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EISHN
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RE: How Do Airline CEO's Travel?

Mon Mar 12, 2007 7:45 pm

Heres a good one for you all.

How does Michael O'Leary, the CEO of europes largest low cost carrier Ryanair, travel to Seattle for talks with Boeing? Would he dare fly First or Club World, or even one of thelower classes, with BA? Or maybe with another one of his arrivals? Or would he fly out Dublin with the likes of AA or Delta, or Continental and then connects on flight to Seattle?

Any insights welcome.
Thanks!
 
Bohlman
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RE: How Do Airline CEO's Travel?

Mon Mar 12, 2007 7:53 pm

As was mentioned, Herb flies CO or WN, usually handing out snacks on either one. I'd love to be sitting on the airplane where the snoody business man gets irritated about something and starts talking trash to Herb, calling him a stewardess...
"I make more in a month than you in a year, how bout you just do what I tell you?"
"Actually sir, I AM this company"
 
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Stitch
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RE: How Do Airline CEO's Travel?

Mon Mar 12, 2007 8:24 pm

Quoting Brenintw (Reply 20):

For people like me, mind translating this to "everyday-speak"?

United Global Services was launched in 2003 as a way to recognize (and cultivate the continued loyalty and lagresse of) what United considers to be their absolute best customers. Before the launch of UGS, United had a VIP program, which was station-specific (so you could be a VIP in SFO, for example, but maybe not in DEN or ORD).

Like the VIP program, it is invite-only. Like Mileage Plus elite status, you can earn UGS at any time during the year. I don't recall if UGS status ends on an MP calendar year (February), or if it ends one year from the date status being granted. You may be re-invited to the program, either on a recurring basis or after having been dropped for one or more years.

Based on UA's own information, it is revenue-based, roughly the top 1% of UA's elite membership and was rumored to be around 18,000 people in 2005. However, there are people who have been invited who, on the surface, do not meet this revenue criteria. They may be old VIPs who have been added (this happened in 2003, at least, when UGS replaced the VIP program), they might influence a great deal more revenue then they themselves generate (travel director of a Fortune 50 company, for example), and some just fly hundreds of thousands of miles a year, or for some reason or another, UA feels they are worth inviting into the program. It has been said that UA Regional Sales managers also have the ability to recommend (if not actually invite) people into the program, which might explain why one person gets in when another does not when they have similar revenue patterns. It has been claimed that the top 100 accounts for the previous year in each Sales Area are invited into the program.

Fare basis also matters to some extent in the calculations. A refundable B Economy Class fare upgraded to Business Class is said to have more weight then a non-refundable Z Business Class fare because it implies the person is more likely to buy an expensive last-minute fare on UA then choose a cheaper fare on a competitor, and UA wishes to encourage that behavior.

There is no published criteria, so our information is both incomplete and conflicting.

Present and past benefits as stated by UGS members include(d):

  • Automatic Star Gold/Premier Executive status (also known as GP).
  • 100% Redeemable (RDM) Mileage Bonus
  • 120 Hour Upgrade Window when using 500 mile certificates.
  • Ability to open award and upgrade First and Business seats when none are available (not a guaranteed benefit - especially now that the ranks have swelled).
  • Ability to use the International Arrivals Lounge, regardless of ticketed cabin (normally restricted to revenue and award First and Business passengers).
  • Ability to use the First Class check-in counter, regardless of ticketed cabin.
  • Access to the International First Class Lounge, regardless of ticketed cabin (this seems to be more station specific and/or you know the IFL staff personally).
  • Ability to board first, regardless of assigned Seating Area or ticketed cabin.
  • Access to private Customer Service offices at most hub and gateway airports (similar to the old "1K Rooms") to handle ticketing and travel issues (note that they are not intended to be pseudo-lounges like the 1K Rooms were).
  • Access to a private, toll-free (domestic and international) reservations number.
  • Access to special "UGS Conciereges" at many international gateways and hubs who will escort you to connecting flights/terminals, similar to the old "United First Concierge" program.


In addition to the automatic Premier Executive status, UGS members can also be Premier Executive 1K's (GK) if they earn 100,000 EQMs or 100 EQS' during a qualifying year. So in addition to their UGS benefits, they also receive the six annual SystemWide Upgrades (SWUs) that 1K status grants. To my knowledge, there is no special code for Million Miler UGS members - they are either GK's (if 1K) or GP's (if 1P).
 
jetdeltamsy
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RE: How Do Airline CEO's Travel?

Mon Mar 12, 2007 8:46 pm

Quoting Bobbydgg (Thread starter):
How do airline CEO's travel?

