Moderators: jsumali2, richierich, ua900, PanAm_DC10, hOMSaR

 
akizidy214
Topic Author
Posts: 258
Joined: Thu Sep 07, 2006 1:10 am

AA/MQ - ALPA/APA "Scope Clause" Agreement Reached

Sat Oct 27, 2007 4:13 pm

A tentative agreement has been reached between the (ALPA), (APA), AA, and MQ.

With this agreement in the works, MQ has submitted the required documents to the AMR board of directors to exercise the purchase rights for the remaining 25 CRJ a/c MQ has options for.

MQ can expect their first delivery in 2009 and the remainder in 2010 & 2011.

[Edited 2007-10-27 09:25:25]
DCA
 
User avatar
ERJ170
Posts: 5919
Joined: Thu Apr 15, 2004 11:15 am

RE: AA/MQ - ALPA/APA "Scope Clause" Agreement Reached

Sat Oct 27, 2007 4:24 pm

Quoting Akizidy214 (Thread starter):
MQ has submitted the required documents to the AMR board of directors to exercise the purchase rights for the remaining 25 CRJ a/c MQ has options for.

I hope they are CR7.. although I would have liked to have seen E70 instead.. but oh well..
Aiming High and going far..
 
akizidy214
Topic Author
Posts: 258
Joined: Thu Sep 07, 2006 1:10 am

RE: AA/MQ - ALPA/APA "Scope Clause" Agreement Reached

Sat Oct 27, 2007 4:55 pm

On a side note the BGR MTX base will be closing OCT 31st with a majority of that work moving to XNA.
DCA
 
CIDFlyer
Posts: 2163
Joined: Wed Apr 13, 2005 7:19 am

RE: AA/MQ - ALPA/APA "Scope Clause" Agreement Reached

Sat Oct 27, 2007 5:23 pm

too bad they couldn't get them sooner that 2009. AAEagle needs planes like yesterday!
 
EXAAUADL
Posts: 1740
Joined: Tue Jun 13, 2006 3:48 am

RE: AA/MQ - ALPA/APA "Scope Clause" Agreement Reached

Sat Oct 27, 2007 6:01 pm

I'd like ot see the CR7s upgraded to CR9s
 
flyf15
Posts: 6633
Joined: Tue May 18, 1999 11:10 am

RE: AA/MQ - ALPA/APA "Scope Clause" Agreement Reac

Sat Oct 27, 2007 6:09 pm

What needs to happen here is that American should get some planes itself to cover that flying. These new RJs will be, mostly, F100 replacements. More mainline jets being replaced by RJs... theres no reason the smallest jet in AA's fleet should be the almost 150 seat MD-80.
 
EXAAUADL
Posts: 1740
Joined: Tue Jun 13, 2006 3:48 am

RE: AA/MQ - ALPA/APA "Scope Clause" Agreement Reached

Sat Oct 27, 2007 6:21 pm

Quoting Flyf15 (Reply 5):
What needs to happen here is that American should get some planes itself to cover that flying. These new RJs will be, mostly, F100 replacements. More mainline jets being replaced by RJs... theres no reason the smallest jet in AA's fleet should be the almost 150 seat MD-80.

Well we'll have to see what type of contract APA gets..no reason to go out and buy mainline E190s without a contract that covers that aircraft or size range. Also if the contract is real real bad for AMR, forget smaller aircraft..go for more seats to get the CASM down.
 
justplanenutz
Posts: 593
Joined: Fri Feb 10, 2006 9:48 am

RE: AA/MQ - ALPA/APA "Scope Clause" Agreement Reached

Sun Oct 28, 2007 1:07 pm

Giving the state of the APA/AA contract talks, this seems hard to believe. The previous "docile" APA leadership would not agree to a contract mod. to allow AA to fly DFW-PKG, a very good-paying gig for APA pilots. Yet, the more "militant" new APA leadership would approve a scope mod. to allow more MQ flying?
 
justplanenutz
Posts: 593
Joined: Fri Feb 10, 2006 9:48 am

RE: AA/MQ - ALPA/APA "Scope Clause" Agreement Reached

Sun Oct 28, 2007 1:13 pm

Shot first, ask questions later....here's a link:

http://startelegram.typepad.com/sky_talk/
 
bucky707
Posts: 955
Joined: Sat Aug 19, 2000 2:01 am

RE: AA/MQ - ALPA/APA "Scope Clause" Agreement Reached

Sun Oct 28, 2007 1:26 pm

Quoting JustPlaneNutz (Reply 7):
Giving the state of the APA/AA contract talks, this seems hard to believe. The previous "docile" APA leadership would not agree to a contract mod. to allow AA to fly DFW-PKG, a very good-paying gig for APA pilots. Yet, the more "militant" new APA leadership would approve a scope mod. to allow more MQ flying?

