P2p Route

Thu Mar 08, 2007 10:26 am

Quoting Knope2001 (Reply 45):
Unfortunately this is AirTran's standard operating proceedure

Thank you Knope' for some insight into FL.

Over the years, I've learned a lot about the airlines that I dealt with all the time: which ones you could count on, which ones to not turn your back on, which ones didn't know what they were doing, and just how they operated in general. I do appreciate your thoughts about AirTran and now realize what we are dealing with here.

And your comments are always great to get too, Lindy'. After this start, maybe 2007 will be a good year for Florida (from SD!) Other than that, no comments...

I will just back off this whole thing and wait and see what happens and how it turns out. I was just way to enthusiastic about it at the beginning, hopes were quickly dashed, and I will now adapt as I learn more.

bb

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