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Lemurs
Posts: 1320
Joined: Sat Mar 12, 2005 5:13 am

RE: TLV Passport Stamp: No Entry Into Other Countries?

Fri Mar 30, 2007 8:14 am

None of this is overly unusual in a place where airplanes destined to and from the area have been historically hijaked, and where people blow up cafes and busses on a regular basis. If you're single, male, young, and traveling alone, you will get extra special treatment at the airport regardless of your reasons for coming or leaving, and regardless of where your passport says you are from. As one of the above posters mentioned, being from a friendly country gets you no breaks.

This is the way security really should work, by the way. You can't trust pieces of paper exclusively. You need to be skeptical and thorough. TLV is really a wonder of efficiency when you consider the number of people who go in and out of there on a regular basis at that high level of security. Of course, if every airport had that level of security, flying would be a lot more expensive...but it'd at least be efficient and effective. Oh well.
There are 10 kinds of people in the world; those who understand binary, and those that don't.
 
domokun
Posts: 206
Joined: Sun Sep 24, 2006 5:46 pm

RE: TLV Passport Stamp: No Entry Into Other Countries?

Fri Mar 30, 2007 8:36 am

Quoting SW733 (Reply 33):
Jamesontheroad (Reply 27):
True. Any American passport holder who wants to visit Cuba can do so without worrying - passports aren't stamped at any Cuban airport, so all you have to worry about is connecting to the USA through YYZ in December and coming home with a tan

I know many people in the University where I work who have been to Cuba more than once. They always go through Mexico and haven't run into problems yet. The whole anti-Cuba policy here is... retarded. Oh-well.

Quoting Cedarjet (Reply 38):
Not me mate.

Completely agree  Smile
 
keno
Posts: 1809
Joined: Thu Feb 19, 2004 5:46 pm

RE: TLV Passport Stamp: No Entry Into Other Countries?

Fri Mar 30, 2007 2:20 pm

Quoting Semsem (Reply 34):
Tourists from all Arab and Islamic countries are allowed into Israel. Israel is encouraging tourism from Islamic countries such as Indonesia.

I've come across several tour groups from Malaysia organizing visits to Israel (specifically Jerusalem), often packaged together with Hajj/Umrah package to Mecca but this came to an abrupt end when the Intifada broke out.

Our passport explicitly mention "....all countries except Israel", so if something happens to you while in Israel, our government wont be held responsible for assistance - you may go but do it at your own risk. However, the entry point to Israel for these tour group was overland via Jordan, not by air from Tel Aviv. When I first had a passport as a child, South Africa is also in the list together with Israel but this was removed after 1994 with the end of apartheid.
 
tzadik
Posts: 152
Joined: Tue Dec 06, 2005 2:08 am

RE: TLV Passport Stamp: No Entry Into Other Countries?

Fri Mar 30, 2007 2:39 pm

Quoting EK156 (Reply 44):
And you'll also notice that is says CITIZENS AND RESIDENTS.... not people who have visited Israel

you just repeated the same thing i said... thanks for the help... the same people just with a little extra cash.
 
Type-Rated
Posts: 3901
Joined: Sun Sep 19, 1999 5:18 am

RE: TLV Passport Stamp: No Entry Into Other Countries?

Fri Mar 30, 2007 3:06 pm

This is not something new. I knew a BA F/A back in the early 80's that told me about having a separate piece of paper for Israel to stamp upon entry. She said it was for two reasons, one being not to have problems entering Islamic countries that BA served, but also in case she was ever on a hijacked aircraft terrorists could look at your passport and after seeing a Israel immigration stamp, could possibly make you an "example".
Fly North Central Airlines..The route of the Northliners!
 
CaliAtenza
Posts: 1686
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RE: TLV Passport Stamp: No Entry Into Other Countries?

Fri Mar 30, 2007 3:07 pm

So me being a Indian American Hindu...holding US Citzenship and a US passport...would i get questioned like crazy if i decided to visit Israel??? cause i mean i dont really wanna go if they are going to grille me at customs/immigration..
 
VonRichtofen
Posts: 4296
Joined: Sun Nov 05, 2000 3:10 am

RE: TLV Passport Stamp: No Entry Into Other Countries?

Fri Mar 30, 2007 6:11 pm

Quoting Evan767 (Reply 17):
Good to hear that I can travel to Dubai. Thanks guys.

