Lexy
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Sun Sep 23, 2007 1:43 am

Quoting Exusair (Reply 12):
Also, a merger with JetBlue.

LOL! GAWD what a curve ball you just threw.
Nashville, Tennessee KBNA
 
N270FT
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Sun Sep 23, 2007 1:46 am

I would really like to see more UK airports, perhaps BHX or STN.

AW
 
DAL767400ER
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Sun Sep 23, 2007 1:46 am

Quoting RJpieces (Reply 47):
If they do the latter, their new JFK operation will be a mess for years to come...

Like that would make any difference anymore after this summer  Wink .

Quoting ConcordeBoy (Reply 41):
Quoting Rcardinale (Reply 34):
The last time any airline flew BOS-BRU was Sabena in the 90's

IINM, didn't VG/Delsey offer service well beyond that?.

They sure did in 2002. IIRC, they actually launched BRU-BOS before BRU-JFK. But alas, like the airline, those routes obviously didn't last long.
 
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SLCUT2777
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Sun Sep 23, 2007 1:47 am

Quoting ChrisNH (Reply 17):
I don't know who to blame: Massport

Look no further than the infamous Port Authority of Massachusetts. They know how to screw up something good before it gets started.

Quoting Jetlanta (Reply 18):
If you really need to place blame, how about blaming the BOS market? If it was a better opportunity Delta would serve it. It's just not big enough, or high-yielding enough when considering all the existing competition at BOS and opportunities at JFK & ATL.

It would be nice if the Boston market were better, but their wonderful port authority  sarcastic  is nothing short of awful, and they've done little if anything to help promote international service in and out of Logan International Airport.  irked  Massport just has this attitude about "airlines coming into BOS to serve Massport." Until that most arrogant of bureaucratic attitude changes to the opposite, nothing great will happen at BOS. Despite all the problems the NYC Port Authority has at all three airports, there will be a bug sucking sound coming from New England that direction for the foreseeable future due to Massport. BOS might not be quite as big as NYC, Philly or DC-metro, but they do have much potential untapped.
DELTA Air Lines; The Only Way To Fly from Salt Lake City; Let the Western Heritage always be with Delta!
 
B752OS
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Sun Sep 23, 2007 1:57 am

Quoting EXAAUADL (Reply 44):
Boy you know zero about the airline industry....your entire above argument is precisely WHY JFK has lower yields...COMPETITION...let me ask you have you actually seen the P&Ls for DL on transatlantic routes served from both JFK and ATL??? I thought not. Guess who has..........me.

Wow, all I can do is laugh at you. Would you like a medal for seeing the data.

Quoting Jetlanta (Reply 33):
No one is saying that ATL is a more important business center man. The point being made here, if you'd calm down and listen, is that JFK has so much service and so many leisure passengers that yields are lower on average than ATL-Europe. This absolutely true. It isn't saying that ATL is a better gateway than JFK for passengers. It is saying that it is a more profitable gateway for Delta than JFK.

If you read the post I was repsonding to, never once was it mentioned that JFK has more competition wich equals lower yields. All that was mentioned was that JFK is filled with VFR and consolidator traffic.

Quoting SLCUT2777 (Reply 53):
It would be nice if the Boston market were better, but their wonderful port authority is nothing short of awful, and they've done little if anything to help promote international service in and out of Logan International Airport. Massport just has this attitude about "airlines coming into BOS to serve Massport." Until that most arrogant of bureaucratic attitude changes to the opposite, nothing great will happen at BOS. Despite all the problems the NYC Port Authority has at all three airports, there will be a bug sucking sound coming from New England that direction for the foreseeable future due to Massport. BOS might not be quite as big as NYC, Philly or DC-metro, but they do have much potential untapped.

In some respecits, such as this one, Massport sucks. BOS is a top 5 destination to Europe in the United States and could handle more service. The passengers are back to pre 9/11 levels and only growing.

Quoting Dbo861 (Reply 30):
Quoting Nycfly75 (Thread starter):
It was also said that he will be at JFK next week to address Delta's JFK Terminal Situation.

Could this be the long awaited announcement of plans to replace Terminals 2 and 3?

One could only hope so. AA has a brand new, beautiful terminal and I believe DL needs one to keep up with them. Are 2 and 3 going to be able to handle a large expansion by DL?
 
