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xtoler
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RE: Sukhoi Superjet-100 Roll Out Count Down Thread

Thu Sep 27, 2007 9:11 am

Quoting EYKD (Reply 90):
Parenthetically, and with regard to the A/C's aesthetics, I have often puzzled at the previous, uniquely odd looks of earlier Soviet jetliners. The only explanation I can come up with is that much of the technology and design I would imagine would have been borrowed from Soviet military application. The "Superjet" seems to have shed that aesthetic connection...

Times have changed and there is a lot of sharing of different technologies available now to the Eastern countries which weren't available during the Soviet era. In their present economy there is no reason to have to interchange parts from a civilian airliner to a military aircraft in case of war. Also, there are more freedoms (as far as I know) in regards to designing aircraft there now. With somewhat free trade there is less reason to copy other people's plans in a covert way.

No offense to Russians: but at least through this web site and what we share of our interest in aviation, it seems relations are a lot warmer between us than they were some 18 years ago.

Kudos on the Super Jet, I've been looking forward to this for quite a while.

Larry
EMB145 F/A, F/E, J41 F/A, F/E, because my wife clipped my wings, armchair captain
 
xtoler
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RE: Sukhoi Superjet-100 Roll Out Count Down Thread

Thu Sep 27, 2007 9:57 am

Quoting SSTsomeday (Reply 99):
guess you give the public and media credit for being a lot more fair and open minded (or oblivious) than I do.

I still think there is a stigma to get over, and that the media would be much more interested in the mileage they could get out of an American airline buying a Russian airliner, than they could about a Brazilian or European airliner.

And I believe that airlines are acutely aware of public opinion and of image.

I agree that the majority of the travelling public are not aware of what they are flying in, but I suggest that for a Russian A/C it would be different.

Also, relations between Russia and The U.S. are becoming more icy with each passing day, as the Russian government regresses in many way more towards it's old Soviet ways, and does more and more global posturing. I would think prospective buyers of this A/C, who would be committed to it for up to 20 years, are not unaware of factors such as potential interuptions in the supply/repair chain, or disruptions in deliveries due to political posturing, sanctions, or freezing of assets from one of the respective governments somewhere down the line.

I didn't want to be too political, but yes, our relations with the Russian government is not great at the moment (sorry, Russian guys). If aviation decisions were built on what our so called "news" media has to say, we would be in even worse shape. I do notice no mention of this aircraft in any American media. Probabably a good thing if some of our airlines do decide to buy it. I could just imagine now Rush Limbaugh making a big stink out of it... And to think Boeing had anything to do with this! Oh my goodness! What is this world coming to?

As far as the American public not knowing what they are flying in is very true. What they don't know, ain't gonna hurt em, might even make 'em stronger. When I was an F/A on J41's and EMB145's I'd get a few questions from fellow enthusiasts and a lot of times I could give them answers off the top of my head. If I couldn't and I had plenty of time to kill and not working I'd get more in depth and glance at some of the specific data off the specific aircraft's data from the permanant manuals. If some of you are asking, they are not flight specific details. I'm an aviation geek, and the second thing I liked best on my flights were fellow enthusiasts like myself. Nine times out of ten, pax really don't care except to go from point a to point b and don't care how or what they are flying on as long as they get to where they are going.
EMB145 F/A, F/E, J41 F/A, F/E, because my wife clipped my wings, armchair captain
 
ikramerica
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RE: Sukhoi Superjet-100 Roll Out Count Down Thread

Thu Sep 27, 2007 11:13 am

Quoting SSTsomeday (Reply 99):
I guess you give the public and media credit for being a lot more fair and open minded (or oblivious) than I do.

No, you give them no credit, or more specifically, you give Americans no credit.

What you forget is that "Americans" are from everywhere. In most of our major cities, 20-25% of the population was not born in the USA. And no matter how hard some politicians or the press try to influence buying habits, it rarely has an impact. Boycott french wine and cheese? Nah, didn't take.

Further, we don't seem to be holding too much of a grudge v. Germany and Japan considering our automobile market, nor do we feel the Japanese cars are crap even though at one time they were. Same holds for Korean cars, which entered our market as garbage but are now quite good.