Don't count on it:

Quoting Emirates029 (Reply 22):
Officially, the UAE policy is not to allow people in with Israeli stamps, but I have heard stories of people with them in their passports being allowed in. Never come across someone first hand that has though.
You'd be better off applying for a new passport without a stamp just in case.

Kris
 
AirSpare
Posts: 570
Joined: Fri Jun 30, 2006 1:13 am

RE: TLV Passport Stamp: No Entry Into Other Countries?

Fri Mar 30, 2007 7:32 pm

I have a half a dozen entry stamps into Israel, while I'm not much of a Middle East traveler, last year there were no issues for me to get into the UAE. It was harder to get into the duty free zone to work.

No problem to Egypt either, for Jews or Israel passport stamp holders.

My girlfiend (sic) met me in TLV. She is a Brasilian national, they held her at the airport for 2 hours while they cross checked our "history" by cell phone.

Israel is an odd place, security there is like being able to trust your brother, paper, contract or ID is not required, it's the word and judgement of the individual. I had a quick job to do in the Knesset and that day I happended to be without any form of ID. It was ok to enter as an Israeli vouched for me (try that in the White House!), but had to leave my camera behind. It was pretty cool seeing it from the inside, photos of Moshe Dayan and all of teh Prime Ministers (there was also a photo of Arafat) around a meeting table. So much history in one place.

Heads up on the UAE-You need a liquor liscence to buy adult beverages...Unless you can find a friendly shop, smile and say you are waiting for it and pay cash. Hotel prices will leave you dry.
Get someone else for your hero worship fetish
 
bimmerkid19
Posts: 284
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RE: TLV Passport Stamp: No Entry Into Other Countr

Fri Mar 30, 2007 8:29 pm

On another note, I have a question. This Summer when I get a stamp in my passport from Dubai,UAE, will that automatically void me from being allowed into Israel?
Last flights: LH 3738 MUC - ZRH , LH 3749 ZRH - MUC . Upcoming: EK 50 MUC - DXB 3-aug. and EK 322 DXB - ICN 7- Aug.
 
DiscoverCSG
Posts: 599
Joined: Wed Jan 31, 2007 2:22 am

RE: TLV Passport Stamp: No Entry Into Other Countries?

Fri Mar 30, 2007 10:04 pm

Quoting AirlineEcon (Reply 47):
Its not jus the Arab countries that are nasty about Isreali travel. My jewish american roommate was travelling in Israel and wanted to go to Petrah in Jordan. For his flight from Tel Aviv to Eilat, the security guys asked him the purpose of his trip to Eilat, so he told them that he was going to Jordan to visit Petra. They detained him for 2 hours in a small room and told him that maybe they would let him on the flight. 10 minutes before it left, they let him on, but wouldn't let him carry anything on his person except a passport, no watch, no wallet, nothing. He had a nice trip to Jordan. On the way back the security guy figured he was in Jordan, detained him for 2 hours again, same story with items on his person, but this time they wouldn't allow him to have any electronics in his checked bag, namely his camera, they would put it on the next flight and he could pick it up the tel aviv airport at a later.

Hmm ... this makes me wonder if security saw/heard something to make them suspicious.

But I can't blame the secuirty guys too much, he keeps shaggy hair and a beard. He looks just like that American Taliban kid.

Earlier, I posted about my trip to Israel, Egypt, Jordan, and back to Israel. At the beginning of that trip, after landing at TLV on CO, we transfered by taxi to SDV for an Israir flight to ETH for the purpose of crossing to Egypt to continue our journey. We bought one-way tickets. At SDV's living room-sized terminal, security questioned us about every aspect of our journey. I showed the agent all our hotel reservations for three weeks, all our maps, and so on and so forth. The questions kept coming and coming, but I had answers for all of them.

As it turned out, these security officers, all female and under 25, told us they were under instructions to practice their full range of questioning techniques. Since we turned up almost 3 hours early (bumper time in case of a late CO84, or exploding GE90 or whatever), they took full advantage. We didn't mind.  Wink

Quoting AirSpare (Reply 57):
My girlfiend (sic)

Priceless!!!! I'm guessing this didn't turn out so well...

Quoting Bimmerkid19 (Reply 58):
This Summer when I get a stamp in my passport from Dubai,UAE, will that automatically void me from being allowed into Israel?