Humberside
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Sun Sep 23, 2007 1:59 am

Anyone know if JFK-EDI is definetly going ahead. Its on sale but there are rumours on some British aviation forums it wont happen. Also rumours of GLA-ATL
Visit the Air Humberside Website and Forum
 
Evan767
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Sun Sep 23, 2007 2:06 am

What a stupid argument... Get over it people.
The proper term is "on final" not "on finals" bud...
 
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SLCUT2777
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Sun Sep 23, 2007 2:19 am

Quoting Jetlanta (Reply 33):
It just isn't a profit goldmine for anyone.

Hopefully better rail service being discussed in another thread can make JFK as valuable to any carrier as LGA slots are. What hurts JFK more than anything is it's lack of proximity to mid-town Manhattan.
DELTA Air Lines; The Only Way To Fly from Salt Lake City; Let the Western Heritage always be with Delta!
 
Evan767
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Sun Sep 23, 2007 2:31 am

Quoting Humberside (Reply 55):
Anyone know if JFK-EDI is definetly going ahead

It's available for booking.
The proper term is "on final" not "on finals" bud...
 
gilesdavies
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Sun Sep 23, 2007 2:41 am

I wonder if there will be any new UK destinations to be added?

They should try and get a bite of the north London/Home Counties market, as AA are at STN, maybe they could compete with them on a 752/763 service LTN-JFK/ATL!

Well can hope!  pray 

I definately think there is potential for daily non-premium service from LTN to the USA...
 
B747forever
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DL To Announce Latest Int'l Expansion This Week

Sun Sep 23, 2007 2:43 am

Quoting Gilesdavies (Reply 59):
maybe they could compete with them on a 752/763 service LTN-JFK/ATL!

I dont think that this will happen.

Quoting Gilesdavies (Reply 59):
definately think there is potential for daily non-premium service from LTN to the USA...

That is already covered up with other carrier.
Work Hard, Fly Right
 
FlyPNS1
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Sun Sep 23, 2007 2:50 am

Quoting Jetlanta (Reply 36):
I should clarify this by saying that stage-adjusted yields are higher, on average, from ATL.

Which is exactly why your analysis of ATL's high-yields is flawed. You shouldn't need to stage adjust transatlantic revenues between flows over ATL versus flows over JFK. The difference isn't that great and DL should be charging a higher fare to make up for the extra difference. If DL isn't getting extra revenue to make up the difference, then the network clearly isn't so high yield.

That's not to say DL isn't making a profit on its transatlantic flying, but just to temper the cheerleaders who seem to believe everything DL touches is making massive profits.
 
Evan767
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Sun Sep 23, 2007 2:52 am

Regarding the Zagreb rumor:
DL JFK-ZAG? (by Evan767 Mar 5 2007 in Civil Aviation)

Here's the newspaper article:

http://img485.imageshack.us/my.php?image=pl3ze0.jpg
The proper term is "on final" not "on finals" bud...
 
RL757PVD
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Sun Sep 23, 2007 2:55 am

#1 enough with the yeilds.... those in the know...know you are right, and know what you will never convince the ignant ones  Smile

#2 while all airlines are stupid, and may schedule more flights than airport capacity, they arent going to schedule 40 mainline flights for 26 mainline gates. granted early or late flights might have to wait a little but whatever. Id imagine any large scale JFK expansion would involve more splitting of the banks and probably a 3rd, late bank so say like 4:30 7pm and 9pm. Key flights to competitive markets and long flights will be at the earlier times, and closer flights and less competitive routes can leave at 7 or 9p.
Experience is what you get when what you thought would work out didn't!
 
OOer
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Sun Sep 23, 2007 3:00 am

I have heard talk of DL possibly starting JFK - CTA and or PMO.....anyone hear anything similar?
 
Chugach
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DL To Announce Latest Int'l Expansion This Week

Sun Sep 23, 2007 3:36 am

Quoting USAirALB (Reply 35):
hows ATL/CVG-ANC doin?

Fine for what they are (seasonal routes), but last I checked ANC wasn't an international destination for DL  Wink
 
nycfly75
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DL To Announce Latest Int'l Expansion This Week

Sun Sep 23, 2007 3:45 am

Quoting RJpieces (Reply 47):
while they rebuild T2/T3.

Who said thats the only option...there are others being discussed.
 
