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traindoc
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Safety Brochures Now Show A/C Manufacture

Fri Apr 20, 2012 10:31 pm

Now the inflight safety/emergency brochures show country of the A/C manufacture. Is this so pax can decide if they want to fly on a foreign built A/C? I am assuming another "stupid pet trick" from our U.S. Congress.
 
skycub
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RE: Safety Brochures Now Show A/C Manufacture

Fri Apr 20, 2012 10:38 pm

The safety cards at my airline have included the fact that final assembly of the aircraft took place in the United States for at least the past several years.

I never thought anything of it. What's the big deal and why does it have to be political?

Do you have any evidence that this is a result of Congress or are you just spouting off personal opinions?

Like I said though.... it's been on the safety cards at my carrier for at least five years now.
 
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Phen
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RE: Safety Brochures Now Show A/C Manufacture

Fri Apr 20, 2012 10:41 pm

Quoting traindoc (Thread starter):
Is this so pax can decide if they want to fly on a foreign built A/C?

Probably a bit late to change their minds at that stage, the aircraft is probably about to turn onto the runway by the time they've read it 
 
tribird1011
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RE: Safety Brochures Now Show A/C Manufacture

Sat Apr 21, 2012 12:49 am

Although final assembly may in fact have been in the US (Boeing) or France (Airbus), what's the likelihood that at least half of the components were built on the other side of the pond (for both manufacturers) and then shipped over...



Quoting SkyCub (Reply 1):
never thought anything of it. What's the big deal and why does it have to be political?

I don't think it's a big deal, but I do believe that there is some political motives behind it ("Made in America" and such) nothing really wrong with it, but I'm sure there are plenty of non-US made components on a Boeing and there are plenty of non-French (European even) components an an Airbus, so much so that the final assembly location is almost irrelevant!

Funny aspect here, don't remember where, but there was talk about Airbus opening up an assembly line somewhere in the US (IIRC). Now, assuming that happened, and Boeing "returned the favour" and built an assembly line somewhere in France/Europe, how would that look:

Boeing B787 ... made in France
Airbus A350 ... made in USA
 
 
Cubsrule
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RE: Safety Brochures Now Show A/C Manufacture

Sat Apr 21, 2012 1:54 am

Quoting tribird1011 (Reply 3):
Funny aspect here, don't remember where, but there was talk about Airbus opening up an assembly line somewhere in the US (IIRC).

Also a pain in the butt aspect, especially 20-30 years in the future, when I bet most types will be manufactured in multiple countries. AA's 5 Chinese M80s have different safety cards. There aren't that many subfleets like that out there today, but it's only going to become more prevalent.
 
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TZTriStar500
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RE: Safety Brochures Now Show A/C Manufacture

Sat Apr 21, 2012 2:34 am

It was indeed politically motivated and this explains its origin:

http://www.aviationtoday.com/regions...Required-on-Safety-Cards_2734.html

It is in 14CFR 121.571(b)(3) as required from June 12, 2005.
 
ghifty
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RE: Safety Brochures Now Show A/C Manufacture

Sat Apr 21, 2012 2:52 am

It bugs me how the AS safety cards say "Final assembly of this aircraft completed in the USA." No was?

Quoting traindoc (Thread starter):
Is this so pax can decide if they want to fly on a foreign built A/C? I am assuming another "stupid pet trick" from our U.S. Congress.

... I don't think most passengers could care where final assembly occurred. If they did, they wouldn't have booked a flight on an Airbus/Boeing aircraft to start with (those who care/know enough, anyways).

Quoting tribird1011 (Reply 3):
I don't think it's a big deal, but I do believe that there is some political motives behind it ("Made in America" and such)

Nope, it's not. Of course there's political motives.. "Made in China." "Made in Vietnam." etc.. I think those are there for consumer knowledge. IMO, it always interests me to find out that my sweater was made in Cambodia but my jeans in India. It's not meant to be a deterrent. I have yet to see anyone see "Made in X" and reject the produce because it comes from there.
 
71Zulu
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RE: Safety Brochures Now Show A/C Manufacture

Sat Apr 21, 2012 3:24 am

Airbus made in France but with almost 50 % US components so what's the point?
 
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antoniemey
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RE: Safety Brochures Now Show A/C Manufacture

Sat Apr 21, 2012 8:18 am

Quoting ghifty (Reply 6):
It bugs me how the AS safety cards say "Final assembly of this aircraft completed in the USA." No was?

It is a complete statement without the past tense form of the verb "to be" in there. It seems odd on its own, but if you read a lot of statements like that, the majority of them are similarly phrased.

Legal English vs. daily usage English.

Quoting ghifty (Reply 6):
I have yet to see anyone see "Made in X" and reject the produce because it comes from there.

But there are people out there that do.
 
MEA-707
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RE: Safety Brochures Now Show A/C Manufacture

Sat Apr 21, 2012 9:54 am

Quoting SkyCub (Reply 1):
I never thought anything of it. What's the big deal and why does it have to be political?

They are hoping that passengers who (increasingly) find 'final assembly in France' (or Brazil) on their UA, AA, DL safety cards call in to the shareholders, press, congressmen and demand to buy local in the future.
 
MD11Engineer
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RE: Safety Brochures Now Show A/C Manufacture

Sat Apr 21, 2012 12:41 pm

Do you know how many parts made in Mexico a typical Boeing aircraft has?
The best law proposal was the one where it was supposed to be a requirement that, if an aircraft was ordered by the US government, not just the aircraft itself should be US made, but the machines and tooling it was produced upon as well. There were immediate protests by the manufacturers, because they were e.g. using machines made in Germany, because there was no US equivalent available and the German company owned the patents.
AFAIK, the law went straight into the bin.