Again, it's the airlines buying the planes, not the public, and the percentage of people who would see it was called Sukhoi and connect that to Russia and refuse to fly is miniscule. Most wouldn't know the name Sukhoi meant it was actually FROM Russia, as we have other products with all sorts of names that are from all sorts of places. Think about the brand of a certain helicopter manufacturer, and it sure sounds like it's Russian...  Wink

Again, the vast majority of fliers do not know that Embraer is from Brazil, and they are surprised to find out. But few think it must be less safe because it aint 'merican.

For better or worse we have faith in the FAA to not allow unsafe planes to be flying in the USA. And considering the decline in fatal plane crashes in the USA over time, maybe that faith isn't as silly as some people make it out to be?

So if the FAA says the plane is safe for our skies, and the airlines determine that they are reliable and that parts are going to be easy to get now and into the future, then the airlines will buy them. And the public will climb aboard, ask for a full can of coke, and life will go on.  Smile
Of all the things to worry about... the Wookie has no pants.
 
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EYKD
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RE: Sukhoi Superjet-100 Roll Out Count Down Thread

Thu Sep 27, 2007 2:18 pm

Quoting Ikramerica (Reply 102):
Think about the brand of a certain helicopter manufacturer, and it sure sounds like it's Russian...

Sikorsky doesn't sound Russian, it is Russian!  Smile

Sukhoi made right decision to change this bird's name from Russian Regional Jet to Sukhoi Super Jet. This makes the a/c "sounds" more international. In the recent time it's more and more called just Super Jet.

Also, Sukhoi and Italian's Alenia just announced creation of the joint company that will take care of Super Jet 100 sales in the Western countries, including USA. Thus, for the majority of the flying people it will sound like "Italian" a/c  Wink
 
phxplanes
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RE: Sukhoi Superjet-100 Roll Out Count Down Thread

Thu Sep 27, 2007 2:26 pm

Is it just me or is every new aircraft starting to look like Embraer, especially the nose. 787, crj c series, superjet.
 
ikramerica
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RE: Sukhoi Superjet-100 Roll Out Count Down Thread

Thu Sep 27, 2007 3:12 pm

Quoting EYKD (Reply 103):
Sikorsky doesn't sound Russian, it is Russian!  

Well yeah, but it isn't a Russian company. That's the point. Sikorsky was an American, becoming a citizen in 1928, just like so many others who emigrated to this country, so the idea that people in this country would judge another company by name alone is somewhat shortsighted.

Especially since Sukhoi sounds Asian to us. Big grin
Of all the things to worry about... the Wookie has no pants.
 
Alias1024
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RE: Sukhoi Superjet-100 Roll Out Count Down Thread

Thu Sep 27, 2007 3:13 pm

Quoting Ikramerica (Reply 97):
Most people don't know that a Embraer comes from Brazil or that Bombardier is from Canada, and they think SAAB is made by the same company that makes cars, as are Rolls Royce engines, so few people would even know it was from Russia anyway, and those that did would be savvy enough to make a judgment on the plane based on whether it's comfortable inside...

Good points. Going along with that, I don't think the name Sukhoi is going to register as a Russian name in people's minds like Antonov or Tupolev might. Someone posted an advertisement for the Superjet in the crewroom where I work. I saw two captains looking at the ad, commenting that it was a very good looking plane, then trying to decide where it came from. They thought Sukhoi looked like a Japanese name.
It is a mistake to think you can solve any major problems with just potatoes.
 
ikramerica
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RE: Sukhoi Superjet-100 Roll Out Count Down Thread

Thu Sep 27, 2007 3:31 pm

Quoting Alias1024 (Reply 106):
They thought Sukhoi looked like a Japanese name.

Yep. Sounds very Japanese to us Westerners.

Kind of sounds like a breed of Japanese dog or something... Big grin
Of all the things to worry about... the Wookie has no pants.
 