I was thinking the same thing. I have read a lot about whats going on at AA. I have also spoken to some AA pilots I know. I have seen nor heard anything about scope changes. The only changes I have seen proposed with relation to AE regards the flow through agreement.
 
akizidy214
Topic Author
Posts: 258
Joined: Thu Sep 07, 2006 1:10 am

RE: AA/MQ - ALPA/APA "Scope Clause" Agreement Reached

Sun Oct 28, 2007 1:56 pm

Quoting ERJ170 (Reply 1):
although I would have liked to have seen E70 instead

Yes, alot of people within MQ wanted the same thing due to the fact that MQ and Embraer have a better working "Much Better" relationship than MQ and Bombardier. But an additional fleet type was not wanted due to the high cost so the CRJ options were taken.


MQ could have pushed for an earlier delivery date but logistically MQ will not be ready to take new a/c before 2009. One reason the DFW hangar will be closing for a period of time that is unknown currently to remove asbestos. These a/c will be split between DFW, XNA, & ORD. It is currently not known what routes will be upgraded from the EMB or new routes that will be initiated by this delivery.

Quoting JustPlaneNutz (Reply 8):
Shot first, ask questions later....here's a link:

MQ will issue an official press release to the media early this week.  Wink
DCA
 
qqflyboy
Posts: 1635
Joined: Sat Oct 25, 2003 1:47 pm

RE: AA/MQ - ALPA/APA "Scope Clause" Agreement Reached

Sun Oct 28, 2007 2:42 pm

Quoting Akizidy214 (Reply 10):
These a/c will be split between DFW, XNA, & ORD.

I wish, I wish, I wish they'd fly them out of JFK to BOS, RDU and DCA (among other places). The often weight restricted ERJs just don't get the job done. They could also come in quite handy at LGA for the same flying (BOS, RDU and DCA, among others).
The views expressed are mine alone and do not necessarily reflect my employer’s views.
 
akizidy214
Topic Author
Posts: 258
Joined: Thu Sep 07, 2006 1:10 am

RE: AA/MQ - ALPA/APA "Scope Clause" Agreement Reached

Sun Oct 28, 2007 2:57 pm

Quoting QQflyboy (Reply 11):
(BOS, RDU and DCA, among others).

MQ is quite happy with flying the EMB in the north east. Currently there is no MTX base in the north east for the CRJ although CLE does contract MTX. Maybe maybe we will see.....CRJ's in LGA would be great. LGA-DCA, LGA- BOS, LGA - RDU, LGA - YYZ & YUL I doubt it though.

[Edited 2007-10-28 07:58:19]
DCA
 
MAH4546
Posts: 26411
Joined: Wed Jan 24, 2001 1:44 pm

RE: AA/MQ - ALPA/APA "Scope Clause" Agreement Reached

Sun Oct 28, 2007 7:05 pm

Quoting Akizidy214 (Reply 10):
It is currently not known what routes will be upgraded from the EMB or new routes that will be initiated by this delivery.

One given is expanded regional flying from MIA and possibly LAX.
a.
 
HPAEAA
Posts: 1142
Joined: Mon May 08, 2006 7:24 am

RE: AA/MQ - ALPA/APA "Scope Clause" Agreement Reached

Sun Oct 28, 2007 8:19 pm

Quoting Akizidy214 (Reply 12):
MQ is quite happy with flying the EMB in the north east. Currently there is no MTX base in the north east for the CRJ although CLE does contract MTX.

MQ also has a base in CMH which helps with some of the BOS, RDU, LGA overnight MX...
1.4mm and counting...
 
akizidy214
Topic Author
Posts: 258
Joined: Thu Sep 07, 2006 1:10 am

RE: AA/MQ - ALPA/APA "Scope Clause" Agreement Reached

Sun Oct 28, 2007 8:30 pm

Quoting HPAEAA (Reply 14):
MQ also has a base in CMH which helps with some of the BOS, RDU, LGA overnight MX...

CMH is the base that gets all the heavy MTX that the above bases and ORD pass off to them....
DCA
 
akizidy214
Topic Author
Posts: 258
Joined: Thu Sep 07, 2006 1:10 am

RE: AA/MQ - ALPA/APA "Scope Clause" Agreement Reached

Sun Oct 28, 2007 8:38 pm

Quoting MAH4546 (Reply 13):
One given is expanded regional flying from MIA and possibly LAX.