Private jets?

Do they non-rev?

Do they sit in coach?

Anyway they want to. Just like the CEO's of any multi-billion dollar corporations.
 
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OzarkD9S
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RE: How Do Airline CEO's Travel?

Mon Mar 12, 2007 9:22 pm

There was a story about Edward J. Crane, former CEO of Ozark Airlines. He was flying positive space from an outstation back to STL and the flight was full of revenue passengers. The ticket agent was a new-hire, and didn't yet know who Crane was. He informed Crane that the flight was full, and he would have to wait for the next flight out. The station manager was right there, overheard the agent and informed him that this was "E.J. Crane", CEO of our company and he WILL get on that flight!

Crane informed the manager that no, the agent was correct....paying passengers first (though he could have bumped one if he wanted to). He earned alot of respect from OZ employees with that gesture. I was fortunate enough to meet him on the OZ inaugural flight to SAN, a real nice guy and even though I was a teenager at the time, he took a few minutes during the ceremony at STL to chat with me a bit. Real class act.
 
Bongodog1964
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RE: How Do Airline CEO's Travel?

Mon Mar 12, 2007 10:08 pm

Quoting EISHN (Reply 50):
How does Michael O'Leary, the CEO of europes largest low cost carrier Ryanair, travel to Seattle for talks with Boeing? Would he dare fly First or Club World, or even one of thelower classes, with BA? Or maybe with another one of his arrivals? Or would he fly out Dublin with the likes of AA or Delta, or Continental and then connects on flight to Seattle?

If I was spending the sort of amount Michael O'Leary does with Boeing; I would expect them to come to see me whenever I felt it neccesary. if I felt the meed to visit them in Seattle, I would expect that they would stump up the fare, or send a private jet.
 
MattCan
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RE: How Do Airline CEO's Travel?

Mon Mar 12, 2007 11:01 pm

How do airline CEOs travel? For FREE of course! Actually it probably depends on the company and the personality of the CEO. Back when I worked for United the top brass were non-rev in the sense they didn't pay, but I believe their boarding priority was higher than that of paying passengers. This priviledge basically guaranteed them access to First Class travel when ever they wanted. Probably true for most CEOs.
 
EISHN
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RE: How Do Airline CEO's Travel?

Mon Mar 12, 2007 11:11 pm


View Large View Medium
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Photo © Royal S King
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Click here for bigger photo!

Photo © Royal S King



What about in instance like this when MOL travels to Seattle.
 
jetdeltamsy
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RE: How Do Airline CEO's Travel?

Tue Mar 13, 2007 12:10 am

Quoting OzarkD9S (Reply 54):
The ticket agent was a new-hire, and didn't yet know who Crane was. He informed Crane that the flight was full, and he would have to wait for the next flight out. The station manager was right there, overheard the agent and informed him that this was "E.J. Crane", CEO of our company and he WILL get on that flight!

Crane informed the manager that no, the agent was correct....paying passengers first (though he could have bumped one if he wanted to).

A little off topic her,but a colleague of mine bumped the Governor of Wisconsin earlier this year from a weight restricted Eagle flight. He in no way identified himself as being Governor of Wisconsin. There was no entourage of security. His record was booked via AA.com.with no notation anywhere who he was. He was offeree the standard offering: a $250 travel voucher, a room at the local Ramada and meals OR a bus ticket home that night. He declined everything.

Then the complaint letter comes in on State of Wisconsin, Officer of the Governor letterhead. Pretty low down I think, but he was more irritated with the policy of offering a maximum of $250 for volunteers at Eagle than he was with my friend. The guy's true identity was unkinown until the letter came in.

Trust me, we all, including our managers had a gut-busting laugh over that one.

[Edited 2007-03-12 17:11:54]
 
UALPHLCS
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RE: How Do Airline CEO's Travel?

Tue Mar 13, 2007 12:18 am

Quoting Stitch (Reply 13):
UA Officers travel positive space (usually in First or Business) when on company business.

An amusing side note, I know one UGS who personally booted UA CEO and Chairman Glen Tilton out of 1A as that was originally the UGS' assigned seat.

This is true for UA, I assume it is the same for most Legacy carriers Confirmed Positive-space F Class.

However, on two occasions with Goodwin and with Tilton, they were booted out of F-Class in PHL by the need to accommodate FAMs. To their credit neither one complained about the bump. Goodwin was even stuck in a middle seat. I'd like to have been there to see how that flight went but I'm sure he made some PR points. "I'm the CEO of this airline and I'm in the middle seat."
 
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clickhappy
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RE: How Do Airline CEO's Travel?