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EYKD
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RE: Sukhoi Superjet-100 Roll Out Count Down Thread

Thu Sep 27, 2007 6:42 pm

A couple of more pics:

Big version: Width: 800 Height: 600 File size: 90kb


Big version: Width: 800 Height: 515 File size: 98kb


Again, I'm not the author of these photos, they were brought from Komsomolsk by one of Sukhoi Civil Aircrafts Company employees and put into internal shared folder.
 
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EYKD
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RE: Sukhoi Superjet-100 Roll Out Count Down Thread

Thu Sep 27, 2007 11:08 pm

It seems like we have the very first official Super Jet photo in airliner.net database!


View Large View Medium
Click here for bigger photo!

Photo © Youri Kabernik

 
RicciPettit
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RE: Sukhoi Superjet-100 Roll Out Count Down Thread

Thu Sep 27, 2007 11:16 pm

In that picture above, anyone think it looks a bit "mercure-esqe"?

Just me? Never mind then.
Elements of the past and the future combining to make something not quite as good as either!
 
RussianJet
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RE: Sukhoi Superjet-100 Roll Out Count Down Thread

Thu Sep 27, 2007 11:18 pm

Quoting RicciPettit (Reply 110):
In that picture above, anyone think it looks a bit "mercure-esqe"?

Only in the way the engines are mounted on the wing. I know what you mean, but overall the aircraft looks pretty different.
✈ Every strike of the hammer is a blow against the enemy. ✈
 
mrocktor
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RE: Sukhoi Superjet-100 Roll Out Count Down Thread

Thu Sep 27, 2007 11:24 pm

Quoting Phxplanes (Reply 104):
Is it just me or is every new aircraft starting to look like Embraer

Blame modern CFD. Since all planes fly in the same atmosphere, shapes that are efficient for one plane are likely to be efficient for another. With modern computing tools, its a lot less trial and error - and it was trial and error that generated all those different and interesting shapes.

Prepare to see convergence, followed by minor optimizations around that basic shape. Until someone finds out something compeltely new that is better and everyone moves to that.
 
kochamLOT
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RE: Sukhoi Superjet-100 Roll Out Count Down Thread

Thu Sep 27, 2007 11:27 pm

How does this aircraft compare directly with the ejets efficiency wise and are there any orders for this plane outside the old USSR and third world? The new pics on a.net show the aircraft is a real beauty looking similar to the 728 jet that I also liked.
 
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Owleye
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RE: Sukhoi Superjet-100 Roll Out Count Down Thread

Thu Sep 27, 2007 11:46 pm

Nice jet, nice livery design. Congratulations Sukhoi!
 
a300
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RE: Sukhoi Superjet-100 Roll Out Count Down Thread

Fri Sep 28, 2007 3:19 am

Nice looking aircraft. Can't wait to see it with the Homa bird on its tail.
Boland Aseman Jayegah Man Ast.
 
LaminarFlow
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RE: Sukhoi Superjet-100 Roll Out Count Down Thread

Fri Sep 28, 2007 3:31 am

A beautiful bird, indeed.

Sukhoi - Поздравляю вас!
 
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csturdiv
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RE: Sukhoi Superjet-100 Roll Out Count Down Thread

Fri Sep 28, 2007 4:16 am

Is the rollout plane flyable, or was it rolled out like the B787? When are they going to start the test flight phase of it?
An American expat from the ORD area living and working in SYD
 
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EYKD
Posts: 141
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RE: Sukhoi Superjet-100 Roll Out Count Down Thread

Fri Sep 28, 2007 4:18 am

Quoting LaminarFlow (Reply 116):
Sukhoi - Ïîçäðàâëÿþ âàñ!

Wow! What a great job on Russian language! Ñïàñèáî! Thank you!
 
ENU
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RE: Sukhoi Superjet-100 Roll Out Count Down Thread

Fri Sep 28, 2007 4:20 am

Quoting Csturdiv (Reply 117):
Is the rollout plane flyable, or was it rolled out like the B787? When are they going to start the test flight phase of it?

It's a test frame, but I think this one will fly. Other frames are used for static tests. Six aircraft will be built for testing purposes. The first flight is scheduled before the end of the year.
 
