BrianDromey
Posts: 2538
Joined: Sun Dec 10, 2006 2:23 am

RE: Irish 7/12: Up There Where The Air Is Rarified ...

Sat May 12, 2012 10:34 pm

I have to say ORK was pretty quiet tonight. I think the days of variety on the ramp are well and truly gone. The days of Spanair, Air Europa, Futura, Air 2000/First Choice, Monarch, Pegasus, Air Luxor and the odd British Midland amongst others, seems long gone. It's strictly harps, shamrocks and mini shamrocks these days. Mostly ORK based, of course, which makes for pretty dramatic peaks and troughs in terms of ramp activity and passenger flow. The food court and duty free were closed at 7 pm for example.

Quoting AmricanShamrok (Reply 192):
I do believe that separation from the DAA is paramount though. Shannon is now effectively competing with Dublin for passenger traffic. As Tony points out above, many people around this area choose to commute to DUB to fly out rather than use SNN itself. Both airports being run by the same authority whose priority will always be DUB just doesn't make sense.

I agree, to a point. I think renaming Aer Rianta as the DAA (or as they prefer to style themselves "daa" - how very web 1.0) probably did promote DUB over the other two airports and Aer Rianta International too. Personally I would like to see ARI be taken as the vehicle for ORK, DUB, SNN, Duty Free and International to operate as independent entities, I believe that this would provide enough separation in terms of operation, yet keep the three state airports independent of the tax payer. While I do believe that DUB does draw from SNN and ORK catchment areas, one could argue that DUB is likely to be a far more ferocious competitor in the future than in the past and will do everything possible to undermine SNN - which is no longer any of the DAA's concern.
Fundamentally I feel this is a political, rather than a practical, move. I don't believe that SNN has the right infrastructure, population density or cost base to attract the LCC airlines in sufficient volumes to be profitable as an independent entity. I don't believe that any real moves have been taken to create a viable business at SNN, another example of parish politics, Im afraid.
 
Cabincrewifly
Posts: 228
Joined: Sun Jul 10, 2011 7:47 pm

RE: Irish 7/12: Up There Where The Air Is Rarified ...

Sun May 13, 2012 10:18 am

Quoting BrianDromey (Reply 200):
I have to say ORK was pretty quiet tonight. I think the days of variety on the ramp are well and truly gone. The days of Spanair, Air Europa, Futura, Air 2000/First Choice, Monarch, Pegasus, Air Luxor and the odd British Midland amongst others, seems long gone. It's strictly harps, shamrocks and mini shamrocks these days. Mostly ORK based, of course, which makes for pretty dramatic peaks and troughs in terms of ramp activity and passenger flow. The food court and duty free were closed at 7 pm for example.

Yes its quiet, but its not at the summer peak yet. We will have the arrival of the 2nd FR aircraft for the summer from June, and there's a few airlines yet to commence charters such as Croatian Airlines and Air Dolomiti, Europe airpost etc. Sunday night is quite busy with eg Wizzair, Jet2, Tailwind, Ryanair and more. From June onwards, there's also student charters from MAD and FCO, and pilgrims to LDE. Its nice to see the based MON A320 around, their full summer schedule is yet to kick into full swing.

A few days in the week, you can now see up to 3 Aer Lingus Regional aircraft on the ramp at once, with the additional BHX, MAN, JER etc. We will also have an increase in Jet2's schedule from ORK NCL from x2 to x3 weekly. Onur Air A321's can be seen buzzing around now, and from OCT we will have OLT Express with a mix of A319's and A320's.
EI FR RE EIR IWD MA FUA
 
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shamrock604
Posts: 2190
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RE: Irish 7/12: Up There Where The Air Is Rarified ...

Mon May 14, 2012 2:39 am

Quoting BrianDromey (Reply 200):

SNN's problems stem from a lack of people willing or wishing to fly anywhere beyond London, New York, Boston and Malaga.

Thats the size of it. They can dress it up any bloody way they wish, but that's the fact of life. Inventing tall tales of the DAA ordering Aerlingus to fly to Paris at certain times of day in order to undermine the route so Dublin won't be hurt (this is actually being seriously discussed on boards.ie) might make people at SNN feel better rather than face up to the fundamental lack of demand, but a very chill wind of commercial reality is about to blow through the place.

