What If? B6 Moving to IWA from PHX.....

CactusOne · Mon Jul 30, 2007 1:24 pm

with the great inflight service that B6 offers (personal entertainments etc), wouldn't it be a great money maker if B6 moved to Williams Field out in East Mesa, AZ and used it as a focus city to NYC, BOS, SJC, OAK, SFO, SMF, SEA, LGB, BUR, ONT, DEN, SLC & LAS and even MX resort cities? They would really have a superior product over both US & WN

itsnotfinals · Mon Jul 30, 2007 1:32 pm

B6 already uses PHX for flight to JFK, why would they move to IWA?

You might want to change the name of your post, it sounds like you are implying they are moving to IWA, or that they don't serve Phoenix at all.

It would be cool if they moved to IWA, but Air Tran also had a chance to go to IWA and chose PHX also.]

Jet Blue is also under a new CEO and they are slowing their growth this year, no big expansions can happen for them until 2009 at least

[Edited 2007-07-30 06:51:19]

asuflyer05 · Mon Jul 30, 2007 2:38 pm

I think it will be a while before IWA takes any large steps to expanding airline offerings. Though if they don't do it soon the NIMBYs moving into Gilbert, East Mesa, and Queen Creek may prevent any future growth.

GARUDAROD · Mon Jul 30, 2007 3:32 pm

If anybody will seriously consider service to IWA, my guess is it would be Skybus.
That is just their kind of market. A little used airport outside the limits of a big city.

EA CO AS · Mon Jul 30, 2007 4:35 pm

Quoting Itsnotfinals (Reply 1):
You might want to change the name of your post, it sounds like you are implying they are moving to IWA

IWA may eventually pick up some reliever traffic to PHX, but not from any of the majors. Not for awhile anyway - it'd be too costly to run service there while cannibalizing traffic you already have to/from PHX.

Wait for the population of IWA's catchment area to grow a bit along with the infrastructure and then it's a possibility - provided, as was said earlier, that the NIMBYs who bought all new homes in Gilbert, Queen Creek, East Mesa etc don't rise up and throw a hissyfit.

itsnotfinals · Mon Jul 30, 2007 10:57 pm

Quoting Asuflyer05 (Reply 2):
NIMBYs moving into Gilbert, East Mesa, and Queen Creek

The airport did a study recently and had a very positive response from NIMBY's ! Anyone who has sat on I-10 or 202 trying to get to PHX for a Monday morning flight would agree, IWA would be the way to go.

The IWA Airport board just refused 2 residential development by IWA and restricted the area to Commercial development only, they are being very smart about keeping issues from NIMBY's down to a minimum which is very smart.

Quoting EA CO AS (Reply 4):
Wait for the population of IWA's catchment area

It's already over 500K for people closer ro IWA than PHX. with Maricopa county now the 3rd largest county in the US with over 3 Million people and the city larger than PHL now, IWA should be a reality soon, just not for any existing major.

AirframeAS · Tue Jul 31, 2007 12:04 am

Quoting EA CO AS (Reply 4):
IWA may eventually pick up some reliever traffic to PHX, but not from any of the majors.

IWA is having problems trying to attract commercial service from the regular airlines that normally fly into PHX. It might happen sometime within the next 20 years. Just not now.

I do support making IWA a secondary airport to relieve PHX of some congestion. If it works with MDW/ORD, it should work here!

JetBlueGuy2006 · Tue Jul 31, 2007 12:13 am

If Allegiant decides to start serving the area, will they use IWA as the focus city instead of PHX?

itsnotfinals · Tue Jul 31, 2007 12:36 am

Quoting JetBlueGuy2006 (Reply 7):
If Allegiant decides to start serving the area, will they use IWA as the focus city instead of PHX?

Alligent already has service to IWA a whopping 1 flight every 45 days or so that is a charter to Laughlin, NV/Bullhead City, AZ for gambling trips.

They have been doing this a few years now so they much not think IWA has much more to offer for them unfortunately.

Humberside · Tue Jul 31, 2007 12:57 am

There is Vision Airlines of course to North Las Vegas twice a week, and possibly Long Beach in the future. Failed scheduled charter airlines Western and the one that was based in Gary have also used IWA recently

chumley · Tue Jul 31, 2007 1:40 am

I definitely think that SkyBus is coming. Seems like a natural fit for them. But... There are 75 daily flights from PHX to LA-area airports on 4 airlines (US, DL, UA, WN) (I counted today's flights ... 0540 first, 2151 last). A couple of those flights are codeshares, so actual departures may be a few less.

Either way, there's a flight to the LA area every 15 minutes.

I think somebody could put regular service from IWA to LAX with several (4-5?) frequencies and be successful.

