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United727
Posts: 351
Joined: Sat Nov 13, 2010 1:26 am

RE: Bolivia's AeroSur Ceases Operations

Thu Apr 05, 2012 9:42 am

Quoting A388 (Reply 48):
Very sad news indeed as I loved their liveries. I was hoping to photograph their Sharko 767 one day in MIA but that will sadly never happen... 

A388

Sharko IS stranded in Miami.... Indefinitely!   Good Photo OP!
 
A388
Posts: 8000
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RE: Bolivia's AeroSur Ceases Operations

Thu Apr 05, 2012 12:27 pm

Quoting United727 (Reply 50):
Sharko IS stranded in Miami.... Indefinitely! Good Photo OP!

Sounds good but how do I photograph it? It is probably parked at a location where photography is obstructed(?)

A388
 
Avianca
Posts: 5375
Joined: Tue Jan 25, 2005 5:33 am

RE: Bolivia's AeroSur Ceases Operations

Thu Apr 05, 2012 3:16 pm

no surprise... unfotunately I missed to fly these nice births

just to remember this great video of Aerosur 747 low pass.


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=B6s0pBqIriw&feature=fvst
Colombia es el Mundo Y el Mundo es Colombia
 
Checo77
Posts: 1263
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RE: Bolivia's AeroSur Ceases Operations

Fri Apr 06, 2012 1:41 am

Quoting Avianca (Reply 52):
just to remember this great video of Aerosur 747 low pass.

The best part is the guy screaming "hijo de puta!"      
Czech Boeing lover living in Lima
 
Avianca
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RE: Bolivia's AeroSur Ceases Operations

Fri Apr 06, 2012 2:40 am

Quoting Checo77 (Reply 53):
"hijo de puta!"

jajaja, yes but he is sooooooooooooo right!
Colombia es el Mundo Y el Mundo es Colombia
 
Avianca
Posts: 5375
Joined: Tue Jan 25, 2005 5:33 am

RE: Bolivia's AeroSur Ceases Operations

Fri Apr 06, 2012 2:45 am

another low pass but this time with the 767-200 but more conservative...

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3Hs2UE59Nks

for sure we will miss these drunk pilots!
Colombia es el Mundo Y el Mundo es Colombia
 
ANITIX87
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RE: Bolivia's AeroSur Ceases Operations

Fri Apr 06, 2012 2:58 am

Quoting A388 (Reply 51):
Sounds good but how do I photograph it? It is probably parked at a location where photography is obstructed
Quoting United727 (Reply 50):

Sharko, at least as of yesterday, is parked at it's usual gate in the F or G pier. You can get a shot of it from the airborne squadron restaurant or from the perimeter road (though that is risky) but heat haze and ground vehicles will be a big problem.

TIS
www.stellaryear.com: Canon EOS 50D, Canon EOS 5DMkII, Sigma 50mm 1.4, Canon 24-70 2.8L II, Canon 100mm 2.8L, Canon 100-4
 
jwhite9185
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RE: Bolivia's AeroSur Ceases Operations

Fri Apr 06, 2012 9:10 am

Glad i managed to catch this at LGW the other week then:

http://i181.photobucket.com/albums/x35/jwhite9185/Brussels/4de8668e.jpg

Shame it came out in such poor quality.
@mytripreport
 
DLD9S
Posts: 164
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RE: Bolivia's AeroSur Ceases Operations

Fri Apr 06, 2012 12:47 pm

I got this email yesterday... Are they not shut down after all?:

AeroSur S.A. to Resume Service between Santa Cruz and Madrid

Bolivian airline AeroSur S.A. (“AeroSur”) announces the arrival of a Boeing 747-400 for service between Santa Cruz, Bolivia (VVI) and Madrid (MAD). “We are pleased to announce the addition of this aircraft into our fleet and to reaffirm our commitment to our customers and passengers,” said Oscar Alcocer, Director of AeroSur S.A.

Mr. Alcocer expanded, “Two Santa Cruz-Madrid cancellations recently occurred after attempts to extend the term of a previously leased Boeing 747-400 failed,” adding “we are very pleased to report that AeroSur has secured the delivery of a Boeing 747-400 aircraft via an operating lease managed by Sky Holding Company, LLC, based in San Francisco and will resume service between Santa Cruz and Madrid in the second half of April.”

