nzblue
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Frontier, Hawaiian Look At Partnership

Fri Sep 07, 2007 1:45 am

Nothing that hasn't already been thrown around both this forum and the general rumor mill a few times, but I thought I'd post it since it did end up in today's Denver Post. Enjoy!

Frontier, Hawaiian Look At Partnership
It's an entirely different kind of flying; all together.
 
Bluewave 707
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RE: Frontier, Hawaiian Look At Partnership

Fri Sep 07, 2007 2:33 am

That could mean ...

a) HA's possible expansion into DIA

and/or

b) HA feeding F9 @ HA's west coast destinations & F9 feeding more pax to Hawai‘i.

Looks like it could be a win-win for HA and F9.
"The best use of your life will be to so live your life, that the use of your life will outlive your life" -- D Severn
 
EXAAUADL
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RE: Frontier, Hawaiian Look At Partnership

Fri Sep 07, 2007 2:37 am

Hawaii is the #1 destination for FF miles..Probably F9 wants to get into the Hawaii market so they can use Hawaii as leverage when pushing their FF program. Probably it will be burn only. F9 FF members can burn their miles to Hawaii. Doubt it will be the reverse, but you never know. Maybe a codeshare from LAX, SFO and SAN to DEN withe the HA code on F9 flights, but not necessary.


Just wondering before some clown claims there is a merger in the works
 
Mikey711MN
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RE: Frontier, Hawaiian Look At Partnership

Fri Sep 07, 2007 2:41 am

Quoting EXAAUADL (Reply 2):
Just wondering before some clown claims there is a merger in the works

Wow! I wonder if there's a merg... err, wait.  Wink

Quoting Bluewave 707 (Reply 1):
That could mean ...

a) HA's possible expansion into DIA

and/or

b) HA feeding F9 @ HA's west coast destinations & F9 feeding more pax to Hawai‘i.

I would think the latter first almost by default, but certainly the former not terribly much thereafter.

-Mike
I plan on living forever. So far, so good...
 
Ramp2CSA2FA2FO
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RE: Frontier, Hawaiian Look At Partnership

Fri Sep 07, 2007 3:01 am

According to the article it seems to be pretty clear that it is a code-share agreement of some sort. Quoting Frontier Spokesman Joe Hodas "It's one of the relationships and code-share thoughts that we've had off and on for quite some time". It seems to me that it would make good sense to have a code share agreement with them to expand their customer base to Hawaii and points served by Hawaiin Airlines. Keep up the good work Frontier.

Happy Landings,

Jay.
 
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SANFan
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RE: Frontier, Hawaiian Look At Partnership

Fri Sep 07, 2007 3:15 am

I haven't heard much on the rumor mill about HA looking at DEN but, hey, maybe there will be more from now on.

The idea of using HA's west coast stations to connect to F9 flights doesn't really make much sense, does it? Most F9 flights from SAN, LAX, SFO, SJC, SMF, PDX, SEA and even LAS and PHX, go to, let's see now, oh yeah, DEN. What's the point of a HA/F9 agreement -- to provide either connecting traffic from HNL or OGG to DEN or double-connections from HNL or OGG (via west coast city plus DEN) to F9 destinations beyond DEN. Again, not many pax would do that, would they?

There are a relatively few F9 flights from the west coast into Mexico and a couple of non-DEN flights but unless HA starts flying n/s HNL-DEN, or F9 starts a lot of P-2-P flying from the west coast overflying DEN, this talk doesn't make sense to me.

bb
 
hnl-jack
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RE: Frontier, Hawaiian Look At Partnership

Fri Sep 07, 2007 3:28 am

DEN has been a market that HA has looked at for a long time. However, without connection feed, the market would probably not support additional non-stop service to Hawaii. A code share agreement with FL at DIA probably makes for a sound business relationship. I would look for an announcement this fall indicating HA will serve DIA with daily non-stop service to HNL early next year.
 