There's plenty of population and the north-Mesa/Gold Canyon area has plenty of affluent customers. Not to mention business connections in the east valley from Boeing, Intel, Motorola, etc.

Would F9 consider it with their RJs? They seem to be moving away from exclusively using DEN as a hub.

itsnotfinals · Tue Jul 31, 2007 1:53 am

F9 already has 7 flights a day to DEN from PHX and also their code share partner FL also chose PHX so I think we can write off F9 doing anything at IWA unfortunately.

Flighty · Tue Jul 31, 2007 1:54 am

Well, it is not like PHX is so crowded and delay prone. It is also closer to Scottsdale. If B6 wants to run a focus city, PHX might be the place. But WN and US would tag-team B6 into submission pretty fast.

IWA provides them some insulation, but in reality very little. Without a hub, it would be hard to underprice US on one hand and WN on the other.

crjflyer35 · Tue Jul 31, 2007 3:12 am

Quoting Humberside (Reply 9):
one that was based in Gary have also used IWA recently

I think you may be referring to SkyValue (operated by Excel Airways IIRC) They are planning on restarting service, from what I've heard/read, in the fall / winter timeframe as loads were promising with all the snowbirds traveling back and forth. My Aunt and Uncle who have 6 kids flew out in Feb. with all 8 of them and had nothing but praise.

PH-TVH · Tue Jul 31, 2007 3:15 am

Dont think IWA would have the infrastructure to support full commercial operations.
Runways enough though, with instrument approaches only on 30C but enough possibilities for sidestep manouvres (common at IWA), it maybe work... In the future...

Maybe in the near future we will see some low cost airlines using it as an alternative for PHX, but full commercial operations has still a loooong way to go.

AirframeAS · Tue Jul 31, 2007 3:18 am

Quoting PH-TVH (Reply 14):
Dont think IWA would have the infrastructure to support full commercial operations.

Yes they do. They have a terminal here with the TSA here as well. The only thing they do not have is an immigrantation hall.

chumley · Tue Jul 31, 2007 3:51 am

I just pulled up their website: http://www.flywga.org/ and notice that their flights (Horizon and Allegiant) list AZA as the airport code. I thought it was IWA?

Quoting Crjflyer35 (Reply 13):
I think you may be referring to SkyValue (operated by Excel Airways IIRC) They are planning on restarting service, from what I've heard/read, in the fall / winter timeframe as loads were promising with all the snowbirds traveling back and forth.

Yes, SkyValue website http://www.flyskyvalue.com/ indicates that summer flights were canceled, but looks to restart service for the winter.

xjet · Tue Jul 31, 2007 3:54 am

Anyone think XE would be a good candidate for IWA?

itsnotfinals · Tue Jul 31, 2007 3:57 am

Quoting Crjflyer35 (Reply 13):
Excel Airways IIRC

Xtra Airways operated the flights for Sky Value.

arizonaguy · Tue Jul 31, 2007 4:00 am

http://www.azcentral.com/news/articles/0730gr-newairline0730-ON.html

According to The Arizona Republic website article above, they are announcing a new carrier in a press conference on 31 July. The claim is that it's a major announcement and with an existing carrier. Whatever that means - as opposed to a non-existent carrier?

CitrusCritter · Tue Jul 31, 2007 4:02 am

I'm sure by "existing carrier" they mean one already flying there. I'm sure this is the announcement that G4 will be making Phoenix / IWA a new tourist destination.

MAH4546 · Tue Jul 31, 2007 4:24 am

Quoting ArizonaGuy (Reply 19):

According to The Arizona Republic website article above, they are announcing a new carrier in a press conference on 31 July. The claim is that it's a major announcement and with an existing carrier. Whatever that means - as opposed to a non-existent carrier?

The announcement is Allegiant Airlines, who will be opening new bases in Phoenix and Fort Lauderdale this fall.

JetBlueGuy2006 · Tue Jul 31, 2007 4:50 am

Quoting MAH4546 (Reply 21):
The announcement is Allegiant Airlines, who will be opening new bases in Phoenix and Fort Lauderdale this fall

Any Clue on Destinations?

MAH4546 · Tue Jul 31, 2007 5:02 am

Quoting JetBlueGuy2006 (Reply 22):
Quoting MAH4546 (Reply 21):
The announcement is Allegiant Airlines, who will be opening new bases in Phoenix and Fort Lauderdale this fall

Any Clue on Destinations?

For FLL, it's safe to assume that if it has a PIE non-stop, it's probably a great candidate for an FLL non-stop. For IWA, no idea. I would figure that many of the Western destinations would get non-stops, along with the larger Midwest destinations (i.e. Rockford, Mid-America).

xjet · Tue Jul 31, 2007 5:25 am

Quoting MAH4546 (Reply 23):
For FLL, it's safe to assume that if it has a PIE non-stop, it's probably a great candidate for an FLL non-stop. For IWA, no idea. I would figure that many of the Western destinations would get non-stops, along with the larger Midwest destinations (i.e. Rockford, Mid-America).