MIA MTX is still having a hard time with the EMB's. Most of the time MQ MTX from CMH, RDU, or DFW fly down to finish of the repair. We might see a few new emb routes but the majority the new routes or routes to be re-started will be on the OW side.
DCA
 
justplanenutz
Posts: 593
Joined: Fri Feb 10, 2006 9:48 am

RE: AA/MQ - ALPA/APA "Scope Clause" Agreement Reached

Tue Oct 30, 2007 7:38 pm

Jeez....do a thread on APA/AA smacking each other around, and you'll get 200 replies about everything that's wrong with labor/management in America. Do a thread on them working together and ORDERING NEW AIRCRAFT.....yawn....off to the back page you go.

What does this mean for MQ's 340 fleet, which still numbers 35? Will some of the CR7s be used to replace EMB jets that will replace the Saabs? I recall that the Saab leases were up around the same period.

While we are at it, AMRs contracts with the Connection carriers at STL are up in 2011 (the were 10 year contracts, right?) Any chance that flying gets brought in house (I know, AMR is considering selling MQ and OW, along with AAdvantage and everything else that isn't bolted down)?
 
User avatar
LAXintl
Posts: 24964
Joined: Wed May 24, 2000 12:12 pm

RE: AA/MQ - ALPA/APA "Scope Clause" Agreement Reached

Tue Oct 30, 2007 8:21 pm

Quoting JustPlaneNutz (Reply 17):
What does this mean for MQ's 340 fleet,

Management has announced a draw down already. First 4 depart in April 2008.
From the desert to the sea, to all of Southern California
 
akizidy214
Topic Author
Posts: 258
Joined: Thu Sep 07, 2006 1:10 am

RE: AA/MQ - ALPA/APA "Scope Clause" Agreement Reached

Tue Oct 30, 2007 11:26 pm

Quoting LAXintl (Reply 18):
Management has announced a draw down already. First 4 depart in April 2008.

Not true to my knowledge... The B+ are going back to SAAB and being replaced by SF3's that were being stored in ABI.

The latest RTS is N211AE she just got a paint job in ROW and should be back in revenue service this week.

Quoting JustPlaneNutz (Reply 17):
What does this mean for MQ's 340 fleet, which still numbers 35? Will some of the CR7s be used to replace EMB jets that will replace the Saabs?

MQ has no plans to dumb SAAB routes for EMB's. The new a/c will be used for new routes, some old ones, and much needed capacity.
DCA
 
User avatar
LAXintl
Posts: 24964
Joined: Wed May 24, 2000 12:12 pm

RE: AA/MQ - ALPA/APA "Scope Clause" Agreement Reached

Tue Oct 30, 2007 11:29 pm

Quoting Akizidy214 (Reply 19):
Not true to my knowledge...

Dallas CP's office made the annoucement. In addition the President of AMR was in LA two weeks back for a base meeting and also confirmed the pull down and made specific mention of 4 aircraft starting in April 2008 with additional to follow in '08.
From the desert to the sea, to all of Southern California
 
akizidy214
Topic Author
Posts: 258
Joined: Thu Sep 07, 2006 1:10 am

RE: AA/MQ - ALPA/APA "Scope Clause" Agreement Reached

Tue Oct 30, 2007 11:35 pm

Quoting LAXintl (Reply 20):
Dallas CP's office made the annoucement. In addition the President of AMR was in LA two weeks back for a base meeting and also confirmed the pull down and made specific mention of 4 aircraft starting in April 2008 with additional to follow in '08.

Arpey was in LAX and mentioned SF3's?
DCA
 
akizidy214
Topic Author
Posts: 258
Joined: Thu Sep 07, 2006 1:10 am

RE: AA/MQ - ALPA/APA "Scope Clause" Agreement Reached

Tue Oct 30, 2007 11:42 pm

Anywho the only SAABs that are leaving MQ fleet are the B+

On a side not MQ is currently in the process of changing hangars in XNA. The will now take over the old Ozark MTX area.
DCA
 
User avatar
LAXintl
Posts: 24964
Joined: Wed May 24, 2000 12:12 pm

RE: AA/MQ - ALPA/APA "Scope Clause" Agreement Reached

Tue Oct 30, 2007 11:52 pm

Sorry meant President of Eagle whom was in LA for a base meeting and did little to reassure the troops about the future of AE on the West Coast.
From the desert to the sea, to all of Southern California
 
akizidy214
Topic Author
Posts: 258
Joined: Thu Sep 07, 2006 1:10 am

RE: AA/MQ - ALPA/APA "Scope Clause" Agreement Reached

Wed Oct 31, 2007 12:05 am

Quoting LAXintl (Reply 23):
Sorry meant President of Eagle whom was in LA for a base meeting and did little to reassure the troops about the future of AE on the West Coast.

