DAYflyer
Topic Author
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NW Scheduling Disasters..and No Customer Service

Mon Jul 30, 2007 11:20 pm

Here is a perfect example of how shoddy they are running operations right now. The flight for which I was scheduled was cancelled and rebooked by NW auto system for tomorrow, which they did late yesterday. When notified, I immediately called and explained my situation, and they re-booked me for this AM which was wonderful. However, upon arrival at the airport for check in, I am told I have yet again been re-booked for a late flight tonight, which I cannot take, and they did so without any notice to me.

After explaining this to the agent, I am told they will rebook...no problem, all is well. The agent said, "go down to delta, we have you now out on the DL 7:15AM flight. They will print your ticket down there." Great, many thanks for all the effort!

So off I go to the DL ticket counter as instructed and they send me back to Northwest after standing in line for 1 hour and 15 minutes. Why? They tell me NW must print the NW ticket first and bring that back to them. So I go stand in yet anoither line behind 50 other disgruntled NW pax, they print the ticket after yet another hour in line, and send me back to DL. In the meantime, I miss the DL flight due to all the back and forth and people not knowing proper processess and proceedures.

So they rebook me yet again and now I am going to be late for an important business meeting, all because the agents at the ticket counters dont know what the hell they are doing.  devil 

Whom in the NW and DL heirarchy do I need to speak to about this? I'm really rather ticked off......the DL people were especially rude and inconsiderate, while the people at NW were clueless.....all because they cancelled flights due to crew/pilot shortages....  devil   irked 
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AIR757200
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RE: NW Scheduling Disasters..and No Customer Service

Mon Jul 30, 2007 11:31 pm

DL could of called the NW ticket counter and asked for a electronic reissue. Would of saved you all that time. I call their MSP CSA help desk and they do it in a flash when I get NW INVOL's without reissues. And they are always very helpful in helping out us other airlines.
 
ikramerica
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RE: NW Scheduling Disasters..and No Customer Service

Mon Jul 30, 2007 11:38 pm

Quoting DAYflyer (Thread starter):
So they rebook me yet again and now I am going to be late for an important business meeting, all because the agents at the ticket counters dont know what the hell they are doing.

Not all NW's fault there. DL could have handled it differently (the days of paper tickets are long past) and/or you could have asked NW for some sort of paper confirmation (I would have, based on past experience).

Seems like NW, DL and DAYflyer all screwed up here...  Wink
Of all the things to worry about... the Wookie has no pants.
 
PanAm747
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RE: NW Scheduling Disasters..and No Customer Service

Tue Jul 31, 2007 12:14 am

Quote:
Not all NW's fault there. DL could have handled it differently (the days of paper tickets are long past) and/or you could have asked NW for some sort of paper confirmation (I would have, based on past experience).

Well now we all know. However, what is one to do if NW says, "oh, we don't print things out anymore - it's all done electronically, and Delta has it on their computer, and they're waiting for you"? Just because airlines code-share and interline, doesn't mean their computers talk to each other. Caveat Emptor - buyer beware.

I am guessing NW upper management decided to cancel the flights and see if the computer could handle it all. And while it seemed to re-schedule things automatically, the customer service agents were left to deal with the mess with no assistance from above.

The lesson here seems to be "don't fly NW at the end of the month - all their pilots will have timed out, and they really won't be eager to help you".
Pan Am:The World's Most Experienced Airline - P(oor) S(ailor's) A(irline): San Diego's Hometown Airline-Catch Our Smile!
 
SPREE34
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RE: NW Scheduling Disasters..and No Customer Service

Tue Jul 31, 2007 12:19 am

Quoting Ikramerica (Reply 2):
Seems like NW, DL......all screwed up here..

Welcome to today's Bottom Line business plan. I'll bet a liitle money spent in the training department would have helped here. That would mean charging a fare to cover exspences and pay the CEOs their bonuses.

As long as we (pax) keep putting up with poor service in exchange for bottom dollar fares these kind of stories will continue, and IMO increase.
I don't understand everything I don't know about this.
 
flyf15
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RE: NW Scheduling Disasters..and No Customer Service

Tue Jul 31, 2007 12:22 am

This is what happens when you screw up running your airline so badly that when you have problems (which you have lots of), you have a bare-bones disgruntled staff that just doesn't care anymore handling it. But, passengers can express their displeasure with various airlines that aren't run well by choosing others, and I encourage you to do so.
 
burnsie28
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RE: NW Scheduling Disasters..and No Customer Service

Tue Jul 31, 2007 12:31 am

What airport di all of this happen at, Dayton is now run by 9E employees on the ground.. some of which are clueless rather then the old NW mainline employees.
 
FLYGUY767
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RE: NW Scheduling Disasters..and No Customer Service

Tue Jul 31, 2007 12:35 am

Quoting DAYflyer (Thread starter):
So off I go to the DL ticket counter as instructed and they send me back to Northwest after standing in line for 1 hour and 15 minutes. Why? They tell me NW must print the NW ticket first and bring that back to them. So I go stand in yet anoither line behind 50 other disgruntled NW pax, they print the ticket after yet another hour in line, and send me back to DL. In the meantime, I miss the DL flight due to all the back and forth and people not knowing proper processess and proceedures

What is the sense of Sky Team if they cannot offer simple Customer Service... There was no need for Delta to send yourself back to Northwest Airlines. It was a poorly managed incident by Delta, and only goes to show that A and B are still not talking to each other. No matter how many code-shares are in place. It truly is sad that Delta Air Lines chose not to assist you in this matter. I blame Delta more than Northwest Airlines. The Ticket Agent could have easily called over to Northwest Airlines, but instead was lazy and lacked service skills forcing yourself to miss you flight. Totally uncalled for both in service and competence..

Quoting DAYflyer (Thread starter):
I'm really rather ticked off......the DL people were especially rude and inconsiderate, while the people at NW were clueless.....all because they cancelled flights due to crew/pilot shortages....