Tue Mar 13, 2007 12:59 am

On several trips to Seattle, MOL and crew have traveled from AMS to SEA on NW, and they fly coach.

Not sure how they get to AMS...
 
darkblue
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RE: How Do Airline CEO's Travel?

Tue Mar 13, 2007 1:06 am

I sat next to Fred Buttrell (former head of Comair) on a flight last May the day before he resigned. I guess after being forced to cram into a seat next to me on a CRJ he decided he had enough!
 
EISHN
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RE: How Do Airline CEO's Travel?

Tue Mar 13, 2007 1:18 am

Probally fly FR to Rotterdam, then train it over to Schipol.Thanks for the info.
 
cubastar
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RE: How Do Airline CEO's Travel?

Tue Mar 13, 2007 1:19 am

Quoting EMBQA (Reply 22):
Quoting Graphic (Reply 18):
I've read that Neeleman flies B6 at least once a week, often working with the F/A's during whatever they call "meal service" and asking for customer feedback. If it's true, that's a CEO that cares!



Quoting 7B" class=quote target=_blank>B747-437B (Reply 49):
Airline CEOs are just like any other guy for the most part - some are unassuming and humble - and others are arrogant pricks.

One grand old gentleman CEO did care (see above) and was most unassuming and humble. That man was Mr. C. E. Wollman, the founder of Delta Air Lines. I was on a DC-7B ATL-CLT-DCA years ago with Mr. Woolman and his wife in first class (the rear of the aircraft in those days). The flight was oversold out of CLT to DCA so Mr. Woolman gave up his seat for that extra paying passenger. As we left, Mr. Wollman was at the fence (no jetways or security in those days) watching us and waving as we taxied out. That was only one of MANY good things about the founder of Delta.
 
PHKLM
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RE: How Do Airline CEO's Travel?

Tue Mar 13, 2007 1:26 am

Quoting EISHN (Reply 63):
Probally fly FR to Rotterdam

FR only has scheduled service to EIN in the Netherlands.
The only airline that flies DUB-AMS is AerLingus. Now that would be something  Wink
KL does have a code-share on this route, so it might be MOL books with KL but both legs are operated by other carriers (Aer Lingus and NWA).
They could take a train from EIN to AMS but this takes two hours and involves quite some hassle, something you would want to avoid when continuing onwards on a long flight to SEA in Y.
 
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clickhappy
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RE: How Do Airline CEO's Travel?

Tue Mar 13, 2007 1:35 am

Now that you mention it KLM did somehow come into the mix, but I am not sure they flew out of DUB. I seem to remember him saying Luton, but who knows, my memory is cloudy  Smile
 
Lucky42
Posts: 297
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RE: How Do Airline CEO's Travel?

Tue Mar 13, 2007 1:40 am

Quoting Gigneil (Reply 11):
Denying boarding to someone with a confirmed seat has all sorts of legal ramifications. They may have done it in 1979, but they don't do it today.

I Don't know what world you are living in but in the world of nwa it doesn't matter..They will kick someone off and pay them compensation. I don't know about recently but in the early 90's I saw them do it a number of times.
 
lincoln
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Joined: Mon Nov 01, 2004 11:22 pm

RE: How Do Airline CEO's Travel?

Tue Mar 13, 2007 1:55 am

Quoting Lucky42 (Reply 67):
I Don't know what world you are living in but in the world of nwa it doesn't matter..They will kick someone off and pay them compensation. I don't know about recently but in the early 90's I saw them do it a number of times.

The problem comes only if the passenger doesn't accept the compensation -- if it's involuntary denied boardinging (vs you volunarially giving up your seat) you can refuse the compensation offer and sue for your actual damages plus (IIRC) the standard compensation (for example, if you missed a day of vacation, you could sue for the hotel room, tickets that you couldn't use, etc.)
 
aad665
Posts: 222
Joined: Tue Dec 21, 1999 11:03 am

RE: How Do Airline CEO's Travel?

Tue Mar 13, 2007 2:08 am

Quoting Bongodog1964 (Reply 55):



Quoting Bongodog1964 (Reply 55):
How does Michael O'Leary, the CEO of europes largest low cost carrier Ryanair, travel to Seattle for talks with Boeing? Would he dare fly First or Club World, or even one of thelower classes, with BA? Or maybe with another one of his arrivals? Or would he fly out Dublin with the likes of AA or Delta, or Continental and then connects on flight to Seattle?

If I was spending the sort of amount Michael O'Leary does with Boeing; I would expect them to come to see me whenever I felt it neccesary. if I felt the meed to visit them in Seattle, I would expect that they would stump up the fare, or send a private jet.