B747forever
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DL To Announce Latest Int'l Expansion This Week

Sun Sep 23, 2007 3:49 am

Quoting OOer (Reply 64):
have heard talk of DL possibly starting JFK - CTA and or PMO

Dont think they will start this routes.
Work Hard, Fly Right
 
nycfly75
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Sun Sep 23, 2007 3:51 am

JFk-NAP is more of a possibility
 
B747forever
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Sun Sep 23, 2007 4:04 am

Quoting Nycfly75 (Reply 68):
JFk-NAP is more of a possibility

I dont think so. But maybe I have wrong.
Work Hard, Fly Right
 
rwsea
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DL To Announce Latest Int'l Expansion This Week

Sun Sep 23, 2007 4:45 am

Quoting Nycfly75 (Reply 2):
China is only the tip of the iceberg

Right - but DL really only has capacity to add one 777 route. If they didn't get China, they would have had a backup in place, IMO.

Quoting BWilliams (Reply 38):
I would have thought that they'd do JFK-ARN... I can understand going through ATL, but I'm not sure that they'll have the pax load to make a go of that route.

Consistent with recent new transatlantic services, DL has added routes from ATL when the destination in question already had adequate NYC service (e.g. PRG, VIE, and now ARN).
 
by738
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Sun Sep 23, 2007 4:45 am

Quoting Humberside (Reply 55):
Also rumours of GLA-ATL

I think that is very unlikely given EDI-ATL was such a sensational flop.
 
GLAGAZ
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DL To Announce Latest Int'l Expansion This Week

Sun Sep 23, 2007 5:20 am

Quoting BY738 (Reply 71):
I think that is very unlikely given EDI-ATL was such a sensational flop.

Far from it in the summer months. Winter was really quite poor however.

Gaz
Neutrality means that u don't really care cos the struggle goes on even when ur not there, blind and unaware
 
Alitalia744
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DL To Announce Latest Int'l Expansion This Week

Sun Sep 23, 2007 5:39 am

Quoting B752OS (Reply 54):
Wow, all I can do is laugh at you. Would you like a medal for seeing the data.

Seriously, while I don't know you, I would suggest a cease and desist.

Yields out of ATL for TATL service are significantly higher than out of JFK, exception to a few routes. Again, while ATL is in the "country-bumpkin, red-neck, tabacki-chewin, confederate flag, southern-belle" South, it is amazing when one strips down and sees the potential of that city and the airport itself.

_________________________________________________

To Jetlanta & others - thanks for continuing to provide clarity on the yields and associated revenue potential for Delta and ATL/JFK.
_________________________________________________



As for JFK's terminal options - there are many options on the table and (I'm sure) DELTA has been connecting with the PANYNJ to fully understand what the long-term options are - either by building a new terminal or assuming portions/all of another terminal.

There are many factors at play including the mess that is JFK, DL's long-term vision for the airport and the NYC market, other airline usage, etc.

What will come out eventually is a plan that while it may not make sense to many here, or may even upset a few people here (afterall, when Delta switches the adverts on the napkins it seems to cause an uproar on a.net...), does make sense given the ability of the airport (design/space, etc) and Delta's long-term vision to NYC.

What it will be is nothing short of exciting for those of us who do happen to have a soft-spot in our hearts for the renewed (and now skinny) red-headed widget gal from the south.

Time will tell...

 Wink
Some see lines, others see between the lines.
 
PanAm747LHR
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DL To Announce Latest Int'l Expansion This Week

Sun Sep 23, 2007 5:55 am

Now here's what we really want to know - with DL announcing international expansion out of JFK (again!) next week, will CO step up to the plate and announce a few more cities out of EWR? VIE? NCE? MUC? VCE? HEL? CMN?
Crossing my fingers!

Nick
 
deltal1011man
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DL To Announce Latest Int'l Expansion This Week

Sun Sep 23, 2007 6:13 am

Quoting Exusair (Reply 12):
3X daily JFK-LHR in March. One 7am flight returning to JFK@10pm.
1 ATL-LHR in April.

i dont think JFK will get 3 flights i think they will keep it down to 1 JFK-LHR and one JFK-LGW CVG will stay LGW and ATL will do the same as JFK(DL only has 3 LHR slots BTW and i think the 3rd will go to LAX but if not i will bet it goes to ATL with 2 ATL-LHR and 1 ATL-LGW)

Quoting Dbo861 (Reply 30):
Could this be the long awaited announcement of plans to replace Terminals 2 and 3?

please god let them be riped down(though it is a shame to see old WorldPort go)

Quoting Nycfly75 (Reply 66):
Who said thats the only option...there are others being discussed.

like?
 
