Turkish Airlines To Buy 15 A330-300

Asiaflyer · Mon Oct 08, 2012 7:20 am

Turkish Airlines has filed to the Istanbul Stock Exchange that they will buy 15 A330-300 during 2014-2016.

http://www.reuters.com/article/2012/...lines-airbus-idUSI7E8JE02820121008

EPA001 · Mon Oct 08, 2012 7:31 am

Another very nice order for the A330. Turkish must be satisfied with their A330's. Good for all involved with TK, Airbus and RR?

.

[Edited 2012-10-08 00:32:08]

KPDX · Mon Oct 08, 2012 7:31 am

Mehhh. I was hoping it was a newer VLA, but congrats to Airbus anyways.

scouseflyer · Mon Oct 08, 2012 8:03 am

Quoting KPDX (Reply 2):
Mehhh. I was hoping it was a newer VLA, but congrats to Airbus anyways.

They're never going to order a VLA, it's a mythical beast that order!

leftyboarder · Mon Oct 08, 2012 8:22 am

I was expecting a larger order but anyway... It's good to see some orders to expand long-haul flying. Hopefully we will see some new US/Canada destinations (e.g. BOS, DTW, MIA, YUL) with these.

B777LRF · Mon Oct 08, 2012 8:37 am

Quoting leftyboarder (Reply 4):
Hopefully we will see some new US/Canada destinations (e.g. BOS, DTW, MIA, YUL) with these.

My money's one more Sub-Saharan Africa, Central Asia and Far East Asia routes. That's where the growth is at.

leftyboarder · Mon Oct 08, 2012 8:43 am

Quoting B777LRF (Reply 5):
My money's one more Sub-Saharan Africa, Central Asia and Far East Asia routes. That's where the growth is at.

They are already expanding Sub-Saharan Africa using 739ERs, maybe Lusaka or Maputo may be out of the range. For Central Asia they fly to almost every city that counts anyway. Far East on the other hand is possible, with MNL, TPE, KUL and more China (if bilateral is revised) likely. Still not enough places to send 15 planes to.

runway23 · Mon Oct 08, 2012 8:52 am

Quoting B777LRF (Reply 5):
My money's one more Sub-Saharan Africa, Central Asia and Far East Asia routes. That's where the growth is at.

In any case they will need to balance their operations between east and west flows. So some of these will have to go in either direction or at one point TK will have to also upgauge a certain number of European routes to widebodies, as it seems some routes constantly have full 321s day in day out and are already running 3x per day at a very constrained airport.

northstar80 · Mon Oct 08, 2012 8:58 am

I wonder if these planes will have the Comfort Class (Premium Economy). I recently flew Comfort Class in their 77W's and was extremely pleased with it (Even tops most other airlines' business class).

chiad · Mon Oct 08, 2012 8:58 am

Quoting Asiaflyer (Thread starter):
will buy 15 A330-300 during 2014-2016.

What does this mean anyway?
Will they actually sign a firm order sometime between 2014 and 2016, or will the frames be delivered then.
I assume the last option.

northstar80 · Mon Oct 08, 2012 8:59 am

Turkish Media also reports that an order of 10-15 77W's will be ordered in November..

art · Mon Oct 08, 2012 10:01 am

Quoting Chiad (Reply 9):
Quoting Asiaflyer (Thread starter):
will buy 15 A330-300 during 2014-2016.

What does this mean anyway?
Will they actually sign a firm order sometime between 2014 and 2016, or will the frames be delivered then.
I assume the last option.

From the Reuters release:

"The carrier will buy four planes in 2014, six in 2015 and five in 2016, the Istanbul-based company said in a statement to the Istanbul Stock Exchange. (Writing by Seda Sezer)"

Badly translated, I suspect. They would not place 3 different orders so like you I guess it means they would receive deliveries as reported in 2014, 2015 an 2016.

scbriml · Mon Oct 08, 2012 11:09 am

Quoting Chiad (Reply 9):
Will they actually sign a firm order sometime between 2014 and 2016, or will the frames be delivered then.

I would expect those are the delivery dates.

Turkish350XWB · Mon Oct 08, 2012 11:55 am

Flightglobal also mentions 5 options...

autothrust · Mon Oct 08, 2012 12:05 pm

The A330 is still selling like hot cakes.... what a great plane!