O Leary own a Lear jet AND a Global Express from Bombardier. The are resgisted under her daughter name.

aad665
 
floridaflyboy
Posts: 1643
Joined: Sat Jun 03, 2006 3:26 pm

RE: How Do Airline CEO's Travel?

Tue Mar 13, 2007 2:16 am

Quoting Gigneil (Reply 11):
Denying boarding to someone with a confirmed seat has all sorts of legal ramifications. They may have done it in 1979, but they don't do it today.

I wish that were true, but it is not. CEO's and various other management people do it ALL the time. Even if it is not business-related.

Quoting Nonfirm (Reply 44):
This is no bull.We have upper mgt from the director level to the CEO that can get away with this in coach and 1 st.

While working for SkyWest (Delta Connection operation), we had a SkyWest VP show up and they bumped a paying passenger so he could get on the flight (not sure what he was doing in BIL). Those aren't even OO passengers, but rather DL passengers and he still got away with it.
 
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clickhappy
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RE: How Do Airline CEO's Travel?

Tue Mar 13, 2007 2:16 am

Does MOL even have a daughter????

I know he has a young son (2 years old perhaps)....
 
nycfuturepilot
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RE: How Do Airline CEO's Travel?

Tue Mar 13, 2007 2:53 am

Quoting WunalaYann (Reply 14):
Quoting Bobbydgg (Thread starter):How do airline CEO's travel?
Lamborghinis?



Quoting WunalaYann (Reply 14):
Quoting Bobbydgg (Thread starter):How do airline CEO's travel?
Lamborghinis?

know you're being sarcastic but actually the top 25 execs at CO drive bmw 745s, must be an interesting parking lot to walk through.


Also, do DL guys get to use delta air elite?
 
EISHN
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RE: How Do Airline CEO's Travel?

Tue Mar 13, 2007 3:08 am

Thats right, MOL only has a son.

Quoting PHKLM (Reply 65):
FR only has scheduled service to EIN in the Netherlands.

Sorry, thats what i meant, thanks for the correction.
Maybe he does fly with EI to AMS. But I think it would just be easier for him to fly with AA, CO, DL to somewhere in the US and then connect to SEA.
 
PHKLM
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RE: How Do Airline CEO's Travel?

Tue Mar 13, 2007 3:54 am

Quoting EISHN (Reply 73):
But I think it would just be easier for him to fly with AA, CO, DL to somewhere in the US and then connect to SEA.

According to Amadeus the fastest option is BA and with the second best alternative KLM (EI and NW code-shares), via AMS it only takes 30 minutes extra and you save a trip thru BAA hell...
 
TomB
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RE: How Do Airline CEO's Travel?

Tue Mar 13, 2007 4:23 am

In response to DL Widget Head's question (Reply #46), when Sam Higginbottom became President of Eastern Airlines in the early 1970's, he wanted an executive jet. So Eastern ended up leasing a Lockheed JetStar primarily to fly Mr. Higginbottom around. In addition to being somewhat expensive to lease and operate, it definitely hurt employee morale. Eastern employees, after being told their was no money in the budget for a pay raise, would walk out of the office building in Miami and see the Lockheed JetStar sitting on the ramp. No money for the employees but plenty to squander of the JetStar for Mr. Higginbottom.
 
JRDC930
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RE: How Do Airline CEO's Travel?

Tue Mar 13, 2007 4:28 am

Quoting Nycfuturepilot (Reply 72):
Also, do DL guys get to use delta air elite?

A little of topic, but i do my flight training at a facility in SLC, that shares space with two DL eliete Jets. Now theres a way to fly!. From what ive been told, they have had DL execs fly from there, but not the CEO.
 
N908AW
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RE: How Do Airline CEO's Travel?

Tue Mar 13, 2007 5:03 am

One of my VATSIM friends recognized Doug Steenland on board a DC9 going SYR-MSP...wrote him a note on a napkin actually.  Smile
 
jetjeanes
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RE: How Do Airline CEO's Travel?

Tue Mar 13, 2007 6:37 am

Did Eal not have a few of those jetstars for use for several other things,and charters
 
c680
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RE: How Do Airline CEO's Travel?

Tue Mar 13, 2007 7:33 am

When Frank Wolf was running USAir(ways) he would fly a chartered Hawker HS125-700 private in and out of DCA all the time. IIRC it was chartered from either Union Pacific or Frito Lay (I rmember the yellow and orange paint) He would usually either drive through the gate straight to the plane, or go through the hanger so he wasn't seen in the terminal, or at least so he thought. It was a running joke at Singature DCA.
 
sea2pdx
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RE: How Do Airline CEO's Travel?