Evan767
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DL To Announce Latest Int'l Expansion This Week

Sun Sep 23, 2007 6:15 am

Quoting PanAm747LHR (Reply 74):
Now here's what we really want to know

We do?
The proper term is "on final" not "on finals" bud...
 
by738
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DL To Announce Latest Int'l Expansion This Week

Sun Sep 23, 2007 7:01 am

Quoting GLAGAZ (Reply 72):
Far from it in the summer months

Perhaps loads wise at height of summer, but if it was a highly profitable money spinner, why was it dropped ? and not even reinstated for the summer ?
I stand by flop. Someone better in the know will perhaps shed some light.

[Edited 2007-09-23 00:02:33]
 
nycfly75
Topic Author
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DL To Announce Latest Int'l Expansion This Week

Sun Sep 23, 2007 7:09 am

Quoting DeltaL1011man (Reply 75):
like?


Quoting Alitalia744 (Reply 73):
As for JFK's terminal options - there are many options on the table and (I'm sure) DELTA has been connecting with the PANYNJ to fully understand what the long-term options are - either by building a new terminal or assuming portions/all of another terminal.

There are many factors at play including the mess that is JFK, DL's long-term vision for the airport and the NYC market, other airline usage, etc.

What will come out eventually is a plan that while it may not make sense to many here, or may even upset a few people here (afterall, when Delta switches the adverts on the napkins it seems to cause an uproar on a.net...), does make sense given the ability of the airport (design/space, etc) and Delta's long-term vision to NYC.

What it will be is nothing short of exciting for those of us who do happen to have a soft-spot in our hearts for the renewed (and now skinny) red-headed widget gal from the south.

Time will tell...



I've heard about the various concepts. One in particular will make people on here spin, especially RJpieces.  

[Edited 2007-09-23 00:21:18]

[Edited 2007-09-23 00:24:30]
 
Evan767
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DL To Announce Latest Int'l Expansion This Week

Sun Sep 23, 2007 7:28 am

Quoting Nycfly75 (Reply 78):

I've heard about the various concepts.

Like?
The proper term is "on final" not "on finals" bud...
 
iflyatldl
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DL To Announce Latest Int'l Expansion This Week

Sun Sep 23, 2007 7:50 am

DL1011man: I agree with everything you posted except the LAX-LHR. For now, if DL ran that, they'll have their a$$ handed to them along with their lunch. LAX has four carriers in play at LAX for LHR(UA,AA,VS and BA). I could see them "testing the waters" doing LAX-LGW and seeing how that pans out. And down the road, why not SLC-LGW since they intend to put CDG into play. But, anything's possible.  Smile
Ah, Summer, Fenway Park, Boston Red Sox and Beer.....
 
Alitalia744
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DL To Announce Latest Int'l Expansion This Week

Sun Sep 23, 2007 7:59 am

Quoting Evan767 (Reply 79):
Like?

Evan - re-read what was written...
Some see lines, others see between the lines.
 
deltal1011man
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DL To Announce Latest Int'l Expansion This Week

Sun Sep 23, 2007 7:59 am

Quoting Iflyatldl (Reply 80):
DL1011man: I agree with everything you posted except the LAX-LHR. For now, if DL ran that, they'll have their a$$ handed to them along with their lunch. LAX has four carriers in play at LAX for LHR(UA,AA,VS and BA). I could see them "testing the waters" doing LAX-LGW and seeing how that pans out. And down the road, why not SLC-LGW since they intend to put CDG into play. But, anything's possible.

well its not so much me(i think it will be 2 ATL and 1 JFK-LHR) but i have seen it on here
 
GLAGAZ
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DL To Announce Latest Int'l Expansion This Week

Sun Sep 23, 2007 8:02 am

Quoting BY738 (Reply 77):
and not even reinstated for the summer ?
I stand by flop. Someone better in the know will perhaps shed some light.

You're entitled to your opinion, but I stick by my information. Which would appear credible to me. There will hopefully be developments over the next week regarding ATL and Scotland. If not, we're left with a rather poor choice of US cities to connect through.