ENU
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RE: Sukhoi Superjet-100 Roll Out Count Down Thread

Fri Sep 28, 2007 4:21 am

Quoting Csturdiv (Reply 117):
Is the rollout plane flyable, or was it rolled out like the B787? When are they going to start the test flight phase of it?

It's a test frame, but I think this one will fly. Other frames are used for static tests. Six aircraft will be built for testing purposes. The first flight is scheduled before the end of the year.
 
ENU
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RE: Sukhoi Superjet-100 Roll Out Count Down Thread

Fri Sep 28, 2007 4:24 am

Quoting Csturdiv (Reply 117):
Is the rollout plane flyable, or was it rolled out like the B787? When are they going to start the test flight phase of it?

It's a test frame, but I think this one will fly. Other frames are used for static tests. Six aircraft will be built for testing purposes. The first flight is scheduled before the end of they year.
 
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EYKD
Posts: 141
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RE: Sukhoi Superjet-100 Roll Out Count Down Thread

Fri Sep 28, 2007 4:36 am

Quoting Csturdiv (Reply 117):
Is the rollout plane flyable, or was it rolled out like the B787? When are they going to start the test flight phase of it?

Yes, it is the first flying bird. It will take part in certification and will remain in company's property. There are supposed to be (3) more flying test frames that will be later handed off to the customers.

As for the non-flying frames: One has been already assembled in early-2007 and is under the static tests in Zhukovsky now. There will be one more assembled for fatigue tests.
 
ikramerica
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RE: Sukhoi Superjet-100 Roll Out Count Down Thread

Fri Sep 28, 2007 4:42 am

Quoting Csturdiv (Reply 117):
Is the rollout plane flyable, or was it rolled out like the B787? When are they going to start the test flight phase of it?

That should rear, like the 787, 777, 767, A380, A340, etc.  Wink
Of all the things to worry about... the Wookie has no pants.
 
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United787
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RE: Sukhoi Superjet-100 Roll Out Count Down Thread

Fri Sep 28, 2007 6:00 am

Quoting ENU (Reply 6):
Sukhoi plans to produce at least 700 RRJs, and intends to sell 35% of them in North America, 25% in Europe, 10% in Latin America, and 7% in Russia and China.

What about the remaining 23%? Asia?
 
Alessandro
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RE: Sukhoi Superjet-100 Roll Out Count Down Thread

Fri Sep 28, 2007 6:08 am

No, the Mercure had a different looking tail...
From New Yorqatar to Califarbia...
 
ikramerica
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RE: Sukhoi Superjet-100 Roll Out Count Down Thread

Fri Sep 28, 2007 6:33 am

Quoting Ikramerica (Reply 123):
That should rear, like the 787, 777, 767, A380, A340, etc.  

That should read, not rear. Either way, few modern planes are rolled out in flying condition. The only one people seem to really be fixated on is the 787, but the other recent programs have had similar roll-out scenarios. Maybe not quite as empty, but just as "not working."
Of all the things to worry about... the Wookie has no pants.
 
qf772
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RE: Sukhoi Superjet-100 Roll Out Count Down Thread

Fri Sep 28, 2007 7:41 am

Is it just me or does that livery make it hard to get a feel for the nose and cockpit windows,

it's disctracting like that checker camofalge car manufacturers use to disguise their new cars.

Nice looking bird though, good to see a bit of variety returning to the skies
Eagles may soar but weasles don't get sucked into jet engines
 
N766UA
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RE: Sukhoi Superjet-100 Roll Out Count Down Thread

Fri Sep 28, 2007 9:13 am

Embraersky!
 
KELPkid
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RE: Sukhoi Superjet-100 Roll Out Count Down Thread

Fri Sep 28, 2007 9:25 am

Quoting N766UA (Reply 128):
Embraersky!

 rotfl  Good one! Let's see if a.net adopts the name and then if the general public in the US adopts it  Wink
Celebrating the birth of KELPkidJR on August 5, 2009 :-)
 
JCKastrup
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RE: Sukhoi Superjet-100 Roll Out Count Down Thread

Fri Sep 28, 2007 9:48 am

What about the superjet as a freighter. Any perspectives or sale in that or is it strictly for passengers?
Who the hell wants to fly to JFK? Nobody does, That's who!
 
ikramerica
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RE: Sukhoi Superjet-100 Roll Out Count Down Thread

Fri Sep 28, 2007 9:59 am

Quoting JCKastrup (Reply 130):
What about the superjet as a freighter. Any perspectives or sale in that or is it strictly for passengers?