Tue Mar 13, 2007 7:53 am

Here's what I can't understand: If you're the CEO of a major airline then you're most likely making bank. That being the case, why wouldn't you help your own airline out and actually purchase tickets? Why travel non-revenue, positive space or not? The CEO and all VPs at my airline travel on confirmed purchased tickets. Naturally they all have priority codes for non-rev travel, but I've only seen them used once. CEO was on a flight I was boarding and asked if I could get one more person onboard if he took the flight deck jumpseat. I told him there was one revenue standby without a seat, so he took the jump to get her on. He actually offers to take the jump quite often if it means getting another passenger on, especially standbys. Computer system won't allow me to place a confirmed pax there, so I had to list him with his priority code to get him in the jump.

Its too bad that other airline execs have the approach to flying that they seem to. To respond to a previous reply, my airline is all coach (or first class, depends on how you look at it), so the CEO has no other option but to travel coach. Believe me, he uses every oppurtunity he has to interact with his fellow passengers. Unless he's in a hurry, he also sticks around after the flight to assist in cleaning the cabin. Now that to me is a CEO that cares about his company and his employees.
 
airtran737
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RE: How Do Airline CEO's Travel?

Tue Mar 13, 2007 8:14 am

Quoting SkyexRamper (Reply 15):
They travel positive at YX/SYX but with nerve they don't even bother to mingle with their paying customers

I flew MKE-MSP three Friday's in a row last summer returning on Sunday evening and I sat next to Tim in the exit row everytime. And no I didn't move myself there, I boarded when it was my turn, and he always boards last. Tim was quite fun to chat with, and on the fourth week he ran into me in the terminal and asked where his seat mate was. It was quite funny.
 
sw733
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RE: How Do Airline CEO's Travel?

Tue Mar 13, 2007 8:37 am

Quoting Norcal773 (Reply 10):
Big mouth SRB has been spotted in coach on his jets from what I've read here.

I wouldn't wish that on anyone, let alone a billionaire...maybe he saw how bad his own airline was?  duck 

I saw the CFO of Air Namibia once on a flight from WDH-JNB...he sat amongst all of us. Never got a chance to talk to him, as the only reason I even knew he was the CFO was because I heard some F/A's chatting it up in the back of the plane...turned out they had no idea who he was either.
 
floridaflyboy
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RE: How Do Airline CEO's Travel?

Tue Mar 13, 2007 8:41 am

Quoting C680 (Reply 80):
When Frank Wolf was running USAir(ways)

Wasn't it Stephen Wolf? Anyway, I've heard he was pretty full of himself.
 
AirMike2
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RE: How Do Airline CEO's Travel?

Tue Mar 13, 2007 8:49 am

Then there's a true story about a CEO of a airline who flew mysteriously into a city (not on his airline) to address the Chamber of Commerce and didn't even stop by the counter to say hello to some of the 10 agents who worked in that city. They found out he had been in town by reading the paper the next morning. TACKY, but not surprizing.
 
BAalltheway
Posts: 58
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RE: How Do Airline CEO's Travel?

Tue Mar 13, 2007 9:04 am

I remember boarding a flight to Newark one time quite a few years back (1999 or 2000 I believe), saw a familiar face sitting in First Class as I schleped it down to Economy. It was Bethune in those days. I introduced myself later at the gate when we arrived - this guy was one of my heros at the time. Turns out he was in town to dedicate "Peter Max" that day - I'll never forget it!

I'll also never forget is how beat up his briefcase was for some reason...private jets...who needs em? He was a class act on his own.
 
nycfuturepilot
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RE: How Do Airline CEO's Travel?

Tue Mar 13, 2007 9:10 am

Quoting Sea2Pdx (Reply 81):
He actually offers to take the jump quite often

I'd do it all the time! Your CEO sounds like a great guy, which company is it?
 
CV580Freak
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RE: How Do Airline CEO's Travel?

Tue Mar 13, 2007 9:31 am

Quoting Norcal773 (Reply 10):
Big mouth SRB has been spotted in coach on his jets from what I've read here.

I understand he speaks highly of you as well !!!
 
Electech6299
Posts: 606
Joined: Fri Aug 19, 2005 11:13 am

RE: How Do Airline CEO's Travel?

Tue Mar 13, 2007 9:47 am

Quoting WestJetYQQ (Reply 27):
Let me Think, If I was the CEO:

I would do whatever could possibly be best my Airline.

