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platinumfoota
Topic Author
Posts: 213
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UA Mechanic Died In SFO

Sat Nov 17, 2007 7:23 am

Just found out a UA Mechanic at San Francisco Maintenance Base has passed away in an accident.
http://www.amfa9.org/news/detail2.asp?id=620
Deepest respect and sympathy to his family
Never forget United 93
 
AirframeAS
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RE: UA Mechanic Died In SFO

Sat Nov 17, 2007 7:33 am

What exactly happened? The AMFA article says he died in a fall. If that is the case, was the mechanic wearing a harness?
A Safe Flight Begins With Quality Maintenance On The Ground.
 
BigJimFX
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RE: UA Mechanic Died In SFO

Sat Nov 17, 2007 7:38 am

Wow! Haven't heard anything, but thoughts and prayers to the mech's family. This a reminder that this industry is not the safest, and bless those that work in it.
I'd like to thank me for flying Me Airways...
 
platinumfoota
Topic Author
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RE: UA Mechanic Died In SFO

Sat Nov 17, 2007 8:01 am

Happend early this morning 11/16, was with UA 18 years.
Never forget United 93
 
MD11Engineer
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RE: UA Mechanic Died In SFO

Sat Nov 17, 2007 11:57 am



Quoting BigJimFX (Reply 2):
This a reminder that this industry is not the safest, and bless those that work in it.

The problem is that in today's cut throat commercial (mainly due to low cost carriers) enviroment profit margins are so low that while the planes are still being kept safe, health and safety rules for the tech staff are often ignored. E.g. from my own experience, the old cherry picker we had practically collapsed (the two eyes where a connecting bolt between the boom and the bucket passes through cracked and the bucket suddenly went hanging down with the two guys occupying it almost falling down, somehow they still made it safely to the ground, we later discovered that also the technical safety inspection on it was years overdue, the hydraulic lines were years overdue etc.): I assume because somewhere in the past at another station this cherry picker has probably been abuse as a crane substitute, again because the companies are reluctant to hire a proper crane if it is needed to change a bigger part and management tells us to improvise with whatever we have at hand.
Then we are getting told that a replacement is too expensive and we should use some rickety scaffolding for the work on the tail, which is too low anyway, so that we are supposed to stand on a ladder way above the guard rails on a scaffolding, which is moving several inches every time you move on it. No safety harness (or point to attach one) either. Other items are the use of highly toxic chemicals without proper protection provided.
All that matters is to get the plane back into service ASAP, no matter how many health and safety shortcuts are needed to get it fixed.
Airworthiness is a different matter, since the authorities have an eye on it, but nobody seems to care for health and safety.

I'm sure every mechanic/ licenced engineer can tell his own stories about accidents and almost accidents due to management ignoring requests to provide the equipment to comply with health and safety rules.

Our colleague in SFO: End of shift November 16, 2007. RIP

Jan
Je Suis Charlie et je suis Ahmet aussi
 
mymiles2go
Posts: 169
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RE: UA Mechanic Died In SFO

Sat Nov 17, 2007 1:56 pm



Quoting MD11Engineer (Reply 4):
I'm sure every mechanic/ licenced engineer can tell his own stories about accidents and almost accidents due to management ignoring requests to provide the equipment to comply with health and safety rules.

Do you have anything in the way of proof (or even ancidotel) to suggest that UA MX at SFO was ignoring requests? UA's MX facilities at SFO are considered one of the best in the world - and while accidents DO happen (in every industry and even in the best facilities) - it seems a bit premature to assume it was due to 'rickety' equipment.
 
MSYtristar
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RE: UA Mechanic Died In SFO

Sat Nov 17, 2007 2:00 pm

This isn't AirTran in MSY we're talking about here....this is a major UA MX base....I'm sure they are doing what they can to ensure a safe operation.
 
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HAWK21M
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RE: UA Mechanic Died In SFO

Sat Nov 17, 2007 2:06 pm

Any details on what transpired.

Safety is very Important in Mx.
regds
MEL
I may not win often, but I damn well never lose!!! ;)
 
AirframeAS
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RE: UA Mechanic Died In SFO

Sat Nov 17, 2007 2:35 pm



Quoting MD11Engineer (Reply 4):
I'm sure every mechanic/ licenced engineer can tell his own stories about accidents and almost accidents due to management ignoring requests to provide the equipment to comply with health and safety rules.

