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RE: DL Cancels Friend's Honeymoon Flight, No Notice

Tue Mar 27, 2007 9:00 am

Quoting DL787932ER (Reply 6):
Did they book directly? I.e. at delta.com, by calling DL directly, or in person at a ticket counter? If not, their travel agent (whether it be a "bricks-and-mortar" agency or an online travel agency like Expedia or Travelocity) is responsible for alerting them to schedule changes and rebooking them if necessary. The agency, not the airline, is who the couple should deal with.

 checkmark 

Quoting B777-700 (Reply 8):
Quoting Brons2 (Thread starter):
And then when they are contacted to not offer us anything for our inconvenience?

Airlines don't compensate for schedule changes. Schedule changes have to happen.

 checkmark 

Quoting ArcrftLvr (Reply 23):
It shouldn't be the customer's responsibilty to confirm schedule changes.

It isn't - if they booked anywhere other than with DL directly, then it's the responsibility of that service provider (Expedia, Orbitz, Travelocity, AAA Travel, whatever) to alert the customer to the schedule change.

If they booked directly with DL, it's DL's responsibility...but one thing we're missing is how far out the schedule change is! When sked chgs occur, it's common practice to notify those people traveling first - so if your flight was cancelled for next month, you'll be advised of it by the airline sooner than someone traveling in four months will.

Quoting BNinMSY (Reply 33):
Delta should NEVER bring up the profitability issue - that is THEIR problem and issue - you are a customer and should be treated as such is my humble opinion.

And you know perfectly well that how this issue came up was the customer shrieking something to the effect of, "How DARE you cancel that Wednesday flight!" with the DL supervisor replying that loads on Wednesdays to and from ANU are really low, making the flight a money-loser - so they cancelled it and moved the flight to a better day, load-wise when they revised the schedule.

It's a perfectly valid point, but all the customer hears is, "BLAH BLAH BLAH profitability BLAH BLAH BLAH" because they've got selective hearing now that they've been inconvenienced.

So...as with just about any air carrier, when a schedule change occurs DL will either rebook them on the next available flight, reschedule them to a different day entirely if the customer wishes, or offer a full refund if these options aren't acceptable to them.

End of story.
"In this present crisis, government is not the solution to our problem - government IS the problem." - Ronald Reagan

Comments made here are my own and are not intended to represent the official position of Alaska Air Group
 
BNinMSY
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RE: DL Cancels Friend's Honeymoon Flight, No Notice

Tue Mar 27, 2007 9:01 am

Bottomline, the airline needs to realize what real customer service is and make doing business with them a pleasure - knock your socks off service. Technology gives corporations great efficency and flexibility this day in time. Delta evidently isn't living by their golden rule of "being the best in the eyes of the customer'.

I will say Delta isn't the only airline that doesn't advise schedule changes - they just seem to the the worst at it. I see it often enough.

Delta use to have the most hospitable and pleasant employees at all levels - that has all been washed away by Management.
 
IADCA
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RE: DL Cancels Friend's Honeymoon Flight, No Notice

Tue Mar 27, 2007 9:08 am

Quoting B777-700 (Reply 45):
Quoting Clickhappy (Reply 43):
Not sure which part of the story I have left out, I was as surprised as you to get that call from Mastercard. Has never happened to me before.

Well, for starters, you can't just bill a credit card again with the same approval code.

Second, airlines just don't cancel flight and make you pay more. If they have a schedule change or flight cancellation, there's no additional cost to the customer.

Bottomline: There's really no way to do what you said they did. Something is being left out, or you're misunderstanding something

Actually, it's entirely possible. I used to work in hospitality. Our room agreements allowed us to bill CCs directly for room damages, and I saw it done a couple times. Never had to be on the receiving end of the customer service call (as I never actually performed the act and would have morally have had a tough time doing it), but it's absolutely definitely possible. If you have the card number, you can just refund the old transaction and run a new one, provided you're still in the same billing cycle.

On the main thrust of this topic, it's ridiculous for DL not to contact them. It's possible they tried and failed, but in that instance it might have been prudent to make a note on their re-booked reservation that such an attempt had been made, just in case something like this happened. When you change someone's reservation by DAYS, it is the carrier's responsibility to make sure they know about it; you can't expect the customer to just go on the website and check their flight every day like a good a.netter.

Quoting LAXdude1023 (Reply 32):
Quoting Evan767 (Reply 22):
Thank you. I like to come off that way, I am no pansy!

Thats not something to be proud of. I highly doubt if you were in that situation you would give yourself the "tough S**t" attitude that you seem to have for everyone else.

These people had a most unfortuanate problem with their honeymoon. Thats a very big deal. I do have much sympathy for the couple. I personally dont have enough details to know whose fault it is.

LAXdude, he's a 13-15 year old kid and a Delta fan. It's too bad he's learning people skills from some of the folks on here...and I agree with you completely.


Here's an analogy, for everyone: Suppose you had a hotel reservation for a weeklong trip, Weds-Weds. The hotel, without telling you, rebooks you Saturday-Saturday. You've already got your plane tickets lined up, and let's assume they're refundable, but the hotel isn't. Now that we have DL and all airlines out of the blame game in this scenario, aren't you gonna be pretty pissed off at the hotel?
 
FlyDeltaJets87
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RE: DL Cancels Friend's Honeymoon Flight, No Notice

Tue Mar 27, 2007 9:41 am

Quoting JetBluefan1 (Reply 46):
Cool. I've flown JetBlue over 20 times and have never had a schedule change. I flew Delta only twice and had a schedule change twice in just one itinerary.

Yea, but I've never been stranded on the tarmac for 10 hours on DL.  wink   duck 

In all seriousness, it's obviously luck of the draw. I've had numerous itineraries with DL where I didn't have a schedule change and other itineraries that have. Same way with AirTran. Big difference is AirTran notifies me. I usually only find out because I log into delta.com to get on the seat-selector to see if any better seats have opened up.