While I fully expect that SNN will recover some routes that have been lost over the last 5 years, it will be cargo and logistics that will support the airport in the years to come.

I wish it the best of luck, and at least from now, we shouldn't have to listen to any conspiracy theories. It's in the hands of local interests now, so let's see what they can pull off.
 
kaitak
Topic Author
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RE: Irish 7/12: Up There Where The Air Is Rarified ...

Mon May 14, 2012 5:45 am

Poor old David Begg ... hope he doesn't get a complex about this:

http://www.independent.ie/business/i...gus-almost-ousts-begg-3105704.html

... and sure even if he did get booted off the EI board, I'm sure the FR board would welcome him with open arms!
 
Eagleboy
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Joined: Fri Dec 04, 2009 2:29 am

RE: Irish 7/12: Up There Where The Air Is Rarified ...

Mon May 14, 2012 3:15 pm

I anticipate quite a few angry passengers by Monday next:

“The www.ryanair.com website will be closed for upgrade maintenance at the below times between Fri. 18 May and Sun. 20 May. Passengers must ensure that they have booked tickets, checked in online and printed their boarding passes etc. prior to the below times"

http://www.newstalk.ie//2012/feature...-com-24-hour-closure-this-weekend/
 
Toulouse
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Joined: Thu Apr 28, 2005 4:30 pm

RE: Irish 7/12: Up There Where The Air Is Rarified ...

Mon May 14, 2012 4:39 pm

How can they get away with this. A total joke. I see Newstalk has learnt they haven't notified passengers by email, which I can confirm as a friend is flying them on Saturday and all we've received is the below email:

"YOU MUST CHECK-IN ONLINE AND PRINT YOUR BOARDING PASS ON AN INDIVIDUAL A4 PAGE FOR PRESENTATION AT BOTH AIRPORT SECURITY AND AT THE BOARDING GATE.

You can check-in online from 15 days up to 4 hours before each scheduled flight departure time.

The option to reserve a seat is available on all Ryanair flights"
Long live Aer Lingus!
 
Cabincrewifly
Posts: 228
Joined: Sun Jul 10, 2011 7:47 pm

RE: Irish 7/12: Up There Where The Air Is Rarified ...

Mon May 14, 2012 5:32 pm

Quoting shamrock604 (Reply 202):
SNN's problems stem from a lack of people willing or wishing to fly anywhere beyond London, New York, Boston and Malaga.

I was talking to 6 pax from Limerick this morning who were flying from ORK FAO, they were complaining about the lack of services from SNN.

On another note, there was an FR diversion into ORK this morning. The flight from PIK to ACE diverted due to 4 unruly pax. Landed safely, dumped them off then continued on.
EI FR RE EIR IWD MA FUA
 
tonymctigue
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Joined: Sat Feb 18, 2006 4:01 am

RE: Irish 7/12: Up There Where The Air Is Rarified ...

Mon May 14, 2012 6:51 pm

Quoting Cabincrewifly (Reply 206):
I was talking to 6 pax from Limerick this morning who were flying from ORK FAO, they were complaining about the lack of services from SNN.

Therein lies two of the most fundamental problems that SNN must overcome to have any chance of success. Many people in what is already a sparse enough catchement will opt for flights out of ORK or DUB when flights to the same destinations are also on offer from SNN. From my own anecdotal observations, the two primary reasons are either the flight from SNN cost slightly more or 2) they simply didn't know the destination was on offer from SNN. You can argue that people of the region are lazy and cheap but ultimately, the buck still stops at the SAA. Why, for example SNN-STN with FR costs €20 more than say ORK-STN, DUB-STN or NOC-STN? It is more than likely to do with the cost base at SNN being too high. Similarly, if someone books say an FR flight to STN from DUB or ORK without knowing this is also offered by FR from SNN, then it is the SAA's fault for not advertising the airport and routes on offer enough.

