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TK787
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Turkish Aviation December 2011

Thu Dec 01, 2011 12:38 am

Welcome to the December 2011 edition of the Turkish Aviation thread.
I wish I had more time to do a recap of this last year, but unfortunately that have to wait.
But here it is; one of the more exciting news of this year:
Atlasjet ordering 10+5 CS300s and Pegasus might go for 100NBs, probably 737s;
Let's wait and see how this unfolds but congrats to all parties involved;

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As usual most of the news come from TK;
-Out of the 3 remaining 333s left to join the fleet, 2 of them are almost ready.
-TK announced bunch of new routes depending on plane availibility; like, Abuja, Kano, Novosibirsk, Ulanbator, Bilbao, La Coruna, Mogadishu.....
-We are still waiting for Manila, or the proposed extension of IST-GRU route to EZE.
-Somehow YYZ frequency supposed to go from 3 to 4 weekly.
-One fact check; Hamdi Topcu of TK made a remark back in January 2011 that by the end of the year TK's fleet to reach 180-200 jets. Even that sounded strange, 20 frames is a lot of play room, within a companies 12 month growth plan. But now that we are in December that number will be actualized, probably around 182-184.
-Hopefully by this time next month TK 739ERs will be flying out of IST.

Please join us with your news, rumors, pictures, suggestions and complaints.
It might be a tad bit early but I wish everyone a happy holiday season and a happy new year.
 
TurkishWings
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RE: Turkish Aviation December 2011

Thu Dec 01, 2011 6:42 am

Quoting TK787 (Thread starter):
Atlasjet ordering 10+5 CS300s

I kinda feel bad when I see AtlasJet ads on TV... They are so proud of their product and try to sell them desperately... With only a handful of aircraft, I wonder how they even make money...

Am I right to say that AtlasJet is still trying to recuperate their brand since the Isparta accident?
Coffee - Tea or Me?
 
leftyboarder
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RE: Turkish Aviation December 2011

Thu Dec 01, 2011 6:59 am

Quoting TurkishWings (Reply 1):
I kinda feel bad when I see AtlasJet ads on TV... They are so proud of their product and try to sell them desperately... With only a handful of aircraft, I wonder how they even make money...

Am I right to say that AtlasJet is still trying to recuperate their brand since the Isparta accident?

To me it seems like AtlasJet has no strategy and honestly not much to differentiate it from competitors on its core markets (IST-ADB and IST-AYT come to mind). I honestly would only pick them if they were the cheapest, I don't care much about the on board service for a 45 minute flight. Also let's not forget that you can get that service on TK anyways, so their only advantage is over PGS. It's a shame they didn't find their niche yet.
 
emrecan
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RE: Turkish Aviation December 2011

Thu Dec 01, 2011 7:06 am

What is going on with Saga Airlines? AFAIK they cannot even pay for their captains..
 
tcm
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RE: Turkish Aviation December 2011

Thu Dec 01, 2011 4:18 pm

TK is replacing the 77W service to CAN with A343s. LH had announced that it will axe CAN from it's network, now TK is decreasing capacity.

Link: http://airlineroute.net/2011/11/30/tk-can-s12/?like=1
 
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TK787
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RE: Turkish Aviation December 2011

Thu Dec 01, 2011 7:26 pm

Quoting tcm (Reply 4):

Well, I guess time to order some 787s, since TK will not have this luxury when 343s are gone.

On a side note;
It is all in the details; December issue of Delta SKY magazine have a section on Turkey, "Turkish Delight", starting on Page 72. Delta flight number 72 is JFK-IST, (besides ATL-JFK)
Coincidence???
 
leftyboarder
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RE: Turkish Aviation December 2011

Thu Dec 01, 2011 10:10 pm

Quoting TK787 (Reply 5):
Delta flight number 72 is JFK-IST, (besides ATL-JFK)

Wasn't it SFO-JFK-IST? Didn't know it changed to ATL-JFK-IST. Totally agree on 787 / A350, it's way overdue!
 