It appears you have experienced what SkyTeam has become... Unorganized... KLM is seeing more and more complaints, Northwest is seeing more and more complaints, and Delta is seeing more and more complaints. Here in NYC there was a news issue a few days ago about the Delta delays at JFK, the Delta Customer Service and so forth. I am so upset to see the "new" Delta is starting to mirror the old Delta.. Painting new colours on the side of the plane and replacing seat covers is not going to change the Customer Service problems that plague not only Delta Air Lines but almost all US airlines in general..

-JD
Summer Trip 2007: DEN HAAG>DUBAI>LONDON>VERONA>COSTA SMERALDA>CAPRI
 
dl1011
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RE: NW Scheduling Disasters..and No Customer Service

Tue Jul 31, 2007 12:38 am

Sorry, but don't blame delta because you bought a ticket from a crappy company that screwed you over and left you out in the cold.
 
ikramerica
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RE: NW Scheduling Disasters..and No Customer Service

Tue Jul 31, 2007 12:41 am

Quoting PanAm747 (Reply 3):
Well now we all know.

Even before paperless ticketing, I've had airlines say I didn't need anything on paper to switch to the other airline due to a delay/cancel. I just never took that as an acceptable answer. And when I got to the otherside, you better bet they were happy to see the paper endorsement.

It's not just airlines. I'd never return a product and not get a receipt, or sign a contract without checking it and having the other party initial changes, or rent a car without checking for dents beforehand. Most people do those things, but that's their bad.

NW should have been more clear on what DL had to do, DL should have been more up to speed on how to do it, and the pax should have gotten something in writing, even it just the phone number and name of the person to talk to.

But of course the lesson is, never have your flight canceled. You can blame NW, since they have a problem right now, but everyone cancels flights and everyone tries to put you on something "the next day" rather than on another airline despite the rules that require them to accommodate you if it's available. It's not a new thing, nor is it post 9/11. ALL airlines behaved this way forever, back in the 80s and the 90s as well, and so much so in the EU that they made draconian laws to protect the pax...
Of all the things to worry about... the Wookie has no pants.
 
PSU.DTW.SCE
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RE: NW Scheduling Disasters..and No Customer Service

Tue Jul 31, 2007 12:45 am

If you were in DAY you were probably getting screwed by clueless employees at the respective regionals who are all rookies. The perfect storm......the pilot absenteeism/ crew shortage issue compounded by the outsourcing of outstations to low wage/high turnover/poorly trained regional CSA's.
 
VgnAtl747
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RE: NW Scheduling Disasters..and No Customer Service

Tue Jul 31, 2007 12:49 am

I disagree with some of this...

It is not DL's fault that NW was wrong about the printing of the ticket. If the NW agent had printed the ticket or transferred it electronically like they should have, then you would have had a normal check-in at DL. DL had a chance to help you out and provide some good customer service by calling NW for the ticket when they found it hadn't been transferred, which they didn't do, but I still don't see how you can all blame all of this on poor DL service when clearly it was NW who failed to rebook and transfer your ticket correctly.

If the NW agent really felt that DL could just print your ticket then that agent needs to be sent back to training.
Work Hard. Fly Right. Continental Airlines
 
FLYGUY767
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RE: NW Scheduling Disasters..and No Customer Service

Tue Jul 31, 2007 12:56 am

Quoting Dl1011 (Reply 8):
Sorry, but don't blame delta because you bought a ticket from a crappy company that screwed you over and left you out in the cold.

It is a catch 22... However Delta Air Lines Agent was at fault for not having taken a pro-active approach to resolve the problem. Northwest Airlines was at fault in the first place, however the Delta Air Lines Agent was at fault for offering poor service and not helping to resolve the problem other than directing the passenger to hit the high road..

Quoting VgnAtl747 (Reply 11):
It is not DL's fault that NW was wrong about the printing of the ticket.

It is the fault of Delta Air Lines Agent for not properly handling the situation and doing the job that they are paid to do :

CUSTOMER SERVICE

I know Customer Service has taken a back seat to everything else in the US airline industry.. Training would help, however I wonder if even training could help the Customer Service end of the US airlines at this point..

-JD
Summer Trip 2007: DEN HAAG>DUBAI>LONDON>VERONA>COSTA SMERALDA>CAPRI
 
dallasnewark
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RE: NW Scheduling Disasters..and No Customer Service

Tue Jul 31, 2007 1:00 am

Quoting FLYGUY767 (Reply 12):
I know Customer Service has taken a back seat to everything else in the US airline industry.. Training would help, however I wonder if even training could help the Customer Service end of the US airlines at this point..

Do you really believe that cust service reps making a whopping $7 per hour would care about the customers? No amount of training will make them do that
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GlobalATL
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RE: NW Scheduling Disasters..and No Customer Service

Tue Jul 31, 2007 1:04 am

Quoting FLYGUY767 (Reply 7):
It appears you have experienced what SkyTeam has become... Unorganized... KLM is seeing more and more complaints, Northwest is seeing more and more complaints, and Delta is seeing more and more complaints. Here in NYC there was a news issue a few days ago about the Delta delays at JFK, the Delta Customer Service and so forth. I am so upset to see the "new" Delta is starting to mirror the old Delta.

Maybe SkyTeam is unorganized in your eyes. Airlines are seeing more complaints in this day 'n age due to other problems regardless of being part of an alliance or not. Agent error or stupidity, is more the likely problem.
TriStar BusinessElite FedEx AirTran Delta Air Lines oneworld SkyTeam JetBlue/jetBlue MAXjet SkyMiles Eos = good spelling
 
jlbmedia
Posts: 311
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RE: NW Scheduling Disasters..and No Customer Service

Tue Jul 31, 2007 1:16 am

Taking into account all the canceled flights recently, this causes me to ask, If you really need to be somewhere at a certin time, why use Northwest?
JLB54061
 
surfdog75
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RE: NW Scheduling Disasters..and No Customer Service

Tue Jul 31, 2007 1:19 am

Quoting FLYGUY767 (Reply 12):
It is the fault of Delta Air Lines Agent for not properly handling the situation and doing the job that they are paid to do :

I disagree. If you (NW) are going to increase the workload on another companies already stretched employees due to your companies problems, the least you can do is make it as easy as possible for them to help you out. DL already runs a very lean schedule, with agents generally very busy, and a sudden influx of unexpected passengers is bound to cause some problems for all including, unfortunately, the DL customers who booked DL in the first place.