Gaz
Neutrality means that u don't really care cos the struggle goes on even when ur not there, blind and unaware
 
iflyatldl
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Sun Sep 23, 2007 8:12 am

Yeah, I think it will be 2 ATL-LHR, 1, maybe 2 JFK-LHR, 1 Maybe JFK-LGW, 1 ATL-LGW, CVG-LGW and 1 CVG-JFK-LHR and 1 SLC-JFK-LHR. LGW has been established for DL for quite sometime time. And not everyone wants to deal with LHR. But, that's just me guessing. It's going to be interesting.  Smile
Ah, Summer, Fenway Park, Boston Red Sox and Beer.....
 
iflyatldl
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DL To Announce Latest Int'l Expansion This Week

Sun Sep 23, 2007 8:34 am

And here's another possibility: (who knows what the powers that be at DL are thinking?)CVG-LHR. IF, they did that, it would give CVG(one of several) shot in the arm it needs. Just a thought.
Ah, Summer, Fenway Park, Boston Red Sox and Beer.....
 
ScottishLaddie
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DL To Announce Latest Int'l Expansion This Week

Sun Sep 23, 2007 9:03 am

Quoting BY738 (Reply 71):
I think that is very unlikely given EDI-ATL was such a sensational flop.

An average load factor for the 12 months from June 06 to June 07 of 80% is a flop? Yes, it didn't perform particularly well in the winter, particularly in February. However, it's a strong route in the summer, and I believe with some better marketing could have been made to work year round. I still say they have been too hasty at chopping it so soon, and a lot of people will say the same thing. They might be starting to realise that themselves though -nor can it have done that bad- if they are looking at operating it summer only.
 
worldtraveler
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DL To Announce Latest Int'l Expansion This Week

Sun Sep 23, 2007 9:23 am

Glad you enjoyed debating the DOT data I referenced. As usual, half of the people who comment don't know what they are talking about even when given the numbers right from the DOT.

What is true is that DL's local and TOTAL ONBOARD is higher than that of most other carriers on comparable routes. WHAT THAT MEANS is that DL's connecting fares have to be higher than other carriers or they couldn't be outperforming other carriers. DL's local traffic on many of its international routes from ATL is about 20%; you can't outperform on the total segment if you don't have superior connecting traffic.

DL does well from ATL because it is able to pick off the most valuable connecting revenue because of the huge number of connections available.

DL also connects many cities to Europe which other carriers don't even serve - so they are able to set the price. JFK on the other hand is highly competitive. While it is a huge local market, prices are not near as good. JFK and ATL are the ying and yang in DL's network.


As for congestion, DL is going to offer, once again, first time service (at least by a US carrier) to a number of new cities. These are the precisely the flights that need to remain - and will.

DL also pushed back its departures so they would begin at 4.30 in an attempt to mitigate congestion at JFK. DL has and will continue to do its part - including pushing more and more flights away from the peak 5-7 departure period but it is also up to the Port Authority and the FAA to make an international network work. Every other country recognizes that in a congested environment, international flights have priority.

Also, you can bet that if a terminal announcement is coming that DL has a provision that if DL is forced to cut back on its flights, it will retain the right to pull the terminal expansion. The PANYNJ knows full well that they have to make DL's expansion work or they will get stuck with a bunch of incomplete buildings.
 
rjpieces
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DL To Announce Latest Int'l Expansion This Week

Sun Sep 23, 2007 9:55 am

Quoting Nycfly75 (Reply 66):
Who said thats the only option...there are others being discussed.



Quoting Alitalia744 (Reply 73):
What will come out eventually is a plan that while it may not make sense to many here, or may even upset a few people here (afterall, when Delta switches the adverts on the napkins it seems to cause an uproar on a.net...), does make sense given the ability of the airport (design/space, etc) and Delta's long-term vision to NYC.



Quoting Alitalia744 (Reply 81):
Evan - re-read what was written...

Oh Lord, I hope they don't take over part of T6...That's about the only thing I can think of based on your comments. I mean, let's see...the T4 plan is ok, but would involve a major expansion of the T4 concourses as well as check-in space. That alone could take a few years....T1/T5/T7/T9 can't be touched...There's only one terminal at JFK to be vacated in the near future and that's T6.