Not at all. You can expect thorough, pointed, and repetitive questioning, but as long as you're legit, they'll figure that out, and you'll be allowed in.
 
Evan767
Topic Author
Posts: 2198
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RE: TLV Passport Stamp: No Entry Into Other Countries?

Sun Apr 08, 2007 3:26 am

Hi guys, sorry to bring this back up. I plan on traveling ATL-TLV-CAI-DXB-ATL. Do you guys think because I am coming from Cairo they will be a bit more lenient in Dubai? Also, will I run into any problems going from TLV-CAI? I should've posted this in the original post. Sorry.
The proper term is "on final" not "on finals" bud...
 
dutchjet
Posts: 7714
Joined: Sat Oct 14, 2000 6:13 am

RE: TLV Passport Stamp: No Entry Into Other Countries?

Sun Apr 08, 2007 3:38 am

Quoting Evan767 (Reply 60):
Hi guys, sorry to bring this back up. I plan on traveling ATL-TLV-CAI-DXB-ATL.

Now, that is an unusual itinerary......sounds like a trip that Condi Rice should be taking.

Quoting Evan767 (Reply 60):
Do you guys think because I am coming from Cairo they will be a bit more lenient in Dubai?

CAI-DXB is no problem. If Israel does not stamp your passport, then you have no issues whatsoever. The only issue is that Dubai ""technically"" can refuse entry is you passport containts a stamp from Israel (as discussed at length above)....but from what I have been told, Dubai is far too commercial and practical and does not enforce this provision.

Quoting Evan767 (Reply 60):
Also, will I run into any problems going from TLV-CAI?

Nope....I have done TLV-CAI with no problems at all.
 
JGPH1A
Posts: 15079
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RE: TLV Passport Stamp: No Entry Into Other Countries?

Sun Apr 08, 2007 3:46 am

Quoting IcLCY (Reply 3):
The UAE is too commercial to be one of the hard line countries in that region. It would only be an issue if the country being visited was Saudi, Iran, Syria, etc.

Don't bank on it though, the rule is still that passport holders with evidence of travel to Israel can be denied entry.

Quoting COERJ (Reply 13):
Many people get a stamp on a different paper, or just rip out pages in the passport.

You shouldn't rip pages out of your passport, that can render it invalid.

Quoting Xkorpyoh (Reply 16):
I crossed overland from Jordan to Israel and the immigration girl seemed offended when I asked her not to stamp it.

I've never had a problem entering Israel and requesting no stamp in my passport - each time the agent just stamps a seperate sheet of paper that you have to give to get out of the immigration area.

Be careful of the Allenby Bridge crossing from Jordan into Israel - some countries will look for the Jordanian stamp, and will deny entry if they see it, because it proves you've been to Israel.
Young and beautiful and thin and gorgeous AND BANNED ! Cya at airspaceonline.com, losers
 
Evan767
Topic Author
Posts: 2198
Joined: Wed Aug 24, 2005 10:52 am

RE: TLV Passport Stamp: No Entry Into Other Countries?

Sun Apr 08, 2007 3:56 am

Quoting Dutchjet (Reply 61):
Now, that is an unusual itinerary......sounds like a trip that Condi Rice should be taking.

Haha, we are the adventurous type!
The proper term is "on final" not "on finals" bud...
 
abrelosojos
Posts: 4322
Joined: Sun May 29, 2005 6:48 am

RE: TLV Passport Stamp: No Entry Into Other Countries?

Sun Apr 08, 2007 4:45 am

Quoting IcLCY (Reply 3):
The UAE is too commercial to be one of the hard line countries in that region. It would only be an issue if the country being visited was Saudi, Iran, Syria, etc.



Quoting COERJ (Reply 13):
Exceptions to this rule are UAE, Jordan, and Egypt, yet you may face difficulty when traveling directly from Israel depending on the destination.



Quoting Dutchjet (Reply 15):
As I mentioned above, in ""real life"" many Arab states do not enforce these rules......a friend who travels to Israel often (with lots of Israeli stamps in his passport) just flew to Dubai. I warned him about the issue and he went directly to EK and the embassy to see if there was an issue......both said it was nothing to worry about and he had no trouble entering or departing Dubai.

