Inflight Death On LH 450 FRA-LAX, 7/28/07

zrs70 · Sun Jul 29, 2007 10:20 am

How sad this was....

Flew FRA-LAX on LH 450 in F. (Loved the FRA terminal). Interesting how things happen. We met two ladies on the ride from the terminal to the plane. Mother and daughter. Mother was 92. They were going to the funeral of another daughter. A parent should never have to outlive a child. As we climbed the stairs to the jetway, we marvelled at what good shape the 92 year old was in.

Flight began superbly. About 5.5 hours in, I noticed that many people were looking over at the old lady. Indeed, she died in her sleep on the flight.

How sad for the suriving daughter, who now is facing two deaths in her family.

They covered the body with a white sheet. The daughter placed roses on top. There was a limited meal service given the circumstances.

At LAX, we pulled up to the remote gate 208. The F cabin was asked to remain onboard. LAPD arrived and itnerviewed us. Then we were released.

May this family find peace and goodness through one another.

skoker · Sun Jul 29, 2007 10:39 am

It happens. Somebody died while I was visiting at the nursing home today.

I don't see why people find this so fascinating and feel the need to make a thread here every time it happens. Although, I will note that it is very unlike LH to limit the meal service in a case like this.

RIHNOSAUR · Sun Jul 29, 2007 10:39 am

My best thoughts go out to the relatives involved.

92 is certainly a long life and there is so much you can learn from people that have live through so much, that is why I always try to pay my respect for the elderly.
That is quite an experience for you Zrs70, Thanks for sharing with us, it certainly makes you think and reflect about many things.

bigphilnyc · Sun Jul 29, 2007 10:41 am

Very sad to hear. Considering how long flights are and how often people do it, this is unfortunately fairly common.

I know of a flight from the US where a woman who had cancer was on her way to go to her homeland to spend the rest of her limited days. She never made it there and died ont he flight. Very sad.

boeing743 · Sun Jul 29, 2007 10:44 am

Thank for info but this is not proper place to share it. We needs to respect many stranger's privacy grief rather than announce on A.net.

I has great uncle that is still alive at age of 96, my grandmother 94 this sept, my great aunt 91 and two grandmother 88 will be 89, one in Dec and one in Jan. I try to see them much as I can but I do not deal with death very good especially for them that I am very closer to.

zrs70 · Sun Jul 29, 2007 10:52 am

Folks,

I am not writing about what happened to me. I'm writing about what happened to the woman on her way to her sister's funeral. Deaths on planes happen all the time. Part of life. But a death on the way to a funeral, that's horrific for a family.

georgebush · Sun Jul 29, 2007 11:02 am

Quoting Skoker (Reply 1):
I don't see why people find this so fascinating and feel the need to make a thread here every time it happens. Although, I will note that it is very unlike LH to limit the meal service in a case like this.

Cuz you know getting your $10 fish and green beans is way more important than the fact that someone died... People make me sick sometimes.

LHUSA · Sun Jul 29, 2007 11:03 am

How do you feel LH handled the situation? If I remember correctly, some airlines were recently criticized for the way the handled deaths during flight.

zrs70 · Sun Jul 29, 2007 11:30 am

LH was extremely professional during the flight. And the entire cabin truly came forward with love and support. As a rabbi, I offered whatever I could on a spiritual level to both the daughter and the flight crew.

WildcatYXU · Sun Jul 29, 2007 11:55 am

I really feel for the family of the deceased old lady. May she rest in peace. It is very interesting how air travel can aggravate health problems people have. The result may be so sad as in this case.

On the other hand, 92 years old, flying in F cabin, in sleep - this is certainly the way I'd like to die.

IADLHR · Sun Jul 29, 2007 12:25 pm

Going to your daughters funeral, at the age of 92, on the other side of the world is stress on top of stress. It is serious stress. When my grandmother passed away at the age of 95, she had already buried all her siblings, husband, 2 daughters and a grandaughter.To one of those funerals, her daughter, she had to fly. Let me tell you it was an ordeal but she did it and that was only from CLE-DEN. What I learned from her about always having a positive attitude, after my mother died at a young age, is incredible.