AeroSur operations including flights to Miami continue as normal and officials of the company are meeting with various sectors of the Government of Bolivia to develop a revised operating plan that will allow the airline to strengthen both its domestic and international market services going forward.
717 727 737 747 757 767 777 DC9 DC10 M80 M90 M11 L10 AB6 333 340 319 320 321 ARJ CRJ EM2 EMJ SF3 146 100 BE1...
 
ATLTPA
Posts: 73
Joined: Sat Nov 03, 2007 5:24 pm

RE: Bolivia's AeroSur Ceases Operations

Fri Apr 06, 2012 1:25 pm

Quoting DLD9S (Reply 58):
I got this email yesterday... Are they not shut down after all?:

Interesting also that www.aerosur.com is now back up and running. When I tried it the other day, I got a generic airline travel website in its place.

Is this a Lazarus moment? Is Aerosur back?

Can anyone shed light on this?

ATLTPA
 
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ghost77
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RE: Bolivia's AeroSur Ceases Operations

Fri Apr 06, 2012 5:42 pm

5L is back, I believe they cut flights for a few days

Where's user 123 from Bolivia???

Last post about a month ago, please inform us!!!!

g77
 
RAGAZZO777
Topic Author
Posts: 401
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RE: Bolivia's AeroSur Ceases Operations

Sat Apr 07, 2012 12:45 am

Quoting ghost77 (Reply 60):
5L is back, I believe they cut flights for a few days

Yes, AeroSur is apparently back. Even their website is back and running, as other poster mentioned, but the airline hasn't issued any press release so far and there are no clear informations regarding the current status of the carrier, not even on other Latin American aviation forums.

In the meantime, La Prensa published this article today where they state that AeroSur will receive in the next few hours a new Boeing 747-400 to resume their flights to Madrid, Spain.


http://www.laprensa.com.bo/diario/ac...para-ruta-europea_22776_36483.html
JESÚS, TE AMO !!
 
na
Posts: 9770
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RE: Bolivia's AeroSur Ceases Operations

Sat Apr 07, 2012 12:35 pm

What is this?

http://www.skyliner-aviation.de/regdb.main?LC=nav4&page=3

A former Aerolineas Argentinas 744 has been delivered to Bolivia yesterday, intended for Aerosur.
 
MEA-707
Posts: 3786
Joined: Mon Nov 15, 1999 4:51 am

RE: Bolivia's AeroSur Ceases Operations

Sat Apr 07, 2012 2:00 pm

Quoting na (Reply 62):
What is this?

It was already planned for a year that they would replace the VS 744 with quite expensive lease rates for a clapped out AR example in spring 2012.... Actually I suspected one of the reasons they ran into problems just now is the swapping of their 744; possible debts to VS, more then expected costs and time to paint and refurbish the AR 744 causing cancellations etc etc

[Edited 2012-04-07 07:31:10]
nobody has ever died from hard work, but why take the risk?
 
123
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RE: Bolivia's AeroSur Ceases Operations

Sat Apr 07, 2012 2:43 pm

I was not commenting to this big mess, which affects me a lot as a Frequent traveller.

5L is as important to me as to all who work there. Ihad to switch days ago from a foreseen 5L flight to a Tam Bolivia flight - a story to worry about - and necxt flights, I have for the time being no choice than to fly with BOA!a nothing to be proud about.

Years ago, LAN wanted to fly f rom SCL via VVI to MIA and also had plans to fly within Bolivia. Plans aborted due to politics... Taca used to codeshare LPB/VVI/LPB with 5L... no longer do so, only on the LIM route.

Flying in Bolivia is getting more difficult every day since LB was downed... let's hope the best for 5L!


regards, 123
 
iadbudd
Posts: 127
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RE: Bolivia's AeroSur Ceases Operations

Sat Apr 07, 2012 11:31 pm

"Sharko" is at IAD today, heading back to MIA and onto Bolivia
 
jfk777
Posts: 7366
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RE: Bolivia's AeroSur Ceases Operations

Sun Apr 08, 2012 6:38 pm

Quoting iadbudd (Reply 66):
"Sharko" is at IAD today, heading back to MIA and onto Bolivia

Good to hear "EL Sharko" is still flying.

