cv640
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RE: Latest 717 Rumor: DL Deal In Place Part 3

Thu May 10, 2012 3:06 am

I doubt Delta wants the DPA, it is quite militant. I'm not sure how things would work out, but ALPA has gone along with all of Delta's proposals. I doubt that Delta would want to risk changing that with a new union.

Scope is the number 1 or number 2 issue with most crews I fly with
 
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RE: Latest 717 Rumor: DL Deal In Place Part 3

Thu May 10, 2012 4:33 am

Quoting B4REAL (Reply 33):
It's definitely a *win* for DL. As the DC-9s finally go out, a mainline type comes in.

It's also a win for Boeing, keeps them flying (parts).

And a win for WN to simplify their fleet (pure 737).

Quoting PSU.DTW.SCE (Reply 37):
Delta pilots will under no circumstances allow scope to increase in seat count. DL management has never said anything that indicates a change in scope is necessary to get the 717 on property. The 717 would be flown by DL mainline pilots.

   Nor would it be proposed. The concept of the 717 as RJ just doesn't pass any rational test. Replace mainline planes with a mainline size plane that weights over 100,000lbm at MTOW and expect pilots to agree?   

Quoting FlyASAGuy2005 (Reply 41):
What are THEY smokin!! because I want some!! LMFAO

I wouldn't. The stuff obviously impairs cognitive skills.  

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delta2ual
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RE: Latest 717 Rumor: DL Deal In Place Part 3

Thu May 10, 2012 1:29 pm

Quoting adtall (Reply 22):
the high-frequency departures to business destinations (LGA, DCA, ORD, BOS) could all run out of T to give business fliers the greatest convenience.
Quoting cokepopper (Reply 38):
I'm pretty sure Delta tried this out of T around 10 years ago. Anyone else remember this?

  

Back when we had hourly to DFW, ORD, LGA, DCA, BOS, & PHL (Leo Mullins idea) the majority were out of T. It was felt the FF's would like the convenience of close-in gates.
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RE: Latest 717 Rumor: DL Deal In Place Part 3

Thu May 10, 2012 3:19 pm

Quoting DeltaL1011man (Reply 49):
worth a shot to ask. Think about EV(is it still EV?) and all the pilots that are going to end up jobless due to parking of 50 seaters of the next 5 years. Its their unions job to push for more Delta/United flying. I just hope DALPA/UALPA don't screw it up like they did with 70/76 seaters.

Doesn't that all have to be done thru their owners, Skywest?
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RE: Latest 717 Rumor: DL Deal In Place Part 3

Thu May 10, 2012 4:03 pm

Quoting DeltaL1011man (Reply 49):
worth a shot to ask

I suppose so. They wouldn't be doing their job if they didn't..
What gets measured gets done.
 
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RE: Latest 717 Rumor: DL Deal In Place Part 3

Thu May 10, 2012 5:59 pm

Quoting PSU.DTW.SCE (Reply 37):
That person is frankly has no clue. Note they are an ALPA rep for a regional.

Delta pilots will under no circumstances allow scope to increase in seat count. DL management has never said anything that indicates a change in scope is necessary to get the 717 on property. The 717 would be flown by DL mainline pilots.

I know this, but this was amajor point for the DPA va. ALPA argument to them...

Who knows!
 
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RE: Latest 717 Rumor: DL Deal In Place Part 3

Thu May 10, 2012 9:24 pm

Quoting bhmdiversion (Reply 55):
Quoting PSU.DTW.SCE (Reply 37):
That person is frankly has no clue. Note they are an ALPA rep for a regional.

Delta pilots will under no circumstances allow scope to increase in seat count. DL management has never said anything that indicates a change in scope is necessary to get the 717 on property. The 717 would be flown by DL mainline pilots.

I know this, but this was amajor point for the DPA va. ALPA argument to them...

Who knows!