Uh, actually pay a full (unrestricted) fare? Can the computers still do that? I heard a rumor that someone paid full fare back in '98....  Wink

Quoting B747-437B (Reply 49):
so he bought a cheap web fare on BA.

Yup...deep pockets but no class. At least he used the website- unless his assistant did it for him  Yeah sure

Quoting Nycfuturepilot (Reply 72):
know you're being sarcastic but actually the top 25 execs at CO drive bmw 745s, must be an interesting parking lot to walk through.

I would imagine that they have valet parking as well...with numbered spaces so the attendants can keep them apart.

Quoting Zephyr98 (Reply 78):
broom.......

Priceless Big grin

Quoting Sea2Pdx (Reply 81):
Here's what I can't understand: If you're the CEO of a major airline then you're most likely making bank. That being the case, why wouldn't you help your own airline out and actually purchase tickets?

Bingo! Like maybe actually going to the ticket counter? Or using your own web site? And paying full fare? I mean really, the suit you're wearing cost more than a full fare ticket, why bother with the circuitous route.

The comments made about time being valuable are very true...You don't want your key decision makers sitting at the gate when there is business to be done. But on the off Tuesday afternoon with no meetings until Thursday, or on travel for personal leave, I would suggest that the spend the time in the shoes of an average pax. That's where insight into operations comes from, not books or board meetings.
 
lincoln
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RE: How Do Airline CEO's Travel?

Tue Mar 13, 2007 10:37 am

Quoting Electech6299 (Reply 89):
Uh, actually pay a full (unrestricted) fare? Can the computers still do that? I heard a rumor that someone paid full fare back in '98....

God do I wish that were true... I just shelled out $1300 for the second time in a month for an unrestricted (Y1-fare basis) ticket to RIC... And I bought that ticket 3 weeks out. (I also bought a unrestricted ticket to RDU for $500...go figure)

I hope someone at Contiental appreciates my business!  Wink
 
sw733
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RE: How Do Airline CEO's Travel?

Tue Mar 13, 2007 10:58 am

Quoting Lincoln (Reply 90):
God do I wish that were true... I just shelled out $1300 for the second time in a month for an unrestricted (Y1-fare basis) ticket to RIC... And I bought that ticket 3 weeks out

Dear god why....?!?! Full fare is a ridiculous rip off...
 
lincoln
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RE: How Do Airline CEO's Travel?

Tue Mar 13, 2007 11:10 am

Quoting SW733 (Reply 91):
Dear god why....?!?! Full fare is a ridiculous rip off...

Combination of factors (a) Our clients' plans often change, necessitating flexibility; (b) My boss doesn't like the accounting implications/hassle of change fees, (c) I hate driving in Ohio, and (d) (least important, of course) I get more EQMs and when flying on a two-class aircraft, better chances at an upgrade (all of my CO flights so far have been on ExpressJet, though)

Lincoln
 
chuchoteur
Posts: 610
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RE: How Do Airline CEO's Travel?

Tue Mar 13, 2007 4:15 pm

Quoting AWombat (Reply 42):
By train !

Sorry could not resist.

In Richard Branson's case, correct!
 biggrin 

Richard Branson I believe travels all classes on Virgin Atlantic... and is supposed to be very friendly.

Last time he came down to Toulouse, he came using a Virgin Atlantic 340, a bit extreme maybe!
 
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vfw614
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RE: How Do Airline CEO's Travel?

Tue Mar 13, 2007 5:44 pm

Lufthansa's ex CEO Jürgen Weber was known for commuting down from Hamburg (where he lived as the former head of Lufthansa Technik) to Frankfurt for work on Lufthansa. Often he was was jumpseating, not always because the flights were full, but obviously because he liked it up front.

As for Michael O'Leary owning two exec jets in his daughter's name, I seriously doubt it (not only because he only has a 2 year old son, Matthew). Probably the Ryan family owns some planes.
 
SkyexRamper
Posts: 1952
Joined: Sun Mar 27, 2005 12:17 am

RE: How Do Airline CEO's Travel?

Tue Mar 13, 2007 11:23 pm

Quoting AirTran737 (Reply 80):
he ran into me in the terminal and asked where his seat mate was.

That's wierd cause every time he is flying skyway or any top YXer it's always the van plane side and all that BS.
 
ua777222
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Joined: Mon Dec 22, 2003 11:23 am

RE: How Do Airline CEO's Travel?

Wed Mar 14, 2007 1:11 am

Re: Why doesn't an exec pay full fare ticket for their travel.