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TK787
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RE: Turkish Aviation December 2011

Fri Dec 02, 2011 1:03 am

 
leftyboarder
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RE: Turkish Aviation December 2011

Fri Dec 02, 2011 7:19 am

Quoting TK787 (Reply 7):
http://flightaware.com/live/flight/DAL72
here it is, i didnt know

Thanks for the update, I guess they changed it sometime after 08.2008, that's when I flew SFO-JFK-IST (although it wasn't a single-plane flight). Makes more sense to at least appear to link your main hub with a major European destination with a single flight number  
 
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TK787
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RE: Turkish Aviation December 2011

Sun Dec 04, 2011 1:52 am

Latest batch, 2nd 737-800 for TK , TC-JHL, completes first flight;
http://boeing-test-flights.blogspot....b737-8f2-turkish-first-flight.html
 
TurkishWings
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RE: Turkish Aviation December 2011

Sun Dec 04, 2011 2:36 pm

Does anyone have any info on the following? I could not find anything on the internet. It looks like a bird strike. I do not remember reading any "Sok sok sok... Yuzlerce yolcu olumden kılpayı dondu" comments on the Turkish media either  
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Turkish350XWB
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RE: Turkish Aviation December 2011

Sun Dec 04, 2011 3:40 pm

Quoting TurkishWings (Reply 10):
I do not remember reading any "Sok sok sok... Yuzlerce yolcu olumden kılpayı dondu" comments on the Turkish media either

  
I do remember a birdstrike. Turkish media reported 50 casualities - it was 50 birds...
 
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LAXintl
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RE: Turkish Aviation December 2011

Sun Dec 04, 2011 5:57 pm

For those flying from the USA-Turkey, TK will continue its €200 airport upgrade offer to Comfort Class during December.


In other news I see China Southern commenced Urumqi - IST service at the end of November. Seems the China-Turkey commerce has become very active lately both on the passenger and cargo arenas.
From the desert to the sea, to all of Southern California
 
TurkishSky
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RE: Turkish Aviation December 2011

Sun Dec 04, 2011 6:44 pm

Quoting Turkish350XWB (Reply 11):
In other news I see China Southern commenced Urumqi - IST service at the end of November. Seems the China-Turkey commerce has become very active lately both on the passenger and cargo arenas.

I can't really say I agree with this. Hainan stopped PVG-URC-IST flights at the same time..
Flown 0B 4I 9U A3 AA AB AF AZ BA BD BR CA CU CX EI EK FR HV JK JP JU KK KL KM LH LX MA ME MS NG OA OK QR OS RJ RO SA SK SQ SR SU UA VY YM
 
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LAXintl
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RE: Turkish Aviation December 2011

Sun Dec 04, 2011 10:12 pm

Well lets see - THY now serves 3 cities in PRC for passenger operations, 1 city with all cargo ops. Chinese interest have purchased a Turkish air carrier and a separate maintenance organization, and China now has become Turkey's 3rd largest (after EU and Russia) trading partner.

I say the commerce between the two nations has grown incredible amount in a short term which trickles down and benefits airlines.
From the desert to the sea, to all of Southern California
 
leftyboarder
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RE: Turkish Aviation December 2011

Mon Dec 05, 2011 2:57 pm

Nov'11 stats for airports out. Apart from ongoing growth at the usual suspects like AYT, ADB, IST, SAW, one can count 14 airports above 1m passengers for 2011 (and that still excludes Dec 2011). Phenomenal!
 
Turkish350XWB
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RE: Turkish Aviation December 2011

Mon Dec 05, 2011 5:29 pm

Quoting leftyboarder (Reply 15):

IST will most probably pass 37m, AYT 25m. Next year we will have 5 airports passing 10m: ADB, ESB,AYT,SAW,IST, with IST having 40m+ with 8.2% growth. Istanbul area will have 55m next year.
 