Credit where credit is due, they have woken up on the advertsing front somewhat with the new "I'm for Shannon" campaign that has been on the go leading up to the summer season and the previous campaign advertising UK routes and SNN car parks. However, it still falls well short of what NOC do which involves weekly full page ads in local papers in the Galway, Mayo, Sligo and Roscommon regions. The SNN ads are primarily of the odd billboard type, most of which are located on the N18 near Bunratty. The cost base on the other had is far more challenging and with in the region of almost 300 people taking redundancy or early retirement over the past number of years, one can imagine it is going to get increasingly difficult to squeeze out any more cost savings.
Airports: SNN GWY NOC DUB ORK BOS EWR JFK ORD MCI BOI SEA LHR STN CDG LYS FAO GVA HKG MEL ADL HBA
 
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shamrock604
Posts: 2190
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RE: Irish 7/12: Up There Where The Air Is Rarified ...

Mon May 14, 2012 7:18 pm

Quoting tonymctigue (Reply 207):

If SNN-STN is 20 quid more than DUB-STN, that is nothing to do with SNN's cost base, which as we know is pretty advantageous to Ryanair.

Quoting Cabincrewifly (Reply 206):

6 passengers does nor make a viable route! I am sure you always meet plenty of Dublin passengers on flights from London to Hong Kong - but it doesnt mean its a viable route from Dublin.

SNNFAO can work alright, it has in the past, but this is another of the "predictable routes" from SNN. As I said, its NY, Boston, London, and a few sun routes.

But dont expect an awful lot more than that until major economic growth takes hold.
 
Cabincrewifly
Posts: 228
Joined: Sun Jul 10, 2011 7:47 pm

RE: Irish 7/12: Up There Where The Air Is Rarified ...

Mon May 14, 2012 7:30 pm

Quoting shamrock604 (Reply 208):
6 passengers does nor make a viable route! I am sure you always meet plenty of Dublin passengers on flights from London to Hong Kong - but it doesnt mean its a viable route from Dublin.

Obviously doesn't make a viable route. I'm just stating the facts. Its a problem for SNN. That's only one flight!!
EI FR RE EIR IWD MA FUA
 
FoxRomeo
Posts: 13
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RE: Irish 7/12: Up There Where The Air Is Rarified ...

Mon May 14, 2012 8:27 pm

Quoting Cabincrewifly (Reply 206):
On another note, there was an FR diversion into ORK this morning. The flight from PIK to ACE diverted due to 4 unruly pax. Landed safely, dumped them off then continued on.

It was due to a passenger who suffered a heart attack actually. Where did the unruly passenger story come from?
 
styles9002
Posts: 258
Joined: Sat May 05, 2007 8:21 pm

RE: Irish 7/12: Up There Where The Air Is Rarified ...

Mon May 14, 2012 10:29 pm

Quoting shamrock604 (Reply 208):
But dont expect an awful lot more than that until major economic growth takes hold.

I wouldn't hold my breath for any 'major economic growth' to take hold in the Eurozone anytime soon. It is going to be more of the same for short- to mid-term, perhaps even worse as the charades in Greece, Spain and Italy continue to unravel.

Even if some moderate organic growth were to return to Ireland, I think airlines like Aer Lingus and Ryanair will wait until they see really strong demand and additional yield growth on existing routes before they go off and launch new routes. Otherwise, I think it would just be reckless and only serve to cannibalize existing demand and yield.

I think Shannon is going to have to have a major focus on bringing in tourists to SNN by targeting overseas tour operators. SNN needs to entice visitors from the US, Germany, Switzerland & Scandinavia, maybe even further afield to set up programs for inbound leisure visitors. The local catchment area will not support anything beyond what is scheduled today and SNN can't depend upon it for growth at all. Ryanair failed to stimulate it over the past 5 years and if they can't do no one will be able to do it absent a short-term population explosion.
It is what it is.
 
Eagleboy
Posts: 1749
Joined: Fri Dec 04, 2009 2:29 am

RE: Irish 7/12: Up There Where The Air Is Rarified ...

Mon May 14, 2012 10:54 pm

Quoting FoxRomeo (Reply 210):
It was due to a passenger who suffered a heart attack actually. Where did the unruly passenger story come from?

Probably an 'unruly' pax on the flight hadn't a clue what was happening and told this story to his mates!!!
 