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OzarkD9S
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RE: Frontier, Hawaiian Look At Partnership

Fri Sep 07, 2007 3:34 am

Wonder if they'll end up in a 3-way with FL?
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Which are the children of an idle brain." -Mercutio
 
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mariner
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RE: Frontier, Hawaiian Look At Partnership

Fri Sep 07, 2007 3:39 am

Quoting Mikey711MN (Reply 3):
Wow! I wonder if there's a merg... err, wait.  

I don't think anyone is talking about merger, but I think that a Frontier and Hawaiian link-up of some kind could make sense.

 Smile

mariner
aeternum nauta
 
HALFA
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RE: Frontier, Hawaiian Look At Partnership

Fri Sep 07, 2007 6:39 am

Quoting NZblue (Thread starter):
but I thought I'd post it since it did end up in today's Denver Post.

Thanks for posting it, hadn't seen it.

Quoting Bluewave 707 (Reply 1):
Looks like it could be a win-win for HA and F9.

 checkmark 

Quoting SANFan (Reply 5):
I haven't heard much on the rumor mill about HA looking at DEN but, hey, maybe there will be more from now on.



Quoting HNL-Jack" class=quote target=_blank>HNL-Jack (Reply 6):
DEN has been a market that HA has looked at for a long time. However, without connection feed, the market would probably not support additional non-stop service to Hawaii.

Yes. It has often been speculated that HA would expand to Denver and I think it will happen sooner rather than later.
Presently, only UA flies the route with a daily nonstop and the flight is full year round. I have family members working for UA in DEN and they often have difficulty standing by for this flight. I think HA could hold it's own on this route with or without a code share with Frontier, as there are thousands of ex-Californians living in the Denver metro area that love Hawaii, not to mention the ex-pat Hawaiian community there.

Quoting HNL-Jack" class=quote target=_blank>HNL-Jack (Reply 6):
I would look for an announcement this fall indicating HA will serve DIA with daily non-stop service to HNL early next year.

I would be a very happy person if this happened.

Aloha,
HALFA
Hawaiian Airlines Since 1929...........
 
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SANFan
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RE: Frontier, Hawaiian Look At Partnership

Fri Sep 07, 2007 7:55 am

And, gulp, where will the a/c for this service come from? (Especially with MNL on the near horizon as well...) Which current service is to be sacrificed; any speculation HNL-Jack, HALFA, anyone? (With the new entry soon starting SEA-HNL service, do you see HA cutting anything in that market? My guess: probably not.)

bb
 
hnl-jack
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RE: Frontier, Hawaiian Look At Partnership

Fri Sep 07, 2007 10:30 am

Quoting SANFan (Reply 10):
And, gulp, where will the a/c for this service come from? (Especially with MNL on the near horizon as well...) Which current service is to be sacrificed; any speculation HNL-Jack, HALFA, anyone? (With the new entry soon starting SEA-HNL service, do you see HA cutting anything in that market? My guess: probably not.)

bb

Rather than cut service, it might be possible that HA may be looking for two to three more 763's. I don't have any inside information, but I wouldn't be surprised.
 
BP1
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RE: Frontier, Hawaiian Look At Partnership

Fri Sep 07, 2007 10:56 am

Mark Dunkerely (Hawaiian - Presidnet and Chief Operating Officer) has not moved into this spot without knowing the strategic advantages to partnerships, relations and alliances through his work in US Government Relations while working for British Airways in Washington D.C. combined with his other various senior leadership capacities with smaller carriers over the past 15-20 years. If we take a look at what Mark has done at HA since coming in, he had to deal with a PR mess from a financially backwards former employee, brought the airline out of bankruptcy, standardized the fleet to the 767 and 717 product away from the DC-10's and has added service to additional locations. If, and only if, Mark is thinking about this move, it will be well thought out before it happens, or perhaps it has already has been well thought out. In working with Mark in the 1990's in the Washington DC office for British Airways there was never any doubt his educational and managerial background combined with his British background and character would significantly benefit a major niche carrier one-day.