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TK787
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RE: Turkish Aviation December 2011

Tue Dec 06, 2011 2:20 pm

I was reading some of the latest TK ratings on Skytrax, mostly positive, but two complaints stuck out;
-cabin temperature being too hot
-not being able to check in earlier than 24 hrs.

-Why is the cabin temp. too hot on TK?? Is this the usual " Klimayi kapatirmisiniz sirtim tutuluyor!" situation? Since I rarely fly on TK I haven't experienced it. But I fly 3-4 times a month mostly in the US and this is hardly an issue and FA's can adjust it if needed. I had a 2.5 hour flight last night and all was fine.

-Why won't TK let people check in and reserve seats earlier then 24 hours? So it is convenient to them? When I fly DL (50% of the time), I can choose seats months in advance and always get it. Check in is 24 hours at DL also, but being able to get seat assignment months earlier is huge.
 
leftyboarder
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RE: Turkish Aviation December 2011

Tue Dec 06, 2011 2:52 pm

Indeed TK review score on Skytrax is higher than LH / AF / BA / EK. And on the way up too.

This article confirms that TK is indeed upping frequencies to YYZ this year and in 2013 as well (to 5 weekly): http://www.embassymag.ca/dailyupdate...elective_arab_awakening_12-05-2011
 
Turkish350XWB
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RE: Turkish Aviation December 2011

Tue Dec 06, 2011 2:56 pm

Quoting TK787 (Reply 17):
not being able to check in earlier than 24 hrs.

Perhaps because they shuffle aircraft so often, and 24h before they know it?
Also with LH and LX check-in starts 23 or 24 hours before departure.
 
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TK787
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RE: Turkish Aviation December 2011

Tue Dec 06, 2011 3:11 pm

Quoting Turkish350XWB (Reply 19):

Maybe that is the industry norm.
Checking in is not that important, getting a seat assignment is. If you wait till the last minute you end up in the middle seat, and that is no fun on a long flight. I think that is most of the complaints point to.



Quoting leftyboarder (Reply 18):

Nice, maybe that is where the spare 77W from CAN will move to.
 
ASA
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RE: Turkish Aviation December 2011

Tue Dec 06, 2011 3:18 pm

Quoting TK787 (Reply 17):

I was reading some of the latest TK ratings on Skytrax, mostly positive, but two complaints stuck out;
-cabin temperature being too hot
-not being able to check in earlier than 24 hrs.

I had issues with both of these during my recent JFK-IST-DAC flights.

The first leg of the journey - JFK-IST - the cabin temperature was really hot. I was sweating in my seat ... there wasn't any air vents on the 77W (is that normal for all Ws?). I mentioned it to one FA - and she said she'll look into it. But it didn't change anything.

But later not, when I went to the lavatory in the back, I found those areas surprisingly cooler - so I'm not sure if it was something to do with less air circulation at the middle of the aircraft. I ended up hanging around the back of the aircraft to cool myself off! 

On the other hand, the A333 on the DAC-IST route was cooler than normal ... luckily I had my jacket with me. So I'm not sure if there is a standard airline policy about the inside temperature - or its just fixed as the FAs feel.

I couldn't choose seats either - I just called TK directly and requested window seats.
 
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TK787
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RE: Turkish Aviation December 2011

Tue Dec 06, 2011 3:26 pm

Quoting ASA (Reply 21):
its just fixed as the FAs feel.