I wouldn't be surprised if the airport has something to do with it. Seems like we've had more trouble in GSO than anywhere else. Last summer (between early-July and mid-August) between my family members and I, we had four flights on Delta. 3 had the flight coming into GSO or going out of GSO cancelled. Twice we were notified. I was the one who wasn't when I flew to Ohio, though I don't know if my sisters notification was more due to the fact that she was an unaccompanied minor.

This may sound like a dumb question, but anyone know if fare class has anything to do with it? When my dad travels, his company buys a slightly higher fare class where as when I travel, I get the cheap fare. Anyone think or suspect fare code has an effect on the urgency with which one is notified?

Quoting B777-700 (Reply 47):
Quoting Aa757first (Reply 44):
Probably. But it seems more people here have reported problems with Delta.

Because this is a thread about Delta!

Yes, but many of the people who have reported major schedule changes on other airlines say they've received notification of the changes. That's the difference. Heck, when I got email notifications from AirTran telling me of schedule changes, I had to click a link in the email confirming that the changes didn't affect my travel plans.

I don't know why, but the airlines just seem like they want to hide things from the passengers hoping the passengers won't ask or find out. They don't feel obligated to tell you of schedule changes. They won't tell you why your flight is delayed. Funny thing is, most passengers are much more cooperative if they just know what's going on.

Quoting Aa757first (Reply 50):
And I don't really care how often the flights run, I know when mine is scheduled to leave. If you cancel it, call me ASAP with a refund. If you cancel it and I find out a few days in advance, it would be a nice gesture for DL to book them on another airline, wouldn't it be?

That's where I was fortunate with my mishap last August. DL at least rebooked me on US when I got to the airport, which worked out better since US got me into DAY earlier than my original itinerary on DL did. I was also fortunate in that DL didn't try to reissue the ticket to me at a higher price and DL was even willing to simply book me GSO-CVG and cancel the CVG-DAY leg at no cost.

Quoting Aa757first (Reply 44):
Its nice for changing seats or getting flight information for relatives, but its reasonable to expect at least an e-mail when your schedule changes.

 checkmark 
I couldn't imagine treating an individual client this way. I mean, if I had a meeting with someone and had to change the meeting time, wouldn't it make sense to call them or email them to let them know "Hey, something's come up and I need to reschedule. My available times are X, Y, and Z. Which one works for you?"

Quoting DfwRevolution (Reply 38):
Try again. Those who can't think, probably shouldn't instruct others to

Why don't you think and try using the smiley faces this website conveniently provides to convey humor next time. But when the only thing you use is the checkmark, that conveys complete agreement to me.
"Let's Roll"- Todd Beamer, United Airlines Flight 93, Sept. 11, 2001
 
aa61hvy
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RE: DL Cancels Friend's Honeymoon Flight, No Notice

Tue Mar 27, 2007 9:42 am

American did the same thing to me and my dad, we were doing DFW-MIA-MBJ... They neglected to tell us that our flight was leaving 25 mins earlier than our ticket had said, they never contacted us. We missed the check in. I am a big frequent flyer, my father flies 100X more than I do (think almost weekly) never happend to him or me before. We ended up going via ATL and MIA 12 hours later... Stuff happens...DL and AA are huge companies, no company that big can ever be perfect.. Just got to play the card you were dealt.
Go big or go home
 
rampart
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RE: DL Cancels Friend's Honeymoon Flight, No Notice

Tue Mar 27, 2007 10:16 am

Quoting Evan767 (Reply 22):

Thank you. I like to come off that way, I am no pansy!

Let us know what your girlfriend thinks when you're old enough to get one.
PLEASE take that in the lighthearted way I intend it!  Smile Just wanted to add some perspective.

-Rampart
 
sparkingwave
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RE: DL Cancels Friend's Honeymoon Flight, No Notice

Tue Mar 27, 2007 10:22 am

Sorry to hear of your canceled honeymoon flight. Let me tell you, the same thing happened to me on SQ. They also never bothered notify me of my canceled flight.

And I've never flown them since.
Flights to the moon and all major space stations. At Pan Am, the sky is no longer the limit!
 
Evan767
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RE: DL Cancels Friend's Honeymoon Flight, No Notice

Tue Mar 27, 2007 10:26 am

Quoting Rampart (Reply 58):
Let us know what your girlfriend thinks when you're old enough to get one.

You can bet on it!

Quoting IADCA (Reply 55):
It's too bad he's learning people skills from some of the folks on here...

Too bad indeed...
The proper term is "on final" not "on finals" bud...
 
vv701
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RE: DL Cancels Friend's Honeymoon Flight, No Notice

Tue Mar 27, 2007 10:51 am

Quoting Brons2 (Thread starter):
Discuss.

In another thread about the EU-US Air Services Agreement I recently said that I thought DL would become a major force on the JFK-LHR route.

Having read this thread and in particular how so many US citizens - the 'honeymoon-lost' DL apologists - are prepared to accept such poor customer service and then roll on their backs and literally ask to be kicked again, I have changed my mind.

Of course what happened here could happen to any airline anywhere. But from what the DL apologists are saying this is the type of thing that we should not be surprised about or perhaps even expect if we book DL. Worse they profess that it is the customer's responsibility to keep checking that the airline has not discontinued the product he or she has ordered and paid for.

How any company can have a policy which accepts an advanced order and an advanced payment and then keeps that payment without contacting the customer when it has discontinued the purchased product really defies belief. No. If DL behaves like this in the name of 'profit' will not become a force to be reckoned with at LHR.
 
billreid
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RE: DL Cancels Friend's Honeymoon Flight, No Notice

Tue Mar 27, 2007 11:15 am

Moral to this story.

If you think this is hard, just imagine 50 years of marriage.

GET OVER IT.
Some people don't get it. Business is about making MONEY!
 
SkyyMaster
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RE: DL Cancels Friend's Honeymoon Flight, No Notice

Tue Mar 27, 2007 11:30 am

Quoting B777-700 (Reply 8):
Let me preface this by saying this happens on ALL airline and it's not exclusive to Delta. It's a necessary evil of the industry.



Quoting Jetdeltamsy (Reply 29):
No airlines guarantees anything, including the schedule.