I would think that if the 717 comes online, runs some of the regional routes with mainline crews, that the DPA AND ALPA would be overjoyed.
"A committee is a group of the unprepared, appointed by the unwilling, to do the unnecessary"----Fred Allen
 
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RE: Latest 717 Rumor: DL Deal In Place Part 3

Thu May 10, 2012 9:58 pm

The 717 will easily replace the remaining DC9 fleet and better than 50 RJ's. This would be a win for ML.
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RE: Latest 717 Rumor: DL Deal In Place Part 3

Thu May 10, 2012 10:58 pm

Quoting mayor (Reply 53):
Doesn't that all have to be done thru their owners, Skywest?

eh, yes and no. I'm not sure how OO works as far as contracts so maybe. I believe though that EV is basically its own company as far as contracts and negotiating contracts so it would be between DL/EV and ALPA.

Quoting FlyASAGuy2005 (Reply 54):
I suppose so. They wouldn't be doing their job if they didn't..

and DALPA track record on scope isn't very good, and the EV pilots don't want to be on the outside looking in if DALPA does allow scope to grow.

Quoting mayor (Reply 56):

I would think that if the 717 comes online, runs some of the regional routes with mainline crews, that the DPA AND ALPA would be overjoyed.

if that is all that happens then your right, but if its bring in the 717 and add more 76 seaters at DCI then.....I personally don't think that will happen but it could. Both management and DALPA has to be on their toes during contract time. They may seem buddy buddy but both are waiting for the chance for a slip up and then to take advantage of it.

Quoting lightsaber (Reply 51):
Nor would it be proposed. The concept of the 717 as RJ just doesn't pass any rational test.

what about DC9s?  
 
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RE: Latest 717 Rumor: DL Deal In Place Part 3

Fri May 11, 2012 3:04 am

Quoting DeltaL1011man (Reply 58):
if that is all that happens then your right, but if its bring in the 717 and add more 76 seaters at DCI then

I think it would be more rational to use the 717s to replace CR7s and CR9s on some routes and move those a/c down into spots where there are RJs, now. Good enough reason to get rid of more RJs.
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RE: Latest 717 Rumor: DL Deal In Place Part 3

Fri May 11, 2012 4:23 am

Quoting DeltaL1011man (Reply 45):
Delta management was part of the YX....they would love nothing more than to farm out as much flying as they could, they just can't.

This is difficult to reconcile with the fact that they recently ordered 100 737s and are soon to complete a deal for more narrowbody aircraft.

Quoting DeltaL1011man (Reply 45):
If DPA is anything close to the APA or SWAPA (?) then Delta wants no part of it. Everything I have seen/heard about DPA is being much more like the APA. Delta loves DALPA because they are buddy buddy. A union that isn't worthless would be a pain for delta.

You seem to think of APA as a model of how a union effectively promotes the interests of its membership. I'm not sure that recent history would support your view.
 
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RE: Latest 717 Rumor: DL Deal In Place Part 3

Fri May 11, 2012 1:17 pm

Quoting DeltaL1011man (Reply 45):
Nothing. ASA pilots union should be pushing up. But the bigger and more powerful DALPA should be pushing down. IMO the RJ unions see the end is near(at least for a good bit of them) so they are going to be pushing for more flying and more flows.




How exactly do they do this? Regional pilots only have a claim on the flying that they have been awarded per their companies AMCI agreement for the length of that agreement. How can they claim anymore? Easy, they sign concessionary agreement after concessionary agreement to drive the race to the bottom, but wait, everyone has been doing this for the last 10 years. Your logic is flawed. Furthermore, DALPA knows that the quickest way to get DPA on the property is to give up anymore scope. It's not going to happen and Delta knows this as well. If, I say if, an agreement is reached to acquire the 717 they will be flown by mainline Delta Pilots.

Back on topic, the rumor mill has been quiet lately. This must mean that talks are moving along.  

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RE: Latest 717 Rumor: DL Deal In Place Part 3

Fri May 11, 2012 3:29 pm

Quoting 727forever (Reply 61):
How exactly do they do this? Regional pilots only have a claim on the flying that they have been awarded per their companies AMCI agreement for the length of that agreement. How can they claim anymore? Easy, they sign concessionary agreement after concessionary agreement to drive the race to the bottom, but wait, everyone has been doing this for the last 10 years. Your logic is flawed. Furthermore, DALPA knows that the quickest way to get DPA on the property is to give up anymore scope. It's not going to happen and Delta knows this as well. If, I say if, an agreement is reached to acquire the 717 they will be flown by mainline Delta Pilots.