[Edited 2007-07-30 18:20:29]

[Edited 2007-07-30 18:21:26]
 
toltommy
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RE: NW Scheduling Disasters..and No Customer Servi

Tue Jul 31, 2007 1:26 am

Quoting DTW.SCE" class=quote target=_blank>PSU.DTW.SCE (Reply 10):
If you were in DAY you were probably getting screwed by clueless employees at the respective regionals who are all rookies. The perfect storm......the pilot absenteeism/ crew shortage issue compounded by the outsourcing of outstations to low wage/high turnover/poorly trained regional CSA's.

DAY in partiucular wasn't any better when it was an NWA run station.

Quite honestly, I find it hard to believe that you stood in line at DL for an hour and fifteen minutes at DAY, and then another hour at NWA. You arrived more than two hours ahead for your flight? At DAY? And then stood behind 50 people at NWA? Yes NWA cancelled flights yesterday, but since there's no mainline service at DAY (only 5 flights to DTW, 2 CRJ 3 SF3), the odds that EVERYONE on the flight was affected was small. I think there may some embellishment here to make the story more interesting....
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FLYGUY767
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RE: NW Scheduling Disasters..and No Customer Service

Tue Jul 31, 2007 1:32 am

Quoting Dallasnewark (Reply 13):
Do you really believe that cust service reps making a whopping $7 per hour would care about the customers?

Sorry, why did they take the job in the first place?

Quoting Dallasnewark (Reply 13):
No amount of training will make them do that

So we are to excuse the pay that the employee knew they would get for the position for the pis-poor service?

Some of the excuses on A.net in regards to Delta Air Lines problems are really unbelievable..

Quoting Surfdog75 (Reply 16):
DL already runs a very lean schedule, with agents generally very busy, and a sudden influx of unexpected passengers is bound to cause some problems for all including unfortunately the DL customers who booked DL in the first place.

Please find the incidents below, it is a prime example of how well Delta schedules its flights..

http://youtube.com/watch?v=R06dAgpmmbg

http://youtube.com/watch?v=e1KvKnyxVSo

http://www.consumerist.com/consumer/...-traffic-control-system-276924.php

http://wcbstv.com/topstories/local_story_046164708.html

-JD
Summer Trip 2007: DEN HAAG>DUBAI>LONDON>VERONA>COSTA SMERALDA>CAPRI
 
DAYflyer
Topic Author
Posts: 3546
Joined: Wed Sep 08, 2004 9:35 pm

RE: NW Scheduling Disasters..and No Customer Service

Tue Jul 31, 2007 1:43 am

Quoting Jlbmedia (Reply 15):
Taking into account all the canceled flights recently, this causes me to ask, If you really need to be somewhere at a certin time, why use Northwest?

Tickets were purchased weeks ago.

Quoting TOLtommy (Reply 17):
Quite honestly, I find it hard to believe that you stood in line at DL for an hour and fifteen minutes at DAY, and then another hour at NWA. You arrived more than two hours ahead for your flight? At DAY? And then stood behind 50 people at NWA? Yes NWA cancelled flights yesterday, but since there's no mainline service at DAY (only 5 flights to DTW, 2 CRJ 3 SF3), the odds that EVERYONE on the flight was affected was small. I think there may some embellishment here to make the story more interesting....

Actually, it was more like an 1 hour and 23 minutes to be exact at DL. Were YOU in line at DL and NW this AM? I think NOT and you are an employee of one of the airlines that screwed up and were trying to defend your company's actions....
And yes, since more than 1 flight of NW people were affected, there were more than 50 people standing there getting re-routed....

Quoting FLYGUY767 (Reply 12):
Northwest Airlines was at fault in the first place, however the Delta Air Lines Agent was at fault for offering poor service and not helping to resolve the problem other than directing the passenger to hit the high road..

Which is exactly the point of the entire thread....they both screwed up and didnt care.
One Nation Under God
 
FLYGUY767
Posts: 1441
Joined: Thu May 24, 2007 11:26 pm

RE: NW Scheduling Disasters..and No Customer Service

Tue Jul 31, 2007 1:52 am

Quoting GlobalATL (Reply 14):
Maybe SkyTeam is unorganized in your eyes. Airlines are seeing more complaints in this day 'n age due to other problems regardless of being part of an alliance or not. Agent error or stupidity, is more the likely problem

Incorrect the airlines are seeing more and more complaints as their fleets are maxed out as well as their employees... As has been the case and cause of numerous delays that plague the JFK market courtesy of Delta Air Lines and their Connection affiliates..

-JD
Summer Trip 2007: DEN HAAG>DUBAI>LONDON>VERONA>COSTA SMERALDA>CAPRI
 
DeltaMIA
Posts: 1622
Joined: Wed Feb 04, 2004 11:53 am

RE: NW Scheduling Disasters..and No Customer Service

Tue Jul 31, 2007 2:00 am

Quoting FLYGUY767 (Reply 12):
It is the fault of Delta Air Lines Agent for not properly handling the situation and doing the job that they are paid to do :

CUSTOMER SERVICE

You think an airline like NW is going to answer their phone during an IROP. Get real.

You think a station staffed like DAY has the time to call NW res in the middle of a check-in at 6:00am. An agent taking the time to do that in the middle of check-in at a small station like DAY could have likely caused 15 other passengers to miss their flight.