Before I ever arrived at AS, years ago, they had an inspector who fell from the teleplatform in SEA to his death. He wasn't wearing a harness at all. AS then required the harness to be worn, but the mechanics and inspectors still didn't wear them anyway. I know I did wear them, I cannot imagine plummeting to my death...no way! I've been called so many inappropriate names when I've donned the harness, I could care less.
A Safe Flight Begins With Quality Maintenance On The Ground.
 
threepoint
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RE: UA Mechanic Died In SFO

Sat Nov 17, 2007 4:26 pm

This is in reponse to MD11Engineer, and has nothing to do with the unfortunate incident in SFO.

Quoting MD11Engineer (Reply 4):
The problem is that in today's cut throat commercial enviroment profit margins are so low that while the planes are still being kept safe, health and safety rules for the tech staff are often ignored.

OK, so who's fault and responsibility is that? As a mechanic, you are obliged to use the appropriate safety gear. If the employer can not or will not provide adequate gear, it usually only takes one site visit by the local worker's safety board (or equivalent) to set things staight in the form of a monetary penalty. It may take a fine for the employer to listen, but if a worker is injured in the meantime, any blame can be equally shared by the maintenence staff if they continue resigning to poor practices like compliant sheep.
The nice thing about a mistake is the pleasure it gives others.
 
BlueSkys
Posts: 286
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RE: UA Mechanic Died In SFO

Sat Nov 17, 2007 6:04 pm



Quoting MD11Engineer (Reply 4):
The problem is that in today's cut throat commercial (mainly due to low cost carriers) enviroment profit margins are so low that while the planes are still being kept safe, health and safety rules for the tech staff are often ignored. E.g. from my own experience, the old cherry picker we had practically collapsed (the two eyes where a connecting bolt between the boom and the bucket passes through cracked and the bucket suddenly went hanging down with the two guys occupying it almost falling down, somehow they still made it safely to the ground, we later discovered that also the technical safety inspection on it was years overdue, the hydraulic lines were years overdue etc.): I assume because somewhere in the past at another station this cherry picker has probably been abuse as a crane substitute, again because the companies are reluctant to hire a proper crane if it is needed to change a bigger part and management tells us to improvise with whatever we have at hand.
Then we are getting told that a replacement is too expensive and we should use some rickety scaffolding for the work on the tail, which is too low anyway, so that we are supposed to stand on a ladder way above the guard rails on a scaffolding, which is moving several inches every time you move on it. No safety harness (or point to attach one) either. Other items are the use of highly toxic chemicals without proper protection provided.
All that matters is to get the plane back into service ASAP, no matter how many health and safety shortcuts are needed to get it fixed.
Airworthiness is a different matter, since the authorities have an eye on it, but nobody seems to care for health and safety.

I'm sure every mechanic/ licenced engineer can tell his own stories about accidents and almost accidents due to management ignoring requests to provide the equipment to comply with health and safety rules.

I apprenticed as an AME for a year while i was in university, my employment was as crew on a DC-4 Restoration project. We lost one mechanic in a fall from an old cherry picker with the guard rails removed. The amount of hazards are immense, and there is no one to oversee a safe workplace. Everyone used to tease me as I would always bring my own safety equipment such as a respirator, gloves, etc....

Some of the guys used to Alodine parts with their bare hands and no respirators!
 
AirframeAS
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RE: UA Mechanic Died In SFO

Sat Nov 17, 2007 6:20 pm

It seems like the mentality of using safety items isn't a cool thing among us AMT's. Its not about being cool, its about protecting yourself and a lot of hotshot AMT's don't realize that, which is sad.

Its not only AMT's not following the rules, its also management too. They are to blame just as much as we are. I have many times refused to use items that did not have safety features, which have ticked off managers and supervisors. This is my safety we are talking about...and everyone else's too!
A Safe Flight Begins With Quality Maintenance On The Ground.
 
A380fo
Posts: 210
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RE: UA Mechanic Died In SFO

Sat Nov 17, 2007 6:22 pm

does anyone know what happend??? howd he die .
 
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fxramper
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RE: UA Mechanic Died In SFO

Sat Nov 17, 2007 7:09 pm



Quoting A380fo (Reply 13):

He fell while working on a/c.

