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vaman
Topic Author
Posts: 316
Joined: Sun Feb 06, 2000 12:27 pm

Least Safest Airlines

Mon Oct 09, 2000 9:49 am

Does any body know what the top 5 or 10 least safest airlines are in the world? I've always wondered.
 
TWA902fly
Posts: 3162
Joined: Fri Dec 31, 1999 5:47 am

RE: Least Safest Airlines

Mon Oct 09, 2000 9:57 am

Im guessing AIR INDIA as #1
life wasn't worth the balance, or the crumpled paper it was written on
 
Guest

RE: Least Safest Airlines

Mon Oct 09, 2000 9:59 am

GARUDA of Indonesia should be on the list. We even had an A-330 flight cancelled when the pilot didnt show up for duty!!
Ted
 
hkgspotter1
Posts: 5750
Joined: Fri Nov 04, 2005 12:43 pm

RE: Least Safest Airlines

Mon Oct 09, 2000 10:44 am

Air India !!!, what are you talking about. Name accidents with Air India in the past years.

If you want bad try Korean or China Airlines or most of the small carriers in south america.
 
IndianGuy
Posts: 3124
Joined: Fri Jul 07, 2000 3:14 pm

RE: Least Safest Airlines

Mon Oct 09, 2000 12:20 pm

TWA902Fly:

What are u talking about? AI hasnt had a fatality in the past 15 years! The last fatality on AI was when one of their Jumbos was blown up over the Atlantic by a terrorist bomb. And that isnt happening ever again, since security has been beefed up since then.

Their ontime performance etc may have suffered over the years, but their maintainance is one of the best in the world! I have personally visited their engineering facilities in BOM, and can say that they are definitely world-class.

Even Indian Airlines(IC) which has had a fatal crash this year has a pretty decent record, considering the huge network they serve.

Most of the hoo-haa about safety of Indian carriers is unfounded. Engineering and Maintainance of ALL indian carriers is truly world-class.

Service ofcourse is another story!
 
Guest

RE: Least Safest Airlines

Mon Oct 09, 2000 12:24 pm

The worst are in this order:
Cubana
AeroPeru
AirZimbabwe
China Airlines
Royal Jordanian
THY
Air India


Ted
 
Pacific
Posts: 1148
Joined: Fri Mar 10, 2000 2:46 pm

RE: Least Safest Airlines

Mon Oct 09, 2000 4:12 pm

This is the list of airlines with accidents. The highest accident ratio airlines are at the top. Taken from www.airsafe.com

Cubana
AeroPeru
Air Zimbabwe
China Airlines
Royal Jordanian
Transportes Aereos Regionais (TAM)
EgyptAir/Air Sinai
THY
Air India
AirTran (ValuJet)
Korean Air
Nigeria Airways
Pakistan International Airlines
Indian Airlines
Philippine Air Lines
Garuda Indonesia Airlines
LAN Chile
Ethiopian Airlines
Midwest Express
Air Afrique
VASP
Avianca
Kenya Airways
TAESA
Iran Air
Transbrasil
Japan Air Lines
Thai Airways International
Aeromexico
Asiana Airlines
Olympic Airways/Olympic Aviation
Royal Air Maroc
Cathay Pacific
Saudi Arabian Airlines
KLM/KLM Cityhopper
Swissair/Crossair
Varig
Aerolineas Argentinas
Air France/Air France Europe
TAP Air Portugal
Malaysia Airlines
Singapore Airlines/SilkAir
British Midland Airways
Iberia
Alitalia
Alaska Airlines/Horizon Air
Trans World Airlines/Trans World Express
Braathens
Air New Zealand
Air Canada
Continental Airlines/Continental Express
South African Airways
US Airways/USAir Express
American Airlines/American Eagle
Mexicana
United Airlines/United Express
Aloha Airlines/Aloha Islandair
Northwest Airlines/Northwest Airlink
Lufthansa/Condor
British Airways
Delta Airlines/Delta Connection
All Nippon Airways

Pacific
 
VirginA340
Posts: 2556
Joined: Sun Jul 17, 2005 12:35 pm

RE: Least Safest Airlines

Mon Oct 09, 2000 10:30 pm

You've got to be joking!!! AI being unsafe. If Sean heard that he would probably flip. Their on-time profomance and on-board service in economy has suffered a bit but their security and maintinace is supurb and they run a tight ship at the maintinance hangers in BOM and DEL when I was there to take a guarded and gided tour of the facilties. They've havn't had a crash since 1884 and that was a bomb since then security and maintinace procedures have been beefed up not like the airlines in the US being lax on security after PA 103 in which my best friend and his family were killed. It shows that US airlines have learned little or nothing because they want to save cash. While AI has learned and is trying damn hard to let history not repeat itself. I belive the worst are Cubana, the old PAN AM after 103, EAL during the Lorenzo era of cutting corners on maintinace. Indian Airlines and unfortionaly (Shmae on you; I expected better) Royal Jordanian.
"FUIMUS"
 