Does AeroSur make money flying a 747 to Madrid just 3 day a week ?
 
PRAirbus
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RE: Bolivia's AeroSur Ceases Operations

Mon Apr 09, 2012 8:27 pm

Just read (ATW Daily News) that AeroSur will restart MAD operations with another leased 747; what's the sense and cost of AeroSur's B747 operation several times per week? The 747 sits idle the rest of the time? No wonder they are bleeding $$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$! :O
 
123
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Joined: Sat Nov 29, 2003 3:49 am

RE: Bolivia's AeroSur Ceases Operations

Mon Apr 09, 2012 10:11 pm

I think the most lucrative route in the 5L system is the VVI/MAD/VVI route. One 744 does the job / OK it's only three x week, but if you look at turnaround times, the aircraft is busy basically 6 days a week, if my calculation is not totally wrong. Take into the calculation obligatory crew rest times, I think the calculation comes out positive.

Remember 5L is the only airline operating between Bolivia and Europe / and loads are normally very high.

My personal point of view is, if 5L can resume the MAD operations, then, they stand good chances to survive their actual economic crisis.
 
A388
Posts: 8000
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RE: Bolivia's AeroSur Ceases Operations

Mon Apr 09, 2012 10:23 pm

Quoting MEA-707 (Reply 64):
It was already planned for a year that they would replace the VS 744 with quite expensive lease rates for a clapped out AR example in spring 2012....

Will Aerosur send this ex-AR 744 to AMS for inspection and painting? Can we expect a new "toro" on this 744?

Quoting 123 (Reply 69):
One 744 does the job / OK it's only three x week, but if you look at turnaround times, the aircraft is busy basically 6 days a week, if my calculation is not totally wrong. Take into the calculation obligatory crew rest times, I think the calculation comes out positive.

Sounds correct, we must not forget that the schedule might be 3 times a week but it takes 6 days to operate the flight going and coming back so Aerosur is making good use of that single 744 operation. If they want to fly more than 3 times a week, they will need another aircraft to operate the additional frequencies. Reading here that Aerosur is the only airline flying to Europe from Bolivia they must be making a decent amount of money on that route.

A388
 
jfk777
Posts: 7366
Joined: Tue Aug 22, 2006 7:23 am

RE: Bolivia's AeroSur Ceases Operations

Tue Apr 10, 2012 4:37 pm

Quoting A388 (Reply 70):
Sounds correct, we must not forget that the schedule might be 3 times a week but it takes 6 days to operate the flight going and coming back so Aerosur is making good use of that single 744 operation. If they want to fly more than 3 times a week, they will need another aircraft to operate the additional frequencies. Reading here that Aerosur is the only airline flying to Europe from Bolivia they must be making a decent amount of money on that route.

Does any one know if the airplane waits for the same crew in Madrid to fly it back or do crews layover 2 or 3 days in Madrid ?
 
A388
Posts: 8000
Joined: Mon May 21, 2001 3:48 am

RE: Bolivia's AeroSur Ceases Operations

Tue Apr 10, 2012 5:12 pm

Quoting jfk777 (Reply 71):
Does any one know if the airplane waits for the same crew in Madrid to fly it back or do crews layover 2 or 3 days in Madrid ?

Hey jfk777 I see you here too  

To answer your question, I assume the crew changes in MAD as I assume it isn't possible to do 3 times a week rotations with the same aircraft if the same crew flies the aircraft back to Bolivia.

A388
 
SJOtoLIR
Posts: 3074
Joined: Thu Jul 19, 2007 12:41 pm

RE: Bolivia's AeroSur Ceases Operations

Tue Apr 10, 2012 9:01 pm

Quoting 123 (Reply 69):
I think the most lucrative route in the 5L system is the VVI/MAD/VVI route.


It's a good point taking into account the lack of any IB VVI-MAD for the time being.
As commented before, IB is experiencing lack of long-haul planes to deploy any new service to Santa Cruz de la Sierra and I'm worried about what would happen with the healthy Bolivia-Spain traffic analyzing the demise of AeroSur.