Glad it wasn't ala CO @ ELP.


Regards to his family.
 
WestJetForLife
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RE: UA Mechanic Died In SFO

Sat Nov 17, 2007 7:11 pm

Wow...18 years at UA, and this is his "retirement".  Sad

Very sad, very sad indeed. My condolences to his family, friends and co-workers. I hope and pray that everything turns out okay for his family.

Nik
I need a drink.
 
etfokker50
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RE: UA Mechanic Died In SFO

Sat Nov 17, 2007 10:47 pm

A countries' economy says nothing about the quality of its Airline MX... A good example in my opinion is the ET base in Addis Abeba. I don't know how many, but there are very many technicians from airlines all over africa who are trained in Ethiopia. (I think it's part of the history: ET started from TWA I think it was training staff and they've always been a Boeing shop... Ethiopian Airlines has a very good safety record also... Ethiopia is one of the poorest countries on earth, and in the capital, there's no way not to see it. So there is atleast some quality, yet the country is poor...
 
dl1011
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RE: UA Mechanic Died In SFO

Sat Nov 17, 2007 10:57 pm

So sorry to read about this. There are many so dangers when working in this field.

I'll have to agree with the post by MD11ENG, shortcuts are taken to save money. I just left a major airline after 17 years and the poor condition of the ground equipment was one of many reasons for my departure. The lift trucks were pretty old and beat up. One truck was removed from service and declared dangerous by the ground support mechanics yet this vehicle was put back in service because it was too expensive to buy a new truck. What is the point of wearing a safety harness if the lift platform collapses? They talk a good game about safety until it's time to spend money.

My regards to the family.
 
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OA260
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RE: UA Mechanic Died In SFO

Sat Nov 17, 2007 10:59 pm

Sad news indeed. I hope his family will be provided for . Not nice when something like this happens. Just shows how dangerous this industry can be. After 18 years I hope UA will honour him in some way.

RIP

OA260
 
MQTmxguy
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RE: UA Mechanic Died In SFO

Sat Nov 17, 2007 11:08 pm

I wasn't reffering to the quality of the actual A/C MX work there. I'm sure the AMTs in Colombia, Ethiopia, or wherever are just as commited to quality as those from the richer parts of the world. I was just saying that it would seem logical to me that the work safety standards in 3rd world countries may not be as stringent because they can't afford the tools to be safe. But of course I could be wrong.
Well at least we can all take comfort in the fact that NW will never retire their DC-9s
 
jbguller
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RE: UA Mechanic Died In SFO

Sat Nov 17, 2007 11:22 pm

I love the way that everyone is so so keen to have an opinion and say whatever they think is right after someone dies, or something goes wrong.

It's fair enough if a plane has an accident and we can try to piece together why it happened in a way only aviation nuts can, but this is a DEATH! If anything, screw opinions, just have some god-damn respect for those involved, especially the family, friends and colleagues.

Leave the pissweak bickering for another forum topic. Sheesh.

RIP
 
tozairport
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RE: UA Mechanic Died In SFO

Sat Nov 17, 2007 11:37 pm



Quoting OA260 (Reply 22):
After 18 years I hope UA will honour him in some way.

His "honor" will probably be in the form of a letter to his family telling them that their pass travel benefits are no longer valid. This is what happened to the many of the employees that were killed in the 9/11 attacks and would be typical of UA (mis)management. Sad day. RIP Stephen.
Meet the new boss, same as the old boss.
 
474218
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RE: UA Mechanic Died In SFO

Sat Nov 17, 2007 11:37 pm

Why do so many people on a.net jump to such wild conclusions before any facts are known? So far in just 23 posts a.net members have blamed: low cost operators, Air Tran at MSY, Columbia, a countries poor economy and Ethiopia. The only thing well really know (if you can believe a union press release) is that the UA mechanic died in a fall. I will say a prayer for him and his family and wait until the facts are known before I place blame.
 
halls120
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RE: UA Mechanic Died In SFO

Sun Nov 18, 2007 12:03 am



Quoting 474218 (Reply 26):
Why do so many people on a.net jump to such wild conclusions before any facts are known? So far in just 23 posts a.net members have blamed: low cost operators, Air Tran at MSY, Columbia, a countries poor economy and Ethiopia. The only thing well really know (if you can believe a union press release) is that the UA mechanic died in a fall. I will say a prayer for him and his family and wait until the facts are known before I place blame.