As far as I know, it is common sense/and depending on the climate of departure city FA's set it. Also, if I am not mistaken the cabin temp has few different section controls.
It would make perfect sense that if you are leaving JFK in winter the cabin temp is set to 72F, since everyone will be walking in with heavy coats, turtlenecks and such. Similarly if you are leaving LAX in summer, the temp should be 76F to keep all those naked toes warm.
Still few degrees shouldn't be a huge problem. On long haul, pax have blankets and it seems like overnight flights when most pax sleeping they turn up the heat to keep them sleeping. Just my observation.
Maybe some of our flight crew friends can chime in.
 
tozbek
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RE: Turkish Aviation December 2011

Tue Dec 06, 2011 3:57 pm

It's very interesting that Pegasus entering to Kazakhistan route. The airline is starting Istanbul Sabiha Gokcen-Almaty route. Waiting more...
 
MEA330
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RE: Turkish Aviation December 2011

Tue Dec 06, 2011 3:59 pm

Atlas Jet is taking delivery of 2 A321-200 (ex MEA).
Delivery DEC 2011.
 
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TK787
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RE: Turkish Aviation December 2011

Tue Dec 06, 2011 4:20 pm

Quoting tozbek (Reply 23):

This is going to get really interesting. With all those brand new 738s arriving Pegasus will have to challenge TK almost everywhere. Good for public, eventually.
 
tcm
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RE: Turkish Aviation December 2011

Tue Dec 06, 2011 4:31 pm

The lack of individual air wents on both the new 333s and 77Ws is a major inconvenience. On most TK long haul flights the cabin tempreture is far too high. I think the FAs prefer higher cabin tempretures so that pax doze off quickly and they can enjoy the social atmosphere of the galley  Of course one other side effect for the passenger is the increased thirst.

Seat selection is still only available by contacting TK, would be nice to be able to do that through the website. Online check-in available at T-24 which AFAIK is standard around the industry.

[Edited 2011-12-06 08:32:49]
 
tcm
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RE: Turkish Aviation December 2011

Tue Dec 06, 2011 6:34 pm

Anyone miss the iststatus feed for ATC communication? Seems they have cut it off  
 
bmibaby737
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RE: Turkish Aviation December 2011

Tue Dec 06, 2011 6:43 pm

Quoting MEA330 (Reply 24):
Atlas Jet is taking delivery of 2 A321-200 (ex MEA).

Would these be F-ORME (last flew 4/12) & F-ORMF (last flew 22/11)...?
 
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TK787
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RE: Turkish Aviation December 2011

Tue Dec 06, 2011 9:13 pm

Quoting tcm (Reply 27):

What's up with that?

TKs 739ERs still doing US tours!!!
http://flightaware.com/live/flight/BOE612
To Charleston this time...
 
tcm
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RE: Turkish Aviation December 2011

Tue Dec 06, 2011 9:47 pm

Quoting TK787 (Reply 29):

No more ATC feeds on the net for IST or am I missing something?

More info here:

http://www.airporthaber.com/iststatus-susturuldu--36590h.html (Turkish Only)

Unbelievable how long it is taking for TK's 739ERs to be ready. Could it be that they are looking to defer the maintenance costs to 2012?

[Edited 2011-12-06 13:50:15]

[Edited 2011-12-06 14:05:30]
 
ISTGRU
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RE: Turkish Aviation December 2011

Wed Dec 07, 2011 5:17 am

Quoting TK787 (Reply 17):
cabin temperature being too hot


Its very true - I generally wake up on TK long haul flights covered in sweat. Its a very uncomfortable experience. Other airlines don't have individual temperature controls on long haul - LX and LH (on the 330/346 fleet) come to mind - but these airlines don't turn up cabin temperatures to hamam conditions so it doesn't really matter. I was on a LX 333 ORD - ZRH last week and I didn't even notice that there were no individual air vents until landing - largely because the temperature was kept to a very comfortable level.
 
MEA330
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RE: Turkish Aviation December 2011

Wed Dec 07, 2011 6:48 am

Quoting bmibaby737 (Reply 28):
Would these be F-ORME (last flew 4/12) & F-ORMF (last flew 22/11)...?

That's correct. They are being prepared for delivery.
MEA is rolling their older A321's with A320 aircraft with 4 new A320's scheduled for delivery next year.
 