Delta is not a fault for NW not doing their job. It is an IATA agreement now that INVOL REROUTES are required to be reissued prior to the new carrier accepting. DL can't even accept a paper ticket with the same O&D unless it is the exact routing, i.e. DAY-DTW-LGA must be reissued to say DAY-ATL-LGA. If NW agents can't do this then they need to issue a FIM.

Quoting DAYflyer (Reply 19):
Which is exactly the point of the entire thread....they both screwed up and didnt care.

DL didn't screw up. When they agreed to accept you on behalf of NW, NW has to reissue the ticket over to DL.
What happened to you is the same as if you show up for a flight without ever purchasing your ticket. Is that DL's fault?
In your case NW just didn't "purchase" your ticket.
It's a big building with patients, but that's not important right now.
 
flyorski
Posts: 732
Joined: Thu Dec 16, 2004 8:23 am

RE: NW Scheduling Disasters..and No Customer Service

Tue Jul 31, 2007 2:05 am

Quoting FLYGUY767 (Reply 18):
Sorry, why did they take the job in the first place?

Because they need to buy food for the family, and McDonald's can not hire everyone.

Quoting FLYGUY767 (Reply 18):
Please find the incidents below, it is a prime example of how well Delta schedules its flights..

http://youtube.com/watch?v=R06dAgpmmbg

http://youtube.com/watch?v=e1KvKnyxVSo

http://www.consumerist.com/consumer/...-traffic-control-system-276924.php

http://wcbstv.com/topstories/local_story_046164708.html

-JD

Thanks, those videos are interesting.
"None are more hopelessly enslaved, than those who falsly believe they are free" -Goethe
 
flyingcat
Posts: 528
Joined: Tue May 29, 2007 10:33 am

RE: NW Scheduling Disasters..and No Customer Service

Tue Jul 31, 2007 2:13 am

Quoting FLYGUY767 (Reply 18):
Please find the incidents below, it is a prime example of how well Delta schedules its flights..

Your bringing up DL's Valentine day problems to B6's St Valentine's day massacre. B6 had far worse problems and they are supposedly the no 1 airline when it comes to customer service.
 
FLYGUY767
Posts: 1441
Joined: Thu May 24, 2007 11:26 pm

RE: NW Scheduling Disasters..and No Customer Service

Tue Jul 31, 2007 2:14 am

Quoting DeltaMIA (Reply 21):
Delta is not a fault for NW not doing their job.

Sorry, but Delta Air Lines is at fault for not dealing with the passenger. Instructing the passenger to go back to NWA after the passenger waited in line was uncalled for. This excuse of "Blame NWA", and "Dont blame the Delta Agents they arent paid enough" are exact examples of why the US airlines are such a mess. And the brunt of jokes around the World. Mismanagement on both Delta and Northwest in this case lead to the passenger being caught in the middle. Delta Air Lines can post as many fluff adverts about "The New Delta", and "Customer Service" as they want after seeing the way in which they did not proactively solve the passengers problem only goes to show that it is a business as usual..

Quoting DeltaMIA (Reply 21):
You think a station staffed like DAY has the time to call NW res in the middle of a check-in at 6:00am. An agent taking the time to do that in the middle of check-in at a small station like DAY could have likely caused 15 other passengers to miss their flight.

So it is okay to excuse the Delta Air Lines Agent for not handling a Customer Service problem? Correct me if I am wrong it doesn't take brain science for the Delta Air Lines Agent to pick up the phone and call either the NWA Ticket Counter, speak with the Delta Air Lines Supervisor on duty or NWA Reservations to have the problem solved. If NWA knew enough to send the passenger to Delta they knew that Delta could handle the problem. Of course in that case it is evident that the Delta Agent at DAY was unable to even perform a simple duty.

Quoting DeltaMIA (Reply 21):
It is an IATA agreement now that INVOL REROUTES are required to be reissued prior to the new carrier accepting.

Odds are that the re-issue was in the CRS and that the Agent at Delta Air Lines did not know what the procedure was, or did not do enough research in notes. Sad to say that this is just another case of Ticket Agent Training gone south..

-JD
Summer Trip 2007: DEN HAAG>DUBAI>LONDON>VERONA>COSTA SMERALDA>CAPRI
 
VgnAtl747
Posts: 1333
Joined: Fri Apr 06, 2001 3:59 am

RE: NW Scheduling Disasters..and No Customer Service

Tue Jul 31, 2007 2:35 am

Quoting FLYGUY767 (Reply 12):
Quoting VgnAtl747 (Reply 11):
It is not DL's fault that NW was wrong about the printing of the ticket.

It is the fault of Delta Air Lines Agent for not properly handling the situation and doing the job that they are paid to do :

CUSTOMER SERVICE

I know Customer Service has taken a back seat to everything else in the US airline industry.. Training would help, however I wonder if even training could help the Customer Service end of the US airlines at this point..

It is not. I'm sorry, but DL is not at fault because NW sent you to them without transfering your ticket. Do you understand how these things work? Yes, the Delta agent could have called NW instead of sending you back to them, but the truth of the matter is that they accepted your ticket from NW. Now if NW sends you there without a ticket then NW needs to fix it. End of story. And if you came up to my ticket counter with the attitude you've showed on this thread then I would have sent you back to NW to get it fixed instead of going the extra mile for you and getting it resolved.

I don't even want to imagine how much of a mess the airport was with all of the NW cancellations, and the other airlines (including DL) probably had their hands full trying to deal with all of the last minute transfers NW was sending them. Now if NW can't get a simple transfer right, then they need to fix it. NW should have just issued a paper ticket to you first, so that you had it and could go to whatever airline they sent you to. Either that or they should have transferred it correctly the first time so DL could access it.