If jumping to conclusions was banned on Anet, the overall post count would likely be cut in half.
"Suppose you were an idiot. And suppose you were a member of Congress. But I repeat myself." Mark Twain, a Biography
 
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OA260
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RE: UA Mechanic Died In SFO

Sun Nov 18, 2007 12:08 am



Quoting Tozairport (Reply 25):
His "honor" will probably be in the form of a letter to his family telling them that their pass travel benefits are no longer valid. This is what happened to the many of the employees that were killed in the 9/11 attacks and would be typical of UA (mis)management. Sad day. RIP Stephen.

Are you for real ???? Is this really true ??? If it is im disgusted!! You would think that they would at least leave it for a year .
 
AirframeAS
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RE: UA Mechanic Died In SFO

Sun Nov 18, 2007 12:11 am



Quoting 474218 (Reply 26):
Why do so many people on a.net jump to such wild conclusions before any facts are known? So far in just 23 posts a.net members have blamed: low cost operators, Air Tran at MSY, Columbia, a countries poor economy and Ethiopia. The only thing well really know (if you can believe a union press release) is that the UA mechanic died in a fall. I will say a prayer for him and his family and wait until the facts are known before I place blame.

474218, If someone gets injured on the job and ignore safety rules, its both parties fault in the whole thing. The user, for not following his/her own safety and the management for not enforcing safety rules.
A Safe Flight Begins With Quality Maintenance On The Ground.
 
isitsafenow
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RE: UA Mechanic Died In SFO

Sun Nov 18, 2007 12:15 am

I read post four. Now if you really want to growl about safety, which you....no, WE ...rightfully should, sent post four to a local news stations in the SFO area. Someone will pick up on it and do some investigating reporting and start a domino effect around the industry.
Things will change for the better in the industry.
safe
If two people agree on EVERYTHING, then one isn't necessary.
 
tozairport
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RE: UA Mechanic Died In SFO

Sun Nov 18, 2007 12:23 am



Quoting OA260 (Reply 28):
Are you for real ????

Yes.

Quoting OA260 (Reply 28):
Is this really true ???

Yes.

Quoting OA260 (Reply 28):
If it is im disgusted!!

As are a large number of the employees when they are faced with a management that is only interested in lining their own pockets at the expense of all of those that have truly built the airline. I have no direct knowledge of the circumstances of this accident, but the simple fact is that the employees (all of the line ones at least) are working longer hours for less pay under more stressful conditions than ever before. I doubt Glenn Tilton lost any sleep last night.
Meet the new boss, same as the old boss.
 
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OA260
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RE: UA Mechanic Died In SFO

Sun Nov 18, 2007 12:26 am



Quoting Tozairport (Reply 31):
As are a large number of the employees when they are faced with a management that is only interested in lining their own pockets at the expense of all of those that have truly built the airline. I have no direct knowledge of the circumstances of this accident, but the simple fact is that the employees (all of the line ones at least) are working longer hours for less pay under more stressful conditions than ever before. I doubt Glenn Tilton lost any sleep last night.

You know sometimes I wish I didnt read things like this . You like to think that mechanics would be at least be given all the tools they need to do their job and keep safe. Reading post 4 its an eye opener. Theres something to be said for state run airlines !!!
 
ikramerica
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RE: UA Mechanic Died In SFO

Sun Nov 18, 2007 12:32 am



Quoting MD11Engineer (Reply 4):
Then we are getting told that a replacement is too expensive and we should use some rickety scaffolding for the work on the tail, which is too low anyway, so that we are supposed to stand on a ladder way above the guard rails on a scaffolding, which is moving several inches every time you move on it. No safety harness (or point to attach one) either. Other items are the use of highly toxic chemicals without proper protection provided.

While this is a bad situation, it is rectified by calling OSHA or union reps. Failure to blow the whistle on your employer (or refuse to work unless they comply) is the root cause of many industrial accidents in the USA, but then there's this...

Quoting AirframeAS (Reply 9):
I've been called so many inappropriate names when I've donned the harness, I could care less.



Quoting BlueSkys (Reply 11):
Everyone used to tease me as I would always bring my own safety equipment such as a respirator, gloves, etc....