Propjets tend to work better as freighters than small jets, at least from what I can tell. They are more efficient, and cargo doesn't care about noise and vibration, and on shorter runs, 30 minutes longer flights won't matter much.
Of all the things to worry about... the Wookie has no pants.
 
TSS
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RE: Sukhoi Superjet-100 Roll Out Count Down Thread

Fri Sep 28, 2007 10:16 am

Quoting JCKastrup (Reply 130):
What about the superjet as a freighter.

The SuperJet seems a little smallish for freighter duty, but I imagine it would be easier for Sukhoi to build them with one big door and no interior trim than it is to build them with several doors and emergency exits plus a complete interior. If the demand is there, I'm sure Sukhoi will be more than happy to meet it.

I think in many ways, this will be the "make-or-break" step for Russian aviation in the US: If the SuperJet turns out to reliable and efficient, US-based airlines will be happy to buy them, but if it has problems or is a maintenance hog, no Russian manufacturer will be able to sell a single aircraft in the US for a very long time.

Congratulations Sukhoi! I hope the SuperJet turns out to be a great success.  Smile
Able to kill active threads stone dead with a single post!
 
ArtATL
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RE: Sukhoi Superjet-100 Roll Out Count Down Thread

Fri Sep 28, 2007 10:28 am

Yeah... looks nice... but how is it with that Cobra maneuver that its brother does so well?
 
burnsie28
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RE: Sukhoi Superjet-100 Roll Out Count Down Thread

Fri Sep 28, 2007 10:38 am

By far the most pathetic looking engines ever.
 
TSS
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RE: Sukhoi Superjet-100 Roll Out Count Down Thread

Fri Sep 28, 2007 1:14 pm

Quoting Burnsie28 (Reply 134):
By far the most pathetic looking engines ever.

Huh?
Who gives a rat's patoot how the engines look? It's how they work that counts.

Also, look at a first-generation 737: Those engines look like little cigars strapped to the wings compared to the huge high-bypass engines installed on later versions. Yet they worked, and worked well (for the period, of course).
Able to kill active threads stone dead with a single post!
 
sstsomeday
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RE: Sukhoi Superjet-100 Roll Out Count Down Thread

Fri Sep 28, 2007 3:46 pm

Quoting Xtoler (Reply 101):
I do notice no mention of this aircraft in any American media.

I would opine that would likely change if an American company placed an order.

Quoting Ikramerica (Reply 102):
No, you give them no credit, or more specifically, you give Americans no credit.

I should probably state here that I am also American.
I come in peace
 
JoeCanuck
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RE: Sukhoi Superjet-100 Roll Out Count Down Thread

Fri Sep 28, 2007 4:18 pm

The two biggest influences to the success of this plane in the west will be the costs to airlines, (purchase, operating), and the reliability of the supply chain.

Western industry really isn't very impressed with Putin's industrial shenanigans over the past few years. I reckon that not very many airlines will be impressed enough by the price or savings offered to be swayed by the potential downside. Companies like BP and Shell have learned, to the tune of billions of dollars, that a deal with russia isn't worth the paper it's printed on. Pitch a fit, turn off the gas to Europe.

The few percentage points of net profit that a successful airline pockets could be eaten away in a heartbeat by a petulant Putin deciding someone needed punishing this week. Sukhoi is going to have to give away these, otherwise, fine planes for them to receive any significant western acceptance.
What the...?
 
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EYKD
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RE: Sukhoi Superjet-100 Roll Out Count Down Thread

Fri Sep 28, 2007 4:44 pm

Quoting N766UA (Reply 128):
Embraersky!

