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StuckInCA
Posts: 1657
Joined: Wed Oct 19, 2005 12:55 pm

RE: UA Flight Returns To Gate Because Of Plane Book

Thu Aug 25, 2011 4:13 pm

Quoting 01pewterz28 (Reply 23):
Btw this was NOT a United Airlines mainline flight but a UNITED Express flight operation ( Trans States Airlines) under a UAL Flight # so let's not all get upset with United for the lack ok knowledge foe the Flightcrew of this flight.
Quoting aviateur (Reply 50):
It was NOT a United flight; it was a United Express flight.
Quoting tu154 (Reply 64):
This is NOT UA...

Only people who work in the airline industry would possibly think this way and, basically, you're out of your mind. United essentially outsourced this service to another company to provide the service as United. In every way except possibly bookkeeping, this is United. No typical customer cares about technicalities. It's United. If they do a bad job then United shouldn't do business with them.

Quoting USAIRWAYS321 (Reply 65):
The major carriers don't want the media and passengers to figure that out until the regional carrier does something wrong. The major carriers can't have it both ways. If they get the benefit of advertising additional service and a wider route network - all with major carrier branding, mind you - they need to own up when something goes wrong on a UAX flight and Joe Schmoe thinks it's UA. After all, that's how UA wanted it in the first place.

Exactly!

Let's put it this way: If you complain about, say, Dell's customer service is it fair for me to say "This is NOT Dell?" Based on the logic being applied here I could argue that it's really some call center in India that you have a problem with, not Dell. (not intending to pick on Dell here, I don't even know if their service is still a horrid experience or whether it's even an overseas call center).

Quoting ozark1 (Reply 38):
Near the anniversary of 9/11 i don't blame any crew member for any actions that they find suspicious

Where do you draw the line on that one? Is it OK to be suspicious that someone is wearing sunglasses? What if their action is to beat someone with a pipe for wearing them?

[Edited 2011-08-25 09:15:57]
 
D L X
Posts: 12676
Joined: Thu May 27, 1999 3:30 am

RE: UA Flight Returns To Gate Because Of Plane Book

Thu Aug 25, 2011 5:10 pm

Quoting ikramerica (Reply 17):
Quoting tjwgrr (Reply 10):
Agreed- I don't think race had anything to do with this incident- could have easily happened to a Caucasian as well. I would like to hear the other side of the story, as I suspect there may be more to it.


Agreed. It's gender profiling maybe, but hardly racial profiling. I mean, if he were Arab and 25? Maybe I could see his point. But he's an older black man. He's not the profile anyone is looking for here.

But you have to admit: being black is a much more common reason to be mistreated than reading a book about airplanes.

I mean, honestly, if someone said something so stupid as "sir, you need to get off my airplane because you're reading a book about airplanes" I'd be in a weird predicament: is this guy kicking me off because he doesn't like black guys, or is he a loon?

Kicking someone off because they're reading a book about airplanes just doesn't make any sense, any way you slice it. I'm sorry if this is ineloquent, but I'd kind of feel like it would just make more sense to me if the real reason were that he didn't like my complexion. Like, "OHHH, okay, I get it. You're a @#$%, but at least your actions make some sort of sense."
 
Grid
Posts: 253
Joined: Wed Apr 14, 2010 4:26 am

RE: UA Flight Returns To Gate Because Of Plane Book

Thu Aug 25, 2011 5:16 pm

Quoting dalalways (Reply 98):
Quoting Grid (Reply 90):

Kind of irrelevant, especially considering United probably sold the ticket or ticketed the passenger.

Not irrelevant...the policies are not United's Flight Crews and Flight Attendants are trained on their carrier's policies, not United's. The third party carrier is the one to blame here not United, just because United sold the ticket does not mean that they hold the sole responsibility for the actions of the express carrier.

Irrelevant because If the facts as stated are true and the guy vigorously purses a claim and wins, he could collect from United. Irrelevant because it doesn't matter who the carrier was - pulling him off the plane was obnoxious and wrong regardless of who did it.

Relevant because United allows this company to use United's branding and name; perhaps United should do more work with these other carriers to ensure they don't do dumb things.

You cannot benefit from such relationship and then disavow acts when it suits you. All of this just guessing, of course, I don't know what United will do.
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thrufru
Posts: 117
Joined: Tue Feb 10, 2009 3:48 pm

RE: UA Flight Returns To Gate Because Of Plane Book

Thu Aug 25, 2011 6:10 pm

Quoting seabosdca (Reply 24):
This is Boston (where I lived for several years). The same city whose residents shut the entire city down over some guerrilla advertising pieces that included a circuit board, which most of the locals seemed to think was justified. The place is far more paranoid than New York or DC despite not actually having fallen victim to any terrorist attacks.

My guess is that the deadheading pilot who started the whole ruckus was a commuting Bostonian.