NuD38
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RE: Turkish Aviation December 2011

Wed Dec 07, 2011 8:17 am

Quoting tcm (Reply 27):

Anyone miss the iststatus feed for ATC communication? Seems they have cut it off

flightradar24 application lost Istanbul coverage too  

I would set up planeplotter and share it online if I had a chance

[Edited 2011-12-07 00:19:46]
 
cuban8
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RE: Turkish Aviation December 2011

Wed Dec 07, 2011 12:33 pm

Quoting TK787 (Reply 17):
I was reading some of the latest TK ratings on Skytrax, mostly positive, but two complaints stuck out;
-cabin temperature being too hot
-not being able to check in earlier than 24 hrs.


I'm surprised that nothing negative has been mentioned regarding the TK ground staff. Usually that's the number one complaint among A.net members when it comes to TK, or was these ratings just related to the flight itself?

A bit of criticism regarding TK; so where is Bahadir when you really need him?  
When business goes to hell, you get rid of three things. Your private jet, your yacht and your mistress..........and most importantly in that order.
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gokmengs
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RE: Turkish Aviation December 2011

Wed Dec 07, 2011 2:06 pm

Quoting TK787 (Reply 29):

TKs 739ERs still doing US tours!!!
http://flightaware.com/live/flight/BOE612
To Charleston this time...

I know you guys discussed this subject before but what is the deal with the super long testing and delay in delivery for these a/c

Also anyone heard any developments regarding UA EWR-IST? I'm wondering if they didn't announce the route yet is it impossible for it to start or 2012 summer season.
Yaşa Mustafa Kemal Paşa Yaşa, Adın Yazılacak Mücevher Taşa
 
777way
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RE: Turkish Aviation December 2011

Wed Dec 07, 2011 2:44 pm

Quoting LAXintl (Reply 14):
THY now serves 3 cities in PRC for passenger operations, 1 city with all cargo ops.

which is the cargo only city?
 
bahadir
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RE: Turkish Aviation December 2011

Thu Dec 08, 2011 2:49 am

Add me to the complainers about the high heat and the lack of gasper fans in these newly delivered airplanes.
Earthbound misfit I
 
leftyboarder
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RE: Turkish Aviation December 2011

Fri Dec 09, 2011 11:31 am

TK flights to MRA (Misrata in Libya) now official; starting Dec 15th (next week!) 4 weekly, becoming daily Jan 5th.

Source (in Turkish): http://www.turkishairlines.com/tr-TR...189/misrata---libya-seferleri.aspx
 
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TK787
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RE: Turkish Aviation December 2011

Fri Dec 09, 2011 8:03 pm

Quoting gokmengs (Reply 35):

TKs 739ERs still doing US tours!!!
http://flightaware.com/live/flight/BOE612
To Charleston this time...

I have no idea why it took so long for these 739ERs. First flight was in June and finally !!!!! the delivery flight scheduled for today;
http://flightaware.com/live/flight/THY6900
 
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TK787
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RE: Turkish Aviation December 2011

Fri Dec 09, 2011 10:57 pm

Quoting TK787 (Reply 39):

Don't know what happened but the flight diverted back to Charleston.
Correction again, now it says it is "on route", don't know if it ever diverted.

[Edited 2011-12-09 15:26:45]
 
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TK787
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RE: Turkish Aviation December 2011

Fri Dec 09, 2011 11:30 pm

TK A320 in new colors, I guess this is a start.
http://www.skyliner-aviation.de/viewphoto.main?LC=&picid=7570
 
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RobK
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RE: Turkish Aviation December 2011

Sat Dec 10, 2011 12:26 am

Quoting TK787 (Reply 39):
I have no idea why it took so long for these 739ERs. First flight was in June and finally !!!!! the delivery flight scheduled for today;
http://flightaware.com/live/flight/T...Y6900

They go to PATS Aircraft Systems at GED for auxiliary fuel tank installation as a general rule (they also do interiors and avionics there too). The length of time they've been there suggests that this is the case with the TK birds (aux tanks). I expect them to be deployed on long range routes based on this.