This is entirely a non-issue. In the context of Delta's current financial performance and outlook, it is absurd to spend time discussing some scenario in which DALPA grants broad scope concessions and 100 seaters are flown by DCI operators.

Any serious discussion of that scenario would necessarily assume that DALPA has no interest in protecting the interests of its members, and that DAL is unable or unwilling to operate a 100 seater profitably. Easy argument to make on an internet message board, but reality would suggest quite the opposite.
 
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RE: Latest 717 Rumor: DL Deal In Place Part 3

Fri May 11, 2012 4:54 pm

I'm sure this has been asked and answered already but with this being string #3, it's hard sifting through the other 500 or so posts.

What's FL's F/Y config on the 717s? Also, assuming DL eventually installs slimeline seats, how many seats SHOULD they be able to cram in the back in theory? I'd assume F will be 12 as to maximize the amount of space for Y seats to decrease the CASM.
What gets measured gets done.
 
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RE: Latest 717 Rumor: DL Deal In Place Part 3

Fri May 11, 2012 5:40 pm

The FL configuration is 12/105, with F pitch at 37" and Y pitch at 30". Unless they install slimline seats, they are going to have to remove a row of seats to accommodate Economy Comfort. I would expect a 12/20/80 configuration with 36" in F, 34" in EC, and 31" in Y. If they do change out all the seats, then they could probably keep a 12/20/85 configuration.
 
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RE: Latest 717 Rumor: DL Deal In Place Part 3

Fri May 11, 2012 6:40 pm

Quoting goldenstate (Reply 60):

This is difficult to reconcile with the fact that they recently ordered 100 737s and are soon to complete a deal for more narrowbody aircraft.

ah adding 100 lower paying jets compared to the bulk of the fleet they will be replacing and on par with the rest.
but what does that to do with more big RJs? PR machine at work here. (see i can do it too, but the 739s have nothing to do with anything said. just typical look at this hand while i slap you with the other management fan boy i see on here)

Quoting goldenstate (Reply 60):

You seem to think of APA as a model of how a union effectively promotes the interests of its membership. I'm not sure that recent history would support your view.

hmm lets look at APA models shall we?
Southwest, Scope is simple. Southwest sells ticket, its has a Southwest pilot period. Any kind of agreement much be oked by the union. period. No codeshare/JV or outsourcing with out approval of the SWAPA. Oh and the fact that there pilots make more than 90%+ of Delta pilots. Yes....truly, truly failing.
APA. Is standing as strong as it possibly can in BK, the judge may give them theirs but outside of having terms forced on them(and they wont even do a FBO it looks like. Taking it straight to the judge and thus keeping section 6 open. aka AA gets to start contract negotiations right after the judge rules. Short term win for AMR, long term it gives the APA a much, much better chance at self-help.) Outside of BK, they have much better scope than that of DALPA and have been much less willing to give in to managements wants.
so yes, for a company can do no wrong person, like yourself, they suck. For someone who doesn't get to sit at the GO making 250K a year and play golf with Anderson....they don't look to bad to me.

Quoting 727forever (Reply 61):

How exactly do they do this? Regional pilots only have a claim on the flying that they have been awarded per their companies AMCI agreement for the length of that agreement. How can they claim anymore? Easy, they sign concessionary agreement after concessionary agreement to drive the race to the bottom, but wait, everyone has been doing this for the last 10 years. Your logic is flawed. Furthermore, DALPA knows that the quickest way to get DPA on the property is to give up anymore scope. It's not going to happen and Delta knows this as well. If, I say if, an agreement is reached to acquire the 717 they will be flown by mainline Delta Pilots.

I didn't say they can claim anymore, They simply reach an agreement with the company(in this case EV) to fly jets with X amount of seats, then EV's management takes the numbers to Delta and Delta then asks for more outsourcing. (or tells EV no thanks)
As for getting DALPA knowing, you may be right, the track record seems to point the other way. Now true they haven't really had a legit shot at being kicked out so maybe they will get it, I am just saying them coming to the group with a TA of 10-15% raise and more 76 seaters with the plan of getting all of FLs 717s wouldn't shock me. (I do however expect a large NO vote and a lot more DPA talk)
 
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RE: Latest 717 Rumor: DL Deal In Place Part 3

Fri May 11, 2012 7:37 pm

Quoting timf (Reply 64):
The FL configuration is 12/105, with F pitch at 37" and Y pitch at 30". Unless they install slimline seats, they are going to have to remove a row of seats to accommodate Economy Comfort. I would expect a 12/20/80 configuration with 36" in F, 34" in EC, and 31" in Y. If they do change out all the seats, then they could probably keep a 12/20/85 configuration.

