Moderators: jsumali2, richierich, ua900, PanAm_DC10, hOMSaR

 
Curious
Topic Author
Posts: 213
Joined: Wed Nov 16, 2005 1:07 am

Lufthansa A300 & 733

Thu Mar 08, 2007 2:12 am

Hi, Sorry if I missed an announcement on this but when does LH plan to retire its A300 and 733's some of them are getting quite old now. Thx
 
User avatar
LAXintl
Posts: 25329
Joined: Wed May 24, 2000 12:12 pm

RE: Lufthansa A300 & 733

Thu Mar 08, 2007 2:30 am

Rather lenghty thread on the A300s already. Retirement Of Lufthansa A300-600? (by FlightLover Nov 2 2006 in Civil Aviation)
From the desert to the sea, to all of Southern California
 
flyorski
Posts: 736
Joined: Thu Dec 16, 2004 8:23 am

RE: Lufthansa A300 & 733

Thu Mar 08, 2007 2:32 am

LH has ordered 5 A319s, 10 A320s and 15 A321s, as well as taken options for a further 30 A32x family aircraft. These should replace the 737 fleet and older A320s. They should start being delivered later this year.

As for the A300s, I would expect an order for both 787s and A350s (though I do not have any facts for this, I think LH may fly a dual fleet, just like they flew 737 and A320s, 747 and A380s and so on).
"None are more hopelessly enslaved, than those who falsly believe they are free" -Goethe
 
A342
Posts: 4017
Joined: Sun Jul 31, 2005 11:05 pm

RE: Lufthansa A300 & 733

Thu Mar 08, 2007 2:38 am

We don't even know if LH really wants a direct A300 replacement at all.
Exceptions confirm the rule.
 
columba
Posts: 5252
Joined: Fri Dec 10, 2004 10:12 pm

RE: Lufthansa A300 & 733

Thu Mar 08, 2007 2:50 am

Quoting Flyorski (Reply 2):
LH has ordered 5 A319s, 10 A320s and 15 A321s, as well as taken options for a further 30 A32x family aircraft. These should replace the 737 fleet and older A320s. They should start being delivered later this year.

As for the A300s, I would expect an order for both 787s and A350s (though I do not have any facts for this, I think LH may fly a dual fleet, just like they flew 737 and A320s, 747 and A380s and so on).

Some of these A32s on order were said to be intended for a new Italian based low cost carrier called Italianwings. Don´t know if LH still have the plans for this.
As for a replacement date for the 737 LH management said a while ago that they intend to fly their 737s for some years and don´t plan to phase out the "Bobbys" before 2010 as there is no decent replacement yet. Once it was mentioned that LH is very interested in the idea of Boeing to produce 2 different 737 successors. But I don´t recall where I have read this.

Regarding the A300 : There were thoughts to use the A330 on some A300 routes but this would cause a lot of trouble at some gates especially in TXL.

[Edited 2007-03-07 18:53:33]
Air Berlin - gone but not forgotten
 
VC10DC10
Posts: 675
Joined: Sun Apr 30, 2006 9:56 am

RE: Lufthansa A300 & 733

Thu Mar 08, 2007 9:52 am

Quoting Columba (Reply 4):
As for a replacement date for the 737 LH management said a while ago that they intend to fly their 737s for some years and don´t plan to phase out the "Bobbys" before 2010 as there is no decent replacement yet.

Sorry to go slightly o/t, but what are the "Bobbys"?
Thanks,
VC10DC10
 
N1120A
Posts: 26659
Joined: Sun Dec 14, 2003 5:40 pm

RE: Lufthansa A300 & 733

Thu Mar 08, 2007 9:56 am

Quoting A342 (Reply 3):
We don't even know if LH really wants a direct A300 replacement at all.

They would be stupid no to, given how much cargo they haul and the density of the routes those aircraft fly.

Quoting Columba (Reply 4):
There were thoughts to use the A330 on some A300 routes but this would cause a lot of trouble at some gates especially in TXL.

Not to mention the problems A330s have had with both QF and MH doing quick turn, short haul service. As good as that aircraft is, it is crap in that application.

Quoting VC10DC10 (Reply 5):
Sorry to go slightly o/t, but what are the "Bobbys"?

I am guessing those are the A300s
Mangeons les French fries, mais surtout pratiquons avec fierte le French kiss
 
User avatar
LTU932
Posts: 13725
Joined: Fri Jan 06, 2006 12:34 am

RE: Lufthansa A300 & 733

Thu Mar 08, 2007 10:23 am

Quoting VC10DC10 (Reply 5):
what are the "Bobbys"?