Jan
 
andz
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RE: Safety Brochures Now Show A/C Manufacture

Sat Apr 21, 2012 3:30 pm

Quoting ghifty (Reply 6):
I have yet to see anyone see "Made in X" and reject the produce because it comes from there.

I have seen it. GE have manufacturing in China and some markets won't accept this so the products are also made in Europe or the USA. Obviously this parallel manufacturing affects the price.

On another note, certain clients of mine will not accept products we have that are made in Israel.
 
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NWAROOSTER
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RE: Safety Brochures Now Show A/C Manufacture

Sat Apr 21, 2012 4:50 pm

Both Boeing and Airbus aircraft are aircraft that are "assembled by Boeing or Airbus" with domestic or foreign parts along with the engineering being foreign or domestic. Passenger aircraft now are being assembled all over the world. This includes the United States, France, Germany, Russia, Canada, China and Brazil. They all use "domestic and foreign" parts and engineering from all over the world. Airbus does final assembly of some of its A320s in China. McDonnell Douglas had a final assembly plant in China for the MD-80 aircraft. Delta Airlines is flying, or will be flying, two MD-90 aircraft assembled in China. The Chinese are using some of the jigs from the MD-80 assembly line to produce their new "regional jet." I can't think of what it is called. Comac? In fact the tail assembly is a clone of the MD aircraft T-tail, along with the nose section. It's fuselage is apparently the same width as the MD aircraft.
The Chinese, in the early 80s ordered about five Boeing 707 aircraft and built several unsuccessful clones of the 707.
They were to be powered by Pratt & Whitney JT3D engines, which they bought extra spares for the 707.   
 
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flyingturtle
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RE: Safety Brochures Now Show A/C Manufacture

Sat Apr 21, 2012 5:33 pm

Quoting ghifty (Reply 6):
Nope, it's not. Of course there's political motives.. "Made in China." "Made in Vietnam." etc..

Exactly. The usage of "Made in Germany" began in Great Britain after 1887 to designate imported products from Germany – to warn consumers that these products would be inferior. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Made_in_Germany

Most of the pax will never know the difference between a final assembly line and the factory that actually produces the landing gear, for example. So, a "Made in ..." is intentionally misleading to make Boeing aircraft look better.
 
roseflyer
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RE: Safety Brochures Now Show A/C Manufacture

Sat Apr 21, 2012 5:43 pm

Quoting MD11Engineer (Reply 10):
Do you know how many parts made in Mexico a typical Boeing aircraft has?

Not a whole lot is from Mexico. The most significant part is the insulation blankets are from Mexico. The largest suppliers are from the US, UK, Japan, France, and Italy based on value.

Complex aircraft parts are manufactured in low quantities, so rarely are offshored. Larger quantity parts are usually manufactured within the US because shipping costs are lower.

When you start getting into brackets, clips, etc then they come from all over the world, but cost wise it is motors, actuators, pumps, electronics etc that are the high budget items.

[Edited 2012-04-21 10:45:56]
 
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vatveng
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RE: Safety Brochures Now Show A/C Manufacture

Sat Apr 21, 2012 5:45 pm

It happened during the "freedom fries" nonsense, and was aimed squarely at France. Never mind that airliners are built in other countries... politicians can't be bothered to think that much.
 
B2468
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RE: Safety Brochures Now Show A/C Manufacture

Sat Apr 21, 2012 6:04 pm

I can't say I have ever paid much attention to this, but I do remember once or twice seeing a "Made in X" legend on safety cards...I always assumed that indicated where the safety card was printed/manufactured, not the manufacture of the actual aircraft. Do Airbus/Boeing/other aircraft manufacturers produce the physical safety cards?

The only time I can remember seeing a "Made in X" legend on an aircraft was on the production plate inside the entry door on a Boeing aircraft (I don't remember the exact wording, but it said something like "MFG by BOEING CO., WASHINGTON, USA").

Quoting vatveng (Reply 15):
It happened during the "freedom fries" nonsense, and was aimed squarely at France. Never mind that airliners are built in other countries... politicians can't be bothered to think that much.

That childish nonsense annoyed me to no end. In response, I have resolved to call the new "Freedom Tower" in NYC the "French Tower".
 
BD500
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RE: Safety Brochures Now Show A/C Manufacture

Sat Apr 21, 2012 6:57 pm

Quoting Roseflyer (Reply 14):
Not a whole lot is from Mexico. The most significant part is the insulation blankets are from Mexico. The largest suppliers are from the US, UK, Japan, France, and Italy based on value.

I believe there are more parts from Mexico than you would think, I'm pretty sure Labinal (division of Safran) in Chihuaha are providing wire harnesses to Boeing.
Also, at Queretaro in the Aerospace park, there are many suppliers of Boeing, such as Meggitt.
 
USAirALB
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RE: Safety Brochures Now Show A/C Manufacture

Sat Apr 21, 2012 7:24 pm

US has done this for years, as has AA I believe. I always thought it was weird to see it at the bottom of the card, and for the average passenger is probably a little confusing. One US plane would say "Final Assembly of this aircraft was in Brazil", the next plane said Germany, and the next said France, and the next said the USA.
 
sxf24
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RE: Safety Brochures Now Show A/C Manufacture

Sat Apr 21, 2012 7:39 pm

Quoting BD500 (Reply 17):
I believe there are more parts from Mexico than you would think, I'm pretty sure Labinal (division of Safran) in Chihuaha are providing wire harnesses to Boeing.
Also, at Queretaro in the Aerospace park, there are many suppliers of Boeing, such as Meggitt.

Actually, I believe most of Labinal's production for legacy Boeing programs is out of Corinth, TX, which used to be owned by Boeing.

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