It's all in the fine print.

 checkmark   checkmark   checkmark 

While I sympathize with the situation, I'm curious - do these people fly often? If so, they'd know schedules are subject to change without notice. Whether or not DL notified the customer is an issue, but they are no different from any other airline. They've notified me of schedule changes before on some flights, on others they haven't. The same with other airlines. Does it suck? Yeppers. Best advice to tell people, don't assume anything. Check your reservation occasionally. That way if your flight does get changed, you can be proactive and not depend on the airline to notify you. As long as the airlines continue to cutback staff and service, this kind of issue is only going to become more frequent.
 
worldtraveler
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RE: DL Cancels Friend's Honeymoon Flight, No Notice

Tue Mar 27, 2007 11:35 am

Quoting VV701 (Reply 61):
Having read this thread and in particular how so many US citizens - the 'honeymoon-lost' DL apologists - are prepared to accept such poor customer service and then roll on their backs and literally ask to be kicked again, I have changed my mind.

Of course what happened here could happen to any airline anywhere.

You truly are kidding, right? You speak out of both sides of your mouth. May I remind you that the largest tenant at LHR has stranded thousands of passengers and bags multiple times over the past 18 months; they have not been the reason for all of their problems but they surely did not make it easier for themselves in the process.

Schedule changes are a fact of life in the airline industry; it is compounded on network airlines because the multiple segments of the itinerary can misconnect. LFCs don't have the problem to the degree network carriers do but they also don't serve the tens of thousands of O&Ds that network carriers do serve.

Like every carrier, DL does have schedule change procedures that involve passenger notification. I have rec'd them. They also notify of schedule changes using the same means (e-mail, crackberry, phone) that every other airline uses.

DL probably has had more schedule changes than other carriers over the past couple years because they have reworked their schedule so dramatically. Leisure destination schedules are more likely to go through schedule change than business schedules.

Airlines, including DL, do issue refunds if they cannot accommodate you and they do have agreements with other carriers if they cannot get you where you need to be when you need to be there. I have rarely seen a situation like the one described above that cannot be resolved if you are willing to work with airlines and be willing to come up with creative suggestions. And yes it may require telling some people that their answer is unacceptable and you wish to discuss the matter with someone else. Usually airline's consumer affairs offices will find an acceptable solution. And POLITELY make sure the people who provide you with unsatisfactory answers know that you have their name and you aren't satisfied with their answer.

Talking to the airline and attempting to find a solution yields far better results than moaning about it on the internet. I have yet to see one reasonable suggestion offered to this situation in the entire thread. I'm not even sure where this passenger is travelling... perhaps we could start there.
 
jycarlisle
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RE: DL Cancels Friend's Honeymoon Flight, No Notice

Tue Mar 27, 2007 11:40 am

Quoting BillReid (Reply 62):
just imagine 50 years of marriage.

Jeesh, I experienced 2.5 years of marriage and that's all I could take...

Cheers,
Jeremy Carlisle
"CHANGE IS: CLEAN PLANES AND DIRTY MARTINIS" (DL)
 
vv701
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RE: DL Cancels Friend's Honeymoon Flight, No Notice

Tue Mar 27, 2007 11:58 am

Quoting WorldTraveler (Reply 64):
Of course what happened here could happen to any airline anywhere.

You truly are kidding, right? You speak out of both sides of your mouth.

Really?

Of course any airline may need to cancel a flight for a whole host of reasons. These range from the weather to a more profitable use of the aircraft that was to fly the cancelled flight.

If you think I am talking out of both sides of my mouth because I criticise an airline that cancels a flight for purely commercial reasons AND cancels that flight well in advance of the planned flight date AND keeps its customers' payments for tickets on a flight it has no intention of operating AND does not notify them of the cancellation then yes, I talk out of both sides of my mouth.

If this is how DL treat their customers and if people like you think it is acceptable customer relations, I feel very sorry for both DL's customers and for you. And I am sure you will have disuaded many readers of this thread from booking with DL when an alternative is available.
 
tommytoyz
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RE: DL Cancels Friend's Honeymoon Flight, No Notice

Tue Mar 27, 2007 12:05 pm

"Did they book directly? I.e. at delta.com, by calling DL directly, or in person at a ticket counter? If not, their travel agent (whether it be a "bricks-and-mortar" agency or an online travel agency like Expedia or Travelocity) is responsible for alerting them to schedule changes and rebooking them if necessary. The agency, not the airline, is who the couple should deal with."

Wrong.

The carriage agreement is between the passenger and the carrier. Period. Unless it is the agent that is making the changes, then the carrier is 100% responsible.

Read these two sometime :
http://www.delta.com/legal/contract_of_carriage/index.jsp

Since the flight is an international one, see the internantional conditions and responsibilties.
http://images.delta.com.edgesuite.ne...pdfs/contract_of_carriage_intl.pdf
See page 52
 
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EA CO AS
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RE: DL Cancels Friend's Honeymoon Flight, No Notice

Tue Mar 27, 2007 1:00 pm

Quoting Tommytoyz (Reply 67):
"Did they book directly? I.e. at delta.com, by calling DL directly, or in person at a ticket counter? If not, their travel agent (whether it be a "bricks-and-mortar" agency or an online travel agency like Expedia or Travelocity) is responsible for alerting them to schedule changes and rebooking them if necessary. The agency, not the airline, is who the couple should deal with."

Wrong.

Actually, you're incorrect. Agencies - online or brick and mortar - bear the responsibility for providing notice of schedule changes when tickets are purchased through them. It's an ARC/IATA rule.