Just for reference, HA manages to squeeze in 123 seats (8/115) with 1 LAV and minimal galley space.

-Aloha!
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RE: Latest 717 Rumor: DL Deal In Place Part 3

Fri May 11, 2012 8:35 pm

Quoting aloha73g (Reply 66):
Just for reference, HA manages to squeeze in 123 seats (8/115) with 1 LAV and minimal galley space.

-Aloha!

I have flown on HA’s 717’s, they are fairly tight seating in coach with about a 30” seat pitch, but for an average flight of one half hour, it is more than bearable.

As far as one lav, I don’t remember ever seeing anyone get up and use the lav, especially on the short HNL to OGG flights that I have been on.

JetStar
 
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RE: Latest 717 Rumor: DL Deal In Place Part 3

Fri May 11, 2012 9:11 pm

Quoting jetstar (Reply 67):

As far as one lav, I don’t remember ever seeing anyone get up and use the lav, especially on the short HNL to OGG flights that I have been on.

During an average day maybe 2-3 passengers use the LAV. Its mostly used by the crew. F/As in flight & on the ground pilots on the ground....since the LAV is in the back.

-Aloha!
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RE: Latest 717 Rumor: DL Deal In Place Part 3

Fri May 11, 2012 9:41 pm

Quoting DeltaL1011man (Reply 65):
ah adding 100 lower paying jets compared to the bulk of the fleet they will be replacing and on par with the rest.
but what does that to do with more big RJs? PR machine at work here. (see i can do it too, but the 739s have nothing to do with anything said. just typical look at this hand while i slap you with the other management fan boy i see on here)

You know I've been biting my hand for a while in regards to some of your posts.

You are not a member of ALPA/DALPA etc. I know you've been reading APC a lot. That being said, I don't think you truly can speak for each person's personal situation and feelings in regards for what they feel of their unions performance.

Frankly I'm sick of the union paranoia that you are constantly promoting.

This is why contracts become amendible and there is a negotiation process. So what DL is going to bring on 739ERs that replace and out-of-production 757 aircraft that is at the end of its usable life. That is a valid negotiation point for the pilots union.

If DL is going to bring on 717s, again the specifics are a valid negotiating topic. The same goes if DL wants to have more 76 seat aircraft. They can make a proposal and they can negotiate.

Obviously not everyone is going to be happy at the outcome no matter what. DL management has every right to float whatever proposal it wants in front of its pilots. The pilots have every right to make their concerns and proposals known too.

I'm frankly sick and tired of hearing these bickering sessions back and forth about scope and what-if scenarios. You do realize there is a lot more to the acquistion of aircraft than just pilot and/or union wages. Do you really think DL management's sole goal in life is to screw the pilots/FAs/mechanics?

Ok, that is the end of my rant.
 
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mayor
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RE: Latest 717 Rumor: DL Deal In Place Part 3

Fri May 11, 2012 10:13 pm

Quoting PSU.DTW.SCE (Reply 69):
Do you really think DL management's sole goal in life is to screw the pilots/FAs/mechanics?

To hear the "screwees" tell it, yes.
"A committee is a group of the unprepared, appointed by the unwilling, to do the unnecessary"----Fred Allen
 
goldenstate
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RE: Latest 717 Rumor: DL Deal In Place Part 3

Fri May 11, 2012 10:59 pm

Quoting DeltaL1011man (Reply 65):
ah adding 100 lower paying jets compared to the bulk of the fleet they will be replacing and on par with the rest.
but what does that to do with more big RJs? PR machine at work here. (see i can do it too, but the 739s have nothing to do with anything said. just typical look at this hand while i slap you with the other management fan boy i see on here)

To anyone that has both feet firmly planted in the world of economic reality, this is very unusual logic. You seem to be arguing that DAL investing in new mainline aircraft is only good if the new aircraft are the same size as or larger than the old ones they replace. Any market driven decisions about domestic fleet gauge are apparently irrelevant.