Cabincrewifly
Posts: 228
Joined: Sun Jul 10, 2011 7:47 pm

RE: Irish 7/12: Up There Where The Air Is Rarified ...

Tue May 15, 2012 6:29 am

Quoting FoxRomeo (Reply 210):
It was due to a passenger who suffered a heart attack actually. Where did the unruly passenger story come from?

Apologies, that's what happens when there's a break down in communication in a company! Check-in staff were told pax causing trouble onboard, and no emergency services were needed....

Quoting Eagleboy (Reply 212):
Probably an 'unruly' pax on the flight hadn't a clue what was happening and told this story to his mates!!!

no......
EI FR RE EIR IWD MA FUA
 
Toulouse
Posts: 2199
Joined: Thu Apr 28, 2005 4:30 pm

RE: Irish 7/12: Up There Where The Air Is Rarified ...

Tue May 15, 2012 6:46 am

Quoting Toulouse (Reply 205):

Well, thankfully somebody in FR has seen sense and/or all the negative response on the radio got to them, as I received the following email late yesterday for my friend flying FR this weekend (her booking was made used my email). So thay have now personnally notified passengers by email AND said that there will be NO charge at airport for those who don't have their boarding-card. Have to say, fair-play to them, once again they created a free publicity buzz, and ended making themselves look good:

"Important - Ryanair website/online check-in not available 18-19 May

The www.ryanair.com website will be closed for upgrade maintenance at the below times between Fri. 18 May and Sun. 20 May. Passengers must ensure that they have booked tickets, checked in online and printed their boarding passes etc. prior to the below times.

1. Online Check-in - Not available from 16:00 hrs on Fri. 18 May until 12:00 hrs. Sun. 20 May. Passengers travelling between these dates and times who are unable to check-in online can check-in at the airport and will not be charged the airport check-in fee.

2. Bookings cannot be made on Ryanair.com from 22:00 hrs on Fri. 18 May until 22:00hrs Sat. 19 May

3. Flight Changes cannot be made from 22:00 hrs on Fri. 18 May until 22:00hrs Sat. 19 May

4. Existing Booking(s), passengers will not be able to review their existing booking details on Ryanair.com or via a Ryanair call centre between 22:00hrs on the Fri. 18 May until 22:00hrs Sat. 19 May.

Please note:

All flights on these days will operate as normal.

The Ryanair website: Destination Information, Travel Questions, Car, Hotel and Insurance booking facilities will be available during the entire changeover/upgrade period.

Ryanair wishes to apologise to all passengers who may be affected by our website closure which is unavoidable in order to upgrade the www.ryanair.com website."
Long live Aer Lingus!
 
dstc47
Posts: 1421
Joined: Thu Sep 16, 1999 3:53 am

RE: Irish 7/12: Up There Where The Air Is Rarified ...

Tue May 15, 2012 7:13 am

Suspect device was removed by bomb disposal team from a light aircraft at ST Angelo last night now reported by the PSNI not to be a bomb.
 
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OA260
Posts: 23756
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RE: Irish 7/12: Up There Where The Air Is Rarified ...

Tue May 15, 2012 9:33 am

Decline in air traffic continues

Flights landing during April were down 1.2% compared with last year, as arrivals and departures into the country’s three main airports continued to decline.

Shannon had the largest decline in flight numbers. There were 154 less flights into and out of Shannon — a fall of nearly 10%.

Figures for Dublin were relatively stable, with a decline of 0.1% or 12 flights. Cork Airport recorded 62 less flights or a decline of 3.4%, according to latest figures released by the Irish Aviation Authority.

http://www.irishexaminer.com/archive...-air-traffic-continues-193931.html

-----
The Dublin Airport Authority has said it could take around two months to address an outstanding security issue uncovered by a European audit.

The DAA are reiterating that it does not affect the screening of passengers or their luggage at Dublin Airport.

They said they are working with the Department of Transport to resolve the problem.

Minister for Transport Leo Varadkar said: "The Commission found two deficiencies during the audit at Dublin and, as a result, is imposing some additional security procedures on aircraft departing from Dublin and arriving into other EU airports.

http://www.irishexaminer.com/breakin...ity-problem-at-airport-551559.html

Quite mysterious and I wonder what the problems were . I also wonder if it is in T1 or T2 or both .
 