Quoting Tommytoyz (Reply 67):
Read these two sometime :

You obviously didn't read it yourself, because if you did, you'd have stumbled across this little nugget:

Times shown in the timetable or elsewhere are not guaranteed and form no part of this contract... Schedules are subject to change without notice.
"In this present crisis, government is not the solution to our problem - government IS the problem." - Ronald Reagan

Comments made here are my own and are not intended to represent the official position of Alaska Air Group
 
Maverick623
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RE: DL Cancels Friend's Honeymoon Flight, No Notice

Tue Mar 27, 2007 1:25 pm

I think everyone can agree to this:

Schedule changes happen. The airline should notify passengers of said changes, as a basic form of customer service. Delta, in this case, did not. Doesn't mean Delta is evil, but should offer some form of compensation including a refund on the price of the ticket, especially if no other viable alternatives are available.
"PHX is Phoenix, PDX is the other city" -777Way
 
floridaflyboy
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RE: DL Cancels Friend's Honeymoon Flight, No Notice

Tue Mar 27, 2007 1:34 pm

Quoting Maverick623 (Reply 69):
I think everyone can agree to this:

Schedule changes happen. The airline should notify passengers of said changes, as a basic form of customer service. Delta, in this case, did not. Doesn't mean Delta is evil, but should offer some form of compensation including a refund on the price of the ticket, especially if no other viable alternatives are available.

I could agree to that. Sounds quite reasonable. I also think some of the airlines may want to look into things like this, not because they are required to, which they aren't, but just because it is always good to improve their level of customer service.
Good goes around!
 
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Aeroflot777
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RE: DL Cancels Friend's Honeymoon Flight, No Notice

Tue Mar 27, 2007 2:22 pm

Quoting Brons2 (Reply 5):
Is it really that hard to send an email?

I've had DL change my flight times many times, but I have always gotten an email notifying me of the change. It's bizaare to hear of all the people that don't!!

Aeroflot777

P.S. Hope it all works out on the honeymoon.
 
wjcandee
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RE: DL Cancels Friend's Honeymoon Flight, No Notice

Tue Mar 27, 2007 2:54 pm

Well, here's my 2 cents.

First, we don't know how long before the honeymoon this is. If it's 3 days, then the "victim" has something to be frustrated by (but see below). If it's two months, no reason to be expecting the notification this soon, assuming that DL is going to rebook them on some other route.

Second, it seems to me that the bitching by the customer is overstated. At first, we hear that "there's no other option until Saturday", which means -- boo hoo! -- loss of a special package price at the resort, (sniff, sniff). But later, we find out that there are alternatives on DL, albeit with less-desireable routings, and on other airlines, with less-desireable routings, on the same day. So what the folks are really bitching about it a longer connection or a less-convenient departure time. To that, I personally believe, honeymoon or not, it's awfully self-centered to be complaining.
 
BAtriple7
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RE: DL Cancels Friend's Honeymoon Flight, No Notice

Tue Mar 27, 2007 5:28 pm

Quoting Wjcandee (Reply 73):
At first, we hear that "there's no other option until Saturday", which means -- boo hoo! -- loss of a special package price at the resort, (sniff, sniff).

Remember that some people can only afford honeymoons at those 'special package prices'! And therefore a changed flight is a missed opportunity, especially since a honeymoon is often a once-in-a-lifetime trip.

Recently Easyjet cancelled a friend's flight 4 hours before departure....and called them while they were stuck on the motorway to the airport. Was it the airline's fault? No - these things happen. However, advance notice is always good - especially for longer flights. And adequate compensation....needless to say, my friend never saw the promised refund.
 
Norcal773
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RE: DL Cancels Friend's Honeymoon Flight, No Notice

Tue Mar 27, 2007 6:44 pm

It's kinda hard to seek help if you don't provide crucial info e.g. how did they book the flight even after numerous requests by different members.

Well, there's a hint that maybe she shouldn't get married.  biggrin 
If you're going through hell, keep going
 
tommytoyz
Posts: 1195
Joined: Thu Jan 18, 2007 9:08 am

RE: DL Cancels Friend's Honeymoon Flight, No Notice

Tue Mar 27, 2007 6:58 pm

Quoting EA CO AS (Reply 66):
Actually, you're incorrect. Agencies - online or brick and mortar - bear the responsibility for providing notice of schedule changes when tickets are purchased through them. It's an ARC/IATA rule.

I'm sorry, US contract law prevails over trade group agreements, especially international ones. The contract for carriage is between the airline and the passenger. Period. If you would have read the DL carriage terms, you would have seen that DL rebooks passengers due to schedule changes. There is no mention anywhere about going back to the travel agent or to rely on the travel agent for anything.

It is a contract between DL and the passenger. Period.

Quoting EA CO AS (Reply 66):
You obviously didn't read it yourself, because if you did, you'd have stumbled across this little nugget:

Times shown in the timetable or elsewhere are not guaranteed and form no part of this contract... Schedules are subject to change without notice.

I did see that in the document. So? Your point is? I never claimed the schedule is guaranteed, correct? So please read and comprehend the posts you are responding to. Thank you.
 
Halcyon
Posts: 1622
Joined: Sat Jul 15, 2006 4:47 pm

RE: DL Cancels Friend's Honeymoon Flight, No Notic

Tue Mar 27, 2007 7:39 pm

Ha, Delta promised me a refund three (going on four) months ago, and I have yet to receive it. I call weekly, and have gotten all these storied:
-I will get a full refund
-I will get no refund, the agent should never have told you that...do you have proof you were told that?
-Your refund will be partial.

Anyway, I'm still negotiating with them. I've also called Consumer Affairs, etc, so the ball is rolling...sheesh...it was a small refund, they could have paid it. Now it's a quest for bloody revenge.

Also, the last three flights I've been on have been overbooked, and it looks like my next two are...strange.

That being said, Delta ALWAYS sends me messages when a flight is changed. They may not pay refunds or say thanks if you help in a medical emergency, and they may lie to you about other things, but they always send you emails or texts of changes.

Of course, since most people would (I hope) say that Delta ALWAYS gives the refund promised, I can see the possibility of them not sending a notice. Different missed strokes for different folks I guess.