So a natural extension of this strange argument would be that the interests of the pilots would be best served if they could force Delta to continue flying domestic 757/767s as long as possible, focus only on the short term goal of avoiding a 3 to 5% pay scale hit from moving to an aircraft with 5 to 50% less capacity, and not worry about the declining economics of large domestic aircraft.

Quoting DeltaL1011man (Reply 65):

hmm lets look at APA models shall we?
SWAPA.
APA.
so yes, for a company can do no wrong person, like yourself, they suck. For someone who doesn't get to sit at the GO making 250K a year and play golf with Anderson....they don't look to bad to me.

Yes, let's look at your suggested DPA models.

SWAPA: completely different business model with much lower structural costs and half as many pilots as Delta, but either way, SWA is headed for a labor cost correction sooner or later.

APA: if their membership's interests extended only as far as Fall 2011, you might have a point. However, I would guess that most AA pilots care about what happens beyond that. Your strategic analysis is totally detached from reality. In a bankruptcy proceeding, tough talk doesn't scare the creditors and self help only helps if the desired outcome is a Chapter 7 liquidation.

Overall, you've done an excellent job of regurgitating the labor extremist talking points, with some nice personal shots thrown in for good measure as well.
 
bobnwa
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RE: Latest 717 Rumor: DL Deal In Place Part 3

Sat May 12, 2012 12:54 pm

Quoting PSU.DTW.SCE (Reply 69):
You are not a member of ALPA/DALPA etc. I know you've been reading APC a lot

You are absolutely right about Delta L1011 not being a member of ALPA/DALPA or any other pilots union. He is not a pilot for any airline but likes to appear as " an insider"regarding the Delta pilots. Definitely right about his reading APC a lot.
 
strfyr51
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RE: Latest 717 Rumor: DL Deal In Place Part 3

Sat May 12, 2012 1:22 pm

if Delta is buying up all the available B717's and MD90's then they have a craftiness not seen before. they may be paying $.25 on a Dollar for the airplanes with PLENTY of life left in them and also saving on training costs in the offing, How Much they can save is beyond me BUT. every dollar counts!! Somebody over at Delta is one "Tightwad Dude"!!
 
FlyASAGuy2005
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RE: Latest 717 Rumor: DL Deal In Place Part 3

Sat May 12, 2012 3:18 pm

Quoting timf (Reply 64):
The FL configuration is 12/105, with F pitch at 37" and Y pitch at 30". Unless they install slimline seats, they are going to have to remove a row of seats to accommodate Economy Comfort. I would expect a 12/20/80 configuration with 36" in F, 34" in EC, and 31" in Y. If they do change out all the seats, then they could probably keep a 12/20/85 configuration.

Thanks for the numbers although I will say that I think EC will be smaller. The 88s that seat more pax only has 3 rows of EC. I think the 717s would be the same. So I envison 12/15 not 12/20. I just got off a 738 today that had the EC mod. 4 rows I believe.

Just a side note but the program's coming along nicely. ASA large RJs are being done pretty fast and they said their fleet should be done by mid June.
What gets measured gets done.
 
deltal1011man
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RE: Latest 717 Rumor: DL Deal In Place Part 3

Sat May 12, 2012 3:36 pm

Quoting FlyASAGuy2005 (Reply 75):
4 rows I believe.

your right

Quoting FlyASAGuy2005 (Reply 75):

Thanks for the numbers although I will say that I think EC will be smaller. The 88s that seat more pax only has 3 rows of EC. I think the 717s would be the same.

agreed. I think Slim lines will be the plan but I think, at least if the numbers above are true, they will wait to add them. Maybe once some of the other work gets done. 12 birds at DL by end of 2012 would mean that 1) not flying or 2) FL bird with new seat covers at most. So fi the plan is to get them and get them going fast, which may be the idea to pull the 17 9s out of the fleet, then they will likely have to wait for a year or so to start heavy mod work.

Quoting mayor (Reply 76):
Quoting DeltaL1011man (Reply 74):
If you want to talk more about it take it to the PM.
 