Yeah....Senior mgt in Eagle hasn't been the best at boosting morale IMHO....But there are new people in certain positions that should change that. Hopefully LAX-LAS will be upgrade to a CRJ
DCA
 
aeroc
Posts: 242
Joined: Thu Aug 05, 2004 9:05 am

RE: AA/MQ - ALPA/APA "Scope Clause" Agreement Reached

Wed Oct 31, 2007 1:44 am

Could they put some CR7's in MIA and give upstate NY a chance at the only direct MIA service? We have lost hundreds of passengers to B6 and FL to the Florida market and many of them continue to South America and the Caribbean. How about some ROC SYR-MIA service! Big grin
 
flyby519
Posts: 1583
Joined: Tue Jul 24, 2007 3:31 am

RE: AA/MQ - ALPA/APA "Scope Clause" Agreement Reac

Wed Oct 31, 2007 5:49 am

I dont see how AE can staff any new a/c without reducing somewhere else. AE wanted to hire 700 pilots in 2007, through November we have hired half that number. We are already understaffed in all equip/bases. If we get new CRJs we will have to lose Saabs to compensate.
 
commavia
Posts: 11489
Joined: Mon Apr 25, 2005 2:30 am

RE: AA/MQ - ALPA/APA "Scope Clause" Agreement Reached

Wed Oct 31, 2007 5:56 am

Quoting Flyby519 (Reply 26):
I dont see how AE can staff any new a/c without reducing somewhere else. AE wanted to hire 700 pilots in 2007, through November we have hired half that number. We are already understaffed in all equip/bases.

Why can't they get flow-back from furloughed mainline APA crews?

Does SCOPE preclude it?

Will the APA crews even go back?
(I don't see why they would if they can get hired as mainline at other carriers making 3-4x what Eagle will pay them).
 
aeroc
Posts: 242
Joined: Thu Aug 05, 2004 9:05 am

RE: AA/MQ - ALPA/APA "Scope Clause" Agreement Reached

Wed Oct 31, 2007 6:54 am

Quoting Flyby519 (Reply 26):
I dont see how AE can staff any new a/c without reducing somewhere else. AE wanted to hire 700 pilots in 2007, through November we have hired half that number. We are already understaffed in all equip/bases

That is VERY true! Eagle is having a hard time piloting its flights right now. They are so short on pilots they are suspending some routes for the 1st Quarter. ROC, SYR-DFW CR7 is the one I know about. It will stop Jan 7th and start again in APR. To bad I cant find the cash to get some hours or I would apply for Eagle.....I need to get my CFI first.
 
flyby519
Posts: 1583
Joined: Tue Jul 24, 2007 3:31 am

RE: AA/MQ - ALPA/APA "Scope Clause" Agreement Reached

Wed Oct 31, 2007 3:31 pm

Quoting Commavia (Reply 27):
Why can't they get flow-back from furloughed mainline APA crews?

Does SCOPE preclude it?

Will the APA crews even go back?
(I don't see why they would if they can get hired as mainline at other carriers making 3-4x what Eagle will pay them).

AA offered a flowback position as CA at AE to most of the furloughed pilots and 300+ of them chose to come to AE. Now that AA is recalling those pilots are leaving AE and returning to AA. I think there are about 200 left at AE today and they are expected to all be called back by late 2008-early 09. Since they are leaving, AE needs to upgrade more first officers to captains to replace the CAs getting recalled. We are so short staffed that we cant take first officers offline to upgrade them, and we cant attract any newhires to AE because of the poor QOL, long upgrade times, and low pay. It is a vicious cycle that is turning into a shrinkage for AE and I expect to see some Saabs being parked in the next 6 months.

Popular Searches On Airliners.net

Top Photos of Last:   24 Hours  •  48 Hours  •  7 Days  •  30 Days  •  180 Days  •  365 Days  •  All Time

Military Aircraft Every type from fighters to helicopters from air forces around the globe

Classic Airliners Props and jets from the good old days

Flight Decks Views from inside the cockpit

Aircraft Cabins Passenger cabin shots showing seat arrangements as well as cargo aircraft interior

Cargo Aircraft Pictures of great freighter aircraft

Government Aircraft Aircraft flying government officials

Helicopters Our large helicopter section. Both military and civil versions

Blimps / Airships Everything from the Goodyear blimp to the Zeppelin

Night Photos Beautiful shots taken while the sun is below the horizon

Accidents Accident, incident and crash related photos

Air to Air Photos taken by airborne photographers of airborne aircraft

Special Paint Schemes Aircraft painted in beautiful and original liveries

Airport Overviews Airport overviews from the air or ground

Tails and Winglets Tail and Winglet closeups with beautiful airline logos