= Ok, I hate to be the party pooper on this but I know of at least 3 people with Israeli stamps who were denied entry to the UAE. Also, a friend of mine was scheduled to go JFK-DXB-NBO and was denied boarding at JFK when a scrutinizing EK crew found several Israeli entry/exit stamps. I am sure its up to the immigration officer, but why do you want to risk it? You dont want to be in a detained cell in the Mid East do you? Remember, UAE DOES NOT officially recognize Israel as a country. While chances are you would be fine with entry/exit stamp and non-Israeli passport to enter DXB, best not to take risks? Get a second passport.

Quoting EWRCabincrew (Reply 19):
As crew, an Israeli stamp may prevent us from entering countries, Turkey is one where we have had issues (Turkish officials made the two crew members stay on the aircraft for the layover, as they were not allowed off), when we are on trips, such as military charters. As a result, if you have an Israeli stamp in your passport, you are unable to do military charters, for risk of deportation or otherwise.

= I am surprised because Turkey has diplomatic relations with Israel and is a pretty progressive country.

Quoting Parisien (Reply 26):
Are you sure Indonesia does not recognize israeli passports ? I plan to travel with a friend who holds an Israle passport...whereas I can get the visa on arrival, he has (this is information from a website) to apply to the consulate before departure and because of the passport he has, the consulate would have to get approval rather than the routine procedure of visa issuance. In other words, it may take longer and less convenient but israeli passport holders can still travel to Indonesia ?!?!?

= Yes. This is the correct information. The following countries not only need a visa obtained from the Embassy, but also would have to have the visas pre-approved by the Directorate of Immigration in Jakarta.

Passport holders from the following countries must obtain permission from the Directorate General of Immigration before applying for an Indonesian visa:

Afghanistan
Albania
Angola
Bangladesh
Cameroon
Cuba
Ethiopia
Ghana
Iraq
Israel
Nigeria
North Korea
Pakistan
Somalia
Sri Lanka
Tanzania
Tonga


Quoting CaliAtenza (Reply 55):
So me being a Indian American Hindu...holding US Citzenship and a US passport...would i get questioned like crazy if i decided to visit Israel??? cause i mean i dont really wanna go if they are going to grille me at customs/immigration..

= Probably not ... though, you would probably get friendlier response with an Indian passport  Smile ... remember, half of Israel (especially youngsters at TLV) have spent a considerable amount of time in India after their army days. I remember going on a business trip with 2 Indian colleagues and it was very amusing ... I got grilled because of my Liectenstein passport (the whole German connection) and my Indian colleagues were joked around with sprinkling words of Hindi.

Cheers,
A.
Live, and let live.
 
Emirates029
Posts: 173
Joined: Sun Mar 25, 2007 4:13 am

RE: TLV Passport Stamp: No Entry Into Other Countries?

Sun Apr 08, 2007 4:51 am

Quoting Abrelosojos (Reply 64):
. I got grilled because of my Liectenstein passport (the whole German connection) and my Indian colleagues were joked around with sprinkling words of Hindi.

Cheers,
A.

...there are Lichtensteinian passports?? Is Lictenstein part of the EU?
 
abrelosojos
Posts: 4322
Joined: Sun May 29, 2005 6:48 am

RE: TLV Passport Stamp: No Entry Into Other Countries?

Sun Apr 08, 2007 5:09 am

Quoting Emirates029 (Reply 65):
...there are Lichtensteinian passports?? Is Lictenstein part of the EU?

= Oh my God, are you serious?!?! I don't know if you know this ... but Liechtenstein (and not the spelling you have) is an independent country ... and as far as I know, that entitles us to our own passports  Smile. We are not part of the EU ... but our average income is higher than 55K (UK is like 30K) ... so things are good. Come visit!



Cheers,
A.
Live, and let live.
 
nzrich
Posts: 1105
Joined: Mon Dec 05, 2005 9:51 pm

RE: TLV Passport Stamp: No Entry Into Other Countries?

Sun Apr 08, 2007 5:19 am

Quoting COERJ (Reply 13):

Many people get a stamp on a different paper, or just rip out pages in the passport.

If you rip out a page in your passport this will give you MORE troubles at immigration as they will be wondering what you have tried to hide on that page ..I strongly suggest you never rip any page out of your passport
"Pride of the pacific"
 
Evan767
Topic Author
Posts: 2198
Joined: Wed Aug 24, 2005 10:52 am

RE: TLV Passport Stamp: No Entry Into Other Countries?