NW screwed up your travel and you missed a meeting. It's in the past, and I'm sure they're not sorry, but get over it-things happen. If DL hadn't accepted your ticket then you would still be sitting in the airport and wouldn't have left at all. Maybe instead of complaining like the man that is never happy you should be grateful that you got out of the airport at all.
Work Hard. Fly Right. Continental Airlines
 
FLYGUY767
Posts: 1441
Joined: Thu May 24, 2007 11:26 pm

RE: NW Scheduling Disasters..and No Customer Service

Tue Jul 31, 2007 2:38 am

Quoting VgnAtl747 (Reply 25):
NW screwed up your travel and you missed a meeting. It's in the past, and I'm sure they're not sorry, but get over it-things happen. If DL hadn't accepted your ticket then you would still be sitting in the airport and wouldn't have left at all. Maybe instead of complaining like the man that is never happy you should be grateful that you got out of the airport at all

FYI

The incident happened to DAYFlyer... Not FLYGUY767

-JD
Summer Trip 2007: DEN HAAG>DUBAI>LONDON>VERONA>COSTA SMERALDA>CAPRI
 
SkyyMaster
Posts: 1082
Joined: Sun Feb 11, 2007 7:34 am

RE: NW Scheduling Disasters..and No Customer Service

Tue Jul 31, 2007 2:53 am

Quoting FLYGUY767 (Reply 7):
It appears you have experienced what SkyTeam has become... Unorganized...

The real problem with Skyteam can be faulted to one carrier, and we all know which one that is. I have never had an unpleasant experience with any Skyteam carrier, sans one and thank God I rarely use Northwest. If you want to fault the alliance for being unorganized, look to the source and place the blame where it belongs. As a 150K mile a year Skyteam flier, I would not shed a single tear if they booted NW. If the management at NW cannot get their act together, they will be revisiting BK sooner than they realize. People aren't going to put up with this crap much longer.
 
VgnAtl747
Posts: 1333
Joined: Fri Apr 06, 2001 3:59 am

RE: NW Scheduling Disasters..and No Customer Service

Tue Jul 31, 2007 2:57 am

Quoting FLYGUY767 (Reply 26):
FYI

The incident happened to DAYFlyer... Not FLYGUY767

-JD

Haha--good call. My bad...
Work Hard. Fly Right. Continental Airlines
 
FLYGUY767
Posts: 1441
Joined: Thu May 24, 2007 11:26 pm

RE: NW Scheduling Disasters..and No Customer Service

Tue Jul 31, 2007 3:02 am

Quoting VgnAtl747 (Reply 28):
Haha--good call. My bad...

It was tongue in cheek...  box 

Quoting SkyyMaster (Reply 27):
As a 150K mile a year Skyteam flier, I would not shed a single tear if they booted NW. If the management at NW cannot get their act together, they will be revisiting BK sooner than they realize.

SkyTeam needs NW more than NW needs SkyTeam..

Quoting SkyyMaster (Reply 27):
People aren't going to put up with this crap much longer.

People have said the same about UA, and US for years... They haven't gone anywhere..

-JD
Summer Trip 2007: DEN HAAG>DUBAI>LONDON>VERONA>COSTA SMERALDA>CAPRI
 
nasmal
Posts: 199
Joined: Mon Jun 19, 2000 4:16 am

RE: NW Scheduling Disasters..and No Customer Service

Tue Jul 31, 2007 3:05 am

Why should Delta have to deal with NWA mismanagement of scheduling? To add to that....

Quoting FLYGUY767 (Reply 24):
Correct me if I am wrong it doesn't take brain science for the Delta Air Lines Agent to pick up the phone and call either the NWA Ticket Counter, speak with the Delta Air Lines Supervisor on duty or NWA Reservations to have the problem solved.

Now have you ever called reservations lately? And as it was described, it sounded like NWA was very busy at their check in counters to immediately take care of a Delta request to take care of their passenger. Following those steps would've risked orginal delta passengers to miss their flight. I don't understand how Delta is responsible for NWA's error in scheduling and on top of that has to finish the task of locating and printing a ticket which was NWA's responsibility in the first place. If you could make me understand it would be greatly appericated.

I
 
FLYGUY767
Posts: 1441
Joined: Thu May 24, 2007 11:26 pm

RE: NW Scheduling Disasters..and No Customer Service

Tue Jul 31, 2007 3:11 am

Quoting Nasmal (Reply 30):
If you could make me understand it would be greatly appericated.

Again... please see below

Quoting FLYGUY767 (Reply 24):
it doesn't take brain science for the Delta Air Lines Agent to pick up the phone and call either the NWA Ticket Counter, speak with the Delta Air Lines Supervisor on duty or NWA Reservations to have the problem solved. If NWA knew enough to send the passenger to Delta they knew that Delta could handle the problem. Of course in that case it is evident that the Delta Agent at DAY was unable to even perform a simple duty



Quoting FLYGUY767 (Reply 24):
Instructing the passenger to go back to NWA after the passenger waited in line was uncalled for. This excuse of "Blame NWA", and "Dont blame the Delta Agents they arent paid enough" are exact examples of why the US airlines are such a mess.



Quoting FLYGUY767 (Reply 12):
However Delta Air Lines Agent was at fault for not having taken a pro-active approach to resolve the problem.



Quoting FLYGUY767 (Reply 12):
the Delta Air Lines Agent was at fault for offering poor service and not helping to resolve the problem other than directing the passenger to hit the high road..



Quoting FLYGUY767 (Reply 7):
The Ticket Agent could have easily called over to Northwest Airlines, but instead was lazy and lacked service skills forcing yourself to miss you flight. Totally uncalled for both in service and competence..

The ball was dropped by both airlines... When the pax got to Delta the problem could have been solved..

A simple thing thing referred to in the Customer Service industry known as..

"Owning, Responding, and Solving"

Owning the Problem
Responding to the Problem
Solving the Problem

-JD
Summer Trip 2007: DEN HAAG>DUBAI>LONDON>VERONA>COSTA SMERALDA>CAPRI
 
nasmal
Posts: 199
Joined: Mon Jun 19, 2000 4:16 am

RE: NW Scheduling Disasters..and No Customer Service

Tue Jul 31, 2007 3:24 am

Quoting FLYGUY767 (Reply 31):
The ball was dropped by both airlines... When the pax got to Delta the problem could have been solved..