Could be interesting though...I'm sure jetBlue won't be happy, especially as their new terminal isn't going to be as large as they could now use.

I wonder what the process would be of Delta shifting some ops to T6...All domestic flights minus Comair would seem logical to me....It wouldn't be the worst situation in the world for two or three years...They would have to block in more connecting time for passengers though, for sure. Heck, they could even have a shuttle bus from T6 airside to T3 airside so that passengers don't have to go through security again.

But I guess the big question is how to rebuild T2/T3. I would guess that T2 has to be knocked down first, as T3 has Immigration and Customs facilities...Once T2 is knocked down, they could theoretically build a joint terminal with T1 and eventually expand it to where T3 is now.

Will be interesting to find out what they are thinking!
"Millions long for immortality who do not know what to do with themselves on a rainy Sunday afternoon"
 
worldtraveler
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DL To Announce Latest Int'l Expansion This Week

Sun Sep 23, 2007 10:36 am

back to the ATL discussion, remember also that DL uses one of the smallest long-range aircraft (the 763ER) as the backbone of its international fleet. Smaller aircraft are capable of supporting higher yields. With the exception of a handful of 762ERs, there is no smaller plane than the 763ER for flying flights from 4000-6000 miles (beyond the range of the 757). DL has used its 767s very well to build an int'l route system that maximizes the 763s capabilities while building on the relatively small size of the aircraft. Most other airlines use larger international aircraft. As DL continues to convert 764s and adds 777s, their average fleet size will grow but the 763 will still be used primarily to open up new long haul transatlantic routes; the 757s will be used from NYC for shorter routes but at least half of the 757s will be replacements for 767s so the 767s can open new, longer routes.
 
BWilliams
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DL To Announce Latest Int'l Expansion This Week

Sun Sep 23, 2007 11:29 am

Quoting RwSEA (Reply 70):
Consistent with recent new transatlantic services, DL has added routes from ATL when the destination in question already had adequate NYC service (e.g. PRG, VIE, and now ARN).

I think I'm missing something, here.

Does another carrier already run JFK-ARN direct? Or is it just that there are enough flights out of JFK that connect through LHR or AMS on other carriers?
Regards, Brad Williams
 
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OA412
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DL To Announce Latest Int'l Expansion This Week

Sun Sep 23, 2007 11:50 am

Quoting BWilliams (Reply 90):
I think I'm missing something, here.

Does another carrier already run JFK-ARN direct? Or is it just that there are enough flights out of JFK that connect through LHR or AMS on other carriers?

No, as the quote you referenced mentions, there is adequate service from NYC. Currently, there are no airlines offering JFK-ARN but 3 offer EWR-ARN service which DL obviously feels is adequate coverage for NYC.
Hughes Airwest - Top Banana In The West
 
deltal1011man
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DL To Announce Latest Int'l Expansion This Week

Sun Sep 23, 2007 3:19 pm

Quoting RJpieces (Reply 88):
Oh Lord, I hope they don't take over part of T6...That's about the only thing I can think of based on your comments. I mean, let's see...the T4 plan is ok, but would involve a major expansion of the T4 concourses as well as check-in space. That alone could take a few years....T1/T5/T7/T9 can't be touched...There's only one terminal at JFK to be vacated in the near future and that's T6.

hold on hold on there is one more open terminal at JFK although it will be gone after the move of AA thats T8(which has cumstoms right?) so who said DL could put flight into T8?(at least while they rebulid T2 and WorldPort(T3))?
 
B747forever
Posts: 13815
Joined: Mon May 21, 2007 9:50 pm

DL To Announce Latest Int'l Expansion This Week

Sun Sep 23, 2007 3:33 pm

Quoting OA412 (Reply 91):
No, as the quote you referenced mentions, there is adequate service from NYC. Currently, there are no airlines offering JFK-ARN but 3 offer EWR-ARN service which DL obviously feels is adequate coverage for NYC.

Will DL start ATL-ARN service??? They fly out of CPH to ATL.
Work Hard, Fly Right
 
jetlanta
Posts: 1662
Joined: Thu Jul 12, 2001 2:35 am

DL To Announce Latest Int'l Expansion This Week

Sun Sep 23, 2007 8:28 pm

Quoting FlyPNS1 (Reply 61):
Which is exactly why your analysis of ATL's high-yields is flawed. You shouldn't need to stage adjust transatlantic revenues between flows over ATL versus flows over JFK. The difference isn't that great and DL should be charging a higher fare to make up for the extra difference. If DL isn't getting extra revenue to make up the difference, then the network clearly isn't so high yield.