Quoting AirframeAS (Reply 12):
It seems like the mentality of using safety items isn't a cool thing among us AMT's.

Peer pressure and corner cutting by the employees themselves. Ignoring rules for their protection either because it's a hassle or because they don't want to be called names. Absolute stupidity personified, happens in construction, maintenance, transportation, even show business etc. Causes so many needless deaths...  Sad
Of all the things to worry about... the Wookie has no pants.
 
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jetmech
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RE: UA Mechanic Died In SFO

Sun Nov 18, 2007 12:34 am



Quoting AirframeAS (Reply 1):
The AMFA article says he died in a fall. If that is the case, was the mechanic wearing a harness?

It would not necessarily require a fall from a great height to kill. I once fell from a height of about six feet onto a concrete hangar floor whilst I was working on a mobile platform in the wheel well of a 747. Luckily for me, I managed to land on my back, and my large, fat arse cushioned most of the impact.

Nonetheless, I was lying on the hangar floor somewhat stunned for a couple of minutes. If I landed on my head, I dare say I would be a paraplegic or quadriplegic. The good thing is I am now much more aware of my safety. I still shudder about that incident to this day, and all the other times I did extremely unsafe things when my enthusiasm over-rode my common sense.

Quoting AirframeAS (Reply 12):
I have many times refused to use items that did not have safety features, which have ticked off managers and supervisors. This is my safety we are talking about...and everyone else's too!

Good to see! It is your life and not your managers on the line so stuff them! It's not easy to stand up for yourself in what is a somewhat macho environment.

Regards, JetMech
JetMech split the back of his pants. He can feel the wind in his hair :shock: .
 
itsnotfinals
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RE: UA Mechanic Died In SFO

Sun Nov 18, 2007 12:56 am



Quoting Tozairport (Reply 31):
As are a large number of the employees when they are faced with a management that is only interested in lining their own pockets at the expense of all of those that have truly built the airline.

That is a patently bad assumption. UA would not skimp on Safety.

Even if for just pure financial reasons, a death or lost time injury accident will cause their Worker's Comp rates to go up considerably.
Speedbird 178 Heavy, FINAL runway 27L
 
phelpsie87
Posts: 263
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RE: UA Mechanic Died In SFO

Sun Nov 18, 2007 1:03 am



Quoting Tozairport (Reply 25):

His "honor" will probably be in the form of a letter to his family telling them that their pass travel benefits are no longer valid. This is what happened to the many of the employees that were killed in the 9/11 attacks and would be typical of UA (mis)management

Family flew from FAR to SFO this morning via ORD. Why don't you stop being an a$$hole and respect this man and his family.
 
tcfc424
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RE: UA Mechanic Died In SFO

Sun Nov 18, 2007 1:45 am

Before everyone here drudges up everything wrong with the industry right now...let's learn some more about what happened. I heard what happened, but the details are not all known at this time. Let's just say it wasn't a result of shoddy equipment. There are a lot of unanswered questions at this point that will likely be answered in the next 24-48 hours.

As for voicing your political views and statements, please go to the non-av forum. Have a little respect.
 
aogdesk
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RE: UA Mechanic Died In SFO

Sun Nov 18, 2007 1:50 am

Regardless of the circumstances surrounding this tragedy, we should heed it as a wake up call to combat the complacency that creeps into all of us. Many thoughts and prayers go out to the family, friends and co-workers of this gentleman. How incredibly tragic.
 
DTWAGENT
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RE: UA Mechanic Died In SFO

Sun Nov 18, 2007 2:13 am

You know. We should not be on hear slamming each other on what is being said. We all should be praying for his family in their time of need.

Chuck
 
474218
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RE: UA Mechanic Died In SFO

Sun Nov 18, 2007 3:58 am



Quoting AirframeAS (Reply 29):

474218, If someone gets injured on the job and ignore safety rules, its both parties fault in the whole thing. The user, for not following his/her own safety and the management for not enforcing safety rules.

Two more people are blamed, management and the deceased man himself, without one shred of evidence what really happened.
 