Regards.
"Goin' up to the spirit in the sky"
 
123
Posts: 622
Joined: Sat Nov 29, 2003 3:49 am

RE: Bolivia's AeroSur Ceases Operations

Tue Apr 10, 2012 9:37 pm

Ages ago, I think in the 1960's, IB used to serve LPB at times, when Santa Cruz was nothing but a lazy tropical town, not the bustling modern city it is now.

VVI/MAD/VVI were served in the past with the ailing LB, and later in codeshare with Air Comet and Aero Sur.

The Air Comet flights were of outstanding quality, their business class product of level of the large international carriers. I miss those flights, as now I have to take complicated detours via GRU, EZE or LIM to reach Europe and beyond destinations.

Not long ago, 5L was mentioning (among others..) 767 service VVI/BCN/VVI in addition to their 744 service to MAD.

... let's see what happens next.
 
asuflyer
Posts: 566
Joined: Mon Jan 01, 2007 12:48 pm

RE: Bolivia's AeroSur Ceases Operations

Wed Apr 11, 2012 12:34 am

Next week will be the last for "Sharko". 5L is in the process of receiving a 763, N984AN from AV.
 
dcajet
Posts: 4708
Joined: Sun Aug 01, 2004 9:31 am

RE: Bolivia's AeroSur Ceases Operations

Wed Apr 11, 2012 6:56 am

Quoting SJOtoLIR (Reply 73):
Quoting 123 (Reply 69):I think the most lucrative route in the 5L system is the VVI/MAD/VVI route.

It's a good point taking into account the lack of any IB VVI-MAD for the time being.
As commented before, IB is experiencing lack of long-haul planes to deploy any new service to Santa Cruz de la Sierra and I'm worried about what would happen with the healthy Bolivia-Spain traffic analyzing the demise of AeroSur.

I suppose the proverbial "one man's treasure is another man's reject" makes sense here. While VVI-MAD may indeed be the star for 5L in terms of profits, it lacks the mix of business/leisure that IB needs to make it a route that will work for them. Let alone the fact that IB is not exactly at a time and a place that they can afford to open new routes that may only pay in the long run. See what happened to COR - yes, planes left both MAD and COR full, but it still did not guarantee the revenue IB needs today - with very little tolerance for marginal revenue producing routes - and the plug was pulled. Same goes for FOR and REC, although these two lasted a few short months only. Whatever Euro bound traffic is generated from these two cities in NE Brazil, TAP has a hold on it.
Keep calm and wash your hands.
 
jfk777
Posts: 7366
Joined: Tue Aug 22, 2006 7:23 am

RE: Bolivia's AeroSur Ceases Operations

Wed Apr 11, 2012 11:38 am

Quoting asuflyer (Reply 74):
Next week will be the last for "Sharko". 5L is in the process of receiving a 763, N984AN from AV.

Why have 1 747 and 1 767 ? Wouldn't AeroSur be better with only 767 and flying to Madrid 5 or 6 days a week ? AeroSur is the only airline in Latin America flying 747's, why ?

A 747 seems too much airplane for this small airline, if a 767 is too smal then a 777 could help.
 
aloges
Posts: 14807
Joined: Tue Jan 17, 2006 3:38 am

RE: Bolivia's AeroSur Ceases Operations

Wed Apr 11, 2012 12:16 pm

Quoting jfk777 (Reply 76):
A 747 seems too much airplane for this small airline, if a 767 is too smal then a 777 could help.

AeroSur has been using old leased 747s on VVI-MAD since 2007, in one form or another. They started with a cooperation with Air Plus Comet which lead to this weird triple-branded 747-200:

View Large View Medium
Click here for bigger photo!

Photo © Biel Gomila

Then they operated a 747-300 under their own brand, went on to use the -400 which was recently returned to VS and plan to use an ex-AR bird in the future, so they've had no reason to downscale from the 747.

I don't know who maintains their 747 and 767, but it's not like those are odd aircraft who can only be maintained by a select few companies in far-flung places.

[Edited 2012-04-11 05:23:02]
Don't cry because it's over, smile because it happened.
 