TK787 · Mon Oct 08, 2012 12:22 pm

Quoting Northstar80 (Reply 8):
I wonder if these planes will have the Comfort Class (Premium Economy)

Probably not.
TK 333s have 34 lie-flat business class seats with 54"pitch
and 236 Y seats with 33-34" pitch.

And if the rumors are true about;
- 77W order in November and
- up to 200 more narrow body order in works and
- the opening of the first phase of a new airport in Istanbul by 2016 and
- still about 50 more narrow-bodies to arrive next few years. (already in order books)
these are exciting times for TK and Turkish Aviation.

TC957 · Mon Oct 08, 2012 12:46 pm

Another great A333 order, but if they're getting up to another 15 77W's as well then surely we can all forget about the much-hyped rumoured VLA aquisition.

TK787 · Mon Oct 08, 2012 1:00 pm

Quoting TC957 (Reply 16):
forget about the much-hyped rumoured VLA aquisition.

You must have missed the latest announcement that 333/77W comes first for TK. But still interested for up to 6 frames of VLAs. Has to wait till the new airport at Istanbul completes first phase, 2016. Order could come by then.

MaverickM11 · Mon Oct 08, 2012 2:10 pm

Quoting scouseflyer (Reply 3):

They're never going to order a VLA, it's a mythical beast that order!

I don't think there's any reason for TK to have a VLA other than ego, especially with the new airport in the pipeline. More 333s makes a lot of sense though

something · Mon Oct 08, 2012 2:31 pm

When are the A343s leaving the fleet? Couldn't this just be a replacement order?

leftyboarder · Mon Oct 08, 2012 2:44 pm

Quoting something (Reply 19):
When are the A343s leaving the fleet? Couldn't this just be a replacement order?

There are only 7 of those in the fleet. Even if this replaces some of those, that still means a net growth of 8 frames.

avek00 · Mon Oct 08, 2012 3:25 pm

Quoting KPDX (Reply 2):
I was hoping it was a newer VLA

Anything larger than a 77W runs contrary to the TK business model.

KPDX · Mon Oct 08, 2012 4:42 pm

Quoting avek00 (Reply 21):
Anything larger than a 77W runs contrary to the TK business model.

Not surprised.. Was just the aviation geek in me.

na · Mon Oct 08, 2012 5:15 pm

More bread-and-butter. Where´s the cake?

maddogjt8d · Mon Oct 08, 2012 5:22 pm

Wonder if this will finally allow them to add ATL, since the announcement of the ATL tag-on via IAD never materialized.

Stitch · Mon Oct 08, 2012 5:31 pm

Quoting na (Reply 23):
More bread-and-butter. Where´s the cake?

Cake is empty calories and it sounds like a VLA is empty seats.

danielkandi · Mon Oct 08, 2012 5:42 pm

Quoting Northstar80 (Reply 8):

I totally agree on the Comfort Class. The food was better than KLM business imo. The price and for what they offer, makes comfort class completely worth the money. Hope they get it on these nice new aircraft!

TK787 · Mon Oct 08, 2012 5:54 pm

Quoting danielkandi (Reply 26):
The food was better than KLM business imo. The price and for what they offer, makes comfort class completely worth the money. Hope they get it on these nice new aircraft!

Who knows if Comfort will be added to the 333 fleet, but as of now it only exist on the 77W fleet.
We all know Comfort Class on TK is one of the best Y+ product out there, but out of the 4 Comfort Class trips I've taken over the last 6 months, NONE of them were sold out. All of those flights had better loads on J class.
In "Turkish Aviation" threads we have discussed this many times and we all come to the conclusion that there are just too many Comfort seats on TK's 77Ws. The space could be better utilized by adding more J seats for Y+ on the 77Ws.
Instead of the current: 28J 63Y+ 246Y, it would be 42J 49Y+ 246Y.

ymincrement · Mon Oct 08, 2012 6:49 pm

how true I am not sure but they say they have the biggest number of destinations in all airlines in their latest advertisement. may be because of that there have to buy more wide-bodies

you may see the advertisement below link and listen our national march with different instruments

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=E8JlBU_LPHE

LAXintl · Mon Oct 08, 2012 8:00 pm

Today the CEO of TK was quoted by Financial Times as saying the carrier needed more long-haul aircraft to "allow more flights to destinations to New York, Chicago, Los Angeles and Sao Paulo as well as locations in China and Japan.'

http://www.ft.com/intl/cms/s/0/501f2...37-00144feabdc0.html#axzz28jqwSkI2

Quoting something (Reply 19):
When are the A343s leaving the fleet? Couldn't this just be a replacement order?