Hawaiian recently announced Honolulu to Manila in 2008 and made an aircraft announcement for some additional 767-300's in 2008. Going into Denver really would be a win for Hawaiian as they can hit upon one of United's major hubs while gaining access to passengers that like the F9 service and planes better than the UA product. There are actaully people that want to fly Hawaiian because of the great service instead of the UA standard product.

Flying back and forth across the Pacific on Hawaiian and United is night and day difference. The Hawaiian service, movies, mini-dvd players, enormous movie selection, HOT meals and being able to use credit and debit cards for in-flight purchases make Hawaiian a much more superior experience than flying on UA.

So, a move into Denver would be fantastic for Hawaiian and add substantial value to Frontier. Ever since the USAirways breakup 1.5 years ago, Hawaiian has not really had a major payer to work with in the US.

Or perhaps a non-stop from New York to take on CO too? You can always speculate to Jet Blue or Virgin America too. But regardless, looking at where HA has come from and what it is now under Mark's leadership is certainly something to keep in mind.

Cheers,
BP1

[Edited 2007-09-07 04:07:30]
"First To Fly The A-380" / 26 October 2007 SYD-SIN Inaugural
 
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SANFan
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RE: Frontier, Hawaiian Look At Partnership

Fri Sep 07, 2007 12:33 pm

Quoting HNL-Jack" class=quote target=_blank>HNL-Jack (Reply 11):
Rather than cut service, it might be possible that HA may be looking for two to three more 763's.



Quoting BP1 (Reply 12):
Hawaiian recently announced Honolulu to Manila in 2008 and made an aircraft announcement for some additional 767-300's in 2008.

Hmmmmm. I certainly seemed to have missed that "aircraft announcement" BP1; details please?

Despite the possibility of cutbacks on existing routes to free up a/c (if HA doesn't/can't find additional 763s in time), both MNL and DEN (especially within the context of some sort of Frontier-relationship) certainly would be great moves for HA.

Of note is the rumor that UA might be expanding their west coast-Hawaii service (e.g. their current SAN-HNL and SEA-HNL Saturday only schedules); wouldn't it be ironic (perhaps more than a coincidence?) if Pualani suddenly started showing up daily at DIA (other than when the Raiders or Seahawks are playing the Broncos at Invesco)?!

It looks like 2008 might be a very interesting year for Hawaiian! I am always happy when nice things happen at one of my favorite airlines (and ex-employer.)

bb
 
HAL
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RE: Frontier, Hawaiian Look At Partnership

Fri Sep 07, 2007 2:20 pm

Quoting BP1 (Reply 12):
and made an aircraft announcement for some additional 767-300's in 2008.

I think I missed that one too BP1. As a pilot for Hawaiian I'm pretty close to any rumors coming out (I'd heard about Manila 6 months ago) and haven't heard anything about more planes, although that would be great news. Any word on where that came from?

HAL
One smooth landing is skill. Two in a row is luck. Three in a row and someone is lying.
 
BP1
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RE: Frontier, Hawaiian Look At Partnership

Fri Sep 07, 2007 2:36 pm

HAL - You got me - I was writing from a biz.yahoo press release I had read from a few weeks ago that said HA took delivery of (4) 767's this year. I was wrong and thought the airline was getting the planes later this year - must be getting old-age already.

The link is here:

http://biz.yahoo.com/prnews/070827/lam126.html?.v=8

Are the (4) planes already in use?

Regards,
BP1

[Edited 2007-09-07 07:37:51]
"First To Fly The A-380" / 26 October 2007 SYD-SIN Inaugural
 
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SANFan
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RE: Frontier, Hawaiian Look At Partnership

Fri Sep 07, 2007 3:06 pm

Quoting BP1 (Reply 15):
HAL - You got me - I was writing from a biz.yahoo press release I had read from a few weeks ago that said HA took delivery of (4) 767's this year. I was wrong and thought the airline was getting the planes later this year - must be getting old-age already

Mahalo (HAL) for getting that cleared up.