123
Posts: 622
Joined: Sat Nov 29, 2003 3:49 am

RE: Bolivia's AeroSur Ceases Operations

Wed Apr 11, 2012 1:59 pm

Quoting jfk777 (Reply 76):
Why have 1 747 and 1 767 ? Wouldn't AeroSur be better with only 767 and flying to Madrid 5 or 6 days a week ? AeroSur is the only airline in Latin America flying 747's, why ? A 747 seems too much airplane for this small airline, if a 767 is too smal then a 777 could help.

Just my thoughts:

3x744 loads are lets calculate high, 1500 pax.
6x767 loads are around 1200 pax
Always, depending on configurations.

To operate during a week nearly daily 767 VVI/MAD/VVI, you need two frames, if you want to offer the same amount or a bit more seats in the same time frame - one week - the formula 3x747 service seems to work out.

So, 767 yes, is too small for this type of service (although LB used them), and T7's I just make a simple guess, have much more expensive leasing costs.

Good point that Bolivia is the only country - with AeroSur the only 747 operator in Latin America. Fact: In Bolivia things are always different, that´s why you see of 727 operations as "normal" here.

Don´t forget that some time ago, rumors went out, that 5L were interested in 787's. Repeat: Rumors.
 
jfk777
Posts: 7366
Joined: Tue Aug 22, 2006 7:23 am

RE: Bolivia's AeroSur Ceases Operations

Wed Apr 11, 2012 4:36 pm

Quoting 123 (Reply 78):
To operate during a week nearly daily 767 VVI/MAD/VVI, you need two frames, if you want to offer the same amount or a bit more seats in the same time frame - one week - the formula 3x747 service seems to work out.

AeroSur should have 4 ,5 or 6 767's which it can roate around Miami, Madrid, Washington and if it ever happens Barcelona.
 
United727
Posts: 351
Joined: Sat Nov 13, 2010 1:26 am

RE: Bolivia's AeroSur Ceases Operations

Wed Apr 11, 2012 6:53 pm

Quoting jfk777 (Reply 79):
AeroSur should have 4 ,5 or 6 767's which it can roate around Miami, Madrid, Washington and if it ever happens Barcelona.

Agreed...Wouldn't multiple B763 or 764er's be way more fuel efficient and lead to a significant cost advantage to the airline?
 
jfk777
Posts: 7366
Joined: Tue Aug 22, 2006 7:23 am

RE: Bolivia's AeroSur Ceases Operations

Wed Apr 11, 2012 10:23 pm

Quoting United727 (Reply 80):
Agreed...Wouldn't multiple B763 or 764er's be way more fuel efficient and lead to a significant cost advantage to the airline?

The history of small airlines flying 747's to their European colonial power is littered with bankruptcy. Their is a reason TAM flies 777 and not 744's. For AeroSur a smaller airplane is better.
 
aloges
Posts: 14807
Joined: Tue Jan 17, 2006 3:38 am

RE: Bolivia's AeroSur Ceases Operations

Wed Apr 11, 2012 11:02 pm

Quoting jfk777 (Reply 81):
Their is a reason TAM flies 777 and not 744's.

Indeed. The reason is that TAM has the money for factory-fresh 777s while AeroSur does not. As I was saying, they've been using old 747s on VVI-MAD for five years - hardly a time that they could have survived if they were losing loads of cash flying those planes.
Don't cry because it's over, smile because it happened.
 
United727
Posts: 351
Joined: Sat Nov 13, 2010 1:26 am

RE: Bolivia's AeroSur Ceases Operations

Thu Apr 12, 2012 6:28 am

Quoting jfk777 (Reply 81):
Their is a reason TAM flies 777 and not 744's. For AeroSur a smaller airplane is better.

Whats the general load differences between 763/4er and the 773er for both Pax count and MTOW?
 
jfk777
Posts: 7366
Joined: Tue Aug 22, 2006 7:23 am

RE: Bolivia's AeroSur Ceases Operations

Thu Apr 12, 2012 11:29 am

Quoting United727 (Reply 83):
Whats the general load differences between 763/4er and the 773er for both Pax count and MTOW?

LOTS !!! A 767-300ER carries about 225 passengers on two classes and an MTOW of about 369,000 pounds. A 77W would seat about 360 passengers and weigh 750,000 pounds. The two are very different, a 777-300ER is too much airplane for AeroSur. A 767 with more weekly flights then the 3 now by 744 would seem better.
 