VirginA340
Posts: 2556
Joined: Sun Jul 17, 2005 12:35 pm

RE: Least Safest Airlines

Mon Oct 09, 2000 10:31 pm

You've got to be joking!!! AI being unsafe. If Sean heard that he would probably flip. Their on-time profomance and on-board service in economy has suffered a bit but their security and maintinace is supurb and they run a tight ship at the maintinance hangers in BOM and DEL when I was there to take a guarded and gided tour of the facilties. They've havn't had a crash since 1884 and that was a bomb since then security and maintinace procedures have been beefed up not like the airlines in the US being lax on security after PA 103 in which my best friend and his family were killed. It shows that US airlines have learned little or nothing because they want to save cash. While AI has learned and is trying damn hard to let history not repeat itself. I belive the worst are Cubana, the old PAN AM after 103, EAL during the Lorenzo era of cutting corners on maintinace. Indian Airlines and unfortionaly (Shame on you; I expected better) Royal Jordanian.
"FUIMUS"
 
lxlgu
Posts: 955
Joined: Mon Sep 04, 2000 7:12 pm

RE: Least Safest Airlines

Mon Oct 09, 2000 11:05 pm

It is very unfair to list Air Zimbabwe in the top ten
The only accidents that they have had were in the 80s
and the Viscounts were shot down by terroists.
They have not had a fatal accident since then.I have
flown them and most of the pilots are ex SAA so they
are top class
 
IndianGuy
Posts: 3124
Joined: Fri Jul 07, 2000 3:14 pm

RE: Least Safest Airlines

Mon Oct 09, 2000 11:37 pm

My earlier post on racist attitudes was pulled out by the administrator. Some of the posts here only confirm what i had said then: That people will talk without any reference to reality.

I am not an Air India fan. I have had many heated exchanges on pvt mails with some forum members, so they should know. However, i dont think the safety record of Indian carriers is bad. As i said in my earlier post here, AI hasnt had a single fatal accident since 1985. Now that is some record. I have seen the maintainance people work their a***'s off to get the planes despatched properly and safely.

I think people should leave some of their attitude behind on this forum. Talk facts. Not BS.
 
nickofatlanta
Posts: 1280
Joined: Tue May 23, 2000 1:06 am

Statistics ...

Mon Oct 09, 2000 11:50 pm

Indian Guy:

I'm sorry you feel that people are being racist. However, I do believe that you may want to check out the source:

http://www.airsafe.com

Because of its relatively small size, one accident for Air India in 16 years will have a greater effect on its statistics than, say, one accident in the same time frame for an airline like Delta with far more flights. If you're a small airline with no crashes, these statistics clearly favor you, but if you're a small airline like Air India and have one accident (even 16 odd years ago), the stats are definitely not in your favor.

I would not hesitate to fly AI. I actually don't believe that terrorist-driven accidents should be included in such stats which it seems they are.

However, I don't believe you should have taken the statements above in the way you did. These are facts based on airline fatalities caused by anything.
 
Airbus A3XX
Posts: 479
Joined: Wed May 19, 1999 5:12 pm

RE: Least Safest Airlines

Tue Oct 10, 2000 12:16 am

I would think they are:
China Airlines
Garuda indonesia
Korean Air
 
Guest

RE: Least Safest Airlines

Tue Oct 10, 2000 12:19 am

AEROFLOT! Over 100 crashes in 5 decades!
 
BOEING747-700
Posts: 1356
Joined: Mon Apr 03, 2000 5:21 am

RE: Least Safest Airlines

Tue Oct 10, 2000 1:23 am

Yes it is Aeroflot who has the worst safty record in the world.
 
Ilyushin96M
Posts: 2506
Joined: Sat Sep 04, 1999 3:15 am

Aeroflot NOT Unsafe!

Tue Oct 10, 2000 1:34 am

I was waiting for this uninformed statement to come up, because it ALWAYS does.

Compared to other airlines, Soviet Aeroflot's fleet was gargantuan. Imagine all the US domestic airlines combined into one, and that's what you'd get. So statistically, there's nothing wrong with Aeroflot. This information has been posted NUMEROUS times, and yet STILL people are making statments they can't back up with facts or statistics.

If anyone can show me unbiased information as to WHY Aeroflot was/is considered unsafe, I'd love to see it. Put up, or shut up.
 