The A340s are already on the way out. Just recently 2 A340s left the fleet headed to Air Blue in Pakistan.

Additionally there is an ongoing bid tender at the moment for sale of another frame as well.

YULWinterSkies · Tue Oct 09, 2012 2:04 am

Quoting leftyboarder (Reply 4):
Hopefully we will see some new US/Canada destinations (e.g. BOS, DTW, MIA, YUL) with these.

DTW and YUL would work well as these are 2 destinations that are popular with mid-easterners. However, VFR is never the highest yielding market. And RJ would be very unhappy if TK were to step in...

CaliAtenza · Tue Oct 09, 2012 2:08 am

so this means they will also expand in India, correct?

VC10er · Tue Oct 09, 2012 2:21 am

I went on line to see the different classes on Turkish (an airline I'd LOVE to fly) but there were so many different seats my head was spinning! Do the F, J, Y+ really differ that much from plane to plane? Or have they standardized across the fleet yet?

sydaircargo · Tue Oct 09, 2012 2:50 am

they wanted to come to Australia one day , would be a far stretch for the A 330 unless you stop
one more time.

lightsaber · Tue Oct 09, 2012 2:53 am

With the proposed new airport, I could see TK ordering a large number of 'small' widebodies. I notice they have yet to select the A350 or 787... that will be an exciting order!

However, in the mean time, they are in a near perfect geographic location to take advantage of further A333s. I suspect they could have one more order in the future...

Quoting leftyboarder (Reply 4):
I was expecting a larger order but anyway...

Ditto, but why not be flexible and see how the new airport construction goes?

Quoting Northstar80 (Reply 10):
Turkish Media also reports that an order of 10-15 77W's will be ordered in November..

WHAT?!?

How is TK doing for terminal space at IST?

Quoting TK787 (Reply 15):
- the opening of the first phase of a new airport in Istanbul by 2016

Is the new airport on schedule? Does it have an ICAO code yet?

Quoting LAXintl (Reply 29):
The A340s are already on the way out. Just recently 2 A340s left the fleet headed to Air Blue in Pakistan.

Do you know the quantity in the fleet? Wikipedia says 7. So is the fleet 7-2-1=4 or 7-1=6 soon?

Lightsaber

EddieDude · Tue Oct 09, 2012 4:09 am

Will these Airbuses be the extended-range/payload versions?

MeCe · Tue Oct 09, 2012 7:13 am

Quoting TK787 (Reply 27):
Instead of the current: 28J 63Y 246Y, it would be 42J 49Y 246Y

That not works like this

J seats have 78" pitch and Y+ have 46". to install one row of J seat you need to remove 2 rows of Y+ seats. Another problem is Y+ can not get premium lavatory if you add J cabin in front of Y+ ( Premium lavs located just behind second doors) So need to add premium lav middle of cabin, another space constrain

I like 330-300, it has great economics over 777 but limited to JFK. It is limited pax for ORD flights, and new routes will be more far than ORD.

leftyboarder · Tue Oct 09, 2012 7:53 am

Quoting MeCe (Reply 36):

They still can fly to BOS or DTW can't they? Both yet untapped by the MidEast giants.

TK787 · Tue Oct 09, 2012 12:27 pm

Quoting MeCe (Reply 36):
That not works like this

Hey, thanks for the explanation/correction.
I am sure they can make it work somehow, move 3 rows of Y+, or go with only one row only and move the lavs back.
Or add more Y instead of Y+, Adjust to the reality instead of waiting.
It is not rocket science.
Again, this is only needed if Comfort seats are harder to fill than J or Y.
Maybe someone has all the info.

photoshooter · Tue Oct 09, 2012 12:39 pm

Seems like a good replacement for the A340s. They will have to replace 7 A340s so I guess they won't add new long haul destinations soon?

Niek

ASA · Tue Oct 09, 2012 3:10 pm

Quoting MaverickM11 (Reply 18):
I don't think there's any reason for TK to have a VLA other than ego, especially with the new airport in the pipeline. More 333s makes a lot of sense though
[quote=leftyboarder,reply=37]They still can fly to BOS or DTW can't they? Both yet untapped by the MidEast giants.

Exactly what went through my mind!