United727
Posts: 351
Joined: Sat Nov 13, 2010 1:26 am

RE: Bolivia's AeroSur Ceases Operations

Thu Apr 12, 2012 2:02 pm

Quoting jfk777 (Reply 84):
A 767 with more weekly flights then the 3 now by 744 would seem better.

Thanks for the answer...Before I replied I wanted to get the correct information. There have been several responses mentioning the 777 and I personally thought that would not be the valid AC for their operation. Is the "new" USED 767 going to be a 3er from AR?
 
jfk777
Posts: 7366
Joined: Tue Aug 22, 2006 7:23 am

RE: Bolivia's AeroSur Ceases Operations

Thu Apr 12, 2012 6:19 pm

Quoting United727 (Reply 85):
Thanks for the answer...Before I replied I wanted to get the correct information. There have been several responses mentioning the 777 and I personally thought that would not be the valid AC for their operation. Is the "new" USED 767 going to be a 3er from AR?

AR does NOT have 767's or ever has. they fly A340 on long haul now. 744 have all left the airline recently.
 
A388
Posts: 8000
Joined: Mon May 21, 2001 3:48 am

RE: Bolivia's AeroSur Ceases Operations

Thu Apr 12, 2012 6:38 pm

We can all discuss why 5L is using the 747 as a small airline in South America while bigger airlines such as TAM use the 77W. Fact is that the 747 apparently works for 5L, especially seeing that they are the only airline flying to Europe from Bolivia, why not make maximum use of it by using the largest aircraft they can afford? TAM uses the 77W but as someone said, they have the money to do this and besides this, they have a larger fleet and more competition. A 747 might even be too big for TAM now!!! You have to look at each airline and its situation seperately. You can't just compare apples with pears like that. TAM and 5L are two totally different airlines operating in totally different markets/environments. TAM has a lot more competition on their long range flights, 5L has no competition. Let's do the math based on these criteria.

Besides this, looking at the distances you can't just rotate the 767 between flights to Miami, Washington, Madrid or Barcelona if you want to offer attractive departure and arrival times in Europe, America and Bolivia. How would you make better use of your fleet by rotating in this case or why would you want to rotate the aircraft? You only complicate your operation this way in my opinion. 5L is small enough to just keep it simple and have dedicated aircraft on their long range routes.

Too bad that Sharko will leave anyways but good to know that they will receive another 767 to take its place.

A388

[Edited 2012-04-12 11:47:49]
 
jfk777
Posts: 7366
Joined: Tue Aug 22, 2006 7:23 am

RE: Bolivia's AeroSur Ceases Operations

Fri Apr 13, 2012 1:01 pm

Quoting A388 (Reply 87):
Besides this, looking at the distances you can't just rotate the 767 between flights to Miami, Washington, Madrid or Barcelona if you want to offer attractive departure and arrival times in Europe, America and Bolivia. How would you make better use of your fleet by rotating in this case or why would you want to rotate the aircraft? You only complicate your operation this way in my opinion. 5L is small enough to just keep it simple and have dedicated aircraft on their long range routes.

Having one type of long haul does NOT mean that airplanes can't be dedicated to one route. It does save on crew training and spare parts etc. If the most efficient way for flying to Miami or Madrid is to have two 767 for each route then so bet it. Having 4, 5 or 6 767's has to be cheaper then one 747 for Madrid & 767's for hte USA route.

Flying the 747 three times weekly to Madrid seems to work for AeruSur, why would a 767 6 times a week not work better ? IF there is a day a week when demand is 500 passengers, why not two 767's ? Smaller planes would also allow AeroSur flying to Barcelona which has gone from no nonstops to Latin America to many flights daily in only 10 years. 767 would also allow AeroSur the idea to expand in the USA to Orlando or JFK, I don't if those are workable from Santa Cruz but a 767 is more workable then a 747. Good Luck to the new El Sharko and Torisimo.
 