News flash... Boston suffered significantly from the terrorist attacks, too. And regarding the guerilla advertising, Bostonians had nothing to do with it or the overreaction of the authorities. In truth, the city took it's officials to task for their heavy-handed and ridiculous response.

Furthermore, it would seem that the most level headed person in this entire incident was a Massachusetts State Police Trooper. He recognized the complete lack of any credible threat and let Mr. Gilbert re-board the plane.

The situation is unfortunate and Mr. Gilbert has made it abundantly clear that he felt humiliated and embarrassed, but I don't see what the big deal is here. The situation was evaluated, security personnel were apprised of the situation, responded and resolved it in the traveler's favor. The system actually worked.

Additionally, when was the last time you boarded a plane (especially from a regional airline) in any city and any member of the crew was from that city, let alone all of them?


And on a final note, while it has been pointed out that it was not a United aircraft but a regional affiliate, it truly still is the responsibility of the mainline carrier to take ownership of the incident. Subcontracting any job in no way absolves the original party of their obligations to their clients or in this case, passengers.
 
mcdu
Posts: 1625
Joined: Thu Apr 28, 2005 5:23 am

RE: UA Flight Returns To Gate Because Of Plane Book

Thu Aug 25, 2011 9:10 pm

Quoting Grid (Reply 102):
You cannot benefit from such relationship and then disavow acts when it suits you. All of this just guessing, of course, I don't know what United will do.

How do you know UA will do anything? How do you know United is guilty of anything? You are basing your judgement on a blog. This is not a news source, this is one side of the story and until you have an independent news source, police report or other items you are grasping at straws.

Let this issue be judged by the authorities and the lawyers. Not yokels on a.net or from the "victims" blog.
 
bennett123
Posts: 9732
Joined: Sun Aug 15, 2004 12:49 am

RE: UA Flight Returns To Gate Because Of Plane Book

Thu Aug 25, 2011 9:15 pm

Has there been any reaction from UA yet.
 
Grid
Posts: 253
Joined: Wed Apr 14, 2010 4:26 am

RE: UA Flight Returns To Gate Because Of Plane Book

Thu Aug 25, 2011 10:55 pm

Quoting mcdu (Reply 104):
Quoting Grid (Reply 102):
You cannot benefit from such relationship and then disavow acts when it suits you. All of this just guessing, of course, I don't know what United will do.

How do you know UA will do anything? How do you know United is guilty of anything? You are basing your judgement on a blog. This is not a news source, this is one side of the story and until you have an independent news source, police report or other items you are grasping at straws.

Let this issue be judged by the authorities and the lawyers. Not yokels on a.net or from the "victims" blog.

I don't know that UA will do anything, and I did not say United was guilty of anything. I said I was guessing. What part of "guessing" do you not understand?

Finally, this is an internet forum. People are free to speculate, guess, judge etc. If this is your first day using the internet, better get used to it.
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DALelite
Posts: 1318
Joined: Thu Jun 01, 2000 7:00 am

RE: UA Flight Returns To Gate Because Of Plane Book

Fri Aug 26, 2011 1:48 am

Quoting rdh3e (Reply 18):
Melodrama much? This guy is clearly exaggerating and it honestly sounds like although they should NOT have gone back to the gate, that the police and TSA handled the matter very professionally.

How arrogant to make such an comment. Why not just take it for real how this man expirienced the situation?
Such incidents have happened to me several times before, and yes... he describes the way i felt back then, perhaps with a little more anger.

Ok.... this gentleman was pulling the racecard, but why is it, that lots of guys automaticallly start to put him into the no win/liar position??? It says alot about the way you treat yourselfs and your envoirement.

DALelite
They loved to fly and it showed..
 
Maverick623
Posts: 4722
Joined: Thu Nov 30, 2006 9:13 am

RE: UA Flight Returns To Gate Because Of Plane Book

Fri Aug 26, 2011 2:04 am

Quoting Grid (Reply 90):
How are people bashing two billion people?

I suggest you go back and read the posts that say "Shame on UA", "Shame on Americans" and "Shame on the industry for being paranoid"... all comments based on a one-sided blog post.

Quoting Grid (Reply 90):
We are reasonable people and free to discuss and speculate about what occurred or may not have occurred.

Except that's not what happened. Several posters took the opportunity, some clearly without reading the blog post, to bash on everyone from a commuting pilot that may or may not have had anything to do with it, to a major city, to the entire system. Those are who I was referring to.

Quoting Grid (Reply 90):
freest country in the world.

     

Don't get me wrong, we live in a great country, and I don't intend on moving away, but have you read the Patriot Act recently?
"PHX is Phoenix, PDX is the other city" -777Way
 
tu154
Posts: 346
Joined: Fri Dec 17, 2004 1:37 am

RE: UA Flight Returns To Gate Because Of Plane Book

Fri Aug 26, 2011 2:16 am

The minute the author of the letter stated he was African American sends a red flag in itself.