No idea what the additional delay is due to. At a guess I would say paperwork issues as initially JYA showed as canx from N973TK on 22 Nov iirc, but now it shows as canx 8 Dec. The diversion tonight is more likely a tech issue though. I'm sure your TK insiders will be able to supply more info if you ask.   
 
gokmengs
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RE: Turkish Aviation December 2011

Sat Dec 10, 2011 1:54 pm

Quoting RobK (Reply 42):

Thanks for the info as always. What is the usual time frame for aux tank installed 739ER's? TK delivery seems to be taking way too long.

In other news UA just launched DOH and everyone says IST next! Let's see if it will happen
Yaşa Mustafa Kemal Paşa Yaşa, Adın Yazılacak Mücevher Taşa
 
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RobK
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RE: Turkish Aviation December 2011

Sat Dec 10, 2011 2:27 pm

Quoting gokmengs (Reply 43):
Thanks for the info as always. What is the usual time frame for aux tank installed 739ER's? TK delivery seems to be taking way too long.

Tanks only is around 1 month. If they are getting the interior done there as well (as I suspect TK did) then 4 months is about the norm if the customer wants them all finished and ready to put them straight into service. The ANA 737-700ERs had tanks and interior done there and they were both 4 months give-or-take. Variant doesn't make any difference.
 
gokmengs
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RE: Turkish Aviation December 2011

Sat Dec 10, 2011 2:43 pm

Quoting RobK (Reply 44):

Tanks only is around 1 month. If they are getting the interior done there as well (as I suspect TK did) then 4 months is about the norm if the customer wants them all finished and ready to put them straight into service. The ANA 737-700ERs had tanks and interior done there and they were both 4 months give-or-take. Variant doesn't make any difference.

Thank you for the detailed info my friend. Let's see where TK will use these ac for...
Yaşa Mustafa Kemal Paşa Yaşa, Adın Yazılacak Mücevher Taşa
 
Turkish350XWB
Posts: 489
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RE: Turkish Aviation December 2011

Sat Dec 10, 2011 5:08 pm

Some pics of the first TK B739ER in IST, unfortunately no interior pics.

http://www.airporthaber.com/turk-hav...lari-filosunda-bir-ilk-36807h.html

Quoting gokmengs (Reply 43):
In other news UA just launched DOH and everyone says IST next! Let's see if it will happen

It's quite strange that IST has only so few non-TK longhaul flights. Curious if IST will once get similarly international as LHR, CDG or FRA.
 
tcm
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RE: Turkish Aviation December 2011

Sun Dec 11, 2011 3:58 pm

Some insight by TK Chairman Hamdi Topcu on TK, Turkish Aviation and the third airport.

see: http://video.ntvmsnbc.com/#mehmet-ba...lasla-45-dakika-9-aralik-2011.html (Turkish)

From the interview it seems to me that TK would prefer the expansion of IST, instead of moving to a new airport.
 
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TK787
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RE: Turkish Aviation December 2011

Sun Dec 11, 2011 8:41 pm

Quoting tcm (Reply 47):

Thanks for the link, a very long interview.
Couple things were interesting; TK is making its 2023 plans depending only on IST
And the financial situation; H.T. had to take a deep breath before answering the question about the loss.
 
TK773ER
Posts: 188
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RE: Turkish Aviation December 2011

Mon Dec 12, 2011 9:58 am

Not sure if this has been mentioned before i know there was talk but it seems IAD and LAX are going daily from march 2012 http://www.travelpulse.com/turkish-a...er-daily-flights-from-iad-lax.html it sounds like both these destinations are doing well....

With these expansions and YYZ going to 4 weekly surely TK must have to announce more WB orders soon ?

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