FoxRomeo
Posts: 13
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RE: Irish 7/12: Up There Where The Air Is Rarified ...

Tue May 15, 2012 10:43 am

Quoting Cabincrewifly (Reply 213):
Apologies, that's what happens when there's a break down in communication in a company! Check-in staff were told pax causing trouble onboard, and no emergency services were needed....

'Chinese whispers' at its finest! I wasn't being smart by the way, and I realise now re-reading it that it may have come across that way. I was just interested as to how the story changed from heart attack to 4 disruptive passengers.
 
nbmike
Posts: 43
Joined: Wed Dec 01, 2004 4:55 pm

RE: Irish 7/12: Up There Where The Air Is Rarified ...

Tue May 15, 2012 4:32 pm

Lord Empey wants an a Bill which will ring fence slots to UK regional airports from LHR, which will guarantee a flight to LHR from BHD or BFS

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-northern-ireland-18068559
 
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AmricanShamrok
Posts: 2100
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RE: Irish 7/12: Up There Where The Air Is Rarified ...

Tue May 15, 2012 4:49 pm

Quoting OA260 (Reply 216):
The Dublin Airport Authority has said it could take around two months to address an outstanding security issue uncovered by a European audit.

Hmmm this isn't the first time the EU commission has cited security shortcomings at DUB. Also, the opening of the US Preclearance in Terminal 2 was delayed due to security "concerns" by the US Department of Homeland Security a while back. Very odd.
 
kaitak
Topic Author
Posts: 9762
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RE: Irish 7/12: Up There Where The Air Is Rarified ...

Tue May 15, 2012 5:23 pm

Quoting nbmike (Reply 218):
Lord Empey wants an a Bill which will ring fence slots to UK regional airports from LHR, which will guarantee a flight to LHR from BHD or BFS

He may well want this and with good reason, but I don't think it's going to happen.

Quoting AmricanShamrok (Reply 219):
Hmmm this isn't the first time the EU commission has cited security shortcomings at DUB.

Yes, it's very disappointing that this has happened; of course, they hide behind the "security" excuse, but it would be very interesting to see what exactly happened; was it simply a case that too many nefarious items got through? Was DUB the only major European airport to have suffered this problem.
 
Ire2008
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Joined: Sun Mar 09, 2008 11:18 pm

RE: Irish 7/12: Up There Where The Air Is Rarified ...

Tue May 15, 2012 5:28 pm

Hi does anybody know if EI are fittin sharklet winglets on there A320s?

Kevin
 
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AmricanShamrok
Posts: 2100
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RE: Irish 7/12: Up There Where The Air Is Rarified ...

Tue May 15, 2012 6:50 pm

Anyone know why an Aeroflot 767-300ER is descending into SNN now?
 
SURFER
Posts: 159
Joined: Fri May 02, 2008 6:08 pm

RE: Irish 7/12: Up There Where The Air Is Rarified ...

Tue May 15, 2012 7:02 pm

Quoting AmricanShamrok (Reply 222):
Anyone know why an Aeroflot 767-300ER is descending into SNN now?

Aeroflot 5642 more than likely a maintenance flight probably heading to Transaero engineering or SNN Aerospace.
 
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shamrock604
Posts: 2190
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RE: Irish 7/12: Up There Where The Air Is Rarified ...

Tue May 15, 2012 7:04 pm

Quoting AmricanShamrok (Reply 219):

Without wishing to identify them for obvious security reasons, as a Dublin Airport ID holder, I can tell you there are a number of security loopholes at Dublin Airport.

They do not involve the pax screening, but they are worrying none the less.
 
Eagleboy
Posts: 1749
Joined: Fri Dec 04, 2009 2:29 am

RE: Irish 7/12: Up There Where The Air Is Rarified ...

Tue May 15, 2012 10:09 pm

Quoting Ire2008 (Reply 221):
Hi does anybody know if EI are fittin sharklet winglets on there A320s

I doubt it. Am I right in saying that the sharklets are more beneficial over longer flgihts so the refit cost may not be cost efficient for EI?