Sorry, I object.  Smile
 
whappeh
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RE: Sukhoi Superjet-100 Roll Out Count Down Thread

Fri Sep 28, 2007 7:02 pm

Gorgeous looking aircraft. Shame it'll probably never fly in the US.... maybe some ultra rich guy will buy one and use it has a private jet.
-Travel now, journey infinitely.
 
andrewuber
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RE: Sukhoi Superjet-100 Roll Out Count Down Thread

Fri Sep 28, 2007 7:54 pm

What's with the logo on the tail?


View Large View Medium
Click here for bigger photo!

Photo © Youri Kabernik



From this angle it almost resembles this:



Nice looking bird though... wish we could see them in North America someday.

Drew

[Edited 2007-09-28 12:55:32]
I'd rather shoot BAD_MOTIVE
 
ENU
Topic Author
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RE: Sukhoi Superjet-100 Roll Out Count Down Thread

Fri Sep 28, 2007 8:05 pm

Quoting AndrewUber (Reply 140):
What's with the logo on the tail?

It's the Sukhoi logo:
 
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zululima
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RE: Sukhoi Superjet-100 Roll Out Count Down Thread

Fri Sep 28, 2007 8:08 pm

Quoting ENU (Reply 141):
It's the Sukhoi logo:

I guess they don't have sarcasm in the Netherlands.
I didn't get a 'Harumph' outta that guy!
 
andrewuber
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RE: Sukhoi Superjet-100 Roll Out Count Down Thread

Fri Sep 28, 2007 8:29 pm

Quoting ZuluLima (Reply 142):

 rotfl 

Nice one Zack!
I'd rather shoot BAD_MOTIVE
 
RussianJet
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RE: Sukhoi Superjet-100 Roll Out Count Down Thread

Fri Sep 28, 2007 9:48 pm

Quoting Burnsie28 (Reply 134):
By far the most pathetic looking engines ever.

Rubbish. They look cool, and they will work brilliantly.
✈ Every strike of the hammer is a blow against the enemy. ✈
 
MEA-707
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RE: Sukhoi Superjet-100 Roll Out Count Down Thread

Fri Sep 28, 2007 10:14 pm

Surprisingly nice airplane now we see it in reality.
But am I the only one to think the name Superjet is unbelievably tacky? It's like the discount supermarkets who advertise their dollar cans and packages of prepared food as "yummy" or "super"
nobody has ever died from hard work, but why take the risk?
 
RuudOnline
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RE: Sukhoi Superjet-100 Roll Out Count Down Thread

Fri Sep 28, 2007 11:27 pm

Quoting RussianJet (Reply 144):
Quoting Burnsie28 (Reply 134):
By far the most pathetic looking engines ever.

Rubbish. They look cool, and they will work brilliantly.

Well I dont like the looks of those engine either.

But who cares, its always nice to see a new plane rolling out of the factory.
 
RussianJet
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RE: Sukhoi Superjet-100 Roll Out Count Down Thread

Sat Sep 29, 2007 1:39 am

Quoting MEA-707 (Reply 145):
But am I the only one to think the name Superjet is unbelievably tacky?

No, it's a good name. I think it sounds a lot less tacky than 'dreamliner' for example.  Smile
✈ Every strike of the hammer is a blow against the enemy. ✈
 
mrocktor
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RE: Sukhoi Superjet-100 Roll Out Count Down Thread

Sat Sep 29, 2007 2:57 am

Quoting RussianJet (Reply 147):
I think it sounds a lot less tacky than 'dreamliner' for example.

Comparing to "Dreamliner" arguably sets the bar faily low. And in my opinion, Superjet fails to surpass even that low bar - by a large margin.
 
ikramerica
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RE: Sukhoi Superjet-100 Roll Out Count Down Thread

Sat Sep 29, 2007 3:34 am

Quoting Mrocktor (Reply 148):
Comparing to "Dreamliner" arguably sets the bar faily low. And in my opinion, Superjet fails to surpass even that low bar - by a large margin.

No worse than Super80...  Wink

I think it's fine.

And it makes it sound even MORE Japanese.

Please to buy my Sukhoi Superjet American Joe! And drink some Pokari Sweat why not? Super thirst annihilator!
Of all the things to worry about... the Wookie has no pants.

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