Are they still growing their fleet? Or is their utilization low enough to absorb this expansion?

JetBlueGuy2006 · Tue Jul 31, 2007 5:26 am

Quoting MAH4546 (Reply 23):
For IWA, no idea. I would figure that many of the Western destinations would get non-stops, along with the larger Midwest destinations (i.e. Rockford, Mid-America).

Guess we will find out tomorrow. I am really hoping for LAN, I have never been out to the PHX area and it would be fun to go for like 3-4 days to see what it is like.

Humberside · Tue Jul 31, 2007 6:24 am

Only thing with Skybus is that they seem to avoiding competing with WN at CMH. CMH-IWA would compete with WN's CMH-PHX

Quoting MAH4546 (Reply 23):
Quoting JetBlueGuy2006 (Reply 22):
Quoting MAH4546 (Reply 21):
The announcement is Allegiant Airlines, who will be opening new bases in Phoenix and Fort Lauderdale this fall

Any Clue on Destinations?

For FLL, it's safe to assume that if it has a PIE non-stop, it's probably a great candidate for an FLL non-stop. For IWA, no idea. I would figure that many of the Western destinations would get non-stops, along with the larger Midwest destinations (i.e. Rockford, Mid-America).

BLI-IWA will probably be one route. Maybe also COS, ICT and Peoria?

itsnotfinals · Tue Jul 31, 2007 6:30 am

Quoting Humberside (Reply 26):
Only thing with Skybus is that they seem to avoiding competing with WN at CMH. CMH-IWA would compete with WN's CMH-PHX

Skybus is competing with WN out of CMH to several cities, with the largest competition on FLL, BUR, OAK and SAN. Basically every city Sybus flies to (Except RIC) is taking some passengers from WN.

IWA would be a great addition for Skybus.

I am eagerly anticipating the annoucement tomrrow for sure.

Humberside · Tue Jul 31, 2007 6:41 am

Quoting Itsnotfinals (Reply 27):
Skybus is competing with WN out of CMH to several cities, with the largest competition on FLL, BUR, OAK and SAN. Basically every city Sybus flies to (Except RIC) is taking some passengers from WN.

I was thinking directly - so far Skybus have avoided LAS, the Orlando area and the Phoenix area. I doubt Skybus will do this forever, but it is notably how they have done it so far

itsnotfinals · Tue Jul 31, 2007 8:14 am

Quoting Humberside (Reply 26):
Only thing with Skybus is that they seem to avoiding competing with WN at CMH. CMH-IWA would compete with WN's CMH-PHX

WN has only 1 CMH-PHX round trip a day so there isn't much to compete w

Quoting Humberside (Reply 28):
I was thinking directly - so far Skybus have avoided LAS, the Orlando area and the Phoenix area. I doubt Skybus will do this forever, but it is notably how they have done it so far

Southwest actually sells CMH-FLL as a "direct flight" with one stop (See flights 287 and 1487 for instance). Skybus is directly competeing with WN and their goal is to be 18-20% less on average fare wise.

B6 and Skybus both compete with WN to the BOS area. B6 wins this with a flight to BOS as opposed to PSM or PVD (Which WN sells also as a "direct" 1 stop flght).

crjflyer35 · Tue Jul 31, 2007 9:03 am

Quoting Itsnotfinals (Reply 18):
Quoting Crjflyer35 (Reply 13):
Excel Airways IIRC

Xtra Airways operated the flights for Sky Value.

That's the one....thanks for the correction

AirframeAS · Tue Jul 31, 2007 11:51 am

Quoting Chumley (Reply 16):
I thought it was IWA?

It is. All of the airport's SIDA badges at Williams Gateway say IWA. Also, see here: http://www.airnav.com/airport/KIWA They also refer themselves as WGA too. Ive seen AZA used on this site (A.net), but I think AZA is Falcon Field, Mesa, AZ. KIWA is the official F.A.A. designator.

[Edited 2007-07-31 04:52:51]

itsnotfinals · Wed Aug 01, 2007 4:53 am

Well the cat is out of the bag, Alligiant is going to start a "hub" (2 aircraft 13 cities to start, I went ahead and opened a new thread in Civ-Av)

This is great news for IWA, let's hope this time they can make it work.

AirframeAS · Wed Aug 01, 2007 10:25 am

Quoting Itsnotfinals (Reply 32):
This is great news for IWA, let's hope this time they can make it work.

We will just have to see if it 'sticks'. Hopefully it will generate more revenue for the East Valley cities.