Continue to keep Pualani flying high, beautiful, and turbulence-free!

bb
 
HAL
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RE: Frontier, Hawaiian Look At Partnership

Fri Sep 07, 2007 3:23 pm

Quoting BP1 (Reply 15):
Are the (4) planes already in use?

Yes. Those are the four ex-Delta planes that were extensively modified from their original non-ER form to become 'EM' models. They don't have the fuel capacity of the ER's, but do have all the required ETOPS equipment for overwater flights. We also had new interiors put into them so they look very nice inside and out. They are N594HA, and 596, 597, 598 too. They don't have the power or lift capacity of the beefier ER's, but they do well for us between Hawaii and the west coast.

HAL
One smooth landing is skill. Two in a row is luck. Three in a row and someone is lying.
 
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Pohakuloa
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RE: Frontier, Hawaiian Look At Partnership

Fri Sep 07, 2007 4:34 pm

I'd say that definitely more aircraft would be a must if expansion to DIA is puched forward upon. I see this mostly because if HA hits their target of 4 non-stop flights a week HNL-MNL and then adds DIA service of any sort, a few more planes should be in the works for HA or else face cutting back on other routes (which by all accounts from people on these message boards is a level above everything else to Hawaii and prefered to other airlines flying across the pacific).

I would tend to agree that HA service is tops of anywhere I have yet to experience and an expansion to DIA would definitely bring smiles to the faces of both Hawaiians and the good people of Colorado.
Fast cars and 'Jet A' - such a sweet smell!
 
hnl-jack
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RE: Frontier, Hawaiian Look At Partnership

Fri Sep 07, 2007 5:10 pm

quote
"Mark Dunkerely (Hawaiian - Presidnet and Chief Operating Officer) has not moved into this spot without knowing the strategic advantages to partnerships, relations and alliances through his work in US Government Relations while working for British Airways in Washington D.C. combined with his other various senior leadership capacities with smaller carriers over the past 15-20 years. If we take a look at what Mark has done at HA since coming in, he had to deal with a PR mess from a financially backwards former employee, brought the airline out of bankruptcy, standardized the fleet to the 767 and 717 product away from the DC-10's"

I would agree that Mark has proved to be a fantastic leader of HA, however it was their former president, Paul Casey who ordered the 717
 
F9Animal
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RE: Frontier, Hawaiian Look At Partnership

Fri Sep 07, 2007 5:30 pm

Wow! This would be a great move for both HA and F9. It will attract more passengers for both airlines, and really enhance the route maps for both. Maybe the attempts of the West Coast expansions from F9 were in hopes of the HA deal. However, it would make more sense for HA to go into DEN. I do know a few execs from F9 dreamed of eventually flying into Hawaii, but it just was that, a dream (maybe someday though!) HA could also really benefit with LYNX.

On a side note,,, HA is going to score with service to the Philippines. Those planes are going to be packed.
I Am A Different Animal!!
 
DIA
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RE: Frontier, Hawaiian Look At Partnership

Fri Sep 07, 2007 11:19 pm

I could go on talking like so many of us do, but the fact is, I would be beating around the bush...so let me be frank...we would all love to see those Hawaiian 763s in Denver. End of story.
Ding! You are now free to keep supporting Frontier.
 
CitrusCritter
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RE: Frontier, Hawaiian Look At Partnership

Fri Sep 07, 2007 11:27 pm

Quoting F9Animal (Reply 20):
Wow! This would be a great move for both HA and F9.

Just imagine the benefits of a 3-way interline between HA, F9, and FL. The connection possibilities for all involved and the expanded offerings would just be amazing.
- CitrusCritter
Long Live the 717!
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