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RE: Latest 717 Rumor: DL Deal In Place Part 3

Sat May 12, 2012 3:48 pm

Quoting DeltaL1011man (Reply 45):
Delta loves DALPA because they are buddy buddy. A union that isn't worthless would be a pain for delta.



DALPA has been plenty militant in the past, particularly during the BK. Many of the members were ready to throw the rest of the employees "under the bus", as it were. For the good of the airline, the union and management were able to finally agree on something.
"A committee is a group of the unprepared, appointed by the unwilling, to do the unnecessary"----Fred Allen
 
timf
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RE: Latest 717 Rumor: DL Deal In Place Part 3

Sun May 13, 2012 1:55 am

Quoting FlyASAGuy2005 (Reply 75):
Thanks for the numbers although I will say that I think EC will be smaller. The 88s that seat more pax only has 3 rows of EC. I think the 717s would be the same. So I envison 12/15 not 12/20. I just got off a 738 today that had the EC mod. 4 rows I believe.

I debated about that number but figured if they were going to eliminate a full row of Y they might as well make an extra row of EC. If they only go with 3 rows of EC then F can stay at 37". Then, there's always the possibility they reduce F from 37" to 34" like on the DC9s. In this case they could add 3 rows of EC at 33" and keep the rest of the Y configuration. That would be pretty cramped in all cabins though.
 
goldenstate
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RE: Latest 717 Rumor: DL Deal In Place Part 3

Mon May 14, 2012 4:35 pm

Quoting DeltaL1011man (Reply 74):
With the fleet being 88(?) frames that 176 engines, the 4th largest engine type in the fleet. I wounder if they will try to bring it in-house. One would think the V2500s would be a more likely move due to being able to bring in 3rd party MRO work.

I wouldn't see either engine as particularly attractive for an in-house overhaul shop at this time.

Quoting DeltaL1011man (Reply 74):
but this has gotten way OT, so i'm done. If you want to talk more about it take it to the PM. Sorry for going way OT mods.

That's a very convenient exit from a post which is loaded with factually incorrect information.
 
deltal1011man
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RE: Latest 717 Rumor: DL Deal In Place Part 3

Mon May 14, 2012 7:00 pm

Quoting goldenstate (Reply 81):
I wouldn't see either engine as particularly attractive for an in-house overhaul shop at this time.

no more attractive than the JT8s. And the V2500s have a large MRO market, being the engine on the M90 and 320.

Quoting goldenstate (Reply 81):
That's a very convenient exit from a post which is loaded with factually incorrect information.

lol no just not trying to get banned. You know taking the mature way out, but it clear you can't do so. Sad really.
 
papatango
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RE: Latest 717 Rumor: DL Deal In Place Part 3

Mon May 14, 2012 7:28 pm

IMHO. Airbus will come out the winner with additional A319's t Delta
 
Dalmd88
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RE: Latest 717 Rumor: DL Deal In Place Part 3

Mon May 14, 2012 7:42 pm

Quoting goldenstate (Reply 81):
With the fleet being 88(?) frames that 176 engines, the 4th largest engine type in the fleet. I wounder if they will try to bring it in-house. One would think the V2500s would be a more likely move due to being able to bring in 3rd party MRO work.

I wouldn't see either engine as particularly attractive for an in-house overhaul shop at this time.

I'm not sure they can bring the BMW in house. First off they only can if BMW allows it. I think they currently have approved only MTU in Europe for overhaul work. Second is real estate, the footprint in ATL for engine work is pretty tight.
 
burnsie28
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RE: Latest 717 Rumor: DL Deal In Place Part 3

Mon May 14, 2012 8:37 pm

Quoting PHLBOS (Reply 24):
The 717's wingspan is comparable to that of a DC-9 (-30/40/50); which, I believe, is narrower than all of the above.

The DC9 has a wingspan of 93' 4" and the MD88/90 has a wingspan of 107' 10"

Quoting PSU.DTW.SCE (Reply 37):
Delta pilots will under no circumstances allow scope to increase in seat count. DL management has never said anything that indicates a change in scope is necessary to get the 717 on property. The 717 would be flown by DL mainline pilots.

Agreed

Quoting DeltaL1011man (Reply 45):
Delta management was part of the YX....they would love nothing more than to farm out as much flying as they could, they just can't.

What makes you think they would want to farm out any flying?