I would never include in a complaint letter or other that..."I am a White American."



The statement of color is a grasp at straws.
FIRST ON THE ATLANTIC.....FIRST ON THE PACIFIC.....FIRST IN LATIN AMERICA...FIRST 'ROUND THE WORLD.....PAN AM!!
 
loggat
Posts: 437
Joined: Sat Feb 12, 2000 11:34 am

RE: UA Flight Returns To Gate Because Of Plane Book

Fri Aug 26, 2011 2:38 am

Quoting milesrich (Reply 92):
Have you ever noticed, or is my imagination, but these incidents usually happen on Regional Aircraft, not mainline aircraft. Remember the UA Regional Flight that made an emergency landing because some Orthodox Jewish Guy was laying Tifillan? While I want aircrews to be careful, this is ridiculous

Same company. That one was a US Express ERj-145 LGA-SDF operated by Chautauqua (same company as Shuttle America), diverted to PHL. Tefellin was an unknown ritual/procedure/item even to the FO of the flight who was a Jew himself. It has to be said that to the ignorant bystander, a person not responding when spoken to, who has his arm wrapped in what appeared to be wires, partaking in a prayer in an audible foreign language, should be a little more suspicious than a dude in a hawaiian shirt, sporting a fanny pack, and reading a book about airplanes. There has to be more to this story than is being let on.
There are 3 types of people in this world, those that can count, and those that can't.
 
D L X
Posts: 12676
Joined: Thu May 27, 1999 3:30 am

RE: UA Flight Returns To Gate Because Of Plane Book

Fri Aug 26, 2011 4:20 am

Quoting tu154 (Reply 109):
"I am a White American."

You would if you got tossed out of a diner in the hood!

Your belief that it is automatically not about race is just as bad if not worse than someone's belief that it might actually be about race.


And let's be honest: getting bounced because of race makes a lot more sense than getting bounced because you were reading a book about airplanes. That doesn't make any sense at all.
 
Grid
Posts: 253
Joined: Wed Apr 14, 2010 4:26 am

RE: UA Flight Returns To Gate Because Of Plane Book

Fri Aug 26, 2011 12:29 pm

Quoting Maverick623 (Reply 108):
I suggest you go back and read the posts that say "Shame on UA", "Shame on Americans" and "Shame on the industry for being paranoid"... all comments based on a one-sided blog post.

I was wondering where you got the number of two billion people.

Quoting Maverick623 (Reply 108):
Don't get me wrong, we live in a great country, and I don't intend on moving away, but have you read the Patriot Act recently?

Yes, I just read the entire act last night. So what? It's still the freest county in the world.

Quoting D L X (Reply 111):
Your belief that it is automatically not about race is just as bad if not worse than someone's belief that it might actually be about race.

True.
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planereality
Posts: 91
Joined: Sun Sep 07, 2008 6:01 pm

RE: UA Flight Returns To Gate Because Of Plane Book

Fri Aug 26, 2011 2:30 pm

Ok- 112 posts later... Who has corroborated this man's story?
Andiamo!
 
Maverick623
Posts: 4722
Joined: Thu Nov 30, 2006 9:13 am

RE: UA Flight Returns To Gate Because Of Plane Book

Fri Aug 26, 2011 8:28 pm

Quoting Grid (Reply 112):

I was wondering where you got the number of two billion people.
Quoting blueflyer (Reply 2):
we have reached new depths of stupidity/paranoia
Quoting flyorski (Reply 5):
we could even get to the point that we need to worry about what we read.
Quoting varigb707 (Reply 32):
The terrorists have won.

Implying that the aviation system in the western world has collapsed.

Quoting Grid (Reply 112):
It's still the freest county in the world.

I disagree... let's agree to that.
"PHX is Phoenix, PDX is the other city" -777Way
 
flyorski
Posts: 733
Joined: Thu Dec 16, 2004 8:23 am

RE: UA Flight Returns To Gate Because Of Plane Book

Fri Aug 26, 2011 9:07 pm

Quoting Maverick623 (Reply 114):
Implying that the aviation system in the western world has collapsed.

I am not implying any such thing.

I am saying its sad that I will now think about what I bring to read on an aircraft. I do not have to, however in the back of my mind stories like this one do influence me.
"None are more hopelessly enslaved, than those who falsly believe they are free" -Goethe
 
alasizon
Posts: 2598
Joined: Sat Apr 28, 2007 8:57 pm

RE: UA Flight Returns To Gate Because Of Plane Book

Sat Aug 27, 2011 12:05 am

Since I'm someone who for the past couple of trips has read books such as Emergency in the Cockpit, I think this is just another odd case where details are withheld and everything is sensationalized.
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