NwAflyer07
Posts: 139
Joined: Sun Oct 14, 2007 3:00 pm

RE: UA Mechanic Died In SFO

Sun Nov 18, 2007 4:14 am

Deep sorrow and many prayers for his friends and family... Being a mechanic is a very dangerous job. My dad's been one at NW for over 20 years and hes told me some very scary stories that have happened to his friends. One being of a mx who was working on an aircraft when suddenly hydrolic fluid dumped out on him with such an intence velocity that it forced its way down his throat and into his stomach. He was rushed to the hospital and survived... but it was quite an ordeal.

airline employees work in very dangerous environments.. saftey should always come first and no one should be mocked for being safe.
 
platinumfoota
Topic Author
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RE: UA Mechanic Died In SFO

Sun Nov 18, 2007 6:28 am

Well UA is honoring him in some way. I found out through our employee page, which for obvious reasons i can not post. From the info on the page they have released his name and are starting an investigation to find out what exactly happened. They show deep respect and sympathy through their comments, for his family and co-workers and say that their priority is to provide for his family.

From the short time I've worked with UA they take safety very seriously and when an incident occurs they enforce new safety procedures(at least on the ramp). I too feel for the mechanics as i too want to be a AMT. IL have more information as i go back to work tomorrow.
Never forget United 93
 
tcfc424
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RE: UA Mechanic Died In SFO

Sun Nov 18, 2007 9:49 am

I understand everyone wanting to voice their dischord about safety practices in the US regarding profits and all. However, what I would really like to see is someone to start a new thread to discuss these things. That stuff does not belong in this thread.

This thread is about a maintenance worker in San Francisco who lost his life while working at the United Airlines maintenance base. UA employees by now have an idea what transpired, but we are unable to share that. It will be released in some form where we can, but right now, we just can't.

Let's honor a fellow aviation employee, wish his family the best, say a prayer, and wait for the facts.

The key to running any good company is to learn from mistakes. Those of us in the industry understand that accidents happen. Aircraft are dangerous. Anyone who thinks otherwise needs to be away from them. There are many ways in which you can be hurt or injured. It is what we do with those instances that shapes us. We all need to be vigilant, and if we are not, people need to learn from that.

We lost a colleague, coworker, etc. It is a terrible loss for UA and the aviation industry as a whole. Pray for his family, they need it. Aside from that, start a new thread or SHUT UP!!!!

Platinum, welcome to my RU.
 
AirframeAS
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RE: UA Mechanic Died In SFO

Sun Nov 18, 2007 1:16 pm



Quoting JetMech (Reply 34):
Good to see! It is your life and not your managers on the line so stuff them! It's not easy to stand up for yourself in what is a somewhat macho environment.

It usually turns into an arguement most of the time. And it gets frustrating.

Quoting TCFC424 (Reply 45):

Dude, relax. We know this is about the tragic accident at UA. The other stuff is still valid in this discussion and very much related.
A Safe Flight Begins With Quality Maintenance On The Ground.
 
hiflyer
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RE: UA Mechanic Died In SFO

Sun Nov 18, 2007 2:08 pm

It's tough working in the industry...and working on aircraft is one of the more complicated jobs there is. The number one rule is to keep your head in the game....first and foremost. Unfortunately with oil over 90bbl it becomes even more difficult....add in at UAL the threat to contract out maintenance......the rumor about UA and CO...or UA and DL......the strife within the workgroup regarding AMFA and possibly bidding for IBT....pensions gone...wages reduced....cost of living up.....it makes it harder and harder to keep your head straight.....as well as everyone keeping their's.


My thoughts and prayers for the family especially as they go into this Holiday Season.....there never will be a good time for this type of tragedy.
 
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HAWK21M
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RE: UA Mechanic Died In SFO

Sun Nov 18, 2007 8:50 pm



Quoting TCFC424 (Reply 38):
The key to running any good company is to learn from mistakes

Follow the rules & learn from mistakes.
regds
MEL
I may not win often, but I damn well never lose!!! ;)
 
ferengi80
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RE: UA Mechanic Died In SFO

Sun Nov 18, 2007 10:30 pm

Many condolences to his friends and family. I have a long time friend who worked at UA MX at SFO. Have been there myself whilst on vacation. A very sad incident indeed.

May he rest in eternal peace.  tombstone 
AF1981 LHR-CDG A380-800 10 July 2010 / AF1980 CDG-LHR A380-800 11 July 2010
 
MSYPI7185
Posts: 133
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RE: UA Mechanic Died In SFO

Sun Nov 18, 2007 10:57 pm

My condolences to the family of the UAL Mechanic, may he RIP.