EI have however expressed an interest in the A320/321NEO.
 
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shamrock350
Posts: 5348
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RE: Irish 7/12: Up There Where The Air Is Rarified ...

Tue May 15, 2012 11:41 pm

Quoting Ire2008 (Reply 221):

Hi does anybody know if EI are fittin sharklet winglets on there A320s?

Is Airbus offering a retrofit programme for existing aircraft now? I thought the wings on current A320s needed significant strengthening for the sharlets so it would only be an option on new build aircraft.

I think if Aer Lingus will eventually go for the NEO anyway but the current A320 fleet has plenty of life left in it, a few more A319/20s could be sourced from somewhere in the short term rather than go to Airbus top up orders.
 
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OA260
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RE: Irish 7/12: Up There Where The Air Is Rarified ...

Wed May 16, 2012 8:50 am

And here is the security breech and quite a worrying one if you ask me . No wonder Irish flights and connecting passengers are to be searched. I wonder how the US Pre clearance authorities feel about this too.


Failure to track shop supplies at airport will cause traveller misery

A FAILURE to track food, equipment and supplies going into Dublin Airport will cause misery for thousands of travellers this summer.

The Irish Independent has learned that security concerns have nothing to do with passengers, but instead relate to goods being brought into the airport for sale in shops and restaurants.

http://www.independent.ie/national-n...ause-traveller-misery-3109984.html

---

Maybe problems at SNN and ORK also :

Security concerns at Cork and Shannon airports

Wednesday, May 16, 2012
There were concerns last night that security checks at Cork and Shannon airports may be affected by the same deficiencies uncovered at Dublin Airport.
A major security audit on Dublin Airport uncovered serious issues with checks on goods brought on board aircraft by the crew and suppliers of airlines.

http://www.irishexaminer.com/ireland...k-and-shannon-airports-194030.html

[Edited 2012-05-16 02:14:05]
 
ein105
Posts: 111
Joined: Wed Jul 13, 2011 3:34 pm

RE: Irish 7/12: Up There Where The Air Is Rarified ...

Wed May 16, 2012 11:21 am

When is the EI winter timetable normally released? There is an "early bird" sale on for travel up to December, but a few routes are not available to book. FUE, OTP and KRK used to operate year round, but can't be booked past October.
 
EIDL
Posts: 885
Joined: Wed Apr 25, 2012 7:11 pm

RE: Irish 7/12: Up There Where The Air Is Rarified ...

Wed May 16, 2012 11:51 am

Quoting ein105 (Reply 228):
When is the EI winter timetable normally released? There is an "early bird" sale on for travel up to December, but a few routes are not available to book. FUE, OTP and KRK used to operate year round, but can't be booked past October.

Winter timetables are up and bookable for certain routes (LGW with its late Saturday LGW-DUB flight that's not on in Summer, for instance) and have been for at least a few weeks. I would have thought FUE was an obvious year-rounder so it'd be odd if it was dropped so they might not have all routes up.
 
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shamrock604
Posts: 2190
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RE: Irish 7/12: Up There Where The Air Is Rarified ...

Wed May 16, 2012 12:38 pm

Quoting OA260 (Reply 227):

I agree, it's a disgrace!

But, I always get rescreened when connecting at other EU airports! Since when did that change?
 
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AmricanShamrok
Posts: 2100
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RE: Irish 7/12: Up There Where The Air Is Rarified ...

Wed May 16, 2012 1:10 pm

Regarding the upcoming NATO summit in Chicago (of which the Taoiseach will be attending...for some reason?) - will he and his staff use the private preclearance at Shannon? Or will they clear it on arrival in Chicago?
 
kaitak
Topic Author
Posts: 9762
Joined: Wed Aug 18, 1999 5:49 am

RE: Irish 7/12: Up There Where The Air Is Rarified ...

Wed May 16, 2012 4:31 pm

Why is he going to a NATO conference? If he is going, I would imagine he would fly with EI? Presumably, there are different regulations for senior government officials.

Anyway, here is the link to the new thread:

Irish 8/12: Holding Short, Awaiting Clearance ... (by kaitak May 16 2012 in Civil Aviation)

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