You need to understand that the travel is not going to be for their personal needs (95% of the time). If they were shelling out for full fare tickets, the rev produced from that ticket would be lost in the reimbursement in that execs annual compensation for their travel. For those who use private jets for their travel, most are "required" to travel on those aircraft for "security" reasons. This means that personal travel is required by private aircraft as well. For those trips (and more often than not, not all personal trips are listed as "personal" [often return trips to HQ from personal destination]) that exec is taxed a rate based on the use of the jet and it is listed in their QR and YR proxys.

My point being, execs will avoid paying for their travel at all costs. I'm not sure what SEC rules are in place in paying full fare and then having that funded by corporate funds (do the math, full fare, 5 trips a week, 4 weeks a month, 10 months a year, often last minute). You're not taking about $1000 here or there, I would guesstimate that full fare for a full FY would be over 100K. Its always easier to just take the free ticket to avoid all of these issues which in turn will create more issues with the press and the management relationship with their employees. If execs should pay for their free travel than there should be no such thing as non-rev for all employees, correct?

Thanks.
 
PanHAM
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RE: How Do Airline CEO's Travel?

Wed Mar 14, 2007 1:32 am

Quoting Columba (Reply 40):
Wolfgang Mayrhuber CEO of Lufthansa said recently that he travels in all classes with LH in order to see how the service is.

He surely does, when time permits. But as a CEO of a top 30 listed company with a 20 Billion € turnover, he is entitled to First Class positive space, or C if F is not available. Makes only sense. Anyone with that work schedule needs the comfort and the work space and no one would want a company CEO delivering a speech at 10 am after he arrived at 8 from a 12 hour flight in economy. This is common sense, especially when he flies back home the same day and has a board meeting the next day.

I am not sure if even an airline CEO can fly jumpseat these days, but Weber was indeed famous for that. LH Flight Captains plus all other similar ranking company officers are entitled to fly F or C as well, at least they can fly jumpseat when deadheading.

The suggestion which came up here, that an airline CEO should pay for his ticket so his airline gets the revenue is cute., Guess who pays, if he is out on a business trip?
 
Electech6299
Posts: 606
Joined: Fri Aug 19, 2005 11:13 am

RE: How Do Airline CEO's Travel?

Wed Mar 14, 2007 10:47 am

Quoting UA777222 (Reply 94):
My point being, execs will avoid paying for their travel at all costs.

That's the point that is ridiculous. I know F/A's that pay for their travel because usually non-rev isn't worth the trouble. If an F/A can make that on their salary, why can't a corporate exec? Why is an airline exec different than a Congressman, a Military officer (or high-ranking DoD civilian) or an exec of a non-av business? Recall that no airlines are in the top 60 or so companies, and airlines are a very slim fraction of the top 500. If the argument for "position" or "importance" is made, then all CEOs should fly free all the time, right?

Quoting UA777222 (Reply 94):
If execs should pay for their free travel than there should be no such thing as non-rev for all employees, correct?



Quoting PanHAM (Reply 95):
Guess who pays, if he is out on a business trip?

Again, it all comes as a compensation package. Is flying free, confirmed or positive space, an appropriate part of the compensation package of an airline CEO? And if the Board gives it to him, should he use it? As to "all the incredible accounting problems" of reimbursing, that's ridiculous. Just like CEOs of other companies, the secretary books the flight with a company credit card. End of story. I just think that, when the trip is optional, it should be a personal credit card and not company.

We aren't talking about a twice-a-day commute, here we are talking about as I mentioned in my post above:

Quoting Electech6299 (Reply 87):
But on the off Tuesday afternoon with no meetings until Thursday, or on travel for personal leave, I would suggest that the spend the time in the shoes of an average pax. That's where insight into operations comes from, not books or board meetings.

Great job at taking my comments out of context.
 
ua777222
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RE: How Do Airline CEO's Travel?

Wed Mar 14, 2007 11:59 am

Quoting Electech6299 (Reply 96):

That's the point that is ridiculous. I know F/A's that pay for their travel because usually non-rev isn't worth the trouble. If an F/A can make that on their salary, why can't a corporate exec? Why is an airline exec different than a Congressman, a Military officer (or high-ranking DoD civilian) or an exec of a non-av business? Recall that no airlines are in the top 60 or so companies, and airlines are a very slim fraction of the top 500. If the argument for "position" or "importance" is made, then all CEOs should fly free all the time, right?