BOEING747-700
Posts: 1356
Joined: Mon Apr 03, 2000 5:21 am

RE: Least Safest Airlines

Tue Oct 10, 2000 2:07 am

DUDE it is on the Dateline web site and it is not that HARD TO FIND IF YOU LOOK!!!!!! TRY IT DUDE!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! Then you are welcome to say what you want.
 
Ilyushin96M
Posts: 2506
Joined: Sat Sep 04, 1999 3:15 am

Dateline? Lol!

Tue Oct 10, 2000 2:37 am

Don't tell me you believe that. How many of those people have flown Aeroflot, and what are their conclusions based on? Idiocy, I tell you.
 
philb
Posts: 2645
Joined: Mon May 24, 1999 5:53 am

RE: Least Safest Airlines

Tue Oct 10, 2000 2:55 am

Usual guesses, garbage and downright nonsense which always accompanies questions regarding safest, least safe etc.

With very few exceptions you cannot state with any certainty which airline is more, or less, safe than any other.

Cubana and Korean have horrendous records for airlines of their size. Aeroflot cannot, logically be dealt with as an airline as each Directorate had semi-autonomous authority and provided everything from long haul service, through ambulance flights to crop spraying. but ALL accidents were attributed to Aeroflot.

QANTAS is forever being hailed for its safe record, the urban myth is it has neverhad an accident or a fatality. A look at the record proves this is false and they have just paid a fortune to put the aircraft that overran at Bangkok back in the air, to avoid their "unblemished" record of not writing off a jetliner being tarnished.

Don't forget that on July 1st this year, statistically, Concorde was the safest transport aircraft in the world with 0% fatalities across the whole fleet. By August 1st it was statistically one of the most dangerous with 7.142% of the total fleet involved in fatal accidents.

This is equal to 267.5 fatal accidents involving the B737
at today's production figures. The 737 has been involved in 47 fatal incidents and is, even with the rudder problems, considered on e of the world's safest and most effective transports.

If you want a good starting point for FACTS, the airsafe.com site IS excellent, but like any other set of statistics, you have to take the figures in context of rotations, passengers carried, type of service, area of operations, route miles flown.

Finally, if a pilot not turning up for a flight makes for an unsafe airline then we are in the area of Alice in Wonderland.

Unless of course, his failure to take the flight led to fatalities when the passengers attacked the cabin crew and the cabin crew massacred the passengers, but our correspondent fails to divulge how this experience on Garuda affected flight safety.

 
Guest

Ilyushin96M

Tue Oct 10, 2000 5:03 am

Shut up. Their planes are never mainteneced. Boeing1071 is right.
 
RIX
Posts: 1590
Joined: Thu Aug 03, 2000 4:46 am

RE: Ilyushin96M

Tue Oct 10, 2000 5:34 am

Just don't pay attention... there is always somebody that can't say anything except "shut up" and "mainteneced". 
 
Ilyushin96M
Posts: 2506
Joined: Sat Sep 04, 1999 3:15 am

Oh, RIGHT.

Tue Oct 10, 2000 5:58 am

COA 737-900, you might give yourself a bit more credibility if you knew basic grammar, wrote more than three-word sentences, and could respond with facts and statistics. Also, I think it's pretty obvious (and quite pathetic) that you and Boeing1071 are the same person and have "each other" as respected users.  
 
airman99o
Posts: 921
Joined: Sat Aug 21, 1999 4:15 am

RE: Oh, RIGHT.

Tue Oct 10, 2000 6:46 am

Hey there,
well I have to add my part to this!! I think that people that say Aeroflot is shabby and all that really need to get over this stupid stereotype!! I for one would love to get on an Aeroflot flight. Mind you there are some othere airlines that I wouldn't go near!! Such As Korean!! NO THANKS!! Nor would I get on PAL!! Seeing that they have had alot of money problems in the past!!
But leave Aeroflot out of this!! they have made great leaps in safety, comfort, New planes and all that!! but Also I have to say that people are entitlied to their own opinion!

Airman99o
Safety is Everyones Responsibility.
 
Guest

RE: Least Safest Airlines

Tue Oct 10, 2000 6:48 am

Illyushin96M,

I wouldn't listen to 747-700. A quick check and you can see some of the other stuff. I agree with you that peoples misconception of Aeroflot is awful.

Many a pilot will tell you that Aeroflot was (still is?) blessed with the best pilots in the world who were highly respected. These pilots had to fly in some of the most difficult and dangerous conditions (weather and terrain) to service the entire Soviet Union.

mb
 
A330
Posts: 709
Joined: Wed May 19, 1999 12:31 am

RE: Least Safest Airlines

Tue Oct 10, 2000 6:56 am

try some Nigerian private outfits, and numerous African Cargo "airlines" flying with B707's who were once maintained... (It is however thanks to these airlines that we still see the mother of all modern airliners...)