I can understand why some are upset that these thread become a thread about safety.

The reason it happens is because many of us who work in this industry see it all of the time. Yes there are times when safety equipment is provided and not used. The simple fact is many times the proper equipment needed to perform a job is NOT provided. I have witnessed this time and time again, my colleagues at other airlines express the same exact concerns. It does not matter whether you are at MX base or an outstation. I have worked at both.

I have personally watched our deicer used as a crane to change jack screws in a loading bridge on several occasions. I have been told by a Station Manager to use a pushback unit that had problems with the brakes, because it was the only one we had and did not want to spend the money to lease another until proper repairs are made. What frequently happens is if I refuse to use the equipment and borrow one and a result is a delay of even 1 minute you face disciplinary action. What happens is if another agent/mechanic uses the same equipment and everything goes OK then that becomes proof that you are working below that of others. If agent X can use it then you can use it!

I have heard the argument all too often that we do not have the money, it is not in the station budget, among others. Do I believe that UAL would cut cost in SFO on safety equipment to save money, Absolutely!

But is that what happened here? We do not know and may never know unless someone who was there can shed light on what happened.

This is tragic and I am amazed that it does not happen more often.
 
charlienorth
Posts: 1069
Joined: Sat Jun 10, 2006 6:24 am

RE: UA Mechanic Died In SFO

Mon Nov 19, 2007 1:15 am



Quoting MSYPI7185 (Reply 43):
This is tragic and I am amazed that it does not happen more often.

 checkmark 

You're correct..all of us can look back and see a time where we skipped a step "I've done this a million times and nothing has ever happened"

Quoting AirframeAS (Reply 39):

Quoting JetMech (Reply 34):
Good to see! It is your life and not your managers on the line so stuff them! It's not easy to stand up for yourself in what is a somewhat macho environment.

It usually turns into an arguement most of the time. And it gets frustrating

Next time get it in writing..safety is MANAGEMENT'S job..he should write you up if you DON'T use the required safety equipment.
We can argue back and forth about what happened but NONE of us know the exact circumstances of this tragedy..let it get the investigated properly before we start throwing boulders around.
Work hard fly right..don't understand it
 
RDUDDJI
Posts: 2208
Joined: Fri Jun 04, 2004 4:42 am

RE: UA Mechanic Died In SFO

Mon Nov 19, 2007 3:25 am

We were all very sad to hear this at UA. Our thoughts and prayers go out to his family. FWIW, Friday UA sent out a blanket e-mail to all employees, as well as posted a "headline" on the internal employee website. Nothing specific, just mentioning that we lost one of our own in an accident on the job at SMB.

Quoting Charlienorth (Reply 44):
safety is MANAGEMENT'S job

That is quite possibly the most ignorant statement I've ever seen on A.net Safety is EVERYONE's job. If you truly believe what you said, your managers and safety reps need to have a talk with you.
Sometimes we don't realize the good times when we're in them
 
AirframeAS
Posts: 9811
Joined: Thu Feb 05, 2004 3:56 pm

RE: UA Mechanic Died In SFO

Mon Nov 19, 2007 3:38 am



Quoting Charlienorth (Reply 44):
safety is MANAGEMENT'S job

No, its not. It's EVERYONE's responsibility.

Quoting Charlienorth (Reply 44):
...he should write you up if you DON'T use the required safety equipment.

Uhmm, I was refusing to use items that were NOT safe to do a job or two, well within my rights per OSHA.
A Safe Flight Begins With Quality Maintenance On The Ground.
 
MD11Engineer
Posts: 13899
Joined: Sun Oct 26, 2003 5:25 am

RE: UA Mechanic Died In SFO

Mon Nov 19, 2007 6:54 am



Quoting RDUDDJI (Reply 45):
That is quite possibly the most ignorant statement I've ever seen on A.net Safety is EVERYONE's job. If you truly believe what you said, your managers and safety reps need to have a talk with you.

It is managements's job to ensure that all the equipment required is at hand and that defective equipment gets repaired. It is also management's job to ENFORCE the rules, so that the macho guys who cut corners get disciplined.
It is the worker's duty to use the equipment supplied in accordance with the rules.