Quoting DeltaL1011man (Reply 45):
Delta loves DALPA because they are buddy buddy. A union that isn't worthless would be a pain for delta.

Being buddy buddy with your union is a win for both sides, the union is there to protect jobs not just from the company but from the government etc.

Quoting DeltaL1011man (Reply 49):
worth a shot to ask. Think about EV(is it still EV?) and all the pilots that are going to end up jobless due to parking of 50 seaters of the next 5 years. Its their unions job to push for more Delta/United flying. I just hope DALPA/UALPA don't screw it up like they did with 70/76 seaters.

Anyone ever think that more RJ pilots might get called up to the big leagues, with so many more mainline aircraft coming online, there will be a shortage of DL pilots, as if there isn't already.

Quoting DeltaL1011man (Reply 74):
all I said was it wouldn't shock me to see DALPA come to its members with a TA for more large RJs

It would me, the pilots have been wanting more flying as it is.
 
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NWAROOSTER
Posts: 1245
Joined: Mon Feb 14, 2005 2:29 pm

RE: Latest 717 Rumor: DL Deal In Place Part 3

Mon May 14, 2012 8:39 pm

Quoting Dalmd88 (Reply 84):
I'm not sure they can bring the BMW in house. First off they only can if BMW allows it. I think they currently have approved only MTU in Europe for overhaul work. Second is real estate, the footprint in ATL for engine work is pretty tight.

Delta still maintains an engine shop at MSP. I do not know if it has the capacity to take on the BMW engine. I also do not know if Delta intends to keep the MSP engine in operation   
Procrastination Is The Theft Of Time.......
 
goldenstate
Posts: 155
Joined: Thu Feb 04, 2010 11:24 pm

RE: Latest 717 Rumor: DL Deal In Place Part 3

Mon May 14, 2012 10:23 pm

Quoting DeltaL1011man (Reply 82):
no more attractive than the JT8s. And the V2500s have a large MRO market, being the engine on the M90 and 320.

The V2500 is a mature product and most of those operated in the Americas are now locked up in long term deals with other vendors.
 
dtw9
Posts: 995
Joined: Mon Sep 22, 2003 10:09 am

RE: Latest 717 Rumor: DL Deal In Place Part 3

Mon May 14, 2012 11:10 pm

Quoting burnsie28 (Reply 85):
Quoting PHLBOS (Reply 24):The 717's wingspan is comparable to that of a DC-9 (-30/40/50); which, I believe, is narrower than all of the above.
The DC9 has a wingspan of 93' 4" and the MD88/90 has a wingspan of 107' 10"

To be exact, the 717 has the DC-9-34 wing. The incidence was changed by 1.25 degrees over other DC-9's to improve drag.
 
bobnwa
Posts: 4514
Joined: Fri Dec 22, 2000 12:10 am

RE: Latest 717 Rumor: DL Deal In Place Part 3

Mon May 14, 2012 11:45 pm

Quoting DeltaL1011man (Reply 74):
all I said was it wouldn't shock me to see DALPA come to its members with a TA for more large RJs

Hasn't happened and more than likely won't happen. Better go back to APC and re-read it.
 
gigneil
Posts: 14133
Joined: Fri Nov 08, 2002 10:25 am

RE: Latest 717 Rumor: DL Deal In Place Part 3

Tue May 15, 2012 2:30 am

Quoting DeltaL1011man (Reply 74):
If your a liberal you don't like to see conservative views.

If you're a liberal you can spell.

NS
 
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mayor
Posts: 6218
Joined: Sun Mar 09, 2008 3:58 pm

RE: Latest 717 Rumor: DL Deal In Place Part 3

Tue May 15, 2012 3:29 am

Quoting burnsie28 (Reply 85):
Anyone ever think that more RJ pilots might get called up to the big leagues, with so many more mainline aircraft coming online, there will be a shortage of DL pilots, as if there isn't already.

There have been many OO pilots lately who are going with WN......mainly, for some reason, because DL doesn't want to hire them. I'm sure it's because that maybe, many of them, don't have a 4 year degree to meet the requirements. Happened to my son-in-law, I'm sure it's happened to others.
"A committee is a group of the unprepared, appointed by the unwilling, to do the unnecessary"----Fred Allen

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