123
Posts: 622
Joined: Sat Nov 29, 2003 3:49 am

RE: Bolivia's AeroSur Ceases Operations

Fri Apr 13, 2012 3:41 pm

Quoting jfk777 (Reply 88):
idea to expand in the USA to Orlando or JFK, I don't if those are workable

I doubt those markets are feasible. 5L enters Washington (IAD) where there is a large Bolivian community living (in Virginia), and as per my knowledge the next destination in the USA that would render direct flights from Bolivia should be LAX.

Latin America has sufficient destinations for widebody service from Bolivia - GRU/EZE and LIM (28 flights between LAN and Taca Peru/Bolivia weekly) are enough evidence to sustain my idea.

Politically - BUT PLEASE let´s not talk about politics - CCS would probably also support regular widebody service - with continuation to HAV.

LB served MEX in the past with 767's - now, nobody flies between Mexico/Bolivia.

Back to Europe: MAD is clear, good destination; BCN is next on the list; Afterwards, Bergamo (sorry, don´t have the code at hand) in Italy would be my target,with so many Bolivian ex-pats living there. Make Bergamo an intercont airport to avoid MXP overall...
 
A388
Posts: 8000
Joined: Mon May 21, 2001 3:48 am

RE: Bolivia's AeroSur Ceases Operations

Fri Apr 13, 2012 3:55 pm

Quoting jfk777 (Reply 88):
Having 4, 5 or 6 767's has to be cheaper then one 747 for Madrid & 767's for hte USA route.
Quoting jfk777 (Reply 88):
Flying the 747 three times weekly to Madrid seems to work for AeruSur, why would a 767 6 times a week not work better ? IF there is a day a week when demand is 500 passengers, why not two 767's ? Smaller planes would also allow AeroSur flying to Barcelona which has gone from no nonstops to Latin America to many flights daily in only 10 years. 767 would also allow AeroSur the idea to expand in the USA to Orlando or JFK, I don't if those are workable from Santa Cruz but a 767 is more workable then a 747.

Based on what is the 767 better for 5L compared to the 747 to Europe? Like I said, if you are the only airline operating from your country to Europe, why wouldn't you want to make maximum profit on your flights by using the largest aircraft that you can afford? Why use 2 smaller aircraft? I can imagine that one 767 is cheaper to operate compared to one 747 but I certainly don't see how two 767's can be cheaper than one 747. Your crew costs alone will be higher by using two aircraft instead of one. Then there is maintenance, lease rates (all two vs one aircraft). The fuel consumption of the 767 might be lower compared to the 747 but is this still the case when using two 767's instead of one 747?

I do agree with you that the 767 is better for the U.S.

A388
 
jfk777
Posts: 7366
Joined: Tue Aug 22, 2006 7:23 am

RE: Bolivia's AeroSur Ceases Operations

Fri Apr 13, 2012 7:55 pm

Quoting A388 (Reply 90):
Based on what is the 767 better for 5L compared to the 747 to Europe? Like I said, if you are the only airline operating from your country to Europe, why wouldn't you want to make maximum profit on your flights by using the largest aircraft that you can afford? Why use 2 smaller aircraft? I can imagine that one 767 is cheaper to operate compared to one 747 but I certainly don't see how two 767's can be cheaper than one 747. Your crew costs alone will be higher by using two aircraft instead of one. Then there is maintenance, lease rates (all two vs one aircraft). The fuel consumption of the 767 might be lower compared to the 747 but is this still the case when using two 767's instead of one 747?

I do agree with you that the 767 is better for the U.S.

Frequency, 3 times a week for teh 747 against daily or alomost daily with a 767. On days when AeroSur doesn't fly people go to Lima, GRU, EZE and other Latin hubs to travel to Madrid. My reasoning is frequency.
 
A388
Posts: 8000
Joined: Mon May 21, 2001 3:48 am

RE: Bolivia's AeroSur Ceases Operations

Fri Apr 13, 2012 8:48 pm

Quoting jfk777 (Reply 91):
My reasoning is frequency.

How big is that number of people in percentage going to GRU and EZE? Are these people not frequent miles members hence their reasons to use GRU? Do you have hard facts on this or is it just own opinion or assumption?