Lucas
 
Toulouse
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RE: DL Cancels Friend's Honeymoon Flight, No Notice

Tue Mar 27, 2007 7:50 pm

Quoting B777-700 (Reply 7):
this by saying this happens on ALL airline and it's not exclusive to Delta

As quite a frequent flyer (on average once a month, often more) mainly with European airlines, this has only ever happened to me once. Itw as actually last year, about a week befroe my flight with Iberia I got an email from Iberia informing me of a change in my flight schedule and their sincerest apologies for any inconveniences caused. I thought "OH NO!!" as I was connecting at MAD. Openned the email, and yes they had modified the departure time of my flight... it was now leaving 10 (yes TEN) MINUTES later than originally scheduled. So really, that made absoloutely no change to my plans. Thought it was nice of Iberia to inform me of the change. Funny thing is boarding was very swift, and we actually took off only 5 minutes after the originally scheduled time and arrived at our destination about 10 minutes ahead of the "original" schedule!
Long live Aer Lingus!
 
halls120
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RE: DL Cancels Friend's Honeymoon Flight, No Notice

Tue Mar 27, 2007 8:59 pm

Quoting Maverick623 (Reply 67):
I think everyone can agree to this:

Schedule changes happen. The airline should notify passengers of said changes, as a basic form of customer service. Delta, in this case, did not. Doesn't mean Delta is evil, but should offer some form of compensation including a refund on the price of the ticket, especially if no other viable alternatives are available.

Not everyone can agree with the above.

Yes, Delta should have informed them in a timely manner. But as long as they offered him a reasonable alternative, why should he get a refund?

You can sign up for e-mail notification of schedule changes with DL like you can with AA and UA. Had our honeymooner taken five minutes to do this, he would have been advised early enough to make alternate plans.

Quoting Wjcandee (Reply 73):
Second, it seems to me that the bitching by the customer is overstated. At first, we hear that "there's no other option until Saturday", which means -- boo hoo! -- loss of a special package price at the resort, (sniff, sniff). But later, we find out that there are alternatives on DL, albeit with less-desireable routings, and on other airlines, with less-desireable routings, on the same day. So what the folks are really bitching about it a longer connection or a less-convenient departure time. To that, I personally believe, honeymoon or not, it's awfully self-centered to be complaining.

 checkmark 
"Suppose you were an idiot. And suppose you were a member of Congress. But I repeat myself." Mark Twain, a Biography
 
B777-700
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RE: DL Cancels Friend's Honeymoon Flight, No Notice

Tue Mar 27, 2007 9:17 pm

Quoting IADCA (Reply 55):
On the main thrust of this topic, it's ridiculous for DL not to contact them



Quoting Halls120 (Reply 79):
But as long as they offered him a reasonable alternative, why should he get a refund?

While I share the same sediments, Delta's policy is to give a full refund for any reason that the customer not be satisfied with the rebooking options.

Quoting Halls120 (Reply 79):
Had our honeymooner taken five minutes to do this, he would have been advised early enough to make alternate plans.

Not even 5 minutes, all you have to do is check a box and enter an email address (hell, sometimes not even that)

Are we agreeing? Big grin

Quoting Toulouse (Reply 78):
As quite a frequent flyer (on average once a month, often more) mainly with European airlines, this has only ever happened to me once.

And your point? This is only likely to happen to you once one DL too.

Quoting Halcyon (Reply 77):
They may not pay refunds or say thanks if you help in a medical emergency

Huh? Oh God, please tell me you didn't want some type of reward for that.

Quoting Tommytoyz (Reply 76):
I'm sorry, US contract law prevails over trade group agreements, especially international ones. The contract for carriage is between the airline and the passenger. Period. If you would have read the DL carriage terms, you would have seen that DL rebooks passengers due to schedule changes. There is no mention anywhere about going back to the travel agent or to rely on the travel agent for anything.

And in reality, Delta can't get in touch w/ a passenger if the travel agency doesn't put contact information in, or puts the agencies number. It happen a lot more than you think. That's how it works in practice, so yes, in those cases, it's the TA's responsibility.
If you don't chew Big Red, then @#$% you.
 
onewickedboi
Posts: 50
Joined: Fri Sep 08, 2006 12:20 pm

RE: DL Cancels Friend's Honeymoon Flight, No Notice

Tue Mar 27, 2007 9:33 pm

Quoting DL787932ER (Reply 5):
Did they book directly? I.e. at delta.com, by calling DL directly, or in person at a ticket counter? If not, their travel agent (whether it be a "bricks-and-mortar" agency or an online travel agency like Expedia or Travelocity) is responsible for alerting them to schedule changes and rebooking them if necessary.

Don't you all think that the DL Customer Service agent and Supervisor who was looking at the passenger's reservation on the computer screen would have brought this detail up if it were relevant? Surely that would have been not only more efficient, but better customer service than the "spiel" on profitability.

It's really nice to know that DL supervisors see it as their duty to educate the public about profitability. Delta's job is to fly the public. It's somewhat ironic that an airline trying to exit bankruptcy gave this individual an economics lesson over the phone.  banghead 

What airlines in general should understand is that the public is sick and tired of hearing about profitability. If an airline, or any business for that matter, cannot make itself profitable in a given economic climate, they should carefully consider going out of business. That is Economics 101. I know that is harsh, but that is a decision any rational business must make when profit maximization is the goal, and they can't do just that. And we've already heard that profitability is the goal. I should think that all the Delta cheerleaders out there would be rather embarrassed by the DL supervisor's attempt at handling this situation by going on about profitability. Pathetic, really!

Speaking from personal experience with Delta, I recently booked flights on Delta's Sky Team partner Air France using Delta's Sky Miles telephone center. As I was making my travel arrangements for dates nearly 11 months out, the Delta representative correctly informed me that the seasonal schedule had not been confirmed and that I would be ticketed, but that the flight times might change and I would need to check back for exact flight times as my travel date approached.

It really doesn't get any easier than that, and Delta surly got it right in my dealing with them, and I for one can give DL a thumbs up for handling my arrangements. I'm also seasoned enough with travel to know that plans change and being a little flexible as a traveler goes a long way.

I'm sure many A.netters will recall the days when most international flights required a telephone confirmation a day or two prior to travel. If having emailed confirmations is so critical, another poster has already pointed out that American Airlines is one carrier which happens to offer several options including email and text messaging of flight and gate notifications. From my experience, American's system works quite well, at least for domestic flights.