That's not to say DL isn't making a profit on its transatlantic flying, but just to temper the cheerleaders who seem to believe everything DL touches is making massive profits.

Certainly you understand the difference between yields and revenue. Delta clearly is getting far superior revenues over ATL. That is not in question.
 
tiago701
Posts: 168
Joined: Thu Jun 29, 2006 4:35 am

DL To Announce Latest Int'l Expansion This Week

Sun Sep 23, 2007 9:28 pm

Quoting B747forever (Reply 93):
Will DL start ATL-ARN service??? They fly out of CPH to ATL.

Read reply 73

I'm hoping to see LIS on that international expansion list.

Quoting Rcardinale (Reply 34):
I also think that it would be a good idea for DL to start BOS- BRU LIS and MAN.

Although i would like to see LIS added from BOS i think it would be harder to make it work without a portugese partner providing connections to the Azores from LIS. Connections from LIS to SID/RAI would be a plus as well.

BOS, where DL, doesn't have much feed when compared to ATL or JFK and would have to rely more on local traffic and, in my oppinion, to make it work that work it is important (or desirable) to provide connections to the Azores islands and Cape Verde.

JFK could be a possibility, although CO and TP are already serving the NYC market from EWR (the great majority of the Portuguese comunity is based in Newark) with 24 weekly flights to LIS and 3 to OPO. During the winter period i think the number of flights is around 12/13 to LIS and 3 to OPO. I don't know how many more flights can LIS support to NYC. Let's wait and see. Maybe DL can make it work relying on its connecting feed (especially to the East coast and Canada) on the top of O&D after competing for it with CO and TP.

About ATL, DL's main hub, i'm secptical it would work, even as a connecting point (for the Portuguese market) and the fares would have to be really good. Could a 752 do LIS-ATL without load restrictions?

I think JFK-LIS it is the most likely of these three options.

Lets wait and see.
 
nycfly75
Topic Author
Posts: 647
Joined: Wed Aug 24, 2005 9:38 pm

DL To Announce Latest Int'l Expansion This Week

Sun Sep 23, 2007 10:09 pm

Quoting DeltaL1011man (Reply 92):
at least while they rebulid T2 and WorldPort(T3))?

As I said they are exploring other options too. I think its almost safe to safe say that all or part of the land that occupies Terminal 3 will be a part of any redevelopment plan for Delta.
 
by738
Posts: 3059
Joined: Wed Sep 20, 2000 7:59 am

DL To Announce Latest Int'l Expansion This Week

Sun Sep 23, 2007 10:43 pm

Quoting ScottishLaddie (Reply 86):
An average load factor for the 12 months from June 06 to June 07 of 80% is a flop?

Perhaps you can show us the calculations for that one....oh and to convince me it wasnt a flop, Ill need the year round yield figures. I suspect, for the latter, ill be waiting a while. Load factors are useless in full fare airlines, bur 42% load in certain months are an eyeopener that the DL bosses have obviously taken note of.

[Edited 2007-09-23 16:06:17]
 
ScottishLaddie
Posts: 2309
Joined: Sat Jan 03, 2004 8:30 am

DL To Announce Latest Int'l Expansion This Week

Sun Sep 23, 2007 11:13 pm

Quoting BY738 (Reply 97):
Perhaps you can show us the calculations for that one....

Quite simple, just work out the monthly load factor for each month (can be found on http://www.egphforum.com for each month if you can't be bothered working it out for yourself...) and work out the average for the year. Source- CAA. I could even tell you how many were booked on it out of EDI today if you really wanted...
 
masseybrown
Posts: 5444
Joined: Wed Dec 11, 2002 2:40 pm

DL To Announce Latest Int'l Expansion This Week

Sun Sep 23, 2007 11:20 pm

Anybody want to suggest why ATL-LGW passenger numbers seem to be down so drastically this summer?

According to the UK's CAA numbers: http://www.caa.co.uk/default.aspx?catid=80&pagetype=90

the traffic has been:

Month..... 2007.....2006
June.......37,732...55,440
July........39,002...55,546
August...35,616...46,795

Some statistical anomaly?

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