A simple thing thing referred to in the Customer Service industry known as..

"Owning, Responding, and Solving"

Owning the Problem
Responding to the Problem
Solving the Problem

Delta did not own and was not responsible for this passenger in the first place. The root of the problem is NWA scheduling. As you said about owning and taking responsibility. NWA owns this passenger missing his flight and must take responsiblity no matter what that this passenger did not make it to his destination on time. Delta finally did the job by getting this passenger to his destination by taking responsibility from NWA in which Delta did get this passenger to his destination that day, in which NWA could not even OWN, TAKE RESPONSIBILITY, OR EVEN SOLVE. They gave it to another carrier to solve.
 
DeltaMIA
Posts: 1622
Joined: Wed Feb 04, 2004 11:53 am

RE: NW Scheduling Disasters..and No Customer Service

Tue Jul 31, 2007 3:39 am

Quoting FLYGUY767 (Reply 31):
The ball was dropped by both airlines... When the pax got to Delta the problem could have been solved..

Very bold statement for not knowing the details behind why DL sent him back to NW. You are just full of assumptions trying to blame DL.

The agent in DAY could have very easily been a 20 year veteran with DL that attempted to retrieve the electronic ticket through 3 different retrieval methods because he came down without even an itinerary from NW. As the NW agent just said "GO". A printed confirmation card could have been a great aid in the absence of a valid or present ETR. You make all these assumptions without knowing and only want to blame DL. DL can't do everything for NW when they have a cancellation, as you seem to expect.

I'm sorry you got fired from DL. I hope I didn't make the wrong assumption on why you are so bitter.
It's a big building with patients, but that's not important right now.
 
FLYGUY767
Posts: 1441
Joined: Thu May 24, 2007 11:26 pm

RE: NW Scheduling Disasters..and No Customer Service

Tue Jul 31, 2007 3:42 am

Quoting Nasmal (Reply 32):
Delta did not own and was not responsible for this passenger in the first place. The root of the problem is NWA scheduling. As you said about owning and taking responsibility. NWA owns this passenger missing his flight and must take responsiblity no matter what that this passenger did not make it to his destination on time. Delta finally did the job by getting this passenger to his destination by taking responsibility from NWA in which Delta did get this passenger to his destination that day, in which NWA could not even OWN, TAKE RESPONSIBILITY, OR EVEN SOLVE. They gave it to another carrier to solve

Responding to anything else in this thread would prove pointless.. Although proving the point time and time again throughout this topic, as usual it has turned into a "Delta is the Best", "Delta does no wrong", "Delta has the best Customer Service", "Delta has the best schedule".... blah blah blah... and "Northwest is the Worst"..

Honestly it would help if people would read and then post instead of not reading the previous replys before posting uninformed comments..

-JD
Summer Trip 2007: DEN HAAG>DUBAI>LONDON>VERONA>COSTA SMERALDA>CAPRI
 
DAYflyer
Topic Author
Posts: 3546
Joined: Wed Sep 08, 2004 9:35 pm

RE: NW Scheduling Disasters..and No Customer Service

Tue Jul 31, 2007 3:45 am

Everyone here has made some valid points.

I believe the case for fault begins at NW myself, since the agent failed to print the new itinerary for the DL people to work with and sent me down there without it. If that had happened, I would almost bet I would have made the DL 7:15 flight.

My beef with DL rests with how rude they were to me when I was sent down to them by the NW person without the needed document. They could have been a little more understanding about the fact that I didnt have it because I didnt know it was needed.
One Nation Under God
 
flyabr
Posts: 864
Joined: Fri Sep 19, 2003 11:42 am

RE: NW Scheduling Disasters..and No Customer Service

Tue Jul 31, 2007 4:00 am

would you have gotten "better" service by calling the NW 800 number. maybe those folks have a better idea on "how" to reschedule you on another airline...just a thought. or can the 800 number folks only reschedule on NW?
 
Falcon84
Posts: 13775
Joined: Fri Sep 10, 2004 11:52 am

RE: NW Scheduling Disasters..and No Customer Service

Tue Jul 31, 2007 4:17 am

Quoting DAYflyer (Thread starter):
So off I go to the DL ticket counter as instructed and they send me back to Northwest after standing in line for 1 hour and 15 minutes. Why? They tell me NW must print the NW ticket first and bring that back to them.

Which is not true. DL screwed you there. NW can push the eticket over to NW without any endorsements, as can be done between ANY Skyteam members. All DL would have had to have done is to "sync" the electronic ticket, and you would have been fine. DL's agent just didn't want to.

Quoting PanAm747 (Reply 3):
Well now we all know. However, what is one to do if NW says, "oh, we don't print things out anymore - it's all done electronically, and Delta has it on their computer, and they're waiting for you"? Just because airlines code-share and interline, doesn't mean their computers talk to each other. Caveat Emptor - buyer beware.

Again, with NW and DL being partners in Skyteam, and with virtually any airline in the nation able to "push" and eticket to another carrier, DL could have handled it right then and there. To me, it sounds like DL scrwed him over on this part.

Quoting VgnAtl747 (Reply 11):
It is not DL's fault that NW was wrong about the printing of the ticket. If

Again, nothing needed to be printed. If NW pushed control of the eticket to DL, then the DL agent needed just a few kestrokes to make it an eticket on DL.

Quoting Dallasnewark (Reply 13):
Do you really believe that cust service reps making a whopping $7 per hour would care about the customers? No amount of training will make them do that

If they have any self-respect, they do. When I was making $5.77 an hour when I started with CO, and since, I've tried to do it right, and with the customer in mind. It isn't about training-it's about self-respect.
Work Right, Fly Hard
 
jcs17
Posts: 7376
Joined: Mon Jun 18, 2001 11:13 am

RE: NW Scheduling Disasters..and No Customer Service

Tue Jul 31, 2007 4:39 am

Northwest is far from what I'd consider a good airline. I'm currently a Silver Elite, but have also flown them a lot as a general member. If you're not an Elite, it's a pretty terrible experience if you run into a cancellation/reroute/misconnect. As a general member, I was stranded three times in MSP for 20+ hours within two years.