That point is far from ridiculous. People are under a false representation that all are treated equal. The harsh reality is that they sit behind a desk at the HQ on the top floor in the corner office. The difference is also why you see Military Officers being herded into the back of a 744 while the General in Charge is taking a Gulfstream around. What ranking on the fortune list is of no importance to the daily responsibilities an Airline CEO has to face compared to that of an opposing-industry CEO. When seniority among pilots is what all is based upon, you can bet your ass that it works the same way for the executives at the company and any company. In regards to CEOs flying free all the time, most do. You can name a few but based on the number of airlines and CEOs in the country, they are the minority. Reality is that executives shouldn't have to pay for their business travel. Until you sit behind that desk I don't think it's fair to challenge the current arrangement airline's have with their executives. I also think that if an Airline CEO wants to push a paying passenger out of their seat they have the authority to do so, to the public eye it might seem harsh but I'm sure there's something important that that individual is attempting to reach. Their sitting in Coach and taking the next flight is a simple courtesy to the passenger.

FedEx currently operates 11 Corporate Aircraft (7- Lear 45 (YMF 98'-00'), 3- Challenger 60 (YMF 89'-95'), 1- Global Express (YMF 2001) ) That I am almost positive are utilized by all executives. Keep in mind that their airline branch is an entirly seperate operation from that of the whole entity that currently creates FedEx.

Thanks.
 
Electech6299
Posts: 606
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RE: How Do Airline CEO's Travel?

Wed Mar 14, 2007 12:42 pm

Perhaps it is just your wording that bugs me, but why should execs avoid paying fares "at all costs"? Try these two sentences:

The tightwad avoids paying fares at all costs.
The CEO avoids paying fares at all costs.

To me, the first sentence is a matter of personal choice and spending habits- and when the same language is applied to an airline CEO, it sounds ridiculous considering the economics involved. Am I just hung up on words, or did you mean for the sentence to sound like that?

Quoting UA777222 (Reply 97):
The harsh reality is that they sit behind a desk at the HQ on the top floor in the corner office.

Oh how '80s....Do airlines really still do that? Most corporate HQs I'm aware of have the execs on 2nd floor.  Wink

You confirmed this point for me...

Quoting UA777222 (Reply 97):
The difference is also why you see Military Officers being herded into the back of a 744

Just like I said,

Quoting Electech6299 (Reply 96):
Why is an airline exec different than a Congressman, a Military officer

When Generals and Admirals go on vacation, they fly on a ticket they bought (Or possibly on space-available military transport, just like junior officers). The pressures of an airline exec are not necessarily higher than all other industries, please don't be so myopic. And no, in fact the pilot seniority does not correlate to the environment of the executive staff. Pilots are typically unionized and paid for seniority, but staff have real world criteria on which their performance (and pay) is based. The business office (and board room) of an airline has much more in common with the business office (and board room) of Campbell Foods than it does with the operations desk or union meeting hall.

My point is that the CEO of Campbell foods on travel should stop by the local manufacturer or distributor, whether he flies on private jet or company-paid first class. The corresponding example is that, when practical, the airline CEO should stop by the cabin of his aircraft during travel.

I am not trying to say that travel to/from Board meetings or in critical situations or tight schedules shouldn't be done with appropriate priority. Certainly they have the right- just as they have the right to remove the plane from service and tell the pilots to fly them to Hawaii. But authority doesn't equate with responsibility, or as this post is focused on, "what is best for the airline." Let me post this one more time:

Quoting Electech6299 (Reply 87):
The comments made about time being valuable are very true...You don't want your key decision makers sitting at the gate when there is business to be done. But on the off Tuesday afternoon with no meetings until Thursday, or on travel for personal leave, I would suggest that the spend the time in the shoes of an average pax. That's where insight into operations comes from, not books or board meetings.
 
PanHAM
Posts: 9719
Joined: Fri May 06, 2005 6:44 pm

RE: How Do Airline CEO's Travel?

Wed Mar 14, 2007 2:50 pm

Quoting Electech6299 (Reply 96):
Again, it all comes as a compensation package. Is flying free, confirmed or positive space, an appropriate part of the compensation package of an airline CEO? And if the Board gives it to him, should he use it? As to "all the incredible accounting problems" of reimbursing, that's ridiculous. Just like CEOs of other companies, the secretary books the flight with a company credit card. End of story. I just think that, when the trip is optional, it should be a personal credit card and not compan

Excuse me, but a business trip is paid by the company you work for. If that company happens to be an airline and the business trip takes place on one of its aircraft, the company is saving the airfare part of the expenses. Paying your own company is ridiculous. Its left pocket to right pocket. If a trip is optional or not is up to the decision of the CEO, he reports to the owners and I have never been on an AGM where the travel expenses of the CEO were questioned.

Personal travel is a different story. There are no "free flights" anyhow since these are usually taxable in most countries, at the personal income tax rate.

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