R E G A R D S
"instant gratification takes too long . . . "
 
ewmahle
Posts: 93
Joined: Thu Mar 24, 2005 10:36 am

RE: DL Cancels Friend's Honeymoon Flight, No Notice

Tue Mar 27, 2007 9:40 pm

This got me interested and I looked up my reservation and every one of my 6 flights, except for the flight I was planning to change, was changed including aircraft types and times. I also lost my seat reservations. I did not need to be anywhere at any specifc time so it is not a huge deal but I would have liked a little info from DL. What I am most upset about is that I am bumped of the MD-80 I was assigned on to a CRJ-700. I have not flown on an MD-80 in years and was really looking forward to it.
 
ewmahle
Posts: 93
Joined: Thu Mar 24, 2005 10:36 am

RE: DL Cancels Friend's Honeymoon Flight, No Notice

Tue Mar 27, 2007 9:44 pm

I actually looked at my reservation again and the flight I wanted to change that had not been change, as mentioned above, is now scheduled with me arriving to CVG at 8:10am and departing for GSO at 8:00am. Is this going to be my chance that I was hoping for to change my flight with little or no cost to me? I wanted a later flight, could this be my chance?
 
Toulouse
Posts: 2200
Joined: Thu Apr 28, 2005 4:30 pm

RE: DL Cancels Friend's Honeymoon Flight, No Notice

Tue Mar 27, 2007 9:49 pm

Quoting B777-700 (Reply 79):
And your point? This is only likely to happen to you once one DL too.

My point??? Just sharing an anecdote of my sole experience of this happening to me, does that bother you??... not once did I refer to Delta, I haven't flown them in years and have no opinion on the airline.
Long live Aer Lingus!
 
ThePRGuy
Posts: 1833
Joined: Thu Aug 10, 2006 10:07 am

RE: DL Cancels Friend's Honeymoon Flight, No Notice

Tue Mar 27, 2007 9:49 pm

Here in the UK, airlines like BA and VS have devices called phones which they utilise to inform passengers of any changes, so not to induce hatred and upset.

Didn't know Delta hadn't got their shipment in yet!
Thanks
Alex
Heathrow has been described as the only building site to have its own airport.
 
acjflyer
Posts: 294
Joined: Mon Aug 15, 2005 9:44 am

RE: DL Cancels Friend's Honeymoon Flight, No Notice

Tue Mar 27, 2007 10:00 pm

The root of the problem here is that Airlines are not putting enough effort into taking care of the people that supply their "profitability." Some struggle more than others but in general we all know it is an industry wide problem.

Yes, the passenger should take some initiative to make sure every thing is in place well in advance, especially when it comes to a flight that is leaving the continental United States, but on the other hand the airlines should also take some initiatives when it comes to not screwing over your passengers.

The sad thing is that as an employess of an airline its hard to see all they don't do to accomodate their pax.
 
onewickedboi
Posts: 50
Joined: Fri Sep 08, 2006 12:20 pm

RE: DL Cancels Friend's Honeymoon Flight, No Notice

Tue Mar 27, 2007 10:07 pm

Quoting ThePRGuy (Reply 82):
Here in the UK, airlines like BA and VS have devices called phones which they utilise to inform passengers of any changes, so not to induce hatred and upset.

Didn't know Delta hadn't got their shipment in yet!

LOL. Funny. And using those little devices don't seem to impact the profits of BA and VS too terribly now do they?

Just keep in mind that it's not just the technology, but the ability of the person (hopefully a person) at the other end to professionally communicate accurate information using said technology.

R E G A R D S
"instant gratification takes too long . . . "
 
halls120
Posts: 8724
Joined: Sun Jun 05, 2005 3:24 am

RE: DL Cancels Friend's Honeymoon Flight, No Notice

Tue Mar 27, 2007 10:12 pm

Quoting B777-700 (Reply 77):
Quoting Halls120 (Reply 79):
Had our honeymooner taken five minutes to do this, he would have been advised early enough to make alternate plans.

Not even 5 minutes, all you have to do is check a box and enter an email address (hell, sometimes not even that)

Are we agreeing?

It would appear that we are.  biggrin 

Quoting Onewickedboi (Reply 78):
What airlines in general should understand is that the public is sick and tired of hearing about profitability.

Well, since it was the "public" and their demand for 99 dollar seats for cross country flights which is partially to blame for the deterioration of airline service over the past decade, I don't blame a DL employee for speaking his/her mind.
"Suppose you were an idiot. And suppose you were a member of Congress. But I repeat myself." Mark Twain, a Biography
 
brons2
Topic Author
Posts: 2480
Joined: Tue Sep 25, 2001 1:02 pm

RE: DL Cancels Friend's Honeymoon Flight, No Notice

Tue Mar 27, 2007 10:15 pm

Just to come back to this thread, my friend did book directly through Delta. I noticed that question being asked a lot in many of the responses.
Firings, if well done, are good for employee morale.
 
Alitalia744
Posts: 3800
Joined: Thu Mar 30, 2000 8:22 am

RE: DL Cancels Friend's Honeymoon Flight, No Notice

Tue Mar 27, 2007 10:21 pm

Quoting Brons2 (Reply 86):
Just to come back to this thread, my friend did book directly through Delta. I noticed that question being asked a lot in many of the responses.

did the enter their information for flight notification?
Some see lines, others see between the lines.
 
onewickedboi
Posts: 50
Joined: Fri Sep 08, 2006 12:20 pm

RE: DL Cancels Friend's Honeymoon Flight, No Notice

Tue Mar 27, 2007 10:34 pm

Quoting Halls120 (Reply 85):
demand for 99 dollar seats for cross country flights which is partially to blame for the deterioration of airline service over the past decade

I would agree, but with heavy emphasis on the word "partially".

And with due respect, would you honestly let a Supervisor (at any airline) take 10 minutes of your time (per the original posting) to "speak his/her mind?"

Nobody should put up with that nonsense, notwithstanding fare paid.