That all said, I've run into a couple issues within the past month. A crew-related cancellation (D9S) and a downgauge in equipment (CR9 to CR2). On the crew cancellation, I recieved a call from an NW representative to reschedule my flight for later, they confirmed my EUAs on both segments of the new itinerary. Quick and easy. On the downgauge, the auto-rebook put me on a flight the next day. I called someone with NW, and it wasn't a problem at all to get me out the same day on AA to MSP, then connecting to NW to GFK. Easy.

One of my biggest problems with NW and 9E is the inconsistency of it's staff at outstations -- usually baaaaaad.

[Edited 2007-07-30 21:45:12]
America's chickens are coming home to rooooost!
 
DeltaMIA
Posts: 1622
Joined: Wed Feb 04, 2004 11:53 am

RE: NW Scheduling Disasters..and No Customer Service

Tue Jul 31, 2007 4:46 am

Quoting Falcon84 (Reply 37):
NW can push the eticket over to NW without any endorsements, as can be done between ANY Skyteam members. All DL would have had to have done is to "sync" the electronic ticket, and you would have been fine. DL's agent just didn't want to.

Which is true, but the NW agent needs to give control over. Or else the DL agent receives an error message that basically says NW still has control preventing the DL agent from even seeing the electronic ticket record. I believe that is specific to NW as DL can actually get control from UA, CO, US and AA tickets without having to send them back.

Quoting Falcon84 (Reply 37):
To me, it sounds like DL scrwed him over on this part.

Again with NW etickets, DL can't see a NW only itinerary etkt record, hence why NW has to reissue the ticket reflecting the DL segments. With any other carriers stock the agents can see the eticket even if it hasn't been reissued.

Quoting Falcon84 (Reply 37):
Again, nothing needed to be printed. If NW pushed control of the eticket to DL, then the DL agent needed just a few kestrokes to make it an eticket on DL.

That is true printing the ticket isn't necessary and frowned upon. DL coudln't accept it if it still has the NW routing as it now must have the DL routing to be a valid ticket whether paper or electronic.

Quoting Falcon84 (Reply 37):
If they have any self-respect, they do. When I was making $5.77 an hour when I started with CO, and since, I've tried to do it right, and with the customer in mind. It isn't about training-it's about self-respect.

Yes which most agents have. DL agents, no matter how much anger passengers sometimes have againstthe "messenger" when they don't hear what they want, aren't out to screw anybody. The bottom line is they needed a valid ticket and didn't have one, so he was referred back to NW.
It's a big building with patients, but that's not important right now.
 
laca773
Posts: 2080
Joined: Sat Nov 06, 2004 7:10 am

RE: NW Scheduling Disasters..and No Customer Service

Tue Jul 31, 2007 5:28 am

Is NW consistantly CX'ng flights in the same markets on a daily basis or are they rotating routes so every city gets their fair share. I've noticed a few days ago, NW brought an 332 to LAX and the on Saturday a 744 to operate one of the MSP flights. Is this to make up for cx'ng other flights?

LACA773
 
Kuna
Posts: 269
Joined: Sat Aug 19, 2006 10:38 am

RE: NW Scheduling Disasters..and No Customer Service

Tue Jul 31, 2007 6:28 am

Quoting PanAm747 (Reply 3):
Well now we all know. However, what is one to do if NW says, "oh, we don't print things out anymore - it's all done electronically, and Delta has it on their computer, and they're waiting for you"? Just because airlines code-share and interline, doesn't mean their computers talk to each other. Caveat Emptor - buyer beware.

As a 9E employee when we reissue a ticket onto another carrier, we give them a receipt and a itinerary with their new flight details, this is the receipt of change for the ticket...as he should of received when they told him to go to Delta.
Pinnacle Airlines
 
Kuna
Posts: 269
Joined: Sat Aug 19, 2006 10:38 am

RE: NW Scheduling Disasters..and No Customer Service

Tue Jul 31, 2007 7:10 am

Quoting Dallasnewark (Reply 13):

Do you really believe that cust service reps making a whopping $7 per hour would care about the customers? No amount of training will make them do that

I take offense to that, who cares what I make an hour, I care about you, and any other passenger on my flight that day. I cannot speak for everyone else, but I take pride in my work, and I strive to turn a bad situation, into a not so bad situation. By doing so, providing good customer service. This type of event could of happened at any other airline, but its not an excuse for it to happen. Both at fault in my eyes, 1 NW didn't properly reissue the ticket, and a simple phone call by DL to NW ticket counter, could have fixed the problem in a few minutes instead 1 hour and 23 minutes. There was no need for the DL agent to be rude about not having the reissue, it happens, sometimes the reissue doesn't get sent electronically even tho I know I did it personally correctly. I just have to redo it, it messes up in transit.
Pinnacle Airlines
 
UnknownUser
Posts: 254
Joined: Tue Mar 27, 2007 7:02 am

RE: NW Scheduling Disasters..and No Customer Service

Tue Jul 31, 2007 7:20 am

Quoting Kuna (Reply 42):
Quoting Dallasnewark (Reply 13):

Do you really believe that cust service reps making a whopping $7 per hour would care about the customers? No amount of training will make them do that


I take offense to that,

I do as well. I hate that misconception that because someone earns low wages, they automatically hate the customer and won't do anything above and beyond. I was never paid much, but I always respected the customer and helped them to the best of my abilities. I would never turn around and personally be rude to anyone just because I am choosing to work where I am.
Die Skybus!!! You need to die for the good of the industry!
 