APFPilot1985 · Sun Jul 29, 2007 12:36 pm

Quoting Boeing743 (Reply 4):
Thank for info but this is not proper place to share it. We needs to respect many stranger's privacy grief rather than announce on A.net.

Yes, because it is a huge intrusion of privacy to talk about this on anet, with no flight number, names, times or dates.

Quoting Georgebush (Reply 6):
Cuz you know getting your $10 fish and green beans is way more important than the fact that someone died... People make me sick sometimes.

Listen I paid for the food I want it. How does someones passing change the need to serve meals.

georgebush · Sun Jul 29, 2007 12:37 pm

Quoting APFPilot1985 (Reply 11):
Listen I paid for the food I want it. How does someones passing change the need to serve meals.

Honestly would you feel like eating sitting behind a corpse? I would be too shocked to eat.

bcoz · Sun Jul 29, 2007 12:51 pm

Godspeed to the gentlewoman and her family.

It sounds as though the LH crew and the rest of the passengers handled the situation with class and dignity. A tip of the cap to them for doing so.

A friend of mine experienced a similar thing coming back to college after Christmas break in, I think, early 2000. A gentleman sitting near him on a UA 727 from ORD to STL suffered a heart attack and passed away. That was before the aircraft departed and they returned to the gate.

bcoz

dl767captain · Sun Jul 29, 2007 1:18 pm

Its a terrible thing that seems to be happening more often and will continue to happen as flights grow longer, it seems like planes should have somewhere to put the person when something like this happens instead of leaving them in the cabin, its just creapy. i know some airline had (or rumored to have) bins for a person but thats just strange so is there some way to bring them into a special cargo area below the plane or somewhere else in the plane clear away from others so as not to offend others.

eoinnz · Sun Jul 29, 2007 3:36 pm

Quoting APFPilot1985 (Reply 11):
Yes, because it is a huge intrusion of privacy to talk about this on anet, with no flight number, names, times or dates.

Everyone of those things apart from the names is in the title of this thread.

That aside still not a big intrusion on privacy - it's only natural to talk about things like this. It's not like it's printed all over the front page of a paper like flights in the past where people have died on board. I certainly wouldn't want that.

Ansett767 · Sun Jul 29, 2007 3:46 pm

God, will the LOT of you who like ot bitch/ cast judgement SHUT UP!! It is HIGHLY annoying.

Everyone is entitled to their own free speech on such a forum!And to the people who think it's not the place to share it, and who then rant on and post cr*p about their own families.... thats just RICH!

May the elderly lady RIP, the poor daughter who has 2 deaths to deal with now. Very sad story indeed but sounds like it was handled well by LH.

EDICHC · Sun Jul 29, 2007 9:45 pm

Quoting DL767captain (Reply 14):
Its a terrible thing that seems to be happening more often and will continue to happen as flights grow longer, it seems like planes should have somewhere to put the person when something like this happens instead of leaving them in the cabin, its just creapy. i know some airline had (or rumored to have) bins for a person but thats just strange so is there some way to bring them into a special cargo area below the plane or somewhere else in the plane clear away from others so as not to offend others.

SQ have a facility for storing a corpse on their 747 & 777's not sure if they have this feature on their Airbus fleet. Where it is located I couldn't tell you.

I'm not so certain that the apparrent increase in such sad events is truly related to long duration. Far more people are flying today than say 20 years ago. It is logical therfore to interpret that the number of in-flight deaths will proportionally increase.