R E G A R D S
"instant gratification takes too long . . . "
 
halls120
Posts: 8724
Joined: Sun Jun 05, 2005 3:24 am

RE: DL Cancels Friend's Honeymoon Flight, No Notice

Tue Mar 27, 2007 10:51 pm

Quoting Onewickedboi (Reply 88):
Quoting Halls120 (Reply 85):
demand for 99 dollar seats for cross country flights which is partially to blame for the deterioration of airline service over the past decade

I would agree, but with heavy emphasis on the word "partially".

And with due respect, would you honestly let a Supervisor (at any airline) take 10 minutes of your time (per the original posting) to "speak his/her mind?"

Nobody should put up with that nonsense, notwithstanding fare paid.

Given the number of times I've stood in line behind arrogant and rude customers listening to them lecture a poor CSR who has little ability to resolve the customer's problem, I have a huge reservoir of sympathy for the CSR that just can't take it any longer.

It's not right, but they are human.
"Suppose you were an idiot. And suppose you were a member of Congress. But I repeat myself." Mark Twain, a Biography
 
slcdeltarumd11
Posts: 4910
Joined: Fri Jan 09, 2004 7:30 am

RE: DL Cancels Friend's Honeymoon Flight, No Notice

Tue Mar 27, 2007 11:12 pm

given the technology currrently availlable such as computers that could automatically call you to inform you that your itinerary has a change there is no excused for this. there is no excuse for an airline to not let you know about a change to your itinerary. i was flying on ua thru den and when my flight from ewr as usual was late they automatically called my cell, left a message, and had me re-booked on the next flight out. when i flew united before and my flight changed time they also called me and the computer told em that there was a change to my itinerary and what it was
 
radarbeam
Posts: 998
Joined: Fri Mar 01, 2002 9:00 am

RE: DL Cancels Friend's Honeymoon Flight, No Notice

Tue Mar 27, 2007 11:15 pm

Quoting Evan767 (Reply 8):
So what does the honeymoon have anything to do with this? Did they notify DL that it was there honeymoon? They just threw that in there just to make DL seem like the big bad man whilst they are the innocent newlyweds... I have no sympathy. These are typical schedule changes.

Excuse me! You have no sympathy? Get off your high horses please. These folks had their flight changed by a full 3 days, and were NEVER notified! How is this a typical schedule change?? In the airline that I come from that is a major sched change and all doors are pretty much open to the customer.

Imagine they were catching a cruise the next day? What would you tell them? One thing is for sure I wouldn't want to have you in charge of customer service of any airlines! You invented the SOL acronym that run into this industry ...didn't you?
 
SkyyMaster
Posts: 1082
Joined: Sun Feb 11, 2007 7:34 am

RE: DL Cancels Friend's Honeymoon Flight, No Notice

Tue Mar 27, 2007 11:19 pm

Quoting VV701 (Reply 64):
If you think I am talking out of both sides of my mouth because I criticise an airline that cancels a flight for purely commercial reasons AND cancels that flight well in advance of the planned flight date AND keeps its customers' payments for tickets on a flight it has no intention of operating AND does not notify them of the cancellation then yes, I talk out of both sides of my mouth.

I'm curious, where does anything indicate that this flight was cancelled "purely for commercial reasons"? When I read the initial complaint, I didn't get that. All I saw was an alleged comment about return to profitability, etc. IF Delta cancelled the flight for that reason, do you really believe they would tell someone that? Highly unlikely. As is most always the case in customer complaints such as these, we are only hearing one side of the story. How do we know all the "facts" given are true? Isn't it possible the affected party embellished their complaint to make a point? I can't see anyone at any airline admitting to a pax they cancelled a flight because it wasn't full enough. I'm quite certain airlines do it, but I'm also quite certain they don't tell people that.
 
vulindlela744
Posts: 462
Joined: Thu Jan 27, 2000 3:03 pm

RE: DL Cancels Friend's Honeymoon Flight, No Notice

Tue Mar 27, 2007 11:21 pm

My friend had the same thing happen to her and her husband after a long awaited vacation in St. Lucia. Apparently, Delta doesn't seem to care that much about their customers. No wonder their reputation is failing.
 
floridaflyboy
Posts: 1608
Joined: Sat Jun 03, 2006 3:26 pm

RE: DL Cancels Friend's Honeymoon Flight, No Notice

Tue Mar 27, 2007 11:23 pm

Quoting Ewmahle (Reply 79):
This got me interested and I looked up my reservation and every one of my 6 flights, except for the flight I was planning to change, was changed including aircraft types and times. I also lost my seat reservations. I did not need to be anywhere at any specifc time so it is not a huge deal but I would have liked a little info from DL. What I am most upset about is that I am bumped of the MD-80 I was assigned on to a CRJ-700. I have not flown on an MD-80 in years and was really looking forward to it.

This happens quite often with DL. They clutter up your online itinerary with 1 minute schedule changes and flight number changes, and aircraft changes that really don't effect your travel plans. Then, it takes months for the inactive flights to go away so you can get your seat assignments back. Plus, one of my flights on an upcoming itinerary was on a fully-booked CR9, and they just swapped it out for a CRJ-200. That ought to be quite the oversold situation, unless they make some changes before we all show up at the airport. Usually, though, if the aircraft type doesn't change, your original seat assignment stands.
Good goes around!
 
B777-700
Posts: 1244
Joined: Thu Oct 28, 1999 10:52 am

RE: DL Cancels Friend's Honeymoon Flight, No Notice

Tue Mar 27, 2007 11:34 pm

Quoting Onewickedboi (Reply 78):
Don't you all think that the DL Customer Service agent and Supervisor who was looking at the passenger's reservation on the computer screen would have brought this detail up if it were relevant?

Maybe they did, you dont know.

Quoting Onewickedboi (Reply 78):
Surely that would have been not only more efficient, but better customer service than the "spiel" on profitability.

It's really nice to know that DL supervisors see it as their duty to educate the public about profitability. Delta's job is to fly the public. It's somewhat ironic that an airline trying to exit bankruptcy gave this individual an economics lesson over the phone.