But from my experience often all that matters for management is the bottom line and, if they are not turning a blind eye on transgressions, they are often promoting an unsafe culture at work by praising the guy who literally risked his life (e.g. as I have seen with a big cargo airline a guy climbing monkey style over a #2 engine on a MD-11, standing on top of the guard rail of a cherry picker 12 meters above ground (40 feet), just held by our manager by his trouser's belt after I have refused to do the job (checking the wiring on a fire loop on top of the engine) without a proper tail dock (which was available at the airport, being owned by LH Cargo, all the manager would have needed to do is to call LH and rent it for a few hours, but this was in his opinion too expensive). I was called a sissy for refusing to work like this.

Of course, if it goes wrong, management usually wash their hands off any responsibility and points to the various safety regulations which got broken.

I don't know what exactly happened at UA, but it shouldn't have happened. Ok, sometimes it is just bad luck, but we are often working under time pressure, where it is considered wasting time to get the right equipment, or you talk to management about equipment you need to do your job properly, they just give you promises "for the next check, just do it this time without", but the "next check" never comes. You could as well be talking to a wall.
You need personal protective equipment (ear muffs, safety boots etc.), you'd better buy them yourself (even if the company is by law required to provide them), because else you'll get the sh*ttiest and cheapest ones they can get, which barely pass the legal requirements, if any.

Jan
Je Suis Charlie et je suis Ahmet aussi
 
MSYtristar
Posts: 7543
Joined: Sat Aug 27, 2005 12:52 am

RE: UA Mechanic Died In SFO

Mon Nov 19, 2007 3:19 pm



Quoting 474218 (Thread starter):
So far in just 23 posts a.net members have blamed: low cost operators, Air Tran at MSY,

I wasn't blaming FL in MSY. I was making a comparison, as safety in the workplace at FL in MSY was pretty poor. We are talking about a major airline MX base where safety clearly HAS to be the top priority. And ultimetely it falls down to the individual to ensure he or she heeds the advise and takes the proper precautions.

In any case, it is tragedy when any life is lost. May the individual RIP.
 
A330323X
Posts: 2666
Joined: Thu Oct 09, 2003 4:06 pm

RE: UA Mechanic Died In SFO

Mon Nov 19, 2007 7:31 pm

November 17, 2007

Dear Local 9 members:

In a letter posted yesterday, Local 9 told its members about the workplace death of a fellow mechanic at the San Francisco Maintenance Base. We have been in contact with the family and they granted permission to release his identity.

Steve Davis, a 39 year-old mechanic from Tracy, California, died as a result of a fall in the Dock 2 hangar. He leaves behind his wife, Lisa, 16 year-old daughter, Stephanie, and 14 year-old son, Brandon.

Steve hired on with United in December, 1989 and spent the last several years of his career as a mechanic in the SFOOV tool crib. Dock 7 OV mechanic and friend, Dan Lievsay, often car-pooled with Steve as they both commuted to and from Tracy.

Steve routinely took work calls on his cell phone before and after his shift and often walked into work from the parking lot engaged in a work-related cell phone call. He intently focused on getting the job done, helping get the airplane out.

Dan said that Steve was the consummate professional who took an intense interest in performing his job well. When a mechanic needed something special or out-of–the ordinary from the tool crib, OV mechanics knew to ask for Steve. “He was the go-to-guy for tools on midnight shift,” Dan remarked.

Memorial services for Steve Davis will be held at

4:00 p.m. on Tuesday, November 20 at Fry Memorial Chapel

550 Central Avenue, Tracy, CA 95376.

After the memorial, family, friends, and coworkers will gather at:

The Elks Lodge, 6400 W 11th Street, Tracy, CA 95304.


The family requests that donations and contributions for the children’s education be sent instead of flowers.

Contributions and/or condolence cards can be sent to the address below.

Lisa Davis and Family, 757 Hemingway Court, Tracy, CA 95376.

Checks can be made out to Lisa Davis

Dock 7 midnight shift mechanic Dan Lievsay will also collect contributions at work on behalf of the family.

AMFA Local 9 will be making a donation and providing flowers from the members of the Local.

The Company agreed to pay all funeral costs and provided positive space travel to the family’s out-of-state relatives.

Any questions may be directed to Dan Lievsay at 209-832-3376.


Sincerely,
Joseph Prisco
President
AMFA Local 9
I'm the expert on here on two things, neither of which I care about much anymore.

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