That's a nickname for LH's 737s.
Sometimes the only thing more dangerous than a question is an answer. - Ferengi Rule of Acquisition 208
 
TriStar500
Posts: 4427
Joined: Thu Nov 04, 1999 9:50 pm

RE: Lufthansa A300 & 733

Thu Mar 08, 2007 4:30 pm

Quoting LTU932 (Reply 7):
Quoting VC10DC10 (Reply 5):
what are the "Bobbys"?

That's a nickname for LH's 737s.

The nickname is based on the name of the B737 in a Lufthansa 60's children's book.

The current order for various A32X aircraft is not intended as a direct replacement for the B737 fleet. It is chiefly used as a capacity increase.
Homer: Facts are meaningless. You could use facts to prove anything that's even remotely true!
 
stylo777
Posts: 2809
Joined: Mon Feb 13, 2006 7:32 pm

RE: Lufthansa A300 & 733

Thu Mar 08, 2007 7:43 pm

Quoting N1120A (Reply 6):
They would be stupid no to, given how much cargo they haul and the density of the routes those aircraft fly.

FRA-TXL/HAM/MUC/LHR... are these routes with high cargo??? Would be new to me!
 
EI321
Posts: 5070
Joined: Tue Jul 07, 2009 4:43 pm

RE: Lufthansa A300 & 733

Thu Mar 08, 2007 8:13 pm

Quoting A342 (Reply 3):
We don't even know if LH really wants a direct A300 replacement at all.

Was there a direct replacement for the A310?
 
johnnybgoode
Posts: 2144
Joined: Wed Jan 03, 2001 8:47 pm

RE: Lufthansa A300 & 733

Thu Mar 08, 2007 8:26 pm

Quoting TriStar500 (Reply 8):
The current order for various A32X aircraft is not intended as a direct replacement for the B737 fleet. It is chiefly used as a capacity increase.

unfortunately, this is not entirely correct. only a portion of this order will be used for fleet expansion, whereas the overall capacity in terms of seats is increased. it is likely that some 733s and A300s will be replaced by it, but it certainly is not a general fleet replacement.
If only pure sweetness was offered, why's this bitter taste left in my mouth.
 
EI321
Posts: 5070
Joined: Tue Jul 07, 2009 4:43 pm

RE: Lufthansa A300 & 733

Thu Mar 08, 2007 8:27 pm

Quoting Johnnybgoode (Reply 11):
it is likely that some 733s and A300s will be replaced by it

How many A300s?
 
Burkhard
Posts: 1916
Joined: Fri Nov 17, 2006 9:34 pm

RE: Lufthansa A300 & 733

Thu Mar 08, 2007 9:21 pm

Quoting EI321 (Reply 12):
How many A300s?

They are free not to decide that now. These aircrafts do a very good job, make money, and are in a very good shape. If they do not need them any longer, they will have ten airlines interested per plane. Same for the 737s.
 
A342
Posts: 4017
Joined: Sun Jul 31, 2005 11:05 pm

RE: Lufthansa A300 & 733

Fri Mar 09, 2007 6:14 am

Quoting EI321 (Reply 10):
Was there a direct replacement for the A310?

No, unless one wants to call the A333 a "direct" replacement...
Exceptions confirm the rule.
 
DALCE
Posts: 2016
Joined: Thu Feb 01, 2007 7:45 pm

RE: Lufthansa A300 & 733

Fri Mar 09, 2007 7:01 am

With D-ABXL (733) being the oldest bird at almost 21 years old, we can asume that LH will start replacing her series of delivery first.
Also the oldest 320's will be replaced with new 32x's. The new 32x's ordered have already rego's and will start with D-AIBA.

The A300-600 is still operating at a high profit on routes like SVO, LHR, ATH, MUC, TXL, HAM
Especially the LHR and ATH flights are operated both ways with heavy cargo onloads. In Winterschedule only one of 3 daily ATH flights is operated with A300's and we are short of cargo-capacity on this route.

As from summerskedule the A300 will also take over the FRA-TSE route, together with CAI.
So LH still operates this bird int-cont aswell.

Quoting Burkhard (Reply 13):
These aircrafts do a very good job, make money, and are in a very good shape. If they do not need them any longer, they will have ten airlines interested per plane

This is absolutely true!
flown: F50,F70,CR1,CR2,CR9,223,E75,E90,143,AR8,AR1,733,735,736,73G,738,
753,763,744,77W,788,319,320,321,333,AB6.
 
Carpethead
Posts: 2620
Joined: Mon Aug 02, 2004 8:15 pm

RE: Lufthansa A300 & 733

Fri Mar 09, 2007 12:25 pm

Quoting N1120A (Reply 6):
Not to mention the problems A330s have had with both QF and MH doing quick turn, short haul service. As good as that aircraft is, it is crap in that application.