Sun Apr 08, 2007 5:27 am

If I call up the UAE Embassy in Washington D.C. do you think they will be able to help me?
The proper term is "on final" not "on finals" bud...
 
dutchjet
Posts: 7714
Joined: Sat Oct 14, 2000 6:13 am

RE: TLV Passport Stamp: No Entry Into Other Countries?

Sun Apr 08, 2007 5:34 am

Quoting Evan767 (Reply 68):
If I call up the UAE Embassy in Washington D.C. do you think they will be able to help me?

Start calling......you have research to do, this was suggested over a week ago when you first posted.
 
Emirates029
Posts: 173
Joined: Sun Mar 25, 2007 4:13 am

RE: TLV Passport Stamp: No Entry Into Other Countries?

Sun Apr 08, 2007 6:44 am

Quoting Abrelosojos (Reply 66):
= Oh my God, are you serious?!?! I don't know if you know this ... but Liechtenstein (and not the spelling you have) is an independent country ... and as far as I know, that entitles us to our own passports Smile. We are not part of the EU ... but our average income is higher than 55K (UK is like 30K) ... so things are good. Come visit!

Ive been to Liechtenstein, very nice place, if a little small Big grin I remember there being a little shop where you could pay a small amount to get a special Liechtenstein stamp, wish I'd got it now!
Dunno for some reason I assumed people there would have Swiss passports, not Liechtensteinian ones!
 
stylo777
Posts: 2809
Joined: Mon Feb 13, 2006 7:32 pm

RE: TLV Passport Stamp: No Entry Into Other Countries?

Mon Apr 09, 2007 9:44 pm

another question which has not been discussed here.

what about people living for example in Germany and citizens of Germany with a German passport were born in TLV or Israel. Will they get into trouble while entering 'non-Israeli' countries? I mean, they don't have any stamps of TLV, but they were born in Israel.
 
Emirates029
Posts: 173
Joined: Sun Mar 25, 2007 4:13 am

RE: TLV Passport Stamp: No Entry Into Other Countries?

Tue Apr 10, 2007 12:13 am

Should be fine. I know someone that hasn't had any problems even though he was born in Israel.
 
BigTom
Posts: 516
Joined: Sun Dec 10, 2006 6:51 pm

RE: TLV Passport Stamp: No Entry Into Other Countr

Tue Apr 10, 2007 12:50 am

I hear that people manage to get in on business visas sponsored by their associates in DXB, but I've heard of many who are denied entry only because of an Israeli stamp. Best get another document or the Israeli stamp on another document. I also know of Israeli nationals who have visited the UAE as part of official delegations (eg the IMF-World Bank meet and the recent IRU congress).

Cheers

[Edited 2007-04-09 17:53:16]
 
airways1
Posts: 538
Joined: Mon Jul 19, 1999 3:05 am

RE: TLV Passport Stamp: No Entry Into Other Countries?

Tue Apr 10, 2007 10:05 am

I have an Israeli stamp in my passport and I have had no trouble getting into Dubai, Abu Dhabi, Indonesia, Malaysia or Afghanistan since then.

The other thing to consider is how often do immigration officers actually check your passport in that much detail? Especially if you have lots of stamps and visas from other countries, a single Israeli stamp might be quite inconspicuous.
 
domokun
Posts: 206
Joined: Sun Sep 24, 2006 5:46 pm

RE: TLV Passport Stamp: No Entry Into Other Countries?

Tue Apr 10, 2007 10:11 am

While this thread is dieing a slow death, it seems like nations need to pay more attention to other pressing matters than fleeting visa issues...
 
keno
Posts: 1809
Joined: Thu Feb 19, 2004 5:46 pm

RE: TLV Passport Stamp: No Entry Into Other Countries?

Tue Apr 10, 2007 2:52 pm

Quoting Emirates029 (Reply 70):
Dunno for some reason I assumed people there would have Swiss passports, not Liechtensteinian ones!

Liechtenstein has joint immigration, customs and monetary union with Switzerland so I wouldn't be too surprised if some people think they have joint passport too.
 
kiwiandrew

RE: TLV Passport Stamp: No Entry Into Other Countries?