RIP to the elderly lady. Passing away while sleeping in F at 37,000ft, if I could choose the manner of my departure from this world that way would be up there. So sad though for her family though given they were travelling to a funeral at the time. Condolences to them all whoever they are.

brokenrecord · Sun Jul 29, 2007 9:49 pm

That definitely sucks, but as was mentioned, dying in the F cabin on an LH heavy would be a good place to go.

ltbewr · Sun Jul 29, 2007 10:28 pm

It is sad when people die, even if they are elderly and during an airline flight. Yes, some kinda joke here that they would like to die in 1st class on a long airline flight in their old age, but as noted in the original post, it did mean others had to deal with her dead body being there and delays for the other F class pax in leaving the aircraft when arrived in LAX to do the necessary police investigation. From what info we have here, LH did the best they could under the circumstances to minimise the issues other F class pax would feel for having a dead person among them. Different people will disagree on how this situation was or how they would have preferred for it to have been handled, but that has been argued many times here on these fourms. That the decision was made to continue the flight to it's planned destination meant not screwing up the lives of 100's of others on that flight. Also, most probably her flight was going to a destination where there were other relatives of the woman that could make the necessary arrangements with a lot less hassle if they had diverted during the fight.
As to the issue of privacy in posting about this, the death did happen on an airline flight with others around and the poster didn't post the name of the dead person.
That the poster is a Rabbi suggests he is someone who has to deal with the deaths of others frequently and I would assume he prayed for the dead woman and her family and offered his condolences to any companion with the woman and may have offered to any other pax spiritual counseling.

robffm2 · Sun Jul 29, 2007 11:02 pm

Quoting EDICHC (Reply 17):

SQ have a facility for storing a corpse on their 747 & 777's not sure if they have this feature on their Airbus fleet. Where it is located I couldn't tell you.

I'm not sure how it would be possible to "handle a dead corpse" with the necessary respect and dignity on a fully loaded plane. That body would have to be taken out of the seat, put into a bag/casket, carried through the plane, likely some stairs down....

(and sorry for the rather technical term "handle", I don't know a better one)

bh4007 · Sun Jul 29, 2007 11:56 pm

As sad as this particular case is, the truth of the matter is that deaths inflight happen all the time and are a weekly occurance at many airports. Does this particular case really need a dedicated thread?

zrs70 · Mon Jul 30, 2007 12:34 am

For those doubters as to why a new thread, let me ask the following:

How often are there threads on turbulence in flight? Should we have a new thread every time it happens?
How often does an airline start a new route? Why post it if they happen often?
How often is there rude behavior in-flight? Why report it?
How often have we seen trip reports with photos of the sun setting over the airplane wing?

We write about it because we care about aviation.

I wrote about this because it is truly a sad incident that can hopefully make each of us just a little more sensitive people.

smcmac32msn · Mon Jul 30, 2007 12:44 am

Quoting APFPilot1985 (Reply 11):
Quoting Boeing743 (Reply 4):
Thank for info but this is not proper place to share it. We needs to respect many stranger's privacy grief rather than announce on A.net.

Yes, because it is a huge intrusion of privacy to talk about this on anet, with no flight number, names, times or dates.

So are you against newspaper obituaries too, Boeing743?

semsem · Mon Jul 30, 2007 1:32 am

Zrs70 thank you for posting the story. I find it interesting. My aunt is 93 and refuses to take long trips or even go on a plane. The stress must have contributed. Anyway it's a beautiful way to die in one's sleep.

[Edited 2007-07-29 18:35:58]

bcoz · Mon Jul 30, 2007 1:38 am

Quoting DL767captain (Reply 14):
i know some airline had (or rumored to have) bins for a person but thats just strange so is there some way to bring them into a special cargo area below the plane or somewhere else in the plane clear away from others so as not to offend others.

I'm not sure that it would be the right policy for crew to move a deceased passenger. While it is obvious in this case that the gentlewoman died peacefully in her sleep, that may not always be the case. As Zrs70 mentioned, LAPD interviewed the surrounding passengers (and I imagine much of the crew) at LAX. Their job, I'm sure, was to make certain that this was indeed a natural death and that there was no foul play involved.

Not to sound too CSI about it, but moving a deceased person like that distrubs the scene.