Curiously, why is it that an aircraft in the similar size, 763 & 772 can be turned around in 40 & 50 minutes, respectively here in Japan?
No problems encountered what-so-ever with one/two boarding bridges and no need to offload the rear pax onto the ramps. Folks at NH or JL do something totally different?
I guess we will never know.
 
DALCE
Posts: 2016
Joined: Thu Feb 01, 2007 7:45 pm

RE: Lufthansa A300 & 733

Fri Mar 09, 2007 3:59 pm

I think one of the problems is the wingspan. For example at LHR the gates LH uses are not big enough to handle an A330 or bigger. But our LHR-based netters might help us out here.
flown: F50,F70,CR1,CR2,CR9,223,E75,E90,143,AR8,AR1,733,735,736,73G,738,
753,763,744,77W,788,319,320,321,333,AB6.
 
columba
Posts: 5252
Joined: Fri Dec 10, 2004 10:12 pm

RE: Lufthansa A300 & 733

Fri Mar 09, 2007 4:31 pm

Quoting DALCE (Reply 17):
I think one of the problems is the wingspan.

This is really one of the main problems for LH the gates for the domestic and intra-european flights are simply to small for the huge wingspan of the A330.
Air Berlin - gone but not forgotten
 
PADSpot
Posts: 1637
Joined: Sat Jan 15, 2005 11:31 pm

RE: Lufthansa A300 & 733

Sat Mar 10, 2007 4:36 am

Quoting EI321 (Reply 10):
Was there a direct replacement for the A310?



Quoting A342 (Reply 14):
No, unless one wants to call the A333 a "direct" replacement...

The long haul A310s were replaced in the first place by 5 leased A332 which had a mixed Swiss/Sabena interior with about 230- 240 seats and thus were a little bigger in capacity. In the second place the A332s were replaced with A333s which have 221 seats and hence are a direct replacement, although the air frame is obviously larger. On the other hand the A333s now have a three-class interior, while the original A310s only had two classes.

The short haul A310s had no direct replacement, because at the same (after 9/11) the combined A300/310 short haul fleet shrunk in size from 20-18 to now about 13 air frames.
 
PanHAM
Posts: 9719
Joined: Fri May 06, 2005 6:44 pm

RE: Lufthansa A300 & 733

Sat Mar 10, 2007 4:51 am

Quoting Stylo777 (Reply 9):

FRA-TXL/HAM/MUC/LHR... are these routes with high cargo??? Would be new to me!

On FRA-LHR there so much cargo that most flights are always full. Difficult to get a booking on the 4744 or 4722 even when operated by AB6. TXL/MUC/HAM get loaded with transit cargo from all over the world, export and import.

The loss of the AB6 wide body capacity would be difficult for LHCargo.



Quoting DALCE (Reply 17):
I think one of the problems is the wingspan. For example at LHR the gates LH uses are not big enough to handle an A330 or bigger. But our LHR-based netters might help us out here

Not really, OA regularly has a 343 at one of the piesr LH also uses. Don't know the gate numbers now, although I used them many times, but a 330/787 would be no problem. In addition, the terminal will be completely rebuild once BA is in T5

It has been discussed here beforem the AB6 will stay with LH for some time to come

LH will make more fleet decisions this year, that was announced by Mr. Mayrhuber at the press conference this week.
Was Erlauben Erdogan!!!
 
columba
Posts: 5252
Joined: Fri Dec 10, 2004 10:12 pm

RE: Lufthansa A300 & 733

Sat Mar 10, 2007 5:51 pm

Quoting PanHAM (Reply 20):
LH will make more fleet decisions this year, that was announced by Mr. Mayrhuber at the press conference this week.

Too bad, I was really looking forward to this but maybe this is an indication that they will choose the A350.
Air Berlin - gone but not forgotten

Popular Searches On Airliners.net

Top Photos of Last:   24 Hours  •  48 Hours  •  7 Days  •  30 Days  •  180 Days  •  365 Days  •  All Time

Military Aircraft Every type from fighters to helicopters from air forces around the globe

Classic Airliners Props and jets from the good old days

Flight Decks Views from inside the cockpit

Aircraft Cabins Passenger cabin shots showing seat arrangements as well as cargo aircraft interior

Cargo Aircraft Pictures of great freighter aircraft

Government Aircraft Aircraft flying government officials

Helicopters Our large helicopter section. Both military and civil versions

Blimps / Airships Everything from the Goodyear blimp to the Zeppelin

Night Photos Beautiful shots taken while the sun is below the horizon

Accidents Accident, incident and crash related photos

Air to Air Photos taken by airborne photographers of airborne aircraft

Special Paint Schemes Aircraft painted in beautiful and original liveries

Airport Overviews Airport overviews from the air or ground

Tails and Winglets Tail and Winglet closeups with beautiful airline logos