isitsafenow
Posts: 3413
Joined: Sun Feb 01, 2004 9:22 am

RE: NW Scheduling Disasters..and No Customer Service

Tue Jul 31, 2007 8:29 am

Correct me if I am wrong ticket counter folks, but if NW crapped out and put you on DL, NW is responsible for the new booking AND the new ticket. All Joe Pax has to do is take his ticket, bags and self to the next carrier, in this case
Delta.....
I have been on all three sides on this one......counter of the xcled carrier, counter of the rebooked on carrier and
as a pax.
safe
If two people agree on EVERYTHING, then one isn't necessary.
 
musapapaya
Posts: 1004
Joined: Mon Apr 05, 2004 10:02 am

RE: NW Scheduling Disasters..and No Customer Service

Tue Jul 31, 2007 8:34 am

ok folks, dont argue anymore - go and use B6, they have apparently the best Customer Service. Try to avoid NW as they appear to be the worst!
Lufthansa Group of Airlines
 
toptravel
Posts: 108
Joined: Wed Oct 05, 2005 5:36 pm

RE: NW Scheduling Disasters..and No Customer Service

Tue Jul 31, 2007 9:02 am

My experience of 'SkyTeam Seemless Travel' is that someone has forgotten the tread on the seems.
 
Falcon84
Posts: 13775
Joined: Fri Sep 10, 2004 11:52 am

RE: NW Scheduling Disasters..and No Customer Service

Tue Jul 31, 2007 9:26 am

Quoting DeltaMIA (Reply 39):
Which is true, but the NW agent needs to give control over.

The fact that the DL agent told our friend he needed to go back and get the ticket printed tells me that the agent didn't really know how to sync it and gain control of it. If NW hadn't given control of the ticket, the agent would have probably acted differently, I would think, in my experience.

Quoting DeltaMIA (Reply 39):
Again with NW etickets, DL can't see a NW only itinerary etkt record, hence why NW has to reissue the ticket reflecting the DL segments.

Are you telling me DL can't tell if NW has given them control of an Eticket? You're kidding? We can tell if we have control of it-if the other airline has control, it tells us that in our system. If it doesn''t and the PNR header says "ETKT NN Sync", we just sync the ticket.

That confuses me greatly. I've pushed tickets over to DL before, and I've taken tickets pushed by DL. I've never had much of a problem if it's done right on either end.

Quoting DeltaMIA (Reply 39):
DL coudln't accept it if it still has the NW routing as it now must have the DL routing to be a valid ticket whether paper or electronic.

Incorrect. As Skyteam partners, DL and NW can accept or send tickets over to other Skyteam partners WITHOUT endorsement, and without a paper ticket. It CAN be printed, and also not need endorsement, but Skyteam members can reroute without endorsement. Better read up on that, my friend.
Work Right, Fly Hard
 
socalfive
Posts: 474
Joined: Sat Mar 10, 2001 5:37 am

RE: NW Scheduling Disasters..and No Customer Servi

Tue Jul 31, 2007 9:33 am

Quoting PanAm747 (Reply 3):
The lesson here seems to be "don't fly NW at the end of the month - all their pilots will have timed out, and they really won't be eager to help you".

Or better YET, why fly them at all? They've screwed me for the last time quite awhile back, then gave me the 'tude factor of 12 and as far as I'm concerned as long as there's a Greyhound Bus going the same way, there's another option over NW.

This is nothing short of management forcing another F.Y. to the employees to prove some minimum wage point, there's no team spirit left from the top end of the organization and these morons better start studying the employee relations manuals at WN or CO or they'll be back in BK in nothing flat. Oh but wait, stupid me, they've already made THEIR money and undoubtedly don't give a crap about the success of the company, the satisfaction of the workers, or the quality of the product they're offering the marketplace. I say "screw 'em" and move on to any other airline, sooner than later, they'll have enough pilots to fill the schedule, believe me.
 
DeltaMIA
Posts: 1622
Joined: Wed Feb 04, 2004 11:53 am

RE: NW Scheduling Disasters..and No Customer Service

Tue Jul 31, 2007 10:57 am

Quoting Falcon84 (Reply 47):
Are you telling me DL can't tell if NW has given them control of an Eticket? You're kidding? We can tell if we have control of it-if the other airline has control, it tells us that in our system. If it doesn''t and the PNR header says "ETKT NN Sync", we just sync the ticket.

No, DL can tell. When they haven't been given control they can't even view the Electronic Ticket Record, if they have then they can view it.

At DL if they aren't synced, DL calls it "hooked", it will say ETKT ELIGIBILE at the top of the PNR. We would pull up the etkt by either searching for it with flight and date or using an entry utilizing a given ticket number. If the ticket hasn't been sent or DL has control of it the ticket will be unable to be displayed and there is nothing a DL agent can do with that ticket until the ticket has been reissued by NW. NW is the only carrier where DL has this problem.

Quoting Falcon84 (Reply 47):
The fact that the DL agent told our friend he needed to go back and get the ticket printed tells me that the agent didn't really know how to sync it and gain control of it. If NW hadn't given control of the ticket, the agent would have probably acted differently, I would think, in my experience.

You can't quote the way it works at NW as though that is how it works at DL. DL agents use a different system. It sounds like NW has a good one, now all they need to do is teach their outsourced employees how to reissue a ticket.

Quoting Falcon84 (Reply 47):
Incorrect. As Skyteam partners, DL and NW can accept or send tickets over to other Skyteam partners WITHOUT endorsement, and without a paper ticket. It CAN be printed, and also not need endorsement, but Skyteam members can reroute without endorsement. Better read up on that, my friend.

That only applies to paper ticket voluntary changes. Etkts are still required to go through the airline "plated" on the electronic ticket for reissues.
Effective May 1, 2007 DL requires all airlines utilizing rule 120.20, or IATA Resolution 735d to reissue tickets to show proper routing and new operating carrier and DL reciprocates. This includes paper tickets without proper routing. This is one of the steps of the process for DL and most IATA carriers to be all electronic by Dec.07.
It's a big building with patients, but that's not important right now.

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