A388
 
kdonohue
Posts: 421
Joined: Mon Sep 24, 2001 8:26 am

RE: Bolivia's AeroSur Ceases Operations

Sun Apr 15, 2012 4:05 pm

What a shame. I interviewed Humberto Roca, the airline's CEO, a couple of years ago while doing a story on AeroSur for Airways magazine. And he was very passionate having to "rescue" the airline several times with his own money. He also spoke of how the government was out to get him and other private business people, most of whom lives in Santa Cruz. A private airline would never be able to compete with the ideologues in La Paz.

I met a few people on the flight who live in Northern Argentina, and they would transfer through Santa Cruz on Aero Sur, because it was quicker than flying through Buenos Aires.

I still remember Roca's response to my question how AeroSur differentiates itself with its competitors..."The length of the flight attendant's skirts," was his answer.

Ken
 
aloges
Posts: 14807
Joined: Tue Jan 17, 2006 3:38 am

RE: Bolivia's AeroSur Ceases Operations

Sun Apr 15, 2012 6:18 pm

Quoting kdonohue (Reply 93):
What a shame.

I trust that you read over the happy news that they are back - for the moment, at least.  
Don't cry because it's over, smile because it happened.
 
jfk777
Posts: 7366
Joined: Tue Aug 22, 2006 7:23 am

RE: Bolivia's AeroSur Ceases Operations

Sun Apr 15, 2012 11:33 pm

Quoting A388 (Reply 92):


How big is that number of people in percentage going to GRU and EZE? Are these people not frequent miles members hence their reasons to use GRU? Do you have hard facts on this or is it just own opinion or assumption?

The days of flying limited frequency on most international routes is over. Iberia flies atleast daily with its A340 nonstop to most Latin Capitals nonstop. Some in Central America are less then daily. Some like Buenos Aires are up to 3 daily.

While some Bolivians will travel only on the nonstop 3 time weekly, some that have to travel on days when there is no Aerosur flight have to connect some where. Its just the way peolpe travel today. Bolivia is NOT Cuba, it has advanced with the internet and cell phones.
 
123
Posts: 622
Joined: Sat Nov 29, 2003 3:49 am

RE: Bolivia's AeroSur Ceases Operations

Mon Apr 16, 2012 12:41 am

Here, this is something all of you who read Spanish will enjoy / sorry, no translation available in "El Deber", the leading daily newspaper from Santa Cruz, Bolivia / the city where Aero Sur has its headquarters and main hub:

http://www.eldeber.com.bo/nota.php?id=120414004053
 
OB1504
Posts: 3980
Joined: Tue Jul 27, 2004 5:10 am

RE: Bolivia's AeroSur Ceases Operations

Fri Apr 20, 2012 5:05 am

Quoting jfk777 (Reply 95):
The days of flying limited frequency on most international routes is over. Iberia flies atleast daily with its A340 nonstop to most Latin Capitals nonstop. Some in Central America are less then daily. Some like Buenos Aires are up to 3 daily.

While some Bolivians will travel only on the nonstop 3 time weekly, some that have to travel on days when there is no Aerosur flight have to connect some where. Its just the way peolpe travel today. Bolivia is NOT Cuba, it has advanced with the internet and cell phones.

Why do you refuse to accept that 5L's current practice of flying a 747 3x weekly on the route is working perfectly for them? It's not the prettiest or most convenient solution, but it works.
 
A388
Posts: 8000
Joined: Mon May 21, 2001 3:48 am

RE: Bolivia's AeroSur Ceases Operations

Fri Apr 20, 2012 12:44 pm

Quoting jfk777 (Reply 95):
some that have to travel on days when there is no Aerosur flight have to connect some where.

Again, what is the percentage of people wanting or needing travel every day?

Quoting OB1504 (Reply 97):
Why do you refuse to accept that 5L's current practice of flying a 747 3x weekly on the route is working perfectly for them?

My point exactly, I tried to explain that the flights that 5L operates now with their 744's apparently works for them and that there is no need to change that (because it works).

A388
 
330lover
Posts: 649
Joined: Tue Jul 29, 2008 7:11 am

RE: Bolivia's AeroSur Ceases Operations

Fri Apr 20, 2012 2:03 pm

Without having to read all preceding posts (too lazy    ), What's the status of Aerosur right now? Still flying or really ceased?

Thanks,
Britten Norman Islander VP-FBR on Falkland Islands. THAT'S FLYING!

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