Just some thoughts...

bcoz

Dazed767 · Mon Jul 30, 2007 2:40 am

Quoting Georgebush (Reply 6):
Cuz you know getting your $10 fish and green beans is way more important than the fact that someone died... People make me sick sometimes.

I don't think he was bitching about the limited meal service, but why should the other 300+ passengers not eat?

I've had an elderly man pass on one of my flights, I can't imagine how traumatic it must be for the family member(s) that are with them.

PYP757 · Mon Jul 30, 2007 3:31 am

Quoting Ansett767 (Reply 16):
God, will the LOT of you who like ot bitch/ cast judgement SHUT UP!! It is HIGHLY annoying.

100% in agreement with you on this one!
Why do some people always have to complain about threads being redundant or not interesting?
Then why do they bother reading them, let alone respond to them? There are enough other threads to read if they want. Some of us find this kind of thread relevant and important - please respect that.

A330300 · Mon Jul 30, 2007 4:26 am

Very interesting that you posted this -

I work for Frontier in SJC and we had a family of 4 who had flown from VRN-FRA-LAX-SJC - and on board LH 450. Their travel agent had booked them to San Jose, California instead of San Jose del Cabo, Baja Mexico (SJD). We were trying to find them tickets to SJD when they mentioned that the death on board the flight had kind of set the trip off to a bad start!

We were able to help them buy tickets on AA into SJD...

zrs70 · Mon Jul 30, 2007 5:22 am

Quoting A330300 (Reply 28):
Very interesting that you posted this -

I work for Frontier in SJC and we had a family of 4 who had flown from VRN-FRA-LAX-SJC - and on board LH 450. Their travel agent had booked them to San Jose, California instead of San Jose del Cabo, Baja Mexico (SJD). We were trying to find them tickets to SJD when they mentioned that the death on board the flight had kind of set the trip off to a bad start!

We were able to help them buy tickets on AA into SJD...

Yes, a very nice family. They were sitting next to us. The father is the one who first realized the lady had died. They were in a hurry to make that connection, especially as we all had to remain on the flight.

awthompson · Mon Jul 30, 2007 8:05 am

Quoting Georgebush (Reply 12):
Honestly would you feel like eating sitting behind a corpse? I would be too shocked to eat.

It's not very nice but here's the way I look at that kind of situation; life at best is very short and the older one gets the more one realizes this. It's better to get a little hardened to death since it will be easier to cope with when we lose our loved ones and indeed face death ourselves. Enough said on that. Just my immediate thoughts and hopefully good advice.

This event reminds me of once at London Heathrow in my spotting days when to our delight a Lufthansa Boeing 747 showed up on final for R10L (as it was back then - now R09L) under a transatlantic flight number. The reg was D-ABYR. It taxied to terminal one where it stopped for an hour and a half before departing on it's way. Later we heard that the diversion was the result of a man having a heart attack on board however he sadly passed away just as the plane touched down at LHR. I have a few shots of the aircraft that day including one of it landing albeit black and white and I was thinking recently of perhaps posting one of them on this website along with the story. I read a comment recently about how rare DLH 747's were at LHR and some might find it interesting if it was accepted by the screeners (quality not great.)

AY104 · Mon Jul 30, 2007 8:07 am

Quoting Boeing743 (Reply 4):
Thank for info but this is not proper place to share it. We needs to respect many stranger's privacy grief rather than announce on A.net.

Quite the contrary. I think that the story told, especially how Zrs70 met the lady and her daughter, is a wonderful tribute to the deceased. I realize that it does happen, and death can come at anytime, anywhere. However, it is sad for the younger lady to have to now face two deaths. I am quite certain that if she knew about this posting, and read it, she would find it a very appropriate tribute to the elderly lady, and would also appreciate the compassion shown for her situation. This is not an announcement of death, it is a sharing of grief by someone who sounds to me to be a very compassionate individual.

Cheers,
AY104

ContnlEliteCMH · Mon Jul 30, 2007 8:53 am

Quoting Georgebush (Reply 12):
Honestly would you feel like eating sitting behind a corpse? I would be too shocked to eat.