Tino
Shiek!
 
v jet
Posts: 757
Joined: Tue May 18, 1999 9:04 am

RE: PhilB

Tue Oct 10, 2000 7:05 am

"QANTAS is forever being hailed for its safe record, the urban myth is it has neverhad an accident or a
fatality. A look at the record proves this is false and they have just paid a fortune to put the aircraft
that overran at Bangkok back in the air, to avoid their "unblemished" record of not writing off a jetliner
being tarnished. "
That statement is completely incorrect. This is an urban myth. Newspapers here had to print retractions for saying that exact same thing. From memory I think it was the insurance company even released a statement saying that the acft was entirely repairable and should not be written off. Even the AF overun at PPT which ended up in the ocean was fixed.
 
tbar220
Posts: 6706
Joined: Wed Feb 02, 2000 12:08 pm

RE: Least Safest Airlines

Tue Oct 10, 2000 7:43 am

What I think TWA902Fly was saying was that Air India has the safest air record, unless I misinterpreted his comment.

Tzvika
NO URLS in signature
 
philb
Posts: 2645
Joined: Mon May 24, 1999 5:53 am

RE: Least Safest Airlines

Tue Oct 10, 2000 7:54 am

V Jet,

I don't have the reference to hand and as it is coming up to midnight here I'm not going to start searching old periodicals and the Net for it, but the information in the INDUSTRY papers (both Insurance and Aviation) was that the combined cost of retrieving the aircraft, repairing it, the down time off line and the subsequent costs of recertification came to 75% or so of the cost of a new 747 - well within the "write off" zone.
 
BOEING747-700
Posts: 1356
Joined: Mon Apr 03, 2000 5:21 am

RE: Least Safest Airlines

Tue Oct 10, 2000 8:17 am

Mx5_boy:

If that is what you are. The THREAD is what is the least Safest Airline. God you need your contacts in or something. Yeah their pilots maybe some grate masters of the sky's but their safety record is what is being talked about. I would would check it out on www.dateline.msnbc.com or www.cnn.com and find out which ones where the least safe. And was it or was it not Aeroflot who had one pilot allow his children to fly the plane which ended up killing 50 people?!?!?!?!?!
 
Guest

RE: Least Safest Airlines

Tue Oct 10, 2000 8:39 am

I fly QF sometimes (my preference AN) and I will avoid the BKK jumbo like the plague.

Cars never run the same again after they have been involved in reasonable ding.

lol

mb
 
acvitale
Posts: 1913
Joined: Sat Aug 18, 2001 8:25 am

RE: Least Safest Airlines

Tue Oct 10, 2000 1:16 pm

Most of the unsafe airlines I can think of are not even available thru CRSs or standard means. Many single or two or three aircraft operators flying in Africa or parts of South America (like specifically Bolivia and Paraguay are pretty bad. But, Most are not ICAO recognized do not participate in IATA or in any ticket clearing houses and normally are not flown by the majority of travellers. I doubt many of you will have the mis fortune of having an engine failure of a DC-6 during takeoff at a high altitude airport in the Andes with high temperatures and a bunch of livestock and sides of beef in a seriously overweight aircraft that coupled with unsecured cargo and poor pilot training results in a fiery crash. Nuff said
 
exitrowaisle
Posts: 243
Joined: Sat May 06, 2000 2:32 am

RE: Least Safest Airlines

Tue Oct 10, 2000 3:15 pm

Ask the people who were on the flight where the kid went berserk, and they'll tell you Southwest! Just kidding. Actually, I don't think using crash data (i.e. #fatalities per flight, etc.) to determine which airline is "safest" works, because you take an airline like AirTran (Valujet), and one crash puts them at the top of the list because they're so small. The fact is, statistically, you're just about as likely to crash on one airline as any other. I would look instead on the country where the airline is based. I would stay away from airlines in countries that don't have good regulatory authorities, or don't have the resources to adhere to international standards. I would, therefore, be more leery about flying on an airline from S. America (except Brazil, Argentina, and Chile), Africa, or S.E. Asia. I'd also wonder about countries in political turmoil, such as Russia. Bottom line though, whoever you fly, your chances of a safe arrival are overwhelmingly positive.
 
v jet
Posts: 757
Joined: Tue May 18, 1999 9:04 am

RE: PhilB

Tue Oct 10, 2000 5:12 pm

We'll have to agree to disagree.
 
draigonair
Posts: 624
Joined: Tue Oct 10, 2000 8:37 pm

RE: Least Safest Airlines

Tue Oct 10, 2000 8:54 pm

eh,, well i the list i agree with them

But the most crudy and unsave is XINGJIAN AIRLINES!!!! who flys crudy tupoleves and ill-86(or how ever u spell it) They havent crashed mucht but r u save and are whorible to fly with!!

nick
cheers

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