DTW is ideally positioned for a 332/333 service, with its Levant-origin population ... we have had countless discussions on how TK is better suited than EK/EY/QR for a DTW service.

BOS is still untapped ... TK should start before EK or QR walks in. IST is geographically much closer and easier to deploy 332s or 333s on this route.

now that the 333s were ordered ... keep the North American expansion coming!

lightsaber · Tue Oct 09, 2012 3:31 pm

Quoting leftyboarder (Reply 37):
They still can fly to BOS or DTW can't they? Both yet untapped by the MidEast giants.

BOS, PHL, DTW, JFK, or EWR are all in A333 range (although DTW will be with winter payload penalties). I could see an A332 to DTW with the A333 replacing an A332 on a route that doesn't require the range.

I could see frequency addition as well as new routes.

Quoting ASA (Reply 40):
we have had countless discussions on how TK is better suited than EK/EY/QR for a DTW service.

Understandable. TK is very well placed for A333 service to a limited corner of the US.

Now does TK serve the Canadian cities in range too?

Lightsaber

TK787 · Tue Oct 09, 2012 5:29 pm

Quoting lightsaber (Reply 41):
Now does TK serve the Canadian cities in range too?

Only problem is the bilaterals.
YYZ is painstakingly went up to 5 x weekly on 77W. TK wants to fly daily.
YUL slots, IIRC is granted if TK chooses to fly there.

TurkishWings · Tue Oct 09, 2012 5:48 pm

Quoting ymincrement (Reply 28):
how true I am not sure but they say they have the biggest number of destinations in all airlines in their latest advertisement. may be because of that there have to buy more wide-bodies

I think they are saying "More international destinations (cities)" than any other airline. I wonder if it's true though...

ASA · Tue Oct 09, 2012 7:13 pm

Quoting lightsaber (Reply 41):
Now does TK serve the Canadian cities in range too?

Yes, YUL is another great candidate ... and an A333 could be a great solution! Sizeable population from francophone nations in North Africa and Levant, although it's quite a backtrack for Morocco, Algeria, and Tunis. It should also attract the subcontinent population ('Desis'

) from Montreal and Ottawa catchment areas. What I hear from this site and my brother who taken the flight, QR is having very good loads on this route.

Quoting TK787 (Reply 42):
Only problem is the bilaterals.
YYZ is painstakingly went up to 5 x weekly on 77W. TK wants to fly daily.
YUL slots, IIRC is granted if TK chooses to fly there.

Does that mean, 5x weekly to ALL of Canada?

I mean, if TK chooses to launch YUL 3x weekly, will it have to give up similar number of YYZ slots ?

goosebayguy · Tue Oct 09, 2012 7:26 pm

Are they trying to take on EK? If so what would be their advantage over EK? THY seem to be seriously gambling on very bright future here. They must surely be looking to order the A380 before too long.

Stitch · Tue Oct 09, 2012 7:32 pm

Quoting goosebayguy (Reply 45):
Are they trying to take on EK? If so what would be their advantage over EK?

IST being a more convenient connection point for the eastern and southern EU and north-eastern Africa than DXB?

[Edited 2012-10-09 12:32:44]

SCQ83 · Tue Oct 09, 2012 7:33 pm

Quoting leftyboarder (Reply 37):
They still can fly to BOS or DTW can't they? Both yet untapped by the MidEast giants.

DTW is already served by RJ (probably RJ is not a "MidEast giant"... but still I am sure they can pretty well serve Middle Eastern community in Michigan).

LAXintl · Tue Oct 09, 2012 8:20 pm

Quoting ASA (Reply 44):
Does that mean, 5x weekly to ALL of Canada?
I mean, if TK chooses to launch YUL 3x weekly, will it have to give up similar number of YYZ slots ?

At the moment the Canada bilateral only allows a single destination and 5x weekly service.

Until Canada is forthcoming with more rights, any hopes of increased service are simply dreams.

Quoting lightsaber (Reply 34):
Do you know the quantity in the fleet? Wikipedia says 7. So is the fleet 7-2-1=4 or 7-1=6 soon?

Today its 7.

One (TC-JDJ) is currently for sale. Reportedly 2 additional frames (TC-JDK/JDL) will be marketed next year.

robffm2 · Wed Oct 10, 2012 10:40 am

Now confirmed by Airbus as a an order:

http://www.airbus.com/newsevents/new...s-another-15-airbus-a330-aircraft/

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