Sure! I'd have no problem eating while sitting behind a corpse. Now, if the corpse were a family member or a friend, I might have no appetite, but the corpse's presence wouldn't bother me. I'd have a *lot* more trouble eating were the lav disgorging its contents into the aisle, as happened on a flight a short while ago. Now THAT is disgusting.

lostturttle · Mon Jul 30, 2007 9:13 am

Quoting Zrs70 (Reply 22):
For those doubters as to why a new thread, let me ask the following:

How often are there threads on turbulence in flight? Should we have a new thread every time it happens?
How often does an airline start a new route? Why post it if they happen often?
How often is there rude behavior in-flight? Why report it?
How often have we seen trip reports with photos of the sun setting over the airplane wing?

We write about it because we care about aviation.

I wrote about this because it is truly a sad incident that can hopefully make each of us just a little more sensitive people.

I travel about 5 or 6 times a year, and have never had the misfortune to witness this kind of event. The whole process of getting to a destination by way of air travel is so stressful now days! Thank you for sharing your experience with us.
Oh and as far as I am concerned, you are correct. quote "We write about it because we care about aviation." Thats why I joined this forum.

Adding you to my respected users list!

pnwtraveler · Mon Jul 30, 2007 2:33 pm

My grandfather had a series of minor strokes in Florida when he was visiting there, the first one happening as he was rushing to return his rental car at the airport. A few days later he actually checked himself out of the hospital against the wishes of the doctors so he could fly home for a funeral of an exbusiness partner. He used a regularly scheduled flight but sprang for a first class upgrade. He was a wealthy man but usually lived pretty frugally. And of course he didn't tell the airline about his condition. Somewhere over the northern states a gentleman on the other side of first class had a heart attack. The plane diverted and landed in one of the Dakotas. Unfortunately the gentleman died. My grandfather was sitting there on a now much extended flight when he shouldn't have been. After over an hour or so the plane took off and flew to Edmonton. He felt so badly he had my grandmother drive him from the airport to the directly to the hospital. His Doctor, a family friend, went ballistic when my grandfather told him what he did. Altitude was not something he should have chanced until he was more stable. His condition was much worse for his choices and he unfortunately never made the business associates funeral.

Analog · Mon Jul 30, 2007 2:58 pm

Quoting Bcoz (Reply 25):
I'm not sure that it would be the right policy for crew to move a deceased passenger.

It certainly is the right policy if the deceased passenger is seated next to someone who does not want to be sitting next to the deceased, especially on a full aircraft.

Quoting Zrs70 (Reply 5):
Cuz you know getting your $10 fish and green beans is way more important than the fact that someone died... People make me sick sometimes.

Does wanting to get the food that you paid for change the fact that someone died, or is wanting to eat on a 10hr+ flight somehow disrespectful of the deceased?

awthompson · Mon Jul 30, 2007 10:39 pm

Quoting Lostturttle (Reply 33):
"We write about it because we care about aviation." Thats why I joined this forum.

Thats what it's all about, sharing our experiences and stimulating conversation Smile

zrs70 · Fri Aug 03, 2007 5:03 am

Quoting Analog (Reply 35):
Does wanting to get the food that you paid for change the fact that someone died, or is wanting to eat on a 10hr+ flight somehow disrespectful of the deceased?

Perhaps because I am so often surrounded by death as part of my job, I am more immune to these things. But I always council others to continue life in the face of death....

fllcontinental · Fri Aug 03, 2007 5:31 am

Quoting Ansett767 (Reply 16):
God, will the LOT of you who like ot bitch/ cast judgement SHUT UP!! It is HIGHLY annoying.

Everyone is entitled to their own free speech on such a forum!And to the people who think it's not the place to share it, and who then rant on and post cr*p about their own families.... thats just RICH!

So maybe it should be in the Non-Aviation section as the only aviation related thing seems to be where she died. Have some respect for people's privacy.

Who is online

Popular Searches On Airliners.net