Tue Apr 10, 2007 3:25 pm

Interestingly enough when I was in Iran last year I found that there is an exemption for the local Iranian Jewish community who are permitted to travel to Israel even though Iran doesn't actually recognise the countries existence - I am not sure which surprised me more , the exemption , or the fact that there is an Iranian Jewish community .


I guess if I was going to Israel I would probably go for either the 'no stamp' option , or , just make sure that I used my British passport for Israel and stick to my New Zealand passport for everywhere else in the region ( actually , bearing in mind that my NZ passport contains an Iranian visa I wonder whether I would even get into Israel on it - I am pretty sure that I would get a lengthy grilling at the least )
 
DiscoverCSG
Posts: 599
Joined: Wed Jan 31, 2007 2:22 am

RE: TLV Passport Stamp: No Entry Into Other Countries?

Wed Apr 11, 2007 1:31 am

Quoting Airways1 (Reply 74):
a single Israeli stamp might be quite inconspicuous.

I've entered/left Israel with stamps from four different officials, all of them in a distinctive green ink. Does Israel use any other color? None of the other countries I've visited in Europe/NA/the MidEast use it - is such green ink unique to Israel? If so, it would seem to make other countries' guards' jobs easier in keeping out visitors who've been to Israel.
 
jwenting
Posts: 9973
Joined: Mon Apr 23, 2001 10:12 pm

RE: TLV Passport Stamp: No Entry Into Other Countries?

Wed Apr 11, 2007 2:31 am

Quoting COERJ (Reply 13):
or just rip out pages in the passport.

which is incredibly stupid as it make the passport itself invalid and you could theoretically be denied entry back into your own country when doing this or at the very least face a hefty fine.
Other countries will also often deny entry to people with damaged passports.
I wish I were flying
 
PADSpot
Posts: 1637
Joined: Sat Jan 15, 2005 11:31 pm

RE: TLV Passport Stamp: No Entry Into Other Countries?

Wed Apr 11, 2007 4:16 am

Quoting COERJ (Reply 13):
or just rip out pages in the passport.



Quoting JGPH1A (Reply 62):
You shouldn't rip pages out of your passport, that can render it invalid.



Quoting Jwenting (Reply 79):
which is incredibly stupid as it make the passport itself invalid and you could theoretically be denied entry back into your own country when doing this or at the very least face a hefty fine.
Other countries will also often deny entry to people with damaged passports.

Ripping out pages is stupid thing to in passports that have numbered pages. The numbers are not to facilitate reading like in a book, but to swiftly check it for manipulation. However, there are countries who have a rather lax handling of passports. India for example. I've got an Indian friend whose passport looks rather interesting. Indian authorities just stapled a new empty passport (w/o the ID-card) in the back of his old one, when it was full. They did that two or three times. He also ripped an Israeli stamp out of the passport, when he traveled from Dubai to Iran (apparently it was not a problem to enter Dubai with that stamp?!). Meanwhile it looks like a 1cm thick book. It really tells a story ...
 
abrelosojos
Posts: 4322
Joined: Sun May 29, 2005 6:48 am

RE: TLV Passport Stamp: No Entry Into Other Countries?

Wed Apr 11, 2007 4:35 am

Quoting Emirates029 (Reply 70):
I remember there being a little shop where you could pay a small amount to get a special Liechtenstein stamp, wish I'd got it now!

= Let me know when you are around. I will take you to the shop. I took a friend last time and think it was either 1,50 or 3,50.

Quoting KEno (Reply 76):
Liechtenstein has joint immigration, customs and monetary union with Switzerland so I wouldn't be too surprised if some people think they have joint passport too.

= Well, we have our own passport  Smile. And trust me, travelling with a LIE passport is an amazing experience. I could write a book on the questions I have got and the confused looks.

-A.
Live, and let live.
 
[email protected]
Posts: 16616
Joined: Sat Jan 13, 2001 6:29 pm

RE: TLV Passport Stamp: No Entry Into Other Countries?

Wed Apr 11, 2007 4:40 am

Quoting TodaReisinger (Reply 4):
if you don't want your passport to be stamped you have to tell it.

I'm sitting here thinking about you telling your passport that you don't want it to be stamped. I know you're Swiss, but that's really no excuse.  Silly
"Everyone writing for the Telegraph knows that the way to grab eyeballs is with Ryanair and/or sex."

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