It's funny how everyone assumes that the "speil about profitability" has something to do with DL being in bankruptcy. In reality, it's most like came out of the passenger berating the agent as to "why do you think you can just change my flights?!" and the agent saying something like "Schedule changes have to happen for many reasons, one of which being we need to operate a flight when it will be more profitable" and the passenger in her anger, just hears "profitable" and doesn't fully understand, and then tells it to her "friend" who posts the misinformation on this forum where people like you pick up that ball and run with it.

How dare they try everything they can to make money! HOW DARE THEM!  Wink

Quoting Onewickedboi (Reply 78):
What airlines in general should understand is that the public is sick and tired of hearing about profitability.

Tough crap. People want $49 fares. Don't want to hear about it? Pay what your flight is worth.

Quoting Ewmahle (Reply 80):
Is this going to be my chance that I was hoping for to change my flight with little or no cost to me? I wanted a later flight, could this be my chance?

It wont cost anything, and you still have you seats. They wont show until the ticket is reissued.

Quoting ThePRGuy (Reply 82):
Here in the UK, airlines like BA and VS have devices called phones which they utilise to inform passengers of any changes, so not to induce hatred and upset.

Didn't know Delta hadn't got their shipment in yet!

Haha you're cute! Thanks for contributing...No, really.

Quoting Acjflyer (Reply 83):
The root of the problem here is that Airlines are not putting enough effort into taking care of the people that supply their "profitability."

There's no truth to that. The root of the problem is people expect perfection.

Quoting Acjflyer (Reply 83):
The sad thing is that as an employess of an airline its hard to see all they don't do to accomodate their pax.

Bull. It's very easy to see all the things they do, but people still complain about. A lot of the time, passengers are unreasonable, and I'm sorry, if not giving them exactly what they want isn't "accommodating" them, then they'll never be satisfied.

Quoting Brons2 (Reply 86):
Just to come back to this thread, my friend did book directly through Delta. I noticed that question being asked a lot in many of the responses.

Great, and you're still not giving a lot of information. When are they traveling? Did they sign up for email alerts? Also, first you say they couldn't go for days later, then it's well, they could go the same day with connections...Which is it?
If you don't chew Big Red, then @#$% you.
 
swiftski
Posts: 1837
Joined: Tue Dec 19, 2006 6:19 am

RE: DL Cancels Friend's Honeymoon Flight, No Notice

Tue Mar 27, 2007 11:35 pm

Finnair changed my HEL-LHR flight by 5 minutes and called as well as left a voicemail.

Needless to say, I feel for your friend.
 
Halcyon
Posts: 1622
Joined: Sat Jul 15, 2006 4:47 pm

RE: DL Cancels Friend's Honeymoon Flight, No Notice

Tue Mar 27, 2007 11:38 pm

Quoting B777-700 (Reply 77):
Oh God, please tell me you didn't want some type of reward for that.

If a "thank you" is a reward troll. I think it's common decency from the flight crew I was looking for. Instead of being asked if "I was sure I was qualified, and where did I work then?" a thanks would have been nice. I did not want a letter from Delta or some crap.  Smile

I would like my refund though. That refund you claim that Delta always gives.
 
ejmmsu
Posts: 1647
Joined: Sat Oct 23, 2004 6:05 am

RE: DL Cancels Friend's Honeymoon Flight, No Notice

Tue Mar 27, 2007 11:41 pm

Dont listen to the DL apologists.

Almost all the DL reservations i've booked in advanced have been changed several times, and I have never recieved any kind of notification that they had done it.

One time I didn't realize it until I tried to check in online, and I had to completely change my plans that day since instead of getting to TUP at 10 am, the earliest they could get me there was in the afternoon. It wouldn't have been so bad had they sent me an email letting me know they had changed my itenerary.

With NW, they send me an email for small changes, and call me for big ones. Always.

DL never has.
"If the facts do not conform to the theory, they will have to be disposed of"
 
Geo772
Posts: 439
Joined: Thu Jul 15, 2004 11:40 pm

RE: DL Cancels Friend's Honeymoon Flight, No Notice

Tue Mar 27, 2007 11:44 pm

I get schedule changes from BA even if I'm on standby for the flight. I get it by email and then a reminder 24 before the flight by text message. Why other carriers can't do this seems beyond me.
Flown on A300B4/600,A319/20/21,A332/3,A343,B727,B732/3/4/5/6/7/8,B741/2/4,B752/3,B762/3,B772/3,DC10,L1011-200,VC10,MD80,
 
woodsboy
Posts: 900
Joined: Sat Mar 18, 2000 5:59 am

RE: DL Cancels Friend's Honeymoon Flight, No Notice

Tue Mar 27, 2007 11:44 pm

I fly DL all the time and I dont have very many schedule change issues, in fact I can only think of one in the last year and it was just a shift in schedule, not a cancellation. Delta sends me and email, I get email from them for everything, so this notification DOES exist. One thing I have noticed recently is that my online notifications from Hawaiiain Airlines have gone to my junk mail bin on Yahoo! Luckily HA also calls you with a recorded msg about the change.

Its true, all airlines change schedules and you just have to keep on top of things especially if you book wayyyyy in advance. Back when I worked for Alaska Airlines we would see all the time people who booked months-6-8-10 in advance and would show up without checking anything and their entire schedule was difference. Back then (early-mid 90s) ALaska shifted schedules 3-4 times a year, at least quarterly and that meant flight numbers, frequencies, departure time, etc. We use to automatically re-book everyone as best we could to avoid problems and we usually did. There were those few who slipped through because of no contact info, disconnected phone numbers or bad addresses. If you fly alot and/or consider yourself a savy traveller then look at your reservation frequently, it is also your/our responsibility to make sure we are where we need to be at the appropriate time!

Also- how DARE Delta cancel/change a flight with honeymooners onboard! The nerve!!! I dont see how this makes any difference to anything AND, if these people were expecting upgrades they must have some elite status which means they must fly enough to know to